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Drax
12-08-2004, 10:44 PM
<DIV>The purpose of this post is to give everyone my personal feelings on the role and purpose of a Shadowknight. I love every ounce of my Shadowknight. Alot of people ask "what is our role in a group"? I for one do not feel anyone in EQ2 has a static role they play each group. I'm going to give you my personal opinion on our roles in various situations, some notes about enhancing my SK gameplay, and a breakdown of some of the important SK spells that make us unique and fun. This guide is also to assure people that I personally do not feel outclassed by other other professions (as many have said "why have an SK if you can have a Guardian and a DPS class?") Welp, heres how I feel about all of that:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><U>Main Tank vs Secondary Tank: The Guardian Debate</U></STRONG></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG>Main Tank</STRONG></DIV> <DIV>I personally find that I can play the role of main tank to IMMENSE success. <EM>Knights Stance</EM> plays a key role in our ability to be a successful primary tank. Upgrading your armor and jewelry can greatly effect our ability to play a main tank in a group. The main concern however is that a Guardian is a better tank than we are and our role in a group is diminished when a Guardian is around. I find this to not be the case. I have more AC and HP's than many Guardians I've grouped with. This, combined with <EM>Knights Stance </EM>and <EM>Vigor of Trust</EM> allows me to tank better than many Guardians. Guardians have many spells that allow them "protect" and enhance a tank (as do we, but I'll move onto that later). Many times its better if I tank and a Guardian buffs me as a Secondary Tank. Do not limit yourself to stepping aside for a Guardian, as this is always not the best choice. This works out best many times because we can hold agro better than Guardians most of the time. This is NOT to say were better than Guardians, but it works out very well when the Shadowknight outclasses the Guardian and has a Guardian protecting him. Remember that Guardian abilities are not solely to increase their tanking power, but to also make another target a better tank. Obviously make sure to cast Demonstration of Faith often to save your healers valuable mana.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG>Secondary Tank</STRONG></DIV> <DIV>When I am outclassed by another tank due to either levels or HP & AC, I can still play an important role in a group as a sub-DPS and tank-enhancer. If a Guardian out-classes me, I often step aside and play the role of the Secondary Tank. I give the Guardian <EM>Vigor of Trust, Offering of Armament, </EM>and <EM>Ancients Pledge</EM>. Intervene isn't a horrible think to throw on there either, though I usually don't go that far. While most SK's immediately dismiss <EM>Offering of Armament</EM> it is actually an amazingly good spell when you're the secondary tank. Remember that if you upgrade these spells, their effects become more noticable. Not only that, but as you level up these spells become more effective on their own as well. I highly suggest you all remember to keep these spells up and your tank WILL love you for it and WILL notice a difference, as will you. Combined with our great ability to taunt, we can pull adds quickly off casters and priests when there isn't an enchanter around to mez. As a Guardian can enhance us, so we too can enhance the primary tank. By all means, do so. We also provide above-average DPS to a group, but more on that later. Obviously, continue to ward him as much as possible. The ammount of HP's youre saving alone through the course of a fight with your ward alone is massive. Count it up one day.</DIV> <DIV><STRONG></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG>When am I primary and when am I secondary when grouped with a Guardian?</STRONG></DIV> <DIV>I normally go with the easiest solution: who has more HP's and who has more AC? Weigh the difference and go from there. Both a Guardian and a Shadowknight can enhance the other, so either way you're going to have an above-average tank.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG>Conclusion of Guardian vs Shadowknight</STRONG></DIV> <DIV>I've heard all too often we become useless when grouped with a Guardian. The idea that they out-tank us seems incorrect to me. Regardless of which tanks, the Guardian or the Shadowknight, we are able to enhance each other to create a bigger, stronger brick wall to protect the group than would have been there previously. If one were to fall, theres another wall to take his place. Because of this, I prefer having a Guardian in my group. My friend and I group regularly and our AC/HP's are so close we often take turns tanking every day. Regardless of who tanks, we are considerably buffed and protected by one another and make for a very, very large wall to protect our priests and DPS classes. Having both in the group seems to create a MUCH better tanking scenario than just one. You are NOT useless with a Guardian as the MT - as you will provide considerable DPS to that group (again, covered later) as well as enhance the Guardian to heights he could not possibly reach alone. Upgrade your protection spells, keep your wards flowing, and keep the buffs on the Guardian and see what happens. Equally, when you're the MT and have a Guardian protecting you notice the difference in your tanking power. I promise you'll see one!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><U></U></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><U>Being the Knight: Saving the Weak</U></STRONG></DIV> <DIV>I'm going to keep this section reletively short as most of us haven't recieved all of our knightly spells yet, but I'll give a short run down of each one and why they prove to be amazing utility spells for the group to have at their disposal.