Altruism?????

XunSarak · 11-21-2008, 11:30 AM

I am thinking of giving up altruism and respecting. The issue is that I have not seen it work more than one or two times. I have cast it on the tank and only once seen it work (and that was only because the wizzy nuked before tank had agro) on a pull. I have cast it on healers and mages and have yet to see it save a healer or mage from dying. I have also been asked NOT to cast it on the tank, OT or MA.

Is it broke? Is there something else I should be doing?

Dorieon · 11-21-2008, 02:39 PM

If you don't raid I don't think its worth it. But if you do raid it is great for figuring out a zone/mob.

Unless I die before it can go off Altruism always works for me. Lots of lazy tanks don't like it because it fd's them and they have to stand up. What they don't understand is that if it didn't fd them they would be dead instead of standing up fully buffed, with all their established agro and normally fully healed. It took some getting used to for my MT but he loves it now, as do my healers. That said, if your raid doesn't like it I would drop it and get a better dps spec.

Junaru · 11-21-2008, 06:51 PM

There is only two reason why it wouldn't work.

1) You were more then 20 meters away2) You died before they died. If you die the buff gets removed.

I've been specced for it a long time for raids and have seen it save the MT many times now. With TSO though I have since specced out of it. Our healers were getting lazy cause of it being there anyways.

XunSarak · 11-22-2008, 12:48 PM

Most of the time the tank is body pulling so it could be the distance. And I guess that the healers or mages could be generating enough agro to over come the hate boost I get from it.

For three years I belonged to one of the best raiding guilds on Butcherblock and raided four or more nights a week. Due to work overload, I can only play a few hours a week now and most groups/raids are pickup. I am beginning to think that it is more my assumption that at eighty everyone should know their role. Also it is difficult in the short time to determine how best to support a group/raid when the composition is always different, the play styles differ and expectations about my role in the group/raid differs. It would be nice to have one more respec available in the mirror.

Dorieon · 11-22-2008, 04:44 PM

Altruism does not have a distance where it stops working. You have to be within 25m to cast it but after that it is zonewide. I have no idea why its not working for you but its not because of distance.

Junaru · 11-24-2008, 06:23 PM

Dorieon@Unrest wrote:

Altruism does not have a distance where it stops working. You have to be within 25m to cast it but after that it is zonewide. I have no idea why its not working for you but its not because of distance.

While I thought this was true myself I have seen people die with this on them when far away. The icon doesn't say you are too far for the effect but I am 99% sure there is a distance issue.

Dorieon · 11-25-2008, 06:11 AM

Junaru wrote:

Dorieon@Unrest wrote:
Altruism does not have a distance where it stops working. You have to be within 25m to cast it but after that it is zonewide. I have no idea why its not working for you but its not because of distance.
While I thought this was true myself I have seen people die with this on them when far away. The icon doesn't say you are too far for the effect but I am 99% sure there is a distance issue.

If there is, then it is either huge or I have been extremely lucky. I have had it work on Nex when I am up top and the tank is down below and one instance when I was afk at the entrance of Chardok and it went off on a healer at the second post. I've never seen it not work for me. But now you have me second guessing myself and I might have to box my alt and do some testing this week.

It does seem to cancel when I zone sometimes which blows, but I just cast it after zoning now.

NamaeZero · 11-26-2008, 12:52 PM

My problem with Altruism is that it only kicks in if you're being a bad tank, or someone misses a heal, draws WAY too much aggro, or basically someone screws up. Generally speaking, as a Monk and as a Fighter you should be dying before the other non-Fighter members of your party, so Altruism is sort of useless for them. The only real use I can think of is to give it to a main tank so they can keep aggro even through a death, or to escort a low level non-Priest character through a high level zone.

Junaru · 11-26-2008, 06:21 PM

Dorieon@Unrest wrote:

Junaru wrote:
Dorieon@Unrest wrote:
Altruism does not have a distance where it stops working. You have to be within 25m to cast it but after that it is zonewide. I have no idea why its not working for you but its not because of distance.
While I thought this was true myself I have seen people die with this on them when far away. The icon doesn't say you are too far for the effect but I am 99% sure there is a distance issue.
If there is, then it is either huge or I have been extremely lucky. I have had it work on Nex when I am up top and the tank is down below and one instance when I was afk at the entrance of Chardok and it went off on a healer at the second post. I've never seen it not work for me. But now you have me second guessing myself and I might have to box my alt and do some testing this week.
It does seem to cancel when I zone sometimes which blows, but I just cast it after zoning now.

