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View Full Version : Noticed some old style Erudites in the previews of SF


Zabjade
11-14-2009, 12:44 AM
<p><span style="color: #00cc00;">I wonder what the lore behind it was, where they protected by Al'Akbar[sp] or where they exploring the void?</span></p>

Vaedaer
11-14-2009, 12:56 AM
<p>Yeah that was a rather fun surprise, I like em better than the current Erudites myself lol. I wonder if in the future players could have an option to be one of the two erudites =o that would be fun. I miss the big forehead from eq1 even tho I've never used erudites much XP</p>

Cusashorn
11-14-2009, 01:15 AM
<p>According to Vhalen, the Erudites changed on an universal level. Not even being inside the void or on any of the planes would prevented them from changing.</p><p>I smell a retcon here.</p><div><a href="list.m?start=0&topic_id=357339#4060792"> <img src="../styles/EQ2/eq2_default/images/common/icon_minipost_new.gif" /></a>04/24/2007 12:05:00</div><p><cite>Vhalen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><strong>The changes to the Erudites were universal.</strong> These changes were not isolated to Odus. The catalyst of the transformation was located on Odus, but the effect extended out to <strong><span style="font-size: small;"><span style="font-size: large;">all</span> </span>erudites.</strong> The erudites have been researching one particular area of the arcane for a long time. That magic practice would play a large role in the celebration that became the catalyst. This field of the arcane has always interested them and you can find displays of that obsession in the pursuits of an erudite caste of old and a caste of new. What really happened to them? Did they evolve or mutate? We may never know until we step foot upon the shores of Odus, something that has been absent for quite sometime.</p></blockquote>

Aurel
11-14-2009, 01:24 AM
<p>*ponder*  Maybe they found a way to de-mutate / de-evolve?  *shrugs and ducks*</p>

Vaedaer
11-14-2009, 01:25 AM
<p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>According to Vhalen, the Erudites changed on an universal level. Not even being inside the void or on any of the planes would prevented them from changing.</p><p>I smell a retcon here.</p><div><a href="list.m?start=0&topic_id=357339#4060792"> <img src="../styles/EQ2/eq2_default/images/common/icon_minipost_new.gif" /></a>04/24/2007 12:05:00</div><p><cite>Vhalen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><strong>The changes to the Erudites were universal.</strong> These changes were not isolated to Odus. The catalyst of the transformation was located on Odus, but the effect extended out to <strong><span style="font-size: small;"><span style="font-size: large;">all</span> </span>erudites.</strong> The erudites have been researching one particular area of the arcane for a long time. That magic practice would play a large role in the celebration that became the catalyst. This field of the arcane has always interested them and you can find displays of that obsession in the pursuits of an erudite caste of old and a caste of new. What really happened to them? Did they evolve or mutate? We may never know until we step foot upon the shores of Odus, something that has been absent for quite sometime.</p></blockquote></blockquote><p>Yeah the newer devs seem to be changing everything the older ones did, in EQ1 is being the same. I doubt they will have a logical explanation for it too =P But still it was a surprise/change I welcome gladly ~ lol</p><p>(on a totally unrelated note, anyone know if you need an active account to post here? I can't post on my main account which is inactive atm, so I had to post with my second account =x)</p>

Cusashorn
11-14-2009, 01:31 AM
<p>I'm curious to hear their reasoning as well. Gninja already told me that the transformation itself was an accident.</p>

Vaedaer
11-14-2009, 01:40 AM
<p><cite>Aurelis wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>*ponder*  Maybe they found a way to de-mutate / de-evolve?  *shrugs and ducks*</p></blockquote><p>That could be too /shrug, if Al'kabor was around he could of had found a way to revert it or something fun like that.</p>

The_Cheeseman
11-14-2009, 01:58 AM
<p>Or perhaps the screen shot in question is of a past event; a vision of a person that existed before the change. Or the person has used magic to alter their appearance so that they look like they used to before the change (as a powerful enchanter would be able to do fairly easily). Or perhaps there was a special, isolated group that were not affected for some important, lore-related reason. I think there are enough possibilities that we don't have to immediately assume a total retcon or abandonment of existing lore.</p>

