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Jethal
12-12-2008, 12:01 PM
<p>Emotions run high as Sony unleashes "<a href="http://www.station.sony.com/en/stationcash/index.vm" target="_blank">Station Cash</a>" - Jethal puts in a, rare, serious plea to the people.. <a href="http://www.kithicor.org/index.php?action=fullnews&id=73" target="_blank">Click Here</a></p>

Elya
12-12-2008, 01:43 PM
<p>I have to agree with Jethal on this one. The armor sets arent super cool looking, so getting them is not something anyone should be bent out of shape over, unless you want to wear noob high end fashion =P Pets and all that are eye candy as well. The potions MAY help a bit, but as a sworn lallygagger and rose sniffer I swear to you those won't work on someone truely dedicated to slowing down =P</p><p>For the record though, if they started offering eye candy like the LDON in game house items I would be in serious trouble with my hubby!</p>

Geothe
12-12-2008, 02:13 PM
<p>Why the hate, because it isnt all "fluff" nor will it stay "fluff"<span ><span style="color: #ffffff;"> </span></span></p><p>As for this Station cash staying just "fluff"This is from a Tentonhammer interview (posted in the thread in the gameplay forums)</p><p> "<span style="font-weight: bold;"><span style="font-weight: bold;">Ten Ton Hammer: You mentioned you won’t be selling “uber armor,” but what about armor or weapon sets that aren’t overpowering, as an idea for returning or casual players?</span></span></p><p><span style="font-weight: bold;">Bruce Ferguson:</span> I don’t know that I can say yes or no to that to be honest with you. It’s an ongoing discussion here as to whether we could do something like that or not, and I don’t think we have a final decision. But as I said, what we don’t want to do is make 80 percent or 100 percent of our customers unhappy with us. Obviously we’re trying to give people a little bit of fun without impacting significant core game play.  The experience potions are great to get caught up. I’ll be honest with you, with this job, I don’t get as much a chance to play as my friends do. They get a level every other day, and I’m a level a month kind of thing. The experience potion thing is a way of leveling that kind of playing field without me buying uber armor so that I can go into raids where they are, and I really don’t have the time or experience to do it.  "</p>

Troubor
12-12-2008, 02:33 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Emotions run high as Sony unleashes "<a href="http://www.station.sony.com/en/stationcash/index.vm" target="_blank">Station Cash</a>" - Jethal puts in a, rare, serious plea to the people.. <a href="http://www.kithicor.org/index.php?action=fullnews&id=73" target="_blank">Click Here</a></p></blockquote><p>I would say that hate is too strong of a word for my feelings about it.  The word I'd use for my personal feeling is "concerned".  Yes, for now it's fluff items more or less on par with LoN loot card items.  But this IMO is a tiny bit of a slippery slope.  If they honestly do stop here, then well..I find it a bit cheesy to buy even fluff items with IRL money, even fluff IMO should be earned within the game to some degree, even if it's just a 5 minute deliver message from point a to point b sort of quest.  But I won't be upset if they keep it just fluff items.  If they do escalate it to something more then fluff, even treasured items with stats, then I think they have crossed a line.</p><p>There's also the way this was implimented, someone correct me if I am wrong, but it was just suddenly patched in, no warning.  Usually they have a big notice on the front page of Eq2players and the EQ1 equivelent page for something like this.  Why did they in effect sneak it in?  Maybe it was just bad PR on their part, but any time I see something snuck in like that, even if it's initially more or less benign (cheesy and maybe even sleazy, but benign) I do get concerned.</p><p>I do like some of the fluff pets, I actually came very close to buying the Boarfiend household pet.  But I'm going to hold off a tiny bit I think, until I really do see where this is going. </p><p>So..no, I don't hate it.  But I find it a bit cheesy and sleazy, and do think it's wise to show some concern about it.</p><p>As a small addendum, I'm going to add a quote from John Smedley himself.  I forget the date, but I remember searching for posts from him when Station Cash went live.  This was taken from a post he made about LoN loot card items:</p><p>"5) This is not some slippery slope towards selling items directly in EQ & EQ II...."</p><p>Again I forget the date, but the post (I think) was made when LoN first went live.  Someone correct me of course if I'm wrong about that.  Regardless, I find it..interesting, and again of some concern when he makes a comment like that, and then now impliments exactly what he promised he wouldn't do, albeit with "just" fluff items.</p><p>To again quote John Smedley: </p><p>"We aren't going to be allowing RMT in any way, shape or form on the non-exchange enabled EQ II servers. Period. End of statement."</p><p>Given that he IMO broke the first promise, will he in a year or two be breaking this promise also?</p>

