EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire

 

Go Back   EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire > EverQuest II > Class Discussion > Scout's Den > Ranger
Members List Search Mark Forums Read

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-03-2006, 10:49 PM   #1
Deml

 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 324
Default

Yesterday we all experienced LU19.  There were some very good things put in with this patch that a lot of people were looking forward to.  There were also some things put into the patch that were never mentioned in the notes.  February 2, 2006 was D-day for melee weapons proccing off bows.  It wasn't announced but it went live.  That's fine, I can live with it, adjust and move on.  We knew it was coming, although some of us may not have agreed with it or with the logic behind it, but as a whole the ranger community will accept it and move on I believe.  The reason for this post though is the OTHER proc changes that went live.

As of LU19 the Cryptic Metallic Coat, Uktrl's Round Shield of Striking, Uktrl's Round Shield of Harmony no longer proc off of bows either.  Now, these items are highly sought after by Rangers for their magical procs.  All of them have the magic ability that on a successful attack you have X% chance to trigger their affect and damage your target.  These all go off when you HIT them mob and not when the mob hits you.  My question is this, why do these no longer work from bows?  Are procs only a melee only thing now?  Rangers get their offensive stance and poisons and that is suppose to counter the fact that no gear with procs will function for us?  This is all speculation as to why this change went in.  At the higher levels, especially 50+ and on raids, Rangers 99% of the time do not use melee attacks.  Our skills are all geared for us to do ranged damage and that’s what we do.  I find it hard to believe that the devs want nothing to proc from bows because that eliminates a good bit of gear that is “scout usable” from being something Rangers want.  Can a dev please respond and let us know what is up with procs.  Is all of this gear bugged or has all equipment been flagged to no longer proc from bow attacks?

Thanks

__________________
Deml is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2006, 10:53 PM   #2
4lta

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 17
Default

i jus wanted to say thx soe for makin the last few months or raiding for all my uber gear completly worthless way to nerf a class! and make a fun game
4lta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2006, 11:11 PM   #3
Zork Phobos

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 47
Default

devs: your clear disdain for rangers comes shining through once more.  just play a ranger from 1-60 and then make changes? Cause its blazingly obvious no dev has made any serious attempt to play/understand rangers ever.

you leave us half broken for over a year after release. then finally you fix our arrow costs and make our lives better lvls 50-60, though, not surprisingly, we have little or no time to enjoy this reprieve and you set back to nerfing us again.

procs only work on melee weapons?

Message Edited by Truxker on 02-03-200611:46 AM

Zork Phobos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2006, 11:14 PM   #4
Deml

 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 324
Default

I never wanted this to be an attack/flame the dev's thread.  I hope to get some honest feedback from the dev team on what's going on with procs.  I never expected to stay at the absolute top of the DPS lists like we were, but I'm a bit confused on all the proc changes and things that happened yesterday.  Please don't flame the dev's in this thread.  Keep it clean and constructive so they will hopefully respond and give us some insight on what's going on.
__________________
Deml is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2006, 11:17 PM   #5
Fennir

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 760
Default

Yeah, I would just like to know the rules.  It would help me decide whether to keep farming MotM for a robe/bp.
__________________
" I constanly read these forums and seeing your stupid sig starting too get to me" - finedork
Fennir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2006, 11:18 PM   #6
Zork Phobos

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 47
Default

Why shouldnt we be at the top of the dps list? As I recall, thats exactly where the devs said we should be.
 
But moreso, this calls to question their absolute disregard for all the efforts of rangers accross all servers to play a class they love, even though they started broken. They create a game WITH NO FABLED BOWS WORTH [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]
Zork Phobos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2006, 11:18 PM   #7
Zork Phobos

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 47
Default

Why shouldnt we be at the top of the dps list? As I recall, thats exactly where the devs said we should be.
 