Kamimura
11-14-2009, 02:05 AM
<p><cite>Aurelis wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>*ponder*  Maybe they found a way to de-mutate / de-evolve?  *shrugs and ducks*</p></blockquote><p>If they did, I hope they share their secret. :p</p>

teddyboy4
11-14-2009, 03:09 AM
<p>It's far more likely that those Erudites are in some flashback cutscene or something rather then a retcon. They could even be in some type of time-travel event where we go back to the past and interact with the Erudites in the time leading up to thier change. I don't think we should just be throwing around the possibility of a retcon so quickly, especially with all the new stuff we've been seeing lately, like Chronomancy for instance, or when you enter into PoF and meet up with the Ethernauts...there's just too many possibilities to jump to retcon right away.</p>

Zabjade
11-14-2009, 11:29 PM
<p><span style="color: #00cc00;">Perhaps Al'Akbar or some other Erudite was shielding some Erudites in case the new Nexus went Boomy and they did not transform, but hid out until later.</span></p>

Xalmat
11-15-2009, 03:21 AM
<p>On a related note, what's with Miragul and all the Erudites in his planar shard not being evolved? I'm not talking his Phylactery, I'm talking his Planar Shard.</p>

Cusashorn
11-15-2009, 03:28 AM
<p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>On a related note, what's with Miragul and all the Erudites in his planar shard not being evolved? I'm not talking his Phylactery, I'm talking his Planar Shard.</p></blockquote><p>Planes can and will appear however it's creator wishes for others to see it. Miragul obviously wants us to see how his race used to be in the past.</p>

Mirander_1
11-15-2009, 08:45 PM
<p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>According to Vhalen, the Erudites changed on an universal level. Not even being inside the void or on any of the planes would prevented them from changing.</p><p>I smell a retcon here.</p><div><a href="list.m?start=0&topic_id=357339#4060792"> <img src="../styles/EQ2/eq2_default/images/common/icon_minipost_new.gif" /></a>04/24/2007 12:05:00</div><p><cite>Vhalen wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><strong>The changes to the Erudites were universal.</strong> These changes were not isolated to Odus. The catalyst of the transformation was located on Odus, but the effect extended out to <strong><span style="font-size: small;"><span style="font-size: large;">all</span> </span>erudites.</strong> The erudites have been researching one particular area of the arcane for a long time. That magic practice would play a large role in the celebration that became the catalyst. This field of the arcane has always interested them and you can find displays of that obsession in the pursuits of an erudite caste of old and a caste of new. What really happened to them? Did they evolve or mutate? We may never know until we step foot upon the shores of Odus, something that has been absent for quite sometime.</p></blockquote></blockquote><p>Vhalen could've just not wanted to spoil the surprise.  Or (if I recall the thread that quote came from correctly) Vhalen could have been making more of a statement that none of the Erudites escaped transformation by happenstance (i.e.: just being far away from Odus, or on another plane, wasn't enough to avoid it), but some of the Erudites that saw it coming managed to shield themselves from it.</p><p>Personally, I'm betting that the un-evolved Erudites will be the result of the efforts of the guy from the 'Halls of Erudin' books, the one who suspected that the Ulteran Spires and the new Nexus wouldn't work.  He'll probably try to shield some Erudites from the effects of it.</p>

Cusashorn
11-15-2009, 08:55 PM
<p>It's kind of hard to see an uncalculated accident coming though.</p>

Meirril
11-16-2009, 12:04 AM
<p>My personal bet would be time travel into the past, or some past euradites time traveling forward.</p>

Rezikai
11-16-2009, 01:01 AM
<p>Aye, i think we travel back in time a bit. In the video we see a group port through a bunch of zig zag particle effects together, I'm betting at least some of the zones take place between the two games eq1-eq2 in the Age of War or Cataclysms, before the event that changed erudites.</p>

Homeskillet
11-16-2009, 02:09 AM
<p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>On a related note, what's with Miragul and all the Erudites in his planar shard not being evolved? I'm not talking his Phylactery, I'm talking his Planar Shard.</p></blockquote><p>Planes can and will appear however it's creator wishes for others to see it. Miragul obviously wants us to see how his race used to be in the past.</p></blockquote><p>I love when you make stuff up, it's funny.</p>

