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View Full Version : Fighting against full PVP gear at the beginning of BG is not fun at all


Couching
02-27-2010, 03:55 AM
<p>It's normal that players from pvp servers have pvp gear.</p><p>However, for most players from pve servers, we do not.</p><p>It's cool to fight with players from pvp servers.</p><p>But it's not cool at all to fight against someone with full T8 pvp gear with tons of toughness and we have zero.</p><p>Toughness should be disabled in the first month of BG.</p>

Sydares
02-27-2010, 04:52 AM
<p>I agree with this. It's utterly annoying that Nagafen and Vox players were able to get full sets of their PvP gear even before setting foot in Battlegrounds. Is World PvP just that easy to grind?</p>

rebyenliv
02-27-2010, 05:05 AM
<p><cite>Sydares wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I agree with this. It's utterly annoying that Nagafen and Vox players were able to get full sets of their PvP gear even before setting foot in Battlegrounds. Is World PvP just that easy to grind?</p></blockquote><p>yes</p>

Dorsan
02-27-2010, 05:07 AM
<p><cite>Sydares wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I agree with this. It's utterly annoying that Nagafen and Vox players were able to get full sets of their PvP gear even before setting foot in Battlegrounds. Is World PvP just that easy to grind?</p></blockquote><p>The PvP gear people are talking about is T8 PvP gear, not the new one...</p>

Sydares
02-27-2010, 05:09 AM
<p>Ah, I hadn't even considered that they'd added toughness to the old stuff. Either way, I wish the matchmaking were a bit more intelligent. Maybe just pit Nagafen and Vox against one another for the first week. Less boring for you guys, less agonizing for us as we try to gear up.</p>

Orthureon
02-27-2010, 05:10 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's normal that players from pvp servers have pvp gear.</p><p>However, for most players from pve servers, we do not.</p><p>It's cool to fight with players from pvp servers.</p><p>But it's not cool at all to fight against someone with full T8 pve gear with tons of toughness and we have zero.</p><p>Toughness should be disabled in the first month of BG.</p></blockquote><p>At level 90 with the T8 PVP gear my Toughness is 14%... yeah tons. So how much more raid gear does the average joe on a PVE server have?</p>

Sydares
02-27-2010, 05:13 AM
<p><cite>Orthureon wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p> So how much more raid gear does the average joe on a PVE server have?</p></blockquote><p>Less than you'd think, especially as we didn't get several of the ward-proc heal rings and other accoutrements that PvP servers exclusively carried.</p>

Couching
02-27-2010, 05:13 AM
<p><cite>Orthureon wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's normal that players from pvp servers have pvp gear.</p><p>However, for most players from pve servers, we do not.</p><p>It's cool to fight with players from pvp servers.</p><p>But it's not cool at all to fight against someone with full T8 pve gear with tons of toughness and we have zero.</p><p>Toughness should be disabled in the first month of BG.</p></blockquote><p>At level 90 with the T8 PVP gear my Toughness is 14%... yeah tons. So how much more raid gear does the average joe on a PVE server have?</p></blockquote><p>You are pathetic if you think 14% isn't much.</p><p>The full T9 BG suit (7 pieces) is 25%. You have 14% in the beginning of BG and every other players from pve servers has 0%.</p><p>In other word, you have advantage over pve players about 4 BG armor pieces.</p><p>Wow, 4 BG armor pieces are not much? BS!</p><p>If it's really not a big deal, how about not using it? Oh wait, no way.</p><p>Not to say, you can get pve gear on pvp servers as well. What's your point here about pve gear on BG?</p><p>Don't tell me that you can be killed by other players in raid instances in pvp servers.</p>

tweety1972
02-27-2010, 05:14 AM
<p>dumb question but what level do you have to be for BG? <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Sydares
02-27-2010, 05:15 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>dumb question but what level do you have to be for BG? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>80-90</p>

tweety1972
02-27-2010, 05:16 AM
<p>where's the fun in that <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Notsovilepriest
02-27-2010, 05:20 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Orthureon wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's normal that players from pvp servers have pvp gear.</p><p>However, for most players from pve servers, we do not.</p><p>It's cool to fight with players from pvp servers.</p><p>But it's not cool at all to fight against someone with full T8 pve gear with tons of toughness and we have zero.</p><p>Toughness should be disabled in the first month of BG.</p></blockquote><p>At level 90 with the T8 PVP gear my Toughness is 14%... yeah tons. So how much more raid gear does the average joe on a PVE server have?</p></blockquote><p>Lol, 14% isn't much comparing to 0%? If it's really not a big deal, how about not using it? Oh wait, no way.</p><p>Not to say, you can get pve gear on pvp servers as well. What's your point here about pve gear on BG?</p></blockquote><p>If people play battlegrounds, You're going to get gear faster than we can get PvP gear really. I personally only have 1 piece of PvP gear(T<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> because of how lame open world PvP had gotten. I don't think that the one week or so of PvP servers having a minor advantage in a PvP battleground is that big a deal. QQ and get your gear.</p>

Azol
02-27-2010, 05:32 AM
<p>This has happened only because someone decided we should allow open-world gear in BGs. Worst decision ever.</p><p>What's more, they allowed using BG gear in open world. Now we have much better form of zerg - "afk zerg in BGs". Way to earn some PVP gear!</p><p>Solution:</p><p>BGs should allow only BG gear (rewarded/Mastercrafted)</p><p>BG gear should be usable only in BG.</p><p>Keep BGs a separate game, similar to LON <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/908627bbe5e9f6a080977db8c365caff.gif" border="0" /> They are already on separate server (ever wondered why you log off from your server when zoning to BG?)</p>

Couching
02-27-2010, 05:39 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Considering I was exiled majority of the expansion in which time  you cannot attain PvP gear and the other part I refused to support the zerg that was KP Docks/TG...Yeah. <strong>Also they said they weren't putting toughness on PvP gear</strong> and I had a full raid set which has almost all the same stats but more set bonuses, so why bother. Please know what  your talking about because  you spew drivel</p></blockquote><p>Good, thank you for telling us that toughness was not supposed on pvp gear.</p>

Notsovilepriest
02-27-2010, 05:55 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Considering I was exiled majority of the expansion in which time  you cannot attain PvP gear and the other part I refused to support the zerg that was KP Docks/TG...Yeah. <strong>Also they said they weren't putting toughness on PvP gear</strong> and I had a full raid set which has almost all the same stats but more set bonuses, so why bother. Please know what  your talking about because  you spew drivel</p></blockquote><p>Good, thank you for telling us that toughness was not supposed on pvp gear.</p></blockquote><p>They went back on it a week before the launch, I totally agree it shouldn't have been there, but take your lumps like every other person like a new person to PvP servers, Get your gear, and fight back. No need to complain, Unless you want gear literally handed out to everyone...Which I don't agree with at all and the battlegrounds gear is borderline handouts anyways.</p>

