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-   -   Player Studio Instance for ingame item review (https://archive.eq2wire.com//showthread.php?t=686136)

Armous 03-05-2013 02:17 AM

<p>Hello,</p><p>I was wondering if there is a possibility of having an instance where one could load it into the instance to see how it will look in game, and to confirm prior to submitting it, whether everything is as it should be.</p><p>The instance might be like a newbie house room with a few items already in it for size comparison, etc. and once you zone back out, whatevery you put in the instnce is automatically removed from the instance, and/or could not be placed into a backpack to prevent it from being carried into the actual game.</p><p>Thought I'd throw the idea out there, see if it floats or sinks to the bottom <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Thanks.</p>

Eden_Evergreen 03-05-2013 10:46 AM

<p>That sounds like a cool idea, and it would be helpful in many ways.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>However, until it happens...</p><p>... there is already a free program that will allow you to to see if things are roughly as they should be. (Note: this free 3D program is *not* associated with SOE.)</p><p>This free 3D rendering program (it can do a lot else also, but for the purpose you just requested, it does that):</p><p><a href="http://www.daz3d.com/software/daz-studio-4" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.daz3d.com/software/daz-studio-4</a></p><p>After installing and opening (running) DAZ|Studio, you can use "import" to get the .obj into the "scene" viewing area. You can then select the .obj in the "scene" tab, and then go to the "surfaces (color)" tab and select the 3 .tga's that apply to the .obj (it has places where you can load diffuse [color] map, specular map, and normal map).</p><p>DAZ|Studio has assorted lighting presets, or you can create your own lighting. You can also rotate the "camera" (your point of view) all around the item, to see how it appears at all angles (and to double-check that you didn't leave any parts of the texture unpainted, for example).</p><p>This procedure allows you to "preview" the item with its textures. The viewscreen gives a fair preview, but a render is better.</p><p>When you choose an angle you think best shows off your item, Ctrl+r will render it for you - handy for making those "screenshot" images that PlayerStudio requires for its submissions. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> You can actually orbit around the item and render it as many times as you wish, and then pick the best result for your screenshot preview.</p><p>If you wish to check for human-relatable scaling, go through the content library tab in DAZ|Studio and find Genesis. You don't have to morph or texture that human-esque figure -- just load it, to see how any other item compares for size.</p><p>Or else load any of the sample .obj's that SOE provides for scale-comparison purposes instead of Genesis. All 3 games that currently have PlayerStudio active use the same scale - approximately 6 feet tall for humans.</p><p>If you need or want to resize your item, you can do that using the "parameters" tab.  Then delete Genesis from the scene (use the scene tab, right click genesis, select "delete from scene") and then export your .obj from DAZ and it *should* adjust the size to match how the .obj appears in DAZ -- and that without changing the UV map or anything else except the size.</p><p>DAZ is very useful as a previewer, even if you don't have any interest in exploring that format for other artwork. It can even do some very simple, basic modeling, but not as well as dedicated modeling programs.</p><p>If someone already has a Poser, it can do all of the above functions (and more) also (though with different human figures). However, Poser is *not* free.</p><p><a href="http://www.contentparadise.com/productDetails.aspx?id=17194" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.contentparadise.com/prod...s.aspx?id=17194</a></p><p><a href="http://www.contentparadise.com/productDetails.aspx?id=19248" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.contentparadise.com/prod...s.aspx?id=19248</a></p><p><a href="http://www.contentparadise.com/productDetails.aspx?id=19256" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.contentparadise.com/prod...s.aspx?id=19256</a></p><p>If all you really want is to preview your item and perhaps do a screenshot of how it might look in game, I'd recommend the free program instead. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Hopefully that information may help someone!</p><p>Happy arting. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Armous 03-05-2013 12:40 PM

<p>Thanks for the suggestion.  I've had prior DAZ and Poser applications on older computers, I never really got into using either one very much, so I didn't install them on this computer.</p><p>Since you suggest DAZ for the purposes indicated, I'm going to install it and give it a try.</p><p>Thanks for your helpful ideas.</p><p>Best regards,</p>

