[Norrsken]

Amphibia wrote:

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:

Amphibia wrote:

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:

Amphibia wrote:

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:

Amphibia wrote:

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:

Amphibia wrote:

Ulvhamne@Nagafen wrote:

Amphibia wrote:

I agree completely with the OP.

I sure dont. I wasnt very fond of the roaming raids farming grays there before they slapped a lvl cap on the zone.

Well, then we disagree. I was one of the greys that were farmed there constantly. It was hard, but also a lot of fun because it really felt like a dangerous PvP environment. That's something I miss in this game, it was so much better before they ruined it with perma immunity, safe docks and waaaay too strict level range limits..... And now? Raids of greys who are hanging out to leech... safe in immunity and can attack whenever they feel that it's safe to do so. Whole guilds lock at 58-59 now, so that they can do this constantly. Why even level up and give up those huge advantages? Bleh. In my opinion, they should go ahead and remove that limit again. There is no excuse to keep it there anylonger, espesially with the way it is being abused. And greys getting ganked, what does it matter? They lose nothing. No fame and no items. They don't even get XP debt anymore. No penalites at all... so why do they need all this protection?

Or, people at lvl cap could go to lvl cap zones? And yah, I know there arent any good zones since in KoS everyone skydives, and in LP, there is aggro everywhere. But seriously, SS is a t6 zone. Complaining about t5-6 toons being unattackable there seems a bit off. And why arent you getting the same sense of danger with the gray raids? you sure as hell couldnt do anything to the red raids, as you cant to the gray ones. Shoudnt matter much, should it?

Actually, I'm not a big fan of level range limits in general. And yes, you are right that Loping Plain and KoS sucks for PvP. For the exact reasons you just mentioned. With all the leeching going on, I don't think it is unreasonable at all to ask for something to change. Alternatively, they could make level range limits swing both ways - reds can't attack greys, and greys can't attack reds. Or make red cons as impossible to beat for greys as a red con mob would be. Maybe then they would think twice about attacking... As for the sense of danger, hehe... were you even there? It just doesn't sound as if you were. Of course I couldn't kill the red cons that were hunting me, but I could run... I could outsmart them sometimes, and I actually had to look over my shoulder, which is just fine on a PvP server.

Oh yes, I were there. I couldnt get a decent pvp fight woithout a [I cannot control my vocabulary] raid popping in. Actually, the very toon in my sig were the first one to get into that hassle. And if you could outrun the roaming raids, well, you were in luch. What I usually had was a raid dropping from a carpet, snaring or rooting me and then everyone hit their fastest attack to land an attack to get faction before I died. I was usually a 2-3 second ordeal. And oh yeah, the revive ponts and carpets were most of the time camped. It wasnt a sense of danger, it was a sense of utter futility. And hell yeah, make reds more dangerous to grays. Make it near impossible to land stuff on someone 20 lvls above you, then you can take a whack at them while they proceed to oneshot your group one by one. Im perfectly fine with that option. Another option would be to change how pvp works altogether, making levels mean close to nothing apart from the skills you get. Damage is scaled to a specific set (ie mentored to a certain level of effectiveness) so a lvl 70s advantage is just that they ahve more skills, not that their skills do a [I cannot control my vocabulary] more damage. A lvl 10 will still be severely gimped compared to a lvl 70. And due to everyone having a fair chance (well, not really, if its a lvl 10 vs a lvl 70) just remove level ranges and let the mayhem begin. Perhaps make it so that you wont lose/gain anything of the level spread is greater than 10-15% (decided from the lower level guy). Still, everyone is attackable. More pvp, more fun.

No, I couldn't outrun raids... but I ran from quite a few groups and solo hunters. One will always feel utter futility against raids - at level 70 I still get rolled big time with minimal chances of escape if I come across one of those... Anyway, your idea sounds very interesting.... allthough I'm sure there are issues with it though, as there are issues with everything. Ok, so everyone would be white con to eachother all the way from 10-70 right? But you can see the number behind their name, as today. The first thought I had was that while a level 10 will be able to land spells on me as if we were the same level, I'll be wearing pieces of the level 70 PvP and EoF fabled gear, and have all those skills in adept 3/master 1 version + 100 AA points ... while he has no choice but to wear noob gear and have 2 nukes.... gimped doesn't even begin to describe that, lol. I would probably destroy him without even trying. As for gear and spells scaling... what would they scale to? Not your opponent, that wouldn't work as this game is very faction and group based. But maybe scale with the zone you are in, perhaps? I'm sure none of us sees all the possible issues with this, but before I can think of more problems, or someone else points them out - I think it sounds like a possibly good idea.

Just use the %. You get the straight % of what the gear gives you. Not the hard stats, or the hard resists, or the hard damage or the hard health. And no, its not impossible to setup a decent scaling system. And how would it be more gimped than a 45 vs a 70, pray tell? And, guess what, I've tried MMOs that utilized such systems. I liked them better than the silly lvl range system of eq2.

Why not just let it scale to the zone? So that if you're level 70 and zone into Antonica, then you're still 70 PvE wise, but to your opponents you are only level 20. In TS, you're 30, in EL you're 40 and so on.... Or did you want it to scale right down to 10 regardless of what zone you're in?

No, I want the PvP and PvE systems (almost) completely separated. Normalize the damage for spells to a fixed level of pve, or whatever. Just normalize it to a fixed point. All the spells of the same line will always do the same damage in pvp. The only advantage gained from more pve levels would be more skills to toy with. Not greater damage, or ten times the health and so on. That way, no level ranges would ever be needed (removing some silly stunts people pull to circumvent them), level locking would be a thing of the past and mentoring wouldnt be a problem in pvp. Quite a few odd things would go away. (And we would prolly gain a few new ones) Some problems would be heals. How would you decide if the pvp or pve version would be applied? Because having pvp heals in pve would either be vastly overpowered, or completely gimpified. And using pve heals would be the same deal. Largest problem with the whole concept really. And Im still thinking about that one. Automatic mentoring to the level at hand would probably be neat as well, if they ever fix mentoring. Only thing I see as a potential problem with that is people exploiting holes in it. that and always bringing raids of people 4 or 8 levels above you. But meh. That would serve to make levellocking more dangerous and the lower tiers more full of action so I dont mind that too much.

That doesn't sound so bad at all, actually. As for heals, they are already toned down some for PvP, and yeah... sometimes that can probably be an issue if you're doing a mob and get jumped etc...

Yah, and if you decide to normalize heals for say, 10k of health, using those heals in t2 pve, ugh. The other way around would be normalizing heals for a 500 health pool. Imagine trying to use those heals in t7 pve. holds tru if you turn it around the other way as well. Which is kindof bothering me. (Even the current pvp implementation suffers from this to a lesser extent.)