Couching
02-27-2010, 06:01 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Considering I was exiled majority of the expansion in which time  you cannot attain PvP gear and the other part I refused to support the zerg that was KP Docks/TG...Yeah. <strong>Also they said they weren't putting toughness on PvP gear</strong> and I had a full raid set which has almost all the same stats but more set bonuses, so why bother. Please know what  your talking about because  you spew drivel</p></blockquote><p>Good, thank you for telling us that toughness was not supposed on pvp gear.</p></blockquote><p>They went back on it a week before the launch, I totally agree it shouldn't have been there, but take your lumps like every other person like a new person to PvP servers, Get your gear, and fight back. No need to complain, Unless you want gear literally handed out to everyone...Which I don't agree with at all and the battlegrounds gear is borderline handouts anyways.</p></blockquote><p>Learn to read, where did I ask to hand gear out to everyone?</p><p>What I asked it to disable toughness so that EVERYONE can get a fair shot.</p><p>Or is it too hard for you to understand what the fairness is?</p><p>Or, let pvp guy gets advantages so that they can get BG gear with relatively easy?</p>

BChizzle
02-27-2010, 06:01 AM
<p>Cry more?  Who cares if Naggy folks have a heads start its fun trying to kill them with the huge advantage they get.</p>

peonpe
02-27-2010, 06:04 AM
<p>Its really not a big deal, the gear that is. The T8 PvP server and geared teams that are rolling people would roll them without the gear. They are used to a PvP environment, they are used to fighting other players. So its not the gear, its the players. And i say this as player on a PvE server, but in other MMos i exclusively PvP'd...and fighting PvE players in those games [even in sh*t gear] was a joke. Give it a month or two and the gear will even out, and hopefully PvE bg players will know how to pvp.</p><p>And besides that, them having T8 pvp gear now, and dying to them...oh well, rez and try to figure out a better way to approach players in pvp [hint-team work and coordination not mindless zerging].</p>

Dorsan
02-27-2010, 06:04 AM
18% toughness is not a huge advantage. If someone has 10k health and 18% toughness it is just the same as someone with 11.8k health...

Notsovilepriest
02-27-2010, 06:09 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Considering I was exiled majority of the expansion in which time  you cannot attain PvP gear and the other part I refused to support the zerg that was KP Docks/TG...Yeah. <strong>Also they said they weren't putting toughness on PvP gear</strong> and I had a full raid set which has almost all the same stats but more set bonuses, so why bother. Please know what  your talking about because  you spew drivel</p></blockquote><p>Good, thank you for telling us that toughness was not supposed on pvp gear.</p></blockquote><p>They went back on it a week before the launch, I totally agree it shouldn't have been there, but take your lumps like every other person like a new person to PvP servers, Get your gear, and fight back. No need to complain, Unless you want gear literally handed out to everyone...Which I don't agree with at all and the battlegrounds gear is borderline handouts anyways.</p></blockquote><p>Learn to read, where did I ask to hand gear out to everyone?</p><p>What I asked it to disable toughness so that EVERYONE can get a fair shot.</p><p>Or is it too hard for you to understand what the fairness is?</p><p>Or, let pvp guy gets advantages so that they can get BG gear with relatively easy?</p></blockquote><p>My guild goes into battle grounds, When most of us have little to no PvP gear, and still kill 90% of the people in there(Including other PvP server guilds with full sets), because we are used to the playstyle.</p><p>I agree it would have been nicer to be on a level playing field,but it's not as big of a deal as you're making.</p>

wickermanuk
02-27-2010, 07:23 AM
<p>Here's a example of what happened to me today on gears.</p><p>Nagafen group vs PUG:</p><p>1. Fight starts</p><p>2. We run down and are killed literally no lie within 10 secs.</p><p>3. Nagafen group camps the spawn point</p><p>4. People jump down and die in 2/3 secs</p><p>5. Repeat 5/7 times</p><p>6. Team just decides to stand there and gives upIt was funny but in all honesty so hopelessly unbalanced I can imagine people just quiting.</p>

gdawg311
02-27-2010, 07:35 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Considering I was exiled majority of the expansion in which time  you cannot attain PvP gear and the other part I refused to support the zerg that was KP Docks/TG...Yeah. <strong>Also they said they weren't putting toughness on PvP gear</strong> and I had a full raid set which has almost all the same stats but more set bonuses, so why bother. Please know what  your talking about because  you spew drivel</p></blockquote><p>Good, thank you for telling us that toughness was not supposed on pvp gear.</p></blockquote><p>They went back on it a week before the launch, I totally agree it shouldn't have been there, but take your lumps like every other person like a new person to PvP servers, Get your gear, and fight back. No need to complain, Unless you want gear literally handed out to everyone...Which I don't agree with at all and the battlegrounds gear is borderline handouts anyways.</p></blockquote><p>Learn to read, where did I ask to hand gear out to everyone?</p><p>What I asked it to disable toughness so that EVERYONE can get a fair shot.</p><p>Or is it too hard for you to understand what the fairness is?</p><p>Or, let pvp guy gets advantages so that they can get BG gear with relatively easy?</p></blockquote><p>I find it funny reading your posts, in your last post you raged on a guy and told him to stop dying and sucking at pvp on nagafen. Now youre hear QQing that you can't compete and get killed easy. </p><p>and just an FYI to be perfectly honest, they could give you a full set of BG gear.... its not going to stop you from getting wrecked by hardened seasoned pvpers from nagafen.  Your 20 minutes in a BG is what we do every day all day. So seriously its not the gear.</p><p>You are basically asking for a hand out because you can't beat people who have been pvping for years whiel you were killing scripted encounters... bluebies ftl....</p>

gdawg311
02-27-2010, 07:37 AM
<p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Here's a example of what happened to me today on gears.</p><p>Nagafen group vs PUG:</p><p>1. Fight starts</p><p>2. We run down and are killed literally no lie within 10 secs.</p><p>3. Nagafen group camps the spawn point</p><p>4. People jump down and die in 2/3 secs</p><p>5. Repeat 5/7 times</p><p>6. Team just decides to stand there and gives upIt was funny but in all honesty so hopelessly unbalanced I can imagine people just quiting.</p></blockquote><p>again its not unbalanced at all, you are just playing against people who have years more experience than you in pvp. when you cast a certan spell or a certain combat art, or even move a certain way, we have a way to counter you. Learn it, it will come in time for you.</p><p>do you really honestly think that if all the gear we all had was equal, that you would stand a chance to win against a set up group of players from nagafen?</p>

Muraazi
02-27-2010, 07:38 AM
<p>Or you could, I dunno, get the crafted toughness gear... There are some pretty good pve players I've seen in the BGs. Hint, it's not the ones that jump off the spawn point 1 by 1 in gears.</p>

Lather
02-27-2010, 07:43 AM
<p>Why does it seem you get more ignorant everytime u post....you been hangin with lourdes or somethin?</p>

Lather
02-27-2010, 07:45 AM
<p><cite>gdawg311 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Here's a example of what happened to me today on gears.</p><p>Nagafen group vs PUG:</p><p>1. Fight starts</p><p>2. We run down and are killed literally no lie within 10 secs.</p><p>3. Nagafen group camps the spawn point</p><p>4. People jump down and die in 2/3 secs</p><p>5. Repeat 5/7 times</p><p>6. Team just decides to stand there and gives upIt was funny but in all honesty so hopelessly unbalanced I can imagine people just quiting.</p></blockquote><p>again its not unbalanced at all, you are just playing against people who have years more experience than you in pvp. when you cast a certan spell or a certain combat art, or even move a certain way, we have a way to counter you. Learn it, it will come in time for you.</p><p>do you really honestly think that if all the gear we all had was equal, that you would stand a chance to win against a set up group of players from nagafen?</p></blockquote><p>This is why im not gonna do bg at lvl 90....pug battlegrounds are alot more fun than stacked groups pounding pugs.</p>

