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View Full Version : Allakhazam announces Zam.com, SOE Partnership


Calthine
08-16-2008, 01:01 AM
Exciting news from Fan Faire! <a href="http://www.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=14688" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"> Read all about it!</a>

Josgar
08-16-2008, 01:09 AM
Congrats ^_^, sounds like a ginormously good deal.

SilkenKidden
08-16-2008, 01:30 AM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote>Exciting news from Fan Faire! <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=14688" target="_blank"> Read all about it!</a></blockquote><p>Does this mean these bulletin boards will move to the new site?  If so, woot.  We really need a better bulletin board system, especially a better search function.  </p>

Cassea
08-16-2008, 06:51 AM
Now we have to pay $9.95 a month for something we used to get for free. Whoopee!End of prediction.

Calthine
08-16-2008, 07:07 AM
<cite>Cassea wrote:</cite><blockquote>Now we have to pay $9.95 a month for something we used to get for free. Whoopee!End of prediction.</blockquote>At Allakhazam traditionally all game content is free.  Premium gets you advanced searches (they are significantly better than the site search) and premium features on some games.  But anyone can go to Alla's and look up game info without so much as a login.A premium subscription is $9.99/3 months, $17.99/6 months, or $29.99/one year.  The most expensive of those is $3.33/month.(Sorry, not an ad, just want to correct some misinformation!)Edit: Premium also turns off the ads.

Calthine
08-16-2008, 07:11 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote>Exciting news from Fan Faire! <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=14688" target="_blank"> Read all about it!</a></blockquote><p>Does this mean these bulletin boards will move to the new site?  If so, woot.  We really need a better bulletin board system, especially a better search function.  </p></blockquote>To the best of my knowledge these forums shall remain, but I'll ask.You're quite welcome over at the eq2.allakhazam.com forums <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Thistleknot
08-16-2008, 10:13 AM
Announcement as it should be read:"SoE and Allakhazam partner to charge you even more money (unless you want to deal with crippled, useless searches), for stuff that we really should have integrated into eq2players.com, but we've just given up fixing the current features on there, so we're letting someone else deal with it so we can suck money out of you from both places."Color me unimpressed and disgusted.

Spyderbite
08-16-2008, 11:19 AM
Woot!! Good news indeed! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Lilj
08-16-2008, 11:49 AM
Will features like looking up live broker prices be free or will it be premium exclusive?Will features like 'getting an email, when the broker prices reaches the level I want' be free or will it be a premium exclusive feature?I guess what I am asking is, seaching for information is free, but will there be certain features that will be premium only? And I don't mean improved search tools and no adds. I mean some of the new features that was mentioned in the introduction.

Spyderbite
08-16-2008, 11:53 AM
<cite>Liljna wrote:</cite><blockquote>Will features like looking up live broker prices be free or will it be premium exclusive?Will features like 'getting an email, when the broker prices reaches the level I want' be free or will it be a premium exclusive feature?I guess what I am asking is, seaching for information is free, but will there be certain features that will be premium only? And I don't mean improved search tools and no adds. I mean some of the new features that was mentioned in the introduction.</blockquote>I'm not "in the loop" as far as the details... but these are great suggestions. And, if they aren't planned as part of this collaboration, then they're definitely worth dropping in the "Suggestion Box". <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Beckah
08-16-2008, 03:42 PM
I have used Alla from back in my days of Everquest(1) I just hope it stays just a good if not better! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />I too am curious to see if it's free or a premium membership.  (Mother, wife and gamer....hopes it's free! *wink*)

Calthine
08-16-2008, 09:19 PM
<cite>Liljna wrote:</cite><blockquote>Will features like looking up live broker prices be free or will it be premium exclusive?Will features like 'getting an email, when the broker prices reaches the level I want' be free or will it be a premium exclusive feature?</blockquote>The latest information I have is "This is still under discussion."  I promise I'll post as soon as I know.

Ogrebe
08-16-2008, 09:50 PM
While i like what you guys are doing. Part of me feels that a lot of the other community site are getting shafted.

dawy
08-16-2008, 11:13 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>While i like what you guys are doing. Part of me feels that a lot of the other community site are getting shafted. </blockquote>Not going to pay for this service tbh and yes it would be interesting to know what the rest of the community sites think about this.

Cassea
08-17-2008, 03:40 AM
We're not stupid. If this was going to be free do you not think they would have announced this at the faire?SOE... I know you are reading this. Free or not? Why silence on this?

Calthine
08-17-2008, 04:34 AM
<cite>Cassea wrote:</cite><blockquote>We're not stupid. If this was going to be free do you not think they would have announced this at the faire?SOE... I know you are reading this. Free or not? Why silence on this?</blockquote>As I said:<p> The latest information I have is "This is still under discussion." I promise I'll post as soon as I know.</p>

ke'la
08-17-2008, 04:58 AM
<cite>Cassea wrote:</cite><blockquote>We're not stupid. If this was going to be free do you not think they would have announced this at the faire?SOE... I know you are reading this. Free or not? Why silence on this?</blockquote>What is the capitol of Nevada? If you take a minute to answer that question does that mean your ignorant? or does it mean it took you a second to think about the answer befor you answered. Sometimes Silence does not mean neferious things are going on... sometimes silence means that someone is still thinking(or figuring out what exsactly they want to do). Silence really is only good for Zam if they don't know either way. Why is that:First if they know it will be completly free(atleast the parts you want) then you would be cheering them right now and that is good for Zam as such they would anounce it.Second if they know they are going to charge for the features you most want then it would be best to anounce it now and get all the hate out of the way at once(more or less)Thrid by being silent eventhough they know they are going to charge, they end up with the conclusion jumper hate now, then when they do anounce it will cost your hate will be renewed and with a new "I told you so swagger", and they will get the hate from the people that agree with you, but don't want to get upset until they know it's justified.Ofcourse the second and third options will also produce launch hate, but why add more hate then neccicary if you already know your doing something that will get hate, like charging for stuff that is currently free.

Cassea
08-17-2008, 01:38 PM
The problem is that most, if not all, of the new features are not really needed now. Sure it may be nice to not be able to log in to check prices but the web page will still be blocked as most peoples work so that is not a plus. It's only slightly easier to check prices out of the game as it is to just log in and I'll still need to log in to do vendor stuff each day so this feature, while helpfull to some, is just fluff to many.Same goes for almost all the features. Right now I use my Profit UI to click on links and this is one of the best features of EQ2. I fear to lose this ability either by having it removed outright or the old pages stopped being updated like they are now.I agree that we do not know but I do not agree that they do not know the answer and are thinking about it. When SOE allocated cash to a project they know ahead of time what it will cost and any expected additional income. They do not say, for example, here's $10,000... go play with it and we'll talk about compensation later. (or whatever it would cost)The fact that nothing about price was mentioned assures me that it will be just like EQplayers. Some near useless "free" features and all the good stuff, many of which is free now, will cost additional $$$ per month.Now as far as the other non-aly web pages... yes this sucks for them. They are only "just" staying afloat via dedication and an ever shrinking ad revenue base. SOE can afford to support a number of these web pages. Why not just advertise on them directly on them? Since some of these support multi-MMORPG it does two things.1. It supports the web pages that support EQ22. It advertises EQ2 to gamers who may not already play EQ2 but are interested in MMORPGsNow, as has been pointed out, if this is designed to replace EQplayers then you could still do this to help other web pages that are not linked with this and give them a leg up but if you do this then you risk those other web pages being just as good and competing with your "for $$$" service.I just hate to see the other EQ2 web pages go down. I saw it with EQ1 and it was nice to see so many excellent EQ2 pages still around.

Calthine
08-17-2008, 02:45 PM
<cite>kela wrote:</cite><blockquote>like charging for stuff that is currently free.</blockquote>I just want to clear this bit up.  'Zam's not becoming a subscription only site.  Any one can go see game data, you don't even need a login. That's not changing.

Valsehna
08-17-2008, 03:13 PM
<p>I guess I am just a bit confused as to WHY this is taking place, and HOW.</p><p>Do I have it correct that SOE will be supplying and providing all of the information and data the game has to offer to this Zam.com entity, so they can put it up on their site, for possibly free or possibly some not for free.</p><p>And SOE is giving it all to them, gratis?</p><p>If so, then why just them, why not other sites to have the same ability?</p><p>And if they're going that far, then why not just fully support the site so it doesn't even need ads or to charge people...just SOE ones.</p><p>Confused.</p>

Cassea
08-17-2008, 05:14 PM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>kela wrote:</cite><blockquote>like charging for stuff that is currently free.</blockquote>I just want to clear this bit up.  'Zam's not becoming a subscription only site.  Any one can go see game data, you don't even need a login. That's not changing.</blockquote>But the "split" is what is the concern. I'm sure "some" content will be free but will it be 50/50 90/10 75/25?Right now EQplayers "free" content is near useless. Will this be the same? Will you have limited "basic" information but anything else take you to that beg for $$$ screen?I know the page is not done but the "plan" is does. SOE would never have entering into an agreement without knowing well in advance about what would be free and what would not be free.In fact, as far as I can see, nothing has been said about any charge at all. Why not just come right out and say, for example:All content that is currently free on Aly will remain the same. The additional content will incure a small fee.This is what I, and others, fear. Will I still be able to look up quests like I do now for free? Will these quests be updated as they are now? Will I be able to access these quests in game like I do in the Profit UI?The other no-no as I see it is this...If being able to look up items out of game is only available for those who pay extra does this now mean that I will be at a disadvantage trying to sell items and craft if I choose not to pay this extra fee? By being able to manage things out of game give an advantage to those who pay more vs those who have to wait until they are off work to log in and do these things themselves?Just as I ABHOR Plat selling and the ability to have rela life money affect in game issues, I have a very bad taste if SOE adds anything that allows out of game abilites that are not available to everyone to affect in game issues.Maybe I'm jumping the gun here but now is the time to let SOE know that this will not be tolerated. If they are looking to dump EQplayers then just dump it. If they are looking for more revenue then there is one area that I have been asking for for years...Allow people to subscribe to EQ2 with limited hour accounts. I cannot tell you how many people would love to subscribe to multiple MMORPG's but will not spend $15 a month when all they want to play is a few hours a week.Example:$5 per month for up to 10 hours of play per month$10 per month for up to 30 hours of play per month$15 per month for unlimited playIf this was in play I would have a ton of MMORPG accounts. I would play EQ1, EQ2, SWG, Pirates of the Burning sea and maybe even Vangard.Yes I can get an all access pass but that costs too much because I would get EQ2 for unlimted $15 and the others $5 for a few hours a month.I would even get multiple accounts for storing more items or the occasional dual botting. I know they would lose some people who now pay $15 and seldom play so maybe a few people would drop to cheaper accounts but I know far more people would would stay with many of the SOE games if only they did not have to commit to $15 when they do not play that much.Perhaps this was the wrong place to pring this up but if revenue is the issue there is a ton of people who even now play WoW that would jump at the change to get a $5 EQ2 account to play with their EQ2 freinds for a few hours a month. Maybe they would turn out to like EQ2 so much that they might move over <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Calthine
08-17-2008, 05:19 PM
I totally hear (and understand) your concerns.  And I'm making sure that my bosses see them too.  I just haven't got any information for you.  On a totally different note, Alla did ask for player feedback on tools they would like.  Basically, if we have the data, what kind of tool have you always wanted for EQII?  Live broker data is way cool.  The item upgrader has me salivating.  What else?<i>edit:  grammar ftw</i>

Detor
08-17-2008, 06:48 PM
<cite>Cassea wrote:</cite><blockquote>We're not stupid. If this was going to be free do you not think they would have announced this at the faire?SOE... I know you are reading this. Free or not? Why silence on this?</blockquote>Umm, you do realize Allakhazam isn't run by SOE right?  Different site, always been independent.  Only thing SOE is doing now that hasn't been done in the past is supplying a live feed of broker data from what I understand.