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><EM>Graven Embrace</EM> - This one is a no brainer. The ability to feign death a target is invaluable. I've saved more people with this spell than I can count. It has a very short cast time and effectively erases agro on a single target. The catch is it takes them out of the game for aprox 7 seconds and wipes them clean of non-aura buffs (note: most group buffs are considered auras. this means instead of actually placing the effect on each of the individual group members in which it would have be recast if dropped or erased, the aura is placed on the caster itself which leaks the effect constantly to nearby group members. this means most group buffs that were dropped when a target is feigned is immediately regained when the target stands back up). With only a five minute recast time and no power cost, you can defenitely save mages and priests alike. I've also saved the group from experience death by using Graven Embrace in order to take over the role of tank when the MA was going to die and no priests had power left to heal him. Graven Embrace is invaluable if you use it correctly. The point of the spell is to save your group experience debt, not so much keep you from having a wipe (in my opinion). If a member is going to go down or likely going to go down and can be expended for 7 seconds, assuming they'd live that long anyway, go ahead and feign death them. Also: This spell makes soloing almost too easy. As long as you leave the general area of the MOBs "home", they will not attack you again when you stand back up and will instead stand around and begin to wonder back home.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><EM>Rescue</EM> - The end all taunt. This spell effectively places your hate level 1 point above the highest hated group member. How many times have you came so close to pulling that mob off of the enchanter, if only your taunt would have worked? Now it will. This is our best form of emergency agro control, making sure one monster is off a fellow non-tanking group member. This, combined with <EM>Graven Embrace</EM>, gives us two chances to save individual non-tanking group members. Once by ending all agro on them and another by gaining absolute agro from a single mob.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><EM>Harm Touch</EM> - Our hallmark spell, of course. I would like to note that upgrading this spell is very difficult right now and I agree entirely on this. However, upgrading this spell (as well as simply leveling up) GREATLY increases the effectiveness of it. Unlike EQLive, <EM>Harm Touch</EM> refreshes MUCH faster this time around. Do not be afraid to use it. Often the spell is used only as a last resort when a group wipe appears immenent. Unfortunately, by the time you realize a group wipe is coming theres probably nothing anyone could ever hope to do to actually stop it. I use <EM>Harm Touch</EM> even to generate agro when all other possibilities are exhausted, to quickly take out a pesky healer before he can get a heal off, to save our healers additional mana in a named or difficult fight, and to finish a mob off when agro has been lost by the MT and he can't switch targets around because hes also the MA. This last point is critical, as we've all been in groups that did not use an /assist key but instead targeted the MT and attacked through him. When this is done, the MT cannot switch targets around to regain agro on mobs that are wailing on healers and casters. This is usually my favorite time to fire off a Harm Touch and help quickly dispatch the mob the MT is targeting so he can switch to a more critical mob and regain agro. <EM>Harm Touch </EM>is only useful if you use it and saving it for a time when everyones surely to die is usually the only way to truely waste the spell.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We obviously have other tools, such as Decree of Decay to AE taunt, but these are the main spells that come to mind that make us more likely to keep individual group members alive and help save on debt. I've been commended many times by firing off a <EM>Graven Embrace</EM> at just the right time. Also, as tanks with such unique save spells its often our job to charge into the fray, agro every mob in sight, and clear the way for a spirit shard recovery and then feign ourselves at just the right moment once our group has had time to recover their shards from a nasty area. Again, it feels great when your entire group commends you on your ability to pull this off. While certainly a monk or a bruiser could feign themselves as well, they lack the HP and AC to do so as effectively as us. Plus, our steed gives us a great advantage in speed over most MOBs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><U>Shadowknight DPS</U></STRONG></DIV> <DIV>This is the subject that most gets my goat. Alot of people feel they are not dealing significant DPS. I can only imagine why someone would feel this, but I will give you a few notes and suggestions to increase your overall DPS in a group. First and foremost, equipment in EQ2 plays a VERY important role in your overall effectiveness. While we are somewhat limited in our weapon selection remember that you can switch from shield and 1hander and to a 2hander very easily in EQ2, since often time they use the same skill (Slashing, Crushing). Even keeping both of these skills up is amazingly easy in EQ2. When I'm tanking I use a shield, when I'm not I usually opt for a more powerful 2hander.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Even more realistic than improving your equipment is improving your combat art and spell levels. Many people do not realize the massive difference between an Apprentice I (or even an Apprentice III) and an Adept I or Adept III skill.