What if the guild leader goes inactive?

[cyclonus11]

Is there a way to salvage the guild if your guild leader goes inactive, and a bunch of your officers leave due to lack of leadership? I have a chunk of GSP contributed, and I don't want to lose it by going to another guild, or disbanding & creating a new guild with the remaining members... <img src="/smilies/c30b4198e0907b23b8246bdd52aa1c3c.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Maroger]

<cite>cyclonus11 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Is there a way to salvage the guild if your guild leader goes inactive, and a bunch of your officers leave due to lack of leadership? I have a chunk of GSP contributed, and I don't want to lose it by going to another guild, or disbanding & creating a new guild with the remaining members... <img src="/smilies/c30b4198e0907b23b8246bdd52aa1c3c.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote>Explain the position and put in a petition to CUstomer Service. I believe that they have helped out people in similar situations so a guild will not fall apart. Give it a try.

[Jrral]

If the person who created the guild's still active, I believe they always have Leader privileges and can make new Leaders if needed. If there's at least one active character with Leader rank, you should be able to promote replacements and basically keep going as normal. If there's anyone with privileges to promote others as far as Leader, you should be able to recover (I don't know if promotion privileges let you bump someone else beyond your own level). If all your Leaders and promotion-capable characters are inactive, you're kind of stuck with what your active character have by way of access and such.

[Ian_RangerTank]

What I wouldn't give to have a DAoC-style mechanic that auto-promotes a remaining active member if the leader went inactive for more than a couple months.  I'm in the same boat as you -- I think I'm the only member left who's logged in within the last 6 months.

[Gnevil]

<p>You have to petition it explaining in detail what has occured.  Customer service will then research your guild and look at th inactivity. I believe they will email said leader with the information contained in his or her account.  If they don't get any response they will then promote another member who is active to leadership allowing for the guild to continue.  There are other posts of this nature if you do a search, it just takes a little time to get this done correctly.</p>

[Norrsken]

This is a good reason to have more than one leader. I usually aim for three. Preferably with a tad different play times so there is most of the time a leader on as well. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Beldin_]

Did your leader just dissapear without a word of goodbye ? Normally i would expect that he should asked the guild who should be the new leaders and give some persons the rights since thats now problem here .. we have 6 or 7 "leaders" meanwhile <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Seagoat]

<cite>Gnevil wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>You have to petition it explaining in detail what has occured.  Customer service will then research your guild and look at th inactivity. I believe they will email said leader with the information contained in his or her account.  If they don't get any response they will then promote another member who is active to leadership allowing for the guild to continue.  There are other posts of this nature if you do a search, it just takes a little time to get this done correctly.</p></blockquote><p>As a player who's had a guild taken from them, I can say with confidence that I never got an email saying that the guild I was a leader of was going to be handed to another member.  Long story short, I was forced to take a 3-month hiatus from the game when I moved back in with my parents for a short time; they only had dialup, so no EQ2 for me!  As soon as I got my own place -- and cable internet -- I logged that character in only to find that I'd been totally kicked from a guild I'd once been the (sole) leader of without so much as a "see ya later."</p><p>So yes, filing a petition will do the trick, but don't expect that the now-former guild leader will get any sort of notice at all about the proceedings.</p>

[Skywarrior]

<cite>Seagoat wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>As a player who's had a guild taken from them, I can say with confidence that I never got an email saying that the guild I was a leader of was going to be handed to another member.  Long story short, I was forced to take a 3-month hiatus from the game when I moved back in with my parents for a short time; they only had dialup, so no EQ2 for me!  As soon as I got my own place -- and cable internet -- I logged that character in only to find that I'd been totally kicked from a guild I'd once been the (sole) leader of without so much as a "see ya later."</p><p>So yes, filing a petition will do the trick, but don't expect that the now-former guild leader will get any sort of notice at all about the proceedings.</p></blockquote><p>Short of serious RL injury or death, there is almost never any excuse for a guildleader to leave a guild stranded in such a fashion.  If you don't have at least one officer you can trust to appoint to Leader rank, even temporarily, then you have a real problem.</p><p>As far as this specific excuse, I've played EQ1, Daoc, Eve, WoW, SWG, Earth and Beyond, and yes, EQ2, for years on a dialup connection.  The only thing I couldn't do in EQ2 via dialup was raid.  Not logging in from your parent's house even once or twice a week to catch up on things and find out how the guild was going was a choice you made that had nothing to do with your connection or the game's connectivity requirements.</p><p>Guildleaders who are not incapacitated somehow in RL and who care about the other players in their guild simply do not disappear from the game without making some kind of provision for the guild to continue functioning normally.  At a minimum you should be able to contact your officers outside of the game environment, either via email or guild forums (there are free forums available such as ezboard, if you don't want to set up and host your own).  If you can't or won't do this (what I consider a minimum effort) then you shouldn't even try to be a guildleader. </p>