Against Druushk I was a bell ringer and had my Altriusm on the MT, he died without it going off. So whatever the distance is from Druushk room and the back bells is where I noticed it not working. This isn't the only time just the last one I remember.

Gilasil · 11-27-2008, 03:10 AM

My 80 bruiser carried around altruism for months and put it on the main tank whenever possible (unless the MT was a himself or another brawler of course).

It seemed to be less a boon to the raid then I'd have thought. It seemed like most times when it went off the main tank was so confused by it all (even when I'd explained what to expect when I put it on) that any advantage was lost.

I think a lot of the main tanks were in first person mode and when everything greyed out thought they'd been stifled, stunned or killed. Oftentimes somone would have to yell at them to stand up and by then another tank had stepped in and taken agro anyway.

I'm sure if I played in a more hardcore crowd things would be smoother. As-is I'm giving up altruism for other things.

Erieg · 11-29-2008, 05:55 PM

I love Altruism. But then again I am playing a dou with my wife's mystic 99% of the time. It has saved us from some very painfull wipes (as long as my FD does fail on me).

Mat · 11-30-2008, 04:45 AM

Altruism does not have a distance limit. I was also a statue clicker on Druushk and shinies gatherer at back wall on Nexona. It always works.

There was never a case it would not work.There was even once a case when i went afk at the start of VP and it triggered for tank half a zone away from me.

The only reason why u "think" it wasnt working, is that your tank died, altruism triggered, tank got FD'ed, then got instantly killed by aoe.

But yes, its only real use is on raids. Or when you dual box some char of yours and dont want it to die because its doesnt have FD and you run into troubles.

NamaeZero · 12-01-2008, 01:01 PM

Also, I'm noticing that the duration of the FD resulting from Altruism is rather short, and many non-Monks expect FD to wipe aggro which it doesn't really do. Since they probably drew too much aggro in the first place which resulted in their death and now only have 10% HP, a re-death from Altruism is actually pretty likely if you don't have a healer zap them while they're still down.

11-21-2008, 06:51 PM	#3
Junaru Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,471	There is only two reason why it wouldn't work. 1) You were more then 20 meters away2) You died before they died. If you die the buff gets removed. I've been specced for it a long time for raids and have seen it save the MT many times now. With TSO though I have since specced out of it. Our healers were getting lazy cause of it being there anyways. __________________

11-24-2008, 06:23 PM	#6
Junaru Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,471	Dorieon@Unrest wrote: Altruism does not have a distance where it stops working. You have to be within 25m to cast it but after that it is zonewide. I have no idea why its not working for you but its not because of distance. While I thought this was true myself I have seen people die with this on them when far away. The icon doesn't say you are too far for the effect but I am 99% sure there is a distance issue. __________________

11-25-2008, 06:11 AM	#7
Dorieon Server: Guk Guild: Despair Rank: Member Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 171	Junaru wrote: Dorieon@Unrest wrote: Altruism does not have a distance where it stops working. You have to be within 25m to cast it but after that it is zonewide. I have no idea why its not working for you but its not because of distance. While I thought this was true myself I have seen people die with this on them when far away. The icon doesn't say you are too far for the effect but I am 99% sure there is a distance issue. If there is, then it is either huge or I have been extremely lucky. I have had it work on Nex when I am up top and the tank is down below and one instance when I was afk at the entrance of Chardok and it went off on a healer at the second post. I've never seen it not work for me. But now you have me second guessing myself and I might have to box my alt and do some testing this week. It does seem to cancel when I zone sometimes which blows, but I just cast it after zoning now.

11-26-2008, 06:21 PM	#9
Junaru Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,471	Dorieon@Unrest wrote: Junaru wrote: Dorieon@Unrest wrote: Altruism does not have a distance where it stops working. You have to be within 25m to cast it but after that it is zonewide. I have no idea why its not working for you but its not because of distance. While I thought this was true myself I have seen people die with this on them when far away. The icon doesn't say you are too far for the effect but I am 99% sure there is a distance issue. If there is, then it is either huge or I have been extremely lucky. I have had it work on Nex when I am up top and the tank is down below and one instance when I was afk at the entrance of Chardok and it went off on a healer at the second post. I've never seen it not work for me. But now you have me second guessing myself and I might have to box my alt and do some testing this week. It does seem to cancel when I zone sometimes which blows, but I just cast it after zoning now. Against Druushk I was a bell ringer and had my Altriusm on the MT, he died without it going off. So whatever the distance is from Druushk room and the back bells is where I noticed it not working. This isn't the only time just the last one I remember. __________________

