INC Nerf

Thakar · 05-10-2006, 09:28 AM

It's that time again! Time for a new round of Summoner nerfs.

Lockeye wrote:There are a few other changes that will impact multiple classes in the next test update:Damage InterceptionFighters have a line of combat arts dedicated to intercepting damage, mostly for use in situations where the Fighter is not the main tank of the group or raid. Currently, it is rarely used because it puts the Fighter that uses it in great danger becaues intercepted damage does not consider any mitigation.The next test update changes damage interception so the caster's mitigation is considered. This will help make off-tanking tactics more viable, especially for fighters that have ways to recover their own health.Summoner BalanceCurrently, Conjurers and Necromancers are a very powerful class that can deliver the most consistent damage in the shortest amount of time and can solo more powerful encounters than most other classes. One of the problems is that their single target damage can exceed that of Wizards in solo, group, and raid situations, even when hostile area effect damage is considered that can kill swarm and dumbfire pets.The next test update decreases the effectiveness of certain pet abilities and buffs that were overpowered. These changes don't necessarily mean that Wizards are always supposed to outdamage Summoners. Summoners can have favorable situations in long fights without large area effects that can tip the scales in their favor above Wizards. It shouldn't be the case anymore that Summoners outdamage Wizards the majority of the time after these changes, and Summoners will still retain relatively powerful soloability even after these changes.

Deila · 05-10-2006, 09:37 AM

Heheh, yeps, looks like it's time. BUT - before anyone panics, let's see what happens.

Looks to me like they're adjusting pet CAs (probably assassin pet, though warlock spells may have also been looked at), and my guess is adjustments to DPS and haste mods from pet buffs.

We don't have LU24 on Test just yet - we're expecting it any time though. I've screenshotted all my pet abilities and persona windows, as well as all pet buffs, so I can compare now with later. Unfortunately, no pet or pet buff masters for me - things are much harder to come by on Test with the overall lower population, but at least we'll have a same-quality before and after look. All adept III, except for Grim Heretic at adept I (just can't seem to get advanced Sage 61 to drop for me, or it'd be adept III as well).

Thakar · 05-10-2006, 09:54 AM

Deila wrote:

Heheh, yeps, looks like it's time. BUT - before anyone panics, let's see what happens.

Looks to me like they're adjusting pet CAs (probably assassin pet, though warlock spells may have also been looked at), and my guess is adjustments to DPS and haste mods from pet buffs.

We don't have LU24 on Test just yet - we're expecting it any time though. I've screenshotted all my pet abilities and persona windows, as well as all pet buffs, so I can compare now with later. Unfortunately, no pet or pet buff masters for me - things are much harder to come by on Test with the overall lower population, but at least we'll have a same-quality before and after look. All adept III, except for Grim Heretic at adept I (just can't seem to get advanced Sage 61 to drop for me, or it'd be adept III as well).

This is SOE...of course they'll go overboard with the nerfs. Well....at least it'll drive a good number of Summoners to quit so, more loot for me I suppose.

Deila · 05-10-2006, 10:00 AM

Eh, not sure yet. I can't really compare the hit Rangers took here necessarily, since proc damage is often multiplicative, and more complex, than the way our pets deal damage which is more linear. Simpler system, so it seems that it'd be easier to adjust predictably.

As I said though, I have no idea yet what changes have been made until LU24 patches to Test. I'll look when it does. If it's bad, then you may all panic. SMILEY Until then though, hang tight. May just be some minor adjustments. No idea yet.

prince_sd · 05-10-2006, 10:26 AM

Rangers got the good end of soe nerf stick.Our dps is being put below wizards !! wizards for christ sake .. wizards do t3 dps right now.

BtilTheMage · 05-10-2006, 11:18 AM

"Rangers got the good end of soe nerf stick.

Our dps is being put below wizards !! wizards for christ sake .. wizards do t3 dps right now."

Don't worry, you'll still beat Warlocks on single target(99.99% of) DPS!

Errie_Tholluxe · 05-10-2006, 12:02 PM

Deila wrote:

Heheh, yeps, looks like it's time. BUT - before anyone panics, let's see what happens.

Looks to me like they're adjusting pet CAs (probably assassin pet, though warlock spells may have also been looked at), and my guess is adjustments to DPS and haste mods from pet buffs.

We don't have LU24 on Test just yet - we're expecting it any time though. I've screenshotted all my pet abilities and persona windows, as well as all pet buffs, so I can compare now with later. Unfortunately, no pet or pet buff masters for me - things are much harder to come by on Test with the overall lower population, but at least we'll have a same-quality before and after look. All adept III, except for Grim Heretic at adept I (just can't seem to get advanced Sage 61 to drop for me, or it'd be adept III as well).