[Seagoat]

<cite>Skywarrior wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Short of serious RL injury or death, there is almost never any excuse for a guildleader to leave a guild stranded in such a fashion.  If you don't have at least one officer you can trust to appoint to Leader rank, even temporarily, then you have a real problem.</p><p>As far as this specific excuse, I've played EQ1, Daoc, Eve, WoW, SWG, Earth and Beyond, and yes, EQ2, for years on a dialup connection.  The only thing I couldn't do in EQ2 via dialup was raid.  Not logging in from your parent's house even once or twice a week to catch up on things and find out how the guild was going was a choice you made that had nothing to do with your connection or the game's connectivity requirements.</p><p>Guildleaders who are not incapacitated somehow in RL and who care about the other players in their guild simply do not disappear from the game without making some kind of provision for the guild to continue functioning normally.  At a minimum you should be able to contact your officers outside of the game environment, either via email or guild forums (there are free forums available such as ezboard, if you don't want to set up and host your own).  If you can't or won't do this (what I consider a minimum effort) then you shouldn't even try to be a guildleader.</p></blockquote><p> Thank you very much for passing a judgment call on me.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  That always makes my day!  <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>My post had nothing to do with circumstances or excuses; I was simply pointing out that the now-former guild leader will receive no notification of anything that happened regarding guild leadership changes while s/he is AWOL.</p><p>As for my own situation, until you know the details, you might not want to assume you're morally superior.  And now, a few intimate tidbits for you, since you asked so politely:</p><p>The guild <i>could</i> function normally without me, and I did not expect to be gone so suddenly or for so long.  My now ex-husband (the one who petitioned to have himself promoted to leader, and therefore had the shiny new ability to kick me out of the guild altogether) had all permissions as a senior officer, with the exception of being able to disband the guild or kick out anyone who was ranked higher than he was.  At the time, that was only me.</p><p>PS - When your spouse decides that going out with other people right under your nose is ok, and expects you to be ok with it as well, then gives you a deadline to be moved out by when you tell him it's NOT ok, <i>then</i> makes your life a living hell and estranges you from nearly all the friends you'd made in what was promising to be a successful guild...well, when that time comes, get back to me and tell me how <i>you</i> were in the wrong for "leaving your guild stranded."</p><p>Enjoy your karma.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Aurumn]

<p>wow, ... just wow. <img src="/smilies/385970365b8ed7503b4294502a458efa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>That would be, like, the best ever reason to get a PK guild together and hunt his digital rear end. It also painfully illustrates the danger of assumptions. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[cyclonus11]

Thanks for the replies, everyone. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I will try to track down some of the former officers & see if they are able to get in touch with him first, before I do any sort of petitioning. Shalla@Valor wrote: <blockquote>Did your leader just dissapear without a word of goodbye ? Normally i would expect that he should asked the guild who should be the new leaders and give some persons the rights since thats now problem here .. we have 6 or 7 "leaders" meanwhile <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote> Back when Vanguard launched, he and a few others said they were going to go play that game, but he would make his alt the leader & still hop on every now & then. Except now, neither him nor his alt have been on in two months, and I heard he told someone he was letting his account expire. So now, all we have is one officer who is actually an alt of someone in another guild... <cite>Gnevil wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>There are other posts of this nature if you do a search, it just takes a little time to get this done correctly.</p></blockquote> I looked everywhere & couldn't find anything. I wish there was a way to search the entire boards. 

[Lancaster38]

