STR question

Anoixia · 11-25-2005, 11:26 PM

Is there a cap on STR?, because I had my STR almost 600 in a group but it did not seem to be increases my skill damage very much. If there is a cap what is a good point I should stop aiming for STR and work on AGI and other stats. RIght now I self buff to about 300 STR (55 Brigand).

Eesti · 11-26-2005, 04:24 AM

the cap is level x7 +20, so if you're lvl60 the cap would be 60x7+20=440

xarion_silentha · 11-26-2005, 06:37 AM

Yes, the CA damage modifier caps at 7x level. However, your attack will continue to increase indefinitely. I can definitely notice a difference between 450 str and 700 str in terms of total dps (although it isnt nearly the change you would see adding below the cap).

Eesti · 11-26-2005, 07:40 AM

My main char is a Necromancer and i can say that the cap is 440 INT for me, after that my spells doesnt get any better at all and i guess it works the same way for brigands. My own brigand hasnt got good enough equipment to verify this but try to get 440 STR and check one of you CA's and then exceed the 440 STR and im pretty sure that CA still shows the same damage as it did at 440 STR.

Anoixia · 11-26-2005, 06:11 PM

ok then what would be a good point to stop trying to get STR items infavor of AGI so that buffs in groups are not being wasted on me because I passed the cap.

Aral · 11-29-2005, 08:20 PM

Arnou wrote:

ok then what would be a good point to stop trying to get STR items infavor of AGI so that buffs in groups are not being wasted on me because I passed the cap.

Never

Go for Stamina items next, or high straight HP items. In groups or in raid, you'll be using the offensive stance, which means a very small avoidance, and even smaller marginal benefit to avoidance from agi increases. Hit points help even when the mob turns and lands a hit. I try to keep extra items with me with high hit points/stamina on them that I swap out when I'm group buffed past the strength cap. Vanadium jewelry pieces are good in place of higher strength (but lower other stats) items like keeper bracelet, caretaker ring, tactician hoop, etc.

Kegofbud · 11-29-2005, 11:59 PM

Personally, AGi over STA any day. Since we aren't supposed to be getting hit, I like my power bar larger then my HP bar. Amazing Reflexes keeps you from ever taking damage if you watch your agro. I don't get the STA arguement at all.

Goonch · 11-30-2005, 12:19 AM

Stamina? You can't be serious.

STR > AGI > STA = WIS > INT

Never take stamina over agility, ever. AGI feeds your power so you can land more CAs to contribute to your dps.

I don't know what you raid but if you get aggro (and dont wipe the rest of your raid in the process because of it) you are going down regardles of your stamina. That extra 100 hps aren't going to help you against Barakha slashing attack for 7k. Choad is right we have amazing reflexes so we should be taking no damage during raids and if you are then 1) youre not managing your aggro 2) i hope you didnt wipe your raid when the mob turned towards you and AEs 3) your dead regardless of your stamina.

Xri · 11-30-2005, 12:42 AM

^^^^^^ What they said.

STR>AGI>STA>WIS>INT

Zade_ · 11-30-2005, 01:11 AM

Hmm... I was under the impression that STR>AGI>INT>STA>WIS in raid situations. I have spoken with a few scouts that seem to think their proc damage is affected by INT. We shouldn't be getting hit by spells so WIS would be last after STA.

Any parsed information on how INT affects procs, especially proc buffs? I'd be interested to see the numbers since I am a dim but strong troll.

Xri · 11-30-2005, 01:49 AM

If the proc description says "melee damage" then it is affected by STR (our offensive stance proc)

If the proc description says "spell damage" then it is affected by INT (pretty sure poison here)

ag · 11-30-2005, 02:25 AM

I've heard alot of folks saying INT affects proc damage, but never have seen any screenshots or evidence to prove it.My poison and offensive-stance procs are identical with 40 INT or 140 INT./shrug

Gyilok · 11-30-2005, 11:59 AM

hehe the word identical is the key, with 100 more int you get slightly more poison proc damage with 200+ int even more but it is far from being worth hunting int gear for

Dajaan · 11-30-2005, 12:42 PM

for our class the only benefit we get from +int indeed is a larger dd/dot for poisons, and of course procs on imbued weapons.

ag · 11-30-2005, 07:32 PM

Gyilok, Dajaan,I think maybe you misunderstood me.I've never seen any delta increase in damage (not even one point) when raising my INT +100. It's identical.In other words, I think this is another urban legend / myth. I'll continue to think that until someone (anyone!) posts screenshots showing their change in INT reflecting a change in proc damage on the examine window.

