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Old 06-11-2008, 01:49 PM   #91
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[email protected] wrote:
  I don't want to replace an inq with a temp, but instead I want to have both just like exileds do.
Same - I want to keep an inqy with the melee DPS grp - where they belong, and I'd like a templar too.
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Old 06-11-2008, 01:52 PM   #92
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I'm all for giving the cities all classes, then they will maybe understand what we mean when we say that it is impossible to progress when you don't have a constant raid force, and you have 1/2 of the raid made up by complete slackers.And just to start up some fun... it isn't gear that makes the exiles hard to beat - before we ever had any mythicals in our guild we were constantly faced with 2 to 1 or 3 to 1 odds and would win the majority of the time.  It is commonplace for us to take on 12+ people with 4 to 6, even sometimes 20+ with 5 or 6.
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Old 06-11-2008, 07:01 PM   #93
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And at the same time, a full group of us can wipe to a group of 3 or 4. It all boils down to the people playing and how much they're paying attention and prepaired.
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Old 06-11-2008, 07:34 PM   #94
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I was a little taken back after seeing Synter's response there.. Circle of Storms wiped a full group of VA at druid rings in KP with only three of us, and we've "lost to" and "beat" VA multiple times in equal sized groups.

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Old 06-11-2008, 07:49 PM   #95
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Sightless wrote:

I was a little taken back after seeing Synter's response there.. Circle of Storms wiped a full group of VA at druid rings in KP with only three of us, and we've "lost to" and "beat" VA multiple times in equal sized groups.

Exactly.  You and Win loose, gear isn't everything.  Being an exile doesn't automatically give you superior gear.We are just players like hte rest of you!!! Stop the hating!
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Old 06-11-2008, 09:03 PM   #96
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[email protected] wrote:
I'm all for giving the cities all classes, then they will maybe understand what we mean when we say that it is impossible to progress when you don't have a constant raid force, and you have 1/2 of the raid made up by complete slackers.And just to start up some fun... it isn't gear that makes the exiles hard to beat - before we ever had any mythicals in our guild we were constantly faced with 2 to 1 or 3 to 1 odds and would win the majority of the time.  It is commonplace for us to take on 12+ people with 4 to 6, even sometimes 20+ with 5 or 6.

I won't begin to say what you do and don't (or can and can't) do on Veneker server.   On nagafen, one single group of exileds could not take down a x2 or x3 of city factioned folks pre-RoK.   When they got gear in VP and nobody else did, that made them able to hold up to two to three times the number of pvp targets.   Then getting mythicals only increased the rate at which they could wipe 2 or 3 groups with their one group.   You are only proving what we are arguing about.  We DEMAND an even playing field.   With all classes, it WILL assist city factions to get to the point where exileds already are.  It will also give more options for pvp groups.

I disagree with your point that it isn't the gear that makes exileds hard to beat.  Yes, it is.   If it weren't for the gear, there is no way in hell that one group of anyone could hold up and continually fight 2 or 3 groups for half an hour and not one single person in that group be below 85% power.   You exileds sometimes act as if you are the most skilled of all skilled when it comes to pvp, and that is entirely not true.   There are many city factioned folks that are better skilled in pvp than many exiled folks.   The gear gives such a huge advantage.   So get off your high horse.   You think you got skill?  Prove it.   Take on 2 to 1 or 3 to 1 odds with equivilant gear to the city factions.   You won't because you can't.    If there were a way to set up a contest of skill, that would prove it once and for all.   Every single person in the game has access to playermade gear.   If only something could have been set up to and a way to regulate it to make sure nobody cheated where there would be a big battle royale and the only gear you could wear was player made armor, jewelry, and weapons (unadorned); how well do you think you exileds would fair then against 2 to 1 or 3 to 1 odds?   I doubt you'd fair so well with even odds.

You go out there with your high end RoK raid gear and mythicals and come here and present yourselves as having it so hard in ezmode.  You downgrade everyone in city factions saying none of us are skilled, dedicated, etc.   Calling us slackers and etc.  You have absolutely no clue as to the amount of dedication many of us put in to progressing without the advantage of access to all classes that you ezmoders have.   We learn encounters just the same...wipe after wipe, until we finally figure out a way to bring down our target with what we have.    FP doesn't have templars for MT support and Q doesn't have brigands for dispatch.   And while I can't say as to what any Q guild does (or any OTHER FP guild for that matter), Betrayed is out there every single raid wiping and figuring raids out.   We just killed Overking for the first time after many unsuccessful attempts.  Why is that?  Because we grinded PR, the rest of Kor-Sha, PB, Tairiza for the GEAR to equipt our members so that we could better stand up to the harder encounters and learn them.   Contrary to anything that you or any other exileds say...GEAR is the primary reason progression succeeds.   I don't care how well you know a zone or how experienced and how good you work together, you won't go into VP with KoS Relic gear and be successful.   So get off your high horse, go back where you came from, and stop confusing superior gear with not so superior skill.

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Old 06-11-2008, 11:00 PM   #97
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I'm wearing exactly 3 pieces of raid gear. 1 is my mythical and the other two are the wrists and shoulders (both drop in tier ONE/TWO raid zones) from the taleweaver's set.

Its not the gear.

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Old 06-11-2008, 11:38 PM   #98
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I've been in many groups as an exile before VP access, before RoK was even released that we'd take on x2s and x3s worth of people and come out on top. The primary reason it's so much easier now compared to before is mages with dispersion providing endless power.
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Old 06-11-2008, 11:48 PM   #99
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http://files.filefront.com/17v6+PvP...;/fileinfo.html

It isn't the gear.  DoM fighting 17 Qs with 6 people.  No T8 raid gear what-so-ever.