But moreso, this calls to question their absolute disregard for all the efforts of rangers accross all servers to play a class they love, even though they started broken. They create a game WITH NO FABLED BOWS WORTH JACK and then when we figure out how to do good dps (ie, item procs using our bows) they nerf that too. but no, do they nerf it in the beginning? of course not, they nerf it over a year into the game when most rangers have spent their entire careers selecting items that will supplement their bugged dps.
 
How can they justify the Uktrils shield not procing? it has ranged and piercing bonuses, uhh DUHHH is it a shield made for archery or isnt it?
How can they justify the Cryptic bp not procing? A good point is our poison and stances proc, whats the difference with a breastplate.
 
No, the reason im [Removed for Content] is not so much the changes, as all things in eq change. its the complete and utter lack of intution they express when making those changes. Its not that they could care less what the changes will do, its that they dont even know what the changes will do. They are ranger ignorrant and should just leave our class alone if they cant put the time into learning about us.

Message Edited by Zork Phobos on 02-03-200612:24 PM

Zork Phobos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2006, 11:27 PM   #8
EverMan

 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 90
Default

Way to go Zork no dev will touch this thread with a 80 foot pole.
__________________
EverMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2006, 11:51 PM   #9
Deml

 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 324
Default

Ok, to clarify.  What I meant by the top DPS thing was that we all know we were far and away higher dps than other classes, or at least the other t1 dps classes.  Moving us to be more in line with them was coming and if you didn't expect that...i feel sorry for you.
 
Zork, your posts of constantly lashing out at the dev's are what I was hoping to NOT have in this thread.  Post that in another thread please and keep this one free so maybe we can get a response from them.
__________________
Deml is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2006, 11:53 PM   #10
Zork Phobos

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 47
Default

Which further inundates sony with the holier than though mentality that is its real problem. They are so frickin detached from what the reality of their own game is (at least in the case of rangers) that they just make these sweeping arbitrary changes that every ranger on every server knows to be a huge mistake. This isnt a case of staying on top dps, ok i admit our dps was a bit over the top, but to change the fundamental way procs from our weapons and items work with our bows. Well thats just ridiculous. They wont post here? well thats their problem. Im not goign to suck up to them, when they need to be told they cant think straight. Play a ranger from 1 - 60 is all I have to say. Devs dont play rangers, they never have.
Zork Phobos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 12:13 AM   #11
Fennir

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 760
Default

Thanks for ruining the thread, bro.
__________________
" I constanly read these forums and seeing your stupid sig starting too get to me" - finedork
Fennir is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 12:23 AM   #12
merula

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 26
Default

Rangers are far and way the best dps class. Even with the weapon procs going away(notice I didn't say nerf) rangers will still be above the other t1 dps classes. As for the weapon/shield procs not working on ranged attacks anymore, that is just perception. It is my opinion that armor/shield/melee weapon procs should not proc with a ranged attack. Like someone stated in another thread, are you shooting your melee weapon/armor/shield like an arrow? If so that would suck to waste t6 fabled gear in one shot... But you are not so it shouldn't use that proc on ranged attacks.. Armor/shield procs should go off when you get hit. Melee procs should go off when you hit something with that weapon. Bow procs should go off when you use a ranged attack. I think poison procs should be able to go off for any of the previous three actions. But that is how I perceive it to be and evidently the devs as well. It just makes sense if you think about it. Someone else said in another thread that all procs no matter where they come from are 'part of my characters magic' (or something to that effect) and should be able to proc for anything. I disagree and the devs as well but again that is just opinion. There is no right answer. Be happy that you are the top dps class.
 
