Crowd control AA builds - Help needed

[TwistedFaith]

OK so my little coercer is just about to hit 60 and I think its time for me to concentrate on my AA's and decide what I want to do with her.Primarily this toon will be used to help guildies through some of the tougher instances within the game, Nizara, MM and most probably the soon to be unrest.I'm not interested in a DPS coercer, i'd prefer to have rock solid mezzes/stuns.As for charms, well I dont plan on solo'ing much with this toon so i'm not sure wether that comes under crowd control, well I guess it does really.Raiding wise, grrrr i'm not sure, more than likely if anything this toon will be 2 boxed for dps buffs and wont be a MT group coercer.So that's the plan just I dont know where to go with the AA's.Will the improved casting speed skills of the agility line make me a better crowd control coercer as I can cast faster to help stun/mez things faster? Is the final skill worth it?I know I want to max out the subjication line but beyond that I really cannot decide.With the new tree, I was simply thinking of maxing out the entire 'efficiency' line apart from the final 1 point skill and maybe work then on all the mana regen skills.I need help basically, does anyone know of some good AA builds for what I am after? Thank you.

[mwr]

I both mostly solo and am new, so take my advice with a grain of salt, but...

If you're looking for unbreakable CC (which is pretty much where I'm going with my Coercer), definitely work the WIS line. AGI is good - and, moreover, the stun cast time decreasers in the EOF tree are good - because a lot of the time stuns (and other CC) are the "emergency button", which makes cast times almost as important as chopping out resists. The active abilities of AGI and WIS have a conflicting weapon loadout, unfortunately, but the threat reducer isn't that useful if you can keep a mob stunned and rooted anyhow.

[Kardg]

Focused on Control with group/raid support in mind. I wouldn't considering this the end all be all build. (For reference this isn't my build. I'm DPS, Control).

 

KoS Tree:

Max the Wisdom line and the Stamina line. Get your hate redux for your group members, healings crits for your healers (Crits also apply to your power heals) Sever Empathy & DayDream for those tough close proximity group pulls. As you mentioned you'll also get your 40 into sub.

 

EoF Tree:

I would max out the Mana tree excluding Vicious Torment and Manaward. I find those two abilities rather lack luster and offering in few gains for someone two-boxing. You can maximize your points in other areas for more gains. When your trucking into battle with nearly capped FT for your group it'll be appreciated. Also Channel & Gorging Thought can be dropped off if your trying to squeeze points in for resistances later.

 

Since your personal DPS isn't a big concern you can go two ways from here. You can max the Coersion tree for Coersive Healing, excluding destructive mind.

 

 I choose these two for the duality in their roles. Your maxed mana efficiency will help you return the additional 5% cost from Coersive Healing and then some while the benefit from Coersive healing will give you bigger wards, more reactives and bigger HoT's. In the Coersion tree you'll gain additional hate redux for Harmonious Link  and also gain additional triggers on one additional CC spell your Mindbend.

 

I'd then focus on the remainder of my ponits into Resistance to maximize Enhanced Domination, Dispel Magic, Marred Pysche and Breakdown. If you have enough points remaining invest in Tashiana for the 3500 Mental debuff. All stacked together your a debuff machine when it comes to magic. The Enhanced dispel will also allow you to remove additional beneficial buffs from your target's encounter.

 

In my opinion this is a very aggressive setup for a non-MT raid Coercer. You won't have to manually do much with this character aside from actually tossing a power heal or debuff from time to time when needed. Most of this build allows for less casting which takes some of the pressure off of the person boxing. If this Coercer was going to be alternated to the MT group I would switch the EoF tree's slightly and build into Efficiency for Thought Snap (When its fixed) and cast reduction time on stuns. In my opinion it requires more management to chain stun your target versus just being the debuff/buff or power battery. The Stuns aren't nearly as useful on a raid due to Epic immunities but the precieved value of Thought Snap seems very signifcant to me. MT drops to due an ugly damage spike, he's rezzed, your casting Thought Snap and the raid is back on track. Group perspective is very nice with the quick stun recasts. You can virtually chain stun no with no end Single, Group, PBAE, MindBend (Now with another trigger).

 

Hope this is helpful.

 

[TwistedFaith]

OK few points here, do you think its worth pouring points into the EoF lines to improve the recast times of the stuns?Also I dont understand why put so many points into debuffs. How many classes actually damage mobs with mental/magic damage.Dont most of the high dps classes use other types of dmg, heat/cold for wizzy etc?My main priority is going to be using this class for highend group zones, raids are secondary. On raids I see this toon as more of a dps buffer than anything else.

[Cattastrophy]

If you want to be all mezz / group / raid buffs then do this.KoS Lines1) WIS LINE - 4 / 4 / 8 / 8 / 0 (the last one is a waste of 8 AA, put them into more resists for raids and more Subj)2) STA LINE - 4 / 4 / 8 / 8 / 0 (again the last in the Sta line is a total waste of AA, get more heal crits and more aggro reducs)3) throw your last point into the 4 INT or raise DayDream another level to help with resists on that.EoF Lines1) MANA LINE! - 5 in Mana Flow / 5 in Ease / 5 in GT / 5 in BE / 1 in that ward at the bottem, it's neet, nothing special though.2) RESIST LINE - 5 in Charm / 3 in Dispell (if they ever decide to fix the stupid thing) / 5 in Breakdown / 5 in MP / 1 in Tash (this will not just help you spells land, but will help raid wide with the other resist checks.)3) COERSION LINE: 5 in HLink - The rest are your's to play with really. You won't have enough for the healer buff at the bottem of Coersion, or the aggro lock at the bottem of the speed line. I'ed personally try to get 2 ticks in Auspex, or speed up your stuns.4) ALTERNATE!: only put 3 in Mana Flow / 0 in the ward / 0 in GT / 0 in Dispell, then you'll have just enough to get the healer buff at the bottem of the Coersion line. (this is the route I took, but the other way focuses a lot more on group wide mana overall.)"[expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] Strong!"

Message Edited by Cattastrophy on 01-15-2007 11:31 PM

[Cattastrophy]

Oh and to answer these questions...."do you think its worth pouring points into the EoF lines to improve the recast times of the stuns?" - No... not really. a second or two won't save you on an epic, and will rarely come in handy on a normal named. unless you are full speed. Control Coercers have everything land and don't need speed to pick up the slack, where as Speed based Coercers rely on lots of quick casting and constant options to win a battle. So no, if you are going control / raid, don't waste the AA."Dont most of the high dps classes use other types of dmg, heat/cold for wizzy etc?" - Yes and no. Remember other Enchanters will LOVE you to death, I can debuff Mental (with Tash on) by over 7,000, but more importantly a lot of debuffs from the healers are Divine and magic based. (as well as Hex dolls) So getting MarPys and Breakdown on a mob is VERY important. As goes DPS, yeah most of it is either cold/fire from a wiz/conj or pois/dis from a Lock/nec, but you can debuff those a little with MarPys, so it still helps."My main priority is going to be using this class for highend group zones" - If you are more worried about groups and you don't want to DPS, get a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]-ton of Subjugation. This will make or break you in some higher end zones for mezzing. 452 Subj w/o buffs, and I keep forgetting what the resist noise sounds like. =p

Message Edited by Cattastrophy on 01-15-2007 11:42 PM

[TwistedFaith]

OK thanks for all the replies, I know in my mind what I want from my coercer, ubah group crowd control with no resists.With that in mind i'm looking at this combo so far:Wisdom: 4,4,4,8OK maxing out sub is obvious, i'm not sure about the resists and daydream though. I honesly have no idea how daydream works, can someone give me a example of it in use?The rest of the KOS line i'm not sure at all. I'm trying to decide if a 13% extra crit chance for healers is worth it for the toon I want, I dont plan on this guy ever being in the MT group for a raid.I was thinking of Agility: 4,8,4,8 to speed up all my stuns/mezzes etc.As for the EoF lines:I was going to try and pour points into the stuns (and mindbend) and then use the rest on ease,manaflow and a debuff if I have enough.Its very difficult to make up my mind and I dont want to be switching around all the time as it gets expensive.

