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View Full Version : Please delete the Gears portion of Battlegrounds


BChizzle
03-04-2010, 05:21 AM
<p>That or at least not have us required to do this steaming pile of a zone to get gear.</p>

Novusod
03-04-2010, 05:30 AM
<p>Gears is retareded easy and good AA even if you don't need the gears.</p>

BChizzle
03-04-2010, 05:36 AM
<p><cite>Novusod wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Gears is retareded easy and good AA even if you don't need the gears.</p></blockquote><p>Its too small its too exploitable it is the least fun out of the 3 zones by a huge margin and we are forced to do it for gear.  That is stupid just make it so you get a coin for whatever instance you do and be done with it I seriously hate this zone it is usually 99% lopsided groups and I don't care if it gives more AA.  Sorry but I don't find it fun to stand there wait for a group to come wipe them and stand there and wait for the group to come wipe then and stand there wait for a group to come wipe them.  /yawn  SOE wants feedback, well Gears sucks so don't force me to have to do it 200 times just to get my gear let us have a choice.</p>

Anestacia
03-04-2010, 06:46 AM
<p>I agree in the fact that Klakanon is my least favorite.  It's a random crapshoot on if you are going to get the classes you need unless you premake it (which is not always an option).  Also, you have to hope that someones not AFK or completly newb, running off by themselves.  Atleast with the other 2, you have a pretty decent chance at having the right people to carry the slackers weight.  I wish the zones would just give one type of token across the board.  Dont bring the price of gear down; just instead of 50 gears and 50 bottles, make that item 100 tokens.  I am sure there is a reason it was done this way and its fine...I dont just hate this map, its just more luck than skill most of the time and it can get frustrating.</p>

Dorsan
03-04-2010, 08:17 AM
Gears is the best bg by far. Smugglers is lets run around in a circle while nukers sit on mid, Ganak is lets put on jumpy boots and sprint home with the flag, Gears is where the fun is.

kcirrot
03-04-2010, 09:06 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>Gears is the best bg by far. Smugglers is lets run around in a circle while nukers sit on mid, Ganak is lets put on jumpy boots and sprint home with the flag, Gears is where the fun is.</blockquote><p>Gears is grab relic and hide in corridor behind my group chokepoints.  Worst zone by far.</p>

Tanna
03-04-2010, 09:06 AM
<p>I would most definitely agree with a 1 coin system, or an ability to trade 2 for 1.</p>

ghhtwsfqa
03-04-2010, 09:50 AM
<p>I like gears, however I agree having one zone for each coin type is rather limiting and tedius when that is what you need for what you want.  Hopefully they will release additoinal zones for each coin type at some point.</p>

Shankapotomus
03-04-2010, 10:14 AM
<p><cite>Anestacia wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I agree in the fact that Klakanon is my least favorite.  It's a random crapshoot on if you are going to get the classes you need unless you premake it (which is not always an option).  Also, you have to hope that someones not AFK or completly newb, running off by themselves.  Atleast with the other 2, you have a pretty decent chance at having the right people to carry the slackers weight.  I wish the zones would just give <span style="color: #ff9900;">one type of token </span>across the board.  Dont bring the price of gear down; just instead of 50 gears and 50 bottles, make that item 100 tokens.  I am sure there is a reason it was done this way and its fine...I dont just hate this map, its just more luck than skill most of the time and it can get frustrating.</p></blockquote><p>This is soooo sad... lets make things easier than they already are.... lets not have to work for anything. You're not supposed to be getting this gear because you're playing in BG, you should be getting gear because you're good at BG. And not just one zone, all of them. Anyone who agrees with this lad should look into WoW much better suited for your type.</p>

BChizzle
03-04-2010, 10:43 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Anestacia wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I agree in the fact that Klakanon is my least favorite.  It's a random crapshoot on if you are going to get the classes you need unless you premake it (which is not always an option).  Also, you have to hope that someones not AFK or completly newb, running off by themselves.  Atleast with the other 2, you have a pretty decent chance at having the right people to carry the slackers weight.  I wish the zones would just give <span style="color: #ff9900;">one type of token </span>across the board.  Dont bring the price of gear down; just instead of 50 gears and 50 bottles, make that item 100 tokens.  I am sure there is a reason it was done this way and its fine...I dont just hate this map, its just more luck than skill most of the time and it can get frustrating.</p></blockquote><p>This is soooo sad... lets make things easier than they already are.... lets not have to work for anything. You're not supposed to be getting this gear because you're playing in BG, you should be getting gear because you're good at BG. And not just one zone, all of them. Anyone who agrees with this lad should look into WoW much better suited for your type.</p></blockquote><p>It isn't a question of being good.  Even winning in Gears is boring as hell 99% of the time.  The way the zone is designed is horrible and most of the time one group rolls another and even when you are winning its boring.  Add to that the fact that 6v6 seems just horrible in creating even matchups I mean I have had a 6 tank group gone in countless times without a healer I have had a 5 healer group its just horrible and I don't really ever want to have to do this zone but I am forced to because of this system that makes me have to get these dumb gear tokens, Ill do Smugglers and CTF all day however the Gears experience is not just unenjoyable it is complete torture.  Stop forcing this zone on me if I want to gear up for the other zones it is completely stupid.</p>