<EM> Righteous Anger </EM>alone went from 30-35DD to 70ishDD by upgrading to Adept I from Apprentice II. <EM>Grim Coil </EM>also provides EXCELLENT results when upgraded. As most of my skills are at Adept I, I can easily outdamage other tank classes, priest classes, and even keep up with the damage of other typical DPS classes such as Necromancers and Bards. Obviously a Warlock, Wizard, Bruiser, Monk, and Assassin will typically out DPS us - that is usually their job. My experience with rangers is an ironic one and I always find myself out damaging them for whatever reason. I've kept up with some Bruisers and Monks as well. The key here is to upgrade your combat arts and spells and use them as effectively as you know how. Do not dismiss certain abilities because they were weak when you got them. <EM>Righteous Blow </EM>has turned into a hard-hitting 80ish, <EM>Grim Coil</EM> at Apprentice II was doing 32 damage a tick quite quickly, easily equally well over 100 damage in its short period of duration.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Without trying to brag for our class, I think our DPS is almost unreasonable considering how well we tank and how well we stand up to other typical DPS classes. The main thing that has helped me feel quite proud of my character is simply watching the market and the blackmarket (which allows you to buy from Qeynos players by swimming out from the dock in East Freeport and using the Fence on the small island there) and keeping my combat arts and spells up to date. Keeping my general equipment up seems to also hold a fair ammount of increased effeciency.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><U>Solo</U></STRONG></DIV> <DIV>We solo pretty darn well. My normal solo setup is <EM>Fighting Chance</EM> followed by <EM>Righteous Anger</EM> and then finished with <EM>Taunt</EM>. It allows me to deal considerable ammounts of damage with the least ammount of power extended possible. I again use <EM>Righteous Anger</EM> followed by <EM>Faithful Swing</EM> and finished with another <EM>Taunt</EM> or <EM>Shout/Decree of Decay</EM> if I managed to beat <EM>Taunts </EM>timer by too much and need to continue the pounding immediately. Notice that I use<EM> Taunt </EM>here, as it costs less power and the actual taunting does nothing for us in solo combat. Depending on what level <EM>Taunt</EM> and<EM> Inflame </EM>are, I simply would suggest using whichever costs less power for you. Throw in a <EM>Grim Coil, Rightous Blow, </EM>or a <EM>Charge </EM>for good measure while I wait for <EM>Fighting Chance</EM> to recharge if the situation seems like I can expend the additional power. Rinse and repeat! Be sure to keep <EM>Demonstration of Faith</EM> on you at all times possible to very-highly extend the duration of your life. I always begin by buffing myself with the standard tank setup of <EM>Vigor of Trust</EM>, <EM>Knights Stance</EM>, and <EM>Blessed Weapon</EM>. All in all when I solo I find I'm a well enough tank to keep myself alive during solo encounters without any problems and this allows me to deal consistent DPS without extending alot of power to do so. Our DPS is highly dependant on our power, so it's important to make sure you don't run out of it too quickly. Don't be afraid to solo as a Shadowknight, its fun and sometimes gets rid of the stress of pickup groups. Besides, when you're soloing and things go bad you can easily throw down a Graven Embrace as explained earlier and as long as you've moved away from the mobs home-point you can rest assured you won't die.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><U>Unholy Steed (Erm, Pony)</U></STRONG></DIV> <DIV>Okay, I'm not going to get into the entire debate about how our Unholy Steeds sure don't look very unholy. It doesn't bother me too much =). I love my steed for other reasons. While it may not be particularly fast remember that it does allow you to run at a higher speed than if you wern't mounted. In long runs you'll easily beat players that are on foot and using sprint. Plus, when you cross the finish line (or zone line) you'll have all your power and your friend won't (when he finally gets there). This is also important in zones such as Nektulos Forest. You'd be suprised, but you'll outrun all the mobs very quickly without having to expend power to sprint (if you have any power left at that point). The Unholy Steed has assured me to survive when it might not have been possible without it (whether its because I'm hauling butt through a dangerous area with a train to clear a path for my friends, its me trying to reach a specific hazardous area quickly, or me running my tail off because Graven Embrace is down). It might not be super-cool looking, but it IS very effective. The speed might not be stallion, but its much faster than trying to sprint there and wasting power. Use your steed, love your steed. Don't be dissapointed in its looks - we might get it upgraded someday be it by leveling, questing, or by patch. Until then, enjoy the benefits it gives now.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><U>Conlusion</U></STRONG></DIV> <DIV>I find us to be a very versatile and valuable class to any group. We perform exceptional DPS, can tank like the best of them, and can even provide valuable when being the secondary tank simply because we can help keep group members alive in trying times - not to mention with our buff spells we can increase the overall effeciency of the main tank to great success. I love my Shadowknight and I don't feel [Removed for Content] at ALL. Many people have expressed they feel out of place when another tank is around or outclassed in tanking and in DPS. I don't find this to be the case at all. I feel very valuable and love my Shadowknight and feel I provide alot to a group. Your thoughts? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <P>Edited to make minor corrections to spelling and to clarification of Solo chapter.</P><p>Message Edited by Draxis on <span class=date_text>12-08-2004</span> <span class=time_text>03:00 PM</span>

