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11-10-2006, 10:16 PM
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#1 |
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 23
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Pre LU13, do you guys remember? I hear they are gonna make brawlers able to tank raid mobs. Doesnt this [Removed for Content] you guys off? I mean we are already replaced by zerkers and now they add brawlers whats next! Shadowknights will be better tanks. I'll telling you guys SOE is against the Guardian!now dont get me wrong we still rock, but how many updates have been done to the Guard sence lu13? maybe 1 or two and dont give me crap about how we are perfect.SOE WHY DO YOU HATE US? - a disgruntaled complaining old fat ogre guardian
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11-10-2006, 10:27 PM
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#2 |
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General
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Germany
Posts: 160
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disgruntaled complaining old fat ogre guardians are so pathetic, even slighty more than barbarian guardians :smileytongue:
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11-11-2006, 12:17 AM
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#3 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: MN, USA
Posts: 113
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I would have to agree with you there. If they want them to be able to tank epic targets, then they should raise our dps to match theirs.
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11-11-2006, 12:34 AM
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#4 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 196
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They may be able to tank lowbie style raid mobs but not top end. Those are reserved for plate tanks for the most part, mainly guards. We still rule the world, don't be scared.
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11-11-2006, 12:51 AM
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#5 |
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Lord
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 368
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Here's a response I gave in the monk forums. It just gives a different point of view from a tanking brawler. *snip* Too be honest, and I'm not speaking for every tanking monk out there but merely giving my opinion based on my playstyle and roles I've chosen, I believe that many of the tanking monks out there wish to have tools to make tanking more viable in the raid setting. This does not always mean being in the MT position. For example, in a raiding scenario: If mobs happen to peel from the MT - having the ability pull those mobs back to the MT with the confidence of not being one-shotted. Let's face it - Many raid mob CA's and the "to-hit" modifiers of most epics will just eat through our Tsunami. Having the ability to rescue when the MT/MA go down - buying time for the healers to scramble with a quick rez, with (once again) the confidence of not being one-shotted. Assuming the MA position of a raid with the same thoughts in mind. Off-Tanking mobs with the same thoughts in mind. So you see, many of the tanking monks in our community do not seek the glory of the MT position, contradictory to what people may think. Sure it's fun, sure I'll do it if asked. But we too want to be a solid part of the raid offering options that can ensure a successful experience other than just mediocre DPS. And the monks built to tank, by sacraficing dps - should have the tools to do just that in my opinion. *snip* On a side note... and realize I mean this in the most respectful way --> I hope you guys are sweating it. Competition is the forebearer of excellence. :smileywink:
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11-11-2006, 03:19 AM
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#6 |
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 23
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so far a zerker can tank everything a guard can and do it well, yeah we are still the best but its getting slimmer and slimmer, I made a guardian to tank epic monks should stop complaining if you wanted to tank you should have picked a plat class. secondly i dont know if you guys agree but tanking groups with a guardian is probly the most boring thing to do in this game besides harvesting. SO WE EARNED IT we are deff not the best group tanks (powerwise) so thats why we rock raids now they are gonna take it away from us guys!! DONT LET IT HAPPEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WE HAVE ALREADY BEEN HIT WITH THE NERF BAT ONCE DONT LET ROUND 2 HAPPEN start complaing like monks do!!! STILL ANGRY FAT OGRE
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11-11-2006, 03:22 AM
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#7 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 147
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Sounds like your bored as well.
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11-11-2006, 03:38 AM
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#8 |
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General
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 210
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Now you do know that ou can do really decent dps right? Let me quote one of your fellow Guardians, and here is the link to the post
Maybe its just that you do not prioritize in favor of dps, but it is not impossible to do DPS compared to DPS Brawlers. But then again my Bruiser doesnt do the same DPS as a DPS Bruiser but that is because i didnt go that path when it came to AA's. Now the good old days you are talking about was full of bugs and flaws in the way combat and threat was generated, and you will never see anything like that ever again.
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11-11-2006, 09:03 PM
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#9 |
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Lord
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 368
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Priceless...
You earn nothing, my plate-wearing, disgruntled, green, over-weight brother - based on what class you choose or the role you've chosen to play. The actions on your server will earn your position.