Cusashorn
11-16-2009, 03:38 AM
<p><cite>Homeskillet wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>On a related note, what's with Miragul and all the Erudites in his planar shard not being evolved? I'm not talking his Phylactery, I'm talking his Planar Shard.</p></blockquote><p>Planes can and will appear however it's creator wishes for others to see it. Miragul obviously wants us to see how his race used to be in the past.</p></blockquote><p>I love when you make stuff up, it's funny.</p></blockquote><p>Go speak with that Owl in Tenebrous Tangle standing next to the Spires portal to Antonica and Commonlands.</p>

Homeskillet
11-16-2009, 03:51 AM
<p>So the owl has lots to say about what Miragul obviously wants, does he?</p><p>Actually, he just mentions how the Bonemire is the front yard of the dragon empire in the clouds. He sure doesn't say anything like, "Cusahorn makes stuff up and acts like it is absolute fact instead of conjecture and assumptions."</p>

Mynervia
11-16-2009, 07:43 AM
<p><cite>Homeskillet wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>On a related note, what's with Miragul and all the Erudites in his planar shard not being evolved? I'm not talking his Phylactery, I'm talking his Planar Shard.</p></blockquote><p>Planes can and will appear however it's creator wishes for others to see it. Miragul obviously wants us to see how his race used to be in the past.</p></blockquote><p>I love when you make stuff up, it's funny.</p></blockquote><p>Pretty sure that one's been mentioned plenty, though.  The planes are what their relevant god wants them to be; they shape and mold it, consciously or unconsciously, and it becomes an expression of themselves.  And we only see some tiny shred of a plane (even in EQ1's version, before it was "shards" of everything), so the portion we see could be further biased to some particular subset of the plane's master's presentation desires.</p>

Vaedaer
11-16-2009, 11:37 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Homeskillet wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>Xalmat wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>On a related note, what's with Miragul and all the Erudites in his planar shard not being evolved? I'm not talking his Phylactery, I'm talking his Planar Shard.</p></blockquote><p>Planes can and will appear however it's creator wishes for others to see it. Miragul obviously wants us to see how his race used to be in the past.</p></blockquote><p>I love when you make stuff up, it's funny.</p></blockquote><p>Pretty sure that one's been mentioned plenty, though.  The planes are what their relevant god wants them to be; they shape and mold it, consciously or unconsciously, and it becomes an expression of themselves.  And we only see some tiny shred of a plane (even in EQ1's version, before it was "shards" of everything), so the portion we see could be further biased to some particular subset of the plane's master's presentation desires.</p></blockquote><p>Yup, the planes reflect their owner deity and their current mood, thats why plane of love is decaying and the creatures angered/sorrowful, thats why on EQ1 Solteris, plane of rage and plane of music are as they are, because the deities on those planes are corrupted,etc.  The stronger the deity, the stronger the plane. Miragul's plane, even tho I haven't been in it (only the phylacteries) probably shows how he used to know norrath, I don't think he knows how the erudites are now or whatever, I am not sure whats up with him in this game =P.</p><p>Oh, Instead of trolling we should just help each other! of course that would be in a perfect world that doesn't exist but.</p>

Saroc_Luclin
11-16-2009, 11:48 AM
<p><klingon>"We don't talk about it."</klingon></p>

Dreyco
11-16-2009, 02:35 PM
<p>Vhalen, as wonderful of a lore writer as he was, also kept a lot of things close to his chest and spoke in a lot of riddles.  This makes what he says very, very difficult to construe what he has said as canon unless it is played out in game... which, in this case, it is now coming out in the game <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>The devs aren't retconning anything, and are staying very faithful to Vhalen's notes.  I got to see some of them myself at Fan Faire.  So i'm sure what we're about to see on Odus will explain everything that probably happened with the Erudites transformation and why some were immune to it.</p>

Ragnaphore
11-16-2009, 06:34 PM
<p><cite>Meirril wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>My personal bet would be time travel into the past, or some past euradites time traveling forward.</p></blockquote><p>That's my bet too.</p><p>Another - less likely - possibility is these Erudites were dead at the time of the transformation (e.g. the undead Erudite in Unrest)</p>

zerfall
11-16-2009, 11:48 PM
<p>I don't know if this contributes much, but isn't there a non-transformed Erudite up in Barren Sky, on the isle with all the Gazers?  I think it's in the north east corner or that vicinity.</p><p>I remember him because as I was levelling up a Necro in that area and doing quests a long time ago, I had read a thread here regarding Erudites and how they got transformed.  I thought to myself that it was funny how he wasn't transformed...</p>