Corydonn
02-27-2010, 08:08 AM
<p>The only advantage PVP players have that could remotely be considered imbalance is that the Banshee Hoop item for healers is not acquireable on PVE servers. Otherwise things are fairly even right now.</p>

wickermanuk
02-27-2010, 08:19 AM
<p><cite>gdawg311 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Here's a example of what happened to me today on gears.</p><p>Nagafen group vs PUG:</p><p>1. Fight starts</p><p>2. We run down and are killed literally no lie within 10 secs.</p><p>3. Nagafen group camps the spawn point</p><p>4. People jump down and die in 2/3 secs</p><p>5. Repeat 5/7 times</p><p>6. Team just decides to stand there and gives upIt was funny but in all honesty so hopelessly unbalanced I can imagine people just quiting.</p></blockquote><p>again its not unbalanced at all, you are just playing against people who have years more experience than you in pvp. when you cast a certan spell or a certain combat art, or even move a certain way, we have a way to counter you. Learn it, it will come in time for you.</p><p>do you really honestly think that if all the gear we all had was equal, that you would stand a chance to win against a set up group of players from nagafen?</p></blockquote><p>Not sure I agree with you there, I dont know if there is a gear discrepancy going on but like I said in my post, literally within 10 secs everyone was dead. I was getting hit twice on the spawn point and dying over and over again.</p><p>Mages in particular seem to be cannon fodder, I had swashys autoattacking me from insane distances, and with mages not being able to cast when you move it was bizzare.</p>

Dorsan
02-27-2010, 08:52 AM
<p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Not sure I agree with you there, I dont know if there is a gear discrepancy going on but like I said in my post, literally within 10 secs everyone was dead. I was getting hit twice on the spawn point and dying over and over again.</p><p>Mages in particular seem to be cannon fodder, I had swashys autoattacking me from insane distances, and with mages not being able to cast when you move it was bizzare.</p></blockquote><p>You do realise that mages can't cast and move on Nagafen open world PvP for years now? We got used to it, so can you. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

wickermanuk
02-27-2010, 09:06 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Not sure I agree with you there, I dont know if there is a gear discrepancy going on but like I said in my post, literally within 10 secs everyone was dead. I was getting hit twice on the spawn point and dying over and over again.</p><p>Mages in particular seem to be cannon fodder, I had swashys autoattacking me from insane distances, and with mages not being able to cast when you move it was bizzare.</p></blockquote><p>You do realise that mages can't cast and move on Nagafen open world PvP for years now? We got used to it, so can you. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>I know the gear has a lot to do with it. It was obvious when you had a mage from nagafen literally standing toe to toe with 3 people wailing on him and yet his health didnt go down that much.</p><p>Big thing I noticed also is if you have a healer who knows what they are doing then you are more than likely to do well.</p>

yadlajoi
02-27-2010, 09:17 AM
there need to have stun daze stiffle root immunity just in PVP ruleset. chanter can stunlock anyone brigand can stunlock anyone. immunity and reduced duration go stuns needed asap. also no more runspeed when carrying a flag.

Orthureon
02-27-2010, 09:59 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Orthureon wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's normal that players from pvp servers have pvp gear.</p><p>However, for most players from pve servers, we do not.</p><p>It's cool to fight with players from pvp servers.</p><p>But it's not cool at all to fight against someone with full T8 pve gear with tons of toughness and we have zero.</p><p>Toughness should be disabled in the first month of BG.</p></blockquote><p>At level 90 with the T8 PVP gear my Toughness is 14%... yeah tons. So how much more raid gear does the average joe on a PVE server have?</p></blockquote><p>You are pathetic if you think 14% isn't much.</p><p>The full T9 BG suit (7 pieces) is 25%. You have 14% in the beginning of BG and every other players from pve servers has 0%.</p><p>In other word, you have advantage over pve players about 4 BG armor pieces.</p><p>Wow, 4 BG armor pieces are not much? BS!</p><p>If it's really not a big deal, how about not using it? Oh wait, no way.</p><p>Not to say, you can get pve gear on pvp servers as well. What's your point here about pve gear on BG?</p><p>Don't tell me that you can be killed by other players in raid instances in pvp servers.</p></blockquote><p>Watch out now a anonymous person on a forum called me pathetic! Internet tough guyz ftw! I didn't come in here slinging insults, you must be really depressed by how badly you are getting destroyed in the BGs. Anyways...</p><p>Hmm 25% they must have nerfed it, because the initial set had 40% or very close to it. If that is the case then yeah 14% is pretty high. I would not use my PVP gear if I wanted to raid all the time... in other words if I was on a PVE server. I didn't join my PVP server to PVE, so yes I will use the gear I earned.</p><p>As for the PVP in a raid zone, for the longest time sides were divided so PVP servers didn't have access to all the classes which they needed to successfully raid. Now we are mostly playing catch up. Again, if I wanted to be in a high-end raid guild why do it on a server dedicated to fighting other people??? The best idea would be to have everyone have to purchase a starter set of PVP gear (ala MC gear) and have at it. I am sure us PVPers would still hear cries of unfair advantages while wearing the same gear.</p>

wickermanuk
02-27-2010, 10:10 AM
<p><cite>yadlajoi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>there need to have stun daze stiffle root immunity just in PVP ruleset. chanter can stunlock anyone brigand can stunlock anyone. immunity and reduced duration go stuns needed asap. also no more runspeed when carrying a flag.</blockquote><p>I think there is a immunity on stuns/dazes etc, i'm almost positive there is.</p><p>I play a chanter and believe me if they took away the ability to stun/daze/stifle people or even reduced it then you may as well just not bother as a chanter. What else do chanters have, their stupid low dmg spells, or power regen. Buffing people is useless as you're all over the place so buffs count for nothing.</p><p>Crowd control effects never seem to last that long to me, the action is to frantic to ever be in a position where someone simply stun locks you. I honestly think if they took those away it becomes more of a gank fest with everyone simply playing wizzys etc for their big hits.</p>

Armironhead
02-27-2010, 10:56 AM
<p><cite>Sydares wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I agree with this. It's utterly annoying that Nagafen and Vox players were able to get full sets of their PvP gear even before setting foot in Battlegrounds. Is World PvP just that easy to grind?</p></blockquote><p>actually we have full sets of pvp gear because we earned it by playing for years in a competitive environment.  All the bluebees have to do to get toughness gear is go to your local ts'er and buy some.  Talk about unfair - lol.  But come on, it really wouldnt matter if we gave the blubees all the gear in the game and some new gear like a tank or a flame thrower.  The bluebees play on the blue servers for a reason - they can only deal with wack a mole on scripted mobs.  Its totally unrealistic to expect them to suddenly shake other the malaise that surrounds their brains and fight opponents that actually think.  I suggest that before blubees be allowed on to the bgs they be forced to undergo basic training - then they can learn certain elementary tactics like turn on your mic and stay with the group.  Oh and perhaps the most important lesson - dont go to the forums and whine about how much you sux and ask that everybody else and everything else be nerfed/banned - its poor form and only underlies how much you really do suc.</p>