Realmling 03-05-2013 01:11 PM

<p>Correct me if I'm wrong, I've used 3dsmax for so long I don't really keep up with other modeling apps - but you should be able to do a quick preview render right there in your modeler without having to go to another app. That's the easiest way to see that something is off and be able to fix it right away for me anyway.</p><p>Another way would be to go into an empty house, take some screen shots of the walls/floors and load them as quick textures onto some simple planes set up in the same scene as your object. Render everything and use that as a way to estimate how your model might look in the game environment. It's not a perfect solution, but it is an option that's rather quick and easy to slap together.</p><p>If you go the Daz/Poser route, I have some simple room props that don't take long to slap a new texture on to render in a faux game environment. Toon Rooms 1 and 2 share the same template, so the same texture can be used for both (just to save time and use something already put together).</p><p><a href="http://www.realmofsavage.com/Poser_downloads.htm" target="_blank">http://www.realmofsavage.com/Poser_downloads.htm</a></p><p><img src="http://www.realmofsavage.com/previews/Troom_1.jpg" width="500" height="431" /></p><p><img src="http://www.realmofsavage.com/previews/toonroom_2.jpg" width="700" height="408" /></p><p>There's another larger room here -- <a href="http://www.realmofsavage.com/holiday/Bxmas08_2.htm" target="_blank">Toon Room 3</a></p>

Armous 03-07-2013 03:04 PM

<p>I downloaded the DAZ program as you suggested.  I have a bunch of stuff that the DAZ 3D install manager downloaded, but that happened before I had the program installed, so when I open the program, there are no items to work with.  Anyway, I'm not sure I want to spend a lot of time learning a new program just so I can view what I've created in an environment that isn't an EQ2 environment.  Why EQ2?  Because of their lighting and other elements unique to their environment, which in order to get the same appearance in another program, would have to be matched pretty closely.</p><p>Within Blender, I can view, render the items I create, and how they appear has a lot to do with lighting set up and camera placement.  Bringing an item into an existing EQ2 environment would allow one to observe how it looks within that environment.</p><p>If I was to create an environment which matched what EQ2 is set up to be, I'd need a lot of technical information to enable me to do that.  Since I'm a newbie at all this, I'm not sure I'm up to the task of building an environment of my own, (although it might be fun and a geat learning experience.)</p><p>I guess I will put my attention on creating something that meets their guildline information, however limited and broad that is.  If I ever get anything accepted, I will find out that way how similar or different it looks within the game. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>BTW, In looking at the DAZ program, I can see how to import items, but didn't get much further than that.</p>

Eden_Evergreen 03-07-2013 09:44 PM

<p>Hmm. Not all modeling programs have rendering options. Since I am unfamiliar with Blender, I did not know it included that option.</p><p>Yes, I realize that lighting is a key factor, and that replicating EQ2's in a separate program would be tricky. Still, some kind of rendering program seemed better than none - and DAZ's UI is pretty clearly labeled.</p><p>I figured that if *this* "old dog" (meaning myself) could learn that "new trick," then probably anybody who's determined could use the tutorials or otherwise figure it out also.</p><p>I had tried to give an outline of what to do in my prior post, but since you found another way to accomplish your immediate goal, I won't make a tutorial you won't use. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Happy arting! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Reliquary 03-08-2013 12:31 AM

<p>the following was posted my Mini in another thread, wrt blender;</p><p><p style="font-family: verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif; color: #333333; background-color: #e5e5e5;">You can load in the normal and spec maps the same way you load in your diffuse map. Basically add another texture map under your difffuse texture. On the Image type (clouds is defualt) click image or movie. Then under the Image tab click the open button and load in your normal map. After that, click on normal map under the Image Sampling tab. Under the Mapping tab you want to change "Generated" to UV. Lastly, under the Influence tab, deselect color(under Diffuse) and select Nor(Under Geometry). You basically reapeat those steps with the spec map with a few exceptions. You will not want to select normal under the sampling tab and you will want to deselect color(under diffuse) and select intensity(under Specular) in the influence tab.</p><p style="font-family: verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif; color: #333333; background-color: #e5e5e5;">The game shaders will ultimately decide how the item looks in game but I have found that using the Blinn type specular material setting(under the material tab next to the texture tab) to be pretty close. You can also use the Toon specular setting but then you have to crank it waaaay down or else things will look overly shiny. Oh, and you will want to turn the materials specular intensity to zero once the spec map is loaded(under the material tab next to the texture tab).</p><p style="font-family: verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif; color: #333333; background-color: #e5e5e5;">I realize the above probably sounds complicated but it really isnt. Do a search on youtube for blender texture mapping and you will get tons of great video examples</p></p><p>This is good advice.   basically; download the samples then use the program of your choice.  tinker with the render settings until you approximate the game.  </p>

