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View Full Version : why isnt FD same to pvp as pve?


Slayiny
10-09-2007, 08:17 AM
<p>If a player FDs in PVE, mobs reset, aggro is lost.</p><p>Its about time changes were made for this to apply to PVP too</p><p>When in PVP combat, the enemy FDs, you should straight away be out of PVP combat and able to evac etc, THEY choose to FD.</p><p>But as it is atm, being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD and leave you to die to mobs, then you lose title/fame etc. And the player DID NOTHING but press 1 BUTTON ! Macro1 - /drag and /FD.. so gratz you bruisers/monks with your crap meaningless titles, where the mobs do all your work.</p><p>Everquest is such a piece of crock for pvp, no wonder there seems to be loads of monks and bruisers about now. Before it was scouts, now its an FDers world.</p><p>Ah well, nothing will happen, we already know Sony is an <b>Invertebrate</b> and doubtless i will get a few responses below from some aggravated sheep.</p><p>When is a decent game out? I've had enough of the Bias in EQ2. </p>

Ba
10-09-2007, 08:20 AM
<p>yes, WE MUST NERF FD!</p><p>edit: I should add that this is also one of the survivability traits we have in PvP. ie I get attacked by a group / twink, if I see agro mobs, the first thing I do is go for em and FD if it seems viable. However, I haven't dragged anyone into them...yet. (drag in 2 more AA points hehe)</p>

Krokous
10-09-2007, 08:28 AM
worst problem is bruisers complete imunity vs all crowd control AND their ability to teleport right to me, me as illusionist i didnt find a way how to beat tose easymode c***s

Bi
10-09-2007, 08:30 AM
i think its a fair call.. if a bruiser/monk chooses to FD, then they should lose their right to a dishonourable kill (ie: death by mobs, rather than player skill)seems this is becoming the new fad after the hookshot losers took off.

Ba
10-09-2007, 08:39 AM
<p>IBe glad this isnt EQ1 where Monks were the masters of the train (those were the days). </p><p>BTW I thought if mobs did 50% or more of Dmg you didnt get kill credit?</p>

Slayiny
10-09-2007, 09:35 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>yes, WE MUST NERF FD!</p></blockquote><p>I dont see it as a nerf, what i see is the current FD is broken to PVP.</p><p>If someone FDs, in pve the encounter breaks, any dmg is forgotten, this should be the same in PVP, so if a [Removed for Content] FDer wants to drag me into a room and then FD, he should and would get nothing, because as soon as he FDs, im out of combat with him.</p><p>Its bad enough some current buttwipes are griefing whole grps using this technique (4 deaths in 10 minutes) and i hope they get cancer.</p><p>But to lose fame from the tiny damage the drag did, before the asswipe FDed, with the mobs doing almost 99% of dmg, yeah this pvp sucks</p>

Norrsken
10-09-2007, 09:40 AM
<cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>yes, WE MUST NERF FD!</p></blockquote><p>I dont see it as a nerf, what i see is the current FD is broken to PVP.</p><p>If someone FDs, in pve the encounter breaks, any dmg is forgotten, this should be the same in PVP, so if a [I cannot control my vocabulary] FDer wants to drag me into a room and then FD, he should and would get nothing, because as soon as he FDs, im out of combat with him.</p><p>Its bad enough some current buttwipes are griefing whole grps using this technique (4 deaths in 10 minutes) and i hope they get cancer.</p><p>But to lose fame from the tiny damage the drag did, before the asswipe FDed, with the mobs doing almost 99% of dmg, yeah this pvp sucks</p></blockquote>I think it would be better to just make FD not work in pve if you are engaged in pvp. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> And make it a stealth change! MUAHA!

Ba
10-09-2007, 09:57 AM
<p>I believe they already made it to where if you engage a person who is under 50% you get no credit to help with ganking. Just also make it to where if mobs to 50% dmg in the fight itself you get no credit. Easy Peasey.</p>

Amphibia
10-09-2007, 11:14 AM
<cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If a player FDs in PVE, mobs reset, aggro is lost.</p><p>Its about time changes were made for this to apply to PVP too</p><p>When in PVP combat, the enemy FDs, you should straight away be out of PVP combat and able to evac etc, THEY choose to FD.</p><p>But as it is atm, being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD and leave you to die to mobs, then you lose title/fame etc. And the player DID NOTHING but press 1 BUTTON ! Macro1 - /drag and /FD.. so gratz you bruisers/monks with your crap meaningless titles, where the mobs do all your work.</p><p>Everquest is such a piece of crock for pvp, no wonder there seems to be loads of monks and bruisers about now. Before it was scouts, now its an FDers world.</p><p>Ah well, nothing will happen, we already know Sony is an <b>Invertebrate</b> and doubtless i will get a few responses below from some aggravated sheep.</p><p>When is a decent game out? I've had enough of the Bias in EQ2. </p></blockquote>Wow, welcome to the thread of complete and utter BS.So let me get this straight: You wanted to kill a bruiser, he ran into a room full of mobs, which added on him as he went in. You followed. He FD'ed. (What else did you expect?) Then you got killed by the mobs and lost your precious fame because you were stupid enough to follow him, and now you want FD nerfed.... did I get it right?Because how the hell can he have dragged you in there, isn't drag nerfed to 1-2 seconds or something in PvP? I haven't had that used on me in ages. And monks don't even get this ability, btw. So here's a tip: When you follow a brawler into an area full of mobs, you better be sure you can handle what else is in there. If you can't - don't follow. I thought everybody knew that? And if we want to talk about really overpowered abilities in PvP... how about we begin with <i>track</i> and<i> evac</i>? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

