Xelgad spills the beans on upcoming Focus Effect improvements! - Page 3

kalaria · 06-25-2012, 08:45 PM

Still no response on the massive nerf to nearly every class in the game?!

Wow.... just wow.

Hirofortis · 06-25-2012, 09:19 PM

Piestro wrote:

Additionally, almost everyone was choosing the same health and power, attribute, and mitigation traits. These traits were functioning like simple stat bonuses as you leveled, so we decided to consolidate these traits into the bonuses based on class foci.

I hope this points out the fact that mitigation is important. And resists are not where the bulk of the game needs. After 5 pages of peeps saying hey, don't mess up our physical mitigation, I hope that the point is made. I have onlly seen 1 person in the comunity who actually thinks this is a good idea. THat is what we call a statistical outlier and we drop those becasue they don't offer value to the whole. Now this goes live tommorow on test and I am just waiting to see how badly the phisical mitigation NERF hurts. My guard really won't care, but my finger wagglers care a heck of a lot. Of course you could go and up the mitigation on all armor in the game, but that would be a bit silly. The physical mit trait has been around for years and has become as much a stable of Good players as the focus effects, having the correct amount of AA, having the right focus effects, etc. Think though this and please at least post that you hear our concerns.

denmom · 06-25-2012, 10:09 PM

Frankly, it comes across as if we're to take the extra Sta given with the new foci and use that for the physical miti. More stamina equals more hit points equals being able to take hits harder.

I just want physical miti back. I and everyone else, save one, on this thread give good reasons for it. Hopefully we'll be heard.

Neonblue · 06-25-2012, 10:25 PM

I agree , the physical mitigation better not be taken away. If they remove the physical mitigation bonus a lot of people will be dying to traumas that didnt kill them before.

Talathion · 06-26-2012, 01:53 AM

Thats probably for level ones.

Level 92s will probably get 70 Stamina/Main Stat per box.

Yimway · 06-26-2012, 11:40 AM

SoE/ Xelgad,

Shame on you for talking around the physical mitigation nerf in your post without actually giving a reasoning for why you think it should be removed.

Hateeternal · 06-26-2012, 05:03 PM

Sorry, I did not have the time to read through the entire thread, but:

I like the changes, but PLEASE do not forget about physical mitigation.

Everyone (I know) is speccing this, especially for raids...

Thanks.

P.S.: You're already giving us more than enough ele/nox/arcane resists on SS items, so don't worry about that. SMILEY

Serik · 06-26-2012, 05:22 PM

Pheep@Unrest wrote:

Frankly, it comes across as if we're to take the extra Sta given with the new foci and use that for the physical miti. More stamina equals more hit points equals being able to take hits harder.
I just want physical miti back. I and everyone else, save one, on this thread give good reasons for it. Hopefully we'll be heard.

The extra STA gained from 10 foci is a paltry 200hp. 200hp is nowhere equal to the 2000+ mitigation I lost on test.

Effectively this change is a gamewide nerf to all character's survivability.

Yimway · 06-26-2012, 05:25 PM

Serik@Butcherblock wrote:

Pheep@Unrest wrote:
Frankly, it comes across as if we're to take the extra Sta given with the new foci and use that for the physical miti. More stamina equals more hit points equals being able to take hits harder.
I just want physical miti back. I and everyone else, save one, on this thread give good reasons for it. Hopefully we'll be heard.
The extra STA gained from 10 foci is a paltry 200hp. 200hp is nowhere equal to the 2000+ mitigation I lost on test.
Effectively this change is a gamewide nerf to all character's survivability.

I agree its a gamewide hit, plate classes don't feel it quite as hard, as we were able to get so far into the curve when raid buffed we just didn't care about mit much anymore.

This adjustment hits non-tank players pretty hard though.

bmg · 06-26-2012, 05:33 PM

Physical mitigation definitely needs to be added to to each focus effect, or a special physical mit focus added. I logged on test copy this morning and my mages really got slammed on physical mit as a result of the current change. Sony, don't go live with GU64 until this is fixed. Most people care about the physical mit we used to get, the resists are worthless.

denmom · 06-27-2012, 02:30 AM

Atan@Unrest wrote:

SoE/ Xelgad,
Shame on you for talking around the physical mitigation nerf in your post without actually giving a reasoning for why you think it should be removed.

In the podcast, Xelgad first says that physical mitigation will be in there but then corrects himself in the same breath that it's not.