Armironhead
02-27-2010, 11:02 AM
<p><cite>yadlajoi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>there need to have stun daze stiffle root immunity just in PVP ruleset. chanter can stunlock anyone brigand can stunlock anyone. immunity and reduced duration go stuns needed asap. also no more runspeed when carrying a flag.</blockquote><p>How about this - stay with your grp and get gear and items that help you break/survive their spells/cas?  Also maybe get items that make you run faster.  Hell there is a new tinker item that runs at 65%.  With jj boots, aa and totems I run at 75%.</p><p>There problem solved and no dev time is actually need.  </p>

Lather
02-27-2010, 11:07 AM
<p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>yadlajoi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>there need to have stun daze stiffle root immunity just in PVP ruleset. chanter can stunlock anyone brigand can stunlock anyone. immunity and reduced duration go stuns needed asap. also no more runspeed when carrying a flag.</blockquote><p>I think there is a immunity on stuns/dazes etc, i'm almost positive there is.</p><p>I play a chanter and believe me if they took away the ability to stun/daze/stifle people or even reduced it then you may as well just not bother as a chanter. What else do chanters have, their stupid low dmg spells, or power regen. Buffing people is useless as you're all over the place so buffs count for nothing.</p><p>Crowd control effects never seem to last that long to me, the action is to frantic to ever be in a position where someone simply stun locks you. I honestly think if they took those away it becomes more of a gank fest with everyone simply playing wizzys etc for their big hits.</p></blockquote><p>U must be a awful chanter then.....ive been top on damage in every bg ive played on my illy save one where i got beat by a warlock....and i dont even have the expansion on that account so no new pretty aa for me.</p>

Couching
02-27-2010, 11:46 AM
<p><cite>gdawg311 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Considering I was exiled majority of the expansion in which time  you cannot attain PvP gear and the other part I refused to support the zerg that was KP Docks/TG...Yeah. <strong>Also they said they weren't putting toughness on PvP gear</strong> and I had a full raid set which has almost all the same stats but more set bonuses, so why bother. Please know what  your talking about because  you spew drivel</p></blockquote><p>Good, thank you for telling us that toughness was not supposed on pvp gear.</p></blockquote><p>They went back on it a week before the launch, I totally agree it shouldn't have been there, but take your lumps like every other person like a new person to PvP servers, Get your gear, and fight back. No need to complain, Unless you want gear literally handed out to everyone...Which I don't agree with at all and the battlegrounds gear is borderline handouts anyways.</p></blockquote><p>Learn to read, where did I ask to hand gear out to everyone?</p><p>What I asked it to disable toughness so that EVERYONE can get a fair shot.</p><p>Or is it too hard for you to understand what the fairness is?</p><p>Or, let pvp guy gets advantages so that they can get BG gear with relatively easy?</p></blockquote><p>I find it funny reading your posts, in your last post you raged on a guy and told him to stop dying and sucking at pvp on nagafen. Now youre hear QQing that you can't compete and get killed easy. </p><p>and just an FYI to be perfectly honest, they could give you a full set of BG gear.... its not going to stop you from getting wrecked by hardened seasoned pvpers from nagafen.  Your 20 minutes in a BG is what we do every day all day. So seriously its not the gear.</p><p>You are basically asking for a hand out because you can't beat people who have been pvping for years whiel you were killing scripted encounters... bluebies ftl....</p></blockquote><p>Who has advantage of gear? You, not players from pve servers.</p><p>Your insist of having gear advantage in the beginning of BG proved that it's you want to get easy kills and get gear handed to you without fair competiton.</p><p>If you are that good, why don't take a fair shot? Oh, your toughness is only on post, lol.</p>

Guld_Ulrish
02-27-2010, 11:47 AM
<p>Ween ween ween, PvPers are diffrent speced then pvers, I use 2 pvp aromor pieces, that is 7% toughness and I kill moast pvers without loosing any health. Got 39kills yesterday and 0 death was soloing all the time.</p><p>Moast Pvers play like this.</p><p>Dont Detarget</p><p>Dont Change back target if I taunt with my pet.</p><p>They try to kill my pet...</p><p>They stand still when I kite them</p><p>They dont cure fear,root,stun or stiffel</p><p>They dont counter with kb or fear when I cast heavy spells.</p><p>They dont slow me.</p><p>I guess I stop there before the list i 4pages long. But then I guess I only kill them cause of my 2 pieces of pvp gear <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p>

asaron
02-27-2010, 12:35 PM
<p>do you pve guys realize the mc mara set of gear has the exact same amount of toughness our level 80 pvp sets have right?</p>

asaron
02-27-2010, 12:37 PM
<p>and yes alot of you are gettin owned by the pvp servers due to tactics and aa not gear imbalance like the guy in anotehr thread tha tasked for healers to be able to heal on the run   on nagafen a healer is one of the toughest enemies you can find some wardens take 6+ people to kill in pvp on nagafen</p>

jam3
02-27-2010, 12:54 PM
<p>the old t8 pvp sets provide roughly 20% toughness so its not a huge advantage at all. I know a few players on nagafen who had 2-3 pvp pieces before battlegrounds stepped out though, but its probably less than 15 people that had this.</p><p>The advantages we have are simply the fear proc earring, which should of been nerfed 2 years ago, shifting band and a few other rok items that cause a lot of BS control effects and detargets.</p><p>I've seen some excellent PVE players so far though, some of the dracos argent and revelations guys are fun and good to play with and and against, but I've seen some terrible pve players that rush the center constantly after dying, die alone, and waste space</p>

wickermanuk
02-27-2010, 01:00 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>yadlajoi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>there need to have stun daze stiffle root immunity just in PVP ruleset. chanter can stunlock anyone brigand can stunlock anyone. immunity and reduced duration go stuns needed asap. also no more runspeed when carrying a flag.</blockquote><p>I think there is a immunity on stuns/dazes etc, i'm almost positive there is.</p><p>I play a chanter and believe me if they took away the ability to stun/daze/stifle people or even reduced it then you may as well just not bother as a chanter. What else do chanters have, their stupid low dmg spells, or power regen. Buffing people is useless as you're all over the place so buffs count for nothing.</p><p>Crowd control effects never seem to last that long to me, the action is to frantic to ever be in a position where someone simply stun locks you. I honestly think if they took those away it becomes more of a gank fest with everyone simply playing wizzys etc for their big hits.</p></blockquote><p>U must be a awful chanter then.....ive been top on damage in every bg ive played on my illy save one where i got beat by a warlock....and i dont even have the expansion on that account so no new pretty aa for me.</p></blockquote><p>Not really man, I got 23 kills and 35 kills on my last two gear games. But I bow down to the ubah chanter on the forums who obviously walks on water lol. I was replying to the guy who said they should reduce the stuns/stifles/dazes etc. I'm sorry but takes these away and it would have a massive impact on the illy class.</p><p>Also for example illys have PC a melee proc (remember coercers have a spell proc they place on themselves, which makes life a LOT easier), a reactive that should ideally be cast on a scout. Thats actually a LOT more difficult than most people would imagine, your group is normally spread all over the place so your relying on macroing it to yourself which isnt ideal.</p><p>CC effects are a awesome ability to have, these games need to have elements of strategy and variations in style rather than just mow every down.</p>

wickermanuk
02-27-2010, 01:06 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I've seen some excellent PVE players so far though, some of the dracos argent and revelations guys are fun and good to play with and and against, but I've seen some terrible pve players that rush the center constantly after dying, die alone, and waste space</p></blockquote><p>Well revelations is the top raid guild on Kithikor with by far the best gear, if your playing against avatar guilds like these as opposed to PUGs then obviously the competition is going to be a lot better.Most of the nubness I have seen is organized pvp players against pugs, in that competition there is only going to be 1 winner. Honestly though the nubfest are kinda fun, I think they end up being more entertaining than total serious pros.</p>

