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View Full Version : Loot tables need to be worked on


Larcain
11-15-2011, 05:32 PM
<p>This may be redundant (though I haven't  seen another thread in at least a month) but these loot tables need to be fixed. In looking at the Xanadu loot database, it appears as though in almost every case in the Drunder zones, every name there drops 4ish fighter, 3ish scout, 1 healer, 1 mage.</p><p>Anecdotally, this plays out. In my raid alliance, every.single. priest has some 25 raids worth of dkp built up, with almost nothing to spend it upon. The mages are almost as bad. Either we have the worlds worst luck, or something is messed up.</p><p>I know it sounds like whining..but kitting out someone's 32nd alt fighter is not exactly fun.</p><p>The thread that I saw was quite a bit ago, where I think (I'm old and forget stuff) I remember it being said that this would be addressed. No offense but, glaciers move too, it is just hard to tell.</p>

Greenmist
11-15-2011, 07:16 PM
<p>Yep.</p>

Onorem
11-15-2011, 07:22 PM
<p>My experience is that healers are cutthroat, scouts are backstabbers, mages look for specific opportunities, and tanks roll on the lowest required bid.</p><p>Smartloot doesn't work. Raid balance is off. Changing loot tables doesn't fix the actual problem.</p>

Larcain
11-17-2011, 02:01 PM
<p><cite>Onorem wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>My experience is that healers are cutthroat, scouts are backstabbers, mages look for specific opportunities, and tanks roll on the lowest required bid.</p><p>Smartloot doesn't work. Raid balance is off. Changing loot tables doesn't fix the actual problem.</p></blockquote><p>I'm not certain how personality traits have to do with loot drop tables that show an obvious disparity in class drops, but okay.</p>

Banditman
11-17-2011, 02:35 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I'm not certain how personality traits have to do with loot drop tables that show an obvious disparity in class drops, but okay.</p></blockquote><p>This.  Drunder is definitely out of balance.  There is a thread over in Items and Equipment where the relative drops from each Drunder named are listed out and it's a very clear and very heavy weight in favor of the melee classes.</p>

Nrgy
11-17-2011, 03:36 PM
<p><cite>Banditman wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I'm not certain how personality traits have to do with loot drop tables that show an obvious disparity in class drops, but okay.</p></blockquote><p>This.  Drunder is definitely out of balance.  There is a thread over in Items and Equipment where the relative drops from each Drunder named are listed out and it's a very clear and very heavy weight in favor of the melee classes.</p></blockquote><p>And very short on Sample Size where statistics are involved...</p>

Gaealiege
11-17-2011, 03:42 PM
<p>Statistics?  Are you absurdly trying to say that having 5 fighter drops to the total of 1 mage and 1 priest drop on a mob doesn't necessitate that a fighter item drops more often?</p>

Larcain
11-17-2011, 03:50 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Statistics?  Are you absurdly trying to say that having 5 fighter drops to the total of 1 mage and 1 priest drop on a mob doesn't necessitate that a fighter item drops more often?</p></blockquote><p>Actually, I think he is suggesting that there are healer/mage items just not reported as dropped in the database. Could be, but I think that would suggest a problem with the drop rate, not the loot tables. Either that, or every. single.raid guild. has really bad luck.</p>

Nrgy
11-17-2011, 03:55 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Statistics?  Are you absurdly trying to say that having 5 fighter drops to the total of 1 mage and 1 priest drop on a mob doesn't necessitate that a fighter item drops more often?</p></blockquote><p>You have esentially conduced a "Random Sample" (that didn't work in your favor) and it is in no way conducive of the randomness of the loot drop event.</p><p>Statistical expedience - For example, include those items readily available or convenient to collect. A choice of small sample sizes, though sometimes necessary, can result in wide confidence intervals or risks of errors in statistical hypothesis testing.</p><p>Out of the multitude of servers and magnitude of players running the event over the longetivity of players running the zone (S*P*Z)... I'm quite certain that sampling SIX events is a touch low to draw conclusions from.  These zones have been run thousands upon thousands of times and although the player base is not privy to the information it would require a much larger sample than you or the other thread has offered, but at least the other thread had many more samplings than this one.  It's witch-hunting for your own misfortune.</p><p> However, if your suggesting that the loot table itself has less of one class gear loaded than other class gear, it would certainly lend itself to statistically drop the gear with a higher presents more often, of course.</p><p>However, if your suggesting that the "balance" of class gear within the loot table is the actual problem, that is basically a compound issue.  #1 you don't know all the loot and #2 you have bad luck on the randomness #3 SOE can't figure out itemization #4 SOE felt that the item distribution as it is, was "balanced" and intended and dependant upon future review.</p><p>So, either you can't /roll well enough ot SOE can't /itemize well enough ... who knows maybe they'll "Look into it"</p>

Larcain
11-17-2011, 04:06 PM
<p><cite>Nrgy wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Statistics?  Are you absurdly trying to say that having 5 fighter drops to the total of 1 mage and 1 priest drop on a mob doesn't necessitate that a fighter item drops more often?</p></blockquote><p>You have esentially conduced a "Random Sample" (that didn't work in your favor) and it is in no way conducive of the randomness of the loot drop event.</p><p>Statistical expedience - For example, include those items readily available or convenient to collect. A choice of small sample sizes, though sometimes necessary, can result in wide confidence intervals or risks of errors in statistical hypothesis testing.</p><p>Out of the multitude of servers and magnitude of players running the event over the longetivity of players running the zone (S*P*Z)... I'm quite certain that sampling SIX events is a touch low to draw conclusions from.  These zones have been run thousands upon thousands of times and although the player base is not privy to the information it would require a much larger sample than you or the other thread has offered, but at least the other thread had many more samplings than this one.  It's witch-hunting for your own misfortune.</p></blockquote><p><shrug> Provide data that is significantly contradictory. 6 events? I was referring to a community database, that in times gone has been both fairly reliable and up to day. My OWN raid alliance was simply an anecdotal representation of the data contained within the database. Drawing a conclusion based on the available data is NOT a witchhunt. It is called "logic", but heck, as I said, I'm old and senile.</p>

Nrgy
11-17-2011, 04:21 PM
<p><cite>Nrgy wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff0000;">However, if your suggesting that the "balance" of class gear within the loot table is the actual problem, that is basically a compound issue.  #1 you don't know all the loot and #2 you have bad luck on the randomness #3 SOE can't figure out itemization #4 SOE felt that the item distribution as it is, was "balanced" and intended and dependant upon future review.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff0000;">So, SOE can't /itemize well enough ... who knows maybe they'll "Look into it"</span></p></blockquote><p>I get it .. you want more Mage Items to drop... who doesn't</p>

Larcain
11-17-2011, 04:33 PM
<p><cite>Nrgy wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Nrgy wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff0000;">However, if your suggesting that the "balance" of class gear within the loot table is the actual problem, that is basically a compound issue.  #1 you don't know all the loot and #2 you have bad luck on the randomness #3 SOE can't figure out itemization #4 SOE felt that the item distribution as it is, was "balanced" and intended and dependant upon future review.</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff0000;">So, SOE can't /itemize well enough ... who knows maybe they'll "Look into it"</span></p></blockquote></blockquote><p>Pretty sure that was the point of suggesting the loot tables need to be re-worked. And yeah, even though I don't raid on a mage, I'd like to kit out our mages more. Killing stuff fast makes it look like I actually know how to heal.</p>