They should add it in with the other mitigations. It just makes no sense.

denmom · 06-27-2012, 02:35 AM

Atan@Unrest wrote:

Serik@Butcherblock wrote:
Pheep@Unrest wrote:
Frankly, it comes across as if we're to take the extra Sta given with the new foci and use that for the physical miti. More stamina equals more hit points equals being able to take hits harder.
I just want physical miti back. I and everyone else, save one, on this thread give good reasons for it. Hopefully we'll be heard.
The extra STA gained from 10 foci is a paltry 200hp. 200hp is nowhere equal to the 2000+ mitigation I lost on test.
Effectively this change is a gamewide nerf to all character's survivability.
I agree its a gamewide hit, plate classes don't feel it quite as hard, as we were able to get so far into the curve when raid buffed we just didn't care about mit much anymore.
This adjustment hits non-tank players pretty hard though.

Raid mages and healers really depend on this miti. Cloth and leather just don't protect well. The chain and plate healers are a little better off, but not by much, same for chain wearers.

I don't know how many times we all have to say it, explain it, logic it...but it's a truth we're trying to get heard: this mitigation is needed by all classes, especially in raiding. Please bring it back to game. PLEASE.

kalaria · 06-27-2012, 12:44 PM

So is Xelgad even AWARE of this nerf and its down stream consequences?!After all the posts here and in the Test forum... and not even the slightest acknowledgement from any SoE red name, is rather disugsting overall.

Onorem · 06-27-2012, 02:09 PM

Was this something that the community was asking for? I don't doubt a few requests were made, but I can't recall a thread that got much attention on the subject at the moment.

Yimway · 06-27-2012, 02:18 PM

kalaria wrote:

and not even the slightest acknowledgement from any SoE red name, is rather disugsting overall.

More often than not, thats 'par for the course'.

thepriz · 06-27-2012, 04:17 PM

I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together. I would hope that people try the changes out and give specific feedback on how your experience was with the changes. It doens't help the devs by complaining that my numbers have been nerfed, we are not going to be able to tank, dps, servive... This is not useful advice and probably will be ignored by developers, speaking as a software developer myself.

kalaria · 06-27-2012, 04:23 PM

Deran@Everfrost wrote:

I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together.

You obviously have no clue as to what the issue is.

thepriz · 06-27-2012, 04:56 PM

kalaria wrote:

Deran@Everfrost wrote:
I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together.
You obviously have no clue as to what the issue is.

You are correct, but from the feedback the only issue that I see right now is that people are complaining that they are being nerfed and won't be able to do what they were able to do before. Isn't that the truth with any change. If you want things fixed, log into test or test copy and experience the changes. Then give constructive feedback like parse info, couldn't hold agro, couldn't stay alive longer than 1 hit, etc... You don't have to do this, but that is why test is there. I am not saying there is or isn't a problem, just saying that feedback so far is comming off as whining and is not very constructive.

Tylia · 06-27-2012, 05:47 PM

I will be losing 1656 physical mitigation if this is pushed live as it is now. That's a huge chunk to be losing suddenly, all at once. Please, Xelgad, devs, somebody.. don't make me any squishier than I already am! Please put physical mit back in to the character traits, or provide some other way to obtain what you are taking away!

/walking away muttering something about hunting for some fury plate armor...

Lempo · 06-27-2012, 06:11 PM

Deran@Everfrost wrote:

kalaria wrote:
Deran@Everfrost wrote:
I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together.
You obviously have no clue as to what the issue is.
You are correct, but from the feedback the only issue that I see right now is that people are complaining that they are being nerfed and won't be able to do what they were able to do before. Isn't that the truth with any change. If you want things fixed, log into test or test copy and experience the changes. Then give constructive feedback like parse info, couldn't hold agro, couldn't stay alive longer than 1 hit, etc... You don't have to do this, but that is why test is there. I am not saying there is or isn't a problem, just saying that feedback so far is comming off as whining and is not very constructive.

Well at least you admitted you have no clue to the issue, though even if you hadn't led out this post with that the remainder of your post makes it crystal clear.

This is going to have a major impact on raiding and grouping. I see nothing new being gained here, I do see something being taken away, then something that we already have is being moved somewhere else. What is going to replace the focus effects on my gear, nothing was wrong with it where it was, what was wrong was the utter uselessness of it (nothing much changed here) no we are being told that we have a choice.

There is no reason to remove the physical mit, for all we know it was just yet another silly oversight, but we can't seem to catch the attention of anyone that will clear it up. If there is a reason then say it, otherwise don't reach into our bags and pull something out hoping we wont notice.

gourdon · 06-27-2012, 08:01 PM

Deran@Everfrost wrote:

kalaria wrote:
Deran@Everfrost wrote:
I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together.
You obviously have no clue as to what the issue is.
You are correct, but from the feedback the only issue that I see right now is that people are complaining that they are being nerfed and won't be able to do what they were able to do before. Isn't that the truth with any change. If you want things fixed, log into test or test copy and experience the changes. Then give constructive feedback like parse info, couldn't hold agro, couldn't stay alive longer than 1 hit, etc... You don't have to do this, but that is why test is there. I am not saying there is or isn't a problem, just saying that feedback so far is comming off as whining and is not very constructive.