11-21-2008, 11:30 AM	#1
XunSarak Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 43	I am thinking of giving up altruism and respecting. The issue is that I have not seen it work more than one or two times. I have cast it on the tank and only once seen it work (and that was only because the wizzy nuked before tank had agro) on a pull. I have cast it on healers and mages and have yet to see it save a healer or mage from dying. I have also been asked NOT to cast it on the tank, OT or MA. Is it broke? Is there something else I should be doing?

11-21-2008, 02:39 PM	#2
Dorieon Server: Guk Guild: Despair Rank: Member Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 171	If you don't raid I don't think its worth it. But if you do raid it is great for figuring out a zone/mob. Unless I die before it can go off Altruism always works for me. Lots of lazy tanks don't like it because it fd's them and they have to stand up. What they don't understand is that if it didn't fd them they would be dead instead of standing up fully buffed, with all their established agro and normally fully healed. It took some getting used to for my MT but he loves it now, as do my healers. That said, if your raid doesn't like it I would drop it and get a better dps spec.

11-22-2008, 12:48 PM	#4
XunSarak Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 43	Most of the time the tank is body pulling so it could be the distance. And I guess that the healers or mages could be generating enough agro to over come the hate boost I get from it. For three years I belonged to one of the best raiding guilds on Butcherblock and raided four or more nights a week. Due to work overload, I can only play a few hours a week now and most groups/raids are pickup. I am beginning to think that it is more my assumption that at eighty everyone should know their role. Also it is difficult in the short time to determine how best to support a group/raid when the composition is always different, the play styles differ and expectations about my role in the group/raid differs. It would be nice to have one more respec available in the mirror.

11-22-2008, 04:44 PM	#5
Dorieon Server: Guk Guild: Despair Rank: Member Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 171	Altruism does not have a distance where it stops working. You have to be within 25m to cast it but after that it is zonewide. I have no idea why its not working for you but its not because of distance.

11-26-2008, 12:52 PM	#8
NamaeZero Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 242	My problem with Altruism is that it only kicks in if you're being a bad tank, or someone misses a heal, draws WAY too much aggro, or basically someone screws up. Generally speaking, as a Monk and as a Fighter you should be dying before the other non-Fighter members of your party, so Altruism is sort of useless for them. The only real use I can think of is to give it to a main tank so they can keep aggro even through a death, or to escort a low level non-Priest character through a high level zone.

11-27-2008, 03:10 AM	#10
Gilasil Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 907	My 80 bruiser carried around altruism for months and put it on the main tank whenever possible (unless the MT was a himself or another brawler of course). It seemed to be less a boon to the raid then I'd have thought. It seemed like most times when it went off the main tank was so confused by it all (even when I'd explained what to expect when I put it on) that any advantage was lost. I think a lot of the main tanks were in first person mode and when everything greyed out thought they'd been stifled, stunned or killed. Oftentimes somone would have to yell at them to stand up and by then another tank had stepped in and taken agro anyway. I'm sure if I played in a more hardcore crowd things would be smoother. As-is I'm giving up altruism for other things.

11-29-2008, 05:55 PM	#11
Erieg Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 32	I love Altruism. But then again I am playing a dou with my wife's mystic 99% of the time. It has saved us from some very painfull wipes (as long as my FD does fail on me).

11-30-2008, 04:45 AM	#12
Mat General Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 2	Altruism does not have a distance limit. I was also a statue clicker on Druushk and shinies gatherer at back wall on Nexona. It always works. There was never a case it would not work.There was even once a case when i went afk at the start of VP and it triggered for tank half a zone away from me. The only reason why u "think" it wasnt working, is that your tank died, altruism triggered, tank got FD'ed, then got instantly killed by aoe. But yes, its only real use is on raids. Or when you dual box some char of yours and dont want it to die because its doesnt have FD and you run into troubles.

12-01-2008, 01:01 PM	#13
NamaeZero Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 242	Also, I'm noticing that the duration of the FD resulting from Altruism is rather short, and many non-Monks expect FD to wipe aggro which it doesn't really do. Since they probably drew too much aggro in the first place which resulted in their death and now only have 10% HP, a re-death from Altruism is actually pretty likely if you don't have a healer zap them while they're still down.