Tanking and Soloing

[uzhiel feathered serpe]

<div><p>BTW, i feel kinda betrayed right now, since I did nothing but stand up for Evasion tanks for the LONGEST time..because i see crap like this:</p><p><a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=6&message.id=30514" target="_blank">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=6&message.id=30514</a></p><p>Now, most of you who know me are aware that I post in favor of all classes to get fixed, but this one rankles deep. Why? because I have heard many times that plate tanks dont need a boost in DPS. I dont mind not being able to solo as well as other chars...but this is ridiculous, specially when evasion tanks are complaining that they need a boost in tanking.</p><p>Now, we get our ancient pledge line nerfed..sweet. ..but as you can see from the link above it seems the Devs have a real skewed and biased way of determining tanking solo ability. For those of you who are confused, check out whats going on with our Ancient Pledge line.</p><p>Sigh. Guards ate it too with their parry buff. What is up with the plate tank hate? How about fixing our DPS instead of nerfing our buffs?</p><p> </p><p> </p></div>

[JudyJudy]

<div></div><p><em>Don't worry, friend.  We just got a royal solo nerf.  As you know, us fighters cannot cast our "protection buff" on our pets and/or group members then disband.  We have to be in group with them at all times for it to be active.</em></p><p><em>This takes away 10+ deflection for the solo'ist.  This, in case you don't know, is the largest factor in determining our avoidance.</em></p>

[Arraza]

<div>I'm a n00b pali, but if you are soloing cant you just summon a squire and cast it on him?  Won't be online till later tonight so I cant try it out.</div>

[Crib92]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Wintermute218 wrote:<div>I'm a n00b pali, but if you are soloing cant you just summon a squire and cast it on him?  Won't be online till later tonight so I cant try it out.</div><hr></blockquote>The point of this thread is that with LU21 you can no longer do that. :smileywink:

[Arraza]

<div>Ah... well.... then.... ah.... hmmmm... I guess I have nothing else to add then. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[T1GR]

<div>I have serious issues with this. First off, why even tantalize us with pets? Second, why do I have a "Attack Target" box in my pet window? The ONLY useful reason for having a pet is that buff and they take even that away. Can they un-nerf Pally pets so they have a function in life? Even if its to take aggro or something....</div>

[Wargod1968]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>T1GR wrote:<div>I have serious issues with this. First off, why even tantalize us with pets? Second, why do I have a "Attack Target" box in my pet window? The ONLY useful reason for having a pet is that buff and they take even that away. Can they un-nerf Pally pets so they have a function in life? Even if its to take aggro or something....</div><hr></blockquote>Considering others get to summon a useless holy symbol, make others /dance,  make their hands go on fire, or assume an Ogre illusion, none of which have substantive value in the game, why expect the Squire fluff spell to have amy practical use? Not a flame, I just don't understand why someone would demand utility from a spell type that is intended to have none. :smileyindifferent:

[Gwydion20]

<div></div>Well there's a workaround, i got very upset with this blatant nerf but i've realized that if you cast the buff on someone and then go linkdead when you come back you still have the buff up, at least this is what a pally friend says. Hope it helps. It just gets a little tricky now. I still can't see the point on this nerf.

[ChrisRay]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>JudyJudy wrote:<div></div><p><em>Don't worry, friend.  We just got a royal solo nerf.  As you know, us fighters cannot cast our "protection buff" on our pets and/or group members then disband.  We have to be in group with them at all times for it to be active.</em></p><p><em>This takes away 10+ deflection for the solo'ist.  This, in case you don't know, is the largest factor in determining our avoidance.</em></p><hr></blockquote>Every fighter got hit with this though, <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> So what effects you has definately affected us as well..</span></div>

[JudyJudy]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>ChrisRay wrote:<div><span><blockquote><hr>JudyJudy wrote:<div></div><p><em>Don't worry, friend.  We just got a royal solo nerf.  As you know, us fighters cannot cast our "protection buff" on our pets and/or group members then disband.  We have to be in group with them at all times for it to be active.</em></p><p><em>This takes away 10+ deflection for the solo'ist.  This, in case you don't know, is the largest factor in determining our avoidance.</em></p><hr></blockquote>Every fighter got hit with this though, <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> So what effects you has definately affected us as well..</span></div><hr></blockquote><p><em>Yes, I agree - All of us fighters felt the push on this.  However, as an example bruisers lost a good portion of agility with this fix.  Agility is not very important in determining overall avoidance.  Deflection is the first and foremost attribute used in determining our defining factor in tanking.  This is where the solo monk lost alot of self buffed avoidance (due to the loss of about +10 deflection).</em></p><p><em>I'm sure it's a bit different with each fighter on what attribute was buffed while having this "Protection Buff" active.</em></p><p><em>I will correct myself and restate, however, that this was not a nerf, but a FIX.  I mean c'mon now...  A group protection buff that's used on a pet that isn't there?  Or a ex-group-mate that isn't there?  It was a fix.</em></p><p><span class="time_text"></span> </p><p>Message Edited by JudyJudy on <span class="date_text">03-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">04:10 AM</span></p>

[Crib92]