I have an idea to cut people's hands off and re-attach them to improve functionality. I'm sure you'd like to sign up for a study, yes?

Some changes are obviously harmful and don't need to be tested to find out. Further, the test server is non-functional for so many other reasons that this change can't be evaluated there in a timely manner. SOE will only respond to overwhelmingly negative feedback, so we are giving it without doing testing that is unnecessary to begin with.

Chronus1 · 06-28-2012, 03:03 PM

I would trade 4 of my 10 choices on my warlock for 1656 physical mit without even thinking about it and would go to 6 after about 2 seconds, 9 after 5 seconds. It means that much.

DeathMagus · 07-01-2012, 08:16 PM

Sands@Antonia Bayle wrote:

So, what becomes of completing the Fallen Swords signature quest series. The only real perk for doing this quest, through the Kael Drakkel portion, is gaining access to a red adornment merchant in Thurgadin that has shoulder adornments with class foci/stat combinations you can't buy anywhere else... (And frankly all the gear you get from doing the rest of the series is now irrelevant, so the shoulder adornment is the only reason to bother with this quest.)

The healer charm clicky is still useful for some classes.

The fighter and scout charm clickies can still be used pre-pull to give essentially free stats for the first part of an encounter.

The mage charm is kinda crap... but if you really want to have a personal AOE blocker that is going to be up when you want it the item does the trick.

Malchore · 07-05-2012, 02:12 PM

Check out the Test Update Notes for Tuesday, July 3rd 2012. Here is a section from that note:

ABILITIES / ALTERNATE ADVANCEMENT

Magi's Shielding now grants 1035 physical mitigation at level 92.

Armor of Seasons, Armor of Nature, Sacred Armor, Holy Armor, Runic Armor and Shroud of Armor now grant over 50% more mitigation, going from 1079 at Master on the level 84 versions to 1654.

Savage Ruin, Bladeweaver, Villainy and Hunter's Instinct now grant 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master.

Street Smarts grants an additional 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master.

Unflinching Will, Crouching Tiger, Bodyguard, Armored, Knight's Stance and Lucan's Pact all grant 5% physical damage reduction to the caster. This does not scale with ability quality or level.

Daelis' Dance of Blades and Death's Door grant 997 mitigation from the 89 version at Master quality.

The devs have obviously seen this post and attempted to address this. I'm not an expert in this area of mechanics but isn't it true we're still loosing out on physical mitigation?

For example, let's take Armor of Nature. That's a spell that already exists, and it already grants X amount of physical mitigation on top of what we already (currently) have which was 1656 I belive. I'm guessing the way it currently works is to add 1079 (at Master of the level 84 version) to 1656 giving a total of 2735 physical mit. After this change goes live, Armor of Nature will give 1654 physical mit. Where will the rest come from? I must have missed something.

Laenai · 07-05-2012, 02:40 PM

Malchore wrote:

Check out the Test Update Notes for Tuesday, July 3rd 2012. Here is a section from that note:
ABILITIES / ALTERNATE ADVANCEMENT
Magi's Shielding now grants 1035 physical mitigation at level 92.
Armor of Seasons, Armor of Nature, Sacred Armor, Holy Armor, Runic Armor and Shroud of Armor now grant over 50% more mitigation, going from 1079 at Master on the level 84 versions to 1654.
Savage Ruin, Bladeweaver, Villainy and Hunter's Instinct now grant 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master.
Street Smarts grants an additional 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master.
Unflinching Will, Crouching Tiger, Bodyguard, Armored, Knight's Stance and Lucan's Pact all grant 5% physical damage reduction to the caster. This does not scale with ability quality or level.
Daelis' Dance of Blades and Death's Door grant 997 mitigation from the 89 version at Master quality.

The devs have obviously seen this post and attempted to address this. I'm not an expert in this area of mechanics but isn't it true we're still loosing out on physical mitigation?

For example, let's take Armor of Nature. That's a spell that already exists, and it already grants X amount of physical mitigation on top of what we already (currently) have which was 1656 I belive. I'm guessing the way it currently works is to add 1079 (at Master of the level 84 version) to 1656 giving a total of 2735 physical mit. After this change goes live, Armor of Nature will give 1654 physical mit. Where will the rest come from? I must have missed something.

I guess they're trying to form a group in their head and add all the numbers together.