<cite>Seagoat wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Skywarrior wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Short of serious RL injury or death, there is almost never any excuse for a guildleader to leave a guild stranded in such a fashion.  If you don't have at least one officer you can trust to appoint to Leader rank, even temporarily, then you have a real problem.</p><p>As far as this specific excuse, I've played EQ1, Daoc, Eve, WoW, SWG, Earth and Beyond, and yes, EQ2, for years on a dialup connection.  The only thing I couldn't do in EQ2 via dialup was raid.  Not logging in from your parent's house even once or twice a week to catch up on things and find out how the guild was going was a choice you made that had nothing to do with your connection or the game's connectivity requirements.</p><p>Guildleaders who are not incapacitated somehow in RL and who care about the other players in their guild simply do not disappear from the game without making some kind of provision for the guild to continue functioning normally.  At a minimum you should be able to contact your officers outside of the game environment, either via email or guild forums (there are free forums available such as ezboard, if you don't want to set up and host your own).  If you can't or won't do this (what I consider a minimum effort) then you shouldn't even try to be a guildleader.</p></blockquote><p> Thank you very much for passing a judgment call on me.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  That always makes my day!  <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>My post had nothing to do with circumstances or excuses; I was simply pointing out that the now-former guild leader will receive no notification of anything that happened regarding guild leadership changes while s/he is AWOL.</p><p>As for my own situation, until you know the details, you might not want to assume you're morally superior.  And now, a few intimate tidbits for you, since you asked so politely:</p><p>The guild <i>could</i> function normally without me, and I did not expect to be gone so suddenly or for so long.  My now ex-husband (the one who petitioned to have himself promoted to leader, and therefore had the shiny new ability to kick me out of the guild altogether) had all permissions as a senior officer, with the exception of being able to disband the guild or kick out anyone who was ranked higher than he was.  At the time, that was only me.</p><p>PS - When your spouse decides that going out with other people right under your nose is ok, and expects you to be ok with it as well, then gives you a deadline to be moved out by when you tell him it's NOT ok, <i>then</i> makes your life a living hell and estranges you from nearly all the friends you'd made in what was promising to be a successful guild...well, when that time comes, get back to me and tell me how <i>you</i> were in the wrong for "leaving your guild stranded."</p><p>Enjoy your karma.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>You come across like a wonderful guild leader, are there plans for re-building the guild you lost control of? I would be interested in joining, and hopefully being stranded leaderless when you have the eventual falling out with whatever loser you hook up with next.  BTW, is your name Britney?

[Seagoat]

<cite>Lancaster38 wrote:</cite><blockquote>You come across like a wonderful guild leader, are there plans for re-building the guild you lost control of? I would be interested in joining, and hopefully being stranded leaderless when you have the eventual falling out with whatever loser you hook up with next.  BTW, is your name Britney? </blockquote><p> Again, judgment.  Yay!  Do you people have nothing better to do with your time except try to make yourselves feel better by belittling others?  What a diverse and intensely fulfilling life you must lead.  *yawn*</p><p>Again, since you seem so interested in my life story, it's a hell of a lot better now that it was then.  I no longer wake up hating myself every day for trying to make a doomed marriage last.  I've started a webdesign and graphics business and have begun working from home -- which is best, considering that my myriad medical conditions tend to interfere with a more mainstream career.  Since my divorce, I've met a great man who simply adores me and whom I'm madly in love with.  Best of all, I have plenty of time to manage the small, friendly guild I lead that contains friends and friends of friends.</p><p>I somehow doubt you'd ever receive an invitation to join, though...not even on your birthday.</p>

[Skywarrior]

