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Old 08-08-2012, 05:30 AM   #1
Jrral

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Has anyone noticed problems with the group window click-to-cure in the default UI since the new window went in. I needed to diff the window XML files to update ProfitUI, and I noticed that all the cureplayer commands reference g2 (group member 2) regardless of which slot they're in. That'd definitely break things badly. I also noticed that all the slots refer to group member 1's dynamic data regardless of which slot it is, which'd also cause a broken display (healers for instance would see group member 1's health, detrimentals etc. in every slot, making it impossible to figure out who needed to be healed or cured).

I can't imagine this kind of bug getting past even a cursory QA check. And I can't imagine it actually making it live without causing complaints left and right. If nobody else is seeing this, I'm curious as to why since it'd mean the game client isn't obeying SOE's own UI XML.

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Old 08-08-2012, 10:45 AM   #2
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The group window has been made larger, and can't be resized.  My click to cure was "off-kilter" on group members 3 through 6, with the amount of difference increasing with each member.  I could click "on" the dep icon in members 1 and 2 and cure.  With 3 I had to click a little above the icon.. with 4 a little higher yet.. with 5 I had to click midway in between 4 and 5.. and with 6 I had to click just under group member 5's icons.  ( I don't know if that made any sense)  I do use Profit so I just associated that with having to wait until you were able to get an update in for the UI.  After hearing others talk in raid last night, everyone's group window was resized and "not right".

I didn't notice if the click to cures were actually curing the correct group member or not, since I just used the raid window (which did work) or group cures.

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Old 08-08-2012, 12:09 PM   #3
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Yes, they broke this with the update.

I'm not terribly surprised, as since they don't play the game, they didn't understand the impact the changes they made to the window would make.

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Old 08-08-2012, 01:14 PM   #4
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I could resize the window, I had to unlock it first of course. The backdrop (the part in Profit that creates the translucent background) is smaller than the current size needed to hold all the group members, so it looks too small. Mouse around the bottom edge (or the right edge) while it's unlocked and you should find a spot where you get the resize arrows. The raid window wasn't modified in this update, thankfully.

The misalignment's exactly what I'm seeing. The light-up detrimental icons are lined up where they ought to be, but the reactive button part and the quick-raid buttons are progressively further up. You can see the misalignment even on the second group-member slot, it's just not enough to keep things from working. By #4 the QRBs are actually halfway underneath #3's detrimental icons. But they work, so I think if I can figure out the exact sizing I can adjust those elements to line things back up right.

But even the default UI's window is broken. According to the XML, every group member will be showing the voice icon and detrimentals for group member 1. That'd make it all but impossible to use the default group window in any fight that depended on curing, since the healers wouldn't know who had which detrimentals on them. So either the default group window's broken badly, or the window ignores large swathes of the UI XML and hard-codes behavior (which makes life problematic for me).

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Old 08-08-2012, 01:38 PM   #5
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I was able to resize the window to show all 6 group members and all of the det icons, but the whole thing is just larger now than it used to be and really messed with my screen real estate.  Time to shuffle and adjust.  Last night I didn't notice that the quick raid buttons were also off kilter, since I only use those in the raid window.  Thank god they didn't mess with that.

I don't envy your chore in trying to fix Profit because of this mess Jrral, and I am very much appreciative of all of the work you do to keep Profit UI alive and effective.  SMILEY

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Old 08-08-2012, 02:21 PM   #6
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[email protected] wrote:

I don't envy your chore in trying to fix Profit because of this mess Jrral, and I am very much appreciative of all of the work you do to keep Profit UI alive and effective. 

Thanks. It's mostly selfish: I use Profit, I'm comfortable with it, and I really don't want to put in the effort to learn a different UI (using the default's not an option, it's too big to fit everything on-screen without obscuring too much or having things too far apart). And if I'm updating it for myself, sending it to Kaldran to put on the updater's no extra effort. I'm just worried that SOE's taking less and less care to keep things to where we can mod them (witness the XP bar window).

