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Old 06-19-2006, 02:20 AM   #1
Elektra34

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Ok, I was willing to give SOE the benefit of the doubt with the changes to conj, however enough is enough.
 
Since the major nerfage of LU24 I am now consistently outdamaged by a fury on raids, yes you read that right, a FURY for gods sake.
Maybe you might think the fury has better gear and all masters, well i can tell you all my pets are master, the stances are master, my gear is fabled and i have put my aa's into the mage pet line mainly. yet, using a mage pet on these raids I have slipped from usually top 3 of damage to like 8th or lower.
 
Maybe we did need some fine tuning but it seems SOE have taken the sledgehammer approach to balancing. I would be very interested to hear from the devs on which occassions they feel it is right for a so called dps class to be out damaged by a healer class i.e Fury.
 
Come on guys admit you went to far for once, there is no shame in being wrong only in continuing with that wrong.
 
If you dont re-balance what you have done to conj then I can see a mass exodus from the class, oh and finally, I should say Congratulations, for managing to break what was a fun class to play into a next to useless taxi service .

Message Edited by Elektra34 on 06-18-2006 03:22 PM

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Old 06-19-2006, 04:44 AM   #2
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/yawnI call BS!
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Old 06-19-2006, 08:24 AM   #3
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Pre-LU24 in my raids it was Wizard > Conj > Ranger > Necro in parses... Post-LU24 it is still Wizard > Conj > Ranger > Necro... For the record.
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Old 06-19-2006, 08:56 AM   #4
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I call  BS to.....  i could send my pets in and go afk and pretty much out dps any  healer.

 

ps. what kinda  necro you got in your guild that gets  out dpsed by a ranger SMILEY

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Old 06-19-2006, 09:03 AM   #5
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perkinsowns wrote:
I call  BS to.....  i could send my pets in and go afk and pretty much out dps any  healer.
Then your healers suck.  Druids especially need to be around 600-800 and healing.  My pet ain't hitting no 800 anymore. The OP is exaggerating, but is on a point.  Yeah, there are a handful of us that are coming close to where we were, but alot of us aren't.  I'm only about 200ish or so tops away from where I was on single target encounters.  I haven't had a chance to raid the REAL AE encounters yet though.  Mage pet bug once its fixed will REALLY help our dps get back up.  Hopefully they will restore Elemental Vestment and then we'll be perfectly right where we should be.
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Old 06-19-2006, 09:36 AM   #6
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Just my observations, but as for all the "nerfs" hmmmm....lets see, Shattered Terrain's stiffle changed to Daze. Now theres been alot of talk about the difference between daze and stiffle, but they still stand nice and still for me for the 5 secs. The dps decrease on air pet.....so far hes still stealing aggro, just take about 3 more secs. The changes to the swarm and dumbfire pets are the biggest IMO, but aside from a small amount of lost dps, and the annoying rythm breaking new recast timers, overall I've only really lost about 150dps, so instead of my usual 180k+ total dmg, im gettin around 160-70 ish......ooooooooo. I'm still darring people to try and top me beings that my caster pet, given i keep him alive, will easily do 100k on his own.

I am, however, quite annoyed with the apparent stupid pill they seem to of fed my mage pet though. The whole cast, run closer, cast , run closer , run closer , cast thing is really annoying, I'm spending most of my time just clik'n the attack and back off buttons now instead of casting spells. 

I can still solo everything I could before, dont really care about the decrease on Elemental Vestment, since I didnt really use it much to begin with. Strange I know, but it always stole aggro too fast for my taste, so now its more like a bonus that i can use it without worry lol.

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Old 06-19-2006, 10:24 AM   #7
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DobyMT

Then your healers suck.  Druids especially need to be around 600-800 and healing.


 

You need another parser because yours isnt working or you are exaggerating.

 

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Old 06-19-2006, 02:16 PM   #8
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Yup. I've seen plenty of good furies and they're not in full heal mode and doing that kind of DPS. I call more BS. Ever heard of crying wolf? with so much god [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing and complaining going on right now, its really hard to tell the people that are genuinely trying to get summoners into a fair balance from those who just want to be uber and are going to whine about everything.We got nerfed.... I don't like it, i enjoyed being a god as much as anyone. But we WERE overpowered, and imo the nerf was a little bit much on the personal DPS, but gross exagerations liek this just get the community as a whole ignored.Fix the Mage Peteither restore root duration or restore shattered lineEV needs its damage tuned up a bit... my Master 1 at maxed out int is at like 160ish per proc iirc which @ 70 is bogus.Aegnar70 ConjMistmoore
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Old 06-20-2006, 01:51 AM   #9
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Swarm pets aren't on most parsers now also, so dps will look a little lower.
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Old 06-20-2006, 09:05 PM   #10
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Its not only the litel change to Shatterd, that they removed the stunn, but when i logd back on. I saw that I lost about 100 dmg on it as well M1. Enyone ells seen this, but yes, ok about a nerf, but they didnt get us back the HP they took out with one of the other litel paches they did.