norkk
12-08-2004, 11:09 PM
Great post. Alot of ideas in there Im going to try.

TehEvilTro
12-08-2004, 11:14 PM
<DIV>Great post indeed!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I wanted to point out that Knight's Stance is kinda tricky when soloing.  Since it takes from offense to up defense, it basically allows you to try and outlast the nasty at the sake of losing precious DPS.  Maybe with a high AC it won't matter much.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Depending on the mob of course, I try and avoid using it.  If I can tell that I am not going to last the fight, I'll kick it off and run.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Keep in mind I'm only lvl 20 though, and I don't have uber loot just yet.  I'm using my SK sword and a sub-par sheild.  Maybe the 2-handed SKs find it useful. </DIV>

Drax
12-08-2004, 11:53 PM
<DIV>I generally use a Skullcrusher + Stormshield while soloing (although I have a better 1hander, I can't equip it yet). I use knights stance personally simply because I seem to do more damage from powers than from simply hitting the mob and knights stance seems to have no bearing on the strength of powers and combo's. I basically just do combo's over and over while extending the least ammount of power as I can to do them, while remaining entirely defensive.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is just my personal strategy - And I believe you are 100% currect that your equipment could defenitely make a huge difference on whats best when you solo. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Defenitely would love to hear yourself and others go about soloing so we can find out what truely works best. So far thats just what seems to work best for me, I'm sure theres other if not superior ways to go about it <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

Azaz
12-08-2004, 11:59 PM
<DIV>We really do make a good primary tank and seconday assists, pulling add off healers and casters or holding aggro like Draxis rightly points out. The only differnce I can see at present between both ourselves and Guardians is their abilty to hold a much better shield thus improving their AC by a great deal. I think our taunts and self buffs combined with our abilty to cast some pretty effective dots (Grim coil at adept 1 is cool) helps out any group. If we use our class to the best of its abilites, finding a nice balance between the skills available to us we will push aside the myth that we are a sub-par tank class and should only be considered second to Guardians. Besdes our name is far cooler than the other tanks :smileyvery-happy:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Very nice post by the way Draxis</DIV>