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Old 06-11-2008, 11:52 PM   #100
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[email protected] wrote:
Sightless wrote:

I was a little taken back after seeing Synter's response there.. Circle of Storms wiped a full group of VA at druid rings in KP with only three of us, and we've "lost to" and "beat" VA multiple times in equal sized groups.

Exactly.  You and Win loose, gear isn't everything.  Being an exile doesn't automatically give you superior gear.We are just players like hte rest of you!!! Stop the hating!

What hate? I've never given VA any form of hate, in fact, I've gone out of my way to give you guys fair fights. I've given everyone in VA my respect, with the exception of ONE recent member.

But you can't tell me that you could have done VP in faction, without all the classes. Paikis is some how saying you guys are better "as people" and dedicated raiders than all of the factions combined. Yet you guys said your damage increased so much when you picked up key Freeport classes, that what was previously out of reach, became easy.

Gear isn't everything, but it does help. Even moreso, gear and Master Is help a lot. And some Mythicals make raids insanely easy "Troub" and "Assassin" Mythicals are so insanely powerful for a raid, it's not funny. I bet now that Perfect, Paikis and what two other Troubs now have their Mythicals, you'll be running through VP much, much easier now.

I choose not to join a big guild because myself, my wife, my best friend, and his wife leveled our guild to 52 with just the four of us. Not only that we have EVERY level 80 crafter in the guild but one, mine of course who is a 66 Weaponsmith. We've accomplished a lot with just the four of us, and some just don't want to throw that away for a bigger guild. We'd be AWESOME raiders. But alas, we hinder ourselves because it's sometimes hard to trust others. Yet we (Circle of Storms) have always helped Qeynosians out, we even helped Grey Wolves a lot before you guys exiled. You won't get any hate from us, so long as you don't give us any hate in return. And it irritates me Paikis acts like he's THAT much better than everyone because he now has his epic.

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Old 06-12-2008, 12:58 AM   #101
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Sightless wrote:
What hate? I've never given VA any form of hate, in fact, I've gone out of my way to give you guys fair fights. I've given everyone in VA my respect, with the exception of ONE recent member.

But you can't tell me that you could have done VP in faction, without all the classes. Paikis is some how saying you guys are better "as people" and dedicated raiders than all of the factions combined. Yet you guys said your damage increased so much when you picked up key Freeport classes, that what was previously out of reach, became easy.

Gear isn't everything, but it does help. Even moreso, gear and Master Is help a lot. And some Mythicals make raids insanely easy "Troub" and "Assassin" Mythicals are so insanely powerful for a raid, it's not funny. I bet now that Perfect, Paikis and what two other Troubs now have their Mythicals, you'll be running through VP much, much easier now.

I choose not to join a big guild because myself, my wife, my best friend, and his wife leveled our guild to 52 with just the four of us. Not only that we have EVERY level 80 crafter in the guild but one, mine of course who is a 66 Weaponsmith. We've accomplished a lot with just the four of us, and some just don't want to throw that away for a bigger guild. We'd be AWESOME raiders. But alas, we hinder ourselves because it's sometimes hard to trust others. Yet we (Circle of Storms) have always helped Qeynosians out, we even helped Grey Wolves a lot before you guys exiled. You won't get any hate from us, so long as you don't give us any hate in return. And it irritates me Paikis acts like he's THAT much better than everyone because he now has his epic.

I'm saying we're more dedicated. How many of you raid 4-5 nights EVERY week? how many of you have the exact same 26 people log in for EVERY raid? And yes, gear and Master !s do help, but we have no more than 10 pieces of loot accross the whole raid force that you guys can't get just as easily as we do. Mythicals certainly help, but the assasin mythical, while nice, is only going to increase the DPS of one person... and only by 500-1000/sec. Raid-wide PotM is only a 5-10k DPS increase. As for running through VP much easier... we've been stuck on Nexona for 2 weeks now. Which means we've put in atleast 24 hours worth of pulls. We got her to 8% today, and I assure you it isn't because our gear is insanely better than it was when we started.

And for the record, I'm not THAT much better than everyone. I like to think Im better than most, but do you know what I did in the Druushk fight? I sat way back out of combat, almost out of targetting range and I clicked a statue. The guild got me my mythical, and I can honestly say that VA as a raid guild is miles ahead of anything I've seen in factions.

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Old 06-12-2008, 01:36 AM   #102
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Paikis wrote:
Sightless wrote:
What hate? I've never given VA any form of hate, in fact, I've gone out of my way to give you guys fair fights. I've given everyone in VA my respect, with the exception of ONE recent member.

But you can't tell me that you could have done VP in faction, without all the classes. Paikis is some how saying you guys are better "as people" and dedicated raiders than all of the factions combined. Yet you guys said your damage increased so much when you picked up key Freeport classes, that what was previously out of reach, became easy.

Gear isn't everything, but it does help. Even moreso, gear and Master Is help a lot. And some Mythicals make raids insanely easy "Troub" and "Assassin" Mythicals are so insanely powerful for a raid, it's not funny. I bet now that Perfect, Paikis and what two other Troubs now have their Mythicals, you'll be running through VP much, much easier now.

I choose not to join a big guild because myself, my wife, my best friend, and his wife leveled our guild to 52 with just the four of us. Not only that we have EVERY level 80 crafter in the guild but one, mine of course who is a 66 Weaponsmith. We've accomplished a lot with just the four of us, and some just don't want to throw that away for a bigger guild. We'd be AWESOME raiders. But alas, we hinder ourselves because it's sometimes hard to trust others. Yet we (Circle of Storms) have always helped Qeynosians out, we even helped Grey Wolves a lot before you guys exiled. You won't get any hate from us, so long as you don't give us any hate in return. And it irritates me Paikis acts like he's THAT much better than everyone because he now has his epic.