Costa
03-04-2010, 10:49 AM
<p>If you want to fix things in zones fix the exploits 1st and then worry about content. So far the biggest exploit i've seen is in capture the flag and someone uses the jumpy boots to get to an area that is un-accessable if your stuck in combat. Klak's tactic of sitting in a corridor is just common sense. Why stand in the open with an item ticking your health down and have every ranged dps in the oppositions group taking you out. Create a bottle neck and slog it out. It's not like its an exploit and impossable to over come. Lets face it any half decent wiz or lock will break through a group if they have a decent tank keeping the enemy on them.</p><p>Keep these things a challange and make the gear hard to obtain, unlike most of the servers this gear does affect 2 servers in that it is equal to the t9 pvp gear and so much easier to get. BG's were asked for by pvp players who were getting frustrated by the amount of lag in open world pvp. Now they have them the blubie players are complaining the gear takes too long to gain and they have to run zones they dislike. I'm sure if it was pve gear that was dropping they would have no problem with farming the instances till they get the piece they want.</p>

BChizzle
03-04-2010, 11:05 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>If you want to fix things in zones fix the exploits 1st and then worry about content. So far the biggest exploit i've seen is in capture the flag and someone uses the jumpy boots to get to an area that is un-accessable if your stuck in combat. Klak's tactic of sitting in a corridor is just common sense. Why stand in the open with an item ticking your health down and have every ranged dps in the oppositions group taking you out. Create a bottle neck and slog it out. It's not like its an exploit and impossable to over come. Lets face it any half decent wiz or lock will break through a group if they have a decent tank keeping the enemy on them.</p><p>Keep these things a challange and make the gear hard to obtain, unlike most of the servers this gear does affect 2 servers in that it is equal to the t9 pvp gear and so much easier to get. BG's were asked for by pvp players who were getting frustrated by the amount of lag in open world pvp. Now they have them the blubie players are complaining the gear takes too long to gain and they have to run zones they dislike. I'm sure if it was pve gear that was dropping they would have no problem with farming the instances till they get the piece they want.</p></blockquote><p>I don't care about your pvp servers and your QQing about gear being too easy to get, ironically you can get the exact same gear without doing the crap gears zone by just doing open land pvp and I want the option not to do gears too.  I don't want to do gears it sucks but I still want to pvp in the other two instances so stop forcing me to do this stupid zone.</p>

Shankapotomus
03-04-2010, 11:10 AM
<p><cite>BChizzle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Anestacia wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I agree in the fact that Klakanon is my least favorite.  It's a random crapshoot on if you are going to get the classes you need unless you premake it (which is not always an option).  Also, you have to hope that someones not AFK or completly newb, running off by themselves.  Atleast with the other 2, you have a pretty decent chance at having the right people to carry the slackers weight.  I wish the zones would just give <span style="color: #ff9900;">one type of token </span>across the board.  Dont bring the price of gear down; just instead of 50 gears and 50 bottles, make that item 100 tokens.  I am sure there is a reason it was done this way and its fine...I dont just hate this map, its just more luck than skill most of the time and it can get frustrating.</p></blockquote><p>This is soooo sad... lets make things easier than they already are.... lets not have to work for anything. You're not supposed to be getting this gear because you're playing in BG, you should be getting gear because you're good at BG. And not just one zone, all of them. Anyone who agrees with this lad should look into WoW much better suited for your type.</p></blockquote><p>It isn't a question of being good.  Even winning in Gears is boring as hell 99% of the time.  The way the zone is designed is horrible and most of the time one group rolls another and even when you are winning its boring.  Add to that the fact that 6v6 seems just horrible in creating even matchups I mean I have had a 6 tank group gone in countless times without a healer I have had a 5 healer group its just horrible and I don't really ever want to have to do this zone but I am forced to because of this system that makes me have to get these dumb gear tokens, Ill do Smugglers and CTF all day however the Gears experience is not just unenjoyable it is complete torture.  Stop forcing this zone on me if I want to gear up for the other zones it is completely stupid.</p></blockquote><p>PvE... The whole point of PvP is go in with your own group and wipe the floor with the other premade group. Just like in PvE, what type of game is this? A <span style="color: #00ff00;">group</span> orianted game. How many raids have you completed by just throwing people to gether without consideration. And if you can't find a group don't expect to compete. Can't blame SOE for the flux of tanks. Healers are the least played sub-type in the game. Don't you think it makes since that your group hardly finds one in a PUG?</p><p>Why do you want gear you're talking about maknig less uses for? Complete torture is tryin to complete a PvP writ and the only update you need left is a priest update and you haven't found one in hours. Then you finally find one to kill and you're so happy, you get you're one token. Now only 99 more to go for you're first PvP armor (pre nublification of PvP gear). Life is tough, get over it. Once again, <a href="http://www.worldofwarcraft.com" target="_blank">www.worldofwarcraft.com</a></p>

LivelyHound
03-04-2010, 11:13 AM
I've found Gears to be one of the most fun and even with lopsided teams I find you can still have very close matches. If your having trouble getting the relic back, coordinate, and why yes I am from a pve server.