Roland_Descha
12-09-2004, 12:30 AM
<DIV>by far the one of the best post on our class that i have ever seen (sony's site included) thx alot for the info, as someone who just dinged this gives me alot to think about and some tactics that appear to work as supposed to trying to just figure the class out on my own.</DIV>

IBSomnifer
12-09-2004, 12:51 AM
Rescue does not work as properly as you suggest. I has done abolustely nothing for me in the past when trying to regain agro.

Drax
12-09-2004, 12:56 AM
<DIV>Thank you all so much for the great feedback. Glad some of the information was found useful to y'all <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As for rescue: Was it changed (or bugged) that we don't know about since release/beta?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'll try to get more input on rescue and update the post in the near future.</DIV>

DUNN
12-09-2004, 01:24 AM
<DIV>Nice post and i agree our dps is very nice.  Ya it was not to par when you become a SK but as you progress those upgrades make a difference.  I am noticing that mobs are turning to me when i am MA without doing any taunts. So I just hold on specials till the tank gets aggro back.  I can't wait to get more arts and spells.  Hopefully soon i will be the damage machine i was hoping  would be.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Dunnott</DIV> <DIV>SK of Malicious Legion (Guk)</DIV>

Oloo
12-09-2004, 01:27 AM
<DIV><FONT color=#ffffff>Great post maybe a little long winded but good post. I like to say I have found SK as a very good solo class. I also served as a MT for my very small guild and have not had much problems as long as I pull I can build the hate up on my from the get go. </FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Butcherblock: Oloo</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

Koobkno
12-09-2004, 01:45 AM
<DIV>Just wanted to say great post, a good read for any unfaithful SK's you may find. (Im not one of em, I love my SK)</DIV>

ChaosImbu
12-09-2004, 01:49 AM
Another important element to maximizing DPS is proper timing and use of powers. I've seen many players go OOM early in a fight because they spam all of their powers early. It's much better for your DPS to use your best powers and space them out over the fight. Instead of blowing your wad early, maximize your use of HOs and hit with the heavy hitting spells more often over the course of the entire fight.

swampthing
12-09-2004, 02:17 AM
Good post. Definately sums up the SK class well. I personally couldn't be happier how i stack up to other classes. I definately never feel like a paper bag and my DPS is where i'd expect it to be.My only complaint with the SK is the lack of anything to make him feel like a SK, ie. evil and opressive. The horse is a joke appearance wise compared to the paladin. I just saw my first paladin horse the other night and was quite ticked, theirs is head and shoulders above ours in relation to fitting their class.

IBSomnifer
12-09-2004, 02:32 AM
I love SK...it was my first and only character I've made. One of the major issues I feel needs to be addressed is the random outcomes of our HOs. Starting and finishing our halmark HO yields like 3 different outcomes 2 different DDs...and 1 AoE dd. This can lead to some very dangerious situations, due to agro and breaking mezz. This leaves me with the "spam abilities" option for my dps. While others can safely continue their massive dps HOs. I can't even safely complete other classes HOs for fear of a AoE dd.Anyone have other opinions about this?<p>Message Edited by IBSomnifer on <span class=date_text>12-08-2004</span> <span class=time_text>04:32 PM</span>

Frostborne
12-09-2004, 02:48 AM
<blockquote><hr>IBSomnifer wrote:I love SK...it was my first and only character I've made. One of the major issues I feel needs to be addressed is the random outcomes of our HOs. Starting and finishing our halmark HO yields like 3 different outcomes 2 different DDs...and 1 AoE dd. This can lead to some very dangerious situations, due to agro and breaking mezz. This leaves me with the "spam abilities" option for my dps. While others can safely continue their massive dps HOs. I can't even safely complete other classes HOs for fear of a AoE dd.Anyone have other opinions about this?<p>Message Edited by IBSomnifer on <span class=date_text>12-08-2004</span> <span class=time_text>04:32 PM</span><hr></blockquote>I would suggest backing up to a "clear" area and HO away. That's what I've done. Depends on the radius of the HO I suppose.