<cite>Seagoat wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Skywarrior wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Short of serious RL injury or death, there is almost never any excuse for a guildleader to leave a guild stranded in such a fashion.  If you don't have at least one officer you can trust to appoint to Leader rank, even temporarily, then you have a real problem.</p><p>As far as this specific excuse, I've played EQ1, Daoc, Eve, WoW, SWG, Earth and Beyond, and yes, EQ2, for years on a dialup connection.  The only thing I couldn't do in EQ2 via dialup was raid.  Not logging in from your parent's house even once or twice a week to catch up on things and find out how the guild was going was a choice you made that had nothing to do with your connection or the game's connectivity requirements.</p><p>Guildleaders who are not incapacitated somehow in RL and who care about the other players in their guild simply do not disappear from the game without making some kind of provision for the guild to continue functioning normally.  At a minimum you should be able to contact your officers outside of the game environment, either via email or guild forums (there are free forums available such as ezboard, if you don't want to set up and host your own).  If you can't or won't do this (what I consider a minimum effort) then you shouldn't even try to be a guildleader.</p></blockquote><p> Thank you very much for passing a judgment call on me.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  That always makes my day!  <img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>My post had nothing to do with circumstances or excuses; I was simply pointing out that the now-former guild leader will receive no notification of anything that happened regarding guild leadership changes while s/he is AWOL.</p><p>As for my own situation, until you know the details, you might not want to assume you're morally superior.  And now, a few intimate tidbits for you, since you asked so politely:</p><p>The guild <i>could</i> function normally without me, and I did not expect to be gone so suddenly or for so long.  My now ex-husband (the one who petitioned to have himself promoted to leader, and therefore had the shiny new ability to kick me out of the guild altogether) had all permissions as a senior officer, with the exception of being able to disband the guild or kick out anyone who was ranked higher than he was.  At the time, that was only me.</p><p>PS - When your spouse decides that going out with other people right under your nose is ok, and expects you to be ok with it as well, then gives you a deadline to be moved out by when you tell him it's NOT ok, <i>then</i> makes your life a living hell and estranges you from nearly all the friends you'd made in what was promising to be a successful guild...well, when that time comes, get back to me and tell me how <i>you</i> were in the wrong for "leaving your guild stranded."</p><p>Enjoy your karma.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote><p>I wasn't passing judgment on you personally and your response to my post basically proves my point.  I was commenting on your stated reason for not logging onto the game for three months.  I wasn't asking for more details, could care less really, as I was basing my comments on the information you yourself provided.  You said you didn't sign in because all you had was dialup.  I said that was a weak excuse (it is) and that your decision had to be based on something else.  You came back all righteous indignation and provided more detail that proved my point.  Your decision not to log in was based on something else.  </p><p>I'm sorry you had such a miserable experience, I really am.  I wouldn't wish that experience on anyone.  I hope you never experience it or anything like it ever again and that the remainder of your life is very happy.  Seriously.</p><p>Your now (and frankly unnecessarily) embellished story still doesn't change the apparent fact that there was nothing except your emotions preventing you from logging in for less than 5 minutes and promoting one of your officers to Leader and then logging off.  They didn 't even have to be online for you to do it.  You just do it if you are a responsible person with any thought for others.  The efforts you make to execute your responsibilities, no matter how small, are a direct reflection of how you value other people.  This is true in every aspect of life, be it the emergency room in a hospital or in a game.  Even now, in this discussion, you have allowed your emotions to rule you in your response to me.  You could have simply answered my post with a "well, yeah, the dialup thing was a strawman for my real reason which is a lot more personal and something I don't think the world needs to know about.  Suffice it to say that I could have done something about the guild but I was emotionally incapacitated at the time."  At least that is an honest answer rather than the one you gave initially or the guilt trip you are attempting to put on me.  In an online forum, the only thing we as readers have to respond to is the words written.  If you write something that is not defensible (I couldn't log on because all I had was dialup), expect to be challenged on it.</p><p>I will enjoy my karma as I tend to take life as it falls and if it gives me lemons I make lemonade.  In your case, I sincerely hope your "lemonade" is a soulmate with whom you can enjoy the rest of your life, as I have with mine for the past 35 years.  Good luck. </p>

[Lancaster38]

<cite>Seagoat wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Lancaster38 wrote:</cite><blockquote>You come across like a wonderful guild leader, are there plans for re-building the guild you lost control of? I would be interested in joining, and hopefully being stranded leaderless when you have the eventual falling out with whatever loser you hook up with next.  BTW, is your name Britney? </blockquote><p> Again, judgment.  Yay!  Do you people have nothing better to do with your time except try to make yourselves feel better by belittling others?  What a diverse and intensely fulfilling life you must lead.  *yawn*</p><p>Again, since you seem so interested in my life story, it's a hell of a lot better now that it was then.  I no longer wake up hating myself every day for trying to make a doomed marriage last.  I've started a webdesign and graphics business and have begun working from home -- which is best, considering that my myriad medical conditions tend to interfere with a more mainstream career.  Since my divorce, I've met a great man who simply adores me and whom I'm madly in love with.  Best of all, I have plenty of time to manage the small, friendly guild I lead that contains friends and friends of friends.</p><p>I somehow doubt you'd ever receive an invitation to join, though...not even on your birthday.</p></blockquote><p>Actually, I didn't want your life story, I've been in guilds with leaders that focus on personal problems at the expense of the guild THEY CREATED, so yes, I am passing judgment on you. </p><p>I could care less about your RL crap, don't start a guild if you don't care enough about the members to touch base with them at all. </p>

[Seagoat]

<cite>Lancaster38 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Actually, I didn't want your life story, I've been in guilds with leaders that focus on personal problems at the expense of the guild THEY CREATED, so yes, I am passing judgment on you. </p><p>I could care less about your RL crap, don't start a guild if you don't care enough about the members to touch base with them at all.</p></blockquote><p> LOL  So my real life should go to pot because my priority ought to be a guild I created in a <i>video game</i>?  Wow.</p>

[Kendricke]