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Old 08-08-2012, 02:34 PM   #7
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I've just submitted the fix for this. Thanks for finding it! SMILEY

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Old 08-08-2012, 02:37 PM   #8
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I swear, its like you guys don't unit test at all.

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Old 08-08-2012, 07:56 PM   #9
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Terrogaunt wrote:

I've just submitted the fix for this. Thanks for finding it!

It is very fustrating that within hours of the servers going live after Patch Tuesday there are so many players complaining about the same exact issues with the default UI.  These have not been one-of and off the wall bugs.  It didn't take long after go live for players to encounter issues recently with casting bars not working - and now we have click to cure and non-editable group window size problems.

I am hoping that SOE recognizes this is a critical issue and does not force its players to wait a week while this fix navigates the Fix-It-Next-Tuesday process.

Players shouldn't have suffer for SOE's failure to properly QA their code and then be subjected to waiting a whole week while the fix goes through normal workflow. 

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Old 08-09-2012, 04:30 AM   #10
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It was very difficult yesterday to do skyshrine UD; my grp window was messed up badly.  I changed to ProfitUI and back to Drums trying to find the problem, loaded the default and same problem.  Very difficult to cure when you can't even see the icon.  Went back to Drums and with some help from a friend found a workaround.

I don't see how this wouldn't have been seen in Test (if indeed it were tested).  Good to see they are fixing it but why is everything that is a new feature (SoEmote, voice fonts) so much trouble? Seems like a Jenga puzzle: pull out a piece and hope the tower doesn't collapse.

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Old 08-09-2012, 05:58 AM   #11
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[email protected] wrote:

I swear, its like you guys don't unit test at all.

Of course they don't unit test, or run any other type of test, even manual, like login and play the game for 10 minutes.

We got a bunch of junior developers now. That in itself is not necesarily a bad thing except they are stuck with a horrible code base and have to learn from the previous "experts" who more than likely don't even know what TDD is, let alone teach others about professional development and methodologies.

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Old 08-09-2012, 06:01 AM   #12
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[email protected] Bayle wrote:

It was very difficult yesterday to do skyshrine UD; my grp window was messed up badly.  I changed to ProfitUI and back to Drums trying to find the problem, loaded the default and same problem.  Very difficult to cure when you can't even see the icon.  Went back to Drums and with some help from a friend found a workaround.

I don't see how this wouldn't have been seen in Test (if indeed it were tested).  Good to see they are fixing it but why is everything that is a new feature (SoEmote, voice fonts) so much trouble? Seems like a Jenga puzzle: pull out a piece and hope the tower doesn't collapse.

Simply because Eq2 has grown to be a massive product. It was put together by different people, who did not work together as a team and all of them did their own thing without thinking of future developments and without even attempting to build a scalable product. There is no test infrastructure, no QA and the devs don't play the game at all.

Right now, getting something out the door is much more important than quality and we are the ones left paying for it. Well, hoever many there are left, that is.

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Old 08-09-2012, 02:23 PM   #13
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It looks like this bug was introduced in a change that didn't have anything to do with combat, so I'd guess it's pretty easy for it to go unnoticed when you're not actually fighting things.

Anyway, the dynamic data for the debuffs and click to cure as well as the pet data section should be functioning correctly again. If anyone see's any further weird-ness about it, be sure to get back to me and I'll be happy to look into it.

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Old 08-09-2012, 03:34 PM   #14
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Terrogaunt wrote:

It looks like this bug was introduced in a change that didn't have anything to do with combat, so I'd guess it's pretty easy for it to go unnoticed when you're not actually fighting things.

Anyway, the dynamic data for the debuffs and click to cure as well as the pet data section should be functioning correctly again. If anyone see's any further weird-ness about it, be sure to get back to me and I'll be happy to look into it.

Did you address the issue that with soemote turned off, and the faces not displayed in the group window, that the minimum size of the window is now 250% larger than it was prior to this release?  

