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Old 12-07-2011, 02:08 AM   #1
Tigress

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This red-name post is going to get buried.  In fact, it already has and it's just going to get worse.  I copy & quote it here so all can easily find it.

rl_soe wrote:

Hi folks, this is Rich Lawrence, CTO with SOE. Some of you probably remember me from original Planetside as "Twist". TR rules, but I digress.

I must apologize for the extended down time of EQ2 while we get everything in order for free to play. Obviously we didn't anticipate it being this long. I know how important it is for the game to be available when you want to play, and what it means to miss a raid you were looking forward to, or check out new features. In this case the issues that are keeping you from playing are under my watch, so I need to say it: I'm sorry. I value my game time as well when I can get it, and I know how you feel.

EQ2 is a great product with a long history for us, and part of the reason we are taking so long on this update is because of that. Let me explain a bit. In order for everyone that played in the past or currently to get the best experience when logging in on the first day of free to play, there were many changes that had to be made in data to represent all of the features those players (past or present) were entitled to, plus new goodies, and the merge of what amounts to two different products in a business sense (EQ2 and EQ2X). This is a lot of accounts - millions - and a lot of 'business rule' complexity. While we have top of the line hardware running our databases for this kind of thing, and folks dedicated just to keeping it working well, the result of all that took quite a bit longer than we thought it would.

I hear the engineers of you out there (and yes, I know we have many very capable developers in our audience) saying, "But you should have modeled it ahead of time and known how long it would take!". You're absolutely right. We did. Turns out our model was just a tad less than 1:1 scale in some respects. I know, I know, Captain Obvious calling.

In the end we realized two things as the maintenance progressed - that this was going to take much longer than we thought it would, and correspondingly the results would be not as well tested as they should be before release. For instance, there was a risk that some out of those millions might not end up with the right race packs or character slots. In the end, we decided it was best to extend the maintenance through the night so we could do a better job of checking that kind of thing.

Please understand that we don't do this casually or think that it's a lack of dedication. Most of the key people involved in this publish, on the game team and our platform side, have been here very long days and every day leading up to this. I just had to tell some folks that had been here for 30+ hours to go get some sleep. If there was any way I thought we could be certain you'd be able to play with everything correct tonight, we would have done that.

I'm committed to changing how we do this type of operation going forward so that it has much less visible impact on you the players - we will trade more back end prep time and resources against less publish downtime, basically. I do hope everybody enjoys the massive effort the game team has put into this release. I'll see you online tomorrow.

Thank you, RL SOE, I appreciate your candor.

http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...topic_id=510214

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Old 12-07-2011, 02:14 AM   #2
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Thank you Tigress. And even more .. thank you Rich for what could amount to ... honesty and no beating around the bush.

Very much appreciated.

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Old 12-07-2011, 02:16 AM   #3
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Yep. Found it myself before it was buried. Thanks Twist.

BTW. TR does rule!

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Old 12-07-2011, 02:17 AM   #4
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I just hope that he's serious about making this kind of thing something of the past, its gotten old, and in 7 years of EQ2, alot more if you include the EQ1 time....well, it shouldn't be happening, period.  I can understand and respect the balls and humility it took to make this post; a huge admittance of "sorry guys, I'm in charge of this and I F**KED up".  So, Kudos on taking responsibility, and hopefully we really are in game tomorrow.

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Old 12-07-2011, 02:21 AM   #5
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Smed tweet: j_smedley (@j_smedley) 12/6/11 11:06 PM sorry for the extended downtime for EQ2. It's taking longer than anticipated. we expect it to be up by 10am PST. more tmw morning early https://twitter.com/j_smedley/statu...281613969272832
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Old 12-07-2011, 02:25 AM   #6
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i got beta invite 48 hrs ago....

thats not the problem their having though, all of the merging of 2 seperate game clients that should have happened when eq2 went ftp in the first place.

best launch since Vanguard though is what the press will say.

sad year for SOE, SMILEY my fav game shot down in a blaze of glory... if you can call this expansion glory...

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Old 12-07-2011, 02:25 AM   #7
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Thank you, RL SOE, If only more at SOE would follow your lead (community relations) things would most likely not get so heated on the boards

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Old 12-07-2011, 02:27 AM   #8
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This is not directed at anyone in this thread but as a whole ....

Sometimes these forums make me really sad.  I love coming here for discussions about the game but all I have been reading is negativity after negativity.

I would rather them hold back the game to make sure it is done right, then open the servers up and find the coding a half baked pice of [bleep].

Heck, I'm sure MANY of you know upset you can get when console games or pc games come out bugged ... Skyrim anyone?  And how did that turn out?  The forums flooded with bugs and venomous posts ... not a welcoming place to go.

So sure, I'm excited about DoV and yeah, I will admit right here I am quite addicted to the whole game (2500 quests done and counting, decorating a huge New Halas mansion, crafting, alts, exploring, etc) and I sat each hour waiting to see if stuff is up ... but for the love of everything that is holy, PLEASE let them do their work.

Brasse was on the Jethal show LIVE tonight, and she sounded proud and honest that there are people there with sleeping bags and staying there to get this done.  [bleep] happens.  Coding is done by human beings who make mistakes.  But all I see is people [bleep] and moan about how "they could do better", or "SoE fails", etc.  I suggest you get on a plane or in your car and go work there to see how hard it is.

*sigh*  Had to get that off my chest.  Now, how about we all get some sleep, or for those in Europe a nice cup of coffee or tea and get ready for work or a nice day, and be ready to play when the servers come up tomorrow! 