<cite>Seagoat wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Lancaster38 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Actually, I didn't want your life story, I've been in guilds with leaders that focus on personal problems at the expense of the guild THEY CREATED, so yes, I am passing judgment on you. </p><p>I could care less about your RL crap, don't start a guild if you don't care enough about the members to touch base with them at all.</p></blockquote><p> LOL  So my real life should go to pot because my priority ought to be a guild I created in a <i>video game</i>?  Wow.</p></blockquote> <p> Let me first say, I'm not in any way condoning or agreeing with the way Lancaster38 chose to respond to you.  That said, I'm going to respond to your comment quoted here directly.  </p><p>That guild you created may exist within a "video game", but the people who joined it are very real.  The work and effort they put into that guild is very real.  The time they sacrificed away from friends and family is very real.  The emotional bonds they formed with each other and with the guild organization as a whole are very real.  </p><p>The guild itself may belong in a world of make believe, but there's nothing made up about the people who formed the guild.  </p><p>Your real life should absolutely take priority.  However, to simply abandon those people - those living, breathing, very real people - without so much as a "sorry guys, but I need to step down for a while to deal with some issues" simply doesn't fly for me.  </p><p>I think the main source of angst you're seeing here from other players is that you just poured out your entire sordid story for hundreds of thousands of strangers to see online just to make a point in a discussion about a guild you created "in a video game"...but you couldn't make a similar effort to tell the same thing to people that had joined you in good faith.  In fact, you admitted that you didn't tell them anything at all. </p><p>I've had to step down from my guild twice in the past nine years.  The first time, in 1999, shortly after our founding, I left no message and came back to find that those remaining guildmembers felt completely betrayed and hurt by my abandonment.  They had turned to another officer, and when I returned, I returned as a regular member who had to earn my place within the guild once more...just like everyone else.  </p><p>When I left my guild for a short time at the end of 2003, I made certain not to repeat the mistake.  I assigned leadership duties to another officer and made certain that our senior officers were aware of my situation on a semi-regular basis.  When I returned a few months later, the guild was still in good shape and no one was upset with my absence...because I'd taken the time to inform them that there were issues that demanded my attention elsewhere.  </p><p>I showed them my respect.  In return, they showed me theirs.  </p><p>Though I do not agree with the attacks upon you, I can at least understand where some of  the venom fueling such attacks is coming from.  </p>

[Echgar]

Some of the comments in this thread have turned a bit personal and I would like to ask everyone to be careful not to allow your disagreements to turn down that road.  I understand how difficult it can be sometimes to hold back responding to someone you feel is being disrespectful, but being the bigger person and avoiding the bait can be the more honorable position (not to mention it saving an otherwise decent discussion from turning into a flamewar). <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Gillain]

<blockquote><p>That guild you created may exist within a "video game", but the people who joined it are very real.  The work and effort they put into that guild is very real.  The time they sacrificed away from friends and family is very real.  The emotional bonds they formed with each other and with the guild organization as a whole are very real.  </p><p>The guild itself may belong in a world of make believe, but there's nothing made up about the people who formed the guild. </blockquote></p>This argument would carry a lot more weight if she had disbanded the guild or did something else to disrupt/destroy the bonds that those real people had with each other. But, as stated, she left the guild intact with a high-ranking officer in place who could take care of all the details of day-to-day running of the guild. Seriously people, while I admit she over-shared rather drastically, this whole hate-fest started in response to her just pointing out that 'No, the current guild leader will not be notified.'  That was the point of her post. And suddenly the thread turns into a "Why Seagoat is a lousy guild leader." topic (she isn't, by the way, I'm in her guild and she's always been very patient and helpful and way, WAY more polite than a few of you in this thread). I mean, really, don't you people have *anything* better to do with your time than dump on people you don't know?

[Jai1]

