Keeping health under 50% an exploit?

[Sheissam]

I'm seeing a new trend become much more popular among those who Exile.

Solo exiled players running around with under 50% health so you can't get credit for them.  Usually are casters.  And if you get near them while they are in red, they will not hesitate to nuke you for your fame.

All the players I see doing this are Generals or Masters.

Also, exiles are killing themselves before they can be engaged. 

I believe these are exploits as defined by SoE.  Most exiles however, if you read eq2flames, do NOT think this is an exploit.  They also deny pvping for fame also, which boggles me.

I'm not sure why I see so many Generals and Masters from exiled superguilds running around JW solo all the time under 50% health if they aren't concerned with fame.

So is this an exploit?  What can be done to fix this?

[Roald]

I think it's lame and pretty [Removed for Content], like most fame whoring tactics. Don't think its an exploit tho.

[rvc]

   Whether its an exploit or not there needs to be a fix for this.  If your under 50% health and throw the first blow you should lose infamy and credit should be given where its due.

Sure the system works fine when people use it as intended.  Your out doing PVE and get jumped while your below 50%, but having a guy with mana shield run in under 50pct health and engageing people with his mana shield up and having nothing to lose if he doesnt win, sounds like an exploit to me.

[Dracot]

Ummm necro's have the ability to keep ourselves under 50% thru not using food...so if sony wants to provide free food that could fix this a bit.  But honestly if someone is playing a class that is gimped and they can do this and prevent losing coin, by using class DEFINING abiltities, meanwhile a ranger can exploit the focus aim off feature in pvp by precasting b4 a fight, I don't see ANYTHING wrong here. I do not know how a MS clas is able to do this though.  All a necro has to do is heal pet a few times and not have food on, and cast lich, we all set. If im out in RoK zones with plat on me to buy faction gear, I'll be damned sure ill be under 50%.  Actually im pretty sure ANY class can do this, let a mob beat on you til under 50%, so accusing only certain classes of doing this is kinda wrong.  No solid rule states in eq2 pvp you must be at full health so scout_997 can get a free update.

[rvc]

If thats all thats being done Dracot thats fine.  The exploit is people intentionally keeping thier health under 50pct and ((Initiating the combat))

The FIX:  If you start the fight you lose infamy regardless of health.  However If your defending yourself after someone else has engaged you and your under 50% health you lose nothing.

[eu]

How about it's a pvp server. If you die you loose fame money etc. regardless of where your health is at.

[Derrickr]

I'm seeing this a lot also.  There was a wizard on SS docks and his health was in the yellow.  I saw freeps converging on him so I tossed him a heal and he got really upset about it.  And, of course, he was a general.

[yohann koldheart]

isnt there a caster aa  that gives the clothie a dps buff if their health is under 50%?

cant remember what caster class has it, it may be under a power percentage that im thinkin of tho

[zorros]

Adriana@Venekor wrote:

isnt there a caster aa  that gives the clothie a dps buff if their health is under 50%?

cant remember what caster class has it, it may be under a power percentage that im thinkin of tho

Illus power under 30% is what i think you mean and if im soloing and lots of fps are around me i will stay under 50% for however long it takes them to get bored and kill me anyway. Cant see its a exploit really. Its a tactic. Justingrell uses this tactic all the time and he hasnt been banned yet, oh wait yes he has lulz

[Dracot]

euar wrote:

How about it's a pvp server. If you die you loose fame money etc. regardless of where your health is at.

Paly a broken class first, then travel with cash on you to buy faction items in RoK, at full health.  My guess is a post started by you whining how such and such scout took your cash. 

[ken579]

I think casters should exploit that, after all they are getting screwed anyways.  The whole 50% health thing is only good for melee classes anyways.  With casters it should be if you are under 50% power the person killing you gains no infamy.  The point of the 50% health dealio was to prevent ganking right after someone kills a mob, but casters can walk away from killing a mob with full health but no mana.  But after all, whats the point of the 50% health thing if a group of 6 can gank 1 anyways and gain infamy.