Cassea
08-17-2008, 07:07 PM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote>I totally hear (and understand) your concerns.  And I'm making sure that my bosses see them too.  I just haven't got any information for you.  On a totally different note, Alla did ask for player feedback on tools they would like.  Basically, if we have the data, what kind of tool have you always wanted for EQII?  Live broker data is way cool.  The item upgrader has me salivating.  What else?<i>edit:  grammar ftw</i></blockquote>Well you asked so I'll tell LOL...World Maps! EQ2 lacks up to date world maps. Bonus for zone connection maps. I have found a few older maps from the original game but I would really like a high resolution world map of the entire EQ2 universe with the zones superinposed over. You would be able to click on the zone on the large world map and gain the following information:- Approximate level for this zone- dungeons (and their level) within this zone- zone connections including bird routes and teleports- quests- named mobsand other stuffThe ability to look at the world map and see the existing zones outlined is key. You can do this with EQ1 and it really gives you a sence of the zones fitting in the world instead of trying to memerize where everything is.Everquest 1 used to have this on their web page. You would see a cool map of Norrath and all the zones and if you clicked on a zone it would zoom in.Bonus points if the map is high resolution, in color and PRINTABLE! Am I the only one who gets excited about a cool looking map? LOLThink of Mapquest and the ability to zoom in on the map to different levels.Just a thought 

Lilj
08-17-2008, 07:42 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I guess I am just a bit confused as to WHY this is taking place, and HOW.</p><p>Do I have it correct that SOE will be supplying and providing all of the information and data the game has to offer to this Zam.com entity, so they can put it up on their site, for possibly free or possibly some not for free.</p><p>And SOE is giving it all to them, gratis?</p><p>If so, then why just them, why not other sites to have the same ability?</p><p>And if they're going that far, then why not just fully support the site so it doesn't even need ads or to charge people...just SOE ones.</p><p>Confused.</p></blockquote>As I understood it from the introduction where it was annouced, SoE is indeed providing Zam with information.I don't think anyone but SoE and Zam knows if it is given for free or if Zam and SoE has made a contract and there is payment* involved.If SoE is giving the information for free, I think SoE should seriously consider giving it to all fansites, so all fansites are treated equally. If it is given for free and only Zam is getting the information, I am strongly opposed to it. If there is some kind of payment* involved, it would be nice to know as a community. Perhaps not the details, perhaps not the price, but perhaps just know that there is payment* and contacts involved.*Payment can be a lot of things, it doesn't have to be monetary. It could just as well mean some kind of service that Zam can provide for SoE. More information could be nice, simply because not giving it, can lead to a lot of tinfoil hats, which I don't think it good for the project. More information could also be helpful for other fansites, so they know where they stand in relation to SoE.

Calthine
08-17-2008, 08:24 PM
<cite>Detor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Umm, you do realize Allakhazam isn't run by SOE right?  Different site, always been independent.  Only thing SOE is doing now that hasn't been done in the past is supplying a live feed of broker data from what I understand.</blockquote>Actually, it's the whole kit and caboodle.  A complete database with detailed information that you can only get directly from the game itself."  Like what we have, only lots better.Which will make things like Cassea's suggestions theoretically possible.

CRLig
08-17-2008, 08:41 PM
<cite>Cassea wrote:</cite><blockquote><span style="color: #ff0000;">The problem is that most, if not all, of the new features are not really needed now.</span> Sure it may be nice to not be able to log in to check prices but the web page will still be blocked as most peoples work so that is not a plus. It's only slightly easier to check prices out of the game as it is to just log in and I'll still need to log in to do vendor stuff each day so this feature, while helpfull to some, is just fluff to many.<span style="color: #ff0000;">Then don't pay and use it lol</span>Same goes for almost all the features. Right now I use my Profit UI to click on links and this is one of the best features of EQ2. I fear to lose this ability either by having it removed outright or the old pages stopped being updated like they are now.<span style="color: #ff0000;">What I know from your replies is that you are ANGRY about EQ2LLink is gonna dead and inconvenienced you period.</span> <span style="color: #ff0000;">So you turn and blame THE PROJECT that even NOT LIVE now.</span>I agree that we do not know but I do not agree that they do not know the answer and are thinking about it. When SOE allocated cash to a project they know ahead of time what it will cost and any expected additional income. They do not say, for example, here's $10,000... go play with it and we'll talk about compensation later. (or whatever it would cost)<span style="color: #ff0000;">Let's see...As I read from the news, the project itself is like some kind of add-on features from the original Allakhazam's website, BUT it's still free for us to search the database.</span><span style="color: #ff0000;">Just make it simple, SOE pushed a service it may or may not charge with Zam.com, but they won't force us to pay for the service if you don't want to, so as many others who doesn't want to use the service, EQ2LLink still has it's demand.</span><span style="color: #ff0000;">You should ask why they closed before we don't even know we are turning to Zam.com or not.</span>The fact that nothing about price was mentioned assures me that it will be just like EQplayers. Some near useless "free" features and all the good stuff, many of which is free now, will cost additional $$$ per month.Now as far as the other non-aly web pages... yes this sucks for them. They are only "just" staying afloat via dedication and an ever shrinking ad revenue base. SOE can afford to support a number of these web pages. Why not just advertise on them directly on them? Since some of these support multi-MMORPG it does two things.1. It supports the web pages that support EQ22. It advertises EQ2 to gamers who may not already play EQ2 but are interested in MMORPGsNow, as has been pointed out, if this is designed to replace EQplayers then you could still do this to help other web pages that are not linked with this and give them a leg up but if you do this then you risk those other web pages being just as good and competing with your "for $$$" service.<span style="color: #ff0000;">I just hate to see the other EQ2 web pages go down.</span> I saw it with EQ1 and it was nice to see so many excellent EQ2 pages still around.<span style="color: #ff0000;">TBH this is the main reason why you are complaining.</span> <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote>

Vonotar
08-17-2008, 08:45 PM
This is total outragous!!*cough* err Calthine, when you get that database can you let me know where the Paladin red/white breastplate is in Tim Deep, cos no game wiki appears to know...*whistles innocently*

Detor
08-17-2008, 10:23 PM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Detor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Umm, you do realize Allakhazam isn't run by SOE right?  Different site, always been independent.  Only thing SOE is doing now that hasn't been done in the past is supplying a live feed of broker data from what I understand.</blockquote>Actually, it's the whole kit and caboodle.  A complete database with detailed information that you can only get directly from the game itself."  Like what we have, only lots better.Which will make things like Cassea's suggestions theoretically possible.</blockquote>Complete database?  So, you'll have it direct from SOE where mob's spawn, what they drop, the chances of each item, and the item's stats?  Sounds very useful - but when's it going to be ready? : P

ke'la
08-18-2008, 12:14 AM
<cite>Detor wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Detor wrote:</cite><blockquote>Umm, you do realize Allakhazam isn't run by SOE right? Different site, always been independent. Only thing SOE is doing now that hasn't been done in the past is supplying a live feed of broker data from what I understand.</blockquote>Actually, it's the whole kit and caboodle. A complete database with detailed information that you can only get directly from the game itself." Like what we have, only lots better.Which will make things like Cassea's suggestions theoretically possible.</blockquote>Complete database? So, you'll have it direct from SOE where mob's spawn, what they drop, the chances of each item, and the item's stats? Sounds very useful - but when's it going to be ready? : P</blockquote>Wild Guess.... Soon(tm) <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />As for who is getting what, the way I understood the way the Zam Network guy was talking, this is just the first of many partnerships with many games they want to do, all with features that those other games would find very appealing. Cal correct me if i am wrong here.

Daroc
08-18-2008, 09:31 AM
<i>Live Broker Data. You will be able to log onto our site and see exactly what is for sale at that moment. You will also be able to request that you get e-mailed or texted when certain items come up for sale at certain prices.</i>Aaarggghhh... Can I please get a bot that buys the stuff from the broker please? It's kinda sad I must log in the game and walk to the broker no?While you're add it why not let the bot put that same item back on the broker with a nice profit, margin x? This makes for a great economy!<i>3D Models of everything in the game including mobs, items and your profile. You will be able to try on outfits and see what they look like.</i>Nice! This feature will save me from having to go through dungeon x, look up named y and wear dropped gear I didn't like the looks of. Good stuff! At least now I'll know how every mob and named looks like so I won't be in awe by the looks of boss mob z when I finally encounter it.<i>Profile Upgrade Search. Put in your parameters, like solo only or quest only or exclude raid and search your profile for easy upgrades to your current equipment, then print out the directions on how to get it and go.</i>Yipieyayee! At least I won't have to explore on my own now. I kinda hated that - exploring and seeing new things. I'll now exactly where to go now. Does this come with GPS data and device please?With all this data you might as well create a bot that levels me to 80 no? Leveling is boring and with all this data the bot should be easy to create. Seriously think about it.Great new stuff I've been waiting for. This makes an MMO much more enjoyable.And who really needed a community outside the game itself? Let's kill em all exept one by making their data rubish and absolete fast.And to all the NAY sayers : "You dont have to use it you know."Cheers!

Raknid
08-18-2008, 09:59 AM
What do IGE and the ZAM network have in common, and is it really a good idea to begin doing business with them, especially opening a direct pipeline to data?

Calthine
08-18-2008, 02:06 PM
<cite>Raknid wrote:</cite><blockquote>What do IGE and the ZAM network have in common, and is it really a good idea to begin doing business with them, especially opening a direct pipeline to data?</blockquote>Absolutely nothing.  Our parent company sold off IGE last year.<a href="http://eq2.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=3;mid=117772225728544482" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://eq2.allakhazam.com/forum.htm...772225728544482</a>

Cheesyfish
08-18-2008, 06:13 PM
So... Basically Allakhazam and SoE are going to charge people ANOTHER $10 a month, to find info that they would find on <a href="http://www.eq2wikia.com." target="_blank" rel="nofollow">www.eq2wikia.com.</a> Allakhazam was sometimes good in eq1, most of the time it lacked detail. It was the same for eq2, even after DoF i checked on there for details about original content HQ's and there was none. im sorry, but why would people stop using eq2 maps (in game mod, works well) or Eq2wikia just to pay another $10 a month.