Spag
10-09-2007, 12:30 PM
I say make no change to FD.  If FD would drop them out of combat, imagine the number of brawlers that will begin a fight, start losing just to FD, and fly away, or FD at 10% to make their death a dishonorable one, where they lose nothing.  It will be worse than it was with the rhaondrilliis.  Basically you would never get credit for killing a brawler, or anyone else that has FD.  And those with group feign death will use that to get their group out of combat, and then evac when things start going south.

Bloodfa
10-09-2007, 12:47 PM
<cite>Amphibia wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If a player FDs in PVE, mobs reset, aggro is lost.</p><p>Its about time changes were made for this to apply to PVP too</p><p>When in PVP combat, the enemy FDs, you should straight away be out of PVP combat and able to evac etc, THEY choose to FD.</p><p>But as it is atm, being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD and leave you to die to mobs, then you lose title/fame etc. And the player DID NOTHING but press 1 BUTTON ! Macro1 - /drag and /FD.. so gratz you bruisers/monks with your crap meaningless titles, where the mobs do all your work.</p><p>Everquest is such a piece of crock for pvp, no wonder there seems to be loads of monks and bruisers about now. Before it was scouts, now its an FDers world.</p><p>Ah well, nothing will happen, we already know Sony is an <b>Invertebrate</b> and doubtless i will get a few responses below from some aggravated sheep.</p><p>When is a decent game out? I've had enough of the Bias in EQ2. </p></blockquote>Wow, welcome to the thread of complete and utter BS.So let me get this straight: You wanted to kill a bruiser, he ran into a room full of mobs, which added on him as he went in. You followed. He FD'ed. (What else did you expect?) Then you got killed by the mobs and lost your precious fame because you were stupid enough to follow him, and now you want FD nerfed.... did I get it right?Because how the hell can he have dragged you in there, isn't drag nerfed to 1-2 seconds or something in PvP? I haven't had that used on me in ages. And monks don't even get this ability, btw. So here's a tip: When you follow a brawler into an area full of mobs, you better be sure you can handle what else is in there. If you can't - don't follow. I thought everybody knew that? And if we want to talk about really overpowered abilities in PvP... how about we begin with <i>track</i> and<i> evac</i>? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote><p>Hey!  Leave my Track & Evac outta this, you overpowered Bruiser! <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Mighty Melvor
10-09-2007, 01:02 PM
<cite>Spag wrote:</cite><blockquote>I say make no change to FD.  If FD would drop them out of combat, imagine the number of brawlers that will begin a fight, start losing just to FD, and fly away, or FD at 10% to make their death a dishonorable one, where they lose nothing.  It will be worse than it was with the rhaondrilliis.  Basically you would never get credit for killing a brawler, or anyone else that has FD.  And those with group feign death will use that to get their group out of combat, and then evac when things start going south.</blockquote><p>/agreed</p><p>I really wish others would think about what they post before suggesting FD puts you out-of-combat.  If people think drag is a problem now, just wait for out-of-combat to generate 100s of General Bruisers.</p>

Killque
10-09-2007, 02:30 PM
<p>I see no difference with people following monks/bruisers into mobs just to have them FD and following someone who isnt agro at all through mobs and getting yourself killed.</p><p>Face it, you killed yourself and the bruiser had little to do with it. You are complaining about someone clicking 1 button and killing you, yet it is 100% avoidable, unlike things like decap, sniper shot, PT etc.</p><p>Drag was uber nerfed, 2 second duration and if the person would fall to their death, like in KOS or in Butcher block it will NOT drag them off the cliff but just to the edge.</p><p>Just because you die does not mean they need to be nerfed, especially when its avoidable for gods sake.</p>

Tae
10-09-2007, 03:26 PM
Aren't you a ranger? Honestly of all the classes to be calling for a nerf, rangers shouldn't be one of them. If you follow a bruiser into a group of mobs and he FDs it is your own fault.

Novusod
10-09-2007, 03:46 PM
FD was already nerfed in that it puts my bruiser into combat. Not all bruisers have drag or titles btw.