<p>It is entirely possible to have leadership within a guild without an active GL position.  In EQ, I was in a guild pretty much since the first day I played until years later when I started EQ2 and that guild didn't have an active GL.  In fact, the only time I ever saw that GL log on was for guild combines, to help secure a name and also get the GL spot again.  It's been a few since I played and don't remember how roles and responsibilities went but the guild still was very active and prospered without an active GL.  We still had excellent Raid Leaders which was more important.</p><p>I inherited my first EQ2 raid guild and, actually, it's the first guild created on Najena, Legion.  The GL here was also relatively inactive but we still were active and had leadership in officer positions.  Unfortunately, the guild collapsed and everyone left, basically, besides me and my friend that helps me run it.  I also had to boot the old inactive GL I felt before he booted everyone and killed the guild.  Him taking down our site abnd forums was enough for me and I didn't have to worry about him after the boot.  Later, I tried but failed to revive this guild with low levels who may have what I thought was missing from the raiders I recruited, loyalty.  Now, it's basically an alt guild for my friend's raiding guild.  In this case, I imagine the guild wouldn't need much leadership other than roster management.  </p><p>In my main's guild(as tagged), I had a VERY active GL.  It was a nice change but it was a situation where the guild leader needed to be active because, I believe, they refreshed the troops.  A guild needs active recruiters more than anything I feel.  In DoD, however,  the GL identified that he would have less time and moved to an officer position while promoting 3 or so officers to GL.   This is very respectable and shows great character.  I am more used to GL going inactive and keeping leadership whether or not it's the best for the guild. </p><p>I think there have been a few cases of GL's going inactive, being kicked and coming back later to no guild.  I wouldn't want that to happen to me.  I do go inactive but my leadership isn't really needed for an alt guild.  I'm not recruiting anymore and that's fine with me.  In guilds where the role is vital to the guild's success or if the members 'need' to have an active GL,  then it's probably best for the majority to remove the GL but I'd try other means of communication and try to have them give an explaination or give up the spot for those who care more.  I think it really just depends and cases where there are few members or not a whole lot of guild activity then it could be a case of trying to 'get' the guild.  I guess it depends on how long the GL has been inactive.  Something like 3 months isn't a whole lot of time to me.  A year, maybe, but I'd try to get a hold of the old GL.  I imagine CS may give you their email but it might be a confidentiality issue.</p>

[Seagoat]

<cite>Kendricke wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Let me first say, I'm not in any way condoning or agreeing with the way Lancaster38 chose to respond to you.  That said, I'm going to respond to your comment quoted here directly.  </p><p>That guild you created may exist within a "video game", but the people who joined it are very real.  The work and effort they put into that guild is very real.  The time they sacrificed away from friends and family is very real.  The emotional bonds they formed with each other and with the guild organization as a whole are very real.  </p><p>The guild itself may belong in a world of make believe, but there's nothing made up about the people who formed the guild.  </p><p>Your real life should absolutely take priority.  However, to simply abandon those people - those living, breathing, very real people - without so much as a "sorry guys, but I need to step down for a while to deal with some issues" simply doesn't fly for me.  </p><p>I think the main source of angst you're seeing here from other players is that you just poured out your entire sordid story for hundreds of thousands of strangers to see online just to make a point in a discussion about a guild you created "in a video game"...but you couldn't make a similar effort to tell the same thing to people that had joined you in good faith.  In fact, you admitted that you didn't tell them anything at all. </p><p>I've had to step down from my guild twice in the past nine years.  The first time, in 1999, shortly after our founding, I left no message and came back to find that those remaining guildmembers felt completely betrayed and hurt by my abandonment.  They had turned to another officer, and when I returned, I returned as a regular member who had to earn my place within the guild once more...just like everyone else.  </p><p>When I left my guild for a short time at the end of 2003, I made certain not to repeat the mistake.  I assigned leadership duties to another officer and made certain that our senior officers were aware of my situation on a semi-regular basis.  When I returned a few months later, the guild was still in good shape and no one was upset with my absence...because I'd taken the time to inform them that there were issues that demanded my attention elsewhere.  </p><p>I showed them my respect.  In return, they showed me theirs.  </p><p>Though I do not agree with the attacks upon you, I can at least understand where some of  the venom fueling such attacks is coming from.</p></blockquote><p> Thank you very much, Kendricke, for not stooping to the levels others have and making this about how "bad" a person I am.  I've had a rough day (yeah, life really sucks sometimes), and you helped smooth it over a bit for me.  I appreciate it.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>I want to clarify my position here.  I'm definitely not saying that "RL crap" gives people a free pass to ignore the relationships they've built in-game.  I LOVE this game, and when everything else went down the tubes, I had friends in EQ2 that were there for me -- some of them moreso than my "RL" friends.  I've been on the other end of the situation too, and no, it's not cool.</p><p>I'm not trivializing guilds or guild leaders' responsibilities...but stuff happens, as you know.  If provisions can be made, they should be made, but sometimes they can't be.  Sometimes provisions <i>are</i> made and things still go horribly wrong.  That being said, you can bet that if I ever suspect I'll be offline again for any length of time, I'll plan a little better than I did last time.  :p </p><p>Sorry for over-sharing...</p>