VampirePrince
12-09-2004, 04:25 AM
Many thanks for sharing the well written article. Five stars to you for supporting us hardworking Shadowknights and our virtues <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Ancient Pledge or Lucans Pact? Hmm hmm! And HT will be crushed by a higher level spell we get. Hmm! You have to write an even longer article when you gain more levels hehe

Deadjest
12-09-2004, 07:05 PM
<DIV>Well done, congratz  =)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Haruchai</DIV> <DIV>22 Shadow Knight</DIV> <DIV>Highhold</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why can't we be friends till your backs turned and in weapons range.</DIV>

IBSomnifer
12-09-2004, 07:40 PM
frost, In alot of cases you cannot back up away from mobs. You don't want to agro more mobs. Also any non kos mobs wandering around you will join the fight when you use a HO around them when it aoes'.

Kanfo
12-09-2004, 07:43 PM
<blockquote><hr>Frostborne wrote:<blockquote><hr>IBSomnifer wrote:I love SK...it was my first and only character I've made. One of the major issues I feel needs to be addressed is the random outcomes of our HOs. Starting and finishing our halmark HO yields like 3 different outcomes 2 different DDs...and 1 AoE dd. This can lead to some very dangerious situations, due to agro and breaking mezz. This leaves me with the "spam abilities" option for my dps. While others can safely continue their massive dps HOs. I can't even safely complete other classes HOs for fear of a AoE dd.Anyone have other opinions about this?<p>Message Edited by IBSomnifer on <span class=date_text>12-08-2004</span> <span class=time_text>04:32 PM</span><hr></blockquote>I would suggest backing up to a "clear" area and HO away. That's what I've done. Depends on the radius of the HO I suppose.<hr></blockquote>The three results of our solo HO'sSky Cleave - Instant DD. Seems to scale with the max hp's of a mob, so better against tougher foes.Crushing Anvil - Instant encounter DD. This will ONLY hit mobs in the encounter. You're safe to use it unless you have an enchanter mezzing.Hero's Armor - 3:00 duration ac buff. Yummy.You're safe to HO away while soloing. The AE isn't a real aoe, it just hits every mob in the encounter you're engaged with.

_Baal_
12-09-2004, 08:09 PM
<DIV>its good to finally read something good about our class. not that i didnt know we were good to begin with.</DIV>

Drax
12-09-2004, 09:10 PM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kanfoxy wrote:<BR>The three results of our solo HO's<BR><BR>Sky Cleave - Instant DD. Seems to scale with the max hp's of a mob, so better against tougher foes.<BR>Crushing Anvil - Instant encounter DD. This will ONLY hit mobs in the encounter. You're safe to use it unless you have an enchanter mezzing.<BR>Hero's Armor - 3:00 duration ac buff. Yummy.<BR><BR>You're safe to HO away while soloing. The AE isn't a real aoe, it just hits every mob in the encounter you're engaged with.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>This is correct from my experience. The Crushing Anvil HO only nail mobs in the encounter, so you're okay when soloing. His problem with it was with an encounter with mezed mobs, in which I believe it would break mez - therefor I don't HO when we have a mezer in the group - just to be safe. If you have an experienced rogue, they could flip the HO away from Crushing Anvil - however if its a bad roll, you may get stuck with it.</DIV>

Poena_De
12-09-2004, 11:16 PM
<DIV>Very good post Draxis.  I completely agree with everything you posted.  I actually grouped with a Guardian last night and we were switching off tanking.  He would pull and tank for about an hour and then I would fill the spot, kept us both sharp and entertained killing giants.  I think too many people quickly dismiss the idea of having two "tanks" and are quite apt to embrace the idea of "Guardians only please."</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks for informing everyone!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

Zoradan
12-10-2004, 02:07 AM
<DIV>Nice work, good thought to.</DIV>

Drax
12-11-2004, 12:57 AM
<DIV>Thanks everyone! Glad people agree with me. Thought a fresh look into the SK would do us all good <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

switchdoc
12-11-2004, 03:09 AM
<DIV>Copied. Printed. Into my EQ2 folder. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Nice guide!!</DIV>

Drax
12-11-2004, 06:36 PM
<DIV>Hehe switchdoc =)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm going to likely make some updates, since alot of tactics mentioned above can be improved upon a bit as you level. My soloing tactics have changed a bit with Fetid Grasp, as I alternate between Righteous Anger and Fetid Grasp to a much more effective degree.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks for the feedback y'all - If anyone has any SK ideas, tactics, or general thoughts feel free to post them. Glad alot of us like our class =P</DIV>

za
12-13-2004, 11:33 AM
<DIV>oops <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> multi post</DIV><p>Message Edited by zato on <span class=date_text>12-12-2004</span> <span class=time_text>11:11 PM</span>

za
12-13-2004, 11:33 AM
<DIV>and again -=((((((((((</DIV><p>Message Edited by zato on <span class=date_text>12-12-2004</span> <span class=time_text>11:11 PM</span>

za
12-13-2004, 12:13 PM
<DIV> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff>Hello all.  Currently I am a 32 sk, and im loving it. lets go through a few things.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></SPAN> </P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff>soloing - very easy, no I don't have a ton of dps, but I'm not bad.  With decrepit slam, grim sword, condemning smite, fetid grasp, grim coil, painbringer, and charge.  I can solo a low ^^ green without a problem, I currently use the Ebon Eye War Maul when going solo instead of a shield and my feysteel flamberge and a shield.... soloing these ^^ and groups of two ^ mobs is actually quite easy, since they RARELY hit me.  Lucan’s Pact makes the difference, it only raises my defense a few points but it makes me a dodgeing parrying blocking machine, so the offense we give up to use it is WELL worth it, you can't solo unless you have it up in my opinion....</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></SPAN> </P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff>grouping - were great... right now at 32 my guardian ogre guild mate has me by about 300 hps at the same lvl and with the same gear.... but it doesn't really matter, because 2500 fully buffed for me to 2800 for him doesn't show a big difference.  Not sure yet how this will be in the future, where at 50 with equal gear he would probably have me by 500-600 hps, but even then that’s less than 1 special attack from a monster at that lvl.  As far as taunting, were great at it, any skilled player shouldn't have any trouble keeping the single mob on them instead of the group, this changes though when fighting an encounter that has 4+ monsters, I sometimes lose aggro to the healer since Decree of Decay has a fairly long recast time.  That on top of the fact that when using decree of decay it only seems to taunt the monsters near you, when pulling a group of goblins that has a caster or two in the back, they cast on me 1 or 2 times before they run to me while the fighters in their group will rush me right away, so when I use area effect taunt early and the casters haven't hit my range yet they sometimes go after the shammy or cleric healing me, or if I wait till the casters of the encounter reach me sometimes the fighters that rushed in 1st have jumped on the healer.... kind of annoying but I don't see a real fix other than making the area taunt hit the whole encounter regardless of distance... When aggro is lost though I can usually get it back fairly quick by spamming damage skills and warding the target, using graven embrace is always a last resort because of the buff loss but them having to recast is better than having debt so I say always use it if you need it.<SPAN>  </SPAN>Berserkers are my enemy ^_^ but only because I can’t hold aggro off of them when they use their berserk ability….. I know their not out damaging the rangers or casters but for the life of me I can’t get the monsters to stay on me… so the only thing to do is to have them NOT use their special ability, which sucks because then there is no reason to have them in the group if their just using normal attacks… or have them tank and have me go full dps, which also sucks because I don’t hold a candle to any of the real dps classes.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></SPAN> </P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff>Problems - rescue, this is useless, I have tried it MANY times since getting it and it rarely pulls aggro from whoever is betting beat on… Maybe 25% of the time it works as intended… which isn’t acceptable for us trying to save a mage or priest…<SPAN>  </SPAN>I really want my undead form from Lucan’s Pact but im sure the devs know about it by now since I have seen many people mention it on the boards.<SPAN>  </SPAN>The consume vitae spell doesn’t heal us enough, paladins heal themselves for a few hundred damage at this lvl yet my consume vitae spell at adept 1 hits for ~120 damage and heals me for about half of that… so a 60 point heal doesn’t exactly save my but when I catch barrages and sneak attacks for 600 damage. <SPAN> </SPAN>Our horse doesn’t exactly inspire fear but for a fun spell, I think its pretty bad **mods 4 teh win!!1!**, I would much rather have my little pony than the ability to make someone bow, so no complaints there… I would like the ability to pay to have a better undead pony, even if I had to pay MORE than other players buying normal horses to get a special shadow knight horse like everyone has been suggesting…</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></SPAN> </P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff>Overview – I really love my class.<SPAN>  </SPAN>I wouldn’t mind doing a bit more damage but I understand that I shouldn’t out damage a monk or berserker because we do tank better…<SPAN>  </SPAN>I love the role of leader in the group and main tank usually allows me that, deciding what we do and where we go.<SPAN>  </SPAN>The best groups as I have seen consist of us for main tank, a healer or two, or an enchanter and a healer, and the rest scout / mage dps classes… I don’t invite other fighters into the group unless there is no more actually dps classes available, not to be mean to anyone, but even with a 2 handed wep f my lvl and going full out on attacks we pale in comparison to a mage hitting for 400+ or a rogue hitting for 800+ and while monks and berserkers are better than me, its only small difference.<SPAN>  </SPAN>For what we are there for though, we excel.<SPAN>  </SPAN>I can’t wait to lvl up some more and see what else we get to do =D.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></SPAN> </P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></SPAN> </P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff>kinda long I know, I ramble sometimes O=('.'Q)</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></SPAN> </P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#ffffff>Lurin</FONT></SPAN></P></DIV>