I look forward to a post from you with screenies letting us know :smileywink: Thanks Delia

evhallion · 05-10-2006, 01:50 PM

Thakar wrote:

It's that time again! Time for a new round of Summoner nerfs.

Lockeye wrote:
There are a few other changes that will impact multiple classes in the next test update:

Damage Interception

Fighters have a line of combat arts dedicated to intercepting damage, mostly for use in situations where the Fighter is not the main tank of the group or raid. Currently, it is rarely used because it puts the Fighter that uses it in great danger becaues intercepted damage does not consider any mitigation.

The next test update changes damage interception so the caster's mitigation is considered. This will help make off-tanking tactics more viable, especially for fighters that have ways to recover their own health.

Summoner Balance

Currently, Conjurers and Necromancers are a very powerful class that can deliver the most consistent damage in the shortest amount of time and can solo more powerful encounters than most other classes. One of the problems is that their single target damage can exceed that of Wizards in solo, group, and raid situations, even when hostile area effect damage is considered that can kill swarm and dumbfire pets.

The next test update decreases the effectiveness of certain pet abilities and buffs that were overpowered. These changes don't necessarily mean that Wizards are always supposed to outdamage Summoners. Summoners can have favorable situations in long fights without large area effects that can tip the scales in their favor above Wizards. It shouldn't be the case anymore that Summoners outdamage Wizards the majority of the time after these changes, and Summoners will still retain relatively powerful soloability even after these changes.

I get the feeling this may hurt a bit.....

Uanelven · 05-10-2006, 03:13 PM

The amount of hurt that is inflicted is yet to be seen but this will be a significant hit. Trying to soften the blow in a post like that tells me this really.

Message Edited by Uanelven on 05-10-2006 04:21 AM

KBern · 05-10-2006, 04:32 PM

Currently, Conjurers and Necromancers are a very powerful class that can deliver the most consistent damage in the shortest amount of time and can solo more powerful encounters than most other classes.

Overall this was expected and I am not freaking out, but this part makes me laugh and shows how much they really dont know what other classes can do.

We are beat in this category by beserkers, bruisers, monks, wizards and warlocks....and even wardens on some typs of mobs.

But in the long run, I have a hard time not pulling agro on raids with my DPS. Nothing I can do, even with amends last night I was just killing the Paladin lol

So I think as long as we are not hammered with the nerf bat, and just nudged as they say.....it is not so bad.

KBern · 05-10-2006, 04:33 PM

Deila wrote:

Heheh, yeps, looks like it's time. BUT - before anyone panics, let's see what happens.

Looks to me like they're adjusting pet CAs (probably assassin pet, though warlock spells may have also been looked at), and my guess is adjustments to DPS and haste mods from pet buffs.

We don't have LU24 on Test just yet - we're expecting it any time though. I've screenshotted all my pet abilities and persona windows, as well as all pet buffs, so I can compare now with later. Unfortunately, no pet or pet buff masters for me - things are much harder to come by on Test with the overall lower population, but at least we'll have a same-quality before and after look. All adept III, except for Grim Heretic at adept I (just can't seem to get advanced Sage 61 to drop for me, or it'd be adept III as well).

Thank you Deila, keep us up to date. :smileyhappy:

Jal · 05-10-2006, 04:42 PM

KBern wrote:
But in the long run, I have a hard time not pulling agro on raids with my DPS. Nothing I can do, even with amends last night I was just killing the Paladin lol
So I think as long as we are not hammered with the nerf bat, and just nudged as they say.....it is not so bad.
Hehe i always get moaned at for peeling if i forget myself and go all out. Skywatcher + slow casting and agro is fine in most groups/raids but i can probably pull agro in most groups if i wanted to.

KBern · 05-10-2006, 05:03 PM

I temporarily changed my last name on the raid last night to Saurakk Dorfkillah :smileytongue:

Barobra · 05-10-2006, 05:44 PM

BtilTheMage wrote:

"Rangers got the good end of soe nerf stick.

Our dps is being put below wizards !! wizards for christ sake .. wizards do t3 dps right now."

Don't worry, you'll still beat Warlocks on single target(99.99% of) DPS!

Wizards are not T3

Errie_Tholluxe · 05-10-2006, 05:46 PM

Barobrain wrote:

BtilTheMage wrote:
"Rangers got the good end of soe nerf stick.Our dps is being put below wizards !! wizards for christ sake .. wizards do t3 dps right now."

Don't worry, you'll still beat Warlocks on single target(99.99% of) DPS!

Wizards are not T3

Lol when the man has Illusionist in his sig, trust me he knows what he's talking about :smileyvery-happy:

KBern · 05-10-2006, 05:50 PM

BAH he is just trying to hide his uber illusionist DPS!!11~

:smileywink:

^^

Winky face...winky face....

Barobra · 05-10-2006, 06:05 PM

Actually with help I can be uber. But by myself ya its kind of sad.