[Norrsken]

Itscrackerjack@Nagafen wrote:

Adriana@Venekor wrote:

isnt there a caster aa  that gives the clothie a dps buff if their health is under 50%?

cant remember what caster class has it, it may be under a power percentage that im thinkin of tho

Illus power under 30% is what i think you mean and if im soloing and lots of fps are around me i will stay under 50% for however long it takes them to get bored and kill me anyway. Cant see its a exploit really. Its a tactic. Justingrell uses this tactic all the time and he hasnt been banned yet, oh wait yes he has lulz

Isnt exploiting using a game mechanic in a way that it is not intended to be used to gain an unfair advantage?I remember when every fame [Removed for Content] on naggy used the silly stealth item from an instance in DoF to always keep below 50% health. That item was changed to curb that behavior. If it isnt an exploit, why did they change that item?

[zorros]

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:

Itscrackerjack@Nagafen wrote:

Adriana@Venekor wrote:

isnt there a caster aa  that gives the clothie a dps buff if their health is under 50%?

cant remember what caster class has it, it may be under a power percentage that im thinkin of tho

Illus power under 30% is what i think you mean and if im soloing and lots of fps are around me i will stay under 50% for however long it takes them to get bored and kill me anyway. Cant see its a exploit really. Its a tactic. Justingrell uses this tactic all the time and he hasnt been banned yet, oh wait yes he has lulz

Isnt exploiting using a game mechanic in a way that it is not intended to be used to gain an unfair advantage?I remember when every fame [Removed for Content] on naggy used the silly stealth item from an instance in DoF to always keep below 50% health. That item was changed to curb that behavior. If it isnt an exploit, why did they change that item?

If i stay under 50% all the time and attack people in pvp then i would say yes. Keeping myself under 50% and stoping a group ganking me solo when i have no chance of winning = smart imo.

[Amphibia]

If done to avoid losing fame before attacking someone, it's lame. But hardly an exploit.

[Krakelkr]

They are exploiting game mechanics to gain an unintended advantage. Easy concept.

[Norrsken]

Itscrackerjack@Nagafen wrote:

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:

Itscrackerjack@Nagafen wrote:

Adriana@Venekor wrote:

isnt there a caster aa  that gives the clothie a dps buff if their health is under 50%?

cant remember what caster class has it, it may be under a power percentage that im thinkin of tho

Illus power under 30% is what i think you mean and if im soloing and lots of fps are around me i will stay under 50% for however long it takes them to get bored and kill me anyway. Cant see its a exploit really. Its a tactic. Justingrell uses this tactic all the time and he hasnt been banned yet, oh wait yes he has lulz

Isnt exploiting using a game mechanic in a way that it is not intended to be used to gain an unfair advantage?I remember when every fame [Removed for Content] on naggy used the silly stealth item from an instance in DoF to always keep below 50% health. That item was changed to curb that behavior. If it isnt an exploit, why did they change that item?

If i stay under 50% all the time and attack people in pvp then i would say yes. Keeping myself under 50% and stoping a group ganking me solo when i have no chance of winning = smart imo.

Most exploits are smart and give you an advantage. So...

[Bloodfa]

Dracot72 wrote:

euar wrote:

How about it's a pvp server. If you die you loose fame money etc. regardless of where your health is at.

Paly a broken class first, then travel with cash on you to buy faction items in RoK, at full health.  My guess is a post started by you whining how such and such scout took your cash. 

Tell me you're going out with 2 plat stacks of fuel and not actual coin ... I mean, hell, I have 10 plat on me at any given moment ... in fuel.

[Dracot]

Krakelkrak wrote:

They are exploiting game mechanics to gain an unintended advantage. Easy concept.

So when im fighting a mob and get ganked by a scout, but mob has me under 50% health i guess im guilty and need to be banned fropm game.

[Dracot]

Bloodfang@Nagafen wrote:

Dracot72 wrote:

euar wrote:

How about it's a pvp server. If you die you loose fame money etc. regardless of where your health is at.

Paly a broken class first, then travel with cash on you to buy faction items in RoK, at full health.  My guess is a post started by you whining how such and such scout took your cash. 

Tell me you're going out with 2 plat stacks of fuel and not actual coin ... I mean, hell, I have 10 plat on me at any given moment ... in fuel.

For awhile Bloodfang, there wasnt an option to sell to vendors in faction areas.  Tried that as my first resort.  Either it was that or i didnt ahve enough faction with the merchant i don't quite remember.  I have no need for it now, but seriously if i don't feel like giving the non skilled  classes free fame its my class ability to do so.  Sorry if this annoys people, but its hardly an exploit.  Until they fix the slam 6 CA's into one macro exploit that negates all timers for CA's rending the opponent dead in less than 1 second i think you folks can easily live with this.  Sux to be me dieing in a second, sux to be you not getting fame for a kill.

[zorros]

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:

Itscrackerjack@Nagafen wrote:

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:

Itscrackerjack@Nagafen wrote:

Adriana@Venekor wrote:

isnt there a caster aa  that gives the clothie a dps buff if their health is under 50%?

cant remember what caster class has it, it may be under a power percentage that im thinkin of tho

Illus power under 30% is what i think you mean and if im soloing and lots of fps are around me i will stay under 50% for however long it takes them to get bored and kill me anyway. Cant see its a exploit really. Its a tactic. Justingrell uses this tactic all the time and he hasnt been banned yet, oh wait yes he has lulz

Isnt exploiting using a game mechanic in a way that it is not intended to be used to gain an unfair advantage?I remember when every fame [Removed for Content] on naggy used the silly stealth item from an instance in DoF to always keep below 50% health. That item was changed to curb that behavior. If it isnt an exploit, why did they change that item?

If i stay under 50% all the time and attack people in pvp then i would say yes. Keeping myself under 50% and stoping a group ganking me solo when i have no chance of winning = smart imo.

Most exploits are smart and give you an advantage. So... " />

I only do this if i see a gank group coming. I dont however do a justingrell and get under 50% and go start a fight. Difference imo.

[Bloodfa]

Dracot72 wrote:

Bloodfang@Nagafen wrote:

Dracot72 wrote:

euar wrote:

How about it's a pvp server. If you die you loose fame money etc. regardless of where your health is at.

Paly a broken class first, then travel with cash on you to buy faction items in RoK, at full health.  My guess is a post started by you whining how such and such scout took your cash. 

Tell me you're going out with 2 plat stacks of fuel and not actual coin ... I mean, hell, I have 10 plat on me at any given moment ... in fuel.

For awhile Bloodfang, there wasnt an option to sell to vendors in faction areas.  Tried that as my first resort.  Either it was that or i didnt ahve enough faction with the merchant i don't quite remember.  I have no need for it now, but seriously if i don't feel like giving the non skilled  classes free fame its my class ability to do so.  Sorry if this annoys people, but its hardly an exploit.  Until they fix the slam 6 CA's into one macro exploit that negates all timers for CA's rending the opponent dead in less than 1 second i think you folks can easily live with this.  Sux to be me dieing in a second, sux to be you not getting fame for a kill.

Fame, no fame, doesn't matter to me, I spend more time untitled than anything else.  Same with percentage of hit points left, unless they're right at the cusp, then I'll wait.  But otherwise, I'll kill you at 5%, 50%, or 100%.  Well, try to anyway.  Reward or not, isn't it what we're supposed to be doing on a PvP server?  If nothing else, at least you'll have to revive, and maybe take an armor ding.

And it was the faction thing that prevented it, the selling of fuel.  Drove me nuts, too. 

[Kneemin]

oh you guys gonna like this one.. i've been [I cannot control my vocabulary] in petition ... 3rd or 4th one now... w/e the case I made myself very clear that it was BS and should be bannable.... finally they sent it to a senior GM and I got this in response.....(not exact quote)It was the developers intention that players under 50% would not lose anything from pvp.  So it is not an exploit and is simply a good tactic.*i'll grab the quote and update here in a minuteHere is the most recent replyWhile we do understand your frustration, the only means by which you can suggest feedback to the developers is to use the /feedback command or to post on the forums. We brought this up internally and were advised by developers that this was not considered an exploit so the issue is really out of the hands of CS. All we can advise is to use the communication lines already mentioned. I can assure you your comments will be read but ultimately you may never receive any response and there is no guarantee that any changes may occur as a result of said comments. I am sorry we could not be of more assistance. If you have any other issues we may be able to address in the future, please contact us at your convenience. We wish you good luck and safe journey in the lands of Norrath!

[Derrickr]

Kneemin@Nagafen wrote:

oh you guys gonna like this one.. i've been [I cannot control my vocabulary] in petition ... 3rd or 4th one now... w/e the case I made myself very clear that it was BS and should be bannable.... finally they sent it to a senior GM and I got this in response.....(not exact quote)It was the developers intention that players under 50% would not lose anything from pvp.  So it is not an exploit and is simply a good tactic.*i'll grab the quote and update here in a minuteHere is the most recent replyWhile we do understand your frustration, the only means by which you can suggest feedback to the developers is to use the /feedback command or to post on the forums. We brought this up internally and were advised by developers that this was not considered an exploit so the issue is really out of the hands of CS. All we can advise is to use the communication lines already mentioned. I can assure you your comments will be read but ultimately you may never receive any response and there is no guarantee that any changes may occur as a result of said comments. I am sorry we could not be of more assistance. If you have any other issues we may be able to address in the future, please contact us at your convenience. We wish you good luck and safe journey in the lands of Norrath!