 

Fun fun almost all the time.......

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Old 06-21-2006, 05:54 PM   #11
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DobyMT wrote:

perkinsowns wrote:
I call  BS to.....  i could send my pets in and go afk and pretty much out dps any  healer.
Then your healers suck.  Druids especially need to be around 600-800 and healing.  My pet ain't hitting no 800 anymore.

ROFL!!!!
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Old 06-21-2006, 07:02 PM   #12
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If your being out dps'd by a healer.....um....I have no idea what to tell you that wont seem stupid and obvious. Last night just for kicks I was in a group that consisted of just me and an assassin (long story, dont bother asking). I have absolutely no buffs in this set up at all, but no way a healer was going to come close. Furies can do pretty solid dps, like 1200, but we should still be above that if the fury is pulling that much anyways.And on the topic of swarm pets on the parser, why doesnt everyone use ACT, wich does pick up the pets, just assigns them to you? ACT is by far the most superior parser these days and the only other one worth having is Combat Stats for the ae dings.
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Old 06-22-2006, 11:02 PM   #13
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I don't use a parser, I can care less what I parse.  Even in an avoidance build I'm still top of parse, top in deaths too.  I think mobs have a special simonsays aggro, so when something goes wrong they decide to go after me first.  The only time I have seen a healer beat a conjuror was in PPtR and the conjuror had his shattering line down on 1 of those 24 mob fallen raider groups.  Otherwise it shouldn't happen at all under normal circumstances.

Message Edited by Loranthala on 06-22-2006 12:02 PM

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Old 06-29-2006, 09:39 AM   #14
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Well i come from a pvp server and these nerfs hurt the conj pretty bad.  The shattered line of spells was the conj's only saviour to the stealth scout due to its stifle and 2 sec cast time ( temor never helps cause as you know the stun durations are greatly reduced in pvp and u pretty much can't even tell there is a stun with it).  Now with 3 secs to cast well....if u get jumped good luck getting it off.  With all the interupts and a 3 sec cast time...you'll laying on the ground b4 u can get it off.  Now both the conj's stuns/stifles (or "daze" i guess) being 3 sec cast times and the reduced dps on pretty much everything we had, well lets just say it sucks.  I mean we wear cloth..we need some dps.
 
As for raiding goes its also a little tougher to get all the dps out that u can.  With 60sec recast swarm pets and the 17.whatever % reduced dps.  I mean with a named the first AE and there goes most of your dps, if u have your scout pet well then there goes 80% of your dps.  I think conj's had such good dps in the first place is because alot of it is pets that have little hp.  I thought the reduced damage on the tank pet was pretty funny though....that just how bad we got it.  Sony even took the worst dps pet we had and nerfed it. 
 
But all said and done all i ask is that they give us back our damage and 2 sec cast on shattered terrain and our 30s recast on our other stun.  If you think about it warlocks have ae's that can do 3x's the damage ours can so at least give us our 2 seconds cast time back.
 
 
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Old 06-29-2006, 07:40 PM   #15
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I can't speak for PVP servers, i don't play on any. PVP players may be hit badly, but I can't tell.
 
Regarding raiding, the changes are quite fine for me. My mage pet doesn't die very often, as the micromanagement of the pet does work quite well for me. When i am careless, the pet is gone. It's just not an 'attack and forget about it' pet like the scout one, but as I like pet handling, I am quite comfortable with that. The dumbfire pets needed to be timed with AEs anyway to be of good use. Soloing and grouping works fine as well. It takes a bit longer to take mobs down.
 
I don't work harder for my DPS now, I always do my best - pre or post LU24. The DPS is down a bit, but nothing ground breaking.
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Old 06-29-2006, 07:44 PM   #16
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Elektra34 wrote:
Ok, I was willing to give SOE the benefit of the doubt with the changes to conj, however enough is enough.
 
Since the major nerfage of LU24 I am now consistently outdamaged by a fury on raids, yes you read that right, a FURY for gods sake.
Maybe you might think the fury has better gear and all masters, well i can tell you all my pets are master, the stances are master, my gear is fabled and i have put my aa's into the mage pet line mainly. yet, using a mage pet on these raids I have slipped from usually top 3 of damage to like 8th or lower.
 
