Max DPS?

TheBu · 07-26-2006, 07:56 PM

Sup I am intrested in how much dps a 70 wiz should be pumpin out in a raid...

in solo and in group encounters?

sometimes i have no tank or troub. heck some times no fury...

So how much does our dps depend on the rest of the group? for the agro managment and for dps output.

in group encounters are you guys waiting 10% for aoes?

and when are u getting 1600dps?

I am not talking about casting Glacial Wind then Fusion

but suptained dps

for master i expect a 15% to 20% increase in damage. I have masters for Ball of Lava, Iceshield, protoferno, Irradiate, Cease and Glacial Wind & Electrifying Flash

I looked at the casting times and damage and think i know what spell do the most damage. Ice Nove,Ball of lave, Irradiate and Glacial Wind

But how much dps are u wizs doing? and how?

Admhel wrote:

/agree Soulbringer..

and for those wizards who think u can't toss out dps more than 1100-1600 each mob fight in raids... think again and re-learn your class.

gosh.. I hate being #1 DPS .. cuz there's a 100% chance other classes will envy you and eventually you'll become nerfed. ><

Message Edited by Admhel on 05-09-2006 11:41 PM

Message Edited by TheBuzZ on 07-26-2006 08:56 AM

daray · 07-26-2006, 09:02 PM

Well solo and group content dies so fast that it is hard to suggest an appropriate dps for it. I am not overly concerned on agro vs. solo/group content either (with maybe the exception of nizara), so dont tend to hold back too much as the mobs are pretty [Removed for Content]. Raid dps is highly dependent on the person behind the toon, and I have little problem sustaining 1600 single target dps on a several minute fight. Group dps is highly depended on how many mobs you have in the encounter. Having said that, a few things come to mind that will certainly improve your dps: Your raid setup A good tank - that knows how to hold agro. Dirge / Coercer / Scout hate onto the MT as needed (shouldn't need all 3) to increase their agro. Dirge and coercers increase MT agro by approx 40% ea. Troubador in your group - 40% hate reduction, damage procs, power regen, +spell crits, + casting times, Fury and/or Inquisitor in group make me happy too. Furies are obvious ... Inqs have a nifty ability that reduces your casting timers by 50% odd for 24 secs. Debuffs Debuffs on raids will make a huge difference. With sufficient debuffs you will be looking at 25k+ crit ice novas and fusions. Make sure that everyone is debuffing. Make sure you have a brigand or 2 SMILEY

Your spell quality I am fully mastered for all end-game spells. Your AA setup I have all 50 AAs spent such to maximise dps. Your spell order Spell order will all also have a big impact on the DPS you can put out. With the help of a parser, identify an optimal spell casting order to maximise dps. Your gear This is probably one of the more obvious things to state, but make sure your int is maxed out. I also make good use of damage proc gear (i wear 7 items that proc damage). Well that is all that i can think of atm. I am sure there is more i have missed, but the above is a good starting point.

Message Edited by neleso on 07-26-2006 10:09 AM

painkiller · 07-26-2006, 09:59 PM

on which encounter or encounters where you could sustain 1600dps were you referring to? you said, several minutes....could you name same of these encounters plz?? were they named?? ae encounters?? i just dont see a wiz sustaining dps on a fight lasting longer then 2 mins....i too have many proc items 8 in total.....lvl 70 wiz and on anything lasting a considerate length of time 2mins+ usually parse around 1400 on ae's 2500+.........

IllusiveThoughts · 07-26-2006, 10:16 PM

painkiller75 wrote:

on which encounter or encounters where you could sustain 1600dps were you referring to? you said, several minutes....could you name same of these encounters plz?? were they named?? ae encounters?? i just dont see a wiz sustaining dps on a fight lasting longer then 2 mins....i too have many proc items 8 in total.....lvl 70 wiz and on anything lasting a considerate length of time 2mins+ usually parse around 1400 on ae's 2500+.........

there's 3 power proc items that all wizards drool over, its the wand the legs and the chest,

legs of mo and forgot where the wand comes from but combined they add anywhere from 1-2k power in procs per min. add in capped flowing thought at 105 and you have 2-3k power per min, combine that with heart/shart/vital conversion and you have 3-4k power per minute, and vioala you have sustained dps.

my personal best without these items (except for xhavis gown) was 1150 dps on an 8 minute fight.

and almost 800 dps on a 17 minute fight (damned azlid!) still had 40% power left too.

but neleso pretty much summed it up.

HomeChicken · 07-27-2006, 05:27 PM

yah as soon as you get those power procing items its really easy to keep your power up, specially between manastone 1 - 2, dracomancer gloves, FT gear, your own power pumping spells, and regen in your group, power seems like a lot less of a problem.

and if ya got power, you can keep cranking out the dps heh

electricninjasex · 07-27-2006, 06:05 PM

The only sampling periods I consider valid for power regen procs in terms of FT are between the beginning and end of sustained spellcasting. The only fights long enough for that are the Harla Dar add burn, 3 Princes, and possibly MO. That in mind, I calculated X'Haviz's Gown of Glory for me to be roughly FT20 and the Wand of the Tempest FT27. Not the Fount of Everlasting Power per se but light years beyond the Godking weapon and any pathetic endgame FT robe.

HerzenFunia · 07-27-2006, 08:01 PM

imho there's a bit more long fight encounters like Venekor and Chel'Drak. And i havent seen my pwr below 90% when we were burning adds on harla non-stop.

Brockaine2 · 07-27-2006, 11:55 PM

Group setup is by far the biggest factor. For example if you only have a dirge in MT group and no troub around your dps will suck or you'll die a ton. Throw in a troubador a coercer in the mt and the right healer for a caster group and watch ur dps sky rocket to top of the raid or very close.

electricninjasex · 07-28-2006, 01:12 AM

HerzenFunia wrote:

And i havent seen my pwr below 90% when we were burning adds on harla non-stop.

Because you're calling help on the adds. It's almost impossible to actually count the regen'd power, so we don't do it that way. You go to the log file, add up the procs during the fight, assume that the average amount of the regen was done per proc, and average out the sum regen over the length of the fight. FT outside of combat is irrelevant, so we ignore the fact that the robe is giving you the FT0 equivalent at that time.

trixx · 07-28-2006, 01:35 AM

I am trying to figure out why the 2 wizards and 1 warlock that roll with us on our raids NEVER get above 600 DPS. Usually, around 500. our scouts are rockin 1k-1500 DPS.

A: is there something I am missing in the parse? EG. is there a pet i need to parse too or something

B: they claim to have all adept 3 at least, and one of them is geared in nearly all fabled. When asked to up the DPS, though, they merely start pulling aggro and die.

What can I do>?? Id like to see this 1600 damage, but that seems far off.

Ankha, AB

IllusiveThoughts · 07-28-2006, 01:40 AM

trixxie wrote:

I am trying to figure out why the 2 wizards and 1 warlock that roll with us on our raids NEVER get above 600 DPS. Usually, around 500. our scouts are rockin 1k-1500 DPS.

A: is there something I am missing in the parse? EG. is there a pet i need to parse too or something

B: they claim to have all adept 3 at least, and one of them is geared in nearly all fabled. When asked to up the DPS, though, they merely start pulling aggro and die.

What can I do>?? Id like to see this 1600 damage, but that seems far off.

Ankha, AB

sorry to be harsh but get a better tank.

I've raided with 0 hate reduction buffs and have been able to do 1500 dps without pulling agro.

I've also parsed 1K dps fights using only dots....(that means without using ice nova, fusion, sunstrike, ball of lava, incapacitate or ice flame) spamming irradiate, surging tempest, protoferno, forge of ro, firey convultions, rending icicles, glacial winds, shocking flash, and meleing the mob with grizzlefazzles equipped.

If that doesn't work for you, then try putting a troubador in the same group as the mages, and playing his hate reduction song (40%), and if that doesn't work, give each mage amends, or moderate, and as a last resort have a coercer give each one harmonious link.

if that still isn't working, farm the tenerborus tangle ring event on temple grounds to get each one a skywatchers robe and make them wear it.

if that still isn't working, have each one start casting a hex doll on the dps call, and start dps'ing 8 seconds after the rest of the raid but go full burn, (can still acheive 12-1400 ext dps like this but with lower chance of agro)

and finally if that isn't working make them only use dots and use concussive before casting ball of lava, and ceace before casting incapaciate.