I'm saying we're more dedicated. How many of you raid 4-5 nights EVERY week? how many of you have the exact same 26 people log in for EVERY raid? And yes, gear and Master !s do help, but we have no more than 10 pieces of loot accross the whole raid force that you guys can't get just as easily as we do. Mythicals certainly help, but the assasin mythical, while nice, is only going to increase the DPS of one person... and only by 500-1000/sec. Raid-wide PotM is only a 5-10k DPS increase. As for running through VP much easier... we've been stuck on Nexona for 2 weeks now. Which means we've put in atleast 24 hours worth of pulls. We got her to 8% today, and I assure you it isn't because our gear is insanely better than it was when we started.

And for the record, I'm not THAT much better than everyone. I like to think Im better than most, but do you know what I did in the Druushk fight? I sat way back out of combat, almost out of targetting range and I clicked a statue. The guild got me my mythical, and I can honestly say that VA as a raid guild is miles ahead of anything I've seen in factions.

If I didn't have to leave behind my current guild, whom are all real life friends, and family, I'd raid 4-5 nights a week easily. I raided in EQ1, where a raid could take FOREVER just to start so EQ2 raiding isn't as.... strenuous. SMILEY But most guilds will not bother with you unless you're in their guild.
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Old 06-12-2008, 02:16 AM   #103
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Sightless wrote:
And it irritates me Paikis acts like he's THAT much better than everyone because he now has his epic.

Actually, Paikis acts like he's THAT much better than everyone because well... look for yourself.

(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Sorted By DPS"(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Raid Dps: 62435.94(00:53)"(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Cigam 4863.30" <- Wizard(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Doike 4558.03" <- Conjuror(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Aurrora 4349.39" <- Swashbuckler(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Zinzerena 4320.09" <- illusionist(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Undacova 4265.18" <- Ranger(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Nycol 3888.94" <- Brigand(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Pail 3830.27" <- Warlock(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Paikis 3723.12" <- Troubador(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Perfect 3549.97" <- Mythical wielding Assasin(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Ragefist 3308.06" <- N00b.... er monk(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Synter 2673.97" <- Dirge(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Gaby 2605.15" <- Coercer

This was a drakota in VP, Orange con, think they're 84? 85? with no buffs other than group/raid-wide buffs. Jester's Cap was on Zinzerena. You find me a Troub that can pull that much on a raid mob on this server with no buffs, and I'll cut the superior attitude. Oh, and the mythical really doesn't help my DPS that much. Wait until the dirges and Illies get theirs.

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Old 06-12-2008, 03:07 AM   #104
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Paikis wrote:
Sightless wrote:
And it irritates me Paikis acts like he's THAT much better than everyone because he now has his epic.

Actually, Paikis acts like he's THAT much better than everyone because well... look for yourself.

(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Sorted By DPS"(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Raid Dps: 62435.94(00:53)"(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Cigam 4863.30" <- Wizard(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Doike 4558.03" <- Conjuror(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Aurrora 4349.39" <- Swashbuckler(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Zinzerena 4320.09" <- illusionist(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Undacova 4265.18" <- Ranger(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Nycol 3888.94" <- Brigand(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Pail 3830.27" <- Warlock(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Paikis 3723.12" <- Troubador(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Perfect 3549.97" <- Mythical wielding Assasin(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Ragefist 3308.06" <- N00b.... er monk(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Synter 2673.97" <- Dirge(1212972186)[Mon Jun 09 08:43:06 2008] aPC -1 Synter:Synter/a tells (5), "Gaby 2605.15" <- Coercer

This was a drakota in VP, Orange con, think they're 84? 85? with no buffs other than group/raid-wide buffs. Jester's Cap was on Zinzerena. You find me a Troub that can pull that much on a raid mob on this server with no buffs, and I'll cut the superior attitude. Oh, and the mythical really doesn't help my DPS that much. Wait until the dirges and Illies get theirs.

As your raid dps goes up, so does yours. Go parse the wall in KJ 10 times .
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Old 06-12-2008, 03:54 AM   #105
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Paikis wrote:

Its not the gear.

Yes it is. You noobs join exile and all of a sudden think youre gods gift to pvp. On and on and on you go, when youll stop nobody knows. /YAWN

Just take a look at all the posts by exiles on this thread. No, i mean really look.

Youre all up your own arses. No offence intended, just an observation of the theme running through all the exiles posts. Condescending, patronising, arrogant, dictatorial and most importantly ignorant. But then ignorance is bliss.

When mythicals got released it was like the floodgates from citys>exile had opened. All because the lootwhores wanted their mythical updates. It wasnt that 24 people in a city couldnt raid well together, it was that the mobs died so much easier in exile ( AND NOT BECAUSE OF PLAYER SKILL ). PATH OF LEAST RESISTANCE. Stop telling people if they want to raid they should exile, WHERES THE CHOICE IN THAT? dont answer that, rhetoric. 

ITS ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT THE GEAR~

Dont try and defend your corner, its indefensible. Maybe one day you will wake up and all start telling the truth, or not.

I have seen the parse of q guilds in t2. I am not gonna bring names into it but, i know for a fact all the people on those raids can play their toons. Compare those parses to an all classes t2 raid the difference on average is staggering. You can spin this how you like,  q raid guilds would die for an extra 10-20k(30k?) dps zonewide. And personally, yes i think its just down to the fact that exile have access to both city classes for any and all achievements ( on nagafen anyway ). Lets face it, this hasnt been proved wrong has it.

p.s you guys writing all your crap made me write all this crap, so you only have yourselves to blame.

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Old 06-12-2008, 05:31 AM   #106
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Shadow_Viper wrote:
Izzypop wrote:
Shadow_Viper wrote:
Izzypop wrote:
There are only 2 ways of changing this.#1) Go Monty Hall on city factions.  Behind door #1 PvP armor that's better than VP gear.  Behind door #2 Upgrade your fabeled epic to a Mythical for a fistfull of PvP tokens.  Behind door #3 Bitter hatred from the bulk of your level 80 raiders as everything they have worked for becomes worthless next to the power of revive zerging each other at the KP docks for tokens.#2) Open all classes to City factions.  There are a lot of exiles who don't want to be exiled, but are stuck being in exile because they want to raid end game content.  Given the choice of raiding with all classes in a city or haven many of them would choose a city instead, and some would stay for the challenge of being the server's underdogs in haven. 

Those are not the only two ways to address the exiled issue. All SOE really needs to do would be.

1) Restrict Exiled players from entering raid zones.

2) Remove the creature comforts from haven, bank, broker, merchants, crafting stations, etc.

3) Permanently ban the accounts of every player who keeps a player in exile for more than 1 week. 

I think that is a bad idea, no reason for it.

The exiled faction should be a brief rest stop when betraying from one city to another(example: Moving from Qeynos to Freeport). Don't listen to SOE when they say exile is a fully recognized faction.  My opinion matters more than SOE's

I am aware of what SOE says, these are only my opinions and suggestions regarding the issues, nothing more. Where did I state my opinion matters more than SOE's?

Please remember that we all have our own opinions on the matter, no one opinion is more valid than another. Just because you may disagree with one person's opinion is no excuse to make obvious flamebait comments and try to put words in their mouth.

If you go through with your 1st 2 steps you may as well include my step 3 because they will all quit anyways.Exile is not an original faction when the game launched 4 years ago, but it is a fully recognized faction by SOE.  Exile has just as much of a right to exist as the 2 city factions.If not being present 4 years ago when the game launched=2nd class player why not restrict Fae, frogs, & Sarnaks from entering raid zones?  Better yet go through with your idea, but force all Fae, frogs, & Sarnaks to remain permanently exiled.You know who else was not present 4 years ago when the game went live? City factions.Restrict single alignment city factions of PvP servers from entering raid zones.Spit in the face of your player base, ban everybody's account on pvp servers, & salt the earth while you are at it.As amazingly incompetent as SOE can be even they are not dumb enough to destroy the most successful faction of the PvP servers for having the audacity to succeed where others have failed.   St Jude says "Give up the cause Skree"Players don't like making raids more difficult on themselves.  The problem is not that raiding in a city is impossible.  The problem is making things more difficult on your raid force is the antithesis of successful raiding.  Raiding in a city faction is making things more difficult on your raid force and therefor it is the antithesis of successful raiding.  Giving access to all classes would give exiles the choice of moving to a city without making things more difficult on themselves when raiding.  Given that choice most of exile would go back to a city and haven would once again be the home of the few brave souls who remain in haven for PVP not raidgear.  If your guild doesn't  have what it takes to beat VP getting access to all classes won't get a guild their epics, it will just put you on equal terms with the guilds that can. This is about choice not force. My suggestions are not forcing anyone to do anything.Encourage exiles to leave the hole, don't beat them with the nerfbat until the quit the game.  Make it their choice to leave. 

Give city factions a fighting chance.  As long as city factions have 1 hand tied behind their back serious raiders who will put in 40 hours a week will pretty much be forced to remain in exile.

Fact remains that without the option to betray on PVP servers, the exiled faction would've never been added. As I said, in my opinion it should be a brief rest stop between good and evil cities, not a faction for people to use in order to have easier raiding on PVP servers, I think PVP servers are about the added challenge. Combating against other players and raiding without all classes.

Dude this is the worse kind of trolling.  The devs made exile to be a faction.  SOE fully recognizes exile as a faction.  They just screwed things up and made what was meant to be the underdog faction into the powerhouse faction.  Exile was meant to be the underdog faction where life is more difficult than city life, but any fool can see that it is a superior way to do end game raiding.SOE made exile a fully recognized and functioning faction.  The answer is not to destroy the faction.  It makes no more sense to destroy exile than it does to delete all Sarnaks.  You may as well be asking the devs the roll the combat system back to pre LU13.There are better answers than to simply destroy exile as a faction.  Give city factions access to all classes (Easy patch), give city factions some way to mimic critical missing abilities like templars & coercers (difficult complex patch) or maybe even nerf mythicals to be good/evil only items like end game mounts and pvp gear (easy patch, but lots of drama)
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Old 06-12-2008, 06:16 AM   #107
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God damnit I hate exiles.

Next exile I see i'm going to punch him directly in his neutral nonalignment face.

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Old 06-12-2008, 06:24 AM   #108
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God damnit I hate exiles.

Next exile I see i'm going to punch him directly in his neutral nonalignment face.

<-- is glad there's a server between us.
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Old 06-12-2008, 06:55 AM   #109
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Did you change your last name to Peace, yet?
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Old 06-12-2008, 08:09 AM   #110
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Izzypop wrote:
Shadow_Viper wrote:
Izzypop wrote:
Shadow_Viper wrote:
Izzypop wrote:
There are only 2 ways of changing this.#1) Go Monty Hall on city factions.  Behind door #1 PvP armor that's better than VP gear.  Behind door #2 Upgrade your fabeled epic to a Mythical for a fistfull of PvP tokens.  Behind door #3 Bitter hatred from the bulk of your level 80 raiders as everything they have worked for becomes worthless next to the power of revive zerging each other at the KP docks for tokens.#2) Open all classes to City factions.  There are a lot of exiles who don't want to be exiled, but are stuck being in exile because they want to raid end game content.  Given the choice of raiding with all classes in a city or haven many of them would choose a city instead, and some would stay for the challenge of being the server's underdogs in haven. 

Those are not the only two ways to address the exiled issue. All SOE really needs to do would be.

1) Restrict Exiled players from entering raid zones.

2) Remove the creature comforts from haven, bank, broker, merchants, crafting stations, etc.