But man I love a troub in my group. was parsing 1k-1.5k parses last night in raid with the troub. That one skill that makes every spell a proc roxorz your boxorz.

BtilTheMage · 05-10-2006, 06:22 PM

"Wizards are not T3 "

I didn't say they were, it was a response. I type in red, not white!

Barobra · 05-10-2006, 06:32 PM

BtilTheMage wrote:

"Wizards are not T3 "

I didn't say they were, it was a response. I type in red, not white!

I apologize I did actually mean to hit reply on the previous person.

Steven9 · 05-10-2006, 08:02 PM

Currently, Conjurers and Necromancers are a very powerful class that can deliver the most consistent damage in the shortest amount of time and can solo more powerful encounters than most other classes. Is it just me or is that statment false for necs. I can outdps my entire raid on epic mobs that take forever to kill but when it comes to grp enconters who die fast i barely get a spell off. Necros to me only do very high dmg only on long encounters and for pvp we suck big time.Also for the second part that we can solo more powerful encounters i dont see as true either for my nec anyway. I got a 55nec on pvp server and was trying to solo the 51 ^^^ heroics in living tombs to spawn the named for the staff and i got owned so fast. Pet gets hit so hard and i got to constantly heal him killing myself. I also have a 60conj on pve serer and he can do some insane amount of dps with all my pet procs up. Also my conj solos heroics even con to him easy.Also on my 60 monk i solo even con and yellow heroics ^^^ so easy its not even funny yet they wanna nerf summoners and allow monks to be easily the best class since soe doesnt do anything to monks but make them better. Just my thoughts summoners are nowhere near be overpowered imo

Tallika_Runwithbears · 05-10-2006, 08:03 PM

i like how calm we are compared to other classes. if something like this happened elsewhere you'd think they were anticipating the end of the world... whereas here we are all laid back with just a little bit of nervious anticipation. ok and a reasonable amount of dread while we wait for the other shoe to drop.

danup · 05-10-2006, 08:27 PM

I don't get where's the problem to nerf us more.

Do we solo better? We can do some soloing, hell yeah, dear devs we are a PET CLASS, in case u didn't noticed yet that means the pet takes damage we stay more or less alive doing dmg to the mobs, so we have some advantage to solo. OK! you made our pets to become paper dolls, a pet cannot hold a ^^^ heroic at similar lvl than us, so it hightly nerfed our "advantage", for non ^^^ heroics he can (sometimes) survive, does it really unbalance? I've seen wizards, warlocks, wardens, bruisers and coercer soloing in a way i cant even dream about. Do I whine about it? No, I don't. I assumed that I'm a DPS class with some soloing posibilities (like many other classes in the game). And our DPS comes mainly from the pet dmg, our dots are not kinda uber dps.. the only way do make nice dmg is tapping the mobs (for 1500 at m2)

As many ppl said, yes in long fights we can do a lot of dmg, but in usual groups y can barely land 2 dots and 1 tap, and yeah my pet does pretty more dmg than me.

I agree conjurors were overpowered at the begining of the game, but that was solved long time ago for christ shake, it's getting really anoying to be always waiting for new nerfs. I don¡t care if a wiz or whatever can make more dmg than me, I just want to know my way to play and my abilities will be the ones I have, and I want to be useful for the group, so instead of be EverBalancing2 (I still remembering in EQ1 you are still balancing classes) I would advice you to look for the real problems in the game, and the supposed to be non intended things on game. And please respect the roles of the classes in the game.

Barobra · 05-10-2006, 08:29 PM

danup wrote:

I don't get where's the problem to nerf us more.

Do we solo better? We can do some soloing, hell yeah, dear devs we are a PET CLASS, in case u didn't noticed yet that means the pet takes damage we stay more or less alive doing dmg to the mobs, so we have some advantage to solo. OK! you made our pets to become paper dolls, a pet cannot hold a ^^^ heroic at similar lvl than us, so it hightly nerfed our "advantage", for non ^^^ heroics he can (sometimes) survive, does it really unbalance? I've seen wizards, warlocks, wardens, bruisers and coercer soloing in a way i cant even dream about. Do I whine about it? No, I don't. I assumed that I'm a DPS class with some soloing posibilities (like many other classes in the game). And our DPS comes mainly from the pet dmg, our dots are not kinda uber dps.. the only way do make nice dmg is tapping the mobs (for 1500 at m2)

As many ppl said, yes in long fights we can do a lot of dmg, but in usual groups y can barely land 2 dots and 1 tap, and yeah my pet does pretty more dmg than me.

I agree conjurors were overpowered at the begining of the game, but that was solved long time ago for christ shake, it's getting really anoying to be always waiting for new nerfs. I don¡t care if a wiz or whatever can make more dmg than me, I just want to know my way to play and my abilities will be the ones I have, and I want to be useful for the group, so instead of be EverBalancing2 (I still remembering in EQ1 you are still balancing classes) I would advice you to look for the real problems in the game, and the supposed to be non intended things on game. And please respect the roles of the classes in the game.

