Charm abuse/exploitation.

Varg_MM · 09-21-2006, 10:46 PM

Many coercers have raised issue with the fact that charm can be cured, and that this can occasionally cause uninteded problems, such as with the templar group cure. However, I just had an infuriating experience of my own. About half an hour ago I had my pet repeatedly dispelled by a pair of druids until they finally suceeded in having it kill me.I can think of no other class or class ability that can suffer from involutary griefing by other players on a standard ruleset server. This must be corrected by SOE before the experience I just had becomes widespread.I humbly request that those who might see this as a concern please join me in filling /bug reports on this exploit until it is corrected.Thank you.

Venzule · 09-21-2006, 11:59 PM

Varg_MM wrote:
Many coercers have raised issue with the fact that charm can be cured, and that this can occasionally cause uninteded problems, such as with the templar group cure. However, I just had an infuriating experience of my own. About half an hour ago I had my pet repeatedly dispelled by a pair of druids until they finally suceeded in having it kill me.

I can think of no other class or class ability that can suffer from involutary griefing by other players on a standard ruleset server. This must be corrected by SOE before the experience I just had becomes widespread.

I humbly request that those who might see this as a concern please join me in filling /bug reports on this exploit until it is corrected.

Thank you.

wow.. ive never had that happen and I didnt think it was possible.

Without being in your group??

Oldlore · 09-22-2006, 12:56 AM

Hehe I'll test it myself today by having my warden cure my coercer's charm. I'd suggest appealing those 2 druid as well as that sort of harrassment is probably against the rules on non-PvP servers.

Mordion89 · 09-22-2006, 02:20 AM

soe should fix this problem, if a coercer wanted to cancle the charm, we could do it by ourselves (clicking destroy pet or cancle charm icon on maintained spell), why allow it to be cured by cure arcane, theres no reason to it, other than giving coercers extra problem

JackAll · 09-22-2006, 01:58 PM

The only thing you can do is report them for abuse and spread the word about them on the chat and MB. Dont be afraid to use names either.

Oh and contact the unlucky guild that they are in.

Roriondesexiest · 09-22-2006, 05:25 PM

JackAll wrote:

The only thing you can do is report them for abuse and spread the word about them on the chat and MB. Dont be afraid to use names either.

Oh and contact the unlucky guild that they are in.

Yep, or if you are feeling evil posess a ^^^ mob and run it into them... but Jack's idea is probably better.

Ghu · 09-22-2006, 05:54 PM

Can't you just lock the encounter?

I'm all for getting this fixxed and it sounds like it needs attention but locking the encounter should make it impossible to be griefed until it gets resolved.

Vyndion

Raidi Sovin'faile · 09-22-2006, 09:38 PM

Problem is, locking the encounter makes strange things happen... like your pet not registering at all for the mob so it won't set off your reactives.Kind of caught in a catch 22 here.

Cer · 09-22-2006, 09:44 PM

Raidi Sovin'faile wrote:
Problem is, locking the encounter makes strange things happen... like your pet not registering at all for the mob so it won't set off your reactives.

Kind of caught in a catch 22 here.

Hmm I have never heard of this or had any problem with it. I have had locked encounter since my 20s.

Varg_MM · 09-23-2006, 01:10 AM

Locking your encounters doesn't matter. Once the pet is charmed it's no longer affected by locks. The lock only works for the duration of the mez while you're recasting charm. I suppose you could just sit there remezzing and hope they eventually go away, but I don't feel that's a valid solution.I did report them, and recieved the standard 'I'm not actually going to read your report, but this answer will probably work' boilerplate. Not that I expected anything different, I have incredibly low expectations of SOE's support people. To be honest, I was rather suprised I got the generic cut and paste after only six hours, though I do wish they would use a spellchecker.I'm refraining from draging names and such out publicly, I sent a detailed explanation of events to their guildleader (who ironiclly is a coercer) and am hoping for at least some response on that.In any event, I don't think something like this should be tolerated in the game.

Message Edited by Varg_MM on 09-22-2006 02:11 PM

AdiX__Styxx__ · 09-23-2006, 09:52 AM

actually this gives me an idea for the next DT run! The MT gets charmed a lot by the eyes in that raid wonder if i can target him and cast cure arcane on him ot uncharm him....