3) Permanently ban the accounts of every player who keeps a player in exile for more than 1 week. 

I think that is a bad idea, no reason for it.

The exiled faction should be a brief rest stop when betraying from one city to another(example: Moving from Qeynos to Freeport). Don't listen to SOE when they say exile is a fully recognized faction.  My opinion matters more than SOE's

I am aware of what SOE says, these are only my opinions and suggestions regarding the issues, nothing more. Where did I state my opinion matters more than SOE's?

Please remember that we all have our own opinions on the matter, no one opinion is more valid than another. Just because you may disagree with one person's opinion is no excuse to make obvious flamebait comments and try to put words in their mouth.

If you go through with your 1st 2 steps you may as well include my step 3 because they will all quit anyways.Exile is not an original faction when the game launched 4 years ago, but it is a fully recognized faction by SOE.  Exile has just as much of a right to exist as the 2 city factions.If not being present 4 years ago when the game launched=2nd class player why not restrict Fae, frogs, & Sarnaks from entering raid zones?  Better yet go through with your idea, but force all Fae, frogs, & Sarnaks to remain permanently exiled.You know who else was not present 4 years ago when the game went live? City factions.Restrict single alignment city factions of PvP servers from entering raid zones.Spit in the face of your player base, ban everybody's account on pvp servers, & salt the earth while you are at it.As amazingly incompetent as SOE can be even they are not dumb enough to destroy the most successful faction of the PvP servers for having the audacity to succeed where others have failed.   St Jude says "Give up the cause Skree"Players don't like making raids more difficult on themselves.  The problem is not that raiding in a city is impossible.  The problem is making things more difficult on your raid force is the antithesis of successful raiding.  Raiding in a city faction is making things more difficult on your raid force and therefor it is the antithesis of successful raiding.  Giving access to all classes would give exiles the choice of moving to a city without making things more difficult on themselves when raiding.  Given that choice most of exile would go back to a city and haven would once again be the home of the few brave souls who remain in haven for PVP not raidgear.  If your guild doesn't  have what it takes to beat VP getting access to all classes won't get a guild their epics, it will just put you on equal terms with the guilds that can. This is about choice not force. My suggestions are not forcing anyone to do anything.Encourage exiles to leave the hole, don't beat them with the nerfbat until the quit the game.  Make it their choice to leave. 

Give city factions a fighting chance.  As long as city factions have 1 hand tied behind their back serious raiders who will put in 40 hours a week will pretty much be forced to remain in exile.

Fact remains that without the option to betray on PVP servers, the exiled faction would've never been added. As I said, in my opinion it should be a brief rest stop between good and evil cities, not a faction for people to use in order to have easier raiding on PVP servers, I think PVP servers are about the added challenge. Combating against other players and raiding without all classes.

Dude this is the worse kind of trolling.  The devs made exile to be a faction.  SOE fully recognizes exile as a faction.  They just screwed things up and made what was meant to be the underdog faction into the powerhouse faction.  Exile was meant to be the underdog faction where life is more difficult than city life, but any fool can see that it is a superior way to do end game raiding.SOE made exile a fully recognized and functioning faction.  The answer is not to destroy the faction.  It makes no more sense to destroy exile than it does to delete all Sarnaks.  You may as well be asking the devs the roll the combat system back to pre LU13.There are better answers than to simply destroy exile as a faction.  Give city factions access to all classes (Easy patch), give city factions some way to mimic critical missing abilities like templars & coercers (difficult complex patch) or maybe even nerf mythicals to be good/evil only items like end game mounts and pvp gear (easy patch, but lots of drama)
I do not see how my suggestions would destory the faction. The faction would still exist and would still be good for a betrayal rest stop, and still an option for more PVP, just not for raiding.
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Old 06-12-2008, 08:24 AM   #111
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Wow, i must say, I dont often agree with Freeport players on anything, but this i have to say, The exiles on these forums make me /giggle like a school girl. 

"its my skill that keeps me alive fool, not my wardens Mythical that provides her with endless power to keep me alive"  blah blah blah.  you seriously know how [Removed for Content] you guys sound?   I mean honestly.... get over yourselves...  I've seen bad [Removed for Content] Q's fight bad [Removed for Content] Freeps and it was a hell of a fight... lots of dying and lots of fightihng... I seen those same bad [Removed for Content] Qs and same bad [Removed for Content] Freeps, collectively, get wiped by one group of Exiles with their gear.. Oh and none of the exiles drop below 90 percent HP or 90 percent power the entire fight against 5 groups....... and your trying to tell me that 1 group is just more skill full then 4 or 5 of the best players of each side?  that just makes me /giggle again...   I guess your "uber skill" is whats keeping your power at max?  is that what it is.. cuz you "really know your class" and are "super dedicated players" you can fight for 10 minutes against overwhealming odds and not lose HP or power?   Its because you are "really good at mashing buttons" that keeps you from losing HP and power? or is it your groups gear that provides the procs that does it? Remind me... please....  Cuz last time i looked, Skill at mashing a keyboard in a certain order didnt keep your power and HP at 100 percent for 10 minutes... but i guess i must be wrong, right? Its the "uber skill" of your teamates in their "cohesive and militaristic" practicing and unity and blah blah blah blha... its you F'n gear numb nuts...  And the fact that you can have the best of both worlds with your buffs and group makeup....

So stop pretending your just bad [Removed for Content] at your class and come to the realization that exile is E-Z mode and you in your mom's basement at the age of 40, mashing on the keyboard doesnt make you wipe 6 groups with  your 1, its your gear and all the classes combined that allows this.

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Old 06-12-2008, 09:29 AM   #112
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Krakelkrak wrote:
As your raid dps goes up, so does yours. Go parse the wall in KJ 10 times .