Maybe we did need some fine tuning but it seems SOE have taken the sledgehammer approach to balancing. I would be very interested to hear from the devs on which occassions they feel it is right for a so called dps class to be out damaged by a healer class i.e Fury.
 
Come on guys admit you went to far for once, there is no shame in being wrong only in continuing with that wrong.
 
If you dont re-balance what you have done to conj then I can see a mass exodus from the class, oh and finally, I should say Congratulations, for managing to break what was a fun class to play into a next to useless taxi service .

Message Edited by Elektra34 on 06-18-2006 03:22 PM


Dude... all I have to say is "you are doing it wrong then". I out-parsed my warlock and my necro last night... the swashie is a given (don't ask my opinion on them). Now, that doesn't happen every time, but I am consistently in the top 5. And I see more conjurors rather than less. No mere Fury out parses me! /flex SMILEY But I always want one in my group cause their group heals hit my pet... <3 for teh Fury!

Message Edited by juliev on 06-29-2006 09:45 AM

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Old 06-29-2006, 08:08 PM   #17
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If I add up my damage or DPS to my pet, the only one that beats me on a consistent basis is a Ranger on long fights. On short ones wizards and swashbucklers get in the mix. (No warlocks or necros or assasins in my Guild)
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Old 06-29-2006, 08:13 PM   #18
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I just had another thought.... do you rename your pet to your name for the parse fights? All my pets have my name so I can see my total damage. I also run my own parser when I am doing instances and stuff so I can see how I compare and what is working best. Then I apply that at raid. Idk if that helps at all... hope so SMILEY
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Old 06-29-2006, 08:19 PM   #19
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juliev wrote:
I just had another thought.... do you rename your pet to your name for the parse fights? All my pets have my name so I can see my total damage. I also run my own parser when I am doing instances and stuff so I can see how I compare and what is working best. Then I apply that at raid. Idk if that helps at all... hope so SMILEY

Hmm, this would give the healers some heart attack when my pet dies :smileyvery-happy:
 
I should rename my pet after a templar :smileyhappy:
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Old 06-29-2006, 11:46 PM   #20
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Renpatsu wrote:


juliev wrote:
I just had another thought.... do you rename your pet to your name for the parse fights? All my pets have my name so I can see my total damage. I also run my own parser when I am doing instances and stuff so I can see how I compare and what is working best. Then I apply that at raid. Idk if that helps at all... hope so SMILEY

Hmm, this would give the healers some heart attack when my pet dies :smileyvery-happy:
 
I should rename my pet after a templar :smileyhappy:


ROFL... or get them made MT for the uber Templar DPS they are putting out.. either way... good for a laugh!
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Old 07-02-2006, 06:38 AM   #21
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meh we do that all the time, for a while we named our pets after our MT templar, and he was cranking MASSIVE dps out, and was like RAWR thinking he was a badass Templar lol. Good times...Good times
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Old 07-02-2006, 05:40 PM   #22
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DobyMT wrote:
meh we do that all the time, for a while we named our pets after our MT templar, and he was cranking MASSIVE dps out, and was like RAWR thinking he was a badass Templar lol. Good times...Good times

lol.. I am gonna do it then... we'll see if anyone notices.
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Old 07-02-2006, 05:43 PM   #23
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juliev wrote:


DobyMT wrote:
meh we do that all the time, for a while we named our pets after our MT templar, and he was cranking MASSIVE dps out, and was like RAWR thinking he was a badass Templar lol. Good times...Good times

lol.. I am gonna do it then... we'll see if anyone notices.



Poke and pick, Pick and poke -- LOL Juliev - you are such a troublemaker SMILEY

Whatever else you do keep it up!!

EDITed because I can't type well when laughing ...

Message Edited by CacheRAM on 07-02-2006 08:44 AM

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Old 07-07-2006, 04:40 AM   #24
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How about you people that geek out over math in a video game just quit or better yet, throw out the damned parsers and enjoy the freakiing game and realize that like in life, nothing is fair and balanced and that to do some things you might depend on another class to get you through it.

 

I don't use parsers and I think they should put all of them on the 3rd party software ban list.

 

The only time I hear people complaining about damage etc are usually the same people calling for nerfs of other classes and then when it happens they decide to play that class and then complain that the other classes are then overpowered etc.. and the complaining goes on and on forever. I swear I think some of you people are paid by a company to do nothing but moan and complain on game forums to try and ruin a game.

 

 

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Old 07-07-2006, 10:59 AM   #25
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CacheRAM wrote:


juliev wrote:


DobyMT wrote:
meh we do that all the time, for a while we named our pets after our MT templar, and he was cranking MASSIVE dps out, and was like RAWR thinking he was a badass Templar lol. Good times...Good times

lol.. I am gonna do it then... we'll see if anyone notices.