PeaSy1
02-27-2010, 01:33 PM
<p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>yadlajoi wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>there need to have stun daze stiffle root immunity just in PVP ruleset. chanter can stunlock anyone brigand can stunlock anyone. immunity and reduced duration go stuns needed asap. also no more runspeed when carrying a flag.</blockquote><p>I think there is a immunity on stuns/dazes etc, i'm almost positive there is.</p><p>I play a chanter and believe me if they took away the ability to stun/daze/stifle people or even reduced it then you may as well just not bother as a chanter. What else do chanters have, their stupid low dmg spells, or power regen. Buffing people is useless as you're all over the place so buffs count for nothing.</p><p>Crowd control effects never seem to last that long to me, the action is to frantic to ever be in a position where someone simply stun locks you. I honestly think if they took those away it becomes more of a gank fest with everyone simply playing wizzys etc for their big hits.</p></blockquote><p>U must be a awful chanter then.....ive been top on damage in every bg ive played on my illy save one where i got beat by a warlock....and i dont even have the expansion on that account so no new pretty aa for me.</p></blockquote><p>Not really man, I got 23 kills and 35 kills on my last two gear games. But I bow down to the ubah chanter on the forums who obviously walks on water lol. I was replying to the guy who said they should reduce the stuns/stifles/dazes etc. I'm sorry but takes these away and it would have a massive impact on the illy class.</p><p>Also for example illys have PC a melee proc (remember coercers have a spell proc they place on themselves, which makes life a LOT easier), a reactive that should ideally be cast on a scout. Thats actually a LOT more difficult than most people would imagine, your group is normally spread all over the place so your relying on macroing it to yourself which isnt ideal.</p><p>CC effects are a awesome ability to have, these games need to have elements of strategy and variations in style rather than just mow every down.</p></blockquote><p>With how fast paced bg fights are the current control effects change isnt really changing anything with aa you can still mez people for upwards 13 seconds on fast cast and 17.5 on other.....if thats isnt control idk what is, especially when ill kill people withing 3-5 seconds and move on to the next target.</p>

Pakhet
02-27-2010, 01:34 PM
<p>The only really hard to beat nagafen players are Onyx and well, they are hard to beat cause they not only are PvPers but they are also a huge raiding guild. They have the best gear of both worlds, play together as a team and know how to counter each class. But, oh well. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>There is no way to completely even it out - a person in MC is going to be disadvantaged from a person in legendary, a person in legendary to a person in fabled, etc.</p><p>The one item I DO find really annoying when fighting PvP players is the banshee hoop. Every 3 hits i'm feared against their healers and there is no way PvE players can have that since it is PvP loot. The ward procs etc, we can get too in PvE gear. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Melodii
02-27-2010, 01:39 PM
<p>Why on earth would u nerf run speed when u have a banner? I am a dirge, I SHOULD rightfully have run speed.. taking that away would be stupid and thats a stupid suggestion</p>

Ahlana
02-27-2010, 01:40 PM
<p><cite>Pakhet wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>The one item I DO find really annoying when fighting PvP players is the banshee hoop. Every 3 hits i'm feared against their healers and there is no way PvE players can have that since it is PvP loot. The ward procs etc, we can get too in PvE gear. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>Banshee hoop is completely negated by a crusader in group AA Fear Specced... make sure you take one with you <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Ace235228
02-27-2010, 01:46 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Why on earth would u nerf run speed when u have a banner? I am a dirge, I SHOULD rightfully have run speed.. taking that away would be stupid and thats a stupid suggestion</p></blockquote><p>Because its neigh impossible to kill a tank with the flag if he gets the 100%ish in combat run speed buff from a druid with the flag, especially since capturing it isn't an interuptable option.</p>

Guld_Ulrish
02-27-2010, 02:05 PM
<p><cite>Pakhet wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>The only really hard to beat nagafen players are Onyx and well, they are hard to beat cause they not only are PvPers but they are also a huge raiding guild. They have the best gear of both worlds, play together as a team and know how to counter each class. But, oh well. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p><p>There is no way to completely even it out - a person in MC is going to be disadvantaged from a person in legendary, a person in legendary to a person in fabled, etc.</p><p>The one item I DO find really annoying when fighting PvP players is the banshee hoop. Every 3 hits i'm feared against their healers and there is no way PvE players can have that since it is PvP loot. The ward procs etc, we can get too in PvE gear. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>I think you can find some more good pvp guilds to figth tbh. But yeah Onyx is hard.</p>

PeaSy1
02-28-2010, 06:29 AM
<p><cite>Ahlana wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Pakhet wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>The one item I DO find really annoying when fighting PvP players is the banshee hoop. Every 3 hits i'm feared against their healers and there is no way PvE players can have that since it is PvP loot. The ward procs etc, we can get too in PvE gear. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>Banshee hoop is completely negated by a crusader in group AA Fear Specced... make sure you take one with you <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" /></p></blockquote><p>The fear immune doesnt effect the group but nice try =)</p>

Batez
02-28-2010, 09:26 AM
<p>I have a full set of PVP gear on my guardian, which was a whopping 17% reduction of damage.  PVP gear does not make a difference compared to the avatar charms and other insane gear you bluebies have.  You bluebies lose for one reason and one reason only. You have no idea how to PVP.   PVP is not PVE where you pull a mob, stand there, face it to a wall while your group hits its back.  Mages can't stand still and expect to live, nor can healers.  You don't bunch up your mages and healers in 1 spot.  If there is high grounds, your mages and priests should be on it.  Tanks need to learn how to tank in PVP, it is not clicking 1 target and mashing taunt.</p><p>I have rolled hundreds of PVE groups in BG (full groups of guilds) with only a trio of naggy people, I have also been rolled by full groups and raids of PVEers while having full groups of naggy people on my team.  It is all about how you play.</p><p>If you guys really think 17% damage reduction explains you getting beat 701 - 0 in klak,  405 - 30 in CTF, I don't know what to say, because it doesn't.  A lot of bluebies are also going in there with treasured weapons and gear, how can you be on a blue server and not have a mythical... I don't get it lol.</p>