We should be able to scale this window down to only what is displayed in it when we have the soemote/faces disabled.

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Old 08-09-2012, 03:43 PM   #15
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[email protected] wrote:

Terrogaunt wrote:

It looks like this bug was introduced in a change that didn't have anything to do with combat, so I'd guess it's pretty easy for it to go unnoticed when you're not actually fighting things.

Anyway, the dynamic data for the debuffs and click to cure as well as the pet data section should be functioning correctly again. If anyone see's any further weird-ness about it, be sure to get back to me and I'll be happy to look into it.

Did you address the issue that with soemote turned off, and the faces not displayed in the group window, that the minimum size of the window is now 250% larger than it was prior to this release?  

We should be able to scale this window down to only what is displayed in it when we have the soemote/faces disabled.

This.  I logged in last night to play and my group window was overlapping my heal hot bar.  I don't have a lot of spare real estate on my screen to start with, and the inability to resize this window back to it's original size really set me back. I'm having to reorganize a screen that I've had set the same way for six years.  I'm used to my set up.  I want it back. Please allow for resizing smaller than its current smallest size.

I honestly don't get angry at SOE often, in fact, I rather support them. Last night, I was angry.  I don't even use SOEmote and it managed to screw with my evening...

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Old 08-09-2012, 05:09 PM   #16
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The window is still broken, it is too big and is causing alot of issues with Click to cast. Please do not tell us that we need to fix our custom UIs... This is a problem with the default group window. Something is not sized correctly and with click to cast turned on to the side ( drums) it is only showing it for groupmember 0( myself). Please put the fix in for this... You guys managed to put in 3 useless features ( and I mean completely useless) and break about 5 things that were working 100% fine. Does anyone else see a pattern? Making changes to the UI is understandable , if it is NEEDED.. Stretching my group window for something 92% of the playerbase will never use ( except making faces at raid form up) is not acceptable. You can add all the fluff and all the useless stuff you want but, please do not have it break stuff that we need to play the game. Now we'll have to wait a couple of weeks for one of the devs to get it right. The current "fix" didn't make a difference for me at all. Something is still wrong. Please make it so that it is the way it was with SoEmote turned off and turned on, you can stretch it across the whole screen for all I care.
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Old 08-10-2012, 11:39 AM   #17
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After the game update, and the Profit UI update, my group window worked perfectly last night in raid.  Thank you to the devs, and Jrral for getting this all straightened out.  SMILEY

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Old 08-10-2012, 11:45 AM   #18
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Luckily I saved the old default group window for my EQ2Maps folder.. that new window is too large in general. Seems you can not resize it down to the old default size.

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Old 08-10-2012, 02:13 PM   #19
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Ahlana wrote:

Luckily I saved the old default group window for my EQ2Maps folder.. that new window is too large in general. Seems you can not resize it down to the old default size.

Yes. The 96-pixel SOEmote image elements are a permanent fixture in the UI XML. The client pops them in and out depending on the toggle, but the height of the group member elements doesn't change and includes the vertical space for the portraits regardless of whether they render or not. The only fix is a custom group window.

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Old 08-10-2012, 02:28 PM   #20
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[email protected] wrote:

Terrogaunt wrote:

It looks like this bug was introduced in a change that didn't have anything to do with combat, so I'd guess it's pretty easy for it to go unnoticed when you're not actually fighting things.

Anyway, the dynamic data for the debuffs and click to cure as well as the pet data section should be functioning correctly again. If anyone see's any further weird-ness about it, be sure to get back to me and I'll be happy to look into it.

Did you address the issue that with soemote turned off, and the faces not displayed in the group window, that the minimum size of the window is now 250% larger than it was prior to this release?  

We should be able to scale this window down to only what is displayed in it when we have the soemote/faces disabled.

Bingo.  This is the problem I have.  Quite anoying as I have to shift my UI around and my screen isn't that huge as it is.  Meh.