DaLurk · 11-30-2005, 09:07 PM

Guys, you should have learn that ... the only way to convince Agra is with numbers, not words :smileywink:

Xri · 11-30-2005, 09:48 PM

Who is trying to convince him? SMILEY

If it doesn't, fine. If it does, it is such a tiny amount, that increasing INT is pointless.

I think the general agreement is to forget that INT exists for Brigands, it is definately not worth increasing over more important stats.

Gyilok · 12-01-2005, 12:17 PM

Xrist wrote:

Who is trying to convince him?

If it doesn't, fine. If it does, it is such a tiny amount, that increasing INT is pointless.

I think the general agreement is to forget that INT exists for Brigands, it is definately not worth increasing over more important stats.

hehe yes better let it settle at that, I got way better things to do then to run around int buffed to provide parses hehe

Fig · 12-13-2005, 04:10 AM

agra wrote:
Gyilok, Dajaan,

I think maybe you misunderstood me.

I've never seen any delta increase in damage (not even one point) when raising my INT +100. It's identical.

In other words, I think this is another urban legend / myth. I'll continue to think that until someone (anyone!) posts screenshots showing their change in INT reflecting a change in proc damage on the examine window.

For now, I apologize, but I'm too lazy to post my screenies, but here's a method to "prove" it to you agra.

The Djinn Music Box has the clickable nuke proc on it.

Test 1 stats with Music Box equipped, using all normal gear, but head slot empty:
str:345
atk:1100
int:36 (shutup, im stupid)
Examine window on box shows 961 dmg

Test 2 stats with Box equipped, wearing Tobrins Mystical Eyepatch on me head:
str:345 (Tobrins adds int without adding str, for fair comparison)
atk:1100
int:47
Examine window on box shows 973 dmg

Test 3 stats with Box equipped, wearing Tobrins on head, and replacing Prismatic (main hand) with Dagger of Dripping Water
str:320
atk:1137 (wtheck? i drop 25str but my atk goes up 37pts? does int=atk? I'm going to have to investigate this more)
int:67
Examine window on Music Box shows 996dmg

I'm glad I did this. Shows me something is going on with ATK value that I wasn't fully aware of.

Is it the difference in the dmg rating of the weapons? Is it the fact one is piercing the other slashing? (both skills maxed of course, Level 60 Brigand).

Hmm.

Anyway, agra, there are my tests and numbers. I've seen that Int does affect at least some magical abilities, not sure how that factors into poison if at all, and I've uncovered a mystery about atk and int/str/dmgRtg/or something.

Ergot of Unrest

Message Edited by Figgs on 12-12-2005 03:11 PM

ag · 12-13-2005, 08:28 PM

Awesome! Finally! SMILEY

Carna · 12-17-2005, 09:44 AM

That attack increase is very interesting indeed.

Aral · 12-19-2005, 12:10 AM

Not sure what the Dagger of Dripping Water is, Ergot, but Tier 6 weapons with lower str give higher attack than T5 prismatic or fabled, possibly due to the higher DR, perhaps something hidden. This lead me to believe that the current ATTK statistic is an amalgam of to-hit and auto-attack damage rating.

11-26-2005, 04:24 AM	#2
Eesti Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 79	the cap is level x7 +20, so if you're lvl60 the cap would be 60x7+20=440 __________________ --- Atziamhe/Queuwki on Splitpaw "My friends! You can take away a man's title and his uniform but you can never take away his integrity or his honour. Plus it was mostly Kif's fault."

11-26-2005, 07:40 AM	#4
Eesti Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 79	My main char is a Necromancer and i can say that the cap is 440 INT for me, after that my spells doesnt get any better at all and i guess it works the same way for brigands. My own brigand hasnt got good enough equipment to verify this but try to get 440 STR and check one of you CA's and then exceed the 440 STR and im pretty sure that CA still shows the same damage as it did at 440 STR. __________________ --- Atziamhe/Queuwki on Splitpaw "My friends! You can take away a man's title and his uniform but you can never take away his integrity or his honour. Plus it was mostly Kif's fault."