Here you go, I actually killed it 12 times, the 10 shown below are the 10 best ones and would actually give me a DPS of 2852.79. The top parse in red is the total of the 12 wall kills. No miracles/blessings were used in the killing of these walls. Also no potions or temporary adornments.

Allies: (09:31) 2710.59Paik 2710.59

Allies: (00:44) 2898.14Paik 2898.14

Allies: (00:51) 2559.41Paik 2559.41

Allies: (00:43) 3064.54Paik 3064.54

Allies: (00:45) 2859.07Paik 2859.07

Allies: (00:45) 2836.84Paik 2836.84

Allies: (00:43) 2960.65Paik 2960.65

Allies: (00:42) 3030.62Paik 3030.62

Allies: (00:49) 2666.53Paik 2666.53

Allies: (00:46) 2805.11Paik 2805.11

Allies: (00:44) 2932.57Paik 2932.57

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Old 06-12-2008, 11:41 AM   #113
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Paikis wrote:
Krakelkrak wrote:
As your raid dps goes up, so does yours. Go parse the wall in KJ 10 times .

Here you go, I actually killed it 12 times, the 10 shown below are the 10 best ones and would actually give me a DPS of 2852.79. The top parse in red is the total of the 12 wall kills. No miracles/blessings were used in the killing of these walls. Also no potions or temporary adornments.

Allies: (09:31) 2710.59Paik 2710.59

Allies: (00:44) 2898.14Paik 2898.14

Allies: (00:51) 2559.41Paik 2559.41

Allies: (00:43) 3064.54Paik 3064.54

Allies: (00:45) 2859.07Paik 2859.07

Allies: (00:45) 2836.84Paik 2836.84

Allies: (00:43) 2960.65Paik 2960.65

Allies: (00:42) 3030.62Paik 3030.62

Allies: (00:49) 2666.53Paik 2666.53

Allies: (00:46) 2805.11Paik 2805.11

Allies: (00:44) 2932.57Paik 2932.57

Nice parses. Well done. Any troubs up for the challenge?
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Old 06-12-2008, 12:08 PM   #114
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Shadow_Viper wrote:
Izzypop wrote:
Shadow_Viper wrote:
Izzypop wrote:
Shadow_Viper wrote:
Izzypop wrote:
There are only 2 ways of changing this.#1) Go Monty Hall on city factions.  Behind door #1 PvP armor that's better than VP gear.  Behind door #2 Upgrade your fabeled epic to a Mythical for a fistfull of PvP tokens.  Behind door #3 Bitter hatred from the bulk of your level 80 raiders as everything they have worked for becomes worthless next to the power of revive zerging each other at the KP docks for tokens.#2) Open all classes to City factions.  There are a lot of exiles who don't want to be exiled, but are stuck being in exile because they want to raid end game content.  Given the choice of raiding with all classes in a city or haven many of them would choose a city instead, and some would stay for the challenge of being the server's underdogs in haven. 

Those are not the only two ways to address the exiled issue. All SOE really needs to do would be.

1) Restrict Exiled players from entering raid zones.

2) Remove the creature comforts from haven, bank, broker, merchants, crafting stations, etc.

3) Permanently ban the accounts of every player who keeps a player in exile for more than 1 week. 

I think that is a bad idea, no reason for it.

The exiled faction should be a brief rest stop when betraying from one city to another(example: Moving from Qeynos to Freeport). Don't listen to SOE when they say exile is a fully recognized faction.  My opinion matters more than SOE's

I am aware of what SOE says, these are only my opinions and suggestions regarding the issues, nothing more. Where did I state my opinion matters more than SOE's?

Please remember that we all have our own opinions on the matter, no one opinion is more valid than another. Just because you may disagree with one person's opinion is no excuse to make obvious flamebait comments and try to put words in their mouth.

If you go through with your 1st 2 steps you may as well include my step 3 because they will all quit anyways.Exile is not an original faction when the game launched 4 years ago, but it is a fully recognized faction by SOE.  Exile has just as much of a right to exist as the 2 city factions.If not being present 4 years ago when the game launched=2nd class player why not restrict Fae, frogs, & Sarnaks from entering raid zones?  Better yet go through with your idea, but force all Fae, frogs, & Sarnaks to remain permanently exiled.You know who else was not present 4 years ago when the game went live? City factions.Restrict single alignment city factions of PvP servers from entering raid zones.Spit in the face of your player base, ban everybody's account on pvp servers, & salt the earth while you are at it.As amazingly incompetent as SOE can be even they are not dumb enough to destroy the most successful faction of the PvP servers for having the audacity to succeed where others have failed.   St Jude says "Give up the cause Skree"Players don't like making raids more difficult on themselves.  The problem is not that raiding in a city is impossible.  The problem is making things more difficult on your raid force is the antithesis of successful raiding.  Raiding in a city faction is making things more difficult on your raid force and therefor it is the antithesis of successful raiding.  Giving access to all classes would give exiles the choice of moving to a city without making things more difficult on themselves when raiding.  Given that choice most of exile would go back to a city and haven would once again be the home of the few brave souls who remain in haven for PVP not raidgear.  If your guild doesn't  have what it takes to beat VP getting access to all classes won't get a guild their epics, it will just put you on equal terms with the guilds that can. This is about choice not force. My suggestions are not forcing anyone to do anything.Encourage exiles to leave the hole, don't beat them with the nerfbat until the quit the game.  Make it their choice to leave. 

Give city factions a fighting chance.  As long as city factions have 1 hand tied behind their back serious raiders who will put in 40 hours a week will pretty much be forced to remain in exile.

Fact remains that without the option to betray on PVP servers, the exiled faction would've never been added. As I said, in my opinion it should be a brief rest stop between good and evil cities, not a faction for people to use in order to have easier raiding on PVP servers, I think PVP servers are about the added challenge. Combating against other players and raiding without all classes.