Zarador
08-18-2008, 06:24 PM
I'm just honestly curious here.  People have forked over coin for years for EQ Players, never had such a service provided, now SoE in the interest of serving customers intends to work with a 3rd party entity to provide greater services than they now charge for (optional charges).  Bit mind boggling actually.Zam's is great used them for years upon years, I just don't understand fully why it takes a fan site to provide what should have been done years ago on a site that SoE runs?I'm in no way against Zams getting such treatment as they well earned it for the services provided for so many years.  I just think that it would have been nice if EQ2 Players was nearly as good as an almost free site.

Detor
08-18-2008, 07:48 PM
<cite>Cheesyfish wrote:</cite><blockquote>So... Basically Allakhazam and SoE are going to charge people ANOTHER $10 a month, to find info that they would find on <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eq2wikia.com." target="_blank">www.eq2wikia.com.</a> Allakhazam was sometimes good in eq1, most of the time it lacked detail. It was the same for eq2, even after DoF i checked on there for details about original content HQ's and there was none. im sorry, but why would people stop using eq2 maps (in game mod, works well) or Eq2wikia just to pay another $10 a month.</blockquote>I came on this thread not even clear on the specifics of what information SOE was going to provide, but at least I read the thread first.  Premium allakhazam is not $10 a month, they said it's more like $3.  AND they said the database will be free, with premium tools costing.  They haven't determined what they will consider premium though but based on past things I'd guess it'd be like this:  Search broker data - data - free.  Get text message when item pops up - utility - premium.  Search mob location, drops, and percent change - all pure data - free.  Use utility to find upgrade items for what you already have - utilitt - premium.  Etc for the rest of the stuff that can be divided into utility or information.

Spyderbite
08-18-2008, 08:19 PM
<cite>Zarador wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm in no way against Zams getting such treatment as they well earned it for the services provided for so many years.  I just think that it would have been nice if EQ2 Players was nearly as good as an almost free site.</blockquote>Well.. first of all.. I don't think there was any "special <i>treatment</i>". I think it was a business deal. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />From the looks of it, it sounds like SOE decided that it was more cost efficient and beneficial to the players to just outsource the eq2players.com project. That's what companies do these days. Now, the players will have an entire team of editors working on the site full time rather than updates here and there when the resources allow.Looking forward to this move forward myself. Now people can get the features they've been asking for all this time from the eq2players.com site! As for the cost or what exactly is going to change.. I'm not in the loop regarding that. I just punch my time card, edit the wiki, and hand it to Calthine. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

ke'la
08-19-2008, 05:46 AM
<cite>Zarador wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm just honestly curious here. People have forked over coin for years for EQ Players, never had such a service provided, now SoE in the interest of serving customers intends to work with a 3rd party entity to provide greater services than they now charge for (optional charges). Bit mind boggling actually.Zam's is great used them for years upon years, I just don't understand fully why it takes a fan site to provide what should have been done years ago on a site that SoE runs?I'm in no way against Zams getting such treatment as they well earned it for the services provided for so many years. I just think that it would have been nice if EQ2 Players was nearly as good as an almost free site.</blockquote>EQ2players, is run by the same people that, run the servers, the chat channels, are working on station launcher, handle SoE's end of Station Voice, and pritty much everything else that you don't see that keeps games like these running... oh and thats for every SoE game + PotBS, they are also working on adding 'Web 2.0' features to all there sites, using FreeRelms as a test bed. IMO, having this bit of web development taken off thier shoulders is a good thing. Besides this is a business deal as such we don't know who is paying who(between SoE and Zam) for this service.

Daroc
08-19-2008, 07:31 AM
Feature request to the Zam folks who roam here.Would it be possible for us forum owners to implement code that pops up the same item "image" that shows up while hovering over an item link on the Allakhazam site?I think most webmasters use PHPBB, SMF or VBulletin.It would be great if we could get BB code that functions like Sword of Pown.I don't think anyone would mind that clicking on the link would open a new browser to the specific page of Allakhazam with the item and comments.

Calthine
08-19-2008, 01:24 PM
<cite>Daroc wrote:</cite><blockquote>Feature request to the Zam folks who roam here.Would it be possible for us forum owners to implement code that pops up the same item "image" that shows up while hovering over an item link on the Allakhazam site?I think most webmasters use PHPBB, SMF or VBulletin.It would be great if we could get BB code that functions like Sword of Pown.I don't think anyone would mind that clicking on the link would open a new browser to the specific page of Allakhazam with the item and comments.</blockquote>That's a neat idea.  I've no idea if it's feasable, I think the platform people at SOE would have to get involved, but I'll certainly pass it on.

Rijacki
08-19-2008, 05:56 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Zarador wrote:</cite><blockquote>I'm in no way against Zams getting such treatment as they well earned it for the services provided for so many years. I just think that it would have been nice if EQ2 Players was nearly as good as an almost free site.</blockquote>Well.. first of all.. I don't think there was any "special <i>treatment</i>". I think it was a business deal. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />From the looks of it, it sounds like SOE decided that it was more cost efficient and beneficial to the players to just outsource the eq2players.com project. That's what companies do these days. Now, the players will have an entire team of editors working on the site full time rather than updates here and there when the resources allow.Looking forward to this move forward myself. Now people can get the features they've been asking for all this time from the eq2players.com site! As for the cost or what exactly is going to change.. I'm not in the loop regarding that. I just punch my time card, edit the wiki, and hand it to Calthine. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote>The problem with that is some of us have been paying for the EQ2players all this time for a lot of promised features that will now be available on a totally different site, for an additional fee. The fees for EQ2Players should be refunded and/or those who continue subscribing to EQ2Players should have SOE pay for their fees on Allakhazam.Oh.. and yes, this is an effort to make Alla a "one stop for everything" which is being done with SOE.  I don't begrudge it, but it does mean any other fan site relying on contributions of players only is being eliminated.  Maybe not right away, but eventually, as the feed from SOE grows to encompass anything even the niche sites could provide.  For EQ2, Alla hasn't been the best site for any one thing but did have a different perspective on a few different things (i.e. you could get more complete quests on EQi but Alla had a different perspective on some of the same ones).  With the direct feed, that all changes drastically.Yes, this does affect my very very small and very very niche site.  But maybe that's for the better since I won't have to feel guilty about the time I haven't had to update and change it in the ways I have wanted.  I can let it fade into complete oblivion now that even the few uses for it will be irrelivant since I could only use player provided data. Meh, it's time was passing by the time players started settling in with the tradeskill changes and getting used to -that- status quo.

SilkenKidden
08-19-2008, 07:37 PM
<cite>Cheesyfish wrote:</cite><blockquote>So... Basically Allakhazam and SoE are going to charge people ANOTHER $10 a month, to find info that they would find on <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eq2wikia.com." target="_blank">www.eq2wikia.com.</a> Allakhazam was sometimes good in eq1, most of the time it lacked detail. It was the same for eq2, even after DoF i checked on there for details about original content HQ's and there was none. im sorry, but why would people stop using eq2 maps (in game mod, works well) or Eq2wikia just to pay another $10 a month.</blockquote><p>Charge us $10 a month for access to the boards.  No way.  Access to a bulletin board system comes with EQ2 and I expect that to continue.   </p><p>I have gathered that we will have free access just as now but good things will be reserved for the paying customers.  </p><p>I think discussion here on what is coming should focus on what is free.  If we will have to pay for it, it is an advertisement, not a discussion of a change in our benefits.  </p>

Calthine
08-19-2008, 08:34 PM
<cite>Cheesyfish wrote:</cite><blockquote>So... Basically Allakhazam and SoE are going to charge people ANOTHER $10 a month, to find info that they would find on <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eq2wikia.com." target="_blank">www.eq2wikia.com.</a> Allakhazam was sometimes good in eq1, most of the time it lacked detail. It was the same for eq2, even after DoF i checked on there for details about original content HQ's and there was none. im sorry, but why would people stop using eq2 maps (in game mod, works well) or Eq2wikia just to pay another $10 a month.</blockquote>I don't know where people are getting that $10 a month figure, so I'll continue to say that our most expensive Premium package is $9.99 for three months, or $3.33 a month. 

SilkenKidden
08-20-2008, 02:38 AM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Cheesyfish wrote:</cite><blockquote>So... Basically Allakhazam and SoE are going to charge people ANOTHER $10 a month, to find info that they would find on <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eq2wikia.com." target="_blank">www.eq2wikia.com.</a> Allakhazam was sometimes good in eq1, most of the time it lacked detail. It was the same for eq2, even after DoF i checked on there for details about original content HQ's and there was none. im sorry, but why would people stop using eq2 maps (in game mod, works well) or Eq2wikia just to pay another $10 a month.</blockquote>I don't know where people are getting that $10 a month figure, so I'll continue to say that our most expensive Premium package is $9.99 for three months, or $3.33 a month.  </blockquote>3.33 is a lot more reasonable, but even that is something I don't want to pay.  $5 here and $3 there on this big worldwide web starts to add up. 

Calthine
08-20-2008, 04:12 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>3.33 is a lot more reasonable, but even that is something I don't want to pay.  $5 here and $3 there on this big worldwide web starts to add up.  </blockquote>I hear ya <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Just hang in there folks, as we get closer to launch we'll have more info!