Wow if thats true its BS.  It's OK for someone to keep their health under 50% and have zero risk of losing fame as long as they continue to do so?  Then whats the point of the whole fame system if some people can lose it and some can't?

[Elephanton]

Wow, what a BS.I wonder who was that dev who said that this is legit tactics.

[Bloodfa]

Have somebody run around and heal him.  Ventrilo is a nice little tool.

And I'm of the opinion that the response is a copout on the part of the Devs; they don't really seem to want to touch on anything fame-related.  Big pink elephant in the room that nobody wants to talk about but everybody knows is there, ya know?

[Menstor]

Bloodfang@Nagafen wrote:

Have somebody run around and heal him.  Ventrilo is a nice little tool.

And I'm of the opinion that the response is a copout on the part of the Devs; they don't really seem to want to touch on anything fame-related.  Big pink elephant in the room that nobody wants to talk about but everybody knows is there, ya know? " width="15" height="15" />

Yeah, that's what I hear too.

[Ahlana]

Dracot72 wrote:

Until they fix the slam 6 CA's into one macro exploit that negates all timers for CA's rending the opponent dead in less than 1 second.

A little off subject but this doesn't happen on any of my macros? Is this just a gross over exageration of things or is it really happening? I can't get this to happen on any of my characters in testing so it is either a one class thing or really isn't happening. I think the Devs would be all over that bug.

As it is on my classes I have tested it with. I can put multiple CA's in one button. I press the button and the first CA launches and the Second one Queues. After the second one goes off nothing else happens regardless of how many other CA's are in the macro. If I want them to go off I have to continuely press the button over and over. Nothing makes them all go off at once negating the timers.

Anyone else test this?

[Bloodfa]

This is true.  Loading all the CA's you want will still only get the first one and either the second or third, but not more than two.  Unless something recently changed.  You could, however, make several macro's and then just 1, 2, 3 them faster than actually clicking, but where's the fun in that?  One of these days they'll remove macros from combat.

[Sightless]

Ahlana wrote:

Dracot72 wrote:

Until they fix the slam 6 CA's into one macro exploit that negates all timers for CA's rending the opponent dead in less than 1 second.

A little off subject but this doesn't happen on any of my macros? Is this just a gross over exageration of things or is it really happening? I can't get this to happen on any of my characters in testing so it is either a one class thing or really isn't happening. I think the Devs would be all over that bug.

As it is on my classes I have tested it with. I can put multiple CA's in one button. I press the button and the first CA launches and the Second one Queues. After the second one goes off nothing else happens regardless of how many other CA's are in the macro. If I want them to go off I have to continuely press the button over and over. Nothing makes them all go off at once negating the timers.

Anyone else test this?

It isn't true. Dracot tells fish stories when talking about Rangers, or scouts in general.. I caught a fish and it was <--------------------------------------------------> long. This is a common practice when people are trying to get other classes nerfed.

[Krakelkr]

Sightless wrote:

Ahlana wrote:

Dracot72 wrote:

Until they fix the slam 6 CA's into one macro exploit that negates all timers for CA's rending the opponent dead in less than 1 second.

A little off subject but this doesn't happen on any of my macros? Is this just a gross over exageration of things or is it really happening? I can't get this to happen on any of my characters in testing so it is either a one class thing or really isn't happening. I think the Devs would be all over that bug.

As it is on my classes I have tested it with. I can put multiple CA's in one button. I press the button and the first CA launches and the Second one Queues. After the second one goes off nothing else happens regardless of how many other CA's are in the macro. If I want them to go off I have to continuely press the button over and over. Nothing makes them all go off at once negating the timers.

Anyone else test this?

It isn't true. Dracot tells fish stories when talking about Rangers, or scouts in general.. I caught a fish and it was <--------------------------------------------------> long. This is a common practice when people are trying to get other classes nerfed.

This rumour has been around for a long time but I never got it to work.