EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire

EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire (https://archive.eq2wire.com//index.php)
-   Class Discussion (https://archive.eq2wire.com//forumdisplay.php?f=5526)
-   -   Bulwark of Order (https://archive.eq2wire.com//showthread.php?t=924327)

Bigstomp 10-26-2018 07:47 PM

Wanted to start a more focused discussion on this. I believe the purpose of this ability is to try to encourage groups to bring tanks over a dps or another healer in that spot. With that in mind, let's make sure any ideas or discussions we have are not bringing up solutions that completely get rid of this otherwise they probably wont take the suggestion that seriously. <br /> <br />Overall another thing for a fighter to do is not a total issue however, I believe my biggest issue with it, is there's no room for error and it seems like it's on almost every mob.<br /><br />So for example <br />-If your out of power when the check comes... The group dies.<br />-If you are stunned when the check comes.... The group dies.<br />-If you accidentally cast the ability to early (or to late)..... The group dies. <br /><br />I am not entirely sure of any other check in the game that is this punishing that is revolved around one player.<br /><br />I suppose the easiest solution to it would be to make it Instacast,0 power cost , Castable under control effects with the only punishment being if you cast to early or late but, at this point I`m kind of hoping we can come up with a fundamental change to the way it works while keeping the intention of what they were trying to accomplish. <br /><br />Just wanted to see other thoughts and ideas on it. Make sure we keep it constructive regardless <img src="/images/smilies/smile.gif" alt="Smile" />

Bigstomp 10-26-2018 07:57 PM

My thoughts are either<br /><br />A. Tune the fail so that it can be healed through but is clearly punishing, so that tanks can protect their group from it but, if they fail the healer can still handle it with their emergency heals and what not.<br /> <br />B. Make it so the ability can essentially be cast regardless of circumstance (Thus making it only punishing if you hit the ability at the wrong time or fail to do so)<br /> <br />C. Make it so that there is no reuse, so the tanks have to monitor the duration of the spell. So for example if it has a 30-second duration and no recast. You waste time by spamming it every second but, since you need it up you need to keep track of it to maximize DPS and survivability. This would also make the job of making sure every mob has an alert system less of a necessity helping development time of mobs I believe. <br /> <br />D. Make the abilities AOE blockable so that if the tank fails there are other methods to counter that fail that require teamwork and communication. <br /> <br />Just four different thoughts I had about it.

Ingerimm 10-27-2018 01:00 PM

<div align="left"><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">Here I can only speak again.</span></span></span></div><div align="left"><br /></div><div align="left"><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">For one thing, no one seems to have really tested how this new game mechanic works, on the other hand, there are good reasons why it is introduced.</span></span></span></div><div align="left"><br /></div><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">Let's start with the points from Bigstomp.</span></span></span><br /><div align="left"><br /></div><ol><li><div align="left"><span style="font-family: 'arial'"><span style="color: #004000">C<span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">an Bulwark of Order now be under control effects like stun, s</span></span></span><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">tifle and sear are used. </span></span></span><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">This was adapted to our first hint. </span></span></span><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">Meanwhile, this is even described in the ability to examine these.</span></span></span></span></span></div></li><li><div align="left"><span style="font-family: 'arial'"><span style="color: #004000">W<span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">as reduced more mana consumption, so that it is very rare that one does not have enough mana.</span></span></span></span></span></div></li><li><div align="left"><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">If the damage from now "Chaos Barradge" has been massively reduced, it is now not necessarily deadly, but you have to fight well.</span></span></span></div></li><li><div align="left"><span style="font-family: 'arial'"><span style="color: #004000">I<span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">n T1 zones, only 3 people are hit if Bulwark of Order is not casted and T2 is 4 people.</span></span></span></span></span></div></li><li><div align="left"><span style="font-family: 'arial'"><span style="color: #004000">T<span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">he timing is like any tank special you have to adhere to or learn to do it. </span></span></span><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">Or you do not have the courage to be a tank.</span></span></span></span></span></div></li><li><div align="left"><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">Can Bulwark of Order be used paralell to any other ability, they do not lock each other, so you can have a long cast, such as </span></span></span><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">use an Ascension while using Bulwark of Order.</span></span></span></div></li></ol><div align="left"><br /></div><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">The only rakes to Bulwark of Order at the moment are:</span></span></span><br /><ul><li><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">If you really stand at 0 mana, it's a problem, so mana consumption should be reduced to zero.</span></span></span></li><li><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">The ability can be interrupted, this is quite unlikely for a cast time of 0.5 seconds but it can happen, if you do not check the cast and assume that cast is failing, in steady situations that is one tick too much</span></span></span><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">here the ability should be changed so that it can not be interrupted.</span></span></span></li><li><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">There are also mobs with messmerize and charm abilities, no idea if in this addon, but even under these control effects, the ability Bulwark of Order should be castable.</span></span></span></li></ul><div align="left"><span style="color: #222222"><span style="font-size: small"><span style="font-family: 'arial'">Please remain constructive and you really participate in the test before you give judgments and calls or proposes things.</span></span></span></div>

Bigstomp 10-27-2018 07:04 PM

Well your clarifications did remove a bit of the concern I had (I was not aware of some of these changes)<br /> <br />My primary concern is that there are already very few tanks, I can't imagine this will encourage more folks to want to tank but. Possibly I`m wrong maybe, casting an ability on cue in every single fight is what everyone was hoping for so that they could display their CoUrAgE in listening to an act trigger. <br /> <br />All in all its fine, ill adapt to anything they put in the game, ill have to give it another go with the changes you've mentioned, I haven't had much time to beta test, just wanted to try to start a meaningful discussion on this, sounds like it might be much better tuned now.

Makya 10-27-2018 08:40 PM

Another point of failure are lag spikes. Anytime a tight timing mechanic is added with unforgiving consequences (usually in a raid script) it leads to frustration and complaints until the timing is usually adjusted to be well past challenging.<br /> <br />A failure condition of totally killing the group's DPS for a bit would be enough of an incentive to bring a tank but not cause a wipe if there was a failure for whatever reason.

Catterinna 10-30-2018 09:17 AM

good, now you can tank for me and test your Bulwark out!

Xavion 11-09-2018 09:38 AM

i wish it lasted abit longer maybe 12 secs instead of 8

Sigrdrifa 11-09-2018 07:20 PM

<div class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeQuote" data-author="Xavion"> <aside> <div class="attribution type">Xavion said: <a href="index.php?goto/post&id=6528195#post-6528195" class="AttributionLink">↑</a> </div> <blockquote><span class="ae_quote_symbol">“</span><span class="ae_quote_content">i wish it lasted abit longer maybe 12 secs instead of 8</span><span class="ae_quote_symbol">”</span></blockquote> </aside></div>It should really be a permanent buff <img src="/images/smilies/frown.gif" alt="Frown" />


All times are GMT. The time now is 07:36 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
All threads and posts originally from the EQ2 and Station forums operated by Sony Online Entertainment. Their use is by express written permission.