Zabjade
11-17-2009, 01:51 AM
<p><span style="color: #00cc00;">Hmm What about Cross Dimensional Time Travel? After all Everquest I split from Everquest II when the plane of Time was discovered etc. Perhaps we have a group od Erudites who mis-teleported?</span></p>

PinChaser
11-17-2009, 02:16 AM
<p>mm, i'm hopping SoE doesn't address the time split until EQ3 (if there is one). </p>

Cusashorn
11-17-2009, 02:27 AM
<p><cite>Homeskillet wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>So the owl has lots to say about what Miragul obviously wants, does he?</p><p>Actually, he just mentions how the Bonemire is the front yard of the dragon empire in the clouds. He sure doesn't say anything like, "Cusahorn makes stuff up and acts like it is absolute fact instead of conjecture and assumptions."</p></blockquote><p>He mentions how the planes are willfully shaped by the desires of it's owner, and that we only see what they want us to see.</p>

Mynervia
11-17-2009, 03:51 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I don't know if this contributes much, but isn't there a non-transformed Erudite up in Barren Sky, on the isle with all the Gazers? I think it's in the north east corner or that vicinity.</p><p>I remember him because as I was levelling up a Necro in that area and doing quests a long time ago, I had read a thread here regarding Erudites and how they got transformed. I thought to myself that it was funny how he wasn't transformed...</p></blockquote><p>He labels himself as an escapee from the Vaults of El'Arad, and asks you to recover arcane info from the Vaults for him. When you return the information to him, he uses it to teleport himself (skimping you on your reward) - and he says his destination is Odus ("To Odus I go!").  Since Vaults are a Quellithulian thing, I figured that was our most obvious and direct reason for the Quellthulian-led Spire efforts as a prelude to an Odus expansion - the Erudites in Vaults had been working on getting to Odus, and now they had succeded on a large scale.</p><p>(The NPC is Arcanist Nazoor, and the quest is "Stranded!".  The <a href="http://eq2.wikia.com/wiki/File:Arcanist_Nazoor.jpg">EQ2i screenshot</a> looks ambiguous to me as to what kind of Erudite he is, since the robe hides a great deal, but I don't see anything blatantly marking him as EQ1-style rather than EQ2-style)</p>

Kamimura
11-17-2009, 05:24 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>(The NPC is Arcanist Nazoor, and the quest is "Stranded!".  The <a href="http://eq2.wikia.com/wiki/File:Arcanist_Nazoor.jpg">EQ2i screenshot</a> looks ambiguous to me as to what kind of Erudite he is, since the robe hides a great deal, but I don't see anything blatantly marking him as EQ1-style rather than EQ2-style)</p></blockquote><p>Actually, it's clear he's one of the changed Erudites. Grey skin, a rune pattern, the style of eyes.. Erudites in EQL didn't look anything like that.</p>

Mynervia
11-17-2009, 05:51 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>(The NPC is Arcanist Nazoor, and the quest is "Stranded!". The <a href="http://eq2.wikia.com/wiki/File:Arcanist_Nazoor.jpg">EQ2i screenshot</a> looks ambiguous to me as to what kind of Erudite he is, since the robe hides a great deal, but I don't see anything blatantly marking him as EQ1-style rather than EQ2-style)</p></blockquote><p>Actually, it's clear he's one of the changed Erudites. Grey skin, a rune pattern, the style of eyes.. Erudites in EQL didn't look anything like that.</p></blockquote><p>Gah, you're right.  Guess I've been away from EQ1 too long ><</p>

Meirril
11-17-2009, 08:32 AM
<p><cite>Zabjade wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span style="color: #00cc00;">Hmm What about Cross Dimensional Time Travel? After all Everquest I split from Everquest II when the plane of Time was discovered etc. Perhaps we have a group od Erudites who mis-teleported?</span></p></blockquote><p>Its possible. Did anyone notice if any of the Euradites had goatees? Agonizers perhaps?</p>

Saroc_Luclin
11-17-2009, 04:15 PM
<p><cite>Zabjade wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><span style="color: #00cc00;">Hmm What about Cross Dimensional Time Travel? After all Everquest I split from Everquest II when the plane of Time was discovered etc. Perhaps we have a group od Erudites who mis-teleported?</span></p></blockquote><p>That would be neat, especially considering all the time travel and plane hopping EQLivers are doing lately; it wouldn't be too big a jump for some adventuring party to get 'lost' going through the EQLive Void at the end of time. Probably not the actual case, but it would be neat to see happen in either direction. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Rainmare
11-17-2009, 05:07 PM
<p>I think it'll be that the scholar form the lore stories did manage to shield some from the effects. he knew then that building the new nexus was a bad idea, on faulty information. he had support in Erudin at least by the way the Deepwater Knights treated him.</p><p>I'll bet when El'Arad and the High Council tell him to bugger off they are going to do it anyway, he took measures to prevent effects of something going horribly wrong, like he's predicting, and those that were with him on his research or willing to give him the benifit of doubt were protected by his counter/precaution measures.</p>

Cusashorn
11-17-2009, 05:22 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I think it'll be that the scholar form the lore stories did manage to shield some from the effects. he knew then that building the new nexus was a bad idea, on faulty information. he had support in Erudin at least by the way the Deepwater Knights treated him.</p><p>I'll bet when El'Arad and the High Council tell him to bugger off they are going to do it anyway, he took measures to prevent effects of something going horribly wrong, like he's predicting, and those that were with him on his research or willing to give him the benifit of doubt were protected by his counter/precaution measures.</p></blockquote><p>I guess that's plausible and possible, but Gninja said the entire transformation happened entirely by accident. I don't think anyone would have seen it coming. Preparing for disaster is one thing, but to prevent this specifically?</p>

Kamimura
11-17-2009, 07:28 PM
<p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I think it'll be that the scholar form the lore stories did manage to shield some from the effects. he knew then that building the new nexus was a bad idea, on faulty information. he had support in Erudin at least by the way the Deepwater Knights treated him.</p><p>I'll bet when El'Arad and the High Council tell him to bugger off they are going to do it anyway, he took measures to prevent effects of something going horribly wrong, like he's predicting, and those that were with him on his research or willing to give him the benifit of doubt were protected by his counter/precaution measures.</p></blockquote><p>I guess that's plausible and possible, but Gninja said the entire transformation happened entirely by accident. I don't think anyone would have seen it coming. Preparing for disaster is one thing, but to prevent this specifically?</p></blockquote><p>The transformation was an accident, but that doesn't mean whatever they were doing that transformed everyone wasn't a planned event. If there was a shielding involved, they could have been trying to protect themselves from whatever else was going on that caused the unintended side effect - also unintentinally protecting themselves from that as well.</p>

Lodrelhai
11-17-2009, 08:15 PM
<p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I think it'll be that the scholar form the lore stories did manage to shield some from the effects. he knew then that building the new nexus was a bad idea, on faulty information. he had support in Erudin at least by the way the Deepwater Knights treated him.</p><p>I'll bet when El'Arad and the High Council tell him to bugger off they are going to do it anyway, he took measures to prevent effects of something going horribly wrong, like he's predicting, and those that were with him on his research or willing to give him the benifit of doubt were protected by his counter/precaution measures.</p></blockquote><p>I guess that's plausible and possible, but Gninja said the entire transformation happened entirely by accident. I don't think anyone would have seen it coming. Preparing for disaster is one thing, but to prevent this specifically?</p></blockquote><p>An accident just means it wasn't intended.  Someone taking a long, close look at the situation might still see the potential dangers, but if no one actually working on the project believes them, then no precautions are taken.  That individual might have the resources to make their own precautions though.</p><p>Don't most accidents actually turn out to be just that?  Situations which at the time seem to come out of the blue,  but in hindsight had given ample warning or been easily preventable?  If he'd just worn his seatbelt, if she'd used the proper safety equipment, if they'd paid attention to the warning signs...  The Three Mile Island nuclear accident came down, in the end, to a safety violation - the auxilary feedwater pump valves had been closed for maintenance, but the reactor left online because the main pump was handling the load.  No one expected the main pump would happen to fail just then, except for the person or persons who set up the safety protocols in the first place.  Adequet precautions were available and the consequences of not taking them were known - but the people actually on the job decided not to follow procedure.  Nuclear meltdown.</p>

Cusashorn
11-18-2009, 12:18 AM
<p>I don't know.. Something in my mind wants to think that nobody could have seen a metaphysical change like this coming to them.</p>

Kamimura
11-18-2009, 01:53 AM
<p><cite>Cusashorn wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I don't know.. Something in my mind wants to think that nobody could have seen a metaphysical change like this coming to them.</p></blockquote><p>Well, again, maybe such a change was not what they were intending to shield against. Something was going down, it's not too out there to think that someone who knew of it thought it was a bad idea for whatever reasons, and wanted to protect against it somehow. Who knows, really.. there are a lot of factors to consider, and it's pretty much all speculation at this point..</p>

Cusashorn
11-18-2009, 02:02 AM
<p>Yep. Just gotta find out when the expansion comes out.</p>

Paragone
11-18-2009, 08:03 PM
<p>What I find very interesting is everyone is focusing on the erudites "transformation". Aside from appearances what else is different? They still function the same. A horse of a different name is a horse all the same.</p>

Homeskillet
11-18-2009, 09:34 PM
<p>Not like it's a drastic or often noticed differences, but all Erudites can see the auras of people, which as far as game function goes it lets you determine if they are spellcasters etc. While they have always excelled at scholarly pursuits (hell, that is literally a synonym for the word "erudite"), their affinity for magic as a whole is more so than other races. You really don't see the fealty to Prexus and diversity that you used to.</p>

Zabjade
11-19-2009, 05:49 AM
<p><span style="color: #00cc00;">Cross-time or Al'Akbar still seem the best bets to me. </span></p><p><span style="color: #00cc00;">Aura Vision shouls at least show SOMETHING when a Monk is looked at I mean sure they don't cast Spells(although SK's and Pallies DO and don't show up as far as I know) But Monks did Originate Combat arts which is taking anmiane mana and channeling it through the body.</span></p>

Meirril
11-19-2009, 09:29 AM
<p><cite>Paragone wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>What I find very interesting is everyone is focusing on the erudites "transformation". Aside from appearances what else is different? They still function the same. A horse of a different name is a horse all the same.</p></blockquote><p>Pre-transformation they were the most intelligent race on Norrath, but still retained a strong link in appearance to their human heritage. As much as a Human looks like a Barbarian, an Euradite looked like a Human. The only major differences were a slight cone shape to the head (giving a huge forehead), darker skin, and curly black hair.</p><p>Post-transformation the Euradites have nearly severed any connection to the human race. It isn't just their skin tone, or the color of their eyes. They have magic embeded in the very fiber of their being. Every Euradite has a pattern of runes that naturally appears on their skin. You can argue that they are more inherantly magical than Elves or Fae. They are the only race that can trace their magical influence to arcane sources rather than divine. The Sarnak and Droag were created throgh magical experimentation, but it didn't infuse them with magic. The Euradites are forever altered by magic. Is it a new found strength, or a curse? At this point, we don't know.</p><p>They still seem as agrogant, egotistical, and self-centered as they use to be. They have changed the center of their culture to the combined Quellthulian belief system to consolidate the race into a united front. Some may still worship Perexus, others may still worship Innoruk. Probably they all still curse gnomes and Brell. They may even still harbor some hostility towards the Kerra. I guess we'll find out when SF opens.</p><p>If you want to say that an Ogre is a big and stupid human, then yeah a horse is a horse. But that would also make you the kind of person that doesn't look at the horse's teeth when you buy one.</p>

Cusashorn
11-19-2009, 11:26 AM
<p><cite>Meirril wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Some may still worship Perexus, others may still worship Innoruk.</p></blockquote><p>Most of Erudin worshiped Quellious more than Prexus, and the heretics originally worshipped Bertoxxulous before switching to Cazic Thule. Just wanted to clarify that for you.</p>

Aneova
11-19-2009, 03:30 PM
<p>2 words... Time Traveling.</p>

timetravelling
11-19-2009, 04:50 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>2 words... Time Traveling.</p></blockquote><p>1 word! =P</p>

Dreyco
11-19-2009, 06:05 PM
<p>Not to argue Cusa, but Vhalen didn't actually SAY a lot.  Heh.  He left a lot of wide open gaps and "Fill in the blanks". Despite being a very talented writer, we were left guessing more than actually knowing.</p><p>Connotations that were put toward Erudites possibly being transformed on a global scale could have been the farthest thing from the truth, and mere speculation based on the hints that he gave to us.  So it's very possible that the Erudites here are just as viable an option for players as anything else.</p>

Meirril
11-19-2009, 09:26 PM
<p><cite>Dreyco wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Not to argue Cusa, but Vhalen didn't actually SAY a lot.  Heh.  He left a lot of wide open gaps and "Fill in the blanks". Despite being a very talented writer, we were left guessing more than actually knowing.</p><p>Connotations that were put toward Erudites possibly being transformed on a global scale could have been the farthest thing from the truth, and mere speculation based on the hints that he gave to us.  So it's very possible that the Erudites here are just as viable an option for players as anything else.</p></blockquote><p>While I'd love to have the old EQ1 model Euradites as an option for players, I'm certain that its been stated several times that the change to the Euradite race happened on a universal level. That in fact, all euradites that exist at the moment of the ceremony anywhere in the universe (Norrath and other planes) were affected.</p><p>We don't know if time-traveling Euradites would be affected or not. Its possible that if Al'kabor time traveled to modern Norrath he would undergo the transformation himself! There is a lot about this we don't understand. If the whole transformation is some kind of curse, we might actually be able to end the curse in SF and possibly introduce some kind of mechanic where individual Euradites would be able to transform themselves back to their EQ1 appearance. I seriously doubt that would happen, but its possible.</p>

Mynervia
11-21-2009, 01:06 AM
<p>Maybe I'm blind (as was pointed out earlier in this thread), but I only noticed the 1 old-style Erudite, the guy on the pedestal. If it is one singular person, there's a lot more ways for *1* person to have avoided/shielded/prevented/reversed/covered-up the transformation without wider implications, than for even a small group to have.</p><p>Or it could always be a golem, projection, or other constructed being, rather than a true Erudite.</p>

Vaedaer
11-21-2009, 01:31 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Maybe I'm blind (as was pointed out earlier in this thread), but I only noticed the 1 old-style Erudite, the guy on the pedestal. If it is one singular person, there's a lot more ways for *1* person to have avoided/shielded/prevented/reversed/covered-up the transformation without wider implications, than for even a small group to have.</p><p>Or it could always be a golem, projection, or other constructed being, rather than a true Erudite.</p></blockquote><p>Nah there are more, in the trailer they are waking through a city or something and behind them and walking by them are some more erudites, and there are some pictures on Zam too iirc that at least 3 more.</p>

Wilde_Night
11-21-2009, 04:53 AM
<p>I just watched the trailer again.  While the adventuring party walks through the city, you can see 4 NPC models.  Of which, you can see no faces.  They are all hooded or wearing helms.  I see no way this could lead to conclusive evidence of more than that one NPC pictured being old-style Erudites.</p>

Mythanote
11-21-2009, 05:11 AM
<p>Maybe it's Al'Kabor himself, the solitary non-changed Erudite....</p><p>*Pointy hat on*</p>

Vaedaer
11-21-2009, 06:32 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I just watched the trailer again.  While the adventuring party walks through the city, you can see 4 NPC models.  Of which, you can see no faces.  They are all hooded or wearing helms.  I see no way this could lead to conclusive evidence of more than that one NPC pictured being old-style Erudites.</p></blockquote><p>Well if you didn't believed that, nor noticed (or maybe is me) the bigger heads on the npc  and didn't cared to check the other thing I said, here you go</p><p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.zam.com/Im/image/gallery/147953" target="_blank">http://www.zam.com/Im/image/gallery/147953</a></p><p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.zam.com/Im/image/gallery/147951" target="_blank">http://www.zam.com/Im/image/gallery/147951</a></p><p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.zam.com/Im/image/gallery/147962" target="_blank">http://www.zam.com/Im/image/gallery/147962</a></p><p>If those aren't old school erudites then  I don't know what.</p>

Wilde_Night
11-21-2009, 06:46 AM
<p>My apologies, I forgot about those.  They were some of the first shots released.  Even so, personally, I think that the chances of player Erudites getting the option to "return" to their original racial appearance is slim to none.  These Erudites seem to be NPC only, from all of the other evidence we have from the trailer and the screenshots.  Why they are unchanged will be a great mystery to uncover.</p><p>* Edit - In fact... are they even really Erudites?  Perhaps they are not what they appear...</p>

Vaedaer
11-21-2009, 07:13 AM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>My apologies, I forgot about those.  They were some of the first shots released.  Even so, personally, I think that the chances of player Erudites getting the option to "return" to their original racial appearance is slim to none.  These Erudites seem to be NPC only, from all of the other evidence we have from the trailer and the screenshots.  Why they are unchanged will be a great mystery to uncover.</p><p>* Edit - In fact... are they even really Erudites?  Perhaps they are not what they appear...</p></blockquote><p>I agree with you they look . . . weirder =P but then again its 5 am i havent slept since thrusday night and everything looks weird to me right now D:</p><p>I can't wait for SF omg >< I wanna go back to the hole! fall down and die! like the good ol times.</p><p>They are probably voidmen in disguise /nods /nods =P or Cyborgs! and we will raid Arnold too! >_> Yeah I should go to bed lol.</p>

Beef_Supre
11-21-2009, 01:59 PM
<p>I am pumped about seeing 'The Hole' as well.. that was a long time favorite (along with CoM) for me as well.</p><p>The Erudites in the screenshots look [Removed for Content], but good. While I never played one in EQlive, I was a huge fan of the semi-mohawk look they had, especially when people worked around the hood graphic (think it took clicking off an illusion?).. High-and-Tight for the win! OOHRAH!</p>

Homeskillet
11-21-2009, 03:16 PM
<p>I want to be a really smart black dude with a big head again.</p>

Ambrin
11-21-2009, 05:44 PM
<p>Aren't most of the NPC's in Crucible old style Erudite's? I was going through a level 50 version of the zone today so I could do the Darkmail Gauntlets questline and I stopped to look at some of the guard/researchers and they all appeared to be Erudite's as seen in EQLive.</p><p>Has this been otherwise explained? If not, how does it fit in with the Erudite's we saw in the trailer?</p><p>EDIT: I'm not talking about the planar shard that was discussed earlier.</p>

Kamimura
11-21-2009, 06:32 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Aren't most of the NPC's in Crucible old style Erudite's?</p></blockquote><p>Well, they're actually EQ2 human models, but I think they're supose to represent old style Erudites considering they're all named after old Erudin guilds (Deepwater Knights, Crimson Hands, etc).. I don't really know the lore of the zone though, so can't help much beyond that.. (Edit: Wait, isn't it because he created everything in these zones.. so he would have made them look as he knew them then? Same sort of thinking as the shard.. Or am I remembering incorrectly?)</p>

Vaedaer
11-21-2009, 06:34 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Aren't most of the NPC's in Crucible old style Erudite's? I was going through a level 50 version of the zone today so I could do the Darkmail Gauntlets questline and I stopped to look at some of the guard/researchers and they all appeared to be Erudite's as seen in EQLive.</p><p>Has this been otherwise explained? If not, how does it fit in with the Erudite's we saw in the trailer?</p><p>EDIT: I'm not talking about the planar shard that was discussed earlier.</p></blockquote><p>The ones on the crucible are just bald humans with pope hat dealy to make them look like if they were eq1 style erudites from Miragul's memories. Even tho bald humans aren't that far from EQlive style erudites there are still noticeable differences.</p>

Mynervia
11-22-2009, 12:09 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Aren't most of the NPC's in Crucible old style Erudite's?</p></blockquote><p>Well, they're actually EQ2 human models, but I think they're supose to represent old style Erudites considering they're all named after old Erudin guilds (Deepwater Knights, Crimson Hands, etc).. I don't really know the lore of the zone though, so can't help much beyond that.. (Edit: Wait, isn't it because he created everything in these zones.. so he would have made them look as he knew them then? Same sort of thinking as the shard.. Or am I remembering incorrectly?)</p></blockquote><p>My understanding was that the three Miragul's zones, being in Miragul's Phylactary, are all based on Miragul's internal mental representations of places, rather than being based on the real locations - ie the zones are based on Miragul's interpretation / mental picture of Erudin, rather than being based on Erudin proper.  Hence, since in Miragul's time(s), Erudin was populated by EQ1-style Erudites, the Erudites presented in his mental construct are of that form.</p><p>Essentially, it doesn't violate the "all erudites everywhere were changed", because they're not <em>Erudites</em>, they're <em>memories</em> of Erudites.</p>