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Old 11-02-2014, 11:51 PM   #1
Makya

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Boneshattering Combination for brawlers, Vital Trigger for warriors and Earthshock for crusaders.

First, a bug: Vital Trigger is not getting the base reuse time of 60s when it expires or the triggers get to 4, it's just getting the normal recast.

When I first saw this from SOE Live I thought the usage would have required a bit more skill where you would want to get it up to 3 increments quickly, wait for it to drop down to 2 and then hit it again to get it back up to 3. Oh well, guess I'll just have to put up with 30s of downtime every so often.

However, after using them on beta, I assume the best way to use it would be to get up to 3 increments fairly quickly and then either get the 4th increment off asap if you don't care about the duration buff (minor HP for warriors, decent CB for brawlers and decent Pot for crusaders) or wait until the 15s is just about done and hit the 4th increment. Will have to do some more testing to see if the extra 12s of CB/Pot is better or starting the longer 30s reuse timer is better to start a new cycle of the damage/threat component. The new damage values on these make them quite a bit more attractive.
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Old 11-03-2014, 12:50 AM   #2
Karnoz

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While I had initially given up on the utterly ****** Vital Trigger, I tried it again after the recent changes. Spamming it against an epic training dummy in Defensive Stance, Focused Offensive, and full tank gear netted around 170K DPS (I kept going until the dummy was dead). That makes it the first guardian CA that actually manages to out-DPS a single item proc like Mutagenic Shred (80K DPS).

The hate component didn't even amount to half the threat that my single-target taunt generated, but combined with the DPS, it did somewhat better than the taunt in terms of total threat.

As for the HP component, it was pretty much irrelevant, less than 100K. I would have thought it amounted to more; perhaps something is broken there?

Anyway, keep in mind that I was testing the ostensibly broken version of Vital Trigger that can be clicked every 2.5 sec. If they "fix" the CA, so it can be used only 4 times every 40 sec instead of 16 times, it'll become yet another worthless guardian AA ability. In that case, I'll just go back to the Potency endline and another 70 Pot or so instead.

In order to fix the ability, I would propose the following:

1) Fix the reuse bug, so we're back to 4 uses every 40 sec at most.
2) Drop the group heal. Nobody wants to time such a trivial heal, so it would be wasted anyway.
3) Change the HP component to instead add 3500 mitigation plus additional 500 mitigation per increment (this expansion is supposed to be all about mitigation vs HP) .
4) Multiply the damage component by 4.
5) Multiply the threat component by 4.


End result: same DPS and threat as the current bugged version while keeping the buff component mechanic intact. Plus, the buff component helps differentiate guardians further from monks, who currently have way too much mitigation with their temps running when you compare them with plate tanks, especially guardians.
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Old 11-03-2014, 01:57 AM   #3
Genghes

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I wouldn't with about maintaining the buff side of this ability. You're better off imo to try to hit 4 casts of this every time it is up.
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Old 11-03-2014, 04:46 AM   #4
Makya

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Ya, I suspect that's what testing will show for warriors and crusaders for sure and most likely for brawlers.
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Old 11-03-2014, 06:39 AM   #5
Malleria

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The buff is pretty meh. Better off using the fourth cast asap so it refreshes faster imo.
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Old 11-03-2014, 09:44 PM   #6
Xelgad

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We greatly improved the damage on these as of Saturday. Have you checked since then?

Additionally, is Vital Trigger (and any others) still not getting the reuse set properly when they terminate?
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Old 11-03-2014, 10:01 PM   #7
Ansom

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The problem is:

Clic 1: damage, effect (agro, heal, ecc ecc), and buff
Clic 2: + damage, + effect, and + buff
Clic 3: + + damage, + + effect, and + + buff
Clic 4: + + + damage, + + + effect, and... no buff? Because we have the 30-60 reuse.

The buff need to be separate. Clic 1, buff for 30s. Clic 2, + buff for other 30s, ecc ecc.


Now the damage and the effect is.. decent. But the buff, with the current reuse no.
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Old 11-03-2014, 10:04 PM   #8
Genghes

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Old 11-03-2014, 10:12 PM   #9
Xelgad

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The intention with the ability is the option to frontload damage/effects and forsake the buff or spread the damage out to keep the buff.
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Old 11-03-2014, 10:17 PM   #10
GIndotto

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I haven't noticed the buff resetting properly Xelgad. I am able to click Vital Trigger after using the fourth stack and watch the count go back to 1. I can't tell if it's actually hitting or just showing, but either way my first few uses I expected the fourth click in a row to result in a 60 second reuse, no?
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Old 11-03-2014, 11:02 PM   #11
Meshuggahx

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I haven't properly tested earthshock since the fix, the dmg seems ok, but the taunt was still parsing lower than my shield bash taunt on my sk which is really low. i'll post some parses tommorow to demonstrate. Also i like the fact that it cause a detaunt when in reckless, but imo it needs be alot higher so can get rid of that grendish neck when i wanna just dps when not needed to tank.
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Old 11-03-2014, 11:17 PM   #12
Genghes

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The more hp you have the more powerful the threat. Being that it's an ae taunt it's not going to have the same threat value as single target taunts
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Old 11-03-2014, 11:36 PM   #13
Meshuggahx

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Imo the taunt should be at least 40% and the detaunt 60% to make it really desirable ability.
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Old 11-03-2014, 11:52 PM   #14
Genghes

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in a heroic w/ boneshattering combination I saw average threat hits of 4.1 mil and on the upper end I saw 9 mil. that's at 40% so yeah, at 20% you should se about half that size..... which for an AE threat that's pretty good.....
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Old 11-04-2014, 12:43 AM   #15
Karnoz

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My post is based on the improved damage version. I tested it yesterday.

And no, the reuse isn't being set correctly. That's what currently makes this CA worth taking for purely DPS purposes. Fix the bug, and it becomes a waste of points, even after the 400% DPS boost.

At any rate, I've already grown quite tired of spamming the thing every 2.5 sec, so I'll probably go for the Potency endline no matter what (alongside the CB and WDB ones, of course) and just leave this ability alone.
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Old 11-05-2014, 03:20 PM   #16
Meshuggahx

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Tbh i would gladly swap on my sk vital trigger for earthshock. Not like we really need another aoe taunt.
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