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Old 08-10-2012, 02:47 PM   #21
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[email protected] wrote:

Ahlana wrote:

Luckily I saved the old default group window for my EQ2Maps folder.. that new window is too large in general. Seems you can not resize it down to the old default size.

Yes. The 96-pixel SOEmote image elements are a permanent fixture in the UI XML. The client pops them in and out depending on the toggle, but the height of the group member elements doesn't change and includes the vertical space for the portraits regardless of whether they render or not. The only fix is a custom group window.

/facepalm

SOE, you've got to be kidding. Please, get this right. I don't have SOEmote enabled, I don't want anything to do with it, & I don't want to have to use a custom group window just to have my interface the way I want it.

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Old 08-10-2012, 03:51 PM   #22
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[email protected] wrote:

Ahlana wrote:

Luckily I saved the old default group window for my EQ2Maps folder.. that new window is too large in general. Seems you can not resize it down to the old default size.

Yes. The 96-pixel SOEmote image elements are a permanent fixture in the UI XML. The client pops them in and out depending on the toggle, but the height of the group member elements doesn't change and includes the vertical space for the portraits regardless of whether they render or not. The only fix is a custom group window.

Yeap, and SoE doesn't seem to want to comment on it or fix it.  My guess is they want the window to be forced to this size to encourage players to turn the things on.   But thats just my tinfoil hat talking.

I found I had to turn them on, then drag the window off the top of the screen (so the faces aren't rendered) and I have my group window 'working' again in default UI.   This is much the same way that I moved the SC button on the XP bar off the window as well...

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Old 08-13-2012, 07:03 PM   #23
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Any ETA on the default UI group window getting fixed?

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Old 08-14-2012, 02:33 AM   #24
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Well at least Profit is working SMILEY

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Old 08-14-2012, 02:02 PM   #25
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[email protected] wrote:

Any ETA on the default UI group window getting fixed?

I don't think they consider it a bug. And I don't think they've got anyone familiar enough with UI modding to make it work. I could do it, it's the same kind of code that Profit uses for the horizontal/vertical orientation switching, but it's a lot of really messy code.

And no, I do not intend to add the portrait windows to Profit. Ever. The code's enough of a pain as it is.

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Old 08-14-2012, 02:59 PM   #26
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[email protected] wrote:

[email protected] wrote:

Any ETA on the default UI group window getting fixed?

I don't think they consider it a bug. And I don't think they've got anyone familiar enough with UI modding to make it work. I could do it, it's the same kind of code that Profit uses for the horizontal/vertical orientation switching, but it's a lot of really messy code.

And no, I do not intend to add the portrait windows to Profit. Ever. The code's enough of a pain as it is.

Yeah, I can make a custom ui that works as well.

I'm waiting for them to fix the default though, or even acknowledge the issue.  

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Old 08-14-2012, 03:42 PM   #27
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I just asked about this and it sounds like you can shrink the window back down manually after disabling SOEmote. Have you already tried that?

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Old 08-14-2012, 04:21 PM   #28
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Terrogaunt wrote:

I just asked about this and it sounds like you can shrink the window back down manually after disabling SOEmote. Have you already tried that?

Should we have to? Is there a fix still going in, or is it workaround time for the players yet again...and why can't we have it enabled and size the window?

There's no chance that I'll ever enable soemo. I'm just asking.

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Old 08-14-2012, 04:54 PM   #29
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its kind lame that the profit dev can design this feature  and have this working flawlesly for years and soe steals the idea, breaks it trying to implement something totaly unrelated.

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Old 08-14-2012, 05:50 PM   #30
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Terrogaunt wrote:

I just asked about this and it sounds like you can shrink the window back down manually after disabling SOEmote. Have you already tried that?

I know the window can be resized, but I didn't think the group member elements within it changed height to fit. The UI XML says they're a fixed 96 pixel height, and there's no code there to trigger changes though with the amount of hard-coding in the group window already that's no sure indication. I'll have to wait until servers come back up and I can set up a group.

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