Cabel
02-28-2010, 10:03 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>It's normal that players from pvp servers have pvp gear.</p><p>However, for most players from pve servers, we do not.</p><p>It's cool to fight with players from pvp servers.</p><p>But it's not cool at all to fight against someone with full T8 pvp gear with tons of toughness and we have zero.</p><p>Toughness should be disabled in the first month of BG.</p></blockquote><p>Go buy some!  I'm on Najena and I can hang.  I'm not as good, but can hang a little bit.</p>

Siphar
02-28-2010, 10:03 AM
<p><cite>Batez wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I have a full set of PVP gear on my guardian, which was a whopping 17% reduction of damage.  <span style="color: #ff0000;">PVP gear does not make a difference compared to the avatar charms and other insane gear you bluebies have.</span>  You bluebies lose for one reason and one reason only. You have no idea how to PVP.   PVP is not PVE where you pull a mob, stand there, face it to a wall while your group hits its back.  Mages can't stand still and expect to live, nor can healers.  You don't bunch up your mages and healers in 1 spot.  If there is high grounds, your mages and priests should be on it.  Tanks need to learn how to tank in PVP, it is not clicking 1 target and mashing taunt.</p><p>I have rolled hundreds of PVE groups in BG (full groups of guilds) with only a trio of naggy people, I have also been rolled by full groups and raids of PVEers while having full groups of naggy people on my team.  It is all about how you play.</p><p>If you guys really think 17% damage reduction explains you getting beat 701 - 0 in klak,  405 - 30 in CTF, I don't know what to say, because it doesn't.  A lot of bluebies are also going in there with treasured weapons and gear, how can you be on a blue server and not have a mythical... I don't get it lol.</p></blockquote><p>OOps someone said it.... Bluebies have the obvious advantage of avatar gear that is infinitely more difficult to get in PvP. </p><p>But this doesn't count I guess..... lolz...</p>

Siphar
02-28-2010, 10:09 AM
<p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Here's a example of what happened to me today on gears.</p><p>Nagafen group vs <span style="color: #ff0000;">PUG</span>:</p><p>1. Fight starts</p><p>2. We run down and are killed literally no lie within 10 secs.</p><p>3. Nagafen group camps the spawn point</p><p>4. People jump down and die in 2/3 secs</p><p>5. Repeat 5/7 times</p><p>6. Team just decides to stand there and gives upIt was funny but in all honesty so hopelessly unbalanced I can imagine people just quiting.</p></blockquote><p>This happens every day on Nagafen.. an organised grp will destroy a PUG 99% of the time. Completely dominate them.</p><p>Then you have look at who you are fighting. Many people on nagafen raid 5 times/week and are hardcore into pvp.</p><p>Casual players on nagafen stand no chance whatsoever against this people, and neither do you....</p><p>Maybe someone needs to revive the Rules of the jungle thread...</p>

Risca
02-28-2010, 10:11 AM
<p>I got my first piece of toughness gear from doing battle grounds with out any toughness at all i had no problem fighting people form nagafen or from the blue servers</p><p>But then again i have been on the pvp server since it launched with kos and most that time was spent in exile Fighting a server full of pvp gear with out it.</p>

Siphar
02-28-2010, 10:15 AM
<p>PvE players must consider the learning curve of PvP.</p><p>Nagafen is a totally different game IMHO (outside of raid zones).</p><p>My experience of the general quality of the PvE players in PvP so far is weak, not specifically because of the gear, but because of things like curing, positioning and communication, which are essential to successful pvp.</p><p>As an illy in the BG's so far, i don't think a single non-healer has cured any of my CC... go figure...  and consider this if I mez the grp, teleport one away + root, then stun/stifle healers.. all of a sudden a grp of 6 v 6 just became a 6 v 3... and you wonder why you die..</p><p>I can therefore quickly understand how the pro pvp'ers slaughter the blue players.... and its not about 17% toughness..</p>

Batez
02-28-2010, 10:20 AM
<p><cite>Siphar wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Here's a example of what happened to me today on gears.</p><p>Nagafen group vs <span style="color: #ff0000;">PUG</span>:</p><p>1. Fight starts</p><p>2. We run down and are killed literally no lie within 10 secs.</p><p>3. Nagafen group camps the spawn point</p><p>4. People jump down and die in 2/3 secs</p><p>5. Repeat 5/7 times</p><p>6. Team just decides to stand there and gives upIt was funny but in all honesty so hopelessly unbalanced I can imagine people just quiting.</p></blockquote><p>This happens every day on Nagafen.. an organised grp will destroy a PUG 99% of the time. Completely dominate them.</p><p>Then you have look at who you are fighting. Many people on nagafen raid 5 times/week and are hardcore into pvp.</p><p>Casual players on nagafen stand no chance whatsoever against this people, and neither do you....</p><p>Maybe someone needs to revive the Rules of the jungle thread...</p></blockquote><p>It really doesn't even have anything to do with "nagafen" though.  Just read what he said:</p><p>Fight starts-  Before the fight started, did anyone look to see what the other team had?  Do they have warlocks / wizards?  do you have an AOE block? Do you AOE block before the rush?</p><p>We run down and are killed- Again, did you have any clue what you were running into?  Any planning?  Did your healer run in before the tank?  Did you have a fast person trying to get the relic or did you opt to let the other team get it and roll them?</p><p>Nagafen group camps spawn point- It is stupid for them to do so because you can temp up safely and come down at your leisure, should be an easy kill</p><p>people jump down and die in 2 - 3 seconds- Again, any planning?  did you AOE block?  Did you jump down 1 at a time?  or in a certain pattern?  I win fights all the time vs wizards/  warlocks because I let my group know on vent that I'm going to run in and eat all the AOEs solo and probably die, then my DPS comes in and [Removed for Content].  You can not randomly run around and expect to win an objective based game, plain and simple.  Has 0 to do with the server / gear, but generally nagafen people know how to plan for PVP more so than  PVE player, but that is assuming that no PVE player has ever played a FPS game or any other objective based game...  CTF is the same in every game, you should have a few defenders,  a few runners and the rest should be causing havoc somewhere.  A guardian should not be a defender, a mage, rangers, healer with root / stun etc. </p><p>I love when the other team defends their flag with 4 scouts and a tank and I pop reflexes and can't be hit for 20 seconds, I run into them, get  flag and sprint out with no scratches on me.  Usually im running in coordinated with a scout, so if I know I'm going to die, I bait the defender group so he can get the flag... all about teamwork, there is in game voice chat, so there is no reason to say "omg you have vent I don't"</p>

Kunaak
02-28-2010, 10:22 AM
<p>there really should be a simple check box.</p><p>Play Against PVP Servers? Yes/No</p><p>check it, or uncheck it.</p><p>for me - check, and stay checked.</p><p>playing against fully geared PVP geared players isnt even remotely fun.</p>

Siphar
02-28-2010, 10:25 AM
<p><cite>Kunaak wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>there really should be a simple check box.</p><p>Play Against PVP Servers? Yes/No</p><p>check it, or uncheck it.</p><p>for me - check, and stay checked.</p><p>playing against <span style="text-decoration: line-through;">fully geared PVP geared</span> <span style="color: #ff0000;">experienced</span> players isnt even remotely fun.</p></blockquote><p>Fixed it for you...</p><p>Have you played Call of duty? Do you expect to log in there and compete against people that have been in the genre for years and expect to compete? no... then why do it here then.. and then conveniently blame it on gear.</p><p>A poor craftsman always blames his tools..</p>

