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Greenlander
12-28-2007, 04:30 AM
Well after trying out a bunch of classes (Brigand and Inquisitor to t3 among others) I finally decided to scrap them all and play what I really wanted to play from the get-go but had shied away from because I wasn't sure how it would be in pvp.  I guess I'm just a tank and nothing can change that....I'd rather lose more but fight with a sword and shield toe-to-toe and just suck up the damage.Anyway I wasn't really sure what to expect but encountered a ton of pvp today in mok rent and was sort of surprised: I OWN scouts!  I killed two scouts 4 levels higher than me who tried to gank me and weren't smart enough to run, as well as a few more 2-3 lvls higher than me.  A handful of others ran, and obviously there was nothing I could do to catch 'em but it was a satisfying to see them run as it is to kill 'em really.  And most of these guys attacked me while I was engaged with mobs.  So enjoyable to be able to look forward to scout ganking now so I can show 'em what's up.  (admittedly I was in newb zones and there's a great chance of course these scouts were just crappy players despite their titles...so idk if this kind of record will hold up I suppose).I find I don't really miss track because people bring the fight to me anyway, and it seems I don't have to be afraid of any tracking classes.And Stealth I don't miss at all because I hardly ran into q's who couldn't see it anyway.  I suppose trying to stalk people on my brig was kind of fun but the fighting itself was no where near as enjoyable for me.The couple of healers I encountered ate me alive. Both furies and 1 level higher than me.  Seems like this isn't going to change, but then again I don't know what to expect in higher tiers at all.Didn't run into any casters but I imagine if I'm rooted I'm toast.I duo'd for a bit and definitely missed the usefulness of my inquisitor here, though it was still fun and I believe if I had been with a healer would have been awesome. All in all a way more enjoyable experience than I was lead to believe though.  Being able to go toe-to-toe with scouts without breaking a sweat is so nice...especially since 75% of my solo pvp encounters are scouts tryin' to gank me.  Nothing like seein' a slayer 4 levels higher than you runnin for his life after trying to gank you when engaged with a mob.Anyway I'm sold on the Guardian now and I'm relieved to finally have a main after so many hours of t1-3 questing/harvesting/changing mind etc.I'll probably keep playing my inquisitor for a change of pace, though (after all he's riding a 9 plat horse shame to waste it).Anyway just wanted to post some impressions for anyone thinking about Guardian.  Any other Guards care to comment on pvp viability?  How do we do in higher tiers for example?  In what situations do we do well, in what ones will we get owned?

sprogn
12-28-2007, 06:00 AM
<p>Well done for trying something new.  My son rolled a guard a week ago and loved it.  I play an 80 Berserker.  They are very viable PVP classes.</p><p>One tip, keep your ranged skill maxed.  Occasionally this means getting the swashbuckler to tank a few mobs when you're exping so you can back off and ranged them with your bow.  It's invaluable in PVP for dropping casters who are fond of their root button.</p><p>Stick at it, it does have it's rough patches up the levels but with the right AA spec (STR448, STA44882, INT44862) you will rip scouts a new one more than you'll die to them.</p>

Mwahaha
12-28-2007, 11:03 AM
I had a similar experience with my pally vs a orange con brig in the caves.  I just spammed my ward and I kept myself up while doing what damage I could to him and he was eventually in the red then ran off, nothing I could do about that.  Pretty impressed with the class so far.