Whoever said that rangers have been broken for months is right. You are way to overpowered compared to your sister class (Assassin). They are supposed to be doing the same dps but rangers outdo assassin's by 100-200 consistently. So you could say that rangers are broken or assassins are broken. Who knows. Just be happy that you can do mad dps away from those nasty AoE's. SMILEY
merula is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 12:24 AM   #13
Sulas

Loremaster
Sulas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 259
Default

Maybe Zork will do the honorable thing and delete his posts so the OP's point can be discussed.That or maybe Demlar will repost his point and this thread will just die.
__________________
Sulas Wolfdawn
Guk, Children of Loki
Ranger (58) / Woodworker(68)
Tiger pet + snowballs = happy ranger
Sulas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 12:30 AM   #14
dubbs

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 160
Default


merula wrote:
Rangers are far and way the best dps class. Even with the weapon procs going away(notice I didn't say nerf) rangers will still be above the other t1 dps classes. As for the weapon/shield procs not working on ranged attacks anymore, that is just perception. It is my opinion that armor/shield/melee weapon procs should not proc with a ranged attack. Like someone stated in another thread, are you shooting your melee weapon/armor/shield like an arrow? If so that would suck to waste t6 fabled gear in one shot... But you are not so it shouldn't use that proc on ranged attacks.. Armor/shield procs should go off when you get hit. Melee procs should go off when you hit something with that weapon. Bow procs should go off when you use a ranged attack. I think poison procs should be able to go off for any of the previous three actions. But that is how I perceive it to be and evidently the devs as well. It just makes sense if you think about it. Someone else said in another thread that all procs no matter where they come from are 'part of my characters magic' (or something to that effect) and should be able to proc for anything. I disagree and the devs as well but again that is just opinion. There is no right answer. Be happy that you are the top dps class.
 
Whoever said that rangers have been broken for months is right. You are way to overpowered compared to your sister class (Assassin). They are supposed to be doing the same dps but rangers outdo assassin's by 100-200 consistently. So you could say that rangers are broken or assassins are broken. Who knows. Just be happy that you can do mad dps away from those nasty AoE's. SMILEY

Go away until you learn what we are talking about, you are in over your head.
__________________
dubbs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 12:48 AM   #15
merula

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 26
Default


dubbs wrote:
Go away until you learn what we are talking about, you are in over your head.
Easy there killer. I wasn't flaming or being rude. I was merely stating my opinion on the 'nerfs' and how I think they are good changes that will balance out rangers/assassins a bit better. If you don't like my opinions or what I have to say, then ignore me and don't reply. After all it is possible to listen to someone's opinion, disagree with it and still be civil.
merula is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 01:44 AM   #16
GrayStorm

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 155
Default


merula wrote:

dubbs wrote:
Go away until you learn what we are talking about, you are in over your head.
Easy there killer. I wasn't flaming or being rude. I was merely stating my opinion on the 'nerfs' and how I think they are good changes that will balance out rangers/assassins a bit better. If you don't like my opinions or what I have to say, then ignore me and don't reply. After all it is possible to listen to someone's opinion, disagree with it and still be civil.
if you think the best way to fix assassins is to nerf other classes, then just get the h3ll out of the ranger forums... no one wants to hear that crap here.
__________________
Kyudoka
Red Rum


Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats. -- HL Mencken.
GrayStorm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 02:08 AM   #17
Blackin_DeMast

 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 114
Default

Don't feed the Troll....
__________________
Blackin_DeMast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 02:16 AM   #18
GrayStorm

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 155
Default


Blackin_DeMaster wrote:
Don't feed the Troll....
Am I the troll? 
__________________
Kyudoka
Red Rum


Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats. -- HL Mencken.
GrayStorm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 02:29 AM   #19
Blackin_DeMast

 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 114
Default

No, but Merula is.  He is just trying to anger the ranger community.  Posting negative remarks in a forum of a class you don't play is by definition trolling.  As much as I hate we don't need to even acknolidge his comments because he obviously has no clue about rangers.
__________________
Blackin_DeMast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 02:36 AM   #20
GrayStorm

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 155
Default


Blackin_DeMaster wrote:
No, but Merula is.  He is just trying to anger the ranger community.  Posting negative remarks in a forum of a class you don't play is by definition trolling.  As much as I hate we don't need to even acknolidge his comments because he obviously has no clue about rangers.
exactly
__________________
Kyudoka
Red Rum


Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats. -- HL Mencken.
GrayStorm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 02:45 AM   #21
Giallolas

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 164
Default

Wow, this is starting to looking like the Templar Forums that we affectionately call the "Viper's Nest".  Hi guys, although you will see that my main is a Templar, we have more Rangers in our guild than any other dps class and my RL bro plays one too.  We've talked at length about Ranger dps and how good it really was.  I wanted to post my thoughts on this for what it's worth.
 
I will miss the extra dps as our guild relies heavily upon Rangers to take down our raid mobs quickly.  Being a Templar, I know the stunning disappointment that occurs when you're regularly nerfed or ignored by the Dev team.  I'm sorry for your loss.
 
However, the Rangers I've been close to and myself also could see something coming down.  SOE is very focused on trying to make each class equal in one fashion or another.  They did this to the priest classes.  They did this to the heavy armor tank classes.  They've done this to the various casters.  Now they've come around to the Rangers again and tagged you guys.  The nerf is not welcome but still expected.  In my recent conversations with these Rangers they reluctantly have admitted that procs only make up a portion of their dps.  The majority comes from their combat arts.  This loss of extra procs hurts, but thankfully doesn't appear to destroy the class.  It appears you guys will still be the number one dps class out there, and can do so out of that aweful raid AoE.
 
As my RL bro told me just today, even with this nerf his class is so much fun to play that this is a minor inconvenience at best.  I look forward to seeing you guys out there and really am sorry that this unexpected nerf got you guys this time.
 
Sorry,
 

Message Edited by Giallolas on 02-03-200601:46 PM

__________________
Brian Ledgers, 92 Inquisitor (formerly Templar, betrayed by the god SOE)

"It was more power efficient for me to rez you than to heal you"
Giallolas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 02:54 AM   #22
Hyyd

 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 16
Default


Giallolas wrote:
 
 It appears you guys will still be the number one dps class out there, .
 
 

/nods

i was in GoAA and DMP last night as was doing over 1k dps with not great loot(no valian) and the othre guild ranger was doing over 1k and more then me with his valian and great gear

Message Edited by Hyydra on 02-03-200601:55 PM

Hyyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 03:47 AM   #23
Smi

 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 12
Default

This patch has pretty much removed any sense of MMORPG achievement fun factor for me.  I utterly LOVED this game, but now, why should I bother raiding or doing quests?  I never would have finished my prismatic if I was the only class with nothing to gain from it.  Crafter rings blow away all loot rings, armor and weapons are meaningless on my character now....  I already have a valian bow..so basically there is ONE t5/6 item now worth bothering raiding for.  Once you have it, you're done.   Customizing procs and equipment is pretty much the end-game for every PvE MMORPG out there.  They have just removed that end-game for us.
Smi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 06:21 AM   #24
Sirlutt

Loremaster
Sirlutt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,149
Default


Smirk wrote:This patch has pretty much removed any sense of MMORPG achievement fun factor for me.  I utterly LOVED this game, but now, why should I bother raiding or doing quests?  I never would have finished my prismatic if I was the only class with nothing to gain from it.  Crafter rings blow away all loot rings, armor and weapons are meaningless on my character now....  I already have a valian bow..so basically there is ONE t5/6 item now worth bothering raiding for.  Once you have it, you're done.   Customizing procs and equipment is pretty much the end-game for every PvE MMORPG out there.  They have just removed that end-game for us.

very valid points.. i have stopped playing/raiding my Ranger.. and i dont even have any of the end game loot.. but there is very little for scouts..its all for tanks or healers.. so thats what I rerolled... a tank
__________________

I heart DE Broads
Sirlutt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 06:24 AM   #25
Carna

 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 515
Default

While I understand the frustration, there must be some of you here that understand the puzzlement of other classes when Rangers are still very clearly the #1 dps class in the game and are screaming that the sky is falling in.... did nobody suspect an adjustment was comming when Rangers where effectively a Tier unto themselves?... Tier 1 then Tier 0, the Rangers.

It sucks to be nerfed, and you've all every right to be [Removed for Content] off, but show a little perspective. You're ahead of all the other Tier 1 and plain embaress many of the Tier 2.

Carna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 07:37 AM   #26
Crychtonn

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 684
Default

Carnagh no one is complaining about the nerf via loss of weapons proc'ing on bows.  It was clearing stated by the Dev's that this was going to happen.  While it did upset some most of us are fine with it as long as it also made bow proc's not go off on melee attacks.  What this thread is for and why many are upset is the Dev's lied to us about this change effecting non weapons.  We had been told the change would not effect non weapon items like the Cryptic BP, Robe and Shield of Striking.  But when the change went live it DID effect these items and that is what people are upset about.

There is a major bug in the change they put in to remove weapon proc's going off on ranged attacks.  It has effected all armor, shields and jewelry that are suppose to proc on offensive attacks.  This bug is not just limited to Rangers.  It effects anyone that has one of these items and can use ranged attacks.  The bug is also effecting Mage items with offensive proc's.

People need to learn to ignore the troll and flame posts and try to stick to the topic on hand.

 

Dev's please look into this and try and fix it as soon as possible.

 

Crychtonn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 08:41 AM   #27
Carna

 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 515
Default

Gotcha Crychtonn, thanks for the even tempered explaination. Aye, I can understad why that would [Removed for Content] you off. What you outline does sound like a bug.

Might the issue be just how much of Ranger damage is attributed to proccing off bows? It would seem that the devs are trying to level that off somewhat, although the way they've gone about it is a bit raw.

Carna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2006, 10:06 PM   #28
Jay

General
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,137
Default

/applaud

A coherent thread! With minimal flamebait and trolling! Kudos, I won't yell at anyone this time SMILEY

__________________
Jay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2006, 12:42 AM   #29
Zork Phobos

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 47
Default

if the devs would simply ADD MORE BOWS & ARROWS to the game, this change would be reasonable also. I will give credit to sony for giving a good amount of ranged CA's, those are nice. however without a decent variet of bows/arrows they get old quick.

This whole situation wouldnt be nearly as big an issue if devs would put an equal amount of time and effort into fleshing out the game to cater to the ranged style of rangers as much as they do for traditional tank/healer types. when we are broken, it takes them forever to fix us, when we are doing more damage than intended the world must stop in its tracks to correct it. Meanwhile, we have almost no options through new equipment to adjust for any of this.

Message Edited by Zork Phobos on 02-04-200601:44 PM

Zork Phobos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2006, 01:26 AM   #30
Lexan

General
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 170
Default


Carnagh wrote:

While I understand the frustration, there must be some of you here that understand the puzzlement of other classes when Rangers are still very clearly the #1 dps class in the game and are screaming that the sky is falling in.... did nobody suspect an adjustment was comming when Rangers where effectively a Tier unto themselves?... Tier 1 then Tier 0, the Rangers.

It sucks to be nerfed, and you've all every right to be [Removed for Content] off, but show a little perspective. You're ahead of all the other Tier 1 and plain embaress many of the Tier 2.


You obviously havent played with many conjurer's or necros "tier 2" if played well owns all teir 1 atm!

__________________
Kobal...Bezerker of Dissolution
Axkiva Min...Ranger of Dissolution...(retired: class currently crap)
Siegfreid... Monk of Ye Drunken Horde
Kazzi... Defiler of Ye Drunken Horde
Lexan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:03 AM.

vBulletin skin by: CompleteGFX.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
All threads and posts originally from the EQ2 and Station forums operated by Sony Online Entertainment. Their use is by express written permission.