Bruiser Prestige

Genghes · 11-01-2012, 01:56 AM

you know Hert, you are absolutely right. the damage on the abilities need to be increased a lot. also the defensive side ability "material leap" needs to have the required target removed. the more i think about it after looking at data bruisers got watered down abilities.

Novusod · 11-01-2012, 11:34 PM

hert wrote:

nearly every bruiser ever is going to tank sometimes, and dps sometimes. if youre ever soloing, chances are, youre also tanking. so its natural to find the happy medium where you can be an effective tank, and pretend to dps when you get the chance. also, unless you miserably fail at combo, this will never rival onslaught. the problem with the ability in heroic is not the damage, its that mobs dont live long enough to stack pulverize enough to make onslaught to do much.
this is a ZW from DP: a typical em zone that basicly reflects what im trying to get across
http://i46.tinypic.com/mrer8.png

The offensive side is ballanced arround the bruiser being behind the mob for double damage. If it did more damage while in front of the mob the double damage part would have to be dropped because it would be blatently over powered. The way this ability works is already really good. It doesn't need to be made any more powerful.

You can't say it won't get enough use either. From what I have seen in CoE bruisers will be pretty much a pure DPS class. If your guild is min / max'ing then you shouldn't have to tank anything this entire expansion. Think about the defensive side for a minute. Are the defensive abilities usefull while solo? NO. Is the defensive side usefull while doing heroics? NO. Compared to the tank side of the prestige which is completely useless the offensive side is simply amazing. The tank prestige is so completely situational it will never be used but the dps line is affective almost all the time. This is basically everything you asked for before. Now that they gave it to you are just being greedy for wanting more.

If it were up to me bruisers would still be tanks, not dps.

Novusod · 11-03-2012, 03:06 AM

Bunji wrote:

Bruiser
Pulverize is now a castable self buff that does not expire and persists through death. The duration of the DoT has been extended to 16 seconds and an additional tick has been added.
Broken Limbs now improves the trigger chance of Pulverize.
Pulverize will no longer get resisted.

Overpowered, nuf said.

Enjoy your 2+ million parses Hert while they last because you will have every DPS class screaming at the ridiculousness of this in no time at all. Here is a little preview of the coming rage.

hert · 11-03-2012, 01:22 PM

overpowered? so in reckless from behind, it might be 3% of a parse now? thats really the least of our abilities for people to squalk about.

also, thats exactly not what i was suggesting... i just wanted it to somehow persist through mob death so it did something in heroic. its still going to parse the same in heroic with that added on. the bottom line is the buff dies when the mobs die. and when the mob dies in <5 seconds, the ability does nothing. and 95% of heroic content dies in <5 seconds. i already said that the damage was solid in raid.

also, ill believe bruisers are t1 dps when i get a buff!

hert · 11-03-2012, 08:34 PM

i lied. its all the way up to a 60% proc, which is huge. with it procing that much its almost relevent in heroic cuz i usually get off at least a couple Cas before mobs die. with the % that high you might want to lower the damage. perhaps tone down the flanking or behind additional part some, so you dont take a hit to it when youre tanking or soloing.

Corydonn · 11-03-2012, 11:15 PM

hert wrote:

overpowered? so in reckless from behind, it might be 3% of a parse now? thats really the least of our abilities for people to squalk about.
also, thats exactly not what i was suggesting... i just wanted it to somehow persist through mob death so it did something in heroic. its still going to parse the same in heroic with that added on. the bottom line is the buff dies when the mobs die. and when the mob dies in <5 seconds, the ability does nothing. and 95% of heroic content dies in <5 seconds. i already said that the damage was solid in raid.
also, ill believe bruisers are t1 dps when i get a buff!

If anyone can get the class overpowered it's you Hert! I tried forever and nobody bit on it.