My guess is Sony wants to nerf every class until no one is able to solo heroics. :smileyhappy:

Ze · 05-10-2006, 08:48 PM

Necros own the nerfbat.

Deila · 05-10-2006, 09:01 PM

Tallika_Runwithbears wrote:
i like how calm we are compared to other classes. if something like this happened elsewhere you'd think they were anticipating the end of the world...

whereas here we are all laid back with just a little bit of nervious anticipation.

ok and a reasonable amount of dread while we wait for the other shoe to drop.

Yeah, the waiting's the hardest part. No idea to what degree changes will come, and only speculation. Wild speculation, in the case of some (especially non-summoners). Gotta love those dev posts that say 'you're being nerfed', but won't specify how much. :smileysurprised:

Patience, Necromancers. Might be bad, might not. No sense in getting into a panic until we see something. Tell you what though - second thing I'll be doing (right after I get the screenies of the adjusted pet abilities, buffs, etc. to show you all) is running my tank pet through his paces of things I've been able up to now to solo with a good fight to see how he's been affected.

Allowen · 05-10-2006, 10:03 PM

I belive this change will hurt the conjurros more then it wil ldo on necros because their pets can do a bit more dps,tank a bit better then undying dreadnout, uber pet buffs like he mitigatio ngrou pbuff that raises 20defense(probably will get nefred) and their ancient lv 65 spell.

What bothers me is not the reduce on pet s dps but also is that they might tank even worst if was nto enough pets having super low resisatace then after LU 24 even poor fighter pet will die to the 1st mob that does aoe magical spell.

Welcome back to EQ1 it seems where our spectre pets could barely tank some thing, we had to raise hp/avoidance/mitigation on ourselves if we wanted to solo tank some mobs,that coul;d summon and stuff like that..Pet no way could do much on high end raids, and kept dieing ....

I recommend for necros in here that are used to only solo mobs using warrior pet that they start to pratice doing that with scout or mage pet and spend some aa skills on avoidance(parry/cabalist cover) and raise critical hits and get priority on master spells that can heal so we will still be able to solo well, we wil ltank mobs when our super weak pets cant.

Btw since they will nerf pets I would ask that they could make necro pet nightshade master 1 a bit less ultra rare because as far as I know on most servers there are aroudn 15 lv 60 pets for 1 nightshade. This is not fair !

Allowen

necromancer of MM server

Lords of the triple moons

Supa Mint Flava · 05-10-2006, 10:33 PM

Am very curious about the degree to which the nerf will affect conjuror vs. necro. Also, SOE has a habit of announcing changes that come out entirely different as intended. I still remember when the big combat revamp was supposed to be mage>scout>tank>priest in terms of DPS. Talk about liberal exceptions to the rule (I have a 70 dirge as well....sad dps; we won't even talk about solo ability).

Probably the most frustrating part of being nerfed is that it can change the degree of enjoyment of a toon that you've spent an incredibly amount of time developing. But, guess that's one of the things we all know can and does happen. Still isn't any fun.

I switched from necro to Defiler for raiding anyway .

ShadowDragon32 · 05-10-2006, 10:55 PM

Im hoping the nerf isn't too bad. If it is then I might try that new game coming out called Vanguard. The more i read about this game the more i think it could be a superpower in the MMORPG arena. IMO it gets kinda old when the SOE development team continues to dumb down the classes. Takes the fun out of it. Good Luck...

Errie_Tholluxe · 05-10-2006, 11:21 PM

Hey ! Get station pass and you can still even pop in on EQ2 to see whether it got better ! :smileyvery-happy:

Thakar · 05-11-2006, 12:02 AM

Tallika_Runwithbears wrote:i like how calm we are compared to other classes. if something like this happened elsewhere you'd think they were anticipating the end of the world... whereas here we are all laid back with just a little bit of nervious anticipation. ok and a reasonable amount of dread while we wait for the other shoe to drop.

Probably because we've been through this many times before and will go through it more in the future...SOE has a history of nerfing Necromancers. We eventually just sulk in bitter silence and replace the image files of various mobs with pictures of the devs.