Daroc
08-20-2008, 04:26 AM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Daroc wrote:</cite><blockquote>Feature request to the Zam folks who roam here.Would it be possible for us forum owners to implement code that pops up the same item "image" that shows up while hovering over an item link on the Allakhazam site?I think most webmasters use PHPBB, SMF or VBulletin.It would be great if we could get BB code that functions like Sword of Pown.I don't think anyone would mind that clicking on the link would open a new browser to the specific page of Allakhazam with the item and comments.</blockquote>That's a neat idea.  I've no idea if it's feasable, I think the platform people at SOE would have to get involved, but I'll certainly pass it on.</blockquote>Thank you <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

Kaalenarc
08-20-2008, 04:59 AM
<p><span style="color: #ffff00;"><span style="color: #ffff00;">Let me chime in with the soon-to-be-overwhelming chorus of this "tiered content/microtransaction laden" path SOE is starting down.  Enough already. I shouldnt have to pay 40 bucks a year for a site thats traditionally been free. Its "death by a thousand cuts" with SOE. A monthly subscription, LoN cards, EQ2Players, the annual expansion and now a reference site adding "features" that should just be part of the game?</span></span></p><p><span style="color: #ffff00;"><span style="color: #ffff00;"> Hasnt SOE gotten enough of my money? Sure - I **can** play for less, but if you want the full experience, SOE is gonna charge you just a little more, pile on just a little more. Here's some news for ya - sooner or later you're going to hit that tipping point and people will be fed up. And hey, by all means, charge even MORE for people who dont want to buy a long term solution - really gouge the players who just wanna try it out.  Its not "adding value" to make the long term subscription cheaper - its screwing the little guy.</span></span></p><p><span style="color: #ffff00;"><span style="color: #ffff00;"> Count me out of Zam.com altogether if theres ANY fee associated with it. I'll go over to EQ2wiki and see my info for free going forward. 40 bucks a year? Cut it out already.</span></span></p><p><span style="color: #ffff00;"><span style="color: #ffff00;">I mean come on You're presumably getting revenue from SOE to finance this little partnership, ad revenue too. AND you'e gonna hit us up to?</span></span></p><p><span style="color: #ffff00;"><span style="color: #ffff00;">/disapointed. </span></span></p><p><span style="color: #ffff00;"><span style="color: #ffff00;"> PS - SOE - how about fixing eq2players while youre at it? It updates about once every 6-8 weeks now that I pay for it. Back when it was free it updated daily. Just sayin.</span></span></p>

Spyderbite
08-20-2008, 07:20 AM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p> <span style="color: #ffff00;"><span style="color: #ffff00;"> PS - SOE - how about fixing eq2players while youre at it? It updates about once every 6-8 weeks now that I pay for it. Back when it was free it updated daily. Just sayin.</span></span></p></blockquote>I think that's sort of the whole point of this venture. To get a working version of eq2players running.As for the price.. its been said many, many times already in this thread already. All the content currently available on Zam for free will continue to be free. Its features (not necessarily content) beyond that which may incur a cost to utilize. I suspect features similar to those that require a fee on eq2players will be something like what they are referring to.Relax for now. As far as I know everything is still in the development stages. Your gonna get ulcers with all the speculation going on. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

denmom
08-20-2008, 07:47 AM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Cheesyfish wrote:</cite><blockquote>So... Basically Allakhazam and SoE are going to charge people ANOTHER $10 a month, to find info that they would find on <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eq2wikia.com." target="_blank">www.eq2wikia.com.</a> Allakhazam was sometimes good in eq1, most of the time it lacked detail. It was the same for eq2, even after DoF i checked on there for details about original content HQ's and there was none. im sorry, but why would people stop using eq2 maps (in game mod, works well) or Eq2wikia just to pay another $10 a month.</blockquote>I don't know where people are getting that $10 a month figure, so I'll continue to say that our most expensive Premium package is $9.99 for three months, or $3.33 a month. </blockquote>Um...rounding up to $10?I dunno either.Grats again!

Rijacki
08-20-2008, 11:34 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p> <span style="color: #ffff00;"><span style="color: #ffff00;"> PS - SOE - how about fixing eq2players while youre at it? It updates about once every 6-8 weeks now that I pay for it. Back when it was free it updated daily. Just sayin.</span></span></p></blockquote>I think that's sort of the whole point of this venture. To get a working version of eq2players running.</blockquote>Yes, we've had to pay for a crippled EQ2Players to get any of its features (like being able to look up characters at all) and we'll have to pay for EQ2Players -and- Zam to get a 'working version of EQ2Players running".SOE should be paying for Zam for any who are paying for EQ2Players, or SOE should just be paying for Zam and ALL of the features and call that EQ2Players.

Noaani
08-20-2008, 12:34 PM
<p>The only people this sucks for are those that have been paying for upgraded eq2players, and those with their own site that is reliant on player submitted data to provide factual information.</p><p>Depending on what features Zam implements, and exactly what info SoE provide, some sites may still have a place.</p><p>Features I would like to see...</p><p>A database of all mobs, able to be sorted/filtered by zone, level, difficulty (solo, heroic, epic) creature type (skeleton, animal etc) and rariety (common mob, named, place holder etc). From there, being able to select a mob and having its exact spawn point, path/roaming area and its abilities, as well as its loot table with chances to drop for each item. The best feature that Zam will hopefully be able to implement, and one that no other site has been willing/able to do, is the removal/adjusting of items/drop locations as the game progresses and drop locations change. I would be most impressed if Zam can keep their database up to date with exactly where items are dropping (and would be happy to pay the subs if they manage to do this, even if they do nothing else). While every item that has been in game should be accessable, there should be tags on items that no longer drop at all, or no longer drop off mobs that they used to drop from.</p><p>A database of every item in game, able to be sorted by slot, equippable class, level, stats, effects, rariety tier (legendary, fabled etc). Each item should provide me with its drop information (which provides a link to the database entry for the mob/s that drops it). Each item should provide an in game link for the item, its appearance, its full stats and effects, and if it is tradeable (and SoE give you appropriate feeds), the average broker price this item sells for (along with a history of broker sales for each server).</p><p>A database of all recipes, able to be sorted/filtered by class, level, recipe book, components used, crafting station used or skill used. Selecting a recipe will then show you the exact item it produces (including a link to that items "item page" as detailed above, including the average broker sale price), what components are needed and where to find them, what crafting station is needed and where to find it/them etc.</p><p>Thats all I've got for now.</p>

Jesdyr
08-20-2008, 12:54 PM
<cite>Rijacki wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>SOE should be paying for Zam for any who are paying for EQ2Players, or SOE should just be paying for Zam and ALL of the features and call that EQ2Players.</blockquote>Agree I will not be paying for Zam and EQ2players. If Zam can give me everything EQ2Players does SoE will lose that money and Zam will get it. 

Banadux
08-20-2008, 02:53 PM
The database access and API should made public to anyone.  If you are going to give this information to ZAM.com then you should give it to everyone.

Forktunge
08-20-2008, 03:46 PM
<p>So for less than the cost of a 1/4 Pounder with Cheese I get all this information...I think I can swing that.</p><p>I mean really, if you are so poor you're griping about $3.50 a month, you probably need to rethink your priorities.  </p><p>There is no gun pointed at anyone's head to play EQ2, or to sign up for EQ2 Players, or to subscribe to Zam...geeze, what has happened to my country??  You haters need to get a life.</p>

Aneova
08-21-2008, 11:45 AM
I for one am willing to play the waiting game. No one knows what's going to be done yet, so there's no sense in us all running around like a bunch of chickens with their heads chopped off. All the doom and gloom makes nice drama though, I'm gonna go pop some popcorn and watch the show.

Rijacki
08-21-2008, 12:31 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rijacki wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>SOE should be paying for Zam for any who are paying for EQ2Players, or SOE should just be paying for Zam and ALL of the features and call that EQ2Players.</blockquote>Agree I will not be paying for Zam and EQ2players. If Zam can give me everything EQ2Players does SoE will lose that money and Zam will get it. </blockquote>I dropped all but the character thing from EQ2Players now.  It was mostly all I was using with occassionally poking at some of the rest.  But since there probably won't be any more attempt to make it do what was promised back when it started, this saves me $2 of the $3 I can put to 'Zam where SOE is providing the information.$3/mo for EQ2Players isn't a lot.  $3/mo for EQ2Players + $3/mo for Zam, sure it still isn't a lot unless you also count $30 per station account (between my boyfriend and I we have 2) and/or $15 per normal account (between my boyfriend and I we have 2).  $3 EQ2Players + $3 Zam (for many of the same features promised on EQ2Players but never delivered) + $60 (two station accounts) + $30 (two normal accounts) does add up to a bit ($96/mo) with one of those not delivering what I am supposedly paying for...

Spyderbite
08-21-2008, 07:26 PM
<cite>Rijacki wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>$3/mo for EQ2Players isn't a lot.  $3/mo for EQ2Players + $3/mo for Zam, sure it still isn't a lot unless you also count $30 per station account (between my boyfriend and I we have 2) and/or $15 per normal account (between my boyfriend and I we have 2).  </blockquote>Don't quote me on this.. cause I really have no idea how this whole thing is going to be thrown together yet. But, I was under the impression that the new Zam site would replace eq2players.com. Again, I could be wrong. But, that's how I read it.And, if that's the case, then instead of paying SOE $3-$6/month for month for a little content; one would pay a small fee for <b>all</b> the content on Zam.I'm sure somebody more "in the know" will clarify when its official. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Calthine
08-21-2008, 07:44 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rijacki wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>$3/mo for EQ2Players isn't a lot.  $3/mo for EQ2Players + $3/mo for Zam, sure it still isn't a lot unless you also count $30 per station account (between my boyfriend and I we have 2) and/or $15 per normal account (between my boyfriend and I we have 2).  </blockquote>Don't quote me on this.. cause I really have no idea how this whole thing is going to be thrown together yet. But, I was under the impression that the new Zam site would replace eq2players.com. Again, I could be wrong. But, that's how I read it.And, if that's the case, then instead of paying SOE $3-$6/month for month for a little content; one would pay a small fee for <b>all</b> the content on Zam.I'm sure somebody more "in the know" will clarify when its official. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></blockquote>Just for the record, that's speculation.  We don't know either.

Doodar
08-22-2008, 10:16 AM
So when is this going be up and running

Atrix
08-22-2008, 05:35 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>Don't quote me on this.. </blockquote><p>Bwahaha... dontcha know that never works?</p><p>It's like saying "With all due respect..." before you insult someone.</p>

Thistleknot
08-22-2008, 06:29 PM
<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite><p>Bottom line: Why are we still paying for EQ2players then?</p></blockquote>Been wondering that for a while now... the zam.com announcement only makes the question more pressing in my mind.

Kiara
08-22-2008, 07:00 PM
Ease up guys.  We're starting to skirt the line here.Please return to civil discourse.

Calthine
08-22-2008, 07:04 PM
<img src="http://phcatalog.pearson.com/pe/PH/civic_ed/civics.jpg" alt="" border="0" />Oh, CIVIL... nm

Kendricke
08-23-2008, 12:56 PM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Raknid wrote:</cite><blockquote>What do IGE and the ZAM network have in common, and is it really a good idea to begin doing business with them, especially opening a direct pipeline to data?</blockquote>Absolutely nothing.  Our parent company sold off IGE last year.<a rel="nofollow" href="http://eq2.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=3;mid=117772225728544482" target="_blank">http://eq2.allakhazam.com/forum.htm...772225728544482</a></blockquote><p>Since the subject's been raised, what about ZAM's relationship with Itemmania and Player Auctions (both of whom are also owned entirely by Affinity Media)?  </p>

Spyderbite
08-23-2008, 02:07 PM
<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite><p>Since the subject's been raised, what about ZAM's relationship with Itemmania and Player Auctions (both of whom are also owned entirely by Affinity Media)?  </p></blockquote>I dunno. You tell me. I'm not familiar with either of the sites you mentioned. Sounds like a question for the executives of Affinity Media.By the way.. were you aware that RJ Reynolds (producer of tobacco products) also produces many frozen food products which indirectly support the tobacco production industry?

Kiara
08-23-2008, 02:20 PM
Take it to PMs guys.I'm locking this, since it seems we can't get the point not to bicker and attack on this subject.** Reopening for discussion.  I'm watching, so keep it civil and stop trolling and trying to get a flame going.  People will receive vacations.