Wytie
12-28-2007, 11:17 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>Well after trying out a bunch of classes (Brigand and Inquisitor to t3 among others) I finally decided to scrap them all and play what I really wanted to play from the get-go but had shied away from because I wasn't sure how it would be in pvp.  I guess I'm just a tank and nothing can change that....I'd rather lose more but fight with a sword and shield toe-to-toe and just suck up the damage.Anyway I wasn't really sure what to expect but encountered a ton of pvp today in mok rent and was sort of surprised: I OWN scouts!  I killed two scouts 4 levels higher than me who tried to gank me and weren't smart enough to run, as well as a few more 2-3 lvls higher than me.  A handful of others ran, and obviously there was nothing I could do to catch 'em but it was a satisfying to see them run as it is to kill 'em really.  And most of these guys attacked me while I was engaged with mobs.  So enjoyable to be able to look forward to scout ganking now so I can show 'em what's up.  (admittedly I was in newb zones and there's a great chance of course these scouts were just crappy players despite their titles...so idk if this kind of record will hold up I suppose).I find I don't really miss track because people bring the fight to me anyway, and it seems I don't have to be afraid of any tracking classes.And Stealth I don't miss at all because I hardly ran into q's who couldn't see it anyway.  I suppose trying to stalk people on my brig was kind of fun but the fighting itself was no where near as enjoyable for me.The couple of healers I encountered ate me alive. Both furies and 1 level higher than me.  Seems like this isn't going to change, but then again I don't know what to expect in higher tiers at all.Didn't run into any casters but I imagine if I'm rooted I'm toast.I duo'd for a bit and definitely missed the usefulness of my inquisitor here, though it was still fun and I believe if I had been with a healer would have been awesome. All in all a way more enjoyable experience than I was lead to believe though.  Being able to go toe-to-toe with scouts without breaking a sweat is so nice...especially since 75% of my solo pvp encounters are scouts tryin' to gank me.  Nothing like seein' a slayer 4 levels higher than you runnin for his life after trying to gank you when engaged with a mob.Anyway I'm sold on the Guardian now and I'm relieved to finally have a main after so many hours of t1-3 questing/harvesting/changing mind etc.I'll probably keep playing my inquisitor for a change of pace, though (after all he's riding a 9 plat horse shame to waste it).Anyway just wanted to post some impressions for anyone thinking about Guardian.  Any other Guards care to comment on pvp viability?  How do we do in higher tiers for example?  In what situations do we do well, in what ones will we get owned?</blockquote><p>Great post, good to see positive things being shared. </p><p>Its just too rare nowdays........</p>

MaCloud1032
12-28-2007, 11:36 AM
My main is a 80 sk and i got a 42 gaurd right now the best thing is i hold agro in pvp.  I love playing my SK they have a feel all there own but my biggest pet peeve is that i cant hold agro in pvp and the gaurd does it and then some.

Raidyen
12-28-2007, 02:29 PM
Hell just froze over.  A post about scouts getting owned.  I am thrilled to hear this.  Grats on killing some scouts !!  Stick with it and you will see how good a well played tank truely is. 

seahawk
12-28-2007, 03:06 PM
<p>Scouts owned?!? nerf Gaurdians now!  lol!</p><p> Grats on finding a class you like.. good luck man!</p>

Tybr
12-29-2007, 04:56 AM
<p> Ahhhh Guardian...how I love thee.</p><p><span style="font-size: xx-small;">(Please keep in mind this is from a PvP perspective as thats what I like to do.)</span>  </p><p>I would have to say, hands-down, Guardians are a flipping blast to play. My previous experiance on Ven (Dirti Deeds) and now on Nag (Illwinds) has just reinforced this opinion. </p><p>I honestly have nothing but good things to say about this class. I would however caution anyone who cares about titles, this class might not be for you. </p><p>Our job in PvP is to taunt,  and to die...Many may argue with this opinion, but I believe this is where the platemail meets the road. </p><p>In reflection, many of my most rewarding fights have left me dead on the ground with my groupmates alive and victorious. </p><p>So to the OP I'm glad you like the class. </p><p>Welcome to the ranks... Live to serve, Die to protect. </p><p><span style="font-size: xx-small;">EDIT: SPELLIN</span></p>

DS_Wind
12-29-2007, 07:27 AM
about Solo Guardian on top lvl ...hmmMost players know that solo PvP includes 3 big parts:<b><span style="color: #6600ff;">1</span>.</b> opportunity to choose combat (track, advantage in speed, evac ...);<b><span style="color: #6600ff;">2</span>.</b> opportunity to kill (dps, player control ...);<b><span style="color: #6600ff;">3</span>.</b> opportunity not to die in combat (heal, player control, armoravoidanceimmuneresists...);That is why scouts most popular classes on PvP servers and have tons of hi-ranked chars.Thay are kings of N1, in tops of N2 and realy not bad in N3.Let's look at Guardian:1. - very low;2. - very low;3. - u may think "here it is!"... not realy <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/136dd33cba83140c7ce38db096d05aed.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /> the sad thing is, that potentially, any healer class (coz of heal), any crusader (coz of heal), BruiserMonk (coz of hp+heal+knockbacks+buffs), and even WizardWarlock (coz of control+manashield), enchanter (coz of control) have more advantage N3 in solo pvp than Guardians.Guardian main advantage calls "Give N3 to others", there is not such a part in solo pvp but it presents in group pvp and Guardians kings of this ability <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="29" height="15" />