Lame. Tastic.

kalaria · 07-05-2012, 04:04 PM

Malchore wrote:

Check out the Test Update Notes for Tuesday, July 3rd 2012. Here is a section from that note:
ABILITIES / ALTERNATE ADVANCEMENT
Magi's Shielding now grants 1035 physical mitigation at level 92.
Armor of Seasons, Armor of Nature, Sacred Armor, Holy Armor, Runic Armor and Shroud of Armor now grant over 50% more mitigation, going from 1079 at Master on the level 84 versions to 1654.
Savage Ruin, Bladeweaver, Villainy and Hunter's Instinct now grant 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master.
Street Smarts grants an additional 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master.
Unflinching Will, Crouching Tiger, Bodyguard, Armored, Knight's Stance and Lucan's Pact all grant 5% physical damage reduction to the caster. This does not scale with ability quality or level.
Daelis' Dance of Blades and Death's Door grant 997 mitigation from the 89 version at Master quality.

The devs have obviously seen this post and attempted to address this. I'm not an expert in this area of mechanics but isn't it true we're still loosing out on physical mitigation?

For example, let's take Armor of Nature. That's a spell that already exists, and it already grants X amount of physical mitigation on top of what we already (currently) have which was 1656 I belive. I'm guessing the way it currently works is to add 1079 (at Master of the level 84 version) to 1656 giving a total of 2735 physical mit. After this change goes live, Armor of Nature will give 1654 physical mit. Where will the rest come from? I must have missed something.

With those changes on Test, Scouts and Mages will essentially regain all of the physical mit loss from the removal of the character trait when grouped with any priest class.

Priests, on the other hand, are still nerfed by over 1k physical mitigation. The Devs still need to add 1k physical mitigation to ONE of EACH Priest's self buffs. But... they have been stone-wall silent on that problem.

Gealaen_Gaiamancer · 07-06-2012, 09:56 AM

kalaria wrote:

Malchore wrote:
Check out the Test Update Notes for Tuesday, July 3rd 2012. Here is a section from that note:
ABILITIES / ALTERNATE ADVANCEMENT
Magi's Shielding now grants 1035 physical mitigation at level 92.
Armor of Seasons, Armor of Nature, Sacred Armor, Holy Armor, Runic Armor and Shroud of Armor now grant over 50% more mitigation, going from 1079 at Master on the level 84 versions to 1654.
Savage Ruin, Bladeweaver, Villainy and Hunter's Instinct now grant 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master.
Street Smarts grants an additional 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master.
Unflinching Will, Crouching Tiger, Bodyguard, Armored, Knight's Stance and Lucan's Pact all grant 5% physical damage reduction to the caster. This does not scale with ability quality or level.
Daelis' Dance of Blades and Death's Door grant 997 mitigation from the 89 version at Master quality.

The devs have obviously seen this post and attempted to address this. I'm not an expert in this area of mechanics but isn't it true we're still loosing out on physical mitigation?

For example, let's take Armor of Nature. That's a spell that already exists, and it already grants X amount of physical mitigation on top of what we already (currently) have which was 1656 I belive. I'm guessing the way it currently works is to add 1079 (at Master of the level 84 version) to 1656 giving a total of 2735 physical mit. After this change goes live, Armor of Nature will give 1654 physical mit. Where will the rest come from? I must have missed something.
With those changes on Test, Scouts and Mages will essentially regain all of the physical mit loss from the removal of the character trait when grouped with any priest class.
Priests, on the other hand, are still nerfed by over 1k physical mitigation. The Devs still need to add 1k physical mitigation to ONE of EACH Priest's self buffs. But... they have been stone-wall silent on that problem.

I'm very much not looking forward to being 'over 1k physical mit' squishier. Especially for an "in-the-mob's-face" class like Warden. Any word on whether the "update" will stand as-is, or if any tweaks are inc for Priests, please?

Maroger · 07-07-2012, 02:57 PM

Why don't the dev just STOP monkying around with the stat, armor, weapons - everytime they do the player gets royall nerfed is never compensated for the lost time or the lost quality. Remember the adornment change when they removed CM - they refused to reimburse us for the adornment but forced us to ACCEPT THEIR CHANGED - instead of refunding the shards so we could get what we want.

Frankly I think we are treated like DIRT by development with these changed. Find something else to do with your time instead of installing NERFS.

06-25-2012, 09:19 PM	#62
Hirofortis Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 610	Piestro wrote: Additionally, almost everyone was choosing the same health and power, attribute, and mitigation traits. These traits were functioning like simple stat bonuses as you leveled, so we decided to consolidate these traits into the bonuses based on class foci. I hope this points out the fact that mitigation is important. And resists are not where the bulk of the game needs. After 5 pages of peeps saying hey, don't mess up our physical mitigation, I hope that the point is made. I have onlly seen 1 person in the comunity who actually thinks this is a good idea. THat is what we call a statistical outlier and we drop those becasue they don't offer value to the whole. Now this goes live tommorow on test and I am just waiting to see how badly the phisical mitigation NERF hurts. My guard really won't care, but my finger wagglers care a heck of a lot. Of course you could go and up the mitigation on all armor in the game, but that would be a bit silly. The physical mit trait has been around for years and has become as much a stable of Good players as the focus effects, having the correct amount of AA, having the right focus effects, etc. Think though this and please at least post that you hear our concerns.