Elquinjena
12-12-2008, 04:56 PM
<p><a href="http://elquinjena.kithicor.org/?p=104" target="_blank">My two coppers on it.</a></p>

Ciara52
12-12-2008, 05:09 PM
<p>I think everyone should wait and see also, but  if you read the feedback thread the hate is as hot as you know where.</p><p>I'm planning on enjoying Frostfell, I don't think that store is a big deal. </p><p>Maybe it will be someday, but I don't read the future so I'll wait.</p>

DerykRenaln
12-12-2008, 05:11 PM
<p><cite>Elquinjena wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><a href="http://elquinjena.kithicor.org/?p=104" target="_blank">My two coppers on it.</a></p></blockquote><p>VERY well put Elquinjena!</p>

Sharakari
12-12-2008, 05:24 PM
<p>Can I ask what may seem like a stupid question...... What is RMT??</p>

Maroger
12-12-2008, 05:28 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Can I ask what may seem like a stupid question...... What is RMT??</p></blockquote><p>Rmt = real money transfer.</p>

gainerface
12-12-2008, 05:30 PM
<p>The xp potions aren't fluff and they give players willing to pay for them an advantage over other players.  And it leaves the door open for abuses such as making the next 10 levels an unholy grind while making double xp potions available for $20 each.</p>

PsiberDaemon
12-12-2008, 05:32 PM
<p>Real Money Transfer</p><p>(in short, allowing real-world currency to purchase items in-game)</p>

PsiberDaemon
12-12-2008, 05:36 PM
<p><cite>Ciara52 wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I think everyone should wait and see also, but  if you read the feedback thread the hate is as hot as you know where.</p><p>I'm planning on enjoying Frostfell, I don't think that store is a big deal. </p><p>Maybe it will be someday, but I don't read the future so I'll wait.</p></blockquote><p>VERY well said!  I myself have forrayed into that thread once or twice, and I am concerned about the potential abuses, but I think you have the right of it advising a 'wait and see' attitude...</p><p>And of course, Frostfell!  No time for harumphing when there's quests and snowglobes to be had!</p>

Sharakari
12-12-2008, 05:39 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Real Money Transfer</p><p>(in short, allowing real-world currency to purchase items in-game)</p></blockquote><p>Ah... so paying real money for virtual items that only get you further in a virtual world.   Isn't this what plat farmers do?  I guess if being #1 at something in a virtual world is your lifes ambition and the only way of obtaining that goal is to PAY for it, then go for it.  I for one, will not be buying anything for real money.  I pay my real money just to play.... and that's enough of an argument with my wife.  How would I explain to her that I must have 10 XP potions so that I can get my AAs faster for a mere X dollars!  LOL.</p><p>What's next.... eqBay?? (I should probably trademark that now incase SOE gets any ideas!)</p>