Tybr
12-29-2007, 09:08 AM
<p>^</p><p>To put it diffrently...</p><p>Guardians:</p><p>Solo = Dead</p><p>Grouped (with a healer etc.) = Gods.</p><p>And "in general" I would agree. </p>

Izzypop
12-29-2007, 11:55 AM
<p>Gaurds are great in grouped PvP.  Guards & Pallies are the PvP group tanks of chioce.</p><p>We are in the top 4 worst solo PvP classes being Guardian, Dirge, Necromancer, & Conjurer.</p><p>It would be a long complicated post if I tried to argue we are #1</p><p>Problems of solo T8 Guards </p><p>#1 In the Game of Rock Paper Scissors the guardian gets snared kited and stoned to death by rocks, Paper forms into a wet paper bag that a guardian can not dps their way out of, and Scissors just activates swashbuckler/brigand short terms and pwns a guardian in the face.</p><p>#2 Lots of solo quests.  You can't do these quests solo, and not be a walking token pinata.  Be prepared to be pwned by solo green con players if you do go out and grind quests solo as a guard.  On the bright side guards are the most likely to remember to mail out their cash.</p><p>#3 Scouts farm Tokens faster without you.  You can form PvP groups, but it's hard to get scouts to join.  You just slow them down in their own token farming.  LU42 changes may fix this.</p><p>All of these problems combined makes Guardians an non viable solo class, and it's really hard to get a PvP group going with the current token system so all that is left for us to do is wait until we get a PVE group for instances/chardok/seb</p>

Winter12345
12-29-2007, 04:09 PM
<p>The guardian class is the most fun class I've tried so far next to my wizzy, they are great at taunting, protecting other players and just ramming down dps even though in sometimes little amounts. Maybe it is just in the higher teirs but guards aren't so bad solo pvp in t2, they can do well but i do agree that they are way better in groups.</p>

Oneira
12-29-2007, 05:14 PM
Welcome to the guardian class.  First the bad news.By the time you reach t6 you will no longer be owning scouts.  Rangers will kite you to death and there's not much you will be able to do about it.  Swashies once they get En Garde and the like will pretty much rip through you.  More bad news.  Sorcerors with manashield?  no chance.  And healers....no that won't change...they'll easily outheal your damage and wear you down.My t8 guard was pretty much consigned to do the Kylong Plains quests solo, and the amount of times I was ganked left me so frustrated I lost my desire to play my guardian for weeks.  I still haven't played her since.What Izzypop said is pretty much correct.  Being a guardian can be terribly frustrating.  I don't know how many times I logged on asked for a group and got nothing.  That meant soloing.  Fact is, in pvp it just seemed that having a guardian in the group wasn't that important.  I believe Izzy's comment here is correct: in the great token chase, we just slowed those fast-paced scouts down.The satisfaction and success of a guardian in pvp depends on having a consistent, well-built group with you as often as possible.  You just can't compete with other classes solo, and that includes other fighting classes.  Brawlers and Crusaders will outdo you in solo pvp by a long shot.I'm hopeful that LU42 will change this.  If tokens are gained through writs, then us group-friendly classes should be more in demand.

BWLeeEllison
12-29-2007, 07:01 PM
<p><b><span style="font-size: small;color: #0099ff;font-family: comic sans ms,sand;">Awesome post man.  Glad someone can handle being a tank.  I cant <img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></span></b></p><p><b><span style="font-size: small;color: #0099ff;font-family: Comic Sans MS;">QUICK someone make CSKY come read this 8P</span></b></p>

HerbertWalker
12-31-2007, 05:01 PM
Guardian was my roll on day one.   He was middle of the pack in terms of soloability until about T4, when he dropped to very very bad.   His name was Griefer, but he definately was the most killed character on Nagafen before I retired him to roll a battlemage, who is currently level 43 and I think can easily defeat my 70 Guardian.

Bloodfa
12-31-2007, 05:05 PM
<cite>BWLeeEllison wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><b><span style="font-size: small;color: #0099ff;font-family: comic sans ms,sand;">Awesome post man.  Glad someone can handle being a tank.  I cant <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />" width="15" height="15" /></span></b></p><p><b><span style="font-size: small;color: #0099ff;font-family: Comic Sans MS;">QUICK someone make CSKY come read this 8P</span></b></p></blockquote><img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />  <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/97ada74b88049a6d50a6ed40898a03d7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />