Parsing Heals

[Dragonreal]

You're not the only one with a top raiding guild... I'm in arugably the top raiding guild on my server (or at the absolute very least tied with another guild for top spot) and we raid just fine without a fury ever being mt grp (and this is both the fury's preference and the raid leader's preference), and the fact is that whether you think we bring something useful to mt grp or not, furies are STILL a hundred times more use in one of the dps grps than we will ever be.

 

Also how exactly does a fury save any more power being mt grp than they would out of mt grp..? Especially if you're only sticking them there to do DHs and grp regen...

Message Edited by Dragonrealms on 01-24-200612:37 PM

[Kyralis]

Any warden who thinks their direct heals are "lesser" from the perspective of total healing done needs to actually parse them out sometime- or look at the parses posted above. For mine, at least, less than a third of any parse is Wild Growth, and I'm always the one casting it. There are fights on which, *discounting* Wild Growth, I *still* outheal the other healers. (Yes, I know healers do other things. Yes, I'm aware that on many-mob encounters a reactive will heal far more than we do. It doesn't invalidate the benefits that parses do have- especially for druids, who have no debuffs to speak of and therefore should primarily be healing.)Second, T6 raiding is a game of debuffs. Pull, survive the first 5 seconds while the debuffs land, and /yawn. Porcupine is valueable, even on a fully-fabled tank, for surviving those first 5 seconds when debuffs aren't on yet. On the other hand, Wardens provide exactly two things to an MT group: HG for power regeneration against low-damage power-drain mobs, and extra resists. We have effectively identical group regens to the furies, and as a result, they can do all of the in-group healing we can; the only difference is that they don't get the tree.This is especially true in a well-equipped raid, where a Fury's contribution to a mage group is nil (everyone's already at the int cap) and their contribution to a melee dps group is fae flames on occasion and their single-target buff. Given the incredibly meager damage increase this actually is, relative to the raid, initial extra mitigation during the debuff period is easily worthwhile.

[Sorano]

If you look at most raid mobs and how they are designed you will find that the key to success is not your healers but how much DPS you can output. I know my guild can heal the Black Queen just fine with 6 healers, none of which is a fury and the only time we fail is if we get unlucky and the tank gets teleported. Porcupine IMO is training wheels for tanks when you are just starting out or learning an encounter. Tell them to take them off. You will be surprised on how you do without it.

[Mor]

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Sorano wrote:

If you look at most raid mobs and how they are designed you will find that the key to success is not your healers but how much DPS you can output. I know my guild can heal the Black Queen just fine with 6 healers, none of which is a fury and the only time we fail is if we get unlucky and the tank gets teleported. Porcupine IMO is training wheels for tanks when you are just starting out or learning an encounter. Tell them to take them off. You will be surprised on how you do without it.

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While porcupine isn't a requirement by any means, why on earth would you choose to not use a tool at your disposal?

[Unmask]

In my guild, when the guard is MT he wants a warden and when the pally is MT he wants a fury.  Crusaders have better taunts with INT buffs but our guard is a power [Removed for Content].

 

[Lego]

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Morie wrote:

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Sorano wrote:

If you look at most raid mobs and how they are designed you will find that the key to success is not your healers but how much DPS you can output. I know my guild can heal the Black Queen just fine with 6 healers, none of which is a fury and the only time we fail is if we get unlucky and the tank gets teleported. Porcupine IMO is training wheels for tanks when you are just starting out or learning an encounter. Tell them to take them off. You will be surprised on how you do without it.

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While porcupine isn't a requirement by any means, why on earth would you choose to not use a tool at your disposal?

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It's basically just different tactics for different guilds.  We've not found that porcupine is particularly neccesary for fights, other guilds may vary.  So for us, if the warden is on, he's in the MT group.  Period. 

Fighting about who's more useful is fairly pointless.  But to each their own I suppose.

[quetzaqotl]

Wardens and furies are interchangeable in the mt group mostly our mt group is: guardian+dirge+coercer+mystic+templar+fury of that setup the person who gets switched is me (fury) for a warden or another shaman at times or maybe a sk etc. etc. but yeah the mt group is like i posted most of the times.

Tho my guild has only 1 fury and 1 warden and the warden isnt always on.

[Golembes]

I download ACT and I was suprised at how much I was healing.  Against Guardian Tynnis in the master's prism (I think), I outhealed everyone.  (Only 1 group heal).

We had:

• 2x Warden
• 3x Templar
• Fury
• Defiler (wards don't show, but I'm sure she would have been up there)
• Inquisitor (was dead most of the time though)

I think there is something to be said both about the Warden's abilities as a class and the player as well.  I say this because even though I wasn't the warden using Wild Growth, I still topped the charts.  (I wasn't wasting heals trying to get my stats up in the parser either). 

It seems like it is just as much about knowing when to heal as how much you heal. 

[Mor]

I have it and use regularly in the T7 raid zones.   It is how I came to my conclusion. 

[Dragonreal]

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Morie wrote:

I have it and use regularly in the T7 raid zones.   It is how I came to my conclusion. 

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t7? 0_o

[Kainet]

"I have it and use regularly in the T7 raid zones.   It is how I came to my conclusion. "Oh wow. Teach me oh master!

[Wabit]

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Unmasked wrote:

In my guild, when the guard is MT he wants a warden and when the pally is MT he wants a fury.  Crusaders have better taunts with INT buffs but our guard is a power [Removed for Content].

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pfft i resemble that remark :smileysurprised:

[Mor]

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Morie wrote:

I have it and use regularly in the T7 raid zones.   It is how I came to my conclusion. 

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Sorry, this is obviously a typo. But the conclusion remains the same.

[spudAn]

Sorry to interupt, being only a lowlly level 29 Warden, but what's with the number crunching and all this "my healer class is better than your healer class?".

 

Do we as Wardens have to justify ourselves so much?

 

I personally enjoy the class, I love playing Warden as protector and doesn't matter whether it's Group or Solo. If i can hold my own in a group, fantastic, if not, then I need to learn how to play it better (Plus go and find that mender again!!)

 

Sorry to interrupt, just makes me laugh that we have to post pages of stats to try and "justify" our class.

[Kyralis]

As far as I can tell, no one's justifying anything. At the same time, heal parses can prove amazingly beneficial.For instance, a recent heal parse put me significantly above the other warden in healing, even accounting for the fact that I was the WG caster. Inspection revealed that the issue was that I was more willing to use sylvan streams, where he tried to rely too much on VB. That's the sort of concrete information that can be used to actually improve one's skill.Besides, to many of this the information is simply interesting. If it's not to you, then ignore it- its relevance to a level 29 character is effectively nil. If you ever raid, you'll come to realize how important it can be to do more with less- and how much information like this can help with that.

[spudAn]

Thank you for taking the time to explain.

 

I'd just seen the total figures, not realising that actual spell useage / type can be gauged as well and as such i can totally see the point and relevance.

 

I now consider myself "slapped down" in the nicest and most constructive way i have ever seen.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

humbled and educated

[Spag]

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spudAndy wrote:

 

Do we as Wardens have to justify ourselves so much?

 

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Well now that you mention it, and it really does not happen as much as it used to, but it still happens.  This just happened to me a few weeks ago, I got into a group and we had one spot to fill, and the group leaders said "great, now all we need is a healer".  There are still a number of people out there that either don't know that a Warden is a priest class, or do not know that we can hold our own.  So to answer your question, yes sometimes we really to have to justify ourselves, though this may not be in the context that you were referring.

[mikemcmodmi]

I find that the Warden always outparses any other healer in a raid as well, unless it's a very easy mob like some in courts or gates.  That being said, I still believe wards that aren't parsed are blowing everyone else away.

Think of it this way.  The recast is 6 seconds to heal 1400, plus their super efficient.  If parsed, I'd be willing to bet that whoever's warding is doubling everyone else in healing.

We've also never put a fury in G1 as well.  Our usual mix is Pally, Sk shielder, Temp, Mystic, Conj and Dirge.  I find you don't need a coercer if you put a conj in G1 for amends plus you get the mitigation buff.

[Lopan13]

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Spagma wrote:

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spudAndy wrote:

 

Do we as Wardens have to justify ourselves so much?

 

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Well now that you mention it, and it really does not happen as much as it used to, but it still happens.  This just happened to me a few weeks ago, I got into a group and we had one spot to fill, and the group leaders said "great, now all we need is a healer".  There are still a number of people out there that either don't know that a Warden is a priest class, or do not know that we can hold our own.  So to answer your question, yes sometimes we really to have to justify ourselves, though this may not be in the context that you were referring.

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Yar, dis happen to Ol' Ching in sum gruup... Me'z git in dis gruup, dey invite a fury, n dis smug lil halfbreed say " Oh man, we really need some priest, two druids? gah" Me'z say, luuk here halfbreed, joo dun worry bout a ting, if we'z kin keep joo from doin tings as stupid as joo say, we'z gunna live. Da ogur in da armour laughed and we'z laid waste to many places in da desert... at da end o da night... me'z slap dat halfbreed wit da crow dat heem had ta eat.mo betta den dat...many many many moons ago, me'z grup with dis 'zerker, n  heem say " get behind da critter n do as much damage as possible!"me'z say, okies, n me'z heal n do wut me'z do. After bout n hour... heem say, "these guys arent that hard i havent gotten into the yellow once"me'z say," dat cuz me'z healin joo.""but... you're a warden..."Me'z ate well dat night, me'z normally nar like northman. da meat make joo cold, nar matter how joo cook it. but even fer northman heem too dumb to live, n me'z too hungry to let dat go ta waste.

[GroundZro]

Me'z ate well dat night, me'z normally nar like northman. da meat make joo cold, nar matter how joo cook it. but even fer northman heem too dumb to live, n me'z too hungry to let dat go ta waste.

So northman is generally worse than halfies? (I ghost here a lot, love your posts)

[xenocyst]

<3 Lopan13, that is all.