Realmling 03-08-2013 01:04 PM

<p>I think I'd go nuts if my modeling app didn't have some way to render what I was making... (specially since I don't remember which box my Poser disk is in to install on my new machine right now..and I need to get that going for some painting renders /sigh).</p><p>No, the environments wouldn't match 100%, but by using screen captures from the game you can get close enough if you want to put the effort in. That's up to you as far as wanting to preview your items in that way. Which may be the route you'll have to go for right now if it's something you really really really want to see. Because once the background elements and lighting and all that are setup, you can save that file and simply open it and bring in your models every time you want to preview something.</p><p>I've done it in the past to match renders of scantly clad dark elves to screen shots of EQ1 Neriak in the background. Not as hard as it sounds, and if you can teach yourself Blender or another modeling app, you can easily learn Poser/Studio - specially with the wealth of tutorials and resources that already exists for both apps. Lighting, materials settings, render settings - they're only as scary as you allow them to be.</p><p>Camera is less to worry about than lighting and material/render setup, because people are in control of their own cameras and will look at an item from all directions (some you probably don't even think to plan for too).</p><p>Or you can just make your model the best it can be and as long as it looks fine in a standard preview render, you'll probably be good to go regardless of everything else.</p><p>Because there isn't a catch all generic EQ2 environment. Neriak isn't the same as Gorowyn - nor Kelethin - nor any other place - etc,etc,etc. Are you going to request a testing environment that encompasses the entire available game environment? Call me whatever you will (I've been called all sorts of lovely things, I'm used to it), but I don't really see them wasting time and resources on something like this.</p><p>Not when we ourselves can put out a little effort and make a passable faux game environment if we really want to. /shrug</p>

Mini 03-08-2013 01:42 PM

<p>I could wrong, but I'm under the impression that the game engines do not use a global shader. So, creating an environment for people's submissions isn't really possible because every object/landscape/character gets its own unique shader settings applied to it. I'm guessing the shaders have a wide variety of options and that the SoE art/design team then applies settings that they feel are appropriate based on the submitted screenshot/texture maps. So, in other words, the game engine has no idea how to render a submitted object until shaders and their settings are applied.</p><p>Blender, for instance, has 5 different diffuse and specular shaders in the render engine. Each of these has its own settings and delivers a specific look. I assume EQ/EQ2/etc work in a similar manner but with unique shaders created specifically for that game. In the case of EQ, the shaders were probably coded some 14 years ago. So they may not have all the bells and whistles of the newer 3D modeling programs.</p><p>Edit: For those using blender, I suggest using the GLSL shader setting found in the flyout menu when clicking "n" in the 3D viewport(under Display). I think the default setting is multitexture. You will also want the shading style to be "Texture" as it is "Solid" by default. The GLSL shader setting basically applies all the texture map information (diffuse/normal/specular) to the model, live, right in the 3D viewport. So you shouldn't even need to render out files because you are seeing changes as they are made.</p><p>I decided to take a few screenshots inside Blender to show those new to the program some basic settings for the 3 texture maps...Enjoy!</p><p><img src="http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8096/8539166785_c6500d580f_b.jpg" width="1024" height="756" /></p>

Covic 03-11-2013 02:57 PM

<p>I would really not worry to much about refining your asset based on a lighting and environment situation.  Our game has a lot of different environments all with unique settings.  Just focus on making in look good in whatever program you and using and it should be fine. </p><p>Dave</p>

Cakvala 03-11-2013 05:20 PM

<p>From old screenshots ive seen from Everquest Dev team, majority of the stuff in EQ was designed in 3D Studio max (that includes the characters from the Luclin revamp)</p><p>Any item ive made for EQ has translated to almost exactly what is shown in game, thankfully.</p>

MasterMagnus 03-12-2013 01:09 PM

<p>Thanks Mini!  After bumbling around and researching I'm using the same type of setup to view normal and spec maps in place.</p><p>It actually does seem pretty intuitive, but it's so nice of you to make an image that shows all the settings in detail.  Kudos-</p>

Eden_Evergreen 03-13-2013 09:00 PM

<p>Intriguing...</p><p>Someone wrote a free script to export DAZ scenes for rendering in Blender.</p><p>(Link goes to DAZ forums, viewable without sign-in)</p><p><a href="http://www.daz3d.com/forums/viewthread/2877/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.daz3d.com/forums/viewthread/2877/</a></p><p>Had I seen that earlier, I'd have known Blender could render.  <img src="/station/images/smilies/499fd50bc713bfcdf2ab5a23c00c2d62.gif" border="0" /></p>

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