05-10-2006, 09:28 AM	#1
Thakar Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 146	It's that time again! Time for a new round of Summoner nerfs. Lockeye wrote:There are a few other changes that will impact multiple classes in the next test update:Damage InterceptionFighters have a line of combat arts dedicated to intercepting damage, mostly for use in situations where the Fighter is not the main tank of the group or raid. Currently, it is rarely used because it puts the Fighter that uses it in great danger becaues intercepted damage does not consider any mitigation.The next test update changes damage interception so the caster's mitigation is considered. This will help make off-tanking tactics more viable, especially for fighters that have ways to recover their own health.Summoner BalanceCurrently, Conjurers and Necromancers are a very powerful class that can deliver the most consistent damage in the shortest amount of time and can solo more powerful encounters than most other classes. One of the problems is that their single target damage can exceed that of Wizards in solo, group, and raid situations, even when hostile area effect damage is considered that can kill swarm and dumbfire pets.The next test update decreases the effectiveness of certain pet abilities and buffs that were overpowered. These changes don't necessarily mean that Wizards are always supposed to outdamage Summoners. Summoners can have favorable situations in long fights without large area effects that can tip the scales in their favor above Wizards. It shouldn't be the case anymore that Summoners outdamage Wizards the majority of the time after these changes, and Summoners will still retain relatively powerful soloability even after these changes. __________________ Thakar Lifebane Iksar Necromancer Lucan D'lere

05-10-2006, 09:37 AM	#2
Deila Tester Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 443	Heheh, yeps, looks like it's time. BUT - before anyone panics, let's see what happens. Looks to me like they're adjusting pet CAs (probably assassin pet, though warlock spells may have also been looked at), and my guess is adjustments to DPS and haste mods from pet buffs. We don't have LU24 on Test just yet - we're expecting it any time though. I've screenshotted all my pet abilities and persona windows, as well as all pet buffs, so I can compare now with later. Unfortunately, no pet or pet buff masters for me - things are much harder to come by on Test with the overall lower population, but at least we'll have a same-quality before and after look. All adept III, except for Grim Heretic at adept I (just can't seem to get advanced Sage 61 to drop for me, or it'd be adept III as well). __________________

05-10-2006, 09:54 AM	#3
Thakar Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 146	Deila wrote: Heheh, yeps, looks like it's time. BUT - before anyone panics, let's see what happens. Looks to me like they're adjusting pet CAs (probably assassin pet, though warlock spells may have also been looked at), and my guess is adjustments to DPS and haste mods from pet buffs. We don't have LU24 on Test just yet - we're expecting it any time though. I've screenshotted all my pet abilities and persona windows, as well as all pet buffs, so I can compare now with later. Unfortunately, no pet or pet buff masters for me - things are much harder to come by on Test with the overall lower population, but at least we'll have a same-quality before and after look. All adept III, except for Grim Heretic at adept I (just can't seem to get advanced Sage 61 to drop for me, or it'd be adept III as well). This is SOE...of course they'll go overboard with the nerfs. Well....at least it'll drive a good number of Summoners to quit so, more loot for me I suppose. __________________ Thakar Lifebane Iksar Necromancer Lucan D'lere

05-10-2006, 10:00 AM	#4
Deila Tester Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 443	Eh, not sure yet. I can't really compare the hit Rangers took here necessarily, since proc damage is often multiplicative, and more complex, than the way our pets deal damage which is more linear. Simpler system, so it seems that it'd be easier to adjust predictably. As I said though, I have no idea yet what changes have been made until LU24 patches to Test. I'll look when it does. If it's bad, then you may all panic. Until then though, hang tight. May just be some minor adjustments. No idea yet. __________________

05-10-2006, 12:02 PM	#7
Errie_Tholluxe Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 180	Deila wrote: Heheh, yeps, looks like it's time. BUT - before anyone panics, let's see what happens. Looks to me like they're adjusting pet CAs (probably assassin pet, though warlock spells may have also been looked at), and my guess is adjustments to DPS and haste mods from pet buffs. We don't have LU24 on Test just yet - we're expecting it any time though. I've screenshotted all my pet abilities and persona windows, as well as all pet buffs, so I can compare now with later. Unfortunately, no pet or pet buff masters for me - things are much harder to come by on Test with the overall lower population, but at least we'll have a same-quality before and after look. All adept III, except for Grim Heretic at adept I (just can't seem to get advanced Sage 61 to drop for me, or it'd be adept III as well). I look forward to a post from you with screenies letting us know :smileywink: Thanks Delia __________________ This is Pentium of Borg. Precision is futile. You will be approximated.

05-10-2006, 10:26 AM	#5
prince_sd Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 182	Rangers got the good end of soe nerf stick.Our dps is being put below wizards !! wizards for christ sake .. wizards do t3 dps right now.

05-10-2006, 11:18 AM	#6
BtilTheMage Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 138	"Rangers got the good end of soe nerf stick. Our dps is being put below wizards !! wizards for christ sake .. wizards do t3 dps right now." Don't worry, you'll still beat Warlocks on single target(99.99% of) DPS!