Shankapotomus
03-04-2010, 11:17 AM
<p>Why do you want PvP gear you're not even willing to use? yes we can get it out of BG, and do you know why? Because we can use it ou tof BG.</p><p><a href="http://www.worldofwarcraft.com">www.worldofwarcraft.com</a></p>

BChizzle
03-04-2010, 11:19 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>PvE... The whole point of PvP is go in with your own group and wipe the floor with the other premade group. Just like in PvE, what type of game is this? A <span style="color: #00ff00;">group</span> orianted game. How many raids have you completed by just throwing people to gether without consideration. And if you can't find a group don't expect to compete. Can't blame SOE for the flux of tanks. Healers are the least played sub-type in the game. Don't you think it makes since that your group hardly finds one in a PUG?</p><p>Why do you want gear you're talking about maknig less uses for? Complete torture is tryin to complete a PvP writ and the only update you need left is a priest update and you haven't found one in hours. Then you finally find one to kill and you're so happy, you get you're one token. Now only 99 more to go for you're first PvP armor (pre nublification of PvP gear). Life is tough, get over it. Once again, <a href="http://www.worldofwarcraft.com" target="_blank">www.worldofwarcraft.com</a></p></blockquote><p>Sorry but the point of BG's isn't to go with a premade group or else it would be required to enter with a premade group.  Sucks you completely missed the point but the world of warcraft link at the end really helped to drive home that you don't really have a clue.</p><p>I'll give you a hint though maybe it will help, the point of BG's is to log on have some fun pvping get some gear out of it, gears is not fun for me and I don't want to be forced to do it 300 times just so I can get better gear for the other zones.  Sorry you have such a hard time finding yourself a priest but this isn't a thread about pvp writs so take that QQ elsewhere.</p>

Shankapotomus
03-04-2010, 11:46 AM
<p>Yes... I have a hard time findnig myself a priest...</p><p>I guess I dont have a clue, because to enjoy PvP you have to be competitive. And thats not complaining about a zone I'm not good at.</p><p>So my QQ about writs is irrelivant, but we have to listen to you QQ about a zone you get babied in? Here son, take a token for trying... If you can't find a way to be successful in BG without the gear, do you think it will make much difference?</p><p>No one is forcing you to do anything. But you can't always have you're cake and eat it too. I post the WoW link because I realize you're part of the instant gratification society we live in today. And that is the reason they created WoW, is for the players who wanted all the gear, kill anything, kill anyone, and pretty much to whatever you want at anytime. it just seems moer suited to you since the only reason you want gears done away with is because you can't seem to win and still think you deserve the gear.</p>

Snagnasty
03-04-2010, 11:47 AM
<p>How does working towards 70 pcs of one type of coin easier then getting a combination of two different sets of 35 each?   I would rather play the BGs that I enjoy.  If I have 6 guildies together, I would rather do the 6 man instance.   If If I join in a pug (which we all have to do from time to time), I would rather play the other two BGs. </p><p>I hope the designers take this into consideration and make a change towards one coin.  It has nothing to do with  getting the rewards quicker or easier.  I just want to maximize the fun.</p>

Shankapotomus
03-04-2010, 11:58 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>How does working towards 70 pcs of one type of coin easier then getting a combination of two different sets of 35 each?   I would rather play the BGs that I enjoy.  If I have 6 guildies together, I would rather do the 6 man instance.   If If I join in a pug (which we all have to do from time to time), I would rather play the other two BGs. </p><p>I hope the designers take this into consideration and make a change towards one coin.  It has nothing to do with  getting the rewards quicker or easier.  I just want to maximize the fun.</p></blockquote><p>Thats why you zerg the other two when you're solo and do the x1 when you find a group. So what about the groups who just run through one of these zones? then they never have to change zones and can gear up in no time, then they will be totaly unbeatable considering they have all the gear while everyone else is still trying for it. Then certain zones are going to be over run by primarily the same classes considering certain classes have the advantage in all 3 of the zones.</p><p>If an unstopable group rolled through the x2 like my raid did last night, it takes about 3-4 minutes to finish the game, then 3 mins downtime before we zone in again.</p><p>100/3= 33.33 x 6 = 200/60 = 3 hours and 20 min</p><p>And only 2 pieces take 100 tokens, most take from 60-80. So less than 3 hours</p><p>You think its fair for premade raids of 12 people should be able to get a new piece every 3 hours? I got 2 new pieces last night in about that time ( since I had the klak tokens already)</p>

Snagnasty
03-04-2010, 12:40 PM
<p>I have only done BGs a couple of hours over the last two nights.  I have won in every zone and lost in every zone.  If I come accross a good group of players I watch what they do and try to learn.  I am not good at Pvp and my gear and AAs are not quite set up correctly and will continue to make some ajustments the more I play.   I figure if BG is simply getting geared up to reach easy mode than the guilds that have their players get geared up in a couple of days will be done with BGs in a in a week or two(no leader boards reward systems or reason to keep adding coins to your bags).   Maybe I am incorrect but that would be like me running around killing grey mobs hours at a time in PVE over and over again.   Or am I missing something and the mindset of players from PVP servers different?   </p>