Slayiny
10-09-2007, 04:26 PM
<cite>Amphibia wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If a player FDs in PVE, mobs reset, aggro is lost.</p><p>Its about time changes were made for this to apply to PVP too</p><p>When in PVP combat, the enemy FDs, you should straight away be out of PVP combat and able to evac etc, THEY choose to FD.</p><p>But as it is atm, being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD and leave you to die to mobs, then you lose title/fame etc. And the player DID NOTHING but press 1 BUTTON ! Macro1 - /drag and /FD.. so gratz you bruisers/monks with your crap meaningless titles, where the mobs do all your work.</p><p>Everquest is such a piece of crock for pvp, no wonder there seems to be loads of monks and bruisers about now. Before it was scouts, now its an FDers world.</p><p>Ah well, nothing will happen, we already know Sony is an <b>Invertebrate</b> and doubtless i will get a few responses below from some aggravated sheep.</p><p>When is a decent game out? I've had enough of the Bias in EQ2. </p></blockquote>Wow, welcome to the thread of complete and utter BS.So let me get this straight: You wanted to kill a bruiser, he ran into a room full of mobs, which added on him as he went in. You followed. He FD'ed. (What else did you expect?) Then you got killed by the mobs and lost your precious fame because you were stupid enough to follow him, and now you want FD nerfed.... did I get it right?Because how the hell can he have dragged you in there, isn't drag nerfed to 1-2 seconds or something in PvP? I haven't had that used on me in ages. And monks don't even get this ability, btw. So here's a tip: When you follow a brawler into an area full of mobs, you better be sure you can handle what else is in there. If you can't - don't follow. I thought everybody knew that? And if we want to talk about really overpowered abilities in PvP... how about we begin with <i>track</i> and<i> evac</i>? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote><p>ok here we see response from someone who can't even read/understand the initial post. </p><p>Let me start and help you actually READ and UNDERSTAND something... <b>being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD </b></p><p>This means "the bruiser" ran into a room full of mobs, and then pulled me into the room full of mobs (YES PULLED ME IN, i say again, PULLED ME) (understand now?) then he FDed and all the mobs killed me and i lose fame. And whether drag was nerfed to 1 or 2 seconds, i couldnt give a crap, the point is, it still pulls you somewhere you didnt want to go, also just to reply further to your load of irrelevant BS you posted. I didnt want to fight, i was helping some guildys level, the bruser appeared and dragged me into a room, i had no chance, btw none of my grp did either, because he could just go wherever he liked in zone, dragging, Fding and wiping the grp. Which continued with Griefing on our group. For the Bruiser concerned, he has been added to the few names to be ganked at all opportunitys.</p><p>BTW evac and track are both nerfed on pvp compared with pve. But then you obviously didnt know that either. I'm not gonna reply to anymore of your posts, cos you're just one of the aggravated sheep i mentioned in OP. More important is how you honestly can expect a pve ability to be BETTER in pvp as FD is currently</p><p><b>So it is simple, make FD work the way it should, you FD, you are out of combat, if an enemy pvp player dies, you dont get credit, because as soon as you FDed, your dmg was reset. Thats what FD does, not this half S**T house FD we have atm which will reset pve mobs but not pvp mobs (players)</b></p><b></b>

Slayiny
10-09-2007, 04:29 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote>Aren't you a ranger?Honestly of all the classes to be calling for a nerf, rangers shouldn't be one of them. If you follow a bruiser into a group of mobs and he FDs it is your own fault.</blockquote><p>I give up, FOLLOW ??!?!??!? WE DIDNT follow, Taear of all the people, i thought u had a brain</p><p>Anyways, enjoy the thread im out, not worth it, like i said "Invertebrates and Aggravated Sheep"</p>

Amphibia
10-09-2007, 04:41 PM
<cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Amphibia wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If a player FDs in PVE, mobs reset, aggro is lost.</p><p>Its about time changes were made for this to apply to PVP too</p><p>When in PVP combat, the enemy FDs, you should straight away be out of PVP combat and able to evac etc, THEY choose to FD.</p><p>But as it is atm, being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD and leave you to die to mobs, then you lose title/fame etc. And the player DID NOTHING but press 1 BUTTON ! Macro1 - /drag and /FD.. so gratz you bruisers/monks with your crap meaningless titles, where the mobs do all your work.</p><p>Everquest is such a piece of crock for pvp, no wonder there seems to be loads of monks and bruisers about now. Before it was scouts, now its an FDers world.</p><p>Ah well, nothing will happen, we already know Sony is an <b>Invertebrate</b> and doubtless i will get a few responses below from some aggravated sheep.</p><p>When is a decent game out? I've had enough of the Bias in EQ2. </p></blockquote>Wow, welcome to the thread of complete and utter BS.So let me get this straight: You wanted to kill a bruiser, he ran into a room full of mobs, which added on him as he went in. You followed. He FD'ed. (What else did you expect?) Then you got killed by the mobs and lost your precious fame because you were stupid enough to follow him, and now you want FD nerfed.... did I get it right?Because how the hell can he have dragged you in there, isn't drag nerfed to 1-2 seconds or something in PvP? I haven't had that used on me in ages. And monks don't even get this ability, btw. So here's a tip: When you follow a brawler into an area full of mobs, you better be sure you can handle what else is in there. If you can't - don't follow. I thought everybody knew that? And if we want to talk about really overpowered abilities in PvP... how about we begin with <i>track</i> and<i> evac</i>? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote><p>ok here we see response from someone who can't even read/understand the initial post. </p><p>Let me start and help you actually READ and UNDERSTAND something... <b>being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD </b></p><p>This means "the bruiser" ran into a room full of mobs, and then pulled me into the room full of mobs (YES PULLED ME IN, i say again, PULLED ME) (understand now?) then he FDed and all the mobs killed me and i lose fame. And whether drag was nerfed to 1 or 2 seconds, i couldnt give a crap, the point is, it still pulls you somewhere you didnt want to go, also just to reply further to your load of irrelevant BS you posted. I didnt want to fight, i was helping some guildys level, the bruser appeared and dragged me into a room, i had no chance, btw none of my grp did either, because he could just go wherever he liked in zone, dragging, Fding and wiping the grp. Which continued with Griefing on our group. For the Bruiser concerned, he has been added to the few names to be ganked at all opportunitys.</p><p>BTW evac and track are both nerfed on pvp compared with pve. But then you obviously didnt know that either. I'm not gonna reply to anymore of your posts, cos you're just one of the aggravated sheep i mentioned in OP. More important is how you honestly can expect a pve ability to be BETTER in pvp as FD is currently</p><b></b></blockquote>Wow, you are so full of [I cannot control my vocabulary]. I don't care if someone like you is going to respond to my posts or not, because I don't believe you. I don't think it is possible to drag someone unless they are already practically on top of the mobs. Feel free to post the combat log though. PS: You seem to care about losing fame. Well, track and evac are the most supreme tools in the whole [Removed for Content] game to prevent that from happening. If you don't understand how to use these simple tools, then I'm sorry - but that isn't anybody else's fault, now is it?