Dude this is the worse kind of trolling.  The devs made exile to be a faction.  SOE fully recognizes exile as a faction.  They just screwed things up and made what was meant to be the underdog faction into the powerhouse faction.  Exile was meant to be the underdog faction where life is more difficult than city life, but any fool can see that it is a superior way to do end game raiding.SOE made exile a fully recognized and functioning faction.  The answer is not to destroy the faction.  It makes no more sense to destroy exile than it does to delete all Sarnaks.  You may as well be asking the devs the roll the combat system back to pre LU13.There are better answers than to simply destroy exile as a faction.  Give city factions access to all classes (Easy patch), give city factions some way to mimic critical missing abilities like templars & coercers (difficult complex patch) or maybe even nerf mythicals to be good/evil only items like end game mounts and pvp gear (easy patch, but lots of drama)
I do not see how my suggestions would destory the faction. The faction would still exist and would still be good for a betrayal rest stop, and still an option for more PVP, just not for raiding.Shadow_Viper wrote:

1) Restrict Exiled players from entering raid zones.

Seeing as how most all of exile are in exile to raid end game content it would be easy to take this as a form of punishment for exiles having the audacity to succeed where city factions have failed.  If a square peg doesn't fit into a round hole it makes perfect sense to ban the round peg from ever going back into the round hole.  It all makes perfect sense now...neft round pegs....and it's not like exiles have the freedom to leave eq2 for another game.

2) Remove the creature comforts from haven, bank, broker, merchants, crafting stations, etc.

Yep you are right.  Removing the ability of exiles to buy or sell anything is totally not an effort to destroy a faction.  Exiles can stay there on a permanent basis to PvP without access to any markets or the ability to buy any upgrades or consumables.  Real exiles don't need food, or drinks, or totems, or potions, or poisons, or spell/combat art upgrades.  Real exiles don't need to upgrade their gears or spells/combat arts ever.  Just exile at level 30 and keep all your t4 spells into T8 because low level exiles are such an easymode way to play.  I stand corrected these are not in the least bit spiteful ways to destroy a faction.
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Old 06-12-2008, 12:10 PM   #115
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[email protected] wrote:
[email protected] wrote:

people have been raiding just fine through T5, T6, T7 (with T5/6 pre-pvp, still people have raided that after kosrelease) with a split class set, why do you suddenly want rangers running around freeport?

 i think it ruins the immersion and idea of war between good and evil to have all classes on both sides

are you wanting this because you cant succesfully raid T8?

or

 because of a lack of population (exile having their own sacred blue-server)?

Simple question to all the lore defenders/RPers (since you don't want to hear the "but it's like this on PVE servers" argument):Do you think Exiles fit the lore in their current state ? Why wouldn't they fit the lore?  There is a city full of people who are basically anarchists, go figure, right?  I see no logical or lore=based problem to this...Does it fit the lore that Exiles build guilds of hundreds of players ? From lore perspective I would assume exiling means being banned from society. Outcasts of society could easily band together to seurvive, you can also look at them somewhat as "mercenaries" or "neutrals" who hate the prim and properness of Qeynos and the oppression of Freeport...Does it fit the lore that there are all crafting facilities in their cave ? Why couldn't there be crafting in caves?  Skilled crafters could exile to perfect their craft or for other reasons and then decide "You know what, it's dumb for me to throw it all away, so I'll take my *insert name of equipment here* with me as as I go...I don't want to nerf exiles fyi, just asking how do you feel they stand from lore perspective, since lore seems to be the holy grail...And to answer your question why ppl want all classes, at least from my point of view:1) T8 raids are harder than T7, at least KOS T72) The disparity between top raid gear and average group instance gear is wider, especially considering mythicals. There was nothing comparable to mythicals in tier 7. Ppl want their mythical for different reasons. But there are also defined tiers for raiding so that as you "progress" you should be able to close the gap  over time... it's not like people who raid VP are only in group-based gear, they have HAD to do raids before, and if they have to farm the raids for gear for everyone, so be it, but they have the mechanism for it...3) T8 pvp sucks bad, so people look for another thing to do. When pvp sucks and you can't raid successfully, what's left ? lowbie twinking ? oh wait ...
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Old 06-12-2008, 12:41 PM   #116
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goldfeesh641 wrote:
[email protected] wrote:
[email protected] wrote:

people have been raiding just fine through T5, T6, T7 (with T5/6 pre-pvp, still people have raided that after kosrelease) with a split class set, why do you suddenly want rangers running around freeport?

 i think it ruins the immersion and idea of war between good and evil to have all classes on both sides

are you wanting this because you cant succesfully raid T8?

or

 because of a lack of population (exile having their own sacred blue-server)?