06-25-2012, 10:09 PM	#63
denmom Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Paradigm Clutch: Never shift reality without one... Posts: 2,490	Frankly, it comes across as if we're to take the extra Sta given with the new foci and use that for the physical miti. More stamina equals more hit points equals being able to take hits harder. I just want physical miti back. I and everyone else, save one, on this thread give good reasons for it. Hopefully we'll be heard. __________________ What I do when not playing EQ2: Paradigm Clutch

06-26-2012, 11:40 AM	#66
Yimway Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 9,707	SoE/ Xelgad, Shame on you for talking around the physical mitigation nerf in your post without actually giving a reasoning for why you think it should be removed. __________________

06-26-2012, 05:03 PM	#67
Hateeternal Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Berlin Posts: 155	Sorry, I did not have the time to read through the entire thread, but: I like the changes, but PLEASE do not forget about physical mitigation. Everyone (I know) is speccing this, especially for raids... Thanks. P.S.: You're already giving us more than enough ele/nox/arcane resists on SS items, so don't worry about that. __________________ Ihr seid lÃ¤stig und habt euch noch nicht entschieden, wen ihr nerven werdet. SOE Schedule: 8:00: see what isn't broken yet and break it 10:00: ban players complaining about it on the board 11:00: implement stuff noone wants, that breaks other stuff -repeat-

06-26-2012, 05:22 PM	#68
Serik Server: Butcherblock Guild: Order of the Outcast Rank: Officer Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 31	Pheep@Unrest wrote: Frankly, it comes across as if we're to take the extra Sta given with the new foci and use that for the physical miti. More stamina equals more hit points equals being able to take hits harder. I just want physical miti back. I and everyone else, save one, on this thread give good reasons for it. Hopefully we'll be heard. The extra STA gained from 10 foci is a paltry 200hp. 200hp is nowhere equal to the 2000+ mitigation I lost on test. Effectively this change is a gamewide nerf to all character's survivability.

06-25-2012, 08:45 PM	#61
kalaria Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 121	Still no response on the massive nerf to nearly every class in the game?! Wow.... just wow.

06-25-2012, 10:25 PM	#64
Neonblue Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 26	I agree , the physical mitigation better not be taken away. If they remove the physical mitigation bonus a lot of people will be dying to traumas that didnt kill them before.

06-26-2012, 01:53 AM	#65
Talathion Server: Antonia Bayle Guild: Cladire Mortii Rank: Initiate/Slave Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 3,780	Thats probably for level ones. Level 92s will probably get 70 Stamina/Main Stat per box.

06-26-2012, 05:25 PM	#69
Yimway Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 9,707	Serik@Butcherblock wrote: Pheep@Unrest wrote: Frankly, it comes across as if we're to take the extra Sta given with the new foci and use that for the physical miti. More stamina equals more hit points equals being able to take hits harder. I just want physical miti back. I and everyone else, save one, on this thread give good reasons for it. Hopefully we'll be heard. The extra STA gained from 10 foci is a paltry 200hp. 200hp is nowhere equal to the 2000+ mitigation I lost on test. Effectively this change is a gamewide nerf to all character's survivability. I agree its a gamewide hit, plate classes don't feel it quite as hard, as we were able to get so far into the curve when raid buffed we just didn't care about mit much anymore. This adjustment hits non-tank players pretty hard though. __________________

06-26-2012, 05:33 PM	#70
bmg Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 74	Physical mitigation definitely needs to be added to to each focus effect, or a special physical mit focus added. I logged on test copy this morning and my mages really got slammed on physical mit as a result of the current change. Sony, don't go live with GU64 until this is fixed. Most people care about the physical mit we used to get, the resists are worthless.

06-27-2012, 02:30 AM	#71
denmom Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Paradigm Clutch: Never shift reality without one... Posts: 2,490	Atan@Unrest wrote: SoE/ Xelgad, Shame on you for talking around the physical mitigation nerf in your post without actually giving a reasoning for why you think it should be removed. In the podcast, Xelgad first says that physical mitigation will be in there but then corrects himself in the same breath that it's not. They should add it in with the other mitigations. It just makes no sense. __________________ What I do when not playing EQ2: Paradigm Clutch