11-29-2005, 08:20 PM	#6
Aral General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 381	Arnou wrote: ok then what would be a good point to stop trying to get STR items infavor of AGI so that buffs in groups are not being wasted on me because I passed the cap. Never Go for Stamina items next, or high straight HP items. In groups or in raid, you'll be using the offensive stance, which means a very small avoidance, and even smaller marginal benefit to avoidance from agi increases. Hit points help even when the mob turns and lands a hit. I try to keep extra items with me with high hit points/stamina on them that I swap out when I'm group buffed past the strength cap. Vanadium jewelry pieces are good in place of higher strength (but lower other stats) items like keeper bracelet, caretaker ring, tactician hoop, etc.

11-29-2005, 11:59 PM	#7
Kegofbud Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 925	Personally, AGi over STA any day. Since we aren't supposed to be getting hit, I like my power bar larger then my HP bar. Amazing Reflexes keeps you from ever taking damage if you watch your agro. I don't get the STA arguement at all. __________________ Choatly - 90 Defiler

11-30-2005, 12:19 AM	#8
Goonch Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 367	Stamina? You can't be serious. STR > AGI > STA = WIS > INT Never take stamina over agility, ever. AGI feeds your power so you can land more CAs to contribute to your dps. I don't know what you raid but if you get aggro (and dont wipe the rest of your raid in the process because of it) you are going down regardles of your stamina. That extra 100 hps aren't going to help you against Barakha slashing attack for 7k. Choad is right we have amazing reflexes so we should be taking no damage during raids and if you are then 1) youre not managing your aggro 2) i hope you didnt wipe your raid when the mob turned towards you and AEs 3) your dead regardless of your stamina. __________________

11-25-2005, 11:26 PM	#1
Anoixia Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 103	Is there a cap on STR?, because I had my STR almost 600 in a group but it did not seem to be increases my skill damage very much. If there is a cap what is a good point I should stop aiming for STR and work on AGI and other stats. RIght now I self buff to about 300 STR (55 Brigand).

11-26-2005, 06:37 AM	#3
xarion_silentha Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 41	Yes, the CA damage modifier caps at 7x level. However, your attack will continue to increase indefinitely. I can definitely notice a difference between 450 str and 700 str in terms of total dps (although it isnt nearly the change you would see adding below the cap).

11-26-2005, 06:11 PM	#5
Anoixia Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 103	ok then what would be a good point to stop trying to get STR items infavor of AGI so that buffs in groups are not being wasted on me because I passed the cap.

11-30-2005, 12:42 AM	#9
Xri General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 104	^^^^^^ What they said. STR>AGI>STA>WIS>INT __________________ Xrist, Brigand of the Shard

11-30-2005, 01:11 AM	#10
Zade_ General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 58	Hmm... I was under the impression that STR>AGI>INT>STA>WIS in raid situations. I have spoken with a few scouts that seem to think their proc damage is affected by INT. We shouldn't be getting hit by spells so WIS would be last after STA. Any parsed information on how INT affects procs, especially proc buffs? I'd be interested to see the numbers since I am a dim but strong troll. __________________

11-30-2005, 01:49 AM	#11
Xri General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 104	If the proc description says "melee damage" then it is affected by STR (our offensive stance proc) If the proc description says "spell damage" then it is affected by INT (pretty sure poison here) __________________ Xrist, Brigand of the Shard

11-30-2005, 02:25 AM	#12
ag General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 851	I've heard alot of folks saying INT affects proc damage, but never have seen any screenshots or evidence to prove it.My poison and offensive-stance procs are identical with 40 INT or 140 INT./shrug __________________ 70 Brigand, 70 Coercer, 60 Bruiser, 50 Inquisitor 70 Alchemist, 70 Armorer, 70 Carpenter, 70 Provisioner, 40 Jeweler, 350 Tinkerer

11-30-2005, 11:59 AM	#13
Gyilok Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 696	hehe the word identical is the key, with 100 more int you get slightly more poison proc damage with 200+ int even more but it is far from being worth hunting int gear for __________________ Stizeyo

11-30-2005, 12:42 PM	#14
Dajaan Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Valor Posts: 72	for our class the only benefit we get from +int indeed is a larger dd/dot for poisons, and of course procs on imbued weapons.

11-30-2005, 07:32 PM	#15
ag General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 851	Gyilok, Dajaan,I think maybe you misunderstood me.I've never seen any delta increase in damage (not even one point) when raising my INT +100. It's identical.In other words, I think this is another urban legend / myth. I'll continue to think that until someone (anyone!) posts screenshots showing their change in INT reflecting a change in proc damage on the examine window. __________________ 70 Brigand, 70 Coercer, 60 Bruiser, 50 Inquisitor 70 Alchemist, 70 Armorer, 70 Carpenter, 70 Provisioner, 40 Jeweler, 350 Tinkerer

11-30-2005, 09:07 PM	#16
DaLurk General Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: IYA Posts: 336	Guys, you should have learn that ... the only way to convince Agra is with numbers, not words :smileywink: __________________ -- Leks V`Ghera - Mistmoore

11-30-2005, 09:48 PM	#17
Xri General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 104	Who is trying to convince him? If it doesn't, fine. If it does, it is such a tiny amount, that increasing INT is pointless. I think the general agreement is to forget that INT exists for Brigands, it is definately not worth increasing over more important stats. __________________ Xrist, Brigand of the Shard

12-01-2005, 12:17 PM	#18
Gyilok Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 696	Xrist wrote: Who is trying to convince him? If it doesn't, fine. If it does, it is such a tiny amount, that increasing INT is pointless. I think the general agreement is to forget that INT exists for Brigands, it is definately not worth increasing over more important stats. hehe yes better let it settle at that, I got way better things to do then to run around int buffed to provide parses hehe __________________ Stizeyo

12-13-2005, 04:10 AM	#19
Fig Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 35	agra wrote: Gyilok, Dajaan, I think maybe you misunderstood me. I've never seen any delta increase in damage (not even one point) when raising my INT +100. It's identical. In other words, I think this is another urban legend / myth. I'll continue to think that until someone (anyone!) posts screenshots showing their change in INT reflecting a change in proc damage on the examine window. For now, I apologize, but I'm too lazy to post my screenies, but here's a method to "prove" it to you agra. The Djinn Music Box has the clickable nuke proc on it. Test 1 stats with Music Box equipped, using all normal gear, but head slot empty: str:345 atk:1100 int:36 (shutup, im stupid) Examine window on box shows 961 dmg Test 2 stats with Box equipped, wearing Tobrins Mystical Eyepatch on me head: str:345 (Tobrins adds int without adding str, for fair comparison) atk:1100 int:47 Examine window on box shows 973 dmg Test 3 stats with Box equipped, wearing Tobrins on head, and replacing Prismatic (main hand) with Dagger of Dripping Water str:320 atk:1137 (wtheck? i drop 25str but my atk goes up 37pts? does int=atk? I'm going to have to investigate this more) int:67 Examine window on Music Box shows 996dmg I'm glad I did this. Shows me something is going on with ATK value that I wasn't fully aware of. Is it the difference in the dmg rating of the weapons? Is it the fact one is piercing the other slashing? (both skills maxed of course, Level 60 Brigand). Hmm. Anyway, agra, there are my tests and numbers. I've seen that Int does affect at least some magical abilities, not sure how that factors into poison if at all, and I've uncovered a mystery about atk and int/str/dmgRtg/or something. Ergot of Unrest Message Edited by Figgs on 12-12-2005 03:11 PM

12-13-2005, 08:28 PM	#20
ag General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 851	Awesome! Finally! __________________ 70 Brigand, 70 Coercer, 60 Bruiser, 50 Inquisitor 70 Alchemist, 70 Armorer, 70 Carpenter, 70 Provisioner, 40 Jeweler, 350 Tinkerer

12-17-2005, 09:44 AM	#21
Carna Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 515	That attack increase is very interesting indeed.

12-19-2005, 12:10 AM	#22
Aral General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 381	Not sure what the Dagger of Dripping Water is, Ergot, but Tier 6 weapons with lower str give higher attack than T5 prismatic or fabled, possibly due to the higher DR, perhaps something hidden. This lead me to believe that the current ATTK statistic is an amalgam of to-hit and auto-attack damage rating.