Simple question to all the lore defenders/RPers (since you don't want to hear the "but it's like this on PVE servers" argument):Do you think Exiles fit the lore in their current state ? Why wouldn't they fit the lore?  There is a city full of people who are basically anarchists, go figure, right?  I see no logical or lore=based problem to this...>> Usually Anarchists are a minority in civilized societies. The concept of anarchists somehow implies that you are not capable to build a well structured community/society. Anarchists would probably not form guilds in the first place for instance... There is a contradicition in your sentence "a city full of anarchists" IMO.Does it fit the lore that Exiles build guilds of hundreds of players ? From lore perspective I would assume exiling means being banned from society. Outcasts of society could easily band together to seurvive, you can also look at them somewhat as "mercenaries" or "neutrals" who hate the prim and properness of Qeynos and the oppression of Freeport...>> If they hate Qeynos that much I wonder why they regularly come visit us and camp our Qeynos Harbor docks SMILEYDoes it fit the lore that there are all crafting facilities in their cave ? Why couldn't there be crafting in caves?  Skilled crafters could exile to perfect their craft or for other reasons and then decide "You know what, it's dumb for me to throw it all away, so I'll take my *insert name of equipment here* with me as as I go...I don't want to nerf exiles fyi, just asking how do you feel they stand from lore perspective, since lore seems to be the holy grail...And to answer your question why ppl want all classes, at least from my point of view:1) T8 raids are harder than T7, at least KOS T72) The disparity between top raid gear and average group instance gear is wider, especially considering mythicals. There was nothing comparable to mythicals in tier 7. Ppl want their mythical for different reasons. But there are also defined tiers for raiding so that as you "progress" you should be able to close the gap  over time... it's not like people who raid VP are only in group-based gear, they have HAD to do raids before, and if they have to farm the raids for gear for everyone, so be it, but they have the mechanism for it...>> I agree Exiles had to go through the progression and desserve where they stand raidwise, no doubt. The cities can probably do the same in the long run, but progression is much slower and more painful. There will be no real point seing VP once the next expansion is out (though the mythicals will probably still be desirable). While it does not do the job for you, and you still need the right players, you can't deny having all classes helps a bit with the progression. Currently cities cumulate two handicaps: missing classes, and the fact that they are drained from the players with the best raiding potential, who see in exile the possibility to progress faster raidwise, instead of being stuck in tier 1 or 2 in a city.Two handicaps are just too much. Remove the one that can be fixed relatively easily SMILEY3) T8 pvp sucks bad, so people look for another thing to do. When pvp sucks and you can't raid successfully, what's left ? lowbie twinking ? oh wait ...
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Old 06-12-2008, 08:33 PM   #117
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Wow, i must say, I dont often agree with Freeport players on anything, but this i have to say, The exiles on these forums make me /giggle like a school girl. 

"its my skill that keeps me alive fool, not my wardens Mythical that provides her with endless power to keep me alive"The difference between mythical and fabled warden epic is ~50 power i think on both ends of the proc.  blah blah blah.  you seriously know how [I cannot control my vocabulary] you guys sound?   I mean honestly.... get over yourselves...  I've seen bad [I cannot control my vocabulary] Q's fight bad [I cannot control my vocabulary] Freeps and it was a hell of a fight... lots of dying and lots of fightihng... I seen those same bad [I cannot control my vocabulary] Qs and same bad [I cannot control my vocabulary] Freeps, collectively, get wiped by one group of Exiles with their gear.. Oh and none of the exiles drop below 90 percent HP or 90 percent power the entire fight against 5 groups.......Maybe these Q's and FP that you think are good actually just suck?  Pohodari always gives us a good fight and it just comes down to the fact that we coordinate a good burn on one of their people to swing the battle.  Purity is sometimes the same way except they drop way more god spells. and your trying to tell me that 1 group is just more skill full then 4 or 5 of the best players of each side?Yes  that just makes me /giggle again...   I guess your "uber skill" is whats keeping your power at max?  is that what it is.. cuz you "really know your class" and are "super dedicated players" you can fight for 10 minutes against overwhealming odds and not lose HP or power?Well here's a hint.  If your healers are any good, the tank won't die.  And if your mage's have the right gear combined with the right healers, they aren't gonna die but will instead just keep feeding the group tons of power while you try and burn them.   Its because you are "really good at mashing buttons" that keeps you from losing HP and power? or is it your groups gear that provides the procs that does it? Remind me... please....  Cuz last time i looked, Skill at mashing a keyboard in a certain order didnt keep your power and HP at 100 percent for 10 minutes... but i guess i must be wrong, right? Its the "uber skill" of your teamates in their "cohesive and militaristic" practicing and unity and blah blah blah blha... its you F'n gear numb nuts...  And the fact that you can have the best of both worlds with your buffs and group makeup.... Seriously?  A Qeynos person crying about good PvP groups.  Get yourself a good warden, templar, and plate tank with 3 good DPS or perhaps a CC class and some dps and if you aren't god aweful you'll do fine.  Most of the times in group I'm the only non-Qeynos class as a coercer, and I don't really do much that an Illy couldn't do.

So stop pretending your just bad [I cannot control my vocabulary] at your class and come to the realization that exile is E-Z mode and you in your mom's basement at the age of 40, mashing on the keyboard doesnt make you wipe 6 groups with  your 1, its your gear and all the classes combined that allows this.  I'm not 40 and I don't live in my mom's basement.  Lastly, L2P

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Old 06-13-2008, 04:20 AM   #118
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Give me all of the raid displacement gear, on top of my dispersion gear, and I would take out full groups and only need a healer, and a tank to taunt. Wait! I already do that with a Paladin as my healer/taunter and a Swashbuckler. So I'd probably be able to take out x2s with that kind of gear. It helps everyone struggles to get off the tank, and on to me. But to say a Warlock or Wizard with dispersion is as good as one with both dispersion, and displacement gear is laughable.

And lets not even get into Mythicals, and double Fissions which are easy to get off when the Templar/Inquisitor has triggered Divine Recovery. SMILEY

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Old 06-13-2008, 12:51 PM   #119
Cloakentuna

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And how often do you see a wizard in an exiled PvP group.  We have Keefe and Moonraker with mythicals.  Moonraker never PvPs and I can't say I've seen Keefe in a group PvPing in forever.  When Kraken first went back to Nonok PvPd with us the 2nd day there but that is the only time I have had a wizard in group with me so your double fission thing is pretty much gone.  As far as all the stoneskins.  Keefe is the ONLY person with all the stoneskin procs.  The Robe has dropped once iirc and he is the only one who has it.  The ring has dropped twice since we've come back to exile and belongs to Sinful and Grumple, a necro and an inq.  Keefe also has the ring.
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Old 06-13-2008, 01:15 PM   #120
Ashr

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Double fission is so rare it isn't even funny.  Its only a 10% chance, and it usually happens on a DoT SMILEY
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