06-27-2012, 02:35 AM	#72
denmom Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Paradigm Clutch: Never shift reality without one... Posts: 2,490	Atan@Unrest wrote: Serik@Butcherblock wrote: Pheep@Unrest wrote: Frankly, it comes across as if we're to take the extra Sta given with the new foci and use that for the physical miti. More stamina equals more hit points equals being able to take hits harder. I just want physical miti back. I and everyone else, save one, on this thread give good reasons for it. Hopefully we'll be heard. The extra STA gained from 10 foci is a paltry 200hp. 200hp is nowhere equal to the 2000+ mitigation I lost on test. Effectively this change is a gamewide nerf to all character's survivability. I agree its a gamewide hit, plate classes don't feel it quite as hard, as we were able to get so far into the curve when raid buffed we just didn't care about mit much anymore. This adjustment hits non-tank players pretty hard though. Raid mages and healers really depend on this miti. Cloth and leather just don't protect well. The chain and plate healers are a little better off, but not by much, same for chain wearers. I don't know how many times we all have to say it, explain it, logic it...but it's a truth we're trying to get heard: this mitigation is needed by all classes, especially in raiding. Please bring it back to game. PLEASE. __________________ What I do when not playing EQ2: Paradigm Clutch

06-27-2012, 12:44 PM	#73
kalaria Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 121	So is Xelgad even AWARE of this nerf and its down stream consequences?!After all the posts here and in the Test forum... and not even the slightest acknowledgement from any SoE red name, is rather disugsting overall.

06-27-2012, 02:09 PM	#74
Onorem Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 1,155	Was this something that the community was asking for? I don't doubt a few requests were made, but I can't recall a thread that got much attention on the subject at the moment. __________________ _________________________________ "EQ2 is not a "free to play" game, so microtransactions are unlikely to ever have the "front seat" role that they have in F2P games" - SmokeJumper - 4/20/2010

06-27-2012, 02:18 PM	#75
Yimway Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 9,707	kalaria wrote: and not even the slightest acknowledgement from any SoE red name, is rather disugsting overall. More often than not, thats 'par for the course'. __________________

06-27-2012, 04:17 PM	#76
thepriz Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 219	I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together. I would hope that people try the changes out and give specific feedback on how your experience was with the changes. It doens't help the devs by complaining that my numbers have been nerfed, we are not going to be able to tank, dps, servive... This is not useful advice and probably will be ignored by developers, speaking as a software developer myself. __________________

06-27-2012, 04:23 PM	#77
kalaria Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 121	Deran@Everfrost wrote: I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together. You obviously have no clue as to what the issue is.

06-27-2012, 04:56 PM	#78
thepriz Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 219	kalaria wrote: Deran@Everfrost wrote: I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together. You obviously have no clue as to what the issue is. You are correct, but from the feedback the only issue that I see right now is that people are complaining that they are being nerfed and won't be able to do what they were able to do before. Isn't that the truth with any change. If you want things fixed, log into test or test copy and experience the changes. Then give constructive feedback like parse info, couldn't hold agro, couldn't stay alive longer than 1 hit, etc... You don't have to do this, but that is why test is there. I am not saying there is or isn't a problem, just saying that feedback so far is comming off as whining and is not very constructive. __________________

06-27-2012, 05:47 PM	#79
Tylia Server: Butcherblock Guild: Test of Time Rank: Member Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 757	I will be losing 1656 physical mitigation if this is pushed live as it is now. That's a huge chunk to be losing suddenly, all at once. Please, Xelgad, devs, somebody.. don't make me any squishier than I already am! Please put physical mit back in to the character traits, or provide some other way to obtain what you are taking away! /walking away muttering something about hunting for some fury plate armor...

06-27-2012, 06:11 PM	#80
Lempo Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,179	Deran@Everfrost wrote: kalaria wrote: Deran@Everfrost wrote: I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together. You obviously have no clue as to what the issue is. You are correct, but from the feedback the only issue that I see right now is that people are complaining that they are being nerfed and won't be able to do what they were able to do before. Isn't that the truth with any change. If you want things fixed, log into test or test copy and experience the changes. Then give constructive feedback like parse info, couldn't hold agro, couldn't stay alive longer than 1 hit, etc... You don't have to do this, but that is why test is there. I am not saying there is or isn't a problem, just saying that feedback so far is comming off as whining and is not very constructive. Well at least you admitted you have no clue to the issue, though even if you hadn't led out this post with that the remainder of your post makes it crystal clear. This is going to have a major impact on raiding and grouping. I see nothing new being gained here, I do see something being taken away, then something that we already have is being moved somewhere else. What is going to replace the focus effects on my gear, nothing was wrong with it where it was, what was wrong was the utter uselessness of it (nothing much changed here) no we are being told that we have a choice. There is no reason to remove the physical mit, for all we know it was just yet another silly oversight, but we can't seem to catch the attention of anyone that will clear it up. If there is a reason then say it, otherwise don't reach into our bags and pull something out hoping we wont notice. __________________ All actions have consequences and repercussions. Somewhere in Norrath a guild is about to dissolve.

06-27-2012, 08:01 PM	#81
gourdon Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 632	Deran@Everfrost wrote: kalaria wrote: Deran@Everfrost wrote: I have not had time to check out the changes yet, but I find it interesting that everyone is complaining about the numbers and not how all the changes work together. You obviously have no clue as to what the issue is. You are correct, but from the feedback the only issue that I see right now is that people are complaining that they are being nerfed and won't be able to do what they were able to do before. Isn't that the truth with any change. If you want things fixed, log into test or test copy and experience the changes. Then give constructive feedback like parse info, couldn't hold agro, couldn't stay alive longer than 1 hit, etc... You don't have to do this, but that is why test is there. I am not saying there is or isn't a problem, just saying that feedback so far is comming off as whining and is not very constructive. I have an idea to cut people's hands off and re-attach them to improve functionality. I'm sure you'd like to sign up for a study, yes? Some changes are obviously harmful and don't need to be tested to find out. Further, the test server is non-functional for so many other reasons that this change can't be evaluated there in a timely manner. SOE will only respond to overwhelmingly negative feedback, so we are giving it without doing testing that is unnecessary to begin with. __________________

06-28-2012, 03:03 PM	#82
Chronus1 Loremaster Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 253	I would trade 4 of my 10 choices on my warlock for 1656 physical mit without even thinking about it and would go to 6 after about 2 seconds, 9 after 5 seconds. It means that much. __________________

07-01-2012, 08:16 PM	#83
DeathMagus Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 32	Sands@Antonia Bayle wrote: So, what becomes of completing the Fallen Swords signature quest series. The only real perk for doing this quest, through the Kael Drakkel portion, is gaining access to a red adornment merchant in Thurgadin that has shoulder adornments with class foci/stat combinations you can't buy anywhere else... (And frankly all the gear you get from doing the rest of the series is now irrelevant, so the shoulder adornment is the only reason to bother with this quest.) The healer charm clicky is still useful for some classes. The fighter and scout charm clickies can still be used pre-pull to give essentially free stats for the first part of an encounter. The mage charm is kinda crap... but if you really want to have a personal AOE blocker that is going to be up when you want it the item does the trick.

07-05-2012, 02:12 PM	#84
Malchore Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 180	Check out the Test Update Notes for Tuesday, July 3rd 2012. Here is a section from that note: ABILITIES / ALTERNATE ADVANCEMENT Magi's Shielding now grants 1035 physical mitigation at level 92. Armor of Seasons, Armor of Nature, Sacred Armor, Holy Armor, Runic Armor and Shroud of Armor now grant over 50% more mitigation, going from 1079 at Master on the level 84 versions to 1654. Savage Ruin, Bladeweaver, Villainy and Hunter's Instinct now grant 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master. Street Smarts grants an additional 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master. Unflinching Will, Crouching Tiger, Bodyguard, Armored, Knight's Stance and Lucan's Pact all grant 5% physical damage reduction to the caster. This does not scale with ability quality or level. Daelis' Dance of Blades and Death's Door grant 997 mitigation from the 89 version at Master quality. The devs have obviously seen this post and attempted to address this. I'm not an expert in this area of mechanics but isn't it true we're still loosing out on physical mitigation? For example, let's take Armor of Nature. That's a spell that already exists, and it already grants X amount of physical mitigation on top of what we already (currently) have which was 1656 I belive. I'm guessing the way it currently works is to add 1079 (at Master of the level 84 version) to 1656 giving a total of 2735 physical mit. After this change goes live, Armor of Nature will give 1654 physical mit. Where will the rest come from? I must have missed something.

07-05-2012, 02:40 PM	#85
Laenai Server: Oasis Guild: Tyranny Rank: Raider Loremaster Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 634	Malchore wrote: Check out the Test Update Notes for Tuesday, July 3rd 2012. Here is a section from that note: ABILITIES / ALTERNATE ADVANCEMENT Magi's Shielding now grants 1035 physical mitigation at level 92. Armor of Seasons, Armor of Nature, Sacred Armor, Holy Armor, Runic Armor and Shroud of Armor now grant over 50% more mitigation, going from 1079 at Master on the level 84 versions to 1654. Savage Ruin, Bladeweaver, Villainy and Hunter's Instinct now grant 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master. Street Smarts grants an additional 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master. Unflinching Will, Crouching Tiger, Bodyguard, Armored, Knight's Stance and Lucan's Pact all grant 5% physical damage reduction to the caster. This does not scale with ability quality or level. Daelis' Dance of Blades and Death's Door grant 997 mitigation from the 89 version at Master quality. The devs have obviously seen this post and attempted to address this. I'm not an expert in this area of mechanics but isn't it true we're still loosing out on physical mitigation? For example, let's take Armor of Nature. That's a spell that already exists, and it already grants X amount of physical mitigation on top of what we already (currently) have which was 1656 I belive. I'm guessing the way it currently works is to add 1079 (at Master of the level 84 version) to 1656 giving a total of 2735 physical mit. After this change goes live, Armor of Nature will give 1654 physical mit. Where will the rest come from? I must have missed something. I guess they're trying to form a group in their head and add all the numbers together. Lame. Tastic. __________________