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-27-2006 02:52 PM

trixx · 07-28-2006, 01:44 AM

okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then

IllusiveThoughts · 07-28-2006, 01:59 AM

trixxie wrote:
okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then

I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps.

(alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub)

(amends 39% hate transfer to a paly)

(harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer)

(synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist)

trixx · 07-28-2006, 02:28 AM

IllusiveThoughts wrote:

trixxie wrote:
okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then

I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps.

(alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub)

(amends 39% hate transfer to a paly)

(harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer)

(synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist)

extremely helpful, thank you

Mareth · 07-28-2006, 05:09 AM

trixxie wrote:

IllusiveThoughts wrote:

trixxie wrote:
okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then

I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps.

(alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub)

(amends 39% hate transfer to a paly)

(harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer)

(synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist)

extremely helpful, thank you

...you managed to pull aggro with that? Please, do tell! Did you try to start the fight with Fusion, or somehting? SMILEY

IllusiveThoughts · 07-28-2006, 11:18 AM

LordSarig wrote:

trixxie wrote:

IllusiveThoughts wrote:

trixxie wrote:
okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then

I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps.

(alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub)

(amends 39% hate transfer to a paly)

(harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer)

(synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist)

extremely helpful, thank you

...you managed to pull aggro with that? Please, do tell! Did you try to start the fight with Fusion, or somehting?

3 mob fusion crit for 27k main 24k 2nd mob and 20k 3rd mob.

after a crit glacial winds, and frigid gift procs going off on all of them, along with the hate from forge of ro. and precision of the meistro was up along with a few dissonant note procs with synergisim procs. i remember seeing char and / or burning affliction go off too.

this all happened in about 9 seconds, and i got agro off only one, the sk MT fd me and i ended up staying down for about 20 seconds to ensure i wouldn't get agro when i poped back up, only did 2.2k dps on that one, I wonder what it would of been had i not been fd'd for so long.

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 12:21 AM

merdo · 07-28-2006, 06:48 PM

IllusiveThoughts wrote:

LordSarig wrote:

trixxie wrote:

IllusiveThoughts wrote:

trixxie wrote:
okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then

I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps.

(alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub)

(amends 39% hate transfer to a paly)

(harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer)

(synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist)

extremely helpful, thank you

...you managed to pull aggro with that? Please, do tell! Did you try to start the fight with Fusion, or somehting?

3 mob fusion crit for 27k main 24k 2nd mob and 20k 3rd mob.

after a crit glacial winds, and frigid gift procs going off on all of them, along with the hate from forge of ro. and precision of the meistro was up along with a few dissonant note procs with synergisim procs. i remember seeing char and / or burning affliction go off too.

this all happened in about 9 seconds, and i got agro off only one, the sk MT fd me and i ended up staying down for about 20 seconds to ensure i wouldn't get agro when i poped back up, only did 2.2k dps on that one, I wonder what it would of been had i not been fd'd for so long.

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 12:21 AM

I dont play a wiz or warlock but to see some of you guys "actually" do dps is nice.

I had a similar setup on a raid recently in a t7 raid zone.

I was normally able to do 1200ish dps (before i died) but on this raid i was around 1700 most of the night. (i have one post 50 master spell the rest adept 3)

The assasin was 1100ish (my guild)

the conj was 900ish (he was touting how he had master pets, this conj was from a different guild)

The wiz was doing 1200ish but after a few parses with me she logged to her healer.(partly because we needed one more and it was either me or her, we both have high level alt healers, my guild)

Most of the night I got tells about how i should be nurfed and how 900dps was great for an conj and my class should not be getting anywhere near that dps.

We all had the same agro reduction and the tank never lost agro the whole night.

I can imagine if i had broke the 2k dps mark there would have been a huge melt down. I was told they were gonna do an emailing campaign to nurf my class at 1700ish dps.

Good job on representing your class, I think most wizzies expect to be top dps with no effort and have convinced some others they are right to think this.

IllusiveThoughts · 07-28-2006, 08:09 PM

merdorf wrote:

IllusiveThoughts wrote:

LordSarig wrote:

trixxie wrote:

IllusiveThoughts wrote:

trixxie wrote:
okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then

I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps.

(alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub)

(amends 39% hate transfer to a paly)

(harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer)

(synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist)

extremely helpful, thank you

...you managed to pull aggro with that? Please, do tell! Did you try to start the fight with Fusion, or somehting?

3 mob fusion crit for 27k main 24k 2nd mob and 20k 3rd mob.

after a crit glacial winds, and frigid gift procs going off on all of them, along with the hate from forge of ro. and precision of the meistro was up along with a few dissonant note procs with synergisim procs. i remember seeing char and / or burning affliction go off too.

this all happened in about 9 seconds, and i got agro off only one, the sk MT fd me and i ended up staying down for about 20 seconds to ensure i wouldn't get agro when i poped back up, only did 2.2k dps on that one, I wonder what it would of been had i not been fd'd for so long.

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 12:21 AM

I dont play a wiz or warlock but to see some of you guys "actually" do dps is nice.

I had a similar setup on a raid recently in a t7 raid zone.

I was normally able to do 1200ish dps (before i died) but on this raid i was around 1700 most of the night. (i have one post 50 master spell the rest adept 3)

The assasin was 1100ish (my guild)

the conj was 900ish (he was touting how he had master pets, this conj was from a different guild)

The wiz was doing 1200ish but after a few parses with me she logged to her healer.(partly because we needed one more and it was either me or her, we both have high level alt healers, my guild)

Most of the night I got tells about how i should be nurfed and how 900dps was great for an conj and my class should not be getting anywhere near that dps.

We all had the same agro reduction and the tank never lost agro the whole night.

I can imagine if i had broke the 2k dps mark there would have been a huge melt down. I was told they were gonna do an emailing campaign to nurf my class at 1700ish dps.

Good job on representing your class, I think most wizzies expect to be top dps with no effort and have convinced some others they are right to think this.

so what class are you? brigand, swash, bruiser, or zerker?

and 900 dps for a m1 pet + conj is pitiful, I've seen the pets do 600 dps on their own, and the conj break 800 when separated on the parse.

HerzenFunia · 07-28-2006, 08:11 PM

Illu you're lucky if you're always raiding with those buffs :smileyhappy:

IllusiveThoughts · 07-28-2006, 08:41 PM

HerzenFunia wrote:

Illu you're lucky if you're always raiding with those buffs :smileyhappy:

its pretty rare when I have all of them (only happened 3x so far)

On our last Labs raid I only had Harmonious link (23%) from the coercer for de-agro, had to use conccusive, ceace, skywatchers, and garg pet, to try to keep from dying. I ended up making it to vyemm with about 5 deaths(mostly from MT saving my butt with FD and rescue). MT was holding agro at 1500 or so dps untill we got to the mobs just before the corsolander, and taunts were getting resisted, then it was all guess work (and deathage) one fight I pulled agro at 800, another 1300, /shrug. no troub and no illusionist on that one either.

In lyceum last night for the most part I just had amends, the coercer was charming mobs on the charmable encounters so I lost harmonious link. Still hit a couple 2K fights with only amends. No troub and no illusionist for that raid. Me and the conj were really working hard to beat each other on this raid. He got top parse a few times too. Ended up with the zone wide parse at 1150 for the night. My dps started to drop after we killed essence of fear because the raid started to dwindle down to 3 groups and the mobs there have 1-1.8mil hp so they were lasting 3-5 minutes, and I had to start using heart/shard/vital conversion, and even cardinal intro on myself to keep up my power.

I have found that on reall really long fights you can sustain close to 800 dps if you use manastone, vital conversion, cardinal intro, and shard when ever they refresh, and only cast protoferno, forge of ro, surging tempest, rending icicles and ice nova/fusion when they refresh.

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 09:41 AM

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 09:48 AM

HerzenFunia · 07-28-2006, 08:55 PM

heh we dont have sk/paladin in guild, so no amends at 100% of raids. also corcer always using all his dps buff's for melee classes. same situation with illusionist (but sometimes i have synergizm :smileyhappy: ). but i still have a troub ing grp in 90% of raids so the situation is not so bad SMILEY

PS Do you remember your fight times on mobs in lyce? for example on 2 and 3 droag encounters and on single.