Genghes · 11-05-2012, 10:59 PM

the increase trigger chance actually lowered the number of swings based on my 5 min parse i linked in page one vs the parse i just completed. also, the overall dps of the ability decreased by 2/3 about. current parse is pulverize: 569,900 dmg in 5 min = 1,906.02 dps ; 155 swings.

previous parse i posted on page one. Pulverize: 1,519,680 dmg in 5 min = 5,015.45 dps; 272 swings

so yeah..... even though they increased the proc rate by 60% they killed the damage amount on it. they just keep watering down that ability.

on another note. does anyone know if the end ability on the defensive line prevent incoming damage or just returns damage after it has hit the tank? if it will actually lower the inc damage then it is a good ability and is parsing about 13% damage reduction. if it is not then its another watered down ability.

Novusod · 11-09-2012, 03:06 AM

I did some testing tonight in Sleepers tomb x4 raid. The major concern is that Pulverize would bug on certain fights and stop proccing altogether. It would not proc again unless Pulverize was recast. I will go through the logs and try to post a parse soon.

*edit

This is 11 minute long hardmode fight. Battering Onslaught and Pulverize were combined 6% of my dps. It might have been little higher if it didn't get the recast bug.

Genghes · 11-09-2012, 02:46 PM

were you in reckless or defensive stance?

hert · 11-09-2012, 09:51 PM

not sure why onslaught got gimped? it seemed to be right on damage wise. now its parsing back down below mantis bolt and other normal CAs... around 3% of a solo parse, so less in group. IMO a super dps endline should be significantly higher dps than a CA i learned at level 7's upgrade, should it not? and now pulverize's dps is inflated, however it still parses 2% unless youre reckless and or behind the mob. not sure what the logic is on that nerf. should lower pulverize's back damage, so its a little less all or nothing, and increase onslaughts damage back to where it was.

hert · 11-09-2012, 10:46 PM

just tested it in the gimpy temple zone. i was reckless and in theory not tanking:

pulverize:5%, onslaught: 2%... sounds backwards to me.

http://i46.tinypic.com/2mq5ke0.png

11-01-2012, 11:34 PM	#2
Novusod Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,719	hert wrote: nearly every bruiser ever is going to tank sometimes, and dps sometimes. if youre ever soloing, chances are, youre also tanking. so its natural to find the happy medium where you can be an effective tank, and pretend to dps when you get the chance. also, unless you miserably fail at combo, this will never rival onslaught. the problem with the ability in heroic is not the damage, its that mobs dont live long enough to stack pulverize enough to make onslaught to do much. this is a ZW from DP: a typical em zone that basicly reflects what im trying to get across http://i46.tinypic.com/mrer8.png The offensive side is ballanced arround the bruiser being behind the mob for double damage. If it did more damage while in front of the mob the double damage part would have to be dropped because it would be blatently over powered. The way this ability works is already really good. It doesn't need to be made any more powerful. You can't say it won't get enough use either. From what I have seen in CoE bruisers will be pretty much a pure DPS class. If your guild is min / max'ing then you shouldn't have to tank anything this entire expansion. Think about the defensive side for a minute. Are the defensive abilities usefull while solo? NO. Is the defensive side usefull while doing heroics? NO. Compared to the tank side of the prestige which is completely useless the offensive side is simply amazing. The tank prestige is so completely situational it will never be used but the dps line is affective almost all the time. This is basically everything you asked for before. Now that they gave it to you are just being greedy for wanting more. If it were up to me bruisers would still be tanks, not dps. __________________

11-03-2012, 03:06 AM	#3
Novusod Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,719	Bunji wrote: Bruiser Pulverize is now a castable self buff that does not expire and persists through death. The duration of the DoT has been extended to 16 seconds and an additional tick has been added. Broken Limbs now improves the trigger chance of Pulverize. Pulverize will no longer get resisted. Overpowered, nuf said. Enjoy your 2+ million parses Hert while they last because you will have every DPS class screaming at the ridiculousness of this in no time at all. Here is a little preview of the coming rage. __________________

11-03-2012, 11:15 PM	#6
Corydonn Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 744	hert wrote: overpowered? so in reckless from behind, it might be 3% of a parse now? thats really the least of our abilities for people to squalk about. also, thats exactly not what i was suggesting... i just wanted it to somehow persist through mob death so it did something in heroic. its still going to parse the same in heroic with that added on. the bottom line is the buff dies when the mobs die. and when the mob dies in <5 seconds, the ability does nothing. and 95% of heroic content dies in <5 seconds. i already said that the damage was solid in raid. also, ill believe bruisers are t1 dps when i get a buff! If anyone can get the class overpowered it's you Hert! I tried forever and nobody bit on it.