05-10-2006, 01:50 PM	#8
evhallion Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 330	Thakar wrote: It's that time again! Time for a new round of Summoner nerfs. Lockeye wrote: There are a few other changes that will impact multiple classes in the next test update: Damage Interception Fighters have a line of combat arts dedicated to intercepting damage, mostly for use in situations where the Fighter is not the main tank of the group or raid. Currently, it is rarely used because it puts the Fighter that uses it in great danger becaues intercepted damage does not consider any mitigation. The next test update changes damage interception so the caster's mitigation is considered. This will help make off-tanking tactics more viable, especially for fighters that have ways to recover their own health. Summoner Balance Currently, Conjurers and Necromancers are a very powerful class that can deliver the most consistent damage in the shortest amount of time and can solo more powerful encounters than most other classes. One of the problems is that their single target damage can exceed that of Wizards in solo, group, and raid situations, even when hostile area effect damage is considered that can kill swarm and dumbfire pets. The next test update decreases the effectiveness of certain pet abilities and buffs that were overpowered. These changes don't necessarily mean that Wizards are always supposed to outdamage Summoners. Summoners can have favorable situations in long fights without large area effects that can tip the scales in their favor above Wizards. It shouldn't be the case anymore that Summoners outdamage Wizards the majority of the time after these changes, and Summoners will still retain relatively powerful soloability even after these changes. I get the feeling this may hurt a bit..... __________________

05-10-2006, 03:13 PM	#9
Uanelven Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 465	The amount of hurt that is inflicted is yet to be seen but this will be a significant hit. Trying to soften the blow in a post like that tells me this really. Message Edited by Uanelven on 05-10-2006 04:21 AM __________________ Uanelven : - Necromancer -

05-10-2006, 04:32 PM	#10
KBern Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,372	Currently, Conjurers and Necromancers are a very powerful class that can deliver the most consistent damage in the shortest amount of time and can solo more powerful encounters than most other classes. Overall this was expected and I am not freaking out, but this part makes me laugh and shows how much they really dont know what other classes can do. We are beat in this category by beserkers, bruisers, monks, wizards and warlocks....and even wardens on some typs of mobs. But in the long run, I have a hard time not pulling agro on raids with my DPS. Nothing I can do, even with amends last night I was just killing the Paladin lol So I think as long as we are not hammered with the nerf bat, and just nudged as they say.....it is not so bad. __________________

05-10-2006, 04:33 PM	#11
KBern Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,372	Deila wrote: Heheh, yeps, looks like it's time. BUT - before anyone panics, let's see what happens. Looks to me like they're adjusting pet CAs (probably assassin pet, though warlock spells may have also been looked at), and my guess is adjustments to DPS and haste mods from pet buffs. We don't have LU24 on Test just yet - we're expecting it any time though. I've screenshotted all my pet abilities and persona windows, as well as all pet buffs, so I can compare now with later. Unfortunately, no pet or pet buff masters for me - things are much harder to come by on Test with the overall lower population, but at least we'll have a same-quality before and after look. All adept III, except for Grim Heretic at adept I (just can't seem to get advanced Sage 61 to drop for me, or it'd be adept III as well). Thank you Deila, keep us up to date. :smileyhappy: __________________

05-10-2006, 04:42 PM	#12
Jal General Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: UK Posts: 1,345	KBern wrote: But in the long run, I have a hard time not pulling agro on raids with my DPS. Nothing I can do, even with amends last night I was just killing the Paladin lol So I think as long as we are not hammered with the nerf bat, and just nudged as they say.....it is not so bad. Hehe i always get moaned at for peeling if i forget myself and go all out. Skywatcher + slow casting and agro is fine in most groups/raids but i can probably pull agro in most groups if i wanted to.

05-10-2006, 05:03 PM	#13
KBern Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,372	I temporarily changed my last name on the raid last night to Saurakk Dorfkillah :smileytongue: __________________

05-10-2006, 05:44 PM	#14
Barobra Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 560	BtilTheMage wrote: "Rangers got the good end of soe nerf stick. Our dps is being put below wizards !! wizards for christ sake .. wizards do t3 dps right now." Don't worry, you'll still beat Warlocks on single target(99.99% of) DPS! Wizards are not T3

05-10-2006, 05:46 PM	#15
Errie_Tholluxe Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 180	Barobrain wrote: BtilTheMage wrote: "Rangers got the good end of soe nerf stick.Our dps is being put below wizards !! wizards for christ sake .. wizards do t3 dps right now." Don't worry, you'll still beat Warlocks on single target(99.99% of) DPS! Wizards are not T3 Lol when the man has Illusionist in his sig, trust me he knows what he's talking about :smileyvery-happy: __________________ This is Pentium of Borg. Precision is futile. You will be approximated.

05-10-2006, 05:50 PM	#16
KBern Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,372	BAH he is just trying to hide his uber illusionist DPS!!11~ :smileywink: ^^ Winky face...winky face.... __________________

05-10-2006, 06:05 PM	#17
Barobra Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 560	Actually with help I can be uber. But by myself ya its kind of sad. But man I love a troub in my group. was parsing 1k-1.5k parses last night in raid with the troub. That one skill that makes every spell a proc roxorz your boxorz.