Nahdian
12-12-2008, 06:28 PM
<p> <span style="font-size: x-small;">I don't get it either. All this hate and anger over a bunch of fluff . And the xp potions are'nt worth complaining about. Is it simply people don't want someone else to beat them to 80.  Because it sure is'nt going to affect anyone elses game play. </span></p><p><span style="font-size: x-small;">You got people saying : I did'nt play EQ last night . Instead I spent time with my family. Well gee, is'nt that something you should have been doing all along , instead of sitting in front of a computer.</span></p><p><span style="font-size: x-small;">And all these that say I am quitting, because some other player has a little extra cash and can buy stuff I can't.Well if you get jealous over something in a game. You definately need to quit playing games.</span></p><p><span style="font-size: x-small;">And then of course there are those who say sony lied to us. So were quitting. Well some of ya will , alot of ya are just tellings fibs , hoping sony will go your way or no way. And alot that do quit, will come back, you always do. And those that never come back , well good luck.</span></p><p><span style="font-size: x-small;">When they first thought up this idea. Many of us sent in feedback on it. Some of us even made suggestions about it. But from what I am reading in the posts on these forums , those of you screaming the loudest never sent in feedback at all. I guess its easier to just wait til it happens and then whine about it.</span></p><p><span style="font-size: x-small;">Grow up , its a game. No one is forcing you to buy anything. The game world is changing, just like everything else in life does.  If you can't accept this , then you need to quit playing games</span></p><p><span style="font-size: x-small;">Yeah maybe Sony should have told you  all this was coming before you bought TSO, but they did'nt . Heck I wish my local grocery would notify me in advance when they are going to up the prices too. But it ain't gonna happen.</span></p>

GlitterPaws
12-12-2008, 07:30 PM
<p>I don't get the hate mongering either.  Some people just act like lemmings ))</p><p>Like Eliquinjena I am taking the wait and see approach.  And I also agree with her about the earning of a cool object is always more fun than just the purchase of an object.</p><p>I've tried playing LoN and I am just LoN impaired )). It looks like a fun game and a nice break from the norm.</p><p>However, I am a happy EQ2 player who gets ticked off every now and again at the game yet never enough to quit.</p><p>Also agree with the poster above who states that some will returrn, etc. etc.</p><p>Cheers all have have a great weekend.</p>

Zorastiz
12-12-2008, 07:38 PM
<p>I'm neither waiting to see nor am I upset about it, EQ2 has changed in other ways that I'm not thrilled with so this for me doesn't make or break anything.</p><p>I guess my only thought on the SC is that is is like buying plat with the exception that you cannot YET buy items others quest and strive for by playing thier butts off.</p>

Eshaye
12-12-2008, 07:45 PM
<p><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Emotions run high as Sony unleashes "<a href="http://www.station.sony.com/en/stationcash/index.vm" target="_blank">Station Cash</a>" - Jethal puts in a, rare, serious plea to the people.. <a href="http://www.kithicor.org/index.php?action=fullnews&id=73" target="_blank">Click Here</a></p></blockquote><p>From the lurking shadows I usually have a lot of respect for everything you do for this community Jethal, but on this one I cannot and will not agree to it. And it seems to me that calling it just 'fluff' is hoping really hard that it doesn't become more then that because you have a lot invested in this game for various reasons.</p><p>It's making up small excuses. And hate is a strong word, I don't believe we actually hate SOE and especially not it's developpers, but disapointment and a sense of betrayal is sure to bring some resentment.</p><p>I resent SOE right now. I don't hate you, but I am not happy with this, at all. And in a way I guess I am waiting for what will happen but I am not involved enough in this game to keep paying for it when I am so ambivalent about it. I'm going to play something else, and if SOE changes their stance or gives us a decreased monthly fee or <em>something</em>, then I may come back.</p><p>I think for the majority of people quitting over this is not an emotional response, it's an ethical and moral one. You're making us buy into something we simply don't believe in.</p>

Jethal
12-12-2008, 08:22 PM
<p><cite>Eshaye wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Emotions run high as Sony unleashes "<a href="http://www.station.sony.com/en/stationcash/index.vm" target="_blank">Station Cash</a>" - Jethal puts in a, rare, serious plea to the people.. <a href="http://www.kithicor.org/index.php?action=fullnews&id=73" target="_blank">Click Here</a></p></blockquote><p>From the lurking shadows I usually have a lot of respect for everything you do for this community Jethal, but on this one I cannot and will not agree to it. And it seems to me that calling it just 'fluff' is hoping really hard that it doesn't become more then that because you have a lot invested in this game for various reasons.</p><p>It's making up small excuses. And hate is a strong word, I don't believe we actually hate SOE and especially not it's developpers, but disapointment and a sense of betrayal is sure to bring some resentment.</p><p>I resent SOE right now. I don't hate you, but I am not happy with this, at all. And in a way I guess I am waiting for what will happen but I am not involved enough in this game to keep paying for it when I am so ambivalent about it. I'm going to play something else, and if SOE changes their stance or gives us a decreased monthly fee or <em>something</em>, then I may come back.</p><p>I think for the majority of people quitting over this is not an emotional response, it's an ethical and moral one. You're making us buy into something we simply don't believe in.</p></blockquote><p>*can feel elquinjena tugging at my pant leg shouting "don't respond!"*</p><p>I'm not making any one buy into anything.. but when i see people like Josgar telling us that they're leaving the game over this, and Jeph telling us to Run for our hitpoints.. I see it as major over reaction to the situation, and I'm simply trying to get people to calm down a bit... and hey, if you're leaving, I'm sorry to see you go, really.. hell, <strong>I'VE<em> </em></strong>contemplated leaving EQ2 from time to time, I went to WOW for a year, and have a standing invitation from some friends to join them in Warhammer - but I don't think I'm going anywhere soon.  And for the record, I butt heads with choices that SOE makes all the time, for example..<a href="http://www.kithicor.org/media/songs/waypoint.mp3" target="_blank"> I dislike the new map system</a>.. sure it looks good, but that's another issue.</p><p>so "Why the hate"?  hey.. it was a catchy title, which certainly got attention  *wiggles eyebrows*   I dont express serious opinions often - but please.. deep breaths.. deeeeep.. ahhh, that's better.. dont you feel better?  I do.</p><p>*sighs* maybe I should have stated my opinions in a parody.. every time I speak seriously I get some kind of backlash.. I dont do "serious" very well.</p>

Rayche
12-12-2008, 08:28 PM
<p>They've already held us for ransom with this new system.</p><p>They introduced 60 new AA's and made it agonizingly slow to actually get them. I have some friends that ran back and finished all the Sanctum of the Scaleborn quests and every heritage quest in the game, and their claymore and any other quests they could find... after finishing all of the Shadow Oddysey quests... and they have a whopping 185 AA's...</p><p>Then Sony offers a double AAXP potion... for real world cash...</p><p>That's a slap to the face in my book. I mean, it's one thing to add a leveling curve, or make you work for your advancement, but this feels more like... well more like they're holding our AA's for ransom.</p>

Rast
12-12-2008, 09:03 PM
<p>Jethal</p><p>To sum up why?  We feel lied to, we were told this would be limited to the exchange servers, then we got LoN and we were told this wasn't going to lead to direct selling in the game, and now we have station cash and we were told it would only be fluff...</p><p>One can only take being lied to so many times before they begin to get grumpy with those lying.</p>

Morgonn
12-12-2008, 09:56 PM
<p>This is not about hate.  Plain and simple it's a matter of trust.  There isn't any:</p><p>[quoted from another thread]</p><p><span ><div>Originally Posted by <strong>Smed</strong> <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eq2flames.com/general-gameplay/16896-soe-licenses-3rd-party-rmt-company-game-virtual-property-sales-post382284.html#post382284"><img title="View Post" src="http://www.eq2flames.com/images/styles/eq2/buttons/viewpost.gif" border="0" /></a></div><div>I've been a regular lurker on this site for a while but I wanted to step in here and dispel something that's just plain not true - I don't have my name highlighted here, but anyone that doubts it's me can email me at <a href="mailto:[email protected]"><span style="color: #f6861e;">[email protected]</span></a> and I'll happily reply.We aren't going to be allowing RMT in any way, shape or form on the non-exchange enabled EQ II servers. Period. End of statement. In any event, I wanted to stop in and at least set the record straight - you aren't going to be seeing RMT allowed on the non-exchange enabled servers. John SmedleyPresident, Sony Online Entertainment</div><div></div><div>No hate...just no trust...LOL</div></span></p>

Giral
12-12-2008, 11:57 PM
<p>i think this post sums it up : )</p><p>.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ..............................</p><p> Krugus Wrote :</p><p>Old school Ad&d PnP game.Six of my friends come over to my house to play Ad&d (thats advanced dungeons and dragons for those that have never played a table top role playing game before).I am the DM (Dungeon Master) the one who Runs the game.My players sit down and we start playing.The players encounters a group of orcs but they have yet to be seen by them.One of the players says out loud "Man if I only had an Potion of Speed"DM "Well Bob, give me $5 and you can have one."Bob and the other players "[Removed for Content]? your not serious right?"DM"no I'm serious and look at the other things you can buy from my Dungeon Cash Shop"Potion of Speed $5Potion of Enhanced XP Gain $10Potion of Invisibility $5Armor of Charisma +1 $15Armor of Charisma +3 $30Dragon Orb of Ups (useless pet summoning) $10DM "I take CC, Personal Checks and of course Cash"DM" Don't worry over the next few months I'll add things like"+3 Longbow $20+3 Vorpal Longsword $50+5 Holy Avenger Sword $1001 quiver of (20) +3 arrows $20Bag of Holding $25+3 Shield $30+3 Protection Ring $30Staff of the Magi $75+3 Plate Mail $35+3 Chain Mail $30+3 Dagger of Venom $25DM "but for now it will be just fluff items oh and you wont be able to find them in the game any more and the new items I make up you'll only be able to get them if you buy them from my Dungeon Cash Shop.... so Bob, about that Potion of Speed you wanted"................................How long do you thing my players would stay at my house if I offered this "service" up to them.... Yes thats right, not very long.</p><p> ................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ....................................</p><p>but for some reason people will do this for Soe ? it just boggles the mind .</p><p>and the issue for alot of people is moral and ethical, we were told we would have no RMT of any shape or form on Normal sevrers EVER ,, and it was the reason we had exchange servers.</p><p> we all know the reason it was put directly into the game,,, to Prep people for up coming SOE games that will have Subs and RMT, its is the best of both worlds for SOE.  why only have one way to make money off the game when you can have 5 ways to make money off it ? </p><p>eq2 tries to squeeaze cash out of you at every turn , want extra character slots ? we'll you will have to buy a station pass even if you dont play any other SOE games,  wnat to transfer to another server ? that is going to cost you, you want AA potions? special armor styles ? well get the credit card back out,</p><p>People just wanted to play Eq2, we didnt want to play Eq2 Shoping Mall Adventures.</p><p>i have played since release, never canceled my account, and have friends ingame that i have known from release,these are poeple i have gamed with for 4 straight years ,,,,,,,. Soe has chosen to make me choose between my morals and ethics or my friends ,,,, and that is the lowest form of low i can think of,  i do not play RMT games, i would never have bought eq2. and i wouldnt have stayed playing if it wasnt for the Developers Promise that we would never ever EVER have any RMT in any way shape or form,   </p><p>stay and play with your friends by degrading yourself,and comforming, and not enjoying yourself everytime you log in, or hit the cancel button and Ditch your friends,,,,, yes i have Cancelled, yes i informed  the Guild im in know i am leaving the game ( i had to let 30 + Guildies down, that i made a comitment to that i would be there for raiding , and they could count on me . again Soe has made me feel like Crude) ,, and i also have told and will tell more friends i am leaving , and believe me it isnt easy : (</p><p>there are other games, i will stay in contact with those friends/guildies that still wish to keep in communication  , and hopefully we will be able to meet up in other games.  but i am sure that i will lose 90 % of my friends and guildies from the game after i am gone for a week or so..</p>

Kiara
12-13-2008, 12:43 AM
<p>Folks.</p><p>We have a couple of VERY active and healthy feedback threads for this.</p><p>Please stop spilling over into other threads.  It makes it nearly impossible for me to track all the feedback.</p>