[Kardg]

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valleyboy1 wrote:
OK thanks for all the replies, I know in my mind what I want from my coercer, ubah group crowd control with no resists.

With that in mind i'm looking at this combo so far:

Wisdom: 4,4,4,8

OK maxing out sub is obvious, i'm not sure about the resists and daydream though. I honesly have no idea how daydream works, can someone give me a example of it in use?

When two encounters are very close you cast it on the encounter your pulling to prevent the call for help bringing the second group.

The rest of the KOS line i'm not sure at all. I'm trying to decide if a 13% extra crit chance for healers is worth it for the toon I want, I dont plan on this guy ever being in the MT group for a raid.

If your focus is group support then 13% is extremely valuable when combined with healer AA's. For instance when my Fury is grouped with an Enchanter he then has 30% to crit on his heals which is significant.

I was thinking of Agility: 4,8,4,8 to speed up all my stuns/mezzes etc.

I enjoyed fast casting while leveling but at 70 I find it almost useless to fast cast.   In groups I have more than enough time to cast any spell necessary and while I solo its usually at a moderate pace and no rushing is necessary. Mez, root, debuff so on and so forth. With T7 pets and my equipment setup I don't benefit as much from fast casting. I find much more value for a groups perspective in other lines.

As for the EoF lines:

I was going to try and pour points into the stuns (and mindbend) and then use the rest on ease,manaflow and a debuff if I have enough.

This ones simple. If your raiding stuns are virtually useless however chain stunning in a group can be extremely valuable.

Its very difficult to make up my mind and I dont want to be switching around all the time as it gets expensive.

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In my overall opinion of all AA's within both trees I find the most beneficial setup for me in the Int, Wis lines for maxed subjugation, and I like volitate magic for soloing named, landing the big crits on Sonic Boom. I've got Tashiana & Thought Snap in the EoF trees with maxed stuns and Sonic Boom, with the remainder in Mana Flow, Beholder's Eye & Ease. 

 

Its a no brainer to keep your power locked around 30% for Volitate Magic. Mana Flow at 40%, Marred Pysche, Confoundment, Breakdown, Tashiana, Sonic Boom, HO, Ego, Word & Mez. Mastering your Mez, root and debuffs are key right along with pushing that subjugation skill up. Like previously mentioned debuffs are very helpful for everyone including yourself. Combine Marred Pysche, Breakdown & Tashiana with your Cazic ability (If you chose him) and you'll be landing that god ability for 10k and your Sonic Boom over 5k everytime with crits around 6.5k. New Tunaria you one shot the double up sixty fives and two shot the triple ups with both master debuffs on them and the right pet with its 30k crits.

 

With nearly 70 FT from Ease & Beholder's Eye my MT raid group can't run out of power and a regular group can't dream of it. With this setup I feel I contribute the most to the group. Filling all aspects which I consider vital. Power Heals/FT, Crowd Control, Hate, DPS.

Message Edited by Kardgar on 01-16-2007 08:04 AM

[Cattastrophy]

Couldn't have said it better... speed is more if you were looking at going DPS. Those fraction of a second can help lots on the parse, but not really as much when it comes to mezzing. Crits are nice so you might wana do INT 4-4-4-8-8 if you can mange the points for the extra crit % and the 30% increase on spell damage. Thruthfully, I'm a lazy SOB, and having to wory about my power being at a certain %age besides 100% takes far to much effort. lol