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11-11-2006, 11:16 PM
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#10 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 644
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eveb so it seems like every patch every other tnka class gets to tnak better and with the exceptions of i think it was live 11 which we ere nerfed hardcore.. we have had no tnkaing upgrades.. yet every patch every class can pretty much tnka better but our ability remians the same in every way... I mean monk tanking epics fine whatever.. but then can u at laest fix our dumb dmg soak lines??? for the love of norrath 
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11-12-2006, 12:20 AM
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#11 |
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 23
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its was lu13 where we got nerfd from being gods, but what I am saying is they are making all the other tanks better where the hell is out boost, yeah we can do some DPS BUT I NEVER WANTED TO DO DPS if i wanted to dps i'd picked a dps class I wanna tank so [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] make me tank better. I know dps = better tanking, but before the AAs guardians didnt need DPS we still dont but my point is we are being ignored by SOE while everyone else is getting better we sit here the same. and yes i was bored and i have poor gramar 8( sorry blame my ogre ness
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11-12-2006, 04:01 AM
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#12 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 147
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So what you're saying is you'd like to go back to pre-LU13 where you could just hit a couple taunt buttons and enjoy looking at nudie magazines on your bed. :smileysad: |
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11-12-2006, 07:04 AM
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#13 |
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 23
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yes, and dont forget the ability to tank naked
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11-13-2006, 07:42 AM
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#14 |
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 23
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so what your telling me is you guys dont wanna be a walking god again?
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11-13-2006, 12:30 PM
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#15 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 14
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I wish you had the experience of playing a 70 monk. Guardians have everything so easy when it comes to tanking, and now recently dps. I have recently been playing my guilds MT guardian when he isnt available, and its a freaking joke how easy you have it. Maybe if you played a class that takes skill to tank for once, you wouldn't [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] so much. Go play a monk, bruiser, sk, pally... You probably wouldn't make these posts about how every other fighter is getting so good, and your going nowhere. Play the other classes in a raid environment, then tell me your not gods. Seriously, I cant believe how many guardians [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]...
Message Edited by Zeenon13 on 11-12-2006 11:31 PM |
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11-13-2006, 08:37 PM
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#16 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Reading, England
Posts: 2,309
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Most updates since LU13 (which happened just before I started) have made life as a guard who mainly solos easier. We certainly are not perfect, if we are not being a raid main tank we are doing something that another class could do better, but we are far better than when I started and found blue solo mobs too dangerous to tackle alone.
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11-14-2006, 02:53 AM
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#17 |
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 23
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If have played a pally to lvl 40 and i have had no problems tanking at all. If i were gonna make a monk or bruiser I WOULDNT EXPECT to tank raid mobs. So dont tell me that we got it easy cause zerkers got it easy
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11-14-2006, 03:42 AM
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#18 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 14
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Play a 70 raid geared fighter of any kind and go MT. Guardian and Zerker absolutely have it 10 times easier than a crusader, and 100 times easier than a brawler. Your comparing tanking heroic content on a noob 40 pally...GGYour 1 track mind will take this conversation nowhere fast.
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11-14-2006, 07:09 AM
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#19 |
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 23
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cause we were talking about group tanks dude. and I have played MT for a successful guild back in t6 and quit t7 and then came back, what I am saying is brawlers should not be raid tanks. WHATS NEXT they gonna let brigands and swashies tank too?
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11-14-2006, 07:19 AM
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#20 |
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General
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 210
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And why is that? you can DPS just fine if you set yourself up for it, so a Brawler tank that is set up for tanking should be able to tank just as well.
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11-14-2006, 10:03 AM
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#21 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 14
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A brawler is a fighter archtype, so stop [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing complaining about them maybe even hinting at letting us not get 1 shotted. Even if we could stand in front of the mobs with the next round of changes, we will never be a MT choice since we have no aggro tricks like warriors. And guess what??? Swashies and Brigs, basically any scout takes less damange than a brawler right now. So were an extremely broken class, and your a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]. Think i covered it all.
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11-14-2006, 09:09 PM
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#22 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: 4 Bayle Court, South Qeynos
Posts: 509
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I definitely don't want to go back to the pre LU13 world... and I don't want to go back to the immediate post LU 13 world. Those were hard times for Guardian...The OP raises some valid questions though.- If Berserkers have 95% of the tanking a Guard has but 200% of a Guard's dps (which enables aggro lock), where is the point for a Guard?- With the new mitigation formula, the mitigation advance of Warriors over Brawlers is dwindling. With mitigation being one of the most important stats for an MT, Guards lose some of their (already slim) advantage. What do Guards get in exchange for that?- A dps Guard has to use a buckler while neither a Zerker nor a Brawler needs that to do very good dps. I do not know whether you can still tank epic content with a buckler. If you can't, the days of the MT Guard who can hold aggro as good as a Zerker because of double attack are over. Have Guard MT grps have to have a Coercer, Dirge, Swash AND Assassin in them now?Mind you, I am happy with my Guardian. And I know the personal skill makes you a good tank. But if I have to give 100% and a truckload of plat to be able to do the same a 50% slacking Fighter XY can do, I think there is something wrong
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11-14-2006, 09:49 PM
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#23 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 188
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11-14-2006, 10:39 PM
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#24 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 14
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When I raid MT with our guardian i zonewide parse around 1200. A good zerker might do what... 1400? Two times the dps? Hardly. Your doing something wrong if you cant break 1K EASILY on a guardian.