Echgar
10-09-2007, 05:13 PM
You are all welcome to disagree with each other, but I note some of you are beginning to make your comments a bit too much towards personal attacks & insults.  As stated in the <a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/posts/list.m?topic_id=176" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">forum rules</a>, don't do that! <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />Let's have a constructive discussion please.

Hinosh
10-09-2007, 05:27 PM
It's another good tactic. How to counter: Don't follow them when they head in the middle of the mobs. FIXED!

Quicksote
10-09-2007, 05:29 PM
Sonic fist added in with drag extends the range you can be moved to by quite a lot.  The combination of fd drag sonic fist and close mind allows a bruiser to be quite annoying/deadly in a dungeon.  One bruiser can effectively block a group from a hard dungeon with few ways for the group to retaliate.

Killque
10-09-2007, 05:32 PM
<cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Amphibia wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If a player FDs in PVE, mobs reset, aggro is lost.</p><p>Its about time changes were made for this to apply to PVP too</p><p>When in PVP combat, the enemy FDs, you should straight away be out of PVP combat and able to evac etc, THEY choose to FD.</p><p>But as it is atm, being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD and leave you to die to mobs, then you lose title/fame etc. And the player DID NOTHING but press 1 BUTTON ! Macro1 - /drag and /FD.. so gratz you bruisers/monks with your crap meaningless titles, where the mobs do all your work.</p><p>Everquest is such a piece of crock for pvp, no wonder there seems to be loads of monks and bruisers about now. Before it was scouts, now its an FDers world.</p><p>Ah well, nothing will happen, we already know Sony is an <b>Invertebrate</b> and doubtless i will get a few responses below from some aggravated sheep.</p><p>When is a decent game out? I've had enough of the Bias in EQ2. </p></blockquote>Wow, welcome to the thread of complete and utter BS.So let me get this straight: You wanted to kill a bruiser, he ran into a room full of mobs, which added on him as he went in. You followed. He FD'ed. (What else did you expect?) Then you got killed by the mobs and lost your precious fame because you were stupid enough to follow him, and now you want FD nerfed.... did I get it right?Because how the hell can he have dragged you in there, isn't drag nerfed to 1-2 seconds or something in PvP? I haven't had that used on me in ages. And monks don't even get this ability, btw. So here's a tip: When you follow a brawler into an area full of mobs, you better be sure you can handle what else is in there. If you can't - don't follow. I thought everybody knew that? And if we want to talk about really overpowered abilities in PvP... how about we begin with <i>track</i> and<i> evac</i>? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote><p>ok here we see response from someone who can't even read/understand the initial post. </p><p>Let me start and help you actually READ and UNDERSTAND something... <b>being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD </b></p><p>This means "the bruiser" ran into a room full of mobs, and then pulled me into the room full of mobs (YES PULLED ME IN, i say again, PULLED ME) (understand now?) then he FDed and all the mobs killed me and i lose fame. And whether drag was nerfed to 1 or 2 seconds, i couldnt give a crap, the point is, it still pulls you somewhere you didnt want to go, also just to reply further to your load of irrelevant BS you posted. I didnt want to fight, i was helping some guildys level, the bruser appeared and dragged me into a room, i had no chance, btw none of my grp did either, because he could just go wherever he liked in zone, dragging, Fding and wiping the grp. Which continued with Griefing on our group. For the Bruiser concerned, he has been added to the few names to be ganked at all opportunitys.</p><p>BTW evac and track are both nerfed on pvp compared with pve. But then you obviously didnt know that either. I'm not gonna reply to anymore of your posts, cos you're just one of the aggravated sheep i mentioned in OP. More important is how you honestly can expect a pve ability to be BETTER in pvp as FD is currently</p><p><b>So it is simple, make FD work the way it should, you FD, you are out of combat, if an enemy pvp player dies, you dont get credit, because as soon as you FDed, your dmg was reset. Thats what FD does, not this half S**T house FD we have atm which will reset pve mobs but not pvp mobs (players)</b></p><b></b></blockquote><p>So because you had NO chance makes it ok to nerf crap?</p><p>So what if it was an Orange conning Uber twinked Wizard with manashield that nuke the crap out of you, and you had no chance... nerf them too?</p><p>So, what are you willing to give up in your class to have FD or Drag removed Mr?</p>