<div><em><font color="#ff0000">I mean c'mon now...  A group protection buff that's used on a pet that isn't there?  Or a ex-group-mate that isn't there?  It was a fix.</font></em></div><div>I agree 100%.  I think the reactions you are seeing from the Pally community stems from the fact that soloing just sucked as a Pally.  (Before this change)  And blows after the change.  Low DPS classes feel the pain more because we take 10 minutes to kill...and now we are gonna get hit ever so much more.  We survived the DPS nerf with LU13 and we will survive this.</div><div> </div><div>Was it the right thing to do?  Yes. (In December of 2004) </div>

[Kinash]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Crib92 wrote:<div><em><font color="#ff0000">I mean c'mon now...  A group protection buff that's used on a pet that isn't there?  Or a ex-group-mate that isn't there?  It was a fix.</font></em></div><div>I agree 100%.  I think the reactions you are seeing from the Pally community stems from the fact that soloing just sucked as a Pally.  (Before this change)  And blows after the change.  Low DPS classes feel the pain more because we take 10 minutes to kill...and now we are gonna get hit ever so much more.  We survived the DPS nerf with LU13 and we will survive this.</div><div> </div><div>Was it the right thing to do?  Yes. (In December of 2004) </div><hr></blockquote>All I do is solo, so this effects me a lot. I am already sick and tired of getting my butt-whipped by mobs that con green or grey to me!BTW: I don't know if it still works but when I was playing my Ranger, my Hawk saved my butt many times as it is slower than me and would take agro when I was fleeing a mob.The squire... it just stands there! What I would like the spell to do is have the squire serve as a pack-mule for us. Maybe act as a 10 or more slot bag... cause one of the jobs of a squire is to carry all the Knight's crap!</span></div>

[Ultim]

<div></div><p>Well i dont need the buff to solo for starters, however there is a crafty way i have discovered to keep it on even with no one to put it on!  all you have to do is cast it on a group member and then log out!  it worked for me!  i logged in and it was still up (until i died next).</p><p>it might have just been luck however</p>

[Majorminor]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Crib92 wrote:<div><em><font color="#ff0000">I mean c'mon now...  A group protection buff that's used on a pet that isn't there?  Or a ex-group-mate that isn't there?  It was a fix.</font></em></div><hr></blockquote>I'm fine with the "fix" , doesn't bother me one way or another, But maybe they should "fix" the Granting of armament line, it doesn't drop when the group disbands, and that's much more of a hinderance to us when we go to solo and it's still up.

[Tyr]

This was obviously changed for a reason, so if you are logging out or going link dead in order to keep it then you are abusing game mechanics.  I don't think I would advertise that, but better yet, I wouldn't do it in the first place.<div></div>

[Xan]

<DIV>Maybe I just understand the mechanics of the class on a different level.. or its just long term experience from my main in EQ1 being a paladin.. but I keep seeing "soloing sucks, and soloing is slow, our dps sucks" ... I dont see it... I can solo very well and its not slow at all.. Secondly.. I get tired of seein, "Paladins need to step aside to Guardians and Berserkers"... bull.. As a paladin I can hang with the best of em.. its all in how well you understand the aggro mechanics and the such. Ive on more than one occasion been asked to step up and tank over a guardian.. not bashin guards mind you, they are a great class.. but a good player can take a paladin and tank just as well as any other tank class.. and that goes for any class in the end.. a good player can stay in the game as good as anyone else. Ive played every tank class in the game.. I prefer Paladins because they are highly versatile. I personally have a blast soloing or grouped on my paladin.. and have no trouble with "slow soloing".. i slap in my 1hander and shield, go offensive, and blow through mobs.. including heroics. Im not all master1's either.. most of my arts are adept1, minus my taunts and defensive stance, which are adept3's. And I took the master2 of my ward at 44.. Now.. with a good 1hander sword (im using the blade of torment, 39.4 dmg rating i believe), and a good shield (shiny brass shield atm), Going offensive stance, and, I did finally manage to get fully outfitted in ebon vanguard (big ol pain in the [Removed for Content]), I can go into DoF, into sinking sands, and solo very well, and its not slow at all.. Obviously you cant compare a paladins dps to scouts, monks or zerkers.. but play one right and you can get up there... Saying it "sucks" just shows a real lack of puttin forth some effort or being to busy comparing the class to other classes dps.. you cant compare classes.. they all have ups and downs..</DIV> <DIV>As far as grouping/raiding goes.. Im a MT kinda person.. and Ive had no problems doing it on my paladin.. none at all.. at lv 36, I led a 2 group raid on Cauldon Hollow.. not sure how many people have done it.. but that raid can be a royal pain.. but when I went in there.. as tank and led the raid it went down without a hitch. As Ive gained levels and moved up.. I find I can take rather small groups to do things that most say "take more when you go" and do things without little to no difficulty.. Instead of focusin on what you consider to be flaws or faults in a class.. take the best things and turn them into what makes the class a real powerhouse.. cause if you know the class well.. know the mechanics.. and USE everything at your disposal and know how and what to do.. You can make those little "flaws" non-existent.. AND THAT GOES FOR ANY CLASS!!.. </DIV> <DIV>In closing... its the player that really makes the class what it is... focus on what makes the class good.. and you can do anything..</DIV>