07-05-2012, 04:04 PM	#86
kalaria Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 121	Malchore wrote: Check out the Test Update Notes for Tuesday, July 3rd 2012. Here is a section from that note: ABILITIES / ALTERNATE ADVANCEMENT Magi's Shielding now grants 1035 physical mitigation at level 92. Armor of Seasons, Armor of Nature, Sacred Armor, Holy Armor, Runic Armor and Shroud of Armor now grant over 50% more mitigation, going from 1079 at Master on the level 84 versions to 1654. Savage Ruin, Bladeweaver, Villainy and Hunter's Instinct now grant 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master. Street Smarts grants an additional 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master. Unflinching Will, Crouching Tiger, Bodyguard, Armored, Knight's Stance and Lucan's Pact all grant 5% physical damage reduction to the caster. This does not scale with ability quality or level. Daelis' Dance of Blades and Death's Door grant 997 mitigation from the 89 version at Master quality. The devs have obviously seen this post and attempted to address this. I'm not an expert in this area of mechanics but isn't it true we're still loosing out on physical mitigation? For example, let's take Armor of Nature. That's a spell that already exists, and it already grants X amount of physical mitigation on top of what we already (currently) have which was 1656 I belive. I'm guessing the way it currently works is to add 1079 (at Master of the level 84 version) to 1656 giving a total of 2735 physical mit. After this change goes live, Armor of Nature will give 1654 physical mit. Where will the rest come from? I must have missed something. With those changes on Test, Scouts and Mages will essentially regain all of the physical mit loss from the removal of the character trait when grouped with any priest class. Priests, on the other hand, are still nerfed by over 1k physical mitigation. The Devs still need to add 1k physical mitigation to ONE of EACH Priest's self buffs. But... they have been stone-wall silent on that problem.

07-06-2012, 09:56 AM	#87
Gealaen_Gaiamancer Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Unrest Posts: 157	kalaria wrote: Malchore wrote: Check out the Test Update Notes for Tuesday, July 3rd 2012. Here is a section from that note: ABILITIES / ALTERNATE ADVANCEMENT Magi's Shielding now grants 1035 physical mitigation at level 92. Armor of Seasons, Armor of Nature, Sacred Armor, Holy Armor, Runic Armor and Shroud of Armor now grant over 50% more mitigation, going from 1079 at Master on the level 84 versions to 1654. Savage Ruin, Bladeweaver, Villainy and Hunter's Instinct now grant 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master. Street Smarts grants an additional 997 physical mitigation on the level 89 version at Master. Unflinching Will, Crouching Tiger, Bodyguard, Armored, Knight's Stance and Lucan's Pact all grant 5% physical damage reduction to the caster. This does not scale with ability quality or level. Daelis' Dance of Blades and Death's Door grant 997 mitigation from the 89 version at Master quality. The devs have obviously seen this post and attempted to address this. I'm not an expert in this area of mechanics but isn't it true we're still loosing out on physical mitigation? For example, let's take Armor of Nature. That's a spell that already exists, and it already grants X amount of physical mitigation on top of what we already (currently) have which was 1656 I belive. I'm guessing the way it currently works is to add 1079 (at Master of the level 84 version) to 1656 giving a total of 2735 physical mit. After this change goes live, Armor of Nature will give 1654 physical mit. Where will the rest come from? I must have missed something. With those changes on Test, Scouts and Mages will essentially regain all of the physical mit loss from the removal of the character trait when grouped with any priest class. Priests, on the other hand, are still nerfed by over 1k physical mitigation. The Devs still need to add 1k physical mitigation to ONE of EACH Priest's self buffs. But... they have been stone-wall silent on that problem. I'm very much not looking forward to being 'over 1k physical mit' squishier. Especially for an "in-the-mob's-face" class like Warden. Any word on whether the "update" will stand as-is, or if any tweaks are inc for Priests, please? __________________ Fight with honor and triumph!

07-07-2012, 02:57 PM	#88
Maroger Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,313	Why don't the dev just STOP monkying around with the stat, armor, weapons - everytime they do the player gets royall nerfed is never compensated for the lost time or the lost quality. Remember the adornment change when they removed CM - they refused to reimburse us for the adornment but forced us to ACCEPT THEIR CHANGED - instead of refunding the shards so we could get what we want. Frankly I think we are treated like DIRT by development with these changed. Find something else to do with your time instead of installing NERFS.