Message Edited by HerzenFunia on 07-28-2006 08:56 PM

IllusiveThoughts · 07-28-2006, 10:24 PM

HerzenFunia wrote:

heh we dont have sk/paladin in guild, so no amends at 100% of raids. also corcer always using all his dps buff's for melee classes. same situation with illusionist (but sometimes i have synergizm :smileyhappy: ). but i still have a troub ing grp in 90% of raids so the situation is not so bad

PS Do you remember your fight times on mobs in lyce? for example on 2 and 3 droag encounters and on single.

Message Edited by HerzenFunia on 07-28-2006 08:56 PM

you may want to try and convince the coercer/illusionist/raid leader that a mele haste buff and dps buff will pale to the extra dps 23% less hate will give to the wizard.

look at it this way, on the top end of the scale auto attack will generally hit for 300-400 dps(when parsed over a long sample period like a zone wide parse) with haste/dps buffs which is about 100-150 more dps from auto attack

If the wizard is doing 1000 dps and pulling agro, giving him 23% hate reduction would allow him to do 1230 dps.

if the wizard is doing 1500 dps it jumps to 1845 dps, and so on and so forth.

Hate reduction for a wizard directly correlates to a straight dps increase.

As for synergysim at m1 it can account for 7-8% of my dps on a single parse, and zonewide it can account for 3-4% of my zone dps, considering i can do 1400+ dps for a zone parse that makes synergisim give me roughly 55 dps increase on the zone parse and single parses it can inflate it by as much as 200 dps.

I have the parse info at home and I'll check it later today and post the parses your looking for.

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 11:28 AM

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 11:29 AM

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 11:32 AM

IllusiveThoughts · 07-29-2006, 03:05 AM

Here's some of the lyceum parses you requested funia,

2 mob group minion and trainer,

Allies: (02:37) 1328162 | 8459.63 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-14447]
Illu 15 | 204109 | 1427.34 me obviously
Alle 14 | 154655 | 1104.68 conj1
Oben 45 | 151788 | 1068.93 warlock
Lima 0 | 110329 | 805.32 (forgot)
Numb 16 | 96962 | 923.45 ranger
Band 65 | 82583 | 532.79 zerker
Kais 22 | 81820 | 705.34 bruiser
Monc 15 | 77332 | 633.87 ranger
Vinh 20 | 57550 | 509.29 monk
Sand 7 | 57016 | 543.01 coercer
Alla 7 | 56823 | 403.00 (forgot)
Soul 0 | 53364 | 373.17 (forgot)
Haka 19 | 46004 | 306.69 paly
Cudu 0 | 17004 | 156.00 lvl 64 dirge
Dami 0 | 15612 | 127.97
Kiko 8 | 14603 | 120.69
Pand 1 | 14318 | 94.82
Dani 1 | 9874 | 74.80
Come 0 | 6184 | 48.69
Kenn 11 | 5818 | 38.03
Elva 5 | 4510 | 30.68
Mari 9 | 2738 | 17.44

Here was one of the 3 mob encounters

Allies: (01:51) 1024083 | 9225.97 [HH Illu-Fusion-16002]
Illu 15 | 147476 | 1418.04
Alle 12 | 113203 | 1204.29
a fe 3 | 83914 | 784.24
Vinh 49 | 78096 | 796.90
Kais 30 | 77136 | 763.72
Numb 11 | 74876 | 813.87
Lima 0 | 68146 | 724.96
Oben 13 | 65496 | 873.28
Monc 13 | 61471 | 627.26
Band 27 | 52596 | 482.53
Haka 15 | 42273 | 444.98
Soul 0 | 31660 | 416.58
Alla 13 | 30928 | 355.49
Sand 3 | 25918 | 341.03
Kiko 5 | 21557 | 276.37
Pand 3 | 12130 | 125.05
Cudu 0 | 10202 | 118.63
Dani 7 | 8857 | 89.46
Kenn 6 | 7420 | 85.29
Come 1 | 3434 | 39.02
Mari 6 | 2794 | 28.51
Elva 0 | 2760 | 29.68
Glin 0 | 464 | 5.59

here was the essence of fear single target named

Allies: (03:40) 2007513 | 9125.06 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-20640]
Illu 14 | 239922 | 1249.59
Alle 74 | 193239 | 1192.83
Come 0 | 187157 | 995.52 conj 2
Numb 19 | 142593 | 774.96
Vinh 84 | 140361 | 797.51
Sand 23 | 134676 | 660.18
Kais 21 | 124483 | 638.37
Soul 5 | 115138 | 581.51
Band 51 | 113322 | 527.08
Monc 20 | 108104 | 624.88
Oben 26 | 106333 | 521.24
Dami 0 | 77487 | 377.99
Kiko 30 | 71938 | 390.97
Haka 32 | 61547 | 286.27
Pand 12 | 45662 | 218.48
Kenn 17 | 39634 | 191.47
Dani 12 | 25823 | 122.38
Mari 0 | 21497 | 100.92
Cudu 0 | 15286 | 88.87
Come 0 | 14279 | 74.37
Elva 10 | 10325 | 49.64
Shin 4 | 8083 | 71.53
Glin 0 | 3500 | 17.50
Alou 0 | 2285 | 11.04
Elly 0 | 1259 | 5.97

here was the eye of thul's with 1.8 mil hitpoints and less than 3 groups in the raid. (hence the long encounter time)

Allies: (05:19) 1904275 | 5969.51 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-15585]
Illu 12 | 353120 | 1169.27
Come 10 | 258895 | 860.12
Vinh 107 | 210168 | 698.23
Monc 39 | 192586 | 648.44
Nald 391 | 180066 | 569.83
Sand 1 | 147424 | 506.61
Lima 57 | 115458 | 383.58
Pand 27 | 88249 | 280.16
Haka 33 | 75863 | 243.93
Dark 0 | 67907 | 236.61
Alla 8 | 67858 | 229.25
Slam 5 | 52837 | 174.38
Mari 0 | 28946 | 91.89
Come 2 | 20014 | 68.54
Dani 6 | 18759 | 60.71
Kenn 5 | 15813 | 51.85
Glin 0 | 5353 | 18.02

and the other one

Allies: (04:23) 1861080 | 7076.35 [HH Illu-Fusion-15749]
Illu 10 | 271634 | 1090.90
Come 7 | 232672 | 994.32
Numb 25 | 191031 | 868.32
Vinh 95 | 169627 | 709.74
Kais 51 | 159480 | 667.28
Band 52 | 127612 | 488.93
Monc 29 | 110214 | 559.46
Haka 58 | 100474 | 387.93
Sand 9 | 93099 | 410.13
Kiko 42 | 88179 | 361.39
Soul 0 | 75795 | 306.86
Pand 10 | 70029 | 296.73
Dark 0 | 53503 | 229.63
Kenn 24 | 39470 | 153.58
Dani 30 | 33661 | 132.52
Mari 9 | 15065 | 64.66
Shin 7 | 13843 | 55.82
Glin 0 | 4958 | 22.43
Come 0 | 3788 | 74.27
Elly 0 | 2003 | 7.65
Dami 0 | 1199 | 6.81
Udag 0 | 890 | 3.44

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 04:06 PM

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-29-2006 12:03 AM

aubreyy · 07-29-2006, 04:14 AM

IllusiveThoughts wrote:

Here's some of the lyceum parses you requested funia,

2 mob group minion and trainer,

Allies: (02:37) 1328162 | 8459.63 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-14447]
Illu 15 | 204109 | 1427.34
Alle 14 | 154655 | 1104.68
Oben 45 | 151788 | 1068.93
Lima 0 | 110329 | 805.32
Numb 16 | 96962 | 923.45
Band 65 | 82583 | 532.79
Kais 22 | 81820 | 705.34
Monc 15 | 77332 | 633.87
Vinh 20 | 57550 | 509.29
Sand 7 | 57016 | 543.01
Alla 7 | 56823 | 403.00
Soul 0 | 53364 | 373.17
Haka 19 | 46004 | 306.69
Cudu 0 | 17004 | 156.00
Dami 0 | 15612 | 127.97
Kiko 8 | 14603 | 120.69
Pand 1 | 14318 | 94.82
Dani 1 | 9874 | 74.80
Come 0 | 6184 | 48.69
Kenn 11 | 5818 | 38.03
Elva 5 | 4510 | 30.68
Mari 9 | 2738 | 17.44

Here was one of the 3 mob encounters

Allies: (01:51) 1024083 | 9225.97 [HH Illu-Fusion-16002]
Illu 15 | 147476 | 1418.04
Alle 12 | 113203 | 1204.29
a fe 3 | 83914 | 784.24
Vinh 49 | 78096 | 796.90
Kais 30 | 77136 | 763.72
Numb 11 | 74876 | 813.87
Lima 0 | 68146 | 724.96
Oben 13 | 65496 | 873.28
Monc 13 | 61471 | 627.26
Band 27 | 52596 | 482.53
Haka 15 | 42273 | 444.98
Soul 0 | 31660 | 416.58
Alla 13 | 30928 | 355.49
Sand 3 | 25918 | 341.03
Kiko 5 | 21557 | 276.37
Pand 3 | 12130 | 125.05
Cudu 0 | 10202 | 118.63
Dani 7 | 8857 | 89.46
Kenn 6 | 7420 | 85.29
Come 1 | 3434 | 39.02
Mari 6 | 2794 | 28.51
Elva 0 | 2760 | 29.68
Glin 0 | 464 | 5.59

here was the essence of fear single target named

Allies: (03:40) 2007513 | 9125.06 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-20640]
Illu 14 | 239922 | 1249.59
Alle 74 | 193239 | 1192.83
Come 0 | 187157 | 995.52
Numb 19 | 142593 | 774.96
Vinh 84 | 140361 | 797.51
Sand 23 | 134676 | 660.18
Kais 21 | 124483 | 638.37
Soul 5 | 115138 | 581.51
Band 51 | 113322 | 527.08
Monc 20 | 108104 | 624.88
Oben 26 | 106333 | 521.24
Dami 0 | 77487 | 377.99
Kiko 30 | 71938 | 390.97
Haka 32 | 61547 | 286.27
Pand 12 | 45662 | 218.48
Kenn 17 | 39634 | 191.47
Dani 12 | 25823 | 122.38
Mari 0 | 21497 | 100.92
Cudu 0 | 15286 | 88.87
Come 0 | 14279 | 74.37
Elva 10 | 10325 | 49.64
Shin 4 | 8083 | 71.53
Glin 0 | 3500 | 17.50
Alou 0 | 2285 | 11.04
Elly 0 | 1259 | 5.97

here was the eye of thul's with 1.8 mil hitpoints and less than 3 groups in the raid. (hence the long encounter time)

Allies: (05:19) 1904275 | 5969.51 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-15585]
Illu 12 | 353120 | 1169.27
Come 10 | 258895 | 860.12
Vinh 107 | 210168 | 698.23
Monc 39 | 192586 | 648.44
Nald 391 | 180066 | 569.83
Sand 1 | 147424 | 506.61
Lima 57 | 115458 | 383.58
Pand 27 | 88249 | 280.16
Haka 33 | 75863 | 243.93
Dark 0 | 67907 | 236.61
Alla 8 | 67858 | 229.25
Slam 5 | 52837 | 174.38
Mari 0 | 28946 | 91.89
Come 2 | 20014 | 68.54
Dani 6 | 18759 | 60.71
Kenn 5 | 15813 | 51.85
Glin 0 | 5353 | 18.02

and the other one

Allies: (04:23) 1861080 | 7076.35 [HH Illu-Fusion-15749]
Illu 10 | 271634 | 1090.90
Come 7 | 232672 | 994.32
Numb 25 | 191031 | 868.32
Vinh 95 | 169627 | 709.74
Kais 51 | 159480 | 667.28
Band 52 | 127612 | 488.93
Monc 29 | 110214 | 559.46
Haka 58 | 100474 | 387.93
Sand 9 | 93099 | 410.13
Kiko 42 | 88179 | 361.39
Soul 0 | 75795 | 306.86
Pand 10 | 70029 | 296.73
Dark 0 | 53503 | 229.63
Kenn 24 | 39470 | 153.58
Dani 30 | 33661 | 132.52
Mari 9 | 15065 | 64.66
Shin 7 | 13843 | 55.82
Glin 0 | 4958 | 22.43
Come 0 | 3788 | 74.27
Elly 0 | 2003 | 7.65
Dami 0 | 1199 | 6.81
Udag 0 | 890 | 3.44

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 04:06 PM

Not to put you out, but could you label the classes with the names. at least the DPS. Also, when you parse yourself, do you count the proc damage that you buff other classes with as your own or thiers?

MystaSkrat · 07-29-2006, 08:11 AM

2 things. 1) yea, what classes are what bro? Where's the assassins and summoners at on there? and 2) why, is your raid dps <10,000?

IllusiveThoughts · 07-29-2006, 10:58 AM

aubreyy wrote:

Not to put you out, but could you label the classes with the names. at least the DPS. Also, when you parse yourself, do you count the proc damage that you buff other classes with as your own or thiers?

http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2

parsers do not pick up damage proc buffs put on other classes, the only one it does pick up and give to the wizard is Ice sheild because soe decided to screw wizards over by making them look better on a parse, and removing its function as a hate generation tool with lu24.

IllusiveThoughts · 07-29-2006, 11:00 AM

MystaSkratch wrote:
2 things. 1) yea, what classes are what bro? Where's the assassins and summoners at on there? and 2) why, is your raid dps <10,000?

the parses were meant for someone else, but i guess i can add some of the classes in

and im not going to respond to your 2nd question as it will only cause the demise of this thread.

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-29-2006 12:00 AM

HerzenFunia · 07-29-2006, 02:18 PM

tnx illu

For example in our guild in lyce raid dps is usually between 14-20k, depend's on how much ppl slacking SMILEY And on single mobs I rly cant do a lot of dps because it's dead after 4-5 of my nukes and on this fights assassins/ranger/swash usually on the top of parser. But on grp encounters the situation is better SMILEY I'am only fighiting for the top of parser with conjs and berserker (mt), and sometimes bers is on top of parser with dps like1.4-1.7k, but usually it happens when fusion is not up. My dps is rly depend on fight time. On single targets and 50 seconds fight I cant do a lot of dps. If there 2-3 mobs and 1-2 min I have much more chances to be on top of parser.

PS My best dps result 2650dps - in lyce on large heroic encounter (which on the way to final named). It was 59 secs fight with 17.5k raid dps.

MystaSkrat · 07-29-2006, 07:24 PM

IllusiveThoughts wrote:

MystaSkratch wrote:
2 things. 1) yea, what classes are what bro? Where's the assassins and summoners at on there? and 2) why, is your raid dps <10,000?

the parses were meant for someone else, but i guess i can add some of the classes in

and im not going to respond to your 2nd question as it will only cause the demise of this thread.

Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-29-200612:00 AM

My point in the second question is this: if you are personally doing 1000 dps and your whole raid is doing 9000 or less, then something isn't right. Hard to say what it is if you won't even comment on it. If I'm doing 1200+ dps, then my raid is doing 15000 or so, that's all.

merdo · 07-30-2006, 04:55 AM

so what class are you? brigand, swash, bruiser, or zerker?

and 900 dps for a m1 pet + conj is pitiful, I've seen the pets do 600 dps on their own, and the conj break 800 when separated on the parse.

I play a necromancer /hide last night a wizard was doing on average 400dps in our raid.

the assasin couldent break 900 but he was only 67

I was doing 1200ish anymore and i died but i didnt have ammends or anyother hate reduction beyond azure winds.

funny part was me #1 and our berserker #2 (no he wasnt tanking).