PRALL
08-23-2008, 03:14 PM
<p>Things to remember here folks:</p><p>Zam is a business. SoE is a business. Put yourself in the role of a business and ask yourself what will keep your business going. That's right..money.</p><p>That said, people are so busy complaining they aren't seeing that most of Zam.com will continue to be free. If you want the ultra cool stuff.. take the $3 from your upgraded EQ2players features and apply it to Zam. There, fixed.</p><p>Another thing to remember. You chose to pay to play the game, which includes a subscription fee. You knew going into it that you pay to play. But everyone complaining seems to feel that the $15 subscription fee should include all the data in the game. While we're at it, let's all ask for our own on-call GM or guide,  but don't charge me for it. Sound extreme? Your ISP wants to upgrade your speed... do you get mad when you see that it costs $10 more to go from 3M to 5M cable? It's capitalism FTW folks. Nothing has changed.</p><p>As for the other fansites... I can't tell you how many times I have tried to find information on a mob or quest and come up empty. Sometimes I get what I want only by combining info from 2 or 3 sites. What I'm saying is that there has not been a totally reliable site to go to for EQ2 data. Now there will be. No more long searches through multiple sites. I for one rejoice for this, and believe it is about time.</p><p>And as for this killing other sites? That depends on the other sites. Just like any other situation where competition occurs, you have to sell your product. (By "sell" I don't mean charging money, I mean getting people to choose you over the competition.) My suggestion is to specialize. Zam will be the all-around source, so pick an aspect and excel in it. Make your layout and search practical and different. So when I'm looking for something specific for my ranger, I can hit you site all about rangers. (Just an example.)</p>

Thistleknot
08-23-2008, 04:00 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>ZThat said, people are so busy complaining they aren't seeing that most of Zam.com will continue to be free. If you want the ultra cool stuff.. take the $3 from your upgraded EQ2players features and apply it to Zam. There, fixed.</p></blockquote>The problem with that is that we've been paying money for EQ2players for features that are broke for a long time now. Instead of adding features to the site that we've been supporting all this time, they've partnered with another company and having that company offer the new features. When pressed on what features are going to be free and which are going to be charged for, the question is constantly dodged with no answers. I find it hard to believe that SoE and Zam both announced this new service, but have no pricing structure at all to reveal. They also haven't stated whether they're going to move the EQ2Players features over to zam, or will they continue to make us spend money on half-broken features on EQ2Players and pay for zam.com to access the "ultra cool" stuff (to use your term).From a business sense, I perfectly understand the outsourcing, but I think the points brought up above need to be addressed and honestly, should have been addressed when the partnership was announced.

PRALL
08-23-2008, 05:30 PM
<cite>Thistleknot wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>ZThat said, people are so busy complaining they aren't seeing that most of Zam.com will continue to be free. If you want the ultra cool stuff.. take the $3 from your upgraded EQ2players features and apply it to Zam. There, fixed.</p></blockquote>The problem with that is that we've been paying money for EQ2players for features that are broke for a long time now. Instead of adding features to the site that we've been supporting all this time, they've partnered with another company and having that company offer the new features. When pressed on what features are going to be free and which are going to be charged for, the question is constantly dodged with no answers. I find it hard to believe that SoE and Zam both announced this new service, but have no pricing structure at all to reveal. They also haven't stated whether they're going to move the EQ2Players features over to zam, or will they continue to make us spend money on half-broken features on EQ2Players and pay for zam.com to access the "ultra cool" stuff (to use your term).From a business sense, I perfectly understand the outsourcing, but I think the points brought up above need to be addressed and honestly, should have been addressed when the partnership was announced.</blockquote><p>I hear ya man. I used to pay for the EQ2players features as well. Think of it this way... They know they had issues -> they have many hands in many different pies and it wasn't getting fixed -> Zam gets the info and it's up to them now to make it work. The players benefit from a more dedicated team working on these featuers. SoE benefits from not having to maintain the old system. </p><p>As far as the lack of info is concerned, they can't tell you what they don't know. Thus far they have only agreed to give Zam the info. If they aren't talking, it's because they haven't worked out that part of the agreement. When they work it out and have signed documents and such they will let you know. You don't have to pay for EQ2Players features. No one is twisting your arm. So they can't <i>"make us spend money on half-broken features on EQ2Players and pay for zam.com"</i> (your words.) Pick the one that is better for you, and pay for that one. Drop the other.  CONSIDER IT AN UPGRADE! <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/385970365b8ed7503b4294502a458efa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /> One that is a long time coming.</p><p>I do agree with you on your last statement to a point. We all wish they had all pricing info when they made the announcement. They way I see that is that Fan Faire is the best place to announce new things. (Heck, I'm still waiting for info on The Agency that I wish they had at the announcement in 2007!) You have to view it as a sneak peek, because the launch is a ways away just like the launch of the expansion.. just like the launch of Freerealms. Heck, they didn't even tell you how much the expansion was going to cost at Fan Faire. </p><p>Fan Faire = {{deep breath}} we have some really stuff we are working on that might come out sometime in the future that we're excited about and hope you are too even though we only have a teaser video of something that isn't a finished product. </p>

PRALL
08-23-2008, 05:39 PM
<p>Oh, btw...</p><p>For the people that are concerned about ProfitUI...</p><p>The guy that does that UI is always on top of things like this. If you don't already have the auto-updater, get it. I bet you'll love that link to the new zam page when you click it in game! The poor guy that makes the UI can't have much fun in game with all the updates he does. He's always ready for every GU, so you know he's on test staying current on ui related stuff. If you are still concerned, send him a message on EQ2Interface!</p>

Atrix
08-24-2008, 01:22 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>But everyone complaining seems to feel that the $15 subscription fee should include all the data in the game. </p></blockquote><p>No one is complaining about this because it's never been the case.  EQ2players has always been an extra charge.  You don't -need- the info to play beyond your basic subscription, but extra info is always nice.</p><p>But if you pay for a service, don't you think you should get what you pay for?</p><p>The problem is pent up frustration with a poor product and no real answers from anyone in the know.  To head off an obvious reply of "They don't know yet", I find it hard to believe that as a business deal either SoE or Zam would go into this without ideas on what was going to happen.  Would you go into a business deal with no idea what you were buying or selling?</p><p>I'd like to know what information that is currently being handled by EQplayers is going to be switched over to Zam.  It's a simple question that if I were a memeber of the Zam or SoE team I would have asked before cash exchanged hands.</p><p>As a consumer, I feel it's a good question to ask.  Untill it's answered I've stopped my EQ2players subscription.  I know no one is giving the answer now and I'm fine with it.  I just have a hard time paying for a sub-par service that's now up in the air as far as the direction it's going.</p>

PRALL
08-24-2008, 03:31 PM
<p>While no one is flat out saying that they think the $15 should cover it all, there are some people here that are giving off that vibe. My previous post also addresses the fact that the people that pay for EQ2players (which is sub-par) are complaining that they might have to pay for Zam.com (which can't help but be better maintained.) So, the way I see it, people are upset about nothing more than speculation at this point. Now, if Zam comes out and makes the premium subscription $20 a month, then maybe these folks have a gripe. However, like you stated, you don't have to have anything past the basic EQ2 subscription to play the game.</p><p>I agree with you that you should get what you pay for. That is why I no longer pay for EQ2Players. If Zam makes this a good product at a fair price, I'm there.</p><p>Are you asking what info Zam is getting, or whether EQ2Players will cease once said info is given to Zam? Reading what has been said so far, I see all info going to Zam... a total stream of data coming straight from the servers. If you are asking whether EQ2Players is going away, then that is a valid question that the high muckity-mucks have not answered yet. However, my question to you and the others with this concern is.. What does it matter? If Zam makes this work, why would you even use EQ2Players anymore?</p>

Atrix
08-24-2008, 03:51 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Are you asking what info Zam is getting, or whether EQ2Players will cease once said info is given to Zam? Reading what has been said so far, I see all info going to Zam... a total stream of data coming straight from the servers. If you are asking whether EQ2Players is going away, then that is a valid question that the high muckity-mucks have not answered yet. However, my question to you and the others with this concern is.. What does it matter? If Zam makes this work, why would you even use EQ2Players anymore?</p></blockquote><p>Here's the thing, Zam isn't making anything work yet.  By what Calthine and Spyder (the only people from Zam saying anything here) have said they have no clue what they're going to be doing and SoE is mum on the whole thing.</p><p>There is no sneak peek, there isn't anything to look forward to... there's nothing.  But speculation of course <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>The concern for people still paying for EQ2Players is why should they pay -now- for a product that may or may not be rendered obsolete a month or whenever down the road?</p>

Vonotar
08-24-2008, 04:44 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Are you asking what info Zam is getting, or whether EQ2Players will cease once said info is given to Zam? Reading what has been said so far, I see all info going to Zam... a total stream of data coming straight from the servers. If you are asking whether EQ2Players is going away, then that is a valid question that the high muckity-mucks have not answered yet. However, my question to you and the others with this concern is.. What does it matter? If Zam makes this work, why would you even use EQ2Players anymore?</p></blockquote><p>Here's the thing, Zam isn't making anything work yet.  By what Calthine and Spyder (the only people from Zam saying anything here) have said they have no clue what they're going to be doing and SoE is mum on the whole thing.</p><p>There is no sneak peek, there isn't anything to look forward to... there's nothing.  But speculation of course <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>The concern for people still paying for EQ2Players is why should they pay -now- for a product that may or may not be rendered obsolete a month or whenever down the road?</p></blockquote>Companies should learn not to announce things prematurely...

Ogrebe
08-24-2008, 05:21 PM
Like I said before this is going to hurt the community. <p><a href="http://eq2llinks.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">eq2llinks.com</a> and <a href="http://gypsylynx.eqtraders.com/index.php?/archives/137-Less-Happy-Gaming-News.html" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">eqtraders.com </a>have both mentioned this partnership as one of the reason they may close.</p><p>And I don't believe they will be the last community site to announce there thought of closing because of this. </p><p>These sites worked hard to get the data that they had, and now it just being given to Zam, and it really making the other community sites feel irreverent. That all the hard work in putting up there databases is for nothing. Since Zam has a complete database supplied by SoE.</p><p>If Zam was not getting the complete database and another community site was, you could bet Zam would be [Removed for Content] about this.</p><p>Honestly I think the best way to make all community sites feel included would be to open up this data to everyone. This way no community site feels like they need to close, because Zam get all the data.</p>

Spyderbite
08-24-2008, 05:58 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Honestly I think the best way to make all community sites feel included would be to open up this data to everyone. This way no community site feels like they need to close, because Zam get all the data.</p></blockquote>I think all the modern gaming companies have learned their lessons when passing out "Free For All" data streams. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Too many exploits and illegal 3rd party programming occurs. Offering it to everyone is never going to happen. Next suggestion?

Ogrebe
08-24-2008, 06:10 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Honestly I think the best way to make all community sites feel included would be to open up this data to everyone. This way no community site feels like they need to close, because Zam get all the data.</p></blockquote>I think all the modern gaming companies have learned their lessons when passing out "Free For All" data streams. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Too many exploits and illegal 3rd party programming occurs. Offering it to everyone is never going to happen. Next suggestion?</blockquote>I don't see how the data that Zam said they would be getting could be expolited

Spyderbite
08-24-2008, 06:16 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>I don't see how the data that Zam said they would be getting could be expolited</blockquote>EA & Blizzard said the same thing. Feel like rolling the dice and finding out? I don't.

Ogrebe
08-24-2008, 06:26 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>I don't see how the data that Zam said they would be getting could be expolited</blockquote>EA & Blizzard said the same thing. Feel like rolling the dice and finding out? I don't.</blockquote>Never heard what happened to EA or Blizzard, care to fill me in...Any way the data that Zam has said they would be getting looks very hard to explolit. It looks like there giving you all the data, so i don't see what could be expolited. <blockquote>A complete database with detailed information that you can only get directly from the game itself. Maps of Mob Locations. Mob spells and skills. Complete drop information including the percentage chance of something dropping. Full item stats, including the normally hidden stuff. Complete quest walk throughs with all the text from in game. Spell, skill and AA lists.</blockquote>

Spyderbite
08-24-2008, 06:35 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>Never heard what happened to EA or Blizzard, care to fill me in...Any way the data that Zam has said they would be getting looks very hard to explolit. It looks like there giving you all the data, so i don't see what could be expolited. </blockquote>You got Google.. run with it. I have no desire to relive that nightmare in game again.Meh.. not really an excuse or reason.. more of a "don't come to me when I told you so" statement.

Ogrebe
08-24-2008, 07:05 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>Never heard what happened to EA or Blizzard, care to fill me in...Any way the data that Zam has said they would be getting looks very hard to explolit. It looks like there giving you all the data, so i don't see what could be expolited. </blockquote>You got Google.. run with it. I have no desire to relive that nightmare in game again.Meh.. not really an excuse or reason.. more of a "don't come to me when I told you so" statement.</blockquote>I understand the point your making. Give everyone access to the data, and some people will use the data to cheat in the game.SoE can avoid with by giving access to the date, to just the Comunitiy site, and not everyone. On top of that if Zam publish all the data they said they were, it wouldn't be to hard to parse all the data off there website and make a database out of it.  And then use that database to expolit the game.

PRALL
08-24-2008, 07:41 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Here's the thing, Zam isn't making anything work yet.  By what Calthine and Spyder (the only people from Zam saying anything here) have said they have no clue what they're going to be doing and SoE is mum on the whole thing.</p><p>There is no sneak peek, there isn't anything to look forward to... there's nothing.  But speculation of course <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>The concern for people still paying for EQ2Players is why should they pay -now- for a product that may or may not be rendered obsolete a month or whenever down the road?</p></blockquote><p>Well, Magna is right in that they announced this too early. Now everyone has questions that are not hashed out yet. Right now Calth and Spyder are the lower tier employees that don't have anything to do with the negotiations I'm sure. You have to remember that EQ2 is the FIRST site for the new ZAM, so I'm fairly certain they are still hashing things out for all the games that will have Zam sites. Once that happens, the crap will roll downhill and the specific site people like Calthine will learn more.</p><p>As for people still paying for EQ2Players.... if it is so sub-par, why pay for it? To me, it doesn't matter if it will stay or go once the new Zam goes live. If it isn't worth the money now, than I don't pay for it now.</p>

Skywarrior
08-24-2008, 08:11 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote>Right now Calth and Spyder are the lower tier employees that don't have anything to do with the negotiations I'm sure. You have to remember that EQ2 is the FIRST site for the new ZAM, so I'm fairly certain they are still hashing things out for all the games that will have Zam sites. </blockquote><p>Aye, and Spyderbyte is doing a really bang-up job ensuring that he doesn't alienate any of his employers future potential customer base, too.  <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>But then, if he is the kind of representative Zam wants on these boards then perhaps it is truly indicative of the kind of customer service they intend to provide.  Who knows?</p>

Spyderbite
08-24-2008, 09:15 PM
<cite>Skywarrior wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite><p>But then, if he is the kind of representative Zam wants on these boards then perhaps it is truly indicative of the kind of customer service they intend to provide.  Who knows?</p></blockquote>Ahhh.. another fan. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Atrix
08-24-2008, 09:19 PM
<cite>Skywarrior wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Aye, and Spyderbyte is doing a really bang-up job ensuring that he doesn't alienate any of his employers future potential customer base, too.  <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p><p>But then, if he is the kind of representative Zam wants on these boards then perhaps it is truly indicative of the kind of customer service they intend to provide.  Who knows?</p></blockquote><p>To be fair, while I don't agree with Spyder, he's not a EQ2 forum representaive for Zam.  He works on their boards.  On these boards he's just another player like the rest of us.</p><p>Lets be honest, if you're going to let one employee skew your view of a company then there is probably not much they could do to get your business in the first place.</p>

Spyderbite
08-24-2008, 09:24 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite><p>To be fair, while I don't agree with Spyder, he's not a EQ2 forum representaive for Zam.  He works on their boards.  On these boards he's just another player like the rest of us.</p></blockquote>Exactly! And, that is something people seem to be missing. Probably on purpose.I got access to an "Edit" button on Zam. That's where my knowledge of this whole deal ends. I'm just as speculative as everyone else. *blinks*Ok.. maybe not quite as speculative as most. But, its fun to watch the X-Files rebirth itself in this thread none the less. XD

Atrix
08-24-2008, 09:42 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ok.. maybe not quite as speculative as most. But, its fun to watch the X-Files rebirth itself in this thread none the less. XD</blockquote><p>Hehe... But why is your "positive" speculation any better/worse that my "negative" speculation?  We're all taking out our posteriors at this point.<img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />  Except for some rare instances, it's remaining constructive... and entertaining.</p><p>I really don't think this could be a Bad Thing (tm), I just have some questions that I need answers to before I give any more money to anyone for this aspect of the game.  I'll stay tuned till the answers come out.</p>

Wingrider01
08-24-2008, 10:35 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>Like I said before this is going to hurt the community. <p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://eq2llinks.com/" target="_blank">eq2llinks.com</a> and <a rel="nofollow" href="http://gypsylynx.eqtraders.com/index.php?/archives/137-Less-Happy-Gaming-News.html" target="_blank">eqtraders.com </a>have both mentioned this partnership as one of the reason they may close.</p><p>And I don't believe they will be the last community site to announce there thought of closing because of this. </p><p>These sites worked hard to get the data that they had, and now it just being given to Zam, and it really making the other community sites feel irreverent. That all the hard work in putting up there databases is for nothing. Since Zam has a complete database supplied by SoE.</p><p>If Zam was not getting the complete database and another community site was, you could bet Zam would be [Removed for Content] about this.</p><p>Honestly I think the best way to make all community sites feel included would be to open up this data to everyone. This way no community site feels like they need to close, because Zam get all the data.</p></blockquote><p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eqtraders.com/" target="_blank">http://www.eqtraders.com/</a> is not the site that you linked</p><p>Personally will not be visiting this site, have a bad taste in my mouth from a serious issue with Allakhazam a number of years back and have not been there since. Have a hard block for any of their sites in my firewall</p>

Kendricke
08-24-2008, 10:40 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>To be fair, while I don't agree with Spyder, he's not a EQ2 forum representaive for Zam.  He works on their boards.  On these boards he's just another player like the rest of us.</p></blockquote>On these boards, the name under his says "EQII Allakhazam".  Any time he speaks up regarding Allakhazam, he does so as a representative of that company. 

Vonotar
08-24-2008, 10:59 PM
<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>To be fair, while I don't agree with Spyder, he's not a EQ2 forum representaive for Zam.  He works on their boards.  On these boards he's just another player like the rest of us.</p></blockquote>On these boards, the name under his says "EQII Allakhazam".  Any time he speaks up regarding Allakhazam, he does so as a representative of that company.  </blockquote>I was about to say the same thing, now I know things are going downhill when we agree with each other <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/385970365b8ed7503b4294502a458efa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />I certainly hope that eqtraders doesn't shut down as this site covers a large subject matter that Allakhazam just doesn't do well (and I suspect never will).A quick question to the Alla rep... will player comments be zapped again prior to relaunch as zam.com (same as when ogaming was taken over by allakhazam)?Other sites are needed as I suspect Zam will be very db driven, which is fine for min-max'ers but not for those who truely want real-(game)-life experience and advice.

dawy
08-24-2008, 11:02 PM
If eqtraders does indeed close down this deal will leave a nastier taste in my mouth than it has already

dawy
08-24-2008, 11:04 PM
<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>To be fair, while I don't agree with Spyder, he's not a EQ2 forum representaive for Zam.  He works on their boards.  On these boards he's just another player like the rest of us.</p></blockquote>On these boards, the name under his says "EQII Allakhazam".  Any time he speaks up regarding Allakhazam, he does so as a representative of that company.  </blockquote>Correct Kendricke at least when i see that under his name i assume he's talking for the company

Atrix
08-24-2008, 11:37 PM
<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>To be fair, while I don't agree with Spyder, he's not a EQ2 forum representaive for Zam.  He works on their boards.  On these boards he's just another player like the rest of us.</p></blockquote>On these boards, the name under his says "EQII Allakhazam".  Any time he speaks up regarding Allakhazam, he does so as a representative of that company.  </blockquote><p>That is certainly an opinion you are welcome to.  Personally, I can seperate a person's personal stance from the company they work for when they speak in an entirely different forum.</p><p>Which is a good thing for more fansites than just Alla.</p>

PRALL
08-24-2008, 11:50 PM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>To be fair, while I don't agree with Spyder, he's not a EQ2 forum representaive for Zam.  He works on their boards.  On these boards he's just another player like the rest of us.</p></blockquote>On these boards, the name under his says "EQII Allakhazam".  Any time he speaks up regarding Allakhazam, he does so as a representative of that company.  </blockquote><p>That is certainly an opinion you are welcome to.  Personally, I can seperate a person's personal stance from the company they work for when they speak in an entirely different forum.</p><p>Which is a good thing for more fansites than just Alla.</p></blockquote><p><b>It's a damned if ya do and damned if ya don't thing.</b> Spyder could say "speaking personally (not as a rep of Alla)" and people like Kendricke would still consider it an "official statement." Whereas Atrixya would be on the other end of the spectrum, only taking it as official if Spyder said it was an official statement. </p><p>I guess there will always be the guys wearing the tinfoil hats out there. </p><p>And from what I know of it, Spyder is the new guy. So he doesn't even know what Calthine knows, and she doesn't know what her boss knows.... you know.. <b>just like any job.</b></p>

Kendricke
08-25-2008, 12:10 AM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>To be fair, while I don't agree with Spyder, he's not a EQ2 forum representaive for Zam.  He works on their boards.  On these boards he's just another player like the rest of us.</p></blockquote>On these boards, the name under his says "EQII Allakhazam".  Any time he speaks up regarding Allakhazam, he does so as a representative of that company.  </blockquote><p>That is certainly an opinion you are welcome to.  Personally, I can seperate a person's personal stance from the company they work for when they speak in an entirely different forum.</p><p>Which is a good thing for more fansites than just Alla.</p></blockquote><p><b>It's a damned if ya do and damned if ya don't thing.</b> Spyder could say "speaking personally (not as a rep of Alla)" and people like Kendricke would still consider it an "official statement." Whereas Atrixya would be on the other end of the spectrum, only taking it as official if Spyder said it was an official statement. </p><p>I guess there will always be the guys wearing the tinfoil hats out there. </p><p>And from what I know of it, Spyder is the new guy. So he doesn't even know what Calthine knows, and she doesn't know what her boss knows.... you know.. <b>just like any job.</b></p></blockquote><p>If I'm at a work conference and someone asks my opinion about my company in a public roundtable, ANYTHING I say reflects upon my company.  </p><p>Of course, I'm just one of those people "like me" who think that anytime you post in public, you're reflecting upon your company:  <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.hartsman.com/2007/09/13/beta-community-guidelines-circa-2004/" target="_blank">Beta Community Guidelines (circa 2004)</a> at "Scott Hartsman - Off the Record".</p><blockquote><p>The moment you post something in public, you are no longer in the business of just developing games. </p><p>- You are also acting as Customer Service, Public Relations, and Community Relations, regardless of your actual title. Act accordingly with those roles as well as your primary role.</p><p>- Don't say anything that you don't want printed on the cover of PC Gamer, with your name, EverQuest II, and SOE associated with it.</p></blockquote><p>Whether you think it's fair or not, the fact of the matter is that Spyderbyte is employed by Allakhazam.  Anything he says, especially in a discussion ABOUT Allakhazam, is going to be perceived as representative of the company.  That's simply the way it is.  Perception is reality.</p>

Calthine
08-25-2008, 12:15 AM
<cite>Magnamundian wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>A quick question to the Alla rep... will player comments be zapped again prior to relaunch as zam.com (same as when ogaming was taken over by allakhazam)?Other sites are needed as I suspect Zam will be very db driven, which is fine for min-max'ers but not for those who truely want real-(game)-life experience and advice.</blockquote>I don't know, I'll enquire.And actually, you can do just that on Zam, as the wikibase and comments allow for leaving lots of advice.  It's way more flexible than it was before.

ke'la
08-25-2008, 12:25 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Cheesyfish wrote:</cite><blockquote>So... Basically Allakhazam and SoE are going to charge people ANOTHER $10 a month, to find info that they would find on <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eq2wikia.com." target="_blank">www.eq2wikia.com.</a> Allakhazam was sometimes good in eq1, most of the time it lacked detail. It was the same for eq2, even after DoF i checked on there for details about original content HQ's and there was none. im sorry, but why would people stop using eq2 maps (in game mod, works well) or Eq2wikia just to pay another $10 a month.</blockquote>I don't know where people are getting that $10 a month figure, so I'll continue to say that our most expensive Premium package is $9.99 for three months, or $3.33 a month. </blockquote>Um...rounding up to $10?I dunno either.Grats again!</blockquote>$10 per month = $30 every 3 monthsZam's expencive Package is $9.99 every 3 months.Last I checked $9.99 does not round up to $30.00

Atrix
08-25-2008, 12:29 AM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote>  It's way more flexible than it was before.</blockquote>But still is occular torture.

Calthine
08-25-2008, 12:44 AM
<cite>[email protected] Bayle wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote>  It's way more flexible than it was before.</blockquote>But still is occular torture.</blockquote>I whole heartedly agree!  Feel lucky, I *have* to look at it!  I've been campaigning to be rid of the sea foam green since the day I started <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Did you see<a href="http://www.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=14688" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"> the new look</a>?  Of course, it's still under development, but I was gratified to see no hint of sea foam green anywhere.

Ogrebe
08-25-2008, 12:49 AM
<cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>Like I said before this is going to hurt the community. <p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://eq2llinks.com/" target="_blank">eq2llinks.com</a> and <a rel="nofollow" href="http://gypsylynx.eqtraders.com/index.php?/archives/137-Less-Happy-Gaming-News.html" target="_blank">eqtraders.com </a>have both mentioned this partnership as one of the reason they may close.</p><p>And I don't believe they will be the last community site to announce there thought of closing because of this. </p><p>These sites worked hard to get the data that they had, and now it just being given to Zam, and it really making the other community sites feel irreverent. That all the hard work in putting up there databases is for nothing. Since Zam has a complete database supplied by SoE.</p><p>If Zam was not getting the complete database and another community site was, you could bet Zam would be [Removed for Content] about this.</p><p>Honestly I think the best way to make all community sites feel included would be to open up this data to everyone. This way no community site feels like they need to close, because Zam get all the data.</p></blockquote><p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eqtraders.com/" target="_blank">http://www.eqtraders.com/</a> is not the site that you linked</p><p>Personally will not be visiting this site, have a bad taste in my mouth from a serious issue with Allakhazam a number of years back and have not been there since. Have a hard block for any of their sites in my firewall</p></blockquote>I did link to eqtraders.com, look at the url it is <a href="http://gypsylynx.eqtraders.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://gypsylynx.eqtraders.com</a> that is from the eqtraders.com domain name...

Zarador
08-25-2008, 01:27 AM
I dunno, after 7 pages of reading, not sure anyone brought this up, but...How well did the 3rd party provider Live Gamer work out?  Maybe that's why I cringe to a small degree with the thought of another company "helping" us gamers out with a gee whiz partnership. I used Zam's for years in Everquest and found them very helpful, as a third party fan site.  Now, as others pointed out, there stands a chance that perhaps that "premium access" will in some way provide a database that if used incorrectly could in some way comprimise the game. I guess that concerns me given how LG dealing with the transactions of gamers was not all that well thought out in the beginning or responsive. My dealings with LG were dissapointing at best with a general attitude of "Sony knows there's a problem, we know there's a problem, no ETA on a fix, too bad, can I help you with anything else". That resulted in a feeling of "I trusted SoE with the exchange servers and signed up, they trusted LG later on who dropped the ball, now neither one seems to care about what happened". Gamers tend to be passionate and don't like flippant responses.  You ask a question like "what services will be billed for" and get back pretty much an answer of "who knows".  I like to believe that many of us are involved in the business world and know that such things are often ironed out long before an agreement is made.  Skirting that issue tends to make one assume, correctly or incorrectly that we may not like the answer.  No answer is often an indication that bad news is forthcoming. I might very well be 100% wrong in my apprehensions, but most companies, when they have something really good up and coming that people will be raving and craving for use that information to boost their image and sales for as long as they can.  You keep things that your customers may not like hearing under wraps as long as possible while throwing out sales pitches for the things they seem to really want as often as possible.  Customer: "Wow, this new breakfest sandwich is the best one I ever had at a fast food place!"Fast Food Place: Well, it should be, it has 1,800 calories! errr...I mean, we just added an international coffee bar in all our places!Customer: Will the new coffee cost a lot more?Fast Food Place:  We added a new line of smoothies as well!

Calthine
08-25-2008, 01:31 AM
LOL, I like the restaurant analogy.<cite>Zarador wrote:</cite><blockquote>Gamers tend to be passionate and don't like flippant responses.  You ask a question like "what services will be billed for" and get back pretty much an answer of "who knows".  I like to believe that many of us are involved in the business world and know that such things are often ironed out long before an agreement is made.  Skirting that issue tends to make one assume, correctly or incorrectly that we may not like the answer.  No answer is often an indication that bad news is forthcoming. </blockquote>As for this, I assure you I'm not being flippant.  I've been told it's still under discussion, I really don't know anything else.   You may be right, maybe they have nailed it all down, but if so the info has not trickled down yet.

Rijacki
08-25-2008, 01:54 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Honestly I think the best way to make all community sites feel included would be to open up this data to everyone. This way no community site feels like they need to close, because Zam get all the data.</p></blockquote>I think all the modern gaming companies have learned their lessons when passing out "Free For All" data streams. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Too many exploits and illegal 3rd party programming occurs. Offering it to everyone is never going to happen. Next suggestion?</blockquote>Offering it to even a single 3rd party site, regardless if the site is for-profit (Zam is) or has any ties whatsoever to any Real Money Transfer sites (Zam's parent owned IGE and still has ties to others, but a bit more obscure, perhaps) or even if the site is wholey non-profit and open source (Zam is neither), the data stream is open for exploitation and.. ahem.. 3rd party programming.Regardless of Zam's intent with the data stream or SOE's "safeguards" on it, the existance of this type of stream even to just one outside location opens it up for exploitation.However, the oneous is on SOE.  THEY are the ones who are blundering here.  Zam is opportunistically taking advantage of a business deal.  SOE is the one whom many of us believe gave assurances to some extent that our game would not be open to blatant cheating. SOE also led us to believe it would not sanction sales of in-game items for real money except on Station enabled servers.  But, SOE is a business.  Part of the new business model for MMOGs that has been in discussion in several industry panels is some form of micropayment. Frankly, I think SOE knows full well the state of Zam's parent company's relationship with any RMT related endeavors (most definately better than Zam's own employees even) and is actually counting on that relationship.Calthine, for all that she's been a driving force in improving the Alla site for EQ2 is a mere peon in the wider company.  Spyder is even less so. No, they don't speak for the company at large any more than the janitor speaks for the goings on at Microsoft. They're the messenger, in some ways, the "face of Zam" on this board, but speak authoritively? You would have to be an idiot or have zero business accume to think that either of them are the "official word" of Allakhazam or its parent company.On the record.  I am not thrilled by this change either and not just because I have hosted a very very small niche fansite dedicated to one small aspect of the game (and have been approached by Calthine on ways to cover everything my site has in the past in order to make it completely obsolete).I'm more upset with SOE, though, who is giving a business site the opportunity to obliterate all other similar businesses (no matter their size). In many ways it's like a city doing eminent domain on a parcel of land in order to allow Walmart or Costco to build a store which will put all the small stores down town out of business (btw, that really does happen in real life, I even lived in one such place a few years back).

Nolrog
08-25-2008, 08:18 AM
<cite>Wingrider01 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>Like I said before this is going to hurt the community. <p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://eq2llinks.com/" target="_blank">eq2llinks.com</a> and <a rel="nofollow" href="http://gypsylynx.eqtraders.com/index.php?/archives/137-Less-Happy-Gaming-News.html" target="_blank">eqtraders.com </a>have both mentioned this partnership as one of the reason they may close.</p><p>And I don't believe they will be the last community site to announce there thought of closing because of this. </p><p>These sites worked hard to get the data that they had, and now it just being given to Zam, and it really making the other community sites feel irreverent. That all the hard work in putting up there databases is for nothing. Since Zam has a complete database supplied by SoE.</p><p>If Zam was not getting the complete database and another community site was, you could bet Zam would be [Removed for Content] about this.</p><p>Honestly I think the best way to make all community sites feel included would be to open up this data to everyone. This way no community site feels like they need to close, because Zam get all the data.</p></blockquote><p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.eqtraders.com/" target="_blank">http://www.eqtraders.com/</a> is not the site that you linked</p></blockquote>The link was for Denmom's personal blog on the EQTraders site.  Note the URL: <a href="http://gypsylynx.eqtraders.com/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://gypsylynx.eqtraders.com/</a>

Vonotar
08-25-2008, 09:41 AM
<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite>If I'm at a work conference and someone asks my opinion about my company in a public roundtable, ANYTHING I say reflects upon my company. ..<p>Whether you think it's fair or not, the fact of the matter is that Spyderbyte is employed by Allakhazam.  Anything he says, especially in a discussion ABOUT Allakhazam, is going to be perceived as representative of the company.  That's simply the way it is.  Perception is reality.</p></blockquote>Very true, in exactly the same way that anything we say reflects on the Guild listed under our names (although this currently doesn't count for me as I'm still waiting for the forums and eq2players to catch up on the fact that I finally ditched by dead guild² and joined Shattered Moon Brew Co. last week... *sigh* )I do hope that the new Zam site works well, for us, SoE and Alla itself.  However I *do* believe that the other fan sites have a lot to offer that Zam simply won't be able to cover (nobody can be excellent at everything).Something I have seen elsewhere is that Zam could offer a few olive branches to other sites by providing a mechanism for other sites to reference Zam database information when appropriate.  An example would be eq2traders being able to call up a pop-up window that shows the current stats of crafted clothing taken directly from the SoE-Zam database (with credit to zam at the bottom obviously).  This would save other sites from having to store this additional information, instead DenMum can concentrate on crafting advice (which is what we all want i'm sure, I know that *I* certainly depend on her site for information not obtainable elsewhere) rather than running around attempting to update the crafted items database everytime SoE/Domino tweak them.A simply, "if you know the link number, you can call up the information" rule could apply.²actually Elements of Arcadia might return as a roleplay crafting association rather than a guild... all this depends on the final implementation of guild housing.

Banadux
08-25-2008, 10:43 AM
I'm glad to see I'm not the only one that was asking for public type access to this information.  I don't think the DB should be left read to the world, but it should be available if you are willing to verify your identity and consent to not abusing / exploiting the access.  If other fan sites are allowed access to this information then we can have competition and let quality of service decide what site(s) are used.

Zarador
08-25-2008, 11:32 AM
<cite>Calthine wrote:</cite><blockquote>LOL, I like the restaurant analogy.<cite>Zarador wrote:</cite><blockquote>Gamers tend to be passionate and don't like flippant responses.  You ask a question like "what services will be billed for" and get back pretty much an answer of "who knows".  I like to believe that many of us are involved in the business world and know that such things are often ironed out long before an agreement is made.  Skirting that issue tends to make one assume, correctly or incorrectly that we may not like the answer.  No answer is often an indication that bad news is forthcoming. </blockquote>As for this, I assure you I'm not being flippant.  I've been told it's still under discussion, I really don't know anything else.   You may be right, maybe they have nailed it all down, but if so the info has not trickled down yet.</blockquote>My apologies if the "flippant" remark seemed directed at you or Spyder, it was not intended to come out that way.  By, flippant, I meant the general feel of the situation.  Basically, I think that many others, like myself, are unsure as to how exactly a "Partnership" can be formed without having the details ironed out first.  I don't truely see how both companies, as large as they are, could announce a partnership, then work out the details on how it will be distributed to their customers and at what fee. This is a positive thing, but we don't know how it's going to work out or what access you will have.  Sorry, it's hard to get excited since I'm not Ms. Cleo.  I understand your situation as well as Spyder's, however I think it's human nature to respond to the only representitives that are able to respond to you.  In essence, I don't beleive that the 18 year old associate at the T-Mobile Counter is directing the operations of T-Mobile, but he's the one that gets the earfull when the phone fails.

Cassea
08-25-2008, 12:56 PM
I just fail to see why it's so difficult to tell us what it will cost.It's not going to be free and I think we all know that. What I find increadable....1. SOE and Ally form a joint parnership in which all others are locked outComment: If this was free and a service to the community then why not offer this info to everyone? Why exclusive and lock out some of your best supporters?2. They formed this exclusive relationship but everything else is up in the air from what they will provide to possible pricesComment: This is beyond belief. Two companies form a business relationship and they cannot tell us IF there will be a fee? Maybe the exact fee is not worked out but they know that there will be a fee or not so why not tell us?3. Is EQplayers no more?Comment: The "impression" (true or not) is that you do not want to say because then people will flee EQplayers NOW - why not get an extra month of two of $$$I never subscribed to EQplayers. I felt it was nothing but vanity to try and compare each others toons as if it was some form of competition as to who obtained the most pretend objects. Now let's assume that it worked (which it often did not LOL) and I will say what was nice about it was that I could pay ONE company. I have to laugh every time someone finds an excuse as to why it's acceptable for EQplayers to be all messed up. EQplayers is extra income and as such there should be someone working on it 100% of the time... it's not some extra side cash that the current workers make in their spare time!Oh well... whatever happens happens. I hate the feeling of being nickeled and dimed to death. The "impression" that many of us get is that they are taking something free and charging for it. Until we hear "real" information this will not go away.What is very sad is that this has the potential to drive what few EQ2 sights are left into the ground. This is sad.

PRALL
08-25-2008, 01:13 PM
<cite>Cassea wrote:</cite><blockquote>3. Is EQplayers no more?Comment: The "impression" (true or not) is that you do not want to say because then people will flee EQplayers NOW - why not get an extra month of two of $$$</blockquote><p>Again.... EQ2Players is up right now and Zam has not launched. So, if you want this type of info then you can pay for it there. I agree that it is not up to speed. So right now you can either pay for what is there, or save some money until Zam launches. Ask yourselves what you need. SoE could look at it as extra money. (All the tin hat wearing folks could see it that way, I'm sure.) Or.. and I'm going out on a limb here... they could see it as having data available to those who need it until the Zam site is up and running. Either way, if you want to compare your toon min-maxxer style then you have to deal with what you have for now. </p><p>Don't get me wrong, I think it sucks, but I'm not for the conspiracy theories.</p>

Daroc
08-26-2008, 04:24 AM
Another feature request.<span class="postbody">A few friends and me are trying to share and collect the various stuff that's in game. We are not (yet) in a guild as we're missing a sixth person.We would like to see what's in our trader toon it's bags and bank. Possibly with ways of protecting who can see this per guild member status or individual character names (one would have to have a Zam account to use this).Thank you for considering this./Daroc</span>

Thunderthyze
08-26-2008, 07:27 AM
<p>Speaking as a business person I think you all need to look at the question of price from a different perspective.</p><p>Zam/SOE will already know EXACTLY how much it will cost the subscribers. The question which will still be somewhat up in the air is how much will be free and WHAT will be subscriber only.</p><p>Believe me, the numbers always come first in order that an assessment of profitability can be made. Zam will be trying to balance attraction with take up in order to maximise revenue. They won't give anything away for free that they can get the majority to pay for. It will cost them no more to give content away for free than it will to get people to pay for it. In other words the "cost" is already fixed. The question they are asking themselves is how much revenue can they squeeze out of the subscribers to cover those costs and maximise profits. In other words, increase revenue by increasing subscribers...NOT by increasing subscription (which might have the effect of reducing subscribers and possibly overall revenue).</p>

Hellswrath
08-26-2008, 04:39 PM
I see there is still no official answer about this OR about anything related to EQ2Players.Would be nice to get some real insight as to what is going to happen.

craghack
08-27-2008, 01:55 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>I see there is still no official answer about this OR about anything related to EQ2Players.Would be nice to get some real insight as to what is going to happen.</blockquote>But on a plus side, EQ2Players updated today! It only took 18 days!!!

Detor
10-20-2008, 10:46 PM
It's been several more months and I've not heard of anything further about this.  Did they decide not to do it afterall?

Despak
10-21-2008, 07:41 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>Like I said before this is going to hurt the community. <p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://eq2llinks.com/" target="_blank">eq2llinks.com</a> and <a rel="nofollow" href="http://gypsylynx.eqtraders.com/index.php?/archives/137-Less-Happy-Gaming-News.html" target="_blank">eqtraders.com </a>have both mentioned this partnership as one of the reason they may close.</p><p>And I don't believe they will be the last community site to announce there thought of closing because of this. </p><p>These sites worked hard to get the data that they had, and now it just being given to Zam, and it really making the other community sites feel irreverent. That all the hard work in putting up there databases is for nothing. Since Zam has a complete database supplied by SoE.</p><p>If Zam was not getting the complete database and another community site was, you could bet Zam would be [Removed for Content] about this.</p><p>Honestly I think the best way to make all community sites feel included would be to open up this data to everyone. This way no community site feels like they need to close, because Zam get all the data.</p></blockquote>Traders actually mentions that as the third or fourth reason.  You aren't paying them enough or clicking their ads to make the hosting fees.  So before you blame everything on ZAM or Alla, take a long hard look at yourself and your "right to everything for free"!

Lethe5683
10-21-2008, 09:36 AM
I don't like the idea of this.  First the zam sites tend to be outdated and rather flimsy seeming.  Second they charge money or have tons of annoying adds.

Zorastiz
10-21-2008, 10:01 AM
<p>Even the free EQ2 Players doesn't work, when I use launchpad I have NO characters listed, I haven't had a sig update in months which is why I use a custom sig.</p><p>If you can't get your own service right what would make me think this ZAM thing will work?</p>

Tro
10-21-2008, 01:38 PM
I will gladly pay 30 bucks a year if we get what is advertised.. absolutely no doubt !!

Hellswrath
10-26-2008, 01:11 AM
<p><cite>Detor wrote:</cite></p><blockquote>It's been several more months and I've not heard of anything further about this.  Did they decide not to do it afterall?</blockquote><p>No one who knows is talking.  There are plenty of inquiring minds, though. lol</p>

HaCkHaCkER
01-23-2009, 08:05 PM
<p>I know i am necro posting, but i want to know of any updates involving the Zam.com/SOE partnership.  is it still in the works when is it coming etc...</p>

Calthine
01-23-2009, 10:43 PM
<p><cite>HaCkHaCkER wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>I know i am necro posting, but i want to know of any updates involving the Zam.com/SOE partnership.  is it still in the works when is it coming etc...</p></blockquote><p>Darned if I can find the link, but Draknorr, our Content Director, posted not too long ago that it is definately still in development.  They want to be <em>very</em> sure that it's done right.</p><p>That being said, I've no current ETA beyond Soon(tm).  It <em>is </em>still in the works, and we're getting closer.  Trust that when I have any news I'll post.  Probably lots, until Kiara has to give me dirty looks and hand slappings.</p>

Spyderbite
01-23-2009, 11:53 PM
<p><cite>Calthine wrote:</cite></p><blockquote><p>Probably lots, until Kiara has to give me dirty looks and hand slappings.</p></blockquote><p>I actually have that setup as a ring tone on my phone... she speaks the truth.. Cal will upate as soon as she knows! <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>