Mighty Melvor
10-09-2007, 05:35 PM
<cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Amphibia wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If a player FDs in PVE, mobs reset, aggro is lost.</p><p>Its about time changes were made for this to apply to PVP too</p><p>When in PVP combat, the enemy FDs, you should straight away be out of PVP combat and able to evac etc, THEY choose to FD.</p><p>But as it is atm, being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD and leave you to die to mobs, then you lose title/fame etc. And the player DID NOTHING but press 1 BUTTON ! Macro1 - /drag and /FD.. so gratz you bruisers/monks with your crap meaningless titles, where the mobs do all your work.</p><p>Everquest is such a piece of crock for pvp, no wonder there seems to be loads of monks and bruisers about now. Before it was scouts, now its an FDers world.</p><p>Ah well, nothing will happen, we already know Sony is an <b>Invertebrate</b> and doubtless i will get a few responses below from some aggravated sheep.</p><p>When is a decent game out? I've had enough of the Bias in EQ2. </p></blockquote>Wow, welcome to the thread of complete and utter BS.So let me get this straight: You wanted to kill a bruiser, he ran into a room full of mobs, which added on him as he went in. You followed. He FD'ed. (What else did you expect?) Then you got killed by the mobs and lost your precious fame because you were stupid enough to follow him, and now you want FD nerfed.... did I get it right?Because how the hell can he have dragged you in there, isn't drag nerfed to 1-2 seconds or something in PvP? I haven't had that used on me in ages. And monks don't even get this ability, btw. So here's a tip: When you follow a brawler into an area full of mobs, you better be sure you can handle what else is in there. If you can't - don't follow. I thought everybody knew that? And if we want to talk about really overpowered abilities in PvP... how about we begin with <i>track</i> and<i> evac</i>? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote><p>ok here we see response from someone who can't even read/understand the initial post. </p><p>Let me start and help you actually READ and UNDERSTAND something... <b>being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD </b></p><p>This means "the bruiser" ran into a room full of mobs, and then pulled me into the room full of mobs (YES PULLED ME IN, i say again, PULLED ME) (understand now?) then he FDed and all the mobs killed me and i lose fame. And whether drag was nerfed to 1 or 2 seconds, i couldnt give a crap, the point is, it still pulls you somewhere you didnt want to go, also just to reply further to your load of irrelevant BS you posted. I didnt want to fight, i was helping some guildys level, the bruser appeared and dragged me into a room, i had no chance, btw none of my grp did either, because he could just go wherever he liked in zone, dragging, Fding and wiping the grp. Which continued with Griefing on our group. For the Bruiser concerned, he has been added to the few names to be ganked at all opportunitys.</p><p>BTW evac and track are both nerfed on pvp compared with pve. But then you obviously didnt know that either. I'm not gonna reply to anymore of your posts, cos you're just one of the aggravated sheep i mentioned in OP. More important is how you honestly can expect a pve ability to be BETTER in pvp as FD is currently</p><p><b>So it is simple, make FD work the way it should, you FD, you are out of combat, if an enemy pvp player dies, you dont get credit, because as soon as you FDed, your dmg was reset. Thats what FD does, not this half S**T house FD we have atm which will reset pve mobs but not pvp mobs (players)</b></p><b></b></blockquote>I get a kick out of the fact that several people have posted constructive reasons why this is a terrible idea and yet you keep responding with nonsense.

Amphibia
10-09-2007, 05:44 PM
<cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite></cite><p><b>So it is simple, make FD work the way it should, you FD, you are out of combat, if an enemy pvp player dies, you dont get credit, because as soon as you FDed, your dmg was reset. Thats what FD does, not this half S**T house FD we have atm which will reset pve mobs but not pvp mobs (players)</b></p><b></b></blockquote>Sure, by all means... give us that. I can promose right now that I would use it for all it is worth to make it next to impossible for anyone to gain fame off me. As we all know (well, most of us anyway), you don't get credit for killing someone who is below 50%.  So whenever I'm about to die, I'll just click the FD button and get out of PvP combat - every time. <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

Jeda
10-09-2007, 07:08 PM
<p>Be very carefull what you wish for. If Brawlers had the ability to remove themselves from combat whenever they wanted by simply hitting FD then casting their god evac, or zoning out , or taking a carpet, or jumping on a cloud, THE ENTIRE POPULATION would be [Removed for Content] about it.  It would be nearly impossible to kill a brawler. </p><p>The world is a battleground. You cannot ignore your surroundings when fighting someone. People who get dragged into mobs and die are the same people that get charmed and sent to attack an NPC to lock them in combat, then ganked. (a dirty trick used by troubs). THey are the same people that get safehoused. Know your opponent and know your surroundings. </p>

InfiniteFidelity
10-09-2007, 09:01 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Be very carefull what you wish for. If Brawlers had the ability to remove themselves from combat whenever they wanted by simply hitting FD then casting their god evac, or zoning out , or taking a carpet, or jumping on a cloud, THE ENTIRE POPULATION would be [I cannot control my vocabulary] about it.  It would be nearly impossible to kill a brawler. </p><p>The world is a battleground. You cannot ignore your surroundings when fighting someone. People who get dragged into mobs and die are the same people that get charmed and sent to attack an NPC to lock them in combat, then ganked. (a dirty trick used by troubs). THey are the same people that get safehoused. Know your opponent and know your surroundings. </p></blockquote>Nerf rangers before you nerf any other class Plzkthx <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/49869fe8223507d7223db3451e5321aa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

Mildavyn
10-10-2007, 02:01 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><snip>People who get dragged into mobs and die are the same people that get charmed and sent to attack an NPC to lock them in combat, then ganked. (a dirty trick used by troubs). </p></blockquote><p>Actually Jedash, you will be out of combat as soon as the charm breaks. Also, all the agro you have built up towards that mob will be dumped on the troub when charm breaks. Also, we cannot give players orders. To use this tactic, we have to agro a mob and let it hit us.</p><p>Using charm in this fashion is great for moving people away from cloud pads, but you better be able to handle fighting them with an angry mob trying to kick your [Removed for Content]. And usually the person who gets charmed to move him will simply run back to the cloud pad and fly away. This leaves the Troub locked in PvP combat, next to a cloud pad, with an angry mob trying to kill him. Not a good move.</p><p> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------</p><p>As for the suggested change to FD... no. As amphibia said above, bruisers would exploit this the same way as certain troubs exploit charm. Except FD doesn't have a 2.5s cast time, and it also doesn't check resists.</p><p>NO.</p>

Izzypop
10-10-2007, 03:53 AM
There is 1 HUGE problem with FD removing the brawler from combat.Imagine for a minute FD does work in PVP like it does in PVP and removes the brawler from combat.Imagine killing a brawler and his health goes into the redImagine the brawler then clicking FDnow here is your HUGE problem.....If you now hit the brawler you just engaged a non engaged player who's health is below half.No credit will be earned for killing the brawler.No credit would ever be earned from fighting a brawler when they can just leave combat at 50% health.FD removing the brawler from combat would be even worse than all the charm bug mechanics combined.

XeroXs84
10-10-2007, 05:36 AM
Drag & FD sure is a bad combination... its about as bad as back in time when you could just train mobs on anyone by running a train into him and Feign.However, the "get out of combat" is sure not a solution to that, cos apart from the fame-issues already mentioned, he could just drag, feign (loose aggro), as soon as u get aggro he pops back up and hits u once for some nice fresh fame.I personally think this is an ability(combination) thats extremely overpowered in pvp. A solution that might work is that drag only works while the bruiser is on that players hatelist. Maybe leave an out-of-combat version too but only with very little radius.

mattmandude
10-10-2007, 08:32 AM
I don't understand this at all. You realize that you can cure drag? And on top of that, I don't think it's any worse or different than getting feared into mobs, or getting ported into them (warlock spell I think).As for being able to FD into mobs... why not? It's the brawlers element, just don't engage /shrug In perspective, I wouldn't suggest they nerf stealth because I followed a scout through a whole bunch of aggro while he was stealthed, and died, OMG!!

Vlahkmaak
10-15-2007, 02:28 PM
<p><span style="font-size: medium;">Necros ought to be nerfed.  Their is no other fully fabled nd mastered out class that can die in less than 4 seconds to a predator scout.  This makes killing them not fun. Its over to quick.  Plz nerf the necro fun killing ability with their insane fast death ability please.</span></p><p><span style="font-size: medium;">And Bring back BEASTLORDS, at least for the pvp servers, no one really cares about the carebear servers and their pipe dreams of class balancing.</span></p>

Jeda
10-17-2007, 10:13 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p><snip>People who get dragged into mobs and die are the same people that get charmed and sent to attack an NPC to lock them in combat, then ganked. (a dirty trick used by troubs). </p></blockquote><p>Actually Jedash, you will be out of combat as soon as the charm breaks. Also, all the agro you have built up towards that mob will be dumped on the troub when charm breaks. Also, we cannot give players orders. To use this tactic, we have to agro a mob and let it hit us.</p><p>Using charm in this fashion is great for moving people away from cloud pads, but you better be able to handle fighting them with an angry mob trying to kick your [I cannot control my vocabulary]. And usually the person who gets charmed to move him will simply run back to the cloud pad and fly away. This leaves the Troub locked in PvP combat, next to a cloud pad, with an angry mob trying to kill him. Not a good move.</p><p> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------</p><p>As for the suggested change to FD... no. As amphibia said above, bruisers would exploit this the same way as certain troubs exploit charm. Except FD doesn't have a 2.5s cast time, and it also doesn't check resists.</p><p>NO.</p></blockquote><p>I can tell you for a fact that troubs can lock you into combat by charming. It happened to me today. I was charmed by a Acolas and his group and sent to attack  a whisperwind mystic on WW isle. Not to mention the fact that the mob was halfway accross the isle and put me far from the cloud. A solo troub may not want to do that, but one in a full group can easily gank people who are not paying attention. </p>

othera1
10-17-2007, 10:54 PM
<cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>yes, WE MUST NERF FD!</p></blockquote><p>I dont see it as a nerf, what i see is the current FD is broken to PVP.</p><p>If someone FDs, in pve the encounter breaks, any dmg is forgotten, this should be the same in PVP, so if a [I cannot control my vocabulary] FDer wants to drag me into a room and then FD, he should and would get nothing, because as soon as he FDs, im out of combat with him.</p><p>Its bad enough some current buttwipes are griefing whole grps using this technique (4 deaths in 10 minutes) and i hope they get cancer.</p><p>But to lose fame from the tiny damage the drag did, before the asswipe FDed, with the mobs doing almost 99% of dmg, yeah this pvp sucks</p></blockquote>Awsome idea. Instead of people running into mobs FD'ing then the mobs kill someone else it will now be you are followed by a ranger for half an hour(my guess will be low lvl [Removed for Content] noobs) then you get 10 mobs on you he hits you you defend yourself and FD oh wait you still have mobs on you <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> now your dead!

zaltar
10-17-2007, 11:49 PM
<cite>Amphibia wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Slayinyoo wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If a player FDs in PVE, mobs reset, aggro is lost.</p><p>Its about time changes were made for this to apply to PVP too</p><p>When in PVP combat, the enemy FDs, you should straight away be out of PVP combat and able to evac etc, THEY choose to FD.</p><p>But as it is atm, being able to run into a room full of mobs, drag you in, then FD and leave you to die to mobs, then you lose title/fame etc. And the player DID NOTHING but press 1 BUTTON ! Macro1 - /drag and /FD.. so gratz you bruisers/monks with your crap meaningless titles, where the mobs do all your work.</p><p>Everquest is such a piece of crock for pvp, no wonder there seems to be loads of monks and bruisers about now. Before it was scouts, now its an FDers world.</p><p>Ah well, nothing will happen, we already know Sony is an <b>Invertebrate</b> and doubtless i will get a few responses below from some aggravated sheep.</p><p>When is a decent game out? I've had enough of the Bias in EQ2. </p></blockquote>Wow, welcome to the thread of complete and utter BS.So let me get this straight: You wanted to kill a bruiser, he ran into a room full of mobs, which added on him as he went in. You followed. He FD'ed. (What else did you expect?) Then you got killed by the mobs and lost your precious fame because you were stupid enough to follow him, and now you want FD nerfed.... did I get it right?Because how the hell can he have dragged you in there, isn't drag nerfed to 1-2 seconds or something in PvP? I haven't had that used on me in ages. And monks don't even get this ability, btw. So here's a tip: When you follow a brawler into an area full of mobs, you better be sure you can handle what else is in there. If you can't - don't follow. I thought everybody knew that? And if we want to talk about really overpowered abilities in PvP... how about we begin with <i>track</i> and<i> evac</i>? <img src="/eq2/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" /></blockquote>          Agree 100 %. Also , most people play Fury , Scout and Warden , very few play brawler and even fewer play monk because Monk takes          allot of skill to succeed in pvp unlike many of the easy classes.                   About FD                    It`s a risky action for a few reasons , one is that it`s not guaranteed to work every time and there are many occasions when FD fails          the mobs are not always fooled and will continue attacking as you lay there.          Another thing to consider is that depending on where you FD at , allot of times you can become limited in escaping the area , once you           stand up the mobs will often be right back on you making your exit hazardous whether they killed the other players who chased you or not          your still in danger.          My favorite is when someone uses FD to avoid mobs and other players come up behind them and kill them while their on the ground           because they know if you stand up the mobs will kill you so they simply murder you with no struggle. So many brave hero`s in this game.          FD is not all that it`s cracked up to be , if anything it should work in pvp but then we wouldn`t wan`t brawlers to become equal to the          other classes that are overpowering them right now would we ? Nothing like being 1 shot killed by disease , ranged with obscene amounts          of dot and beating on someone for 10 minutes who has such huge reactive heals that you can never make even a small dent in their HP.          Why not just continue to make the whole brawler class completely useless in pvp ?

Mildavyn
10-18-2007, 12:16 AM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I can tell you for a fact that troubs can lock you into combat by charming. It happened to me today. I was charmed by a Acolas and his group and sent to attack  a whisperwind mystic on WW isle. Not to mention the fact that the mob was halfway accross the isle and put me far from the cloud. A solo troub may not want to do that, but one in a full group can easily gank people who are not paying attention. </p></blockquote><p>There's something dodgy going on there... Firstly, Troubs cannot give attack orders, so unless that mystic was hitting him, Acolas shouldn't have been able to send you over there.</p><p>When you come out of a charm, your auto-attack is turned off, and all the agro you built up against the mob is dumped on whoever charmed you. When you broke that charm, you should have been out of combat, auto-attack turned off, and that mystic should have gone running over towards Acolas.</p><p>Unless things have changed in the last 2 weeks (I've not been playing) then what you're describing just cannot happen. Are you sure it was Acolas who charmed you? Maybe the Enchanter charm works differently?</p><p>EDIT: After thinking about it for a bit, I've come up with 2 ways that you could have been locked in combat. There is still no way for Acolas to have sent you against that mob unless it was attacking him, but here's the ways I can think of that you would have been locked incombat:</p><p>1. You had a ward or a heal reactive triggered while you were fighting the mystic. When charm broke, someone hit you and that ward/heal put you into combat.</p><p>2. You were half way through using a CA when charm broke. It finished casting and put you into combat with the mob. I'm still not convinced that charmed players even use CAs, because I never have while I've been charmed... not sure.</p>

Fluffypaws
10-18-2007, 01:02 PM
<p>FD is not a big thing at all in pvp infact i hardly use it, im all for a fair fight and dont normally back down and tbh i dont want FD to be nerfed to i get a huge advantage over my oppenent</p>

Acolos
10-18-2007, 02:17 PM
<cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>[email protected] wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I can tell you for a fact that troubs can lock you into combat by charming. It happened to me today. I was charmed by a Acolas and his group and sent to attack  a whisperwind mystic on WW isle. Not to mention the fact that the mob was halfway accross the isle and put me far from the cloud. A solo troub may not want to do that, but one in a full group can easily gank people who are not paying attention. </p></blockquote><p>There's something dodgy going on there... Firstly, Troubs cannot give attack orders, so unless that mystic was hitting him, Acolas shouldn't have been able to send you over there.</p><p>When you come out of a charm, your auto-attack is turned off, and all the agro you built up against the mob is dumped on whoever charmed you. When you broke that charm, you should have been out of combat, auto-attack turned off, and that mystic should have gone running over towards Acolas.</p><p>Unless things have changed in the last 2 weeks (I've not been playing) then what you're describing just cannot happen. Are you sure it was Acolas who charmed you? Maybe the Enchanter charm works differently?</p><p>EDIT: After thinking about it for a bit, I've come up with 2 ways that you could have been locked in combat. There is still no way for Acolas to have sent you against that mob unless it was attacking him, but here's the ways I can think of that you would have been locked incombat:</p><p>1. You had a ward or a heal reactive triggered while you were fighting the mystic. When charm broke, someone hit you and that ward/heal put you into combat.</p><p>2. You were half way through using a CA when charm broke. It finished casting and put you into combat with the mob. I'm still not convinced that charmed players even use CAs, because I never have while I've been charmed... not sure.</p></blockquote>how many times does this need to be said....Anyways.. this is probabaly what happened, this is the trick/technique used...... jedash is on to o WW cliff or near the cloud pad... i go up to aversion and jump down on him, while my group are near the pad (possibly this is what hapened).. as i'm falling with my fae cloak, i land next to jedash, attack bird thing, charm him (or charm first), jump down to my group, the bird folows me, and jedash folows the bird to assist me, i get as far away from the pad as possible.. charm breaks we kill or try to before he makes it to the pad... ther is a bug which i haven't seen happen in a long while, and that is sometimes if the player is still auto attacking when charm breaks or in the middle of casting a spell or CA, they wil be in pve combat, which i have seen cause dmg shield procs w hich then puts them in pvp combat on the enemy pvp 's..  /yelling while charmed and/or spamming sit button stops this... only people i have seen put in combat this way is SKs and Druids with thornsand if fame is involved (i haven't got fame this way), i tel my group to stop attacking.. what some people don't realize, is that although they are not in pvp combat, they still have auto attack on, so they can't use pad/carpet.. thats why.. /yell /sit works a dream.... Charm in this way is used by me to take people away from a carpet/zone line, or down from a cliff....

Mildavyn
10-18-2007, 02:36 PM
<cite>Acoloss4 wrote:</cite><blockquote>how many times does this need to be said.... </blockquote><p>I keep telling people, but alot of them insist that "It's happened to me before!!1 You don't know what your talking about~!"</p><p>Glad we could clear that up.</p>

Bozidar
10-18-2007, 02:57 PM
<span style="font-size: x-large;">When someone casts FD their opponent should be forced to immediately return to their initial spawn point in zone, just like PvE!!! </span>

Mighty Melvor
10-18-2007, 03:26 PM
<cite>Bozidar wrote:</cite><blockquote><span style="font-size: x-large;">When someone casts FD their opponent should be forced to immediately return to their initial spawn point in zone, just like PvE!!! </span></blockquote><p>/LOL</p><p>And be granted perma-immunity!</p>

Jeda
10-19-2007, 06:57 PM
<p>This is all I can tell you. The following is EXACTLY what happened to me on WW. </p><p> I had just zoned out of the nest, I was ALONE (not grouped) and was heading toward the cliff, my immunity was counting down. I saw Purity climbing the wall, full group. I jumped down the other side and headed for the cloud. I didnt make it, as soon as my immune wore off I was charmed by Acolas and sent about 30 meters away to attack a whisperwind mystic. Nothing I could do could would stop my attack on the mystic. I was just sitting there attacking the mystic.  So I guess they must have attacked a mob before charming me or something, because i can assure you I was charmed, then went flying accross whisperwind to attack a mob. </p><p>the original point i was trying to make was to be carefull when you see troubies. they have ways of locking you in combat. (weather its because of you not knowing how to avoid it or the troub forcing it on you) Not saying its illegal or dirty or anything, its as everything else, a part of the game and one needs to be carefull of it. </p><p> ps not that i care but there was fame involved when this happened hehe, i was general and as you know purity are all masters overseers. No sweat tho it happens. Just need to be carefull. </p>

Devilsbane
10-19-2007, 07:33 PM
If FD did work in PvP like it did in PvE. Then anyone with a FD ability (class, item, etc) would use it before they were killed (50%< health) to break the PvP encounter. It would also give that player the ability to make themself look like a corpse on the ground to the rival faction (nice way to ambush). Does anyone really want it to work that way? <img src="http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/images/smilies/0320a00cb4bb5629ab9fc2bc1fcc4e9e.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />