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View Full Version : Atleast make leveling less painful?


XEmericaSurfe
12-13-2007, 02:08 AM
<p>So the locks are forced to level. fine.</p><p>Any discussion if AA will be awarded per pvp kill, so grinding wont be nessesary to get to the good pvp? Thinking about going back to a PvE server makes me sad, but with this new system it seems like if I want to max my t8 effectivness I will have to max the AA through PvE. lame. <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p>

Shindah
12-14-2007, 08:04 AM
Amen!!!!!!!!!! well im not religous but this is a very  very valid point........ this is a pvp server ! not an avoid pvp server till lev 80 to get the AA to be competitive!  or is it now?  (if so please bring in pvp to pve transfers) if that happens sony will keep there paying accounts , even if it kills pvp. <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Grimfort
12-14-2007, 09:17 AM
<p>What you are suggesting could allow a player to max out their character by pvping alone, no pve required at all. If you really think that is what you should be able to do, I would think you are playing the wrong game. It's almost like wanting to ignore the fact that there is a pve world out there at all.The pvp servers are pvp added to pve, they are an extension, not a replacement. The kind of pvp I think you are talking about would sit well on like the wow battlegrounds. EQ2 sits in my mind about 75% pve / 25% pvp, but I play much less pvp myself, but starting to play more now.</p><p>I can see how someone who has already done all the pve on another server would not want to do it again. I started on a pvp server and its all I know, and I found a great medium between pvp and pve, even on a low population server. </p>

Grimfort
12-14-2007, 09:27 AM
<cite>Shindah wrote:</cite><blockquote>this is a pvp server ! not an avoid pvp server till lev 80 to get the AA to be competitive!  or is it now?  </blockquote>lol, thats exactly what the new players had to do to keep away from the "competitive" (aka twink) pvpers. The new system will .. push (is my best word) those people back into pve to reach that same competitive level, but at a higher level in which the gap between good and excellent is not as far apart as the lower levels.

Vilesummon
12-14-2007, 09:38 AM
I can tell you from pvping at 80 last night, even when you can't get xp anymore there was NO aa xp given for the kills. Probably had like 25 kills last night and didn't move one aa %. I am really baffled by that especially since the xp gained at max level is supposed to be converted to aaxp. Don't know if this was an oversight...or planned. Whichever way, I will still enjoy the pvp and pick the aaxp up elsewhere.

Grimfort
12-14-2007, 09:41 AM
I do agree on that point, your exp should convert to AA at 80 like it does for pve, but not as you level.

toenukl
12-14-2007, 06:52 PM
Firstly, I am for the newest change.However, now t2/3 PvP gear is impossible to obtain at that level, please adjust the faction required or boost faction/tokens from pvp kills.Secondly, back to OP, I think AA xp and adv xp from PvP would be a tad overpowered unless it's a small amount. But, I DO think if someone's playstyle is PvP only, there should still be a place for them in Norrath. My idea would be to have quests/writs involving PvP that reward substantial amounts of AA xp. Either "Kill 10 enemies", "Kill 10 mages", "Kill 10 hunter titled players" etc and make the AA reward actually worth doing it.

Rutaq
12-14-2007, 07:45 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>Firstly, I am for the newest change.However, now t2/3 PvP gear is impossible to obtain at that level, please adjust the faction required or boost faction/tokens from pvp kills.Secondly, back to OP, I think AA xp and adv xp from PvP would be a tad overpowered unless it's a small amount. But, I DO think if someone's playstyle is PvP only, there should still be a place for them in Norrath. My idea would be to have quests/writs involving PvP that reward substantial amounts of AA xp. Either "Kill 10 enemies", "Kill 10 mages", "Kill 10 hunter titled players" etc and make the AA reward actually worth doing it. </blockquote><p>Great ideas.</p><p>Now that the painful change has been made it is time to clean up some of the collateral damage caused. </p><p>  Reviewing the requirements for PvP gear to make them reasonable since PvPers will be pushed out of the tier long before they could have the faction/token saved up.</p><p> AAs are a big part of the game and there has to be a review of the advancement system to include some way to make up the AA lost when you are pushed out of a tier.  Like  <b>Nail</b>  said...   Maybe a non repeatable PvP based quest at each tier to help boost your AA accumulation to offset the lost PvE AAs.</p>

moonchild1
12-15-2007, 02:43 PM
<cite>Grimfort wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>What you are suggesting could allow a player to max out their character by pvping alone, no pve required at all. If you really think that is what you should be able to do, I would think you are playing the wrong game. It's almost like wanting to ignore the fact that there is a pve world out there at all.The pvp servers are pvp added to pve, they are an extension, not a replacement. The kind of pvp I think you are talking about would sit well on like the wow battlegrounds. EQ2 sits in my mind about 75% pve / 25% pvp, but I play much less pvp myself, but starting to play more now.</p><p>I can see how someone who has already done all the pve on another server would not want to do it again. I started on a pvp server and its all I know, and I found a great medium between pvp and pve, even on a low population server. </p></blockquote><p>MOTD:  Welcome to Everquestgrad comrade!  The newest expansion, Rise of Kommunism, has been a complete success!</p><p>Why should I be punished for winning a fight?  For every win my aa/exp ratio gets screwed?  I have worked VERY hard to NOT be equal.</p><p>I have paid my dues, 2 years on Vox before learning how to become a trully susccessfull PVPer.  If they want to PVE they should go to one of the 21 PVE servers, come to PVP when you are ready for more of a challenge.  Yes, some of the baby turtles are going to get picked off.  I was once a baby turtle.</p><p>Why not just make all things equal comrade?  Soulution:  All classes will now have heals/wards/high dps melee and magic.  All armor will have the same exact stats.  And even if you lose a fight you get a trophy, just like lossing in modern little league baseball, because NOBODY should suffer damage to thier self-esteem.</p><p>Or at least add an EQUAL amount of aa as %EXP per kill.  Most PVE gives MORE aa than %EXP.</p>

Hennyo
12-15-2007, 03:22 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Grimfort wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>What you are suggesting could allow a player to max out their character by pvping alone, no pve required at all. If you really think that is what you should be able to do, I would think you are playing the wrong game. It's almost like wanting to ignore the fact that there is a pve world out there at all.The pvp servers are pvp added to pve, they are an extension, not a replacement. The kind of pvp I think you are talking about would sit well on like the wow battlegrounds. EQ2 sits in my mind about 75% pve / 25% pvp, but I play much less pvp myself, but starting to play more now.</p><p>I can see how someone who has already done all the pve on another server would not want to do it again. I started on a pvp server and its all I know, and I found a great medium between pvp and pve, even on a low population server. </p></blockquote><p>MOTD:  Welcome to Everquestgrad comrade!  The newest expansion, Rise of Kommunism, has been a complete success!</p><p>Why should I be punished for winning a fight?  For every win my aa/exp ratio gets screwed?  I have worked VERY hard to NOT be equal.</p><p>I have paid my dues, 2 years on Vox before learning how to become a trully susccessfull PVPer.  If they want to PVE they should go to one of the 21 PVE servers, come to PVP when you are ready for more of a challenge.  Yes, some of the baby turtles are going to get picked off.  I was once a baby turtle.</p><p>Why not just make all things equal comrade?  Soulution:  All classes will now have heals/wards/high dps melee and magic.  All armor will have the same exact stats.  And even if you lose a fight you get a trophy, just like lossing in modern little league baseball, because NOBODY should suffer damage to thier self-esteem.</p><p>Or at least add an EQUAL amount of aa as %EXP per kill.  Most PVE gives MORE aa than %EXP.</p></blockquote>Welcome to the EXACT reason this change went thru.

Gapik
12-15-2007, 11:36 PM
<cite>XEmericaSurferX wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>So the locks are forced to level. fine.</p><p>Any discussion if AA will be awarded per pvp kill, so grinding wont be nessesary to get to the good pvp? Thinking about going back to a PvE server makes me sad, but with this new system it seems like if I want to max my t8 effectivness I will have to max the AA through PvE. lame. <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></p></blockquote><p>What exactley is considered the aa amount needed to be an effective T8 player? And do my pre eof lvl 70 alts get a hand out too as they leveled theres at a snails pace before the gave it away in droves with eof? afterall they obviousley missed out too but at the time ppl just rolled with it and adapted.</p><p>dont get me wrong i can understand the peole that like to mainly quest or lvl with friends and yes this may hurt them unfortunatley but i guess if push comes to shove the mentoring (just kill me quick) system is still there.</p><p>But other arguments to be honest make me laugh " i need to do 200 quests at lvl 20 to get my t3 armor" who are ppl kidding a) t3 armor and AA would be moot after 200 quests youd be more interested in t4 if not 5 b) id be surprised if you can find 200 quests worth doing hell id be surprised if you had 20 that just had to be done (beside aa building)</p><p>"Im not locked to gank/kill/grief newbies im just taking it slow" people that have been locked at optimum lvl for killing eg wiz lvl 23 ball of flame 1 shot kill or rouges preds for the last year and half are not in any way taking it slow there doing it for the quick easy kills</p><p>"i just ant faction" see above answer</p><p>at the end of the day any problems you think you might face leveling up were always there, nobody had max faction/aa/spells/armor but we managed</p><p>oh before anyone says anything i have chars in all tiers i play t2-t8 and i still welcome the change</p>

Jetblackrogue
12-16-2007, 05:25 AM
<p>Hah, well now people will be forced to do one of two things:</p><p>1) Progress through the game content with the addition of PVP encounters (the content really is wonderful I assure you).</p><p>2) Go back to a non-progress oriented game (maybe a FPS), but I guess that playing field may be too level for many.</p>

moonchild1
12-16-2007, 11:57 PM
<cite>Hennyo wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Grimfort wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>What you are suggesting could allow a player to max out their character by pvping alone, no pve required at all. If you really think that is what you should be able to do, I would think you are playing the wrong game. It's almost like wanting to ignore the fact that there is a pve world out there at all.The pvp servers are pvp added to pve, they are an extension, not a replacement. The kind of pvp I think you are talking about would sit well on like the wow battlegrounds. EQ2 sits in my mind about 75% pve / 25% pvp, but I play much less pvp myself, but starting to play more now.</p><p>I can see how someone who has already done all the pve on another server would not want to do it again. I started on a pvp server and its all I know, and I found a great medium between pvp and pve, even on a low population server. </p></blockquote><p>MOTD:  Welcome to Everquestgrad comrade!  The newest expansion, Rise of Kommunism, has been a complete success!</p><p>Why should I be punished for winning a fight?  For every win my aa/exp ratio gets screwed?  I have worked VERY hard to NOT be equal.</p><p>I have paid my dues, 2 years on Vox before learning how to become a trully susccessfull PVPer.  If they want to PVE they should go to one of the 21 PVE servers, come to PVP when you are ready for more of a challenge.  Yes, some of the baby turtles are going to get picked off.  I was once a baby turtle.</p><p>Why not just make all things equal comrade?  Soulution:  All classes will now have heals/wards/high dps melee and magic.  All armor will have the same exact stats.  And even if you lose a fight you get a trophy, just like lossing in modern little league baseball, because NOBODY should suffer damage to thier self-esteem.</p><p>Or at least add an EQUAL amount of aa as %EXP per kill.  Most PVE gives MORE aa than %EXP.</p></blockquote>Welcome to the EXACT reason this change went thru.</blockquote><p>You COULD be a little more specific as to the point being addressed.  An easy cheesy solution to this whole mess would be to simply take away level 20-29 PVP gear.  This would resolve the noob bashing in T2.  Give them some time to figure out the PVP angles inside of 20 or so levels.  But since the MC gear is now better off, why not just chuck PVP gear altogether?  </p><p>My main concern is being "punished" for winning.  Making it not worthwhile to PVP on a PVP server until level 80. </p>

moonchild1
12-17-2007, 12:31 AM
<cite>Jetblackrogue wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Hah, well now people will be forced to do one of two things:</p><p>1) Progress through the game content with the addition of PVP encounters (the content really is wonderful I assure you).</p><p>2) Go back to a non-progress oriented game (maybe a FPS), but I guess that playing field may be too level for many.</p></blockquote><p>Since Vox was outfitted as an Exchange server, was it not meant to be all-out PVP?  Was it not meant to be the pennacle of player versus player?</p><p>I went to PVP to PVP.  I do a good share of PVE as well, for gaining my aa to have an end result that affects my PVP capability.  I have 32 aa at level 24, still behind the cap of 1.5 per level.  But was FORCED to level to 24 by PVP, or I could just let my title slip when I am trying to PVE.</p><p>If you want to just see the pretty flowers then stay in PVE!</p><p>There are many of us who prefer the complexity of PVP in EQ2, WoW be spat upon!</p><p>Now the economy is shattered, PVP gear and Fabled are worthless compared to MC made from "rares" that are put on the broker by the shovel full.</p><p>AA ratios being depleted per each win.</p><p>Rise of Kommunism is here folks.  You are evil for trying to get ahead.  You must be punished for being successful.</p><p>How about having Vox, since it is an Exchange server, be left to all-out PVP?  There are those of us who have ALSO been paying good money, for YEARS, who will, or already HAVE cancelled subscriptions.</p><p>I have paid my dues in the PVP world, now the nooblets come in and have their little self-esteem issues.  And rather than getting better at PVP themselves, screw over everone else.</p>

moonchild1
12-17-2007, 12:52 AM
<cite>Grimfort wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Shindah wrote:</cite><blockquote>this is a pvp server ! not an avoid pvp server till lev 80 to get the AA to be competitive!  or is it now?  </blockquote>lol, thats exactly what the new players had to do to keep away from the "competitive" (aka twink) pvpers. The new system will .. push (is my best word) those people back into pve to reach that same competitive level, but at a higher level in which the gap between good and excellent is not as far apart as the lower levels.</blockquote><p>Hooooooly cow.....  That has to be the most deranged thinking.  I thought that PVP was supposed to "push" people from PVE to PVP.  Getting your butt kicked inspires one to become a stronger PVP player, at least it was for me.</p><p>About those "avoiding PVP" until level 80.  You haven't seen ANY whinning YET!  Wait till they hit 70 and get ganked at every turn.  From an 80 that has 140 aa.  That 80 will fart at the nooblet 70 and kill him.</p><p>The nooblets are going to catch grief anyway.  The majority I have heard from are going to make disposable toons, level 10 to 20, gank, rinse, repeat.  You have done nothing but irritate your long term client base.</p>

Grimfort
12-17-2007, 06:42 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Grimfort wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Shindah wrote:</cite><blockquote>this is a pvp server ! not an avoid pvp server till lev 80 to get the AA to be competitive!  or is it now?  </blockquote>lol, thats exactly what the new players had to do to keep away from the "competitive" (aka twink) pvpers. The new system will .. push (is my best word) those people back into pve to reach that same competitive level, but at a higher level in which the gap between good and excellent is not as far apart as the lower levels.</blockquote><p>Hooooooly cow.....  That has to be the most deranged thinking.  I thought that PVP was supposed to "push" people from PVE to PVP.  Getting your butt kicked inspires one to become a stronger PVP player, at least it was for me.</p></blockquote><p>I didn't say it was my way of thinking, just saying how it is. However, how can you just "become" a stronger pvp player, you need to do some training (ie rocky!) like pve to get in shape (ie get better gear).</p>

Yonaton
12-17-2007, 08:36 AM
Gear isn't the only thing that makes a twinka twink. Not pwr lvling a toon to t8 is one thing. The sad thing is,on Vox I was teaching people to twink. Storm's Brew was devoted to things like that. Made life a whole lot more easy than things now. the guild is gone,very few guilds are even going to bother teaching toon building,and by the time they know what to do,they'll be up with the "big boys". Pity.

Yonaton
12-17-2007, 08:40 AM
BTW,thank you all for continuing to paint lvl lockers with the broadest brush imaginable. Guess that justifies all teh talk of you "uber" t8's with like,700 kills.

XeroXs84
12-17-2007, 01:10 PM
Just see Archievement Points as Rewards for archieving something in PvE content. Because thats what it always was and what it is designed for. If you want to get that you just have to do PvE no way arround.

XeroXs84
12-17-2007, 01:12 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>T</cite>he nooblets are going to catch grief anyway.  The majority I have heard from are going to make disposable toons, level 10 to 20, gank, rinse, repeat.  You have done nothing but irritate your long term client base.</blockquote>wow THAT sounds like a poor way to play this game.

Bloodfa
12-17-2007, 01:59 PM
<p>76 with a measley 104 AP's.  And for a long time my AP's were around equal to my level due to having blown through the quests <i>before</i> most of them awarded Achievement experience.  And cruised through collection quests early on, due to the need to level quickly, helping friends simply make it outside long enough to run to Thundering Steppes.  Sometimes I can solo kill an 80.  Sometimes not.  Sometimes a group of us can drop a group of high-titled 80's.  Sometimes not.  If you <i>haven't</i> gotten a toon up into T8, please, keep your assumptions silent until you hit that range, because they are wildly inaccurate.  As far as the lower tiers, I have toons in all of them, including newb-town Timorous Deep (that's where everybody has gone, by the way, rolling up new toons).  </p><p>I agree, level 20 PvP gear should either be removed or beefed up for higher tiers, level 30 or so.  Reducing the faction needed for it, still needed regardless, just a question of how much.  If memory serves, the concept of PvP writs, bounties as it were, was bounced around with quite a bit of popularity this past summer.  Non-repeatable writs providing <i>some</i> Achievement XP wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing.  Finding a happy medium is what should be the goal.  And for the love of <insert name of preferred deity here>, would everyone please stop calling the <i>others who disagree with you</i> whiners and carebears.  It makes you look like a petulant youth, on both sides of the fence.</p>

Bloodfa
12-17-2007, 01:59 PM
<p>double post</p>

Yonaton
12-19-2007, 08:54 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>76 with a measley 104 AP's.  And for a long time my AP's were around equal to my level due to having blown through the quests <i>before</i> most of them awarded Achievement experience.  And cruised through collection quests early on, due to the need to level quickly, helping friends simply make it outside long enough to run to Thundering Steppes.  Sometimes I can solo kill an 80.  Sometimes not.  Sometimes a group of us can drop a group of high-titled 80's.  Sometimes not.  If you <i>haven't</i> gotten a toon up into T8, please, keep your assumptions silent until you hit that range, because they are wildly inaccurate.  As far as the lower tiers, I have toons in all of them, including newb-town Timorous Deep (that's where everybody has gone, by the way, rolling up new toons).  </p><p>I agree, level 20 PvP gear should either be removed or beefed up for higher tiers, level 30 or so.  Reducing the faction needed for it, still needed regardless, just a question of how much.  If memory serves, the concept of PvP writs, bounties as it were, was bounced around with quite a bit of popularity this past summer.  Non-repeatable writs providing <i>some</i> Achievement XP wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing.  Finding a happy medium is what should be the goal.  And for the love of <insert name of preferred deity here>, would everyone please stop calling the <i>others who disagree with you</i> whiners and carebears.  It makes you look like a petulant youth, on both sides of the fence.</p></blockquote><p>See,that's the thing. I've played in t8,tho not on my toon. IN fact I ahve access to several other ppls accounts. Some friends,my wife,my two younger brothers. Been there,saw it,got the shirt,and wasn't impressed.</p><p>I've never said T8 was boring. It surely wasn't. I ended up dead more than living most of the time from the roving squads of killers. Some people like that sort of thing,personally I don't have the time. I also don't have the inclination. I've lvled slowly,made my mistakes as I went along,and enjoyed the hell out of it. Not a single toon of mine has maxed aa(except the one I maxed tonight). the others are barely on lvl or woefully behind. They weren't uber geared,I got killed A LOT. Most of us do. But we had a lot of fun dying. It was a fight,it was quick,and at 17 no green 10's were being touched.</p><p>I can't speak for other lockers except the ones I know and run with. We stayed at 17 so we could take it all to the lvl 21's. The occasionally t3 toon over that was fun as well,live or die. As far as pvp gear,I never cared about it. I don't care about the faction,and I don't really need the gear. T2-t3 pvp is FUN. that's all I ever cared about. That and having the time to enjoy lvling my other toons my own pace.</p><p>Seems that most feel it's all about faction or something. Or the kvd. My kvd sucks lol. I fight too much and run too little. But I enjoy the fights that are there.</p>

Gimet
12-19-2007, 09:07 AM
<p>Once you hit your 30's, it doesn't matter anymore. I like this new update, it's bringing PvP from the extreme beginning to every teir. Some people never planned to stay teir 3 forever, but were simply building out their character. These are the people I feel sorry for. I don't feel sorry for the people complaining because their aa ratios are getting screwed simply because they're killing people in the teir that they stand. The ones complaining are the one wih godlike aa which is good enough for them for quite some time. Gimet is level 36 with 43 aa. Not much of a difference, yet I'm still a conjuror sitting at Destroyer title. Imagine what everyone else can do. At my level, I can kill anyone I want and not have to worry about leveling.</p><p>Level up folks. Everyone's doing it now. Keep in the same teir with your enemies and PvP still exists. It's not gone, just more advanced. This is a PvP Server, an addition to PvE. Enjoy some of the PvE while leveling to 35 from whatever your 20's level is. I did it, and I enjoyed it and lost almost no PvP in the process. If you continue to whine, you will continue to be left behind. Deal with it and move on. There is not one person who is going to PvP at one level anymore. We are ALL leveling, ALL progressing....so PvP simply moves with you now instead of you leaving it.</p>