Batez
02-28-2010, 10:26 AM
<p>again, it is not our PVP gear that is beating you, it is our skill.  I shoud fraps some of these fights,  in CTF I don't even cast 1 offensive spell.  I cast 1 spell that any guardian in the game can get and get a flag cap, how does PVP gear matter there?</p><p>In hold the relic, I use a totem for run speed and click 2 spells to not die while holding the relic, how does PVP gear help there?</p><p>In the hold the territory I just run around like an idiot, beause it is impossible to coordinate 18 random people from different servers when my whole group is on vent.</p>

Siphar
02-28-2010, 10:26 AM
<p><cite>Siphar wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kunaak wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>there really should be a simple check box.</p><p>Play Against PVP Servers? Yes/No</p><p>check it, or uncheck it.</p><p>for me - check, and stay checked.</p><p>playing against <span style="text-decoration: line-through;">fully geared PVP geared</span> <span style="color: #ff0000;">experienced</span> players isnt even remotely fun.</p></blockquote><p>Fixed it for you...</p><p>Have you played Call of duty? Do you expect to log in there and play against people that have been in the genre for years and expect to "compete"? no... then why do it here then.. and then conveniently blame it on gear.</p><p>A poor craftsman always blames his tools..</p></blockquote>

BChizzle
02-28-2010, 11:39 AM
<p><cite>Siphar wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Fixed it for you...</p><p>Have you played Call of duty? Do you expect to log in there and compete against people that have been in the genre for years and expect to compete? no... then why do it here then.. and then conveniently blame it on gear.</p><p>A poor craftsman always blames his tools..</p></blockquote><p>First naggy players aren't anything special.  Onyx might be the exception but the top guild is hardly a representation of your server.  We all knew the headstart you guys were getting with gear was going to cause people to cry SOE choose to go the route so w/e.  Secondly you can't compare it to call of duty which is a game balanced simply on player skill where anyone can beat anyone even if its by sheer luck.  PVP armor is like rolling into call of duty as robocop despite what some people say it does provides a huge advantage but that advantage will be gone as soon as others can gear up.</p>

Ahlana
02-28-2010, 12:19 PM
<p><cite>BChizzle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>First naggy players aren't anything special.  Onyx might be the exception but the top guild is hardly a representation of your server.  We all knew the headstart you guys were getting with gear was going to cause people to cry SOE choose to go the route so w/e. </p></blockquote><p>You know some of us have downed our gear to MC BG gear to try and make it more of a challenge for ourselves... but testing has showed that it wasn't the gear after all <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Even with going in with the same gear that is avialable to PVEers the outcome is the same... There are a few decent PVEers in there and the others just don't know what to do. The way they position, the abilities and the order they use em in, everything screams that they think it should be fought like a mob in PVE. /shrug</p><p>I believe time will change things and not because of gear, just because most PVEers need time to learn the PVP system and until then they need to point their fingers somewhere... and their ego immediately points to gear.</p>

Jinoy
02-28-2010, 12:31 PM
<p>It is too easy to blame it all on gear. From what I see, and I have been playing with pick up groups a LOT, there is a huge difference in mentality. I've played with Nagafen players and we were -behind- in a CTF match, kept fighting and turned the match around in a win. All too often, I hear complaints from players "it's no use, it's nagafen, lets just sit here'. Well, with that attitude, those naggy dudes can strip naked and dance ... You will NEVER win.</p><p>On the other hand, I have been in pick up groups with players from blue servers who -did- fight back and we've had good games, AND wins, and yeah, also against teams with a lot of Nagafen/Vox in them. The best tip I can give anyone is not to waste time in battlegrounds on moaning what you don't have (healer, tank, conju, whatever), but exploit the strengths of the classe you do have.</p>

wickermanuk
02-28-2010, 12:31 PM
<p><cite>Ahlana wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>BChizzle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>First naggy players aren't anything special.  Onyx might be the exception but the top guild is hardly a representation of your server.  We all knew the headstart you guys were getting with gear was going to cause people to cry SOE choose to go the route so w/e.</p></blockquote><p>You know some of us have downed our gear to MC BG gear to try and make it more of a challenge for ourselves... but testing has showed that it wasn't the gear after all <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" /> Even with going in with the same gear that is avialable to PVEers the outcome is the same... There are a few decent PVEers in there and the others just don't know what to do. The way they position, the abilities and the order they use em in, everything screams that they think it should be fought like a mob in PVE. /shrug</p><p>I believe time will change things and not because of gear, just because most PVEers need time to learn the PVP system and until then they need to point their fingers somewhere... and their ego immediately points to gear.</p></blockquote><p>I disagree completely with this. From what I have seen the big difference is that the PVP players seem to be pre-grouped far far more than the PVE players.</p><p>Any premade group is going to destroy most pugs, you have no idea who you are playing with, nobody wants to take control and lead etc. Seems to me that the PVP servers are in BG a lot more than anyone else, i've seen more players from naggy than anything else. The opportunity to get easy gear seems to have got them all playing. I dont blame them, if I was on a PVP server i'd be all over BGs, I think for most PVE players they just mess around in them for the most part.</p>

Ahlana
02-28-2010, 12:48 PM
<p><cite>wickermanuk wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Ahlana wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>-snip-</blockquote><p>I disagree completely with this. From what I have seen the big difference is that the PVP players seem to be pre-grouped far far more than the PVE players.</p><p>Any premade group is going to destroy most pugs, you have no idea who you are playing with, nobody wants to take control and lead etc. Seems to me that the PVP servers are in BG a lot more than anyone else, i've seen more players from naggy than anything else. The opportunity to get easy gear seems to have got them all playing. I dont blame them, if I was on a PVP server i'd be all over BGs, I think for most PVE players they just mess around in them for the most part.</p></blockquote><p>You are right this is a big part as well. But that also has to do with experience... we know who to bring to the "party".</p><p>Preformed does indeed usually beat PuG, esspecially if you are just hoping to get a healer.. makes more sense to guarantee yourself a healer/tank combo and lots of DPS and CC.</p>

Shankapotomus
02-28-2010, 04:22 PM
<p>Wow... you guys are getting a week of gankings... Well try 88 levels of being ganked on a Pvp server. Then maybe you could have something to complain about. I've gotten all my gear for T8 PvP over a span of months, and you think it would be fair for SOE to take all that away from us PvPers so non competitive people can get in on the action? With this battlegrounds update it's possible to get fully geared with PvP gear in a matter of weeks. See whos complaining then</p>

Notsovilepriest
02-28-2010, 04:25 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Wow... you guys are getting a week of gankings... Well try 88 levels of being ganked on a Pvp server. Then maybe you could have something to complain about. I've gotten all my gear for T8 PvP over a span of months, and you think it would be fair for SOE to take all that away from us PvPers so non competitive people can get in on the action? With this battlegrounds update it's possible to get fully geared with PvP gear in a matter of weeks. See whos complaining then</p></blockquote><p>you could get T8 PvP gear just as fast as battlegrounds gear...I dont' know why you act like you couldn't</p>