Shankapotomus
03-04-2010, 12:48 PM
<p>lol, you don't buy a new pricey car just to look at. You take it for a spin to show it off. They won't stop playing considering open world PvP has been ruined and BG is the easiest way to get some PvP'in done now. And for most PvP players it's not about getting the gear (thats just a plus to help them on their conquest), it's about making a name for yourself and seeing what you can accomplish against other opponents of like minds (for me at least and thats why you see so many naggy premade groups, no pvp player wants a loss).</p><p>And I have heard talks of tournaments, seasonal winners, rewards, so it could be coming (not sure if it was official news or not).</p>

TheSpin
03-04-2010, 01:02 PM
<p>Fix any legitimate bugs, by all means, but the idea of gears is fun.  Some classses really do well in different situations and the 6 on 6 environment should not be taken out of battlegrounds.</p><p>I would agree, however, that people should not be forced into one particular battleground if that's just not their thing.  I would say that instead of gear requiring (for example) 30 tokens each from 2 different BGs, gear <em>should require 60 tokens total from either BG.</em></p>

Adba
03-04-2010, 01:33 PM
<p>omg no, I love Gears! Don't remove it, fix it!..  add <strong>MORE BATTLEGROUNDS</strong>! <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" /></p><p>I'd really like to see a destruction pyramid where it's everyone against everyone.. Max 3 respawns. by end, the people with most kills wins. though afk-voting would be an issue as you're not teamed with anyone, how to get rid of the afk'ers then?</p>

Costa
03-04-2010, 01:34 PM
<p>If the devs make it so 1 token type is all you need to achieve gear we'll see even more QQing about the pvp players having their premade groups/raids plus their pvp gear winning all the instances and gearing up 3 times faster than the blubies that don't have access to our gear.</p><p>As some one else stated a lot of pvp players don't like to lose but at the same time we've learnt over the years that a well organised group of people that know their class is very formidable even in lesser gear, hence why we try to make our premades before getting dumped into some random group where there is a chance people have no clue or just decide to afk. These are not solo instances so if you have no friends or decide to run around alone and not take part in the group activity then you have to accept that you will die and it will hapen often.</p><p>6v6 if it is premade vs premade is about as good as your going to get for a pvp battle if the groups are pretty even. Unfortunatly soe's inability to create groups that are fairly even or even the ability to have at least 1 healer in each is the part of the failing of the zone, but as i found last night you don't need stacked groups to win or even a healer you just need to have people working together and knowing what they do.</p><p>If you don't like the zone then don't do it, it just means you'll miss out on that gear. It's much the same as PVE some instances and raid mobs are more fun than others but if it the mob you really detest or zone you really dislike has an item you really want or need you'll do it anyways to try and get it. This is the same as the BG's. Get the tokens and then never go back but you need to do something to work for the rewards rather than just sit around afk in an instance untill you've collected enough single tokens to get a decent piece of pvp gear.</p><p>As for not playing on a pvp server and not caring how it affects us well tbh i would sooner it was only naggy and vox players in the BG's so at least then we would get some decent match ups rather than the general steam rolling of the bluebie crybabies who want instant gear and easy updates. Not everyone is looking for fast gear progression some of us actually like to have to work for our tokens and are looking for good fights.</p><p>This gear is already the easiest gear to achieve with hardly any effort so to make you run a zone that you don't like is just good design for easy to get items.</p>

Shankapotomus
03-04-2010, 01:40 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>If the devs make it so 1 token type is all you need to achieve gear we'll see even more QQing about the pvp players having their premade groups/raids plus their pvp gear winning all the instances and gearing up 3 times faster than the blubies that don't have access to our gear.</p><p>As some one else stated a lot of pvp players don't like to lose but at the same time we've learnt over the years that a well organised group of people that know their class is very formidable even in lesser gear, hence why we try to make our premades before getting dumped into some random group where there is a chance people have no clue or just decide to afk. These are not solo instances so if you have no friends or decide to run around alone and not take part in the group activity then you have to accept that you will die and it will hapen often.</p><p>6v6 if it is premade vs premade is about as good as your going to get for a pvp battle if the groups are pretty even. Unfortunatly soe's inability to create groups that are fairly even or even the ability to have at least 1 healer in each is the part of the failing of the zone, but as i found last night you don't need stacked groups to win or even a healer you just need to have people working together and knowing what they do.</p><p>If you don't like the zone then don't do it, it just means you'll miss out on that gear. It's much the same as PVE some instances and raid mobs are more fun than others but if it the mob you really detest or zone you really dislike has an item you really want or need you'll do it anyways to try and get it. This is the same as the BG's. Get the tokens and then never go back but you need to do something to work for the rewards rather than just sit around afk in an instance untill you've collected enough single tokens to get a decent piece of pvp gear.</p><p>As for not playing on a pvp server and not caring how it affects us well tbh i would sooner it was only naggy and vox players in the BG's so at least then we would get some decent match ups rather than the general steam rolling of the bluebie crybabies who want instant gear and easy updates. Not everyone is looking for fast gear progression some of us actually like to have to work for our tokens and are looking for good fights.</p><p>This gear is already the easiest gear to achieve with hardly any effort so to make you run a zone that you don't like is just good design for easy to get items.</p></blockquote><p><img src="/eq2/images/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" /></p>

BChizzle
03-04-2010, 01:56 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>If the devs make it so 1 token type is all you need to achieve gear we'll see even more QQing about the pvp players having their premade groups/raids plus their pvp gear winning all the instances and gearing up 3 times faster than the blubies that don't have access to our gear.</p><p>As some one else stated a lot of pvp players don't like to lose but at the same time we've learnt over the years that a well organised group of people that know their class is very formidable even in lesser gear, hence why we try to make our premades before getting dumped into some random group where there is a chance people have no clue or just decide to afk. These are not solo instances so if you have no friends or decide to run around alone and not take part in the group activity then you have to accept that you will die and it will hapen often.</p><p>6v6 if it is premade vs premade is about as good as your going to get for a pvp battle if the groups are pretty even. Unfortunatly soe's inability to create groups that are fairly even or even the ability to have at least 1 healer in each is the part of the failing of the zone, but as i found last night you don't need stacked groups to win or even a healer you just need to have people working together and knowing what they do.</p><p>If you don't like the zone then don't do it, it just means you'll miss out on that gear. It's much the same as PVE some instances and raid mobs are more fun than others but if it the mob you really detest or zone you really dislike has an item you really want or need you'll do it anyways to try and get it. This is the same as the BG's. Get the tokens and then never go back but you need to do something to work for the rewards rather than just sit around afk in an instance untill you've collected enough single tokens to get a decent piece of pvp gear.</p><p>As for not playing on a pvp server and not caring how it affects us well tbh i would sooner it was only naggy and vox players in the BG's so at least then we would get some decent match ups rather than the general steam rolling of the bluebie crybabies who want instant gear and easy updates. Not everyone is looking for fast gear progression some of us actually like to have to work for our tokens and are looking for good fights.</p><p>This gear is already the easiest gear to achieve with hardly any effort so to make you run a zone that you don't like is just good design for easy to get items.</p></blockquote><p>LOL, I'd love for you to actually give an example of how having one coin type will do anything you are saying fact is it will change nothing except give people a better choice on which instance they want to do.</p>

Badmotorfinger
03-04-2010, 02:03 PM
<p>And they should give every instance the exact same loot table.  That way, when someone's grinding for gear, they only need to play the instance they want.... <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" /></p><p>get real</p><p>If you're not good at a particular zone that you want gear out of, get better at it.  Everything doesn't need to be a handout.</p>

Banditman
03-04-2010, 02:08 PM
<p>The real problem is that there simply isn't enough choice . . . yet.  There is only one 6v6 scenario.  One 12v12.  One 24v24.</p><p>Worse, each group size has only one type of gameplay associated with it.</p><p>What should we have?  Each group size should have 12 maps.  Maybe some are identical, maybe not.  For instance, 24 people wouldn't play very well in Gears.  Nevertheless, each group size should have:  Four Hold the Relic maps, Four ctf maps and four Capture and Hold maps.</p>

Anestacia
03-04-2010, 02:24 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>As for not playing on a pvp server and not caring how it affects us well tbh <span style="color: #ff0000;">i would sooner it was only naggy and vox players in the BG's so at least then we would get some decent match ups rather than the general steam rolling of the bluebie crybabies who want instant gear and easy updates.</span> Not everyone is looking for fast gear progression some of us actually like to have to work for our tokens and are looking for good fights.</p><p>This gear is already the easiest gear to achieve with hardly any effort so to make you run a zone that you don't like is just good design for easy to get items.</p></blockquote><p>The only worth while thing you've spouted out yet.  Just seperate the PvP from PvE so we dont have to listen to you whine any more about "bluebies" getting fast gear b/c I am sick of listening to it tbh.  I really dont get all the superior attitudes coming from the PvP community....the lowest population community in the game btw.  I have met some very professional people from Nagafen and enjoy playing with most of them.  I am in no way grouping the whole server together, but people like you is why some of us cant stand that zone.</p>

BChizzle
03-04-2010, 02:37 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>And they should give every instance the exact same loot table.  That way, when someone's grinding for gear, they only need to play the instance they want.... <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" /></p><p>get real</p><p>If you're not good at a particular zone that you want gear out of, get better at it.  Everything doesn't need to be a handout.</p></blockquote><p>It isnt comparable to an instance does gears give you a 16 hour lockout?  This is more like grinding the contested hole where the loot table is the same in each wing.</p>

Badmotorfinger
03-04-2010, 02:43 PM
<p>So you're saying it's already easier to get BG gear than Instance gear??  Alright then.  Let's not make it any easier.</p>

Neskonlith
03-04-2010, 02:55 PM
<p><cite>Banditman wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>The real problem is that there simply isn't enough choice . . . yet.  There is only one 6v6 scenario.  One 12v12.  One 24v24.</p><p>Worse, each group size has only one type of gameplay associated with it.</p><p>What should we have?  Each group size should have 12 maps.  Maybe some are identical, maybe not.  For instance, 24 people wouldn't play very well in Gears.  Nevertheless, each group size should have:  Four Hold the Relic maps, Four ctf maps and four Capture and Hold maps.</p></blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff0000;">This sounds like a great idea!</span></p><p><span style="color: #ff0000;">I hope SOE is already planning to release new stuff based off of the popularity and constructive feedback they've received to improve the existing!</span></p>

Snagnasty
03-04-2010, 02:58 PM
<p><cite>BChizzle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>If the devs make it so 1 token type is all you need to achieve gear we'll see even more QQing about the pvp players having their premade groups/raids plus their pvp gear winning all the instances and gearing up 3 times faster than the blubies that don't have access to our gear.</p><p>As some one else stated a lot of pvp players don't like to lose but at the same time we've learnt over the years that a well organised group of people that know their class is very formidable even in lesser gear, hence why we try to make our premades before getting dumped into some random group where there is a chance people have no clue or just decide to afk. These are not solo instances so if you have no friends or decide to run around alone and not take part in the group activity then you have to accept that you will die and it will hapen often.</p><p>6v6 if it is premade vs premade is about as good as your going to get for a pvp battle if the groups are pretty even. Unfortunatly soe's inability to create groups that are fairly even or even the ability to have at least 1 healer in each is the part of the failing of the zone, but as i found last night you don't need stacked groups to win or even a healer you just need to have people working together and knowing what they do.</p><p>If you don't like the zone then don't do it, it just means you'll miss out on that gear. It's much the same as PVE some instances and raid mobs are more fun than others but if it the mob you really detest or zone you really dislike has an item you really want or need you'll do it anyways to try and get it. This is the same as the BG's. Get the tokens and then never go back but you need to do something to work for the rewards rather than just sit around afk in an instance untill you've collected enough single tokens to get a decent piece of pvp gear.</p><p>As for not playing on a pvp server and not caring how it affects us well tbh i would sooner it was only naggy and vox players in the BG's so at least then we would get some decent match ups rather than the general steam rolling of the bluebie crybabies who want instant gear and easy updates. Not everyone is looking for fast gear progression some of us actually like to have to work for our tokens and are looking for good fights.</p><p>This gear is already the easiest gear to achieve with hardly any effort so to make you run a zone that you don't like is just good design for easy to get items.</p></blockquote><p>LOL, I'd love for you to actually give an example of how having one coin type will do anything you are saying fact is it will change nothing except give people a better choice on which instance they want to do.</p></blockquote><p>I doubt anyone will come close to answering this question.  Prepare for the march of the straw men =P</p>

Thunndar316
03-04-2010, 10:34 PM
<p>Do they really expect me to collect thousands of these stupid tokens for gear?</p><p>Battlegrounds are one huge epic fail.</p>

Crismorn
03-05-2010, 03:09 PM
<p>I <3 Gears and all the maps, I have no doubt that once these stay popular long enough that more maps and possibly new scenario's will be added and that will be great, cant wait!</p>

bks6721
03-05-2010, 03:58 PM
<p><cite>Thunndar316 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Do they really expect me to collect thousands of these stupid tokens for gear?</p><p>Battlegrounds are one huge epic fail.</p></blockquote><p>i'm a complete pvp noob and I got my Wizard robe in just 1.5 days of playing battlegrounds.   You get more tokens if you win.</p>

Wytie
03-05-2010, 04:07 PM
<p>I love this BG zone. It is by far the zone I feel I can have the most impact on, matter who I am grouped with.</p><p>With the other zones you are mostly dependant on your team, but in this zone you have a chance to be a bigger piece of the pie.</p><p>I enjoy this zone the most please keep it imo!</p>

Ewil
03-05-2010, 04:10 PM
<p>The only problem is that the zone is very poorly designed. Hold a shiny is too simple a task - you end up camping and the other group has to attack.</p><p>Ideas:</p><ol><li>Group with shiny has to repair 2 healing devices in zone to keep shiny from doing massive damage to holder</li><li>Shiny holder is teleported randomly around zone every X sec</li><li>Level 1 (one-shottable only by active/direct damage) mob(s) rush shiny holder and if they touch him, steal shiny and run off. Kill mob to get shiny.</li><li>The floor is made of lava; everyone must move around to avoid "danger spots" that circulate room.</li><li>Super mario party mode: There are tons of shinies in different colors all over; red and blue. First team to touch all of theirs win.</li></ol><p>Common denominator? It forces movement and activity, as opposed to camping. Same problem in Ganak; constant stalemate and camp-out.</p><p>Den, however, has excellent design and only suffers from current, and likely passing, disorgnization in pickup raids.</p>

Taldier
03-05-2010, 04:14 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I love this BG zone. It is by far the zone I feel I can have the most impact on, matter who I am grouped with.</p><p>With the other zones you are mostly dependant on your team, but in this zone you have a chance to be a bigger piece of the pie.</p><p>I enjoy this zone the most please keep it imo!</p></blockquote><p>I dont think they need to do much of anything with this zone except tweak the matchmaker a little to make the randomly assigned teams more even.</p><p>And I just quoted paill for the heck of it cause I think its funny to hear the lock explaining why he like the zone small enough that no one can get away from him heheh <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Wytie
03-05-2010, 04:24 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I love this BG zone. It is by far the zone I feel I can have the most impact on, matter who I am grouped with.</p><p>With the other zones you are mostly dependant on your team, but in this zone you have a chance to be a bigger piece of the pie.</p><p>I enjoy this zone the most please keep it imo!</p></blockquote><p>I dont think they need to do much of anything with this zone except tweak the matchmaker a little to make the randomly assigned teams more even.</p><p>And I just quoted paill for the heck of it cause I think its funny to hear the lock explaining why he like the zone small enough that no one can get away from him heheh <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>Well my comments didnt really have anything to do with the size of the zone, but more so of an impact 1 person has in a group of 6, rather than a group of 12 or 24.</p><p>Just saying in the 12man and 24 man zones no matter how well I do my team could still get it handed too, but in the 6man If I do really well my team is probably going to win the match.</p><p>Granted I am a lock and you all hate my kind, I dont blame you I hate other locks too <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Nayawk
03-05-2010, 06:53 PM
<p>I'm for a single token reward.  It just makes more sense.  Personal choice is good.</p><p>People need to realise battleground isn't pvp.. its battleground.. its something different than open world pvp so all the people going 'well this is how it is in pvp so thats how it has to be in bg' need to realise the rules are different. Yes you get rewards for losing and yes you are going to have pugs, so stop telling people they should just go in with premades.</p><p>That said I don't think Gears is a horrible zone but it is the one most open to mis-matched groups.  Last night in a pug.. the match maker put a group of 4 tanks 2 dps (no healer)  verses a group of 4 healers a tank and a bard.  Cake walk.  Didn't stand a chance.  In any other zone that would have been less of a problem match.</p><p>So I can see why many people would find Gears a zone they just don't want to do given how mis-matched it can be.  And what you really don't want is hoards of pve players abandoning BG completely because they can't get the gear because they hate one zone. </p><p>As much as it pains pvp'ers to admit it but for BGs to be a real long term success it needs to engage and keep pve'ers happy as well.</p>

BChizzle
03-05-2010, 06:56 PM
<p><cite>Nayawk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I'm for a single token reward.  It just makes more sense.  Personal choice is good.</p><p>People need to realise battleground isn't pvp.. its battleground.. its something different than open world pvp so all the people going 'well this is how it is in pvp so thats how it has to be in bg' need to realise the rules are different. Yes you get rewards for losing and yes you are going to have pugs, so stop telling people they should just go in with premades.</p><p>That said I don't think Gears is a horrible zone but it is the one most open to mis-matched groups.  Last night in a pug.. the match maker put a group of 4 tanks 2 dps (no healer)  verses a group of 4 healers a tank and a bard.  Cake walk.  Didn't stand a chance.  In any other zone that would have been less of a problem match.</p><p>So I can see why many people would find Gears a zone they just don't want to do given how mis-matched it can be.  And what you really don't want is hoards of pve players abandoning BG completely because they can't get the gear because they hate one zone. </p><p>As much as it pains pvp'ers to admit it but for BGs to be a real long term success it needs to engage and keep pve'ers happy as well.</p></blockquote><p>Exactly you get it.</p>

Grumble69
03-05-2010, 07:41 PM
<p>I don't particularly care for it too much.  I'm either in the group doing the spanking, or I'm in the group getting spanked.  I don't think I've been in one close match yet.  The other 2 zones can get lopsided, but the score usually doesn't run away so fast.  Once you get behind in Gears though, it seems to be over.</p>

Rothgar
03-05-2010, 08:52 PM
<p>We've increased the tick damage of the relic slightly.  We should probably also look at lowering the number of points you get just for holding onto it and doing nothing.  The idea behind the relic is that you use it to get killing blows which gives you a lot of points.  But currently people find it easier to turtle up with it.</p>

Rotate
03-05-2010, 08:59 PM
<p>lol see i never knew that the point was to use it to kill other players.. always thought it was a game to see whole could hold it the longest becuse it was doing damage.. and teams score was increaseing while holding it =p.</p>

bks6721
03-05-2010, 09:50 PM
<p><cite>Ewil wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>The only problem is that the zone is very poorly designed. Hold a shiny is too simple a task - you end up camping and the other group has to attack.</p><p>Ideas:</p><ol><li>Group with shiny has to repair 2 healing devices in zone to keep shiny from doing massive damage to holder</li><li>Shiny holder is teleported randomly around zone every X sec</li><li>Level 1 (one-shottable only by active/direct damage) mob(s) rush shiny holder and if they touch him, steal shiny and run off. Kill mob to get shiny.</li><li>The floor is made of lava; everyone must move around to avoid "danger spots" that circulate room.</li><li>Super mario party mode: There are tons of shinies in different colors all over; red and blue. First team to touch all of theirs win.</li></ol><p>Common denominator? It forces movement and activity, as opposed to camping. Same problem in Ganak; constant stalemate and camp-out.</p><p>Den, however, has excellent design and only suffers from current, and likely passing, disorgnization in pickup raids.</p></blockquote><p>I actually enjoy the challenge of the charge/defend roles.   Of course I've run across groups that simply overpowered us badly but its still fun.</p>

bks6721
03-05-2010, 09:54 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I love this BG zone. It is by far the zone I feel I can have the most impact on, matter who I am grouped with.</p><p>With the other zones you are mostly dependant on your team, but in this zone you have a chance to be a bigger piece of the pie.</p><p>I enjoy this zone the most please keep it imo!</p></blockquote><p>I dont think they need to do much of anything with this zone except tweak the matchmaker a little to make the randomly assigned teams more even.</p><p>And I just quoted paill for the heck of it cause I think its funny to hear the lock explaining why he like the zone small enough that no one can get away from him heheh <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>I disagree.   Yesterday my group was 2 wiz, 1 warden, 1 fury, 1 necro, 1 dirge.  Other group had an SK with two healers, 1 warlock, brig.   We assumed it was a no win for us.   We won 704 to 56.</p><p>I've had groups with no healers beat premade groups with 2, so you just never know.</p>

Sydares
03-06-2010, 01:13 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I disagree.   Yesterday my group was 2 wiz, 1 warden</p></blockquote><p>Could have stopped there. It was all you needed to win.  <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" /></p>

Notsovilepriest
03-06-2010, 01:17 AM
<p>I'm willing to bet it was more Elemental Toxicity, That ability is massively overpowered.</p>

Taldier
03-06-2010, 01:47 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I dont think they need to do much of anything with this zone except tweak the matchmaker a little to make the randomly assigned teams more even.</p></blockquote><p>I disagree.   Yesterday my group was 2 wiz, 1 warden, 1 fury, 1 necro, 1 dirge.  Other group had an SK with two healers, 1 warlock, brig.   We assumed it was a no win for us.   We won 704 to 56.</p><p>I've had groups with no healers beat premade groups with 2, so you just never know.</p></blockquote><p>I'm not sure why your surprised that the group with 2 healers, a bard, and 4 heavy magic dps beat the group with 2 healers and fewer magic dps...</p><p>Regardless, I wasnt talking so much as just in terms of class but also in terms of gear, maybe aa's as well.  There are a lot of little factors they could try to tweak in aside from the obvious one that each group should have atleast one member of each archtype.</p><p>On 3 occasions so far I've been placed in a group entierly at random with 5 other completely random pvp/raid geared players from naggy and vox vs a full group of blubies that had to be wearing t2 shard armor because I was able to easily solo them all by myself.</p><p>I've also found myself in the reverse situation a couple times where I have to fight an entire pvp/raid geared team by myself and get ganked horribly because the rest of my team is instantly oneshot every time they spawn.</p>

Ewil
03-06-2010, 01:56 AM
<p>Roth, do you know any PlanetSide designers who have looked at BG? If so, what is their input? They've been balancing PvP for years now and have created many exciting, somewhat diverse, and challenging forms of battling. (No, I'm not asking for ZW artillery, but then again, that seems to inadvertadly exist in BG already)</p>

Grumble69
03-06-2010, 03:41 AM
<p>I recant my complaints about Gears.  I'm finding that players are starting to understand better how to play this zone.  I was actually in a group tonite that was down 650-10 (+/- a few points).  We managed a last ditch push, captured the thingiemabob, held onto it, and ended up winning.</p><p>BG is just getting funner & funner for me.  The only negative are the speed hacks.</p>

Costa
03-06-2010, 08:20 AM
<p><cite>Anestacia wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>As for not playing on a pvp server and not caring how it affects us well tbh <span style="color: #ff0000;">i would sooner it was only naggy and vox players in the BG's so at least then we would get some decent match ups rather than the general steam rolling of the bluebie crybabies who want instant gear and easy updates.</span> Not everyone is looking for fast gear progression some of us actually like to have to work for our tokens and are looking for good fights.</p><p>This gear is already the easiest gear to achieve with hardly any effort so to make you run a zone that you don't like is just good design for easy to get items.</p></blockquote><p>The only worth while thing you've spouted out yet.  Just seperate the PvP from PvE so we dont have to listen to you whine any more about "bluebies" getting fast gear b/c I am sick of listening to it tbh.  I really dont get all the superior attitudes coming from the PvP community....the lowest population community in the game btw.  I have met some very professional people from Nagafen and enjoy playing with most of them.  I am in no way grouping the whole server together, but people like you is why some of us cant stand that zone.</p></blockquote><p>I think you failed to see my point. I was not saying to make it harder for pve players to get gear, i'm saying that they don't need to make it any easier. As for the pvp comment well so far when i've gone in the best fights i've had are against pvp players. Coming up against pve players generally results in my zerk 3 shotting them. That isn't fun for me and i'm sure it isn't fun for them. If they changed the tokens so that 1 token type was all you needed then they would possably need to increase the token requirements to prevent more people from just semi afking in instances to collect their 1 token a fight and gearing up with no effort at all.</p><p>By all means make it 1 token type for the bg items because at the end of the day the pvp community will get twice the use out of the items than the pve community due to the fact it is worth something on our servers. You'll probably also see a lot of the people who are farming for their pvp gear leave also, but personally i would sooner SoE worked on the random group generator so at least it did make groups that had 1 of each archtype before filling gaps.</p>

Azzad
03-07-2010, 03:53 PM
<p>I think there will be changes coming anyway. You realize that them calling it "pre-season" just means that you are beta testing it right?</p>

Murchik
03-08-2010, 11:54 AM
<p>I'm from blue server. I do just fine, win some loose some. Unbalanced groups make up is disappointing. When you get premade pvp group from red server against mismatched group , after couple times you get slaughtered in seconds, you realize that not much you can do but just run in over and over to get it over with faster. Wish they made a feature like throwing white flag, so you don't get trueancy for leaving battlegrounds early, because you realize that there is no way in hell you will be able to come close to getting an item. I was on both sides of this, getting killed in seconds and camping other team. Both scenarios are boring, you are just wasting time. Or don't allow premade groups of 6, let only up to 3 people be grouped prior entering the Gears. That should give that team already advantage of having half of the group on the same page.</p>