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Old 12-07-2011, 02:42 AM   #9
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I also listened to the cast on show.

The questions were low-ball at best.

I love Brasse and her tanacity, the bearded dwarf can't be beat.  She also works for a corporation and has a reputation to uphold for her colleagues and own personal gain/survival.

This has been my game, something I've grown very fond of over the last 7 years + years in eq1.

My most dispappointing aspect was her lack of knowledge on the actual expansion.  It was a lot of this sounds really cool, this  is going to be neat, the dev team has worked so hard.  But she had no idea on any of the features beyond being excited to start playing them.... Community manager mind you....?!

Just makes me sad. This is the best game out there. But it's taken a 360 degree turn in the last 9 months... SMILEY

If they listen to the community then I dont know. Could care less about the expansion. I'm not the only one.

Just what about all of us who have played forever?  No CoolAid talk, straight up? serious?

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Old 12-07-2011, 03:02 AM   #10
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[email protected] Bayle wrote:

This is not directed at anyone in this thread but as a whole ....

Sometimes these forums make me really sad.  I love coming here for discussions about the game but all I have been reading is negativity after negativity.

The worst part is that it's all the same complaints over and over, most of which were answered in one or more interviews or statements, but they don't want to accept the answers.  SJ's not a min/max grindfest to 90/300 believer, and no number of threads are likely to change his mind.

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Old 12-07-2011, 03:09 AM   #11
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Kasar wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

This is not directed at anyone in this thread but as a whole ....

Sometimes these forums make me really sad.  I love coming here for discussions about the game but all I have been reading is negativity after negativity.

The worst part is that it's all the same complaints over and over, most of which were answered in one or more interviews or statements, but they don't want to accept the answers.  SJ's not a min/max grindfest to 90/300 believer, and no number of threads are likely to change his mind.

im not sure what either comment has to do with the topic of the thread.

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Old 12-07-2011, 03:23 AM   #12
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Kasar wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

This is not directed at anyone in this thread but as a whole ....

Sometimes these forums make me really sad.  I love coming here for discussions about the game but all I have been reading is negativity after negativity.

The worst part is that it's all the same complaints over and over, most of which were answered in one or more interviews or statements, but they don't want to accept the answers.  SJ's not a min/max grindfest to 90/300 believer, and no number of threads are likely to change his mind.

Funny enough you're the ones complaining in a "Thank you for keeping us informed" thread...

Thanks rl_soe for this post (which beat the "Soon" or "slightly delayed" we're usualy fed) and Tigress for digging it from a "monster thread"

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Old 12-07-2011, 03:33 AM   #13
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Yeah no kiddin', way to derail the a 'real info' thread with more non related whines about whining.

Anyway, its more dev hours, but in the future they need to do a minor/magor migration with a merge at the end.  That way they can preprocess the expensive long data conversions (ie the paid to F2P adjustments) done while live servers are still live and doing the xp, level, inventory, quest, etc stuff that don't need to be screwed with during the update.  Then merge the two.

Its certainly oversimplified but however you implement it... apply the delta update methodology to the backend that you do the game client.

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Old 12-07-2011, 03:45 AM   #14
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thanks to the Red for candor and up front info. really, most of us just want MORE of that on the game in general and not just when things get out of hand.

i hope your candor Red will be a sign of change in SoE's lack of candor in the past. we appreciate it greatly.

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Old 12-07-2011, 03:46 AM   #15
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Sad thing is in any other industry this kind of technology "SNAFU" would end up with multiple people being shown the door.

If you have not come to the harsh reality that the computer gaming realm has long ago established that it can treat it's customers pretty much as poorly as they like, develop, maket and sell substandard/non-functional products and conduct day to day operations as if this is the steam age and not the digital age then you are either very new to computer gaming or hopelessly naieve...

Any other product/service would suffer fatal blows from anyone of these but not gaming.

So the next time you get all worked up about this take a good long look in the mirror because you're looking at the reason it happens.   As consumers if we tolerate/accept it and keep on making companies profitable why in the world would they change?

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Old 12-07-2011, 03:54 AM   #16
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Tigress wrote:

to aidn0816:  only when ppl try to derail a thread that i started.  slightly off-topic, no.  derail, yes.

I hardly see it as de-railing a thread...

The way it looked to me was that he(or she) was saying that they understand that what SOE is doing is tough work. Telling everyone to stop complaining, and that if you don't like it, than you go do SEO's job. They did post on topic, and they were actually showing sypathy for SOE.

Now, back on topic, I am glad that there was an official word, and I am glad that we play games  from a company that has the gall to admit a mistake was made.I'm also glad that in the end SOE generally does right by their customers. Thanks SOE! No hard feelings Rich.

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Old 12-07-2011, 04:03 AM   #17
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i didn't view their complaining posts about ppl complaining as a derail, either.  they were both slightly off-topic but not worthy of a report to mod.  my reply to them was hoping that it wouldn't turn into another whinefest about ppl complaining abt complainers.  my comment abt derailing was directly to the person who decided it would be fun to take a stab at me in a thread that i started to be helpful & informative.  that is why i began my reply as " to aidn0816..."

i am glad that there was official word, too.  from what i read, they were doing it all along on facebook but i dont do facebook so to have a redname finally post an update here was perfect.  (that makes 3 updates since yesterday.)  just glad that the last one let us know "not till at least tmrw".  i doubt that it will be ready at 10am.  hopefully, they'll post another update when (if) it is not ready at that point.

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