If i can then we shouldnt allow soe to change the way it is now cause it seems to be intended then...imagine a group two ++ mobs you charm the warlock and the shaman tries to cure the charm makes sense to get yer ally back doesnt it?

I say try if ya can cure yer MT on a raid if so then leave it as is if not then soe needs to take a looksy!

Raidi Sovin'faile · 09-23-2006, 11:28 AM

I was on a DT raid and the MT was charmed... just for fun a couple of us mages spammed Cure Arcane on him. Nothin'.So yeah.. maybe if the mobs casted cure arcane on the MT, it would have gone away, lol... but it's not allowed as a tactic on our side. Guess that would be too easy.

Magic · 09-27-2006, 01:20 AM

Dang! I hope they fix that soon. Those two druids probably were having quite a laugh from doing that.

On an unrelated subject, I once had a player grief me by killing whatever my pet was killing. It was almost as if I had two charmed pets. This went on for a half hour or so, on and off. I'd go off to sell loot and return, thinking that I was alone again. Minutes later they'd return and repeat it. I grew tired of that and sent my pet to attack a distant mob. Once the griefer joined the attack, I dispelled my charmed pet and watched the griefer get attacked by both my original target and my former pet! I enjoyed that, for some sick reason. This happened a few times with the same person but they eventually got the hint and left me alone.

Roriondesexiest · 09-27-2006, 05:48 PM

Raidi Sovin'faile wrote:
I was on a DT raid and the MT was charmed... just for fun a couple of us mages spammed Cure Arcane on him. Nothin'.

So yeah.. maybe if the mobs casted cure arcane on the MT, it would have gone away, lol... but it's not allowed as a tactic on our side. Guess that would be too easy.

Can you posess him? I have been meaning to try that one of these days in there, would be fun if it worked....

noobslayer · 09-27-2006, 06:06 PM

Possess a mob and plant it next to the person. Besides the aggravation of having to deal with that mob then, often when a recently possessed mob is killed, it will cause a graphic problem that will make everyone near it crash to the desktop.

Aoi · 09-28-2006, 12:17 AM

dalessit wrote:

Raidi Sovin'faile wrote:
I was on a DT raid and the MT was charmed... just for fun a couple of us mages spammed Cure Arcane on him. Nothin'.

So yeah.. maybe if the mobs casted cure arcane on the MT, it would have gone away, lol... but it's not allowed as a tactic on our side. Guess that would be too easy.

Can you posess him? I have been meaning to try that one of these days in there, would be fun if it worked....

[expletive haxx0red by Raijinn], that's a good idea...I usually mes the tank when he gets charm to protect both him and the raid, but posession would be pretty fun!!

Cyene

Raidi Sovin'faile · 09-28-2006, 08:39 AM

Yeah..never thought of that.However, as I recall it can only be cast on something that isn't in combat, correct? That's one of our major beefs with the spell. So unless the tank has stopped fighting, I don't even think it will let you cast it.

Norrsken · 09-28-2006, 05:20 PM

Raidi Sovin'faile wrote:Yeah..never thought of that.However, as I recall it can only be cast on something that isn't in combat, correct? That's one of our major beefs with the spell. So unless the tank has stopped fighting, I don't even think it will let you cast it.

And since charm/possesion are two of the most bug prone skills in the game, I bet the server would disconnect from the internet, run to the nearest gas station, pour gasoline over itself and light a fire. SMILEY

Roriondesexiest · 09-28-2006, 06:18 PM

roxer2b wrote:
Raidi Sovin'faile wrote:Yeah..never thought of that.However, as I recall it can only be cast on something that isn't in combat, correct? That's one of our major beefs with the spell. So unless the tank has stopped fighting, I don't even think it will let you cast it.
And since charm/possesion are two of the most bug prone skills in the game, I bet the server would disconnect from the internet, run to the nearest gas station, pour gasoline over itself and light a fire.

LOL, I actually almost spit my coffee on the monitor when I read that...

silentpsycho · 09-29-2006, 07:31 AM

AdiX__Styxx__ wrote:
actually this gives me an idea for the next DT run! The MT gets charmed a lot by the eyes in that raid wonder if i can target him and cast cure arcane on him ot uncharm him....

If i can then we shouldnt allow soe to change the way it is now cause it seems to be intended then...imagine a group two ++ mobs you charm the warlock and the shaman tries to cure the charm makes sense to get yer ally back doesnt it?

I say try if ya can cure yer MT on a raid if so then leave it as is if not then soe needs to take a looksy!

It still needs to be changed. Your healer should have to cure the MT who is charmed. The way it sounds like it works is that the charmer/coercer (MOB or PC) can be cured of the effect instead - though you probably can't cure MOB's as they are not considered "friend".In case this is too confusing - charm should be able to be dispelled via cure arcane, but the charmed entity should be the target of the cure, not the charmer. If it worked this way, you could still dispell when a MOB charms the MT (by curing the MT), but wouldn't run into scenarios where malicious PC's could run around griefing coercers (because you can't cure a MOB).

Norrsken · 09-29-2006, 03:30 PM

I think you can cure it by targeting the charmed thingy and curing it, or dispelling it. Whatever fits your cup of tea. I know it used to be this way at least.

Korpo · 09-29-2006, 11:51 PM

Raidi Sovin'faile wrote:I was on a DT raid and the MT was charmed... just for fun a couple of us mages spammed Cure Arcane on him. Nothin'.So yeah.. maybe if the mobs casted cure arcane on the MT, it would have gone away, lol... but it's not allowed as a tactic on our side. Guess that would be too easy.

Odd, all our mages try to cast when our tank gets charmed is Fusion.It never seems to cure the charm.

machads · 10-02-2006, 07:33 AM

When our MT gets charmed in DT, cure arcane doesn't work...

It's much more fun to load them up with reactives and watch the explosions :smileyvery-happy:

Outerspace · 10-03-2006, 12:40 AM

When the tank gets charmed in DT, isn't he a locked encounter? I have noticed the small padlock above the tank when it happens and just assumed you could do nothing to him. Although, I haven't raided DT with my coercer so haven't been able to try anything.

09-21-2006, 10:46 PM	#1
Varg_MM Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 52	Many coercers have raised issue with the fact that charm can be cured, and that this can occasionally cause uninteded problems, such as with the templar group cure. However, I just had an infuriating experience of my own. About half an hour ago I had my pet repeatedly dispelled by a pair of druids until they finally suceeded in having it kill me.I can think of no other class or class ability that can suffer from involutary griefing by other players on a standard ruleset server. This must be corrected by SOE before the experience I just had becomes widespread.I humbly request that those who might see this as a concern please join me in filling /bug reports on this exploit until it is corrected.Thank you. __________________

09-21-2006, 11:59 PM	#2
Venzule Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 138	Varg_MM wrote: Many coercers have raised issue with the fact that charm can be cured, and that this can occasionally cause uninteded problems, such as with the templar group cure. However, I just had an infuriating experience of my own. About half an hour ago I had my pet repeatedly dispelled by a pair of druids until they finally suceeded in having it kill me. I can think of no other class or class ability that can suffer from involutary griefing by other players on a standard ruleset server. This must be corrected by SOE before the experience I just had becomes widespread. I humbly request that those who might see this as a concern please join me in filling /bug reports on this exploit until it is corrected. Thank you. wow.. ive never had that happen and I didnt think it was possible. Without being in your group?? __________________ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- It wouldnt be Christmas without a Nerf in our stocking.

09-22-2006, 05:25 PM	#6
Roriondesexiest Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 581	JackAll wrote: The only thing you can do is report them for abuse and spread the word about them on the chat and MB. Dont be afraid to use names either. Oh and contact the unlucky guild that they are in. Yep, or if you are feeling evil posess a ^^^ mob and run it into them... but Jack's idea is probably better. __________________

09-22-2006, 09:44 PM	#9
Cer General Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 94	Raidi Sovin'faile wrote: Problem is, locking the encounter makes strange things happen... like your pet not registering at all for the mob so it won't set off your reactives. Kind of caught in a catch 22 here. Hmm I have never heard of this or had any problem with it. I have had locked encounter since my 20s.

09-23-2006, 01:10 AM	#10
Varg_MM Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 52	Locking your encounters doesn't matter. Once the pet is charmed it's no longer affected by locks. The lock only works for the duration of the mez while you're recasting charm. I suppose you could just sit there remezzing and hope they eventually go away, but I don't feel that's a valid solution.I did report them, and recieved the standard 'I'm not actually going to read your report, but this answer will probably work' boilerplate. Not that I expected anything different, I have incredibly low expectations of SOE's support people. To be honest, I was rather suprised I got the generic cut and paste after only six hours, though I do wish they would use a spellchecker.I'm refraining from draging names and such out publicly, I sent a detailed explanation of events to their guildleader (who ironiclly is a coercer) and am hoping for at least some response on that.In any event, I don't think something like this should be tolerated in the game. Message Edited by Varg_MM on 09-22-2006 02:11 PM __________________

09-22-2006, 12:56 AM	#3
Oldlore Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 237	Hehe I'll test it myself today by having my warden cure my coercer's charm. I'd suggest appealing those 2 druid as well as that sort of harrassment is probably against the rules on non-PvP servers.

09-22-2006, 02:20 AM	#4
Mordion89 Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 104	soe should fix this problem, if a coercer wanted to cancle the charm, we could do it by ourselves (clicking destroy pet or cancle charm icon on maintained spell), why allow it to be cured by cure arcane, theres no reason to it, other than giving coercers extra problem

09-22-2006, 01:58 PM	#5
JackAll Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 282	The only thing you can do is report them for abuse and spread the word about them on the chat and MB. Dont be afraid to use names either. Oh and contact the unlucky guild that they are in.

09-22-2006, 05:54 PM	#7
Ghu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 71	Can't you just lock the encounter? I'm all for getting this fixxed and it sounds like it needs attention but locking the encounter should make it impossible to be griefed until it gets resolved. Vyndion

09-22-2006, 09:38 PM	#8
Raidi Sovin'faile Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,320	Problem is, locking the encounter makes strange things happen... like your pet not registering at all for the mob so it won't set off your reactives.Kind of caught in a catch 22 here.

09-23-2006, 09:52 AM	#11
AdiX__Styxx__ Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 396	actually this gives me an idea for the next DT run! The MT gets charmed a lot by the eyes in that raid wonder if i can target him and cast cure arcane on him ot uncharm him.... If i can then we shouldnt allow soe to change the way it is now cause it seems to be intended then...imagine a group two ++ mobs you charm the warlock and the shaman tries to cure the charm makes sense to get yer ally back doesnt it? I say try if ya can cure yer MT on a raid if so then leave it as is if not then soe needs to take a looksy!

09-23-2006, 11:28 AM	#12
Raidi Sovin'faile Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,320	I was on a DT raid and the MT was charmed... just for fun a couple of us mages spammed Cure Arcane on him. Nothin'.So yeah.. maybe if the mobs casted cure arcane on the MT, it would have gone away, lol... but it's not allowed as a tactic on our side. Guess that would be too easy.

09-27-2006, 01:20 AM	#13
Magic General Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: In front of my computer Posts: 359	Dang! I hope they fix that soon. Those two druids probably were having quite a laugh from doing that. On an unrelated subject, I once had a player grief me by killing whatever my pet was killing. It was almost as if I had two charmed pets. This went on for a half hour or so, on and off. I'd go off to sell loot and return, thinking that I was alone again. Minutes later they'd return and repeat it. I grew tired of that and sent my pet to attack a distant mob. Once the griefer joined the attack, I dispelled my charmed pet and watched the griefer get attacked by both my original target and my former pet! I enjoyed that, for some sick reason. This happened a few times with the same person but they eventually got the hint and left me alone. __________________ Soloist addicted to finding fabled gear.

09-27-2006, 05:48 PM	#14
Roriondesexiest Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 581	Raidi Sovin'faile wrote: I was on a DT raid and the MT was charmed... just for fun a couple of us mages spammed Cure Arcane on him. Nothin'. So yeah.. maybe if the mobs casted cure arcane on the MT, it would have gone away, lol... but it's not allowed as a tactic on our side. Guess that would be too easy. Can you posess him? I have been meaning to try that one of these days in there, would be fun if it worked.... __________________

09-27-2006, 06:06 PM	#15
noobslayer Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 41	Possess a mob and plant it next to the person. Besides the aggravation of having to deal with that mob then, often when a recently possessed mob is killed, it will cause a graphic problem that will make everyone near it crash to the desktop.

09-28-2006, 12:17 AM	#16
Aoi Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 117	dalessit wrote: Raidi Sovin'faile wrote: I was on a DT raid and the MT was charmed... just for fun a couple of us mages spammed Cure Arcane on him. Nothin'. So yeah.. maybe if the mobs casted cure arcane on the MT, it would have gone away, lol... but it's not allowed as a tactic on our side. Guess that would be too easy. Can you posess him? I have been meaning to try that one of these days in there, would be fun if it worked.... [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn], that's a good idea...I usually mes the tank when he gets charm to protect both him and the raid, but posession would be pretty fun!! Cyene

09-28-2006, 08:39 AM	#17
Raidi Sovin'faile Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,320	Yeah..never thought of that.However, as I recall it can only be cast on something that isn't in combat, correct? That's one of our major beefs with the spell. So unless the tank has stopped fighting, I don't even think it will let you cast it.

09-28-2006, 05:20 PM	#18
Norrsken Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 6,450	Raidi Sovin'faile wrote:Yeah..never thought of that.However, as I recall it can only be cast on something that isn't in combat, correct? That's one of our major beefs with the spell. So unless the tank has stopped fighting, I don't even think it will let you cast it. And since charm/possesion are two of the most bug prone skills in the game, I bet the server would disconnect from the internet, run to the nearest gas station, pour gasoline over itself and light a fire. __________________

09-28-2006, 06:18 PM	#19
Roriondesexiest Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 581	roxer2b wrote: Raidi Sovin'faile wrote:Yeah..never thought of that.However, as I recall it can only be cast on something that isn't in combat, correct? That's one of our major beefs with the spell. So unless the tank has stopped fighting, I don't even think it will let you cast it. And since charm/possesion are two of the most bug prone skills in the game, I bet the server would disconnect from the internet, run to the nearest gas station, pour gasoline over itself and light a fire. LOL, I actually almost spit my coffee on the monitor when I read that... __________________

09-29-2006, 07:31 AM	#20
silentpsycho Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 636	AdiX__Styxx__ wrote: actually this gives me an idea for the next DT run! The MT gets charmed a lot by the eyes in that raid wonder if i can target him and cast cure arcane on him ot uncharm him.... If i can then we shouldnt allow soe to change the way it is now cause it seems to be intended then...imagine a group two ++ mobs you charm the warlock and the shaman tries to cure the charm makes sense to get yer ally back doesnt it? I say try if ya can cure yer MT on a raid if so then leave it as is if not then soe needs to take a looksy! It still needs to be changed. Your healer should have to cure the MT who is charmed. The way it sounds like it works is that the charmer/coercer (MOB or PC) can be cured of the effect instead - though you probably can't cure MOB's as they are not considered "friend".In case this is too confusing - charm should be able to be dispelled via cure arcane, but the charmed entity should be the target of the cure, not the charmer. If it worked this way, you could still dispell when a MOB charms the MT (by curing the MT), but wouldn't run into scenarios where malicious PC's could run around griefing coercers (because you can't cure a MOB). __________________ Fyste, 74 Bruiser \| Dyre, 72 Assasin \| Locus 73 Defiler \| Keanu 70 Fury \| etc. {Nagafen} Bruisers... steadily taking up the rear end since LU24 --- say NO to FD NERF 2007

09-29-2006, 03:30 PM	#21
Norrsken Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 6,450	I think you can cure it by targeting the charmed thingy and curing it, or dispelling it. Whatever fits your cup of tea. I know it used to be this way at least. __________________

09-29-2006, 11:51 PM	#22
Korpo Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,141	Raidi Sovin'faile wrote:I was on a DT raid and the MT was charmed... just for fun a couple of us mages spammed Cure Arcane on him. Nothin'.So yeah.. maybe if the mobs casted cure arcane on the MT, it would have gone away, lol... but it's not allowed as a tactic on our side. Guess that would be too easy. Odd, all our mages try to cast when our tank gets charmed is Fusion.It never seems to cure the charm. __________________

10-02-2006, 07:33 AM	#23
machads Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 12	When our MT gets charmed in DT, cure arcane doesn't work... It's much more fun to load them up with reactives and watch the explosions :smileyvery-happy: __________________ Kaipaini 80th Coercer / 80th Sage 140 AA's www.vvvguild.org "leading manufacturer of gnome paste"

10-03-2006, 12:40 AM	#24
Outerspace Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 214	When the tank gets charmed in DT, isn't he a locked encounter? I have noticed the small padlock above the tank when it happens and just assumed you could do nothing to him. Although, I haven't raided DT with my coercer so haven't been able to try anything. __________________ Ingek, Assassin Siris, Coercer Koel, Berserker Splitpaw