Armawk
02-28-2010, 04:28 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Wow... you guys are getting a week of gankings... Well try 88 levels of being ganked on a Pvp server.</p></blockquote><p>ermmm. no thanks? people dont want to play gankworld thats why they dont play on a PvP server. BGs is something else not a place for PvPers to take out your frustrations about being ganked by better PvPers on PvE players who arent geared and practiced at this stuff. Its supposed to be fun for everyone.</p>

Notsovilepriest
02-28-2010, 04:31 PM
<p><cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Wow... you guys are getting a week of gankings... Well try 88 levels of being ganked on a Pvp server.</p></blockquote><p>ermmm. no thanks? people dont want to play gankworld thats why they dont play on a PvP server. BGs is something else not a place for PvPers to take out your frustrations about being ganked by better PvPers on PvE players who arent geared and practiced at this stuff. Its supposed to be fun for everyone.</p></blockquote><p>Lol, Not everyone will find things fun when there is a losing side. Majority of people hate to lose, it's the nature of the beast that there is a loser, therefore, a fair amount of people will dislike it if they lose a lot for any reason.</p>

Armawk
02-28-2010, 04:44 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Wow... you guys are getting a week of gankings... Well try 88 levels of being ganked on a Pvp server.</p></blockquote><p>ermmm. no thanks? people dont want to play gankworld thats why they dont play on a PvP server. BGs is something else not a place for PvPers to take out your frustrations about being ganked by better PvPers on PvE players who arent geared and practiced at this stuff. Its supposed to be fun for everyone.</p></blockquote><p>Lol, Not everyone will find things fun when there is a losing side. Majority of people hate to lose, it's the nature of the beast that there is a loser, therefore, a fair amount of people will dislike it if they lose a lot for any reason.</p></blockquote><p>Oh thats true, and got no sympathy or time for those.. to me a close loss is 99% of the fun a close win is. Its the ones who dont mind losing but in the end get ground down by sheer frustration at never even getting a hit in that I regret losing.</p><p>5 players beating on one isolated toon for 3 minutes then dying when they all ran out of power and he picks them off is silly somewhere.</p><p>Oh and *wave* hi, used to have a character in your guild on Venekor.. hope its still going well.</p>

Kiara
02-28-2010, 04:58 PM
<p>Once again, I'll remind folks that the forum rules apply here.</p><p>That means no calling people idiots, morons, scrubs, etc and telling them to learn to read, learn to play, or otherwise being a jerk <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>It isn't that hard to be nice to other people, anonymity of the interwebs notwithstanding.</p><p>That having been said, don't forget that you can have armour made that is MC and will give you more protection in BG's scenarios.</p>

kcirrot
02-28-2010, 05:24 PM
<p><cite>Kiara wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>That having been said, don't forget that you can have armour made that is MC and will give you more protection in BG's scenarios.</p></blockquote><p>Saying this as respectfully as I can.  Why not just sell a set of basic Legendary PvP gear for 5-10 tokens a piece?  Why gate this by crafters anyway?  I know the devs weren't purposefully trying to make this annoying, but that's the effect.</p>

Notsovilepriest
02-28-2010, 05:27 PM
<p><cite>kcirrot wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kiara wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>That having been said, don't forget that you can have armour made that is MC and will give you more protection in BG's scenarios.</p></blockquote><p>Saying this as respectfully as I can.  Why not just sell a set of basic Legendary PvP gear for 5-10 tokens a piece?  Why gate this by crafters anyway?  I know the devs weren't purposefully trying to make this annoying, but that's the effect.</p></blockquote><p>To help their economy after taking away less profitable tradeskills adornments IMO.</p>

Nayawk
02-28-2010, 05:46 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>kcirrot wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Kiara wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>That having been said, don't forget that you can have armour made that is MC and will give you more protection in BG's scenarios.</p></blockquote><p>Saying this as respectfully as I can.  Why not just sell a set of basic Legendary PvP gear for 5-10 tokens a piece?  Why gate this by crafters anyway?  I know the devs weren't purposefully trying to make this annoying, but that's the effect.</p></blockquote><p>To help their economy after taking away less profitable tradeskills adornments IMO.</p></blockquote><p>Then it seems certainly on my server that the crafters don't want that help because no one is making battlegrounds gear.</p>

Tehom
02-28-2010, 06:27 PM
<p><cite>Ahlana wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>You know some of us have downed our gear to MC BG gear to try and make it more of a challenge for ourselves... but testing has showed that it wasn't the gear after all <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" /> Even with going in with the same gear that is avialable to PVEers the outcome is the same... There are a few decent PVEers in there and the others just don't know what to do. The way they position, the abilities and the order they use em in, everything screams that they think it should be fought like a mob in PVE. /shrug</p></blockquote><p>When a few people who hadn't played pvp before told me they were nervous before going into battlegrounds, I told them to think of players as being 'just like mobs, but with worse AI'. It's usually pretty accurate.</p>

Muraazi
02-28-2010, 08:47 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>shaunfletcher wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Wow... you guys are getting a week of gankings... Well try 88 levels of being ganked on a Pvp server.</p></blockquote><p>ermmm. no thanks? people dont want to play gankworld thats why they dont play on a PvP server. BGs is something else not a place for PvPers to take out your frustrations about being ganked by better PvPers on PvE players who arent geared and practiced at this stuff. Its supposed to be fun for everyone.</p></blockquote><p>Lol, Not everyone will find things fun when there is a losing side. Majority of people hate to lose, it's the nature of the beast that there is a loser, therefore, a fair amount of people will dislike it if they lose a lot for any reason.</p></blockquote><p>A perfect time to give advice that I gave my friend once.....</p><p>Next few times people that hate to lose zone into BGs don't fight back. Just run into a group of players and suicide. Do that so many times until you can laugh about it. Just keep doing it, eventually you won't give a crap about dying. Then and only then you can free yourself of the tension you get from losing.</p>

Megavolt
02-28-2010, 09:35 PM
<p>Is this seriously a topic at all?</p><p>1) Know how to play your class, no Kiera I'm not calling em scrubs, just telling em there's more to their classes they need to learn that are more useful in pvp than they are in pve.</p><p>2)Yes they have alittle toughness, but guess what... you have access to better dps gear than most of them do. Toughness is not an end-all, just a little help.</p><p>3)Learn the other classes in the game. Knowing what your enemy is capable off also teaches you their limitations.</p><p>4)ffs grab a healer to take with you. If you ARE a healer grab a tank. If you have a tank and healer grab some CC. Got those set then move into dps.</p><p>5) There's no debt or repairs off of BG so die with style. Have fun with it. Once you learned how to die well enough then maybe you'll have enough tokens to buy some toughness gear.</p><p>6)The fear proc thingy is waaay OP, just sayin'...</p><p>If I'm really off base with this I guess I'm just one of those out of the norm, a PvEer that doesn't mind going against PvPers because at least its not a bulldozed zone. I like fighting. I don't mind dieing. Playing against a PvP team and getting stomped is still fun to me, it's when the system matches that premade group with 2 healers against my group with none that it gets me upset and I go hide in the corner and take my free token. As of today that sucks a bit more because to wait half an hour plus to get mismatched by the system with no healers I at least would like a fight.</p>