07-26-2006, 10:16 PM	#4
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	painkiller75 wrote: on which encounter or encounters where you could sustain 1600dps were you referring to? you said, several minutes....could you name same of these encounters plz?? were they named?? ae encounters?? i just dont see a wiz sustaining dps on a fight lasting longer then 2 mins....i too have many proc items 8 in total.....lvl 70 wiz and on anything lasting a considerate length of time 2mins+ usually parse around 1400 on ae's 2500+......... there's 3 power proc items that all wizards drool over, its the wand the legs and the chest, legs of mo and forgot where the wand comes from but combined they add anywhere from 1-2k power in procs per min. add in capped flowing thought at 105 and you have 2-3k power per min, combine that with heart/shart/vital conversion and you have 3-4k power per minute, and vioala you have sustained dps. my personal best without these items (except for xhavis gown) was 1150 dps on an 8 minute fight. and almost 800 dps on a 17 minute fight (damned azlid!) still had 40% power left too. but neleso pretty much summed it up. __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-27-2006, 05:27 PM	#5
HomeChicken Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 259	yah as soon as you get those power procing items its really easy to keep your power up, specially between manastone 1 - 2, dracomancer gloves, FT gear, your own power pumping spells, and regen in your group, power seems like a lot less of a problem. and if ya got power, you can keep cranking out the dps heh __________________

07-27-2006, 11:55 PM	#8
Brockaine2 Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 40	Group setup is by far the biggest factor. For example if you only have a dirge in MT group and no troub around your dps will suck or you'll die a ton. Throw in a troubador a coercer in the mt and the right healer for a caster group and watch ur dps sky rocket to top of the raid or very close. __________________ Azameth - Level 70 Wizard - Mistmoore

07-28-2006, 01:12 AM	#9
electricninjasex Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 413	HerzenFunia wrote: And i havent seen my pwr below 90% when we were burning adds on harla non-stop. Because you're calling help on the adds. It's almost impossible to actually count the regen'd power, so we don't do it that way. You go to the log file, add up the procs during the fight, assume that the average amount of the regen was done per proc, and average out the sum regen over the length of the fight. FT outside of combat is irrelevant, so we ignore the fact that the robe is giving you the FT0 equivalent at that time.

07-28-2006, 01:40 AM	#11
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	trixxie wrote: I am trying to figure out why the 2 wizards and 1 warlock that roll with us on our raids NEVER get above 600 DPS. Usually, around 500. our scouts are rockin 1k-1500 DPS. A: is there something I am missing in the parse? EG. is there a pet i need to parse too or something B: they claim to have all adept 3 at least, and one of them is geared in nearly all fabled. When asked to up the DPS, though, they merely start pulling aggro and die. What can I do>?? Id like to see this 1600 damage, but that seems far off. Ankha, AB sorry to be harsh but get a better tank. I've raided with 0 hate reduction buffs and have been able to do 1500 dps without pulling agro. I've also parsed 1K dps fights using only dots....(that means without using ice nova, fusion, sunstrike, ball of lava, incapacitate or ice flame) spamming irradiate, surging tempest, protoferno, forge of ro, firey convultions, rending icicles, glacial winds, shocking flash, and meleing the mob with grizzlefazzles equipped. If that doesn't work for you, then try putting a troubador in the same group as the mages, and playing his hate reduction song (40%), and if that doesn't work, give each mage amends, or moderate, and as a last resort have a coercer give each one harmonious link. if that still isn't working, farm the tenerborus tangle ring event on temple grounds to get each one a skywatchers robe and make them wear it. if that still isn't working, have each one start casting a hex doll on the dps call, and start dps'ing 8 seconds after the rest of the raid but go full burn, (can still acheive 12-1400 ext dps like this but with lower chance of agro) and finally if that isn't working make them only use dots and use concussive before casting ball of lava, and ceace before casting incapaciate. Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-27-2006 02:52 PM __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-26-2006, 07:56 PM	#1
TheBu General Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 400	Sup I am intrested in how much dps a 70 wiz should be pumpin out in a raid... in solo and in group encounters? sometimes i have no tank or troub. heck some times no fury... So how much does our dps depend on the rest of the group? for the agro managment and for dps output. in group encounters are you guys waiting 10% for aoes? and when are u getting 1600dps? I am not talking about casting Glacial Wind then Fusion but suptained dps for master i expect a 15% to 20% increase in damage. I have masters for Ball of Lava, Iceshield, protoferno, Irradiate, Cease and Glacial Wind & Electrifying Flash I looked at the casting times and damage and think i know what spell do the most damage. Ice Nove,Ball of lave, Irradiate and Glacial Wind But how much dps are u wizs doing? and how? Admhel wrote: /agree Soulbringer.. and for those wizards who think u can't toss out dps more than 1100-1600 each mob fight in raids... think again and re-learn your class. gosh.. I hate being #1 DPS .. cuz there's a 100% chance other classes will envy you and eventually you'll become nerfed. >< Message Edited by Admhel on 05-09-2006 11:41 PM Message Edited by TheBuzZ on 07-26-2006 08:56 AM

07-26-2006, 09:02 PM	#2
daray Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 371	Well solo and group content dies so fast that it is hard to suggest an appropriate dps for it. I am not overly concerned on agro vs. solo/group content either (with maybe the exception of nizara), so dont tend to hold back too much as the mobs are pretty [Removed for Content]. Raid dps is highly dependent on the person behind the toon, and I have little problem sustaining 1600 single target dps on a several minute fight. Group dps is highly depended on how many mobs you have in the encounter. Having said that, a few things come to mind that will certainly improve your dps: Your raid setup A good tank - that knows how to hold agro. Dirge / Coercer / Scout hate onto the MT as needed (shouldn't need all 3) to increase their agro. Dirge and coercers increase MT agro by approx 40% ea. Troubador in your group - 40% hate reduction, damage procs, power regen, +spell crits, + casting times, Fury and/or Inquisitor in group make me happy too. Furies are obvious ... Inqs have a nifty ability that reduces your casting timers by 50% odd for 24 secs. Debuffs Debuffs on raids will make a huge difference. With sufficient debuffs you will be looking at 25k+ crit ice novas and fusions. Make sure that everyone is debuffing. Make sure you have a brigand or 2 Your spell quality I am fully mastered for all end-game spells. Your AA setup I have all 50 AAs spent such to maximise dps. Your spell order Spell order will all also have a big impact on the DPS you can put out. With the help of a parser, identify an optimal spell casting order to maximise dps. Your gear This is probably one of the more obvious things to state, but make sure your int is maxed out. I also make good use of damage proc gear (i wear 7 items that proc damage). Well that is all that i can think of atm. I am sure there is more i have missed, but the above is a good starting point. Message Edited by neleso on 07-26-2006 10:09 AM

07-26-2006, 09:59 PM	#3
painkiller Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 6	on which encounter or encounters where you could sustain 1600dps were you referring to? you said, several minutes....could you name same of these encounters plz?? were they named?? ae encounters?? i just dont see a wiz sustaining dps on a fight lasting longer then 2 mins....i too have many proc items 8 in total.....lvl 70 wiz and on anything lasting a considerate length of time 2mins+ usually parse around 1400 on ae's 2500+.........

07-27-2006, 06:05 PM	#6
electricninjasex Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 413	The only sampling periods I consider valid for power regen procs in terms of FT are between the beginning and end of sustained spellcasting. The only fights long enough for that are the Harla Dar add burn, 3 Princes, and possibly MO. That in mind, I calculated X'Haviz's Gown of Glory for me to be roughly FT20 and the Wand of the Tempest FT27. Not the Fount of Everlasting Power per se but light years beyond the Godking weapon and any pathetic endgame FT robe.

07-27-2006, 08:01 PM	#7
HerzenFunia Lord Join Date: May 2006 Location: Russia Posts: 218	imho there's a bit more long fight encounters like Venekor and Chel'Drak. And i havent seen my pwr below 90% when we were burning adds on harla non-stop.

07-28-2006, 01:35 AM	#10
trixx Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 7	I am trying to figure out why the 2 wizards and 1 warlock that roll with us on our raids NEVER get above 600 DPS. Usually, around 500. our scouts are rockin 1k-1500 DPS. A: is there something I am missing in the parse? EG. is there a pet i need to parse too or something B: they claim to have all adept 3 at least, and one of them is geared in nearly all fabled. When asked to up the DPS, though, they merely start pulling aggro and die. What can I do>?? Id like to see this 1600 damage, but that seems far off. Ankha, AB

07-28-2006, 01:44 AM	#12
trixx Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 7	okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then

07-28-2006, 01:59 AM	#13
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	trixxie wrote: okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps. (alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub) (amends 39% hate transfer to a paly) (harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer) (synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist) __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-28-2006, 02:28 AM	#14
trixx Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 7	IllusiveThoughts wrote: trixxie wrote: okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps. (alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub) (amends 39% hate transfer to a paly) (harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer) (synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist) extremely helpful, thank you

07-28-2006, 05:09 AM	#15
Mareth Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Everfrost aka Norway Posts: 380	trixxie wrote: IllusiveThoughts wrote: trixxie wrote: okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps. (alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub) (amends 39% hate transfer to a paly) (harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer) (synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist) extremely helpful, thank you ...you managed to pull aggro with that? Please, do tell! Did you try to start the fight with Fusion, or somehting?