Poke and pick, Pick and poke -- LOL Juliev - you are such a troublemaker SMILEY

Whatever else you do keep it up!!

EDITed because I can't type well when laughing ...

Message Edited by CacheRAM on 07-02-200608:44 AM


I do try Cache baby SMILEY

And regarding the math geeks who use parsers... dude... how else can I know if what I am doing is working? Take a chill... I don't have it enshrined on top of my computer... I just run it when something changes or at raid. Are you upset cause a parser caught you slacking off? hmm?

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Old 07-07-2006, 06:13 PM   #26
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SilverSlayer wrote:

How about you people that geek out over math in a video game just quit or better yet, throw out the damned parsers and enjoy the freakiing game and realize that like in life, nothing is fair and balanced and that to do some things you might depend on another class to get you through it.

I don't use parsers and I think they should put all of them on the 3rd party software ban list.

The only time I hear people complaining about damage etc are usually the same people calling for nerfs of other classes and then when it happens they decide to play that class and then complain that the other classes are then overpowered etc.. and the complaining goes on and on forever. I swear I think some of you people are paid by a company to do nothing but moan and complain on game forums to try and ruin a game.


Ok so you dont like parsing and dont mind if you suck or not because you never want to see how your stacking against other players. I like to see where I stand and what I am capable of.For all you know your the best conjuror world wide or the worst. If your having fun with the way you play being uninformed about wich it is, thats your chioce. I want to try and help my guild out as much as I can so i will continue to parse.Its always nice to see someone belittling people who want to better themselves and others though.

Message Edited by Ishboozor on 07-07-2006 07:13 AM

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Old 07-07-2006, 07:44 PM   #27
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Ishboozor wrote:

SilverSlayer wrote:

How about you people that geek out over math in a video game just quit or better yet, throw out the damned parsers and enjoy the freakiing game and realize that like in life, nothing is fair and balanced and that to do some things you might depend on another class to get you through it.


I don't use parsers and I think they should put all of them on the 3rd party software ban list.


The only time I hear people complaining about damage etc are usually the same people calling for nerfs of other classes and then when it happens they decide to play that class and then complain that the other classes are then overpowered etc.. and the complaining goes on and on forever. I swear I think some of you people are paid by a company to do nothing but moan and complain on game forums to try and ruin a game.



Ok so you dont like parsing and dont mind if you suck or not because you never want to see how your stacking against other players. I like to see where I stand and what I am capable of.

For all you know your the best conjuror world wide or the worst. If your having fun with the way you play being uninformed about wich it is, thats your chioce. I want to try and help my guild out as much as I can so i will continue to parse.

Its always nice to see someone belittling people who want to better themselves and others though.

Message Edited by Ishboozor on 07-07-2006 07:13 AM


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Old 07-08-2006, 04:46 PM   #28
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*Sniff* I'm a necro and  i didnt like the nerf much, i'm ok with dps reduction, i just dont like the root spells nerf, have you looked at the first root spell you get at the lower lvls it's like 10 seconds long. I dont know about you but that aint long enough to get away from a mob you need to root and run from. even your top lvl root is only 30 seconds now and that makes manging a mob harder, even for us  necro's with our highiest power regen in game. even with power tapping your pet your still pushing your luck. O and parsing is BAD usually cos i notice i'm the only dps doing there job in the raid, i should never be 800 - 1000 dps over the next guy on the parsing list.
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Old 07-08-2006, 08:52 PM   #29
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juliev wrote:


CacheRAM wrote:


juliev wrote:


DobyMT wrote:
meh we do that all the time, for a while we named our pets after our MT templar, and he was cranking MASSIVE dps out, and was like RAWR thinking he was a badass Templar lol. Good times...Good times

lol.. I am gonna do it then... we'll see if anyone notices.



Poke and pick, Pick and poke -- LOL Juliev - you are such a troublemaker SMILEY

Whatever else you do keep it up!!

EDITed because I can't type well when laughing ...

Message Edited by CacheRAM on 07-02-200608:44 AM


I do try Cache baby SMILEY

And regarding the math geeks who use parsers... dude... how else can I know if what I am doing is working? Take a chill... I don't have it enshrined on top of my computer... I just run it when something changes or at raid. Are you upset cause a parser caught you slacking off? hmm?




Nope, no one in my guild uses parsers they are pointless.. the point in playing the game is to have FUN not to do math.
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Old 07-09-2006, 06:42 AM   #30
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Don't Fury's in their 60's get a nuke that hits for 1K+ and stuns them?  I was with a Fury the other night and observed a huge nuke he laid out and asked him about it.
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