11-09-2012, 03:06 AM	#8
Novusod Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,719	I did some testing tonight in Sleepers tomb x4 raid. The major concern is that Pulverize would bug on certain fights and stop proccing altogether. It would not proc again unless Pulverize was recast. I will go through the logs and try to post a parse soon. *edit This is 11 minute long hardmode fight. Battering Onslaught and Pulverize were combined 6% of my dps. It might have been little higher if it didn't get the recast bug. __________________

11-01-2012, 01:56 AM	#1
Genghes Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: j Posts: 7	you know Hert, you are absolutely right. the damage on the abilities need to be increased a lot. also the defensive side ability "material leap" needs to have the required target removed. the more i think about it after looking at data bruisers got watered down abilities.

11-03-2012, 01:22 PM	#4
hert Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 11	overpowered? so in reckless from behind, it might be 3% of a parse now? thats really the least of our abilities for people to squalk about. also, thats exactly not what i was suggesting... i just wanted it to somehow persist through mob death so it did something in heroic. its still going to parse the same in heroic with that added on. the bottom line is the buff dies when the mobs die. and when the mob dies in <5 seconds, the ability does nothing. and 95% of heroic content dies in <5 seconds. i already said that the damage was solid in raid. also, ill believe bruisers are t1 dps when i get a buff!

11-03-2012, 08:34 PM	#5
hert Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 11	i lied. its all the way up to a 60% proc, which is huge. with it procing that much its almost relevent in heroic cuz i usually get off at least a couple Cas before mobs die. with the % that high you might want to lower the damage. perhaps tone down the flanking or behind additional part some, so you dont take a hit to it when youre tanking or soloing.

11-05-2012, 10:59 PM	#7
Genghes Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: j Posts: 7	the increase trigger chance actually lowered the number of swings based on my 5 min parse i linked in page one vs the parse i just completed. also, the overall dps of the ability decreased by 2/3 about. current parse is pulverize: 569,900 dmg in 5 min = 1,906.02 dps ; 155 swings. previous parse i posted on page one. Pulverize: 1,519,680 dmg in 5 min = 5,015.45 dps; 272 swings so yeah..... even though they increased the proc rate by 60% they killed the damage amount on it. they just keep watering down that ability. on another note. does anyone know if the end ability on the defensive line prevent incoming damage or just returns damage after it has hit the tank? if it will actually lower the inc damage then it is a good ability and is parsing about 13% damage reduction. if it is not then its another watered down ability.

11-09-2012, 02:46 PM	#9
Genghes Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: j Posts: 7	were you in reckless or defensive stance?

11-09-2012, 09:51 PM	#10
hert Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 11	not sure why onslaught got gimped? it seemed to be right on damage wise. now its parsing back down below mantis bolt and other normal CAs... around 3% of a solo parse, so less in group. IMO a super dps endline should be significantly higher dps than a CA i learned at level 7's upgrade, should it not? and now pulverize's dps is inflated, however it still parses 2% unless youre reckless and or behind the mob. not sure what the logic is on that nerf. should lower pulverize's back damage, so its a little less all or nothing, and increase onslaughts damage back to where it was.

11-09-2012, 10:46 PM	#11
hert Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 11	just tested it in the gimpy temple zone. i was reckless and in theory not tanking: pulverize:5%, onslaught: 2%... sounds backwards to me. http://i46.tinypic.com/2mq5ke0.png