07-28-2006, 11:18 AM	#16
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	LordSarig wrote: trixxie wrote: IllusiveThoughts wrote: trixxie wrote: okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps. (alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub) (amends 39% hate transfer to a paly) (harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer) (synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist) extremely helpful, thank you ...you managed to pull aggro with that? Please, do tell! Did you try to start the fight with Fusion, or somehting? 3 mob fusion crit for 27k main 24k 2nd mob and 20k 3rd mob. after a crit glacial winds, and frigid gift procs going off on all of them, along with the hate from forge of ro. and precision of the meistro was up along with a few dissonant note procs with synergisim procs. i remember seeing char and / or burning affliction go off too. this all happened in about 9 seconds, and i got agro off only one, the sk MT fd me and i ended up staying down for about 20 seconds to ensure i wouldn't get agro when i poped back up, only did 2.2k dps on that one, I wonder what it would of been had i not been fd'd for so long. Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 12:21 AM __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-28-2006, 06:48 PM	#17
merdo General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 83	IllusiveThoughts wrote: LordSarig wrote: trixxie wrote: IllusiveThoughts wrote: trixxie wrote: okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps. (alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub) (amends 39% hate transfer to a paly) (harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer) (synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist) extremely helpful, thank you ...you managed to pull aggro with that? Please, do tell! Did you try to start the fight with Fusion, or somehting? 3 mob fusion crit for 27k main 24k 2nd mob and 20k 3rd mob. after a crit glacial winds, and frigid gift procs going off on all of them, along with the hate from forge of ro. and precision of the meistro was up along with a few dissonant note procs with synergisim procs. i remember seeing char and / or burning affliction go off too. this all happened in about 9 seconds, and i got agro off only one, the sk MT fd me and i ended up staying down for about 20 seconds to ensure i wouldn't get agro when i poped back up, only did 2.2k dps on that one, I wonder what it would of been had i not been fd'd for so long. Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 12:21 AM I dont play a wiz or warlock but to see some of you guys "actually" do dps is nice. I had a similar setup on a raid recently in a t7 raid zone. I was normally able to do 1200ish dps (before i died) but on this raid i was around 1700 most of the night. (i have one post 50 master spell the rest adept 3) The assasin was 1100ish (my guild) the conj was 900ish (he was touting how he had master pets, this conj was from a different guild) The wiz was doing 1200ish but after a few parses with me she logged to her healer.(partly because we needed one more and it was either me or her, we both have high level alt healers, my guild) Most of the night I got tells about how i should be nurfed and how 900dps was great for an conj and my class should not be getting anywhere near that dps. We all had the same agro reduction and the tank never lost agro the whole night. I can imagine if i had broke the 2k dps mark there would have been a huge melt down. I was told they were gonna do an emailing campaign to nurf my class at 1700ish dps. Good job on representing your class, I think most wizzies expect to be top dps with no effort and have convinced some others they are right to think this.

07-28-2006, 08:09 PM	#18
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	merdorf wrote: IllusiveThoughts wrote: LordSarig wrote: trixxie wrote: IllusiveThoughts wrote: trixxie wrote: okay, so if i could make not getting agro the problem, i should just tell them to go nuts? I will try that then I can tell you from experience with the following buffs I have only manged to pull agro once, and this is with me doing 2500+ dps, with the mt clocking in anywhere from 500-700 dps. (alins calming serenade 40% hate reduc from troub) (amends 39% hate transfer to a paly) (harmonious link 23% hate reduction from coercer) (synergisim 500pt dmg proc 700pt deagro from illusionist) extremely helpful, thank you ...you managed to pull aggro with that? Please, do tell! Did you try to start the fight with Fusion, or somehting? 3 mob fusion crit for 27k main 24k 2nd mob and 20k 3rd mob. after a crit glacial winds, and frigid gift procs going off on all of them, along with the hate from forge of ro. and precision of the meistro was up along with a few dissonant note procs with synergisim procs. i remember seeing char and / or burning affliction go off too. this all happened in about 9 seconds, and i got agro off only one, the sk MT fd me and i ended up staying down for about 20 seconds to ensure i wouldn't get agro when i poped back up, only did 2.2k dps on that one, I wonder what it would of been had i not been fd'd for so long. Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 12:21 AM I dont play a wiz or warlock but to see some of you guys "actually" do dps is nice. I had a similar setup on a raid recently in a t7 raid zone. I was normally able to do 1200ish dps (before i died) but on this raid i was around 1700 most of the night. (i have one post 50 master spell the rest adept 3) The assasin was 1100ish (my guild) the conj was 900ish (he was touting how he had master pets, this conj was from a different guild) The wiz was doing 1200ish but after a few parses with me she logged to her healer.(partly because we needed one more and it was either me or her, we both have high level alt healers, my guild) Most of the night I got tells about how i should be nurfed and how 900dps was great for an conj and my class should not be getting anywhere near that dps. We all had the same agro reduction and the tank never lost agro the whole night. I can imagine if i had broke the 2k dps mark there would have been a huge melt down. I was told they were gonna do an emailing campaign to nurf my class at 1700ish dps. Good job on representing your class, I think most wizzies expect to be top dps with no effort and have convinced some others they are right to think this. so what class are you? brigand, swash, bruiser, or zerker? and 900 dps for a m1 pet + conj is pitiful, I've seen the pets do 600 dps on their own, and the conj break 800 when separated on the parse. __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-28-2006, 08:11 PM	#19
HerzenFunia Lord Join Date: May 2006 Location: Russia Posts: 218	Illu you're lucky if you're always raiding with those buffs :smileyhappy:

07-28-2006, 08:41 PM	#20
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	HerzenFunia wrote: Illu you're lucky if you're always raiding with those buffs :smileyhappy: its pretty rare when I have all of them (only happened 3x so far) On our last Labs raid I only had Harmonious link (23%) from the coercer for de-agro, had to use conccusive, ceace, skywatchers, and garg pet, to try to keep from dying. I ended up making it to vyemm with about 5 deaths(mostly from MT saving my butt with FD and rescue). MT was holding agro at 1500 or so dps untill we got to the mobs just before the corsolander, and taunts were getting resisted, then it was all guess work (and deathage) one fight I pulled agro at 800, another 1300, /shrug. no troub and no illusionist on that one either. In lyceum last night for the most part I just had amends, the coercer was charming mobs on the charmable encounters so I lost harmonious link. Still hit a couple 2K fights with only amends. No troub and no illusionist for that raid. Me and the conj were really working hard to beat each other on this raid. He got top parse a few times too. Ended up with the zone wide parse at 1150 for the night. My dps started to drop after we killed essence of fear because the raid started to dwindle down to 3 groups and the mobs there have 1-1.8mil hp so they were lasting 3-5 minutes, and I had to start using heart/shard/vital conversion, and even cardinal intro on myself to keep up my power. I have found that on reall really long fights you can sustain close to 800 dps if you use manastone, vital conversion, cardinal intro, and shard when ever they refresh, and only cast protoferno, forge of ro, surging tempest, rending icicles and ice nova/fusion when they refresh. Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 09:41 AM Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 09:48 AM __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-28-2006, 08:55 PM	#21
HerzenFunia Lord Join Date: May 2006 Location: Russia Posts: 218	heh we dont have sk/paladin in guild, so no amends at 100% of raids. also corcer always using all his dps buff's for melee classes. same situation with illusionist (but sometimes i have synergizm :smileyhappy: ). but i still have a troub ing grp in 90% of raids so the situation is not so bad PS Do you remember your fight times on mobs in lyce? for example on 2 and 3 droag encounters and on single. Message Edited by HerzenFunia on 07-28-2006 08:56 PM

07-28-2006, 10:24 PM	#22
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	HerzenFunia wrote: heh we dont have sk/paladin in guild, so no amends at 100% of raids. also corcer always using all his dps buff's for melee classes. same situation with illusionist (but sometimes i have synergizm :smileyhappy: ). but i still have a troub ing grp in 90% of raids so the situation is not so bad PS Do you remember your fight times on mobs in lyce? for example on 2 and 3 droag encounters and on single. Message Edited by HerzenFunia on 07-28-2006 08:56 PM you may want to try and convince the coercer/illusionist/raid leader that a mele haste buff and dps buff will pale to the extra dps 23% less hate will give to the wizard. look at it this way, on the top end of the scale auto attack will generally hit for 300-400 dps(when parsed over a long sample period like a zone wide parse) with haste/dps buffs which is about 100-150 more dps from auto attack If the wizard is doing 1000 dps and pulling agro, giving him 23% hate reduction would allow him to do 1230 dps. if the wizard is doing 1500 dps it jumps to 1845 dps, and so on and so forth. Hate reduction for a wizard directly correlates to a straight dps increase. As for synergysim at m1 it can account for 7-8% of my dps on a single parse, and zonewide it can account for 3-4% of my zone dps, considering i can do 1400+ dps for a zone parse that makes synergisim give me roughly 55 dps increase on the zone parse and single parses it can inflate it by as much as 200 dps. I have the parse info at home and I'll check it later today and post the parses your looking for. Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 11:28 AM Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 11:29 AM Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 11:32 AM __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-29-2006, 03:05 AM	#23
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	Here's some of the lyceum parses you requested funia, 2 mob group minion and trainer, Allies: (02:37) 1328162 \| 8459.63 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-14447] Illu 15 \| 204109 \| 1427.34 me obviously Alle 14 \| 154655 \| 1104.68 conj1 Oben 45 \| 151788 \| 1068.93 warlock Lima 0 \| 110329 \| 805.32 (forgot) Numb 16 \| 96962 \| 923.45 ranger Band 65 \| 82583 \| 532.79 zerker Kais 22 \| 81820 \| 705.34 bruiser Monc 15 \| 77332 \| 633.87 ranger Vinh 20 \| 57550 \| 509.29 monk Sand 7 \| 57016 \| 543.01 coercer Alla 7 \| 56823 \| 403.00 (forgot) Soul 0 \| 53364 \| 373.17 (forgot) Haka 19 \| 46004 \| 306.69 paly Cudu 0 \| 17004 \| 156.00 lvl 64 dirge Dami 0 \| 15612 \| 127.97 Kiko 8 \| 14603 \| 120.69 Pand 1 \| 14318 \| 94.82 Dani 1 \| 9874 \| 74.80 Come 0 \| 6184 \| 48.69 Kenn 11 \| 5818 \| 38.03 Elva 5 \| 4510 \| 30.68 Mari 9 \| 2738 \| 17.44 Here was one of the 3 mob encounters Allies: (01:51) 1024083 \| 9225.97 [HH Illu-Fusion-16002] Illu 15 \| 147476 \| 1418.04 Alle 12 \| 113203 \| 1204.29 a fe 3 \| 83914 \| 784.24 Vinh 49 \| 78096 \| 796.90 Kais 30 \| 77136 \| 763.72 Numb 11 \| 74876 \| 813.87 Lima 0 \| 68146 \| 724.96 Oben 13 \| 65496 \| 873.28 Monc 13 \| 61471 \| 627.26 Band 27 \| 52596 \| 482.53 Haka 15 \| 42273 \| 444.98 Soul 0 \| 31660 \| 416.58 Alla 13 \| 30928 \| 355.49 Sand 3 \| 25918 \| 341.03 Kiko 5 \| 21557 \| 276.37 Pand 3 \| 12130 \| 125.05 Cudu 0 \| 10202 \| 118.63 Dani 7 \| 8857 \| 89.46 Kenn 6 \| 7420 \| 85.29 Come 1 \| 3434 \| 39.02 Mari 6 \| 2794 \| 28.51 Elva 0 \| 2760 \| 29.68 Glin 0 \| 464 \| 5.59 here was the essence of fear single target named Allies: (03:40) 2007513 \| 9125.06 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-20640] Illu 14 \| 239922 \| 1249.59 Alle 74 \| 193239 \| 1192.83 Come 0 \| 187157 \| 995.52 conj 2 Numb 19 \| 142593 \| 774.96 Vinh 84 \| 140361 \| 797.51 Sand 23 \| 134676 \| 660.18 Kais 21 \| 124483 \| 638.37 Soul 5 \| 115138 \| 581.51 Band 51 \| 113322 \| 527.08 Monc 20 \| 108104 \| 624.88 Oben 26 \| 106333 \| 521.24 Dami 0 \| 77487 \| 377.99 Kiko 30 \| 71938 \| 390.97 Haka 32 \| 61547 \| 286.27 Pand 12 \| 45662 \| 218.48 Kenn 17 \| 39634 \| 191.47 Dani 12 \| 25823 \| 122.38 Mari 0 \| 21497 \| 100.92 Cudu 0 \| 15286 \| 88.87 Come 0 \| 14279 \| 74.37 Elva 10 \| 10325 \| 49.64 Shin 4 \| 8083 \| 71.53 Glin 0 \| 3500 \| 17.50 Alou 0 \| 2285 \| 11.04 Elly 0 \| 1259 \| 5.97 here was the eye of thul's with 1.8 mil hitpoints and less than 3 groups in the raid. (hence the long encounter time) Allies: (05:19) 1904275 \| 5969.51 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-15585] Illu 12 \| 353120 \| 1169.27 Come 10 \| 258895 \| 860.12 Vinh 107 \| 210168 \| 698.23 Monc 39 \| 192586 \| 648.44 Nald 391 \| 180066 \| 569.83 Sand 1 \| 147424 \| 506.61 Lima 57 \| 115458 \| 383.58 Pand 27 \| 88249 \| 280.16 Haka 33 \| 75863 \| 243.93 Dark 0 \| 67907 \| 236.61 Alla 8 \| 67858 \| 229.25 Slam 5 \| 52837 \| 174.38 Mari 0 \| 28946 \| 91.89 Come 2 \| 20014 \| 68.54 Dani 6 \| 18759 \| 60.71 Kenn 5 \| 15813 \| 51.85 Glin 0 \| 5353 \| 18.02 and the other one Allies: (04:23) 1861080 \| 7076.35 [HH Illu-Fusion-15749] Illu 10 \| 271634 \| 1090.90 Come 7 \| 232672 \| 994.32 Numb 25 \| 191031 \| 868.32 Vinh 95 \| 169627 \| 709.74 Kais 51 \| 159480 \| 667.28 Band 52 \| 127612 \| 488.93 Monc 29 \| 110214 \| 559.46 Haka 58 \| 100474 \| 387.93 Sand 9 \| 93099 \| 410.13 Kiko 42 \| 88179 \| 361.39 Soul 0 \| 75795 \| 306.86 Pand 10 \| 70029 \| 296.73 Dark 0 \| 53503 \| 229.63 Kenn 24 \| 39470 \| 153.58 Dani 30 \| 33661 \| 132.52 Mari 9 \| 15065 \| 64.66 Shin 7 \| 13843 \| 55.82 Glin 0 \| 4958 \| 22.43 Come 0 \| 3788 \| 74.27 Elly 0 \| 2003 \| 7.65 Dami 0 \| 1199 \| 6.81 Udag 0 \| 890 \| 3.44 Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 04:06 PM Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-29-2006 12:03 AM __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-29-2006, 04:14 AM	#24
aubreyy Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 120	IllusiveThoughts wrote: Here's some of the lyceum parses you requested funia, 2 mob group minion and trainer, Allies: (02:37) 1328162 \| 8459.63 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-14447] Illu 15 \| 204109 \| 1427.34 Alle 14 \| 154655 \| 1104.68 Oben 45 \| 151788 \| 1068.93 Lima 0 \| 110329 \| 805.32 Numb 16 \| 96962 \| 923.45 Band 65 \| 82583 \| 532.79 Kais 22 \| 81820 \| 705.34 Monc 15 \| 77332 \| 633.87 Vinh 20 \| 57550 \| 509.29 Sand 7 \| 57016 \| 543.01 Alla 7 \| 56823 \| 403.00 Soul 0 \| 53364 \| 373.17 Haka 19 \| 46004 \| 306.69 Cudu 0 \| 17004 \| 156.00 Dami 0 \| 15612 \| 127.97 Kiko 8 \| 14603 \| 120.69 Pand 1 \| 14318 \| 94.82 Dani 1 \| 9874 \| 74.80 Come 0 \| 6184 \| 48.69 Kenn 11 \| 5818 \| 38.03 Elva 5 \| 4510 \| 30.68 Mari 9 \| 2738 \| 17.44 Here was one of the 3 mob encounters Allies: (01:51) 1024083 \| 9225.97 [HH Illu-Fusion-16002] Illu 15 \| 147476 \| 1418.04 Alle 12 \| 113203 \| 1204.29 a fe 3 \| 83914 \| 784.24 Vinh 49 \| 78096 \| 796.90 Kais 30 \| 77136 \| 763.72 Numb 11 \| 74876 \| 813.87 Lima 0 \| 68146 \| 724.96 Oben 13 \| 65496 \| 873.28 Monc 13 \| 61471 \| 627.26 Band 27 \| 52596 \| 482.53 Haka 15 \| 42273 \| 444.98 Soul 0 \| 31660 \| 416.58 Alla 13 \| 30928 \| 355.49 Sand 3 \| 25918 \| 341.03 Kiko 5 \| 21557 \| 276.37 Pand 3 \| 12130 \| 125.05 Cudu 0 \| 10202 \| 118.63 Dani 7 \| 8857 \| 89.46 Kenn 6 \| 7420 \| 85.29 Come 1 \| 3434 \| 39.02 Mari 6 \| 2794 \| 28.51 Elva 0 \| 2760 \| 29.68 Glin 0 \| 464 \| 5.59 here was the essence of fear single target named Allies: (03:40) 2007513 \| 9125.06 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-20640] Illu 14 \| 239922 \| 1249.59 Alle 74 \| 193239 \| 1192.83 Come 0 \| 187157 \| 995.52 Numb 19 \| 142593 \| 774.96 Vinh 84 \| 140361 \| 797.51 Sand 23 \| 134676 \| 660.18 Kais 21 \| 124483 \| 638.37 Soul 5 \| 115138 \| 581.51 Band 51 \| 113322 \| 527.08 Monc 20 \| 108104 \| 624.88 Oben 26 \| 106333 \| 521.24 Dami 0 \| 77487 \| 377.99 Kiko 30 \| 71938 \| 390.97 Haka 32 \| 61547 \| 286.27 Pand 12 \| 45662 \| 218.48 Kenn 17 \| 39634 \| 191.47 Dani 12 \| 25823 \| 122.38 Mari 0 \| 21497 \| 100.92 Cudu 0 \| 15286 \| 88.87 Come 0 \| 14279 \| 74.37 Elva 10 \| 10325 \| 49.64 Shin 4 \| 8083 \| 71.53 Glin 0 \| 3500 \| 17.50 Alou 0 \| 2285 \| 11.04 Elly 0 \| 1259 \| 5.97 here was the eye of thul's with 1.8 mil hitpoints and less than 3 groups in the raid. (hence the long encounter time) Allies: (05:19) 1904275 \| 5969.51 [HH Illu-Ice Nova-15585] Illu 12 \| 353120 \| 1169.27 Come 10 \| 258895 \| 860.12 Vinh 107 \| 210168 \| 698.23 Monc 39 \| 192586 \| 648.44 Nald 391 \| 180066 \| 569.83 Sand 1 \| 147424 \| 506.61 Lima 57 \| 115458 \| 383.58 Pand 27 \| 88249 \| 280.16 Haka 33 \| 75863 \| 243.93 Dark 0 \| 67907 \| 236.61 Alla 8 \| 67858 \| 229.25 Slam 5 \| 52837 \| 174.38 Mari 0 \| 28946 \| 91.89 Come 2 \| 20014 \| 68.54 Dani 6 \| 18759 \| 60.71 Kenn 5 \| 15813 \| 51.85 Glin 0 \| 5353 \| 18.02 and the other one Allies: (04:23) 1861080 \| 7076.35 [HH Illu-Fusion-15749] Illu 10 \| 271634 \| 1090.90 Come 7 \| 232672 \| 994.32 Numb 25 \| 191031 \| 868.32 Vinh 95 \| 169627 \| 709.74 Kais 51 \| 159480 \| 667.28 Band 52 \| 127612 \| 488.93 Monc 29 \| 110214 \| 559.46 Haka 58 \| 100474 \| 387.93 Sand 9 \| 93099 \| 410.13 Kiko 42 \| 88179 \| 361.39 Soul 0 \| 75795 \| 306.86 Pand 10 \| 70029 \| 296.73 Dark 0 \| 53503 \| 229.63 Kenn 24 \| 39470 \| 153.58 Dani 30 \| 33661 \| 132.52 Mari 9 \| 15065 \| 64.66 Shin 7 \| 13843 \| 55.82 Glin 0 \| 4958 \| 22.43 Come 0 \| 3788 \| 74.27 Elly 0 \| 2003 \| 7.65 Dami 0 \| 1199 \| 6.81 Udag 0 \| 890 \| 3.44 Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-28-2006 04:06 PM Not to put you out, but could you label the classes with the names. at least the DPS. Also, when you parse yourself, do you count the proc damage that you buff other classes with as your own or thiers? __________________ Raizzel Flynn "tearing the sail on my way down" 70 swashbuckler of guk!

07-29-2006, 08:11 AM	#25
MystaSkrat Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 693	2 things. 1) yea, what classes are what bro? Where's the assassins and summoners at on there? and 2) why, is your raid dps <10,000? __________________

07-29-2006, 10:58 AM	#26
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	aubreyy wrote: Not to put you out, but could you label the classes with the names. at least the DPS. Also, when you parse yourself, do you count the proc damage that you buff other classes with as your own or thiers? http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2 parsers do not pick up damage proc buffs put on other classes, the only one it does pick up and give to the wizard is Ice sheild because soe decided to screw wizards over by making them look better on a parse, and removing its function as a hate generation tool with lu24. __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-29-2006, 11:00 AM	#27
IllusiveThoughts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,311	MystaSkratch wrote: 2 things. 1) yea, what classes are what bro? Where's the assassins and summoners at on there? and 2) why, is your raid dps <10,000? the parses were meant for someone else, but i guess i can add some of the classes in and im not going to respond to your 2nd question as it will only cause the demise of this thread. Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-29-2006 12:00 AM __________________ The wizards creed: __________________________________________________ _____________________________________ you will die, you will die often, you will die for no reason, you will die for a reason, you will die because soe wants you to die, did I mention you will die? Start getting used to it.

07-29-2006, 02:18 PM	#28
HerzenFunia Lord Join Date: May 2006 Location: Russia Posts: 218	tnx illu For example in our guild in lyce raid dps is usually between 14-20k, depend's on how much ppl slacking And on single mobs I rly cant do a lot of dps because it's dead after 4-5 of my nukes and on this fights assassins/ranger/swash usually on the top of parser. But on grp encounters the situation is better I'am only fighiting for the top of parser with conjs and berserker (mt), and sometimes bers is on top of parser with dps like1.4-1.7k, but usually it happens when fusion is not up. My dps is rly depend on fight time. On single targets and 50 seconds fight I cant do a lot of dps. If there 2-3 mobs and 1-2 min I have much more chances to be on top of parser. PS My best dps result 2650dps - in lyce on large heroic encounter (which on the way to final named). It was 59 secs fight with 17.5k raid dps.

07-29-2006, 07:24 PM	#29
MystaSkrat Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 693	IllusiveThoughts wrote: MystaSkratch wrote: 2 things. 1) yea, what classes are what bro? Where's the assassins and summoners at on there? and 2) why, is your raid dps <10,000? the parses were meant for someone else, but i guess i can add some of the classes in and im not going to respond to your 2nd question as it will only cause the demise of this thread. Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on 07-29-200612:00 AM My point in the second question is this: if you are personally doing 1000 dps and your whole raid is doing 9000 or less, then something isn't right. Hard to say what it is if you won't even comment on it. If I'm doing 1200+ dps, then my raid is doing 15000 or so, that's all. __________________

07-30-2006, 04:55 AM	#30
merdo General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 83	so what class are you? brigand, swash, bruiser, or zerker? and 900 dps for a m1 pet + conj is pitiful, I've seen the pets do 600 dps on their own, and the conj break 800 when separated on the parse. I play a necromancer /hide last night a wizard was doing on average 400dps in our raid. the assasin couldent break 900 but he was only 67 I was doing 1200ish anymore and i died but i didnt have ammends or anyother hate reduction beyond azure winds. funny part was me #1 and our berserker #2 (no he wasnt tanking).