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11-14-2006, 10:50 PM
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#25 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 188
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We don't have the best raid set up (we are casual guild with random people all the tiem on raids |
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11-14-2006, 11:18 PM
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#26 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 67
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PUT THE PIPE DOWN !!! I have raided every mob in this game and you cant tell me you have a guardian parsing over 1k on a raid named !! I will say simply this ... you sir ARE A LIAR !! You cant tell me that he/she has parsed over 1k for a whole zone either. The timers on our CA are simply to long to keep 1k dps. The mt for our guild who has the best gear the game has to offer pretty much maybe MAYBE will parse 700-800 dps for a zone. That is including all the added dps he gets from DS and what not from other classes! Message Edited by Salarionn on 11-14-2006 10:25 AM
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Hating a Pally always makes me better !! |
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11-14-2006, 11:54 PM
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#27 |
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Loremaster
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 19
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Okay I normally don't jump into pointless conversations particularly those between bruisers and guards and tanking. But this has got to be the funniest thing I've ever heard. I don't mean that as a slight against you Dananeb it's just that this mind set goes against every thing I've ever thought of in regards to having different fighter classes. Saying that a Bruiser should be able to tank just as well as a Guard is just like saying that an Inquisitor should be able to do as much dps as a Fury. Our classes are on opposite ends of the fighter spectrum. I agree that you should be able to tank and tank well but saying that you should be able tank just as well as a Guard is over the edge. I am a Guard, I have lower dps, lower survivability, and lower soloability built in to my class in exchange for being the best raid tank in the game. I don't want FD, heals, or high dps. I just want to tank. I have no problem with any other class tanking but to be able to tank just as well as me.... I'm sorry but that would be a serious flaw in the game. Well EoF is here... will the Guard survive? Sure it will but the role outside of raids and perhaps in them is becoming increasingly smaller. Come to think of it Vanguard is looking better every day. Not because of the game play or classes but because I've yet to see one person whining on their boards about how their class should be able to do what all the other classes do. Just out of curiosity Dananeb, are you [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing on the Pally boards that they can heal better than you? |
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11-15-2006, 12:36 AM
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#28 |
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Lord
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 368
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Most in the brawler community don't want what other classes want - We just want to be able to fill our primary role in the raid scene without such a HUGE gap between the warrior and the brawler. It's that simple. We're a hybrid class. We can gear toward DPS, tanking or a little of both. So I'll say it again. Those of us who sacrafice DPS should have the ability to tank better and narrow the gap between the warrior and the brawler in the raid scene. Sony seems to agree. They've revamped avoidance, epic mob to-hit ratios and given us new tanking AA lines. 6. Enhance: Beckon -- Classification: Awareness-- Cost per rank: 1 -- Ranks: 5 -- Prerequisite: Requires 1 or 2 @ rank 3
7. Enhance: Martial Order -- Classification: Awareness -- Cost per rank: 1 -- Ranks: 5 -- Prerequisite: Requires 2 or 3 @ rank 3
16. Enhance: Face of the Mountain -- Classification: Body -- Cost per rank: 1 -- Ranks: 5 -- Prerequisite: Requires 13 or 14 @ rank 3
Why did they do this? Because we're tanks. Not situational. Not sometimes. Not maybe. The role we play is ultimately up to the guild leader, raid coordinator, the voice we make for ourselves and the reputation we establish. These tools - along with the tank geared brawler - can be a worthy asset to any raid - MT or not. We just want the ability to fulfill our primary role while sustaining a viable need within a raid other than moderate DPS and group FD.
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11-15-2006, 01:12 AM
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#29 |
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General
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 210
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I've already show you previously in this post about Guardians that parse very high when the AA's are not concentrated on tanking but DPS, so why should'nt it be possible for a Brawler to tank equally when his AA's are geared towards tanking?
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11-15-2006, 02:58 AM
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#30 |
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 23
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yes you guys see my point. they are giving everyone else abilities to tank with out taking away anything!
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