05-10-2006, 06:22 PM	#18
BtilTheMage Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 138	"Wizards are not T3 " I didn't say they were, it was a response. I type in red, not white!

05-10-2006, 06:32 PM	#19
Barobra Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 560	BtilTheMage wrote: "Wizards are not T3 " I didn't say they were, it was a response. I type in red, not white! I apologize I did actually mean to hit reply on the previous person.

05-10-2006, 08:02 PM	#20
Steven9 General Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 32	Currently, Conjurers and Necromancers are a very powerful class that can deliver the most consistent damage in the shortest amount of time and can solo more powerful encounters than most other classes. Is it just me or is that statment false for necs. I can outdps my entire raid on epic mobs that take forever to kill but when it comes to grp enconters who die fast i barely get a spell off. Necros to me only do very high dmg only on long encounters and for pvp we suck big time.Also for the second part that we can solo more powerful encounters i dont see as true either for my nec anyway. I got a 55nec on pvp server and was trying to solo the 51 ^^^ heroics in living tombs to spawn the named for the staff and i got owned so fast. Pet gets hit so hard and i got to constantly heal him killing myself. I also have a 60conj on pve serer and he can do some insane amount of dps with all my pet procs up. Also my conj solos heroics even con to him easy.Also on my 60 monk i solo even con and yellow heroics ^^^ so easy its not even funny yet they wanna nerf summoners and allow monks to be easily the best class since soe doesnt do anything to monks but make them better. Just my thoughts summoners are nowhere near be overpowered imo __________________ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- kenman wrote: It's because they're SOE. They completely revamp perfectly working systems instead of fixing actual bugs, it's like their trademark. . --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

05-10-2006, 08:03 PM	#21
Tallika_Runwithbears Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The Windy City Posts: 328	i like how calm we are compared to other classes. if something like this happened elsewhere you'd think they were anticipating the end of the world... whereas here we are all laid back with just a little bit of nervious anticipation. ok and a reasonable amount of dread while we wait for the other shoe to drop. __________________

05-10-2006, 08:27 PM	#22
danup Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 5	I don't get where's the problem to nerf us more. Do we solo better? We can do some soloing, hell yeah, dear devs we are a PET CLASS, in case u didn't noticed yet that means the pet takes damage we stay more or less alive doing dmg to the mobs, so we have some advantage to solo. OK! you made our pets to become paper dolls, a pet cannot hold a ^^^ heroic at similar lvl than us, so it hightly nerfed our "advantage", for non ^^^ heroics he can (sometimes) survive, does it really unbalance? I've seen wizards, warlocks, wardens, bruisers and coercer soloing in a way i cant even dream about. Do I whine about it? No, I don't. I assumed that I'm a DPS class with some soloing posibilities (like many other classes in the game). And our DPS comes mainly from the pet dmg, our dots are not kinda uber dps.. the only way do make nice dmg is tapping the mobs (for 1500 at m2) As many ppl said, yes in long fights we can do a lot of dmg, but in usual groups y can barely land 2 dots and 1 tap, and yeah my pet does pretty more dmg than me. I agree conjurors were overpowered at the begining of the game, but that was solved long time ago for christ shake, it's getting really anoying to be always waiting for new nerfs. I don¡t care if a wiz or whatever can make more dmg than me, I just want to know my way to play and my abilities will be the ones I have, and I want to be useful for the group, so instead of be EverBalancing2 (I still remembering in EQ1 you are still balancing classes) I would advice you to look for the real problems in the game, and the supposed to be non intended things on game. And please respect the roles of the classes in the game.

05-10-2006, 08:29 PM	#23
Barobra Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 560	danup wrote: I don't get where's the problem to nerf us more. Do we solo better? We can do some soloing, hell yeah, dear devs we are a PET CLASS, in case u didn't noticed yet that means the pet takes damage we stay more or less alive doing dmg to the mobs, so we have some advantage to solo. OK! you made our pets to become paper dolls, a pet cannot hold a ^^^ heroic at similar lvl than us, so it hightly nerfed our "advantage", for non ^^^ heroics he can (sometimes) survive, does it really unbalance? I've seen wizards, warlocks, wardens, bruisers and coercer soloing in a way i cant even dream about. Do I whine about it? No, I don't. I assumed that I'm a DPS class with some soloing posibilities (like many other classes in the game). And our DPS comes mainly from the pet dmg, our dots are not kinda uber dps.. the only way do make nice dmg is tapping the mobs (for 1500 at m2) As many ppl said, yes in long fights we can do a lot of dmg, but in usual groups y can barely land 2 dots and 1 tap, and yeah my pet does pretty more dmg than me. I agree conjurors were overpowered at the begining of the game, but that was solved long time ago for christ shake, it's getting really anoying to be always waiting for new nerfs. I don¡t care if a wiz or whatever can make more dmg than me, I just want to know my way to play and my abilities will be the ones I have, and I want to be useful for the group, so instead of be EverBalancing2 (I still remembering in EQ1 you are still balancing classes) I would advice you to look for the real problems in the game, and the supposed to be non intended things on game. And please respect the roles of the classes in the game. My guess is Sony wants to nerf every class until no one is able to solo heroics. :smileyhappy:

05-10-2006, 08:48 PM	#24
Ze General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 203	Necros own the nerfbat. __________________ There is no Zerp

05-10-2006, 09:01 PM	#25
Deila Tester Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 443	Tallika_Runwithbears wrote: i like how calm we are compared to other classes. if something like this happened elsewhere you'd think they were anticipating the end of the world... whereas here we are all laid back with just a little bit of nervious anticipation. ok and a reasonable amount of dread while we wait for the other shoe to drop. Yeah, the waiting's the hardest part. No idea to what degree changes will come, and only speculation. Wild speculation, in the case of some (especially non-summoners). Gotta love those dev posts that say 'you're being nerfed', but won't specify how much. :smileysurprised: Patience, Necromancers. Might be bad, might not. No sense in getting into a panic until we see something. Tell you what though - second thing I'll be doing (right after I get the screenies of the adjusted pet abilities, buffs, etc. to show you all) is running my tank pet through his paces of things I've been able up to now to solo with a good fight to see how he's been affected. __________________

05-10-2006, 10:03 PM	#26
Allowen Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 126	I belive this change will hurt the conjurros more then it wil ldo on necros because their pets can do a bit more dps,tank a bit better then undying dreadnout, uber pet buffs like he mitigatio ngrou pbuff that raises 20defense(probably will get nefred) and their ancient lv 65 spell. What bothers me is not the reduce on pet s dps but also is that they might tank even worst if was nto enough pets having super low resisatace then after LU 24 even poor fighter pet will die to the 1st mob that does aoe magical spell. Welcome back to EQ1 it seems where our spectre pets could barely tank some thing, we had to raise hp/avoidance/mitigation on ourselves if we wanted to solo tank some mobs,that coul;d summon and stuff like that..Pet no way could do much on high end raids, and kept dieing .... I recommend for necros in here that are used to only solo mobs using warrior pet that they start to pratice doing that with scout or mage pet and spend some aa skills on avoidance(parry/cabalist cover) and raise critical hits and get priority on master spells that can heal so we will still be able to solo well, we wil ltank mobs when our super weak pets cant. Btw since they will nerf pets I would ask that they could make necro pet nightshade master 1 a bit less ultra rare because as far as I know on most servers there are aroudn 15 lv 60 pets for 1 nightshade. This is not fair ! Allowen necromancer of MM server Lords of the triple moons

05-10-2006, 10:33 PM	#27
Supa Mint Flava Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Neriak - Qeynos Posts: 220	Am very curious about the degree to which the nerf will affect conjuror vs. necro. Also, SOE has a habit of announcing changes that come out entirely different as intended. I still remember when the big combat revamp was supposed to be mage>scout>tank>priest in terms of DPS. Talk about liberal exceptions to the rule (I have a 70 dirge as well....sad dps; we won't even talk about solo ability). Probably the most frustrating part of being nerfed is that it can change the degree of enjoyment of a toon that you've spent an incredibly amount of time developing. But, guess that's one of the things we all know can and does happen. Still isn't any fun. I switched from necro to Defiler for raiding anyway . __________________

05-10-2006, 10:55 PM	#28
ShadowDragon32 Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 98	Im hoping the nerf isn't too bad. If it is then I might try that new game coming out called Vanguard. The more i read about this game the more i think it could be a superpower in the MMORPG arena. IMO it gets kinda old when the SOE development team continues to dumb down the classes. Takes the fun out of it. Good Luck... __________________

05-10-2006, 11:21 PM	#29
Errie_Tholluxe Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 180	Hey ! Get station pass and you can still even pop in on EQ2 to see whether it got better ! :smileyvery-happy: __________________ This is Pentium of Borg. Precision is futile. You will be approximated.

05-11-2006, 12:02 AM	#30
Thakar Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 146	Tallika_Runwithbears wrote:i like how calm we are compared to other classes. if something like this happened elsewhere you'd think they were anticipating the end of the world... whereas here we are all laid back with just a little bit of nervious anticipation. ok and a reasonable amount of dread while we wait for the other shoe to drop. Probably because we've been through this many times before and will go through it more in the future...SOE has a history of nerfing Necromancers. We eventually just sulk in bitter silence and replace the image files of various mobs with pictures of the devs. __________________ Thakar Lifebane Iksar Necromancer Lucan D'lere