Kulleras_Ogre
12-13-2004, 09:27 PM
<DIV>Great post here, but I think we left out one very important factor.....food and drink. I know it's been said a thousand times that food and drink affects your "out of combat" regeneration of hp and power, but use some higher level food and watch your bars during a fight. It will affect your combat regeneration as well!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also as "tanks" we need to start pushing the assist key issue. At higher levels it is going to become very necessary for the tank to switch targets to maintain full aggro. If we start insisting that our groups use the assist keys now it's going to be less of a problem later.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Another topic is HOs, who is using them in groups? I have tried many times to get the groups I'm in to use them and every time the topic just peters out. HOs are an effective tool that we as players don't seem to be using as effectively as we should. The devs have include these into the equation on some of the higher level encouters so they're lack of use is going to become a problem.</DIV>

Trixst
12-14-2004, 02:20 AM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> TehEvilTroll wrote:<BR> <DIV>Great post indeed!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I wanted to point out that Knight's Stance is kinda tricky when soloing.  Since it takes from offense to up defense, it basically allows you to try and outlast the nasty at the sake of losing precious DPS.  Maybe with a high AC it won't matter much.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Depending on the mob of course, I try and avoid using it.  If I can tell that I am not going to last the fight, I'll kick it off and run.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Keep in mind I'm only lvl 20 though, and I don't have uber loot just yet.  I'm using my SK sword and a sub-par sheild.  Maybe the 2-handed SKs find it useful. </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <P>Since no one has responded to this, I thought I should. </P> <P></FONT> </P> <P>The effects of Knight's Stance are as such:</FONT></P> <P></FONT> </P> <P>It raises your defense / shield skills while lowering your crushing / slashing skills.  In the end, this means that you will be hit less often and potentially hit a mob less often.  But when you hit, whether it's with or without Knight's Stance, you will still hit for the same amount.  I pretty much swear by it when soloing as I can use Call to Arms to re-raise my slashing / crushing skill back to the regular level.</FONT></P> <P></FONT> </P> <P></FONT> </P>