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Bi
05-26-2007, 03:03 PM
so .. im a total newbie to pvping. I got lucky with an 'experienced' group of people, who invited me to guild while we were levelling 1-10, (they were 14 just watching over some mates) sadly i havent been able to group with them much, which has left me soloing nearly all the time. I'm 13 now, with 12AAs (I locked at 10, apparently questing 10-15/16 is a good move in pvp as there are a lot of gankers etc once you hit the late teens and people are in pvp status gear - I wouldnt know tbh) anyways so.. I have no stifle, just the 5s stun ( I found a cheap master, thankfully) and no debuff. most other skills are ad1, with a few appr2s (the <8s) root is m1 tho (woohoo) My points are agi 4-4-3 atm I seem to get totally freaking owned at this level; no matter what I do - I'm mostly jumped and I've tried opening with root or stun, I realised mez just gets resisted usually and takes too long to cast anyway, and the encounter ends / i'm chain interrupted before I can get it off. So anyways... once I back up out of melee range after the stun, I get 1-2 nukes off, try to root (mostly resisted, or breaks easily or is cured) and I (mostly) die. I've tried with / without pets.. maybe I need to find some decent caster pets to hang around with me all the time; but having a 'perfect' pet doesnt happen often.. just wondering what I'm doing wrong? or is this just a case of having ad1/apprentice skills vs twinks? I've noticed that there are shedloads of mental resists on every rare jewellery piece, so undoubtedly this contributes a lot to resists.. but really - as a crowd controller, I have problems taking down almost anything 1v1 at this level. the nice thing about locking is that at least all this debt doesnt particularly worry me. any advice into what I'm doing wrong and/or what I could improve?

convict
05-26-2007, 03:26 PM
<p>Im not sure if C's get a ward or magi shielding or not, but if they do, I would get that 1st in your AA..</p><p>Your more than likely not doing anything wrong, and I can almost bet it's scouts owning you.. They have nothing less than MC gear/adept 3's and they hang around the noob area's killing people in island gear because, either they think it's fun, or they cant get kills any other way.</p><p>I would say, get used to it, or re-roll, scouts and druids run eq2 pvp..</p>

Bi
05-26-2007, 03:51 PM
heh, funnily that's it - scouts and druids - particularly rangers / furies, although swashies give me some grief, if i can get away i'm usually ok. I dont get away from rangers though <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

silentpsycho
05-26-2007, 04:34 PM
<cite>Bibe wrote:</cite><blockquote>so .. im a total newbie to pvping. I got lucky with an 'experienced' group of people, who invited me to guild while we were levelling 1-10, (they were 14 just watching over some mates) sadly i havent been able to group with them much, which has left me soloing nearly all the time. I'm 13 now, with 12AAs (I locked at 10, apparently questing 10-15/16 is a good move in pvp as there are a lot of gankers etc once you hit the late teens and people are in pvp status gear - I wouldnt know tbh) anyways so.. I have no stifle, just the 5s stun ( I found a cheap master, thankfully) and no debuff. most other skills are ad1, with a few appr2s (the <8s) root is m1 tho (woohoo) My points are agi 4-4-3 atm I seem to get totally freaking owned at this level; no matter what I do - I'm mostly jumped and I've tried opening with root or stun, I realised mez just gets resisted usually and takes too long to cast anyway, and the encounter ends / i'm chain interrupted before I can get it off. So anyways... once I back up out of melee range after the stun, I get 1-2 nukes off, try to root (mostly resisted, or breaks easily or is cured) and I (mostly) die. I've tried with / without pets.. maybe I need to find some decent caster pets to hang around with me all the time; but having a 'perfect' pet doesnt happen often.. just wondering what I'm doing wrong? or is this just a case of having ad1/apprentice skills vs twinks? I've noticed that there are shedloads of mental resists on every rare jewellery piece, so undoubtedly this contributes a lot to resists.. but really - as a crowd controller, I have problems taking down almost anything 1v1 at this level. the nice thing about locking is that at least all this debt doesnt particularly worry me. any advice into what I'm doing wrong and/or what I could improve? </blockquote> I just re-rolled my pvp coercer and he's locked at level 10 and is also getting repeatedly stomped by just about everyone.  Not one spell has landed on an opponent in any of the 48 times I've been killed, and I have to agree with the OP, it's a little rediculous.  By comparison, my little wizard, at this level with the same gear, spell upgrades and AA's, had a *huge* damage shield (gives me effectively almost 200% of my current HP's), and even his adept 1 spells land on opponents for the most part.  What does SOE have against crowd/mental control anyway?  Why does charm only last for only 0.05 seconds on players (even at master 1)?  Why do assasins/rangers, sk's, furies, wizards and warlocks all get their best attacks as master 2 choices while necros and coercers can't updgrade their pet spells?  A little balance please...

Bi
05-26-2007, 04:41 PM
tbh the lack of see stealth (we only get see invis) and no self invis ((until level 15!!!!)) are the real killers for being jumped.. tho on topic of resists: I attacked a warlock one level above me tonight - I got the jump on him as he was harvesting.. I opened with root (so he couldnt run) then my dot, DD, then stun, - all resisted.. I ended up being killed largely by his debuffs.. (2 dots doing roughly 15-20 a tick damage) he came up to me and /hug(ged) me, humiliation. Kinda suprised that a crowd controlling enchanter is being steamrolled. I didnt even take a bubble off his life. Getting some ad3s and mc gear made now (spent today harvesting for raws) so we'll see how it goes later today/tomorrow I guess 2 things that would *really* help a coercer out - invis at a lower level. Enchanters not being able to choose to be seen seems out of order in a level range where dirges and swashbucklers can?! debuff - an enchanter can't lower his/her enemies defenses at the same level that other classes can stun, stifle and debuff.. I think these things would help out the lower end coercers immensely

Skill
05-26-2007, 06:47 PM
<span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><b>Maybe I can give a few tips: </b></span></span><ul><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you haven't already, make sure you're /anon</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you can, use an illusion form so it's harder for people to tell what class you are. Form of the Droag collection can often be found cheap, (look for awakened emblems) and doesn't break during combat.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">When you are solo, ALWAYS have a pet. Grab the best one you can, perferrably heroic. Make sure your charm is at least Adept 3, if not master. Remember, if you get killed, your heroic pet will start beating on them. Get all your other spells up to at least Ad1. Harvest rares till you can get Ad3s made, and make sure your gear is at least as good as Tier 2 Mastercrafted. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Do instances, like decrepit crypt, BSV, Den of Darkblade assassins, etc. to get drops you can use or sell for better gear/spells</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Make your coercer a crafter so you can make $ and gear. Tailor, Sage, would help.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Become a transmuter, and transmute your old gear/crappy drops. You can turn the stuff you get into adornments, or have them made for you. Look for + vs crushing/slashing/piercing, + to mental dmg, and Int, sta, hp adorns.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a good imbued wand for when you are oop, or for runners.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Agi AA line is good. Some people like Str line for the reflect ability. In EoF tree, there is an ability that lowers resist rates to your spells by 50%. Some Coercers I talked to think this is a must for PVP. May be worth trying if you get a load of AAs.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a load of AAs. Kill every named you see, join pickup groups who are AA hunting, go to Gfay and do the outpost quest series, go to Darklight and finish those quests. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Try to find PvPing groups. Most pvp groups will be all scouts, bruisers, druids and Sks anyway, and would probably like a Coercer to group with. In a group you will shine, use your encounter disrupts, mezz like crazy, and remember to cast see invis on yr friends. And don't be shy about using your dispel magic. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> Solo? roll with pets, lead off with mezz then root, let pet hit them while you blast them. Vs healers, throw some power drains in. A OOP healer = a dead healer. </span></span></b></li></ul><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Best of luck, and stick with it. Coercer is a hard class to play, but if you stick it out, you'll have fun. Go to the Coercer forums, there is some great info there, as well as links to some of the better pets per tier. Be prepared to die a lot, because all casters do.From what I hear, you won't start becoming a force till around tier 3. So use these early levels to rake in the AA, and try not to worry about that KvD ratio too much <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </span></span></b>

deepruntramp
05-26-2007, 07:36 PM
Locking at level 10 is an awful idea for all INT casters. You need to get out of T2 range ASAP, because that's where all the twinked level locking "pros" are, and quite simply, INT casters are bottom of the barrel at this stage.

Bi
05-26-2007, 10:33 PM
great tips skillet, especially the droag form. I havent charmed heroics up until today, as ad1 charm breaks a fair bit; and I didnt trust what it can do - but now i have a m1 charm, and have np charming ^^^s I dont really know the instances you are talking about either :/ I only really knew wc and fallen gate from my pve levelling - generally you do 2-3 runs of both, and you're out of the zones, so there isnt much hanging around. Apart from that - groups seem few and far between, and crafting really isnt my forte <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> i did have 1 more question - does sta actually do anything at all? I took 3 items off with 4sta and +5 hp, and i lost... 5hp  :/ kinda disappointing seeing as mages rely on hp more than power at this level(at least i do)

CresentBlade
05-26-2007, 11:22 PM
Level 30+ you start coming into your own<img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Balrok
05-27-2007, 12:05 AM
<p>Do your self a favor and unlock you exp.  Twinked scout will own you at that level... not much you can do.  Play the game the way it's designed and level that coercer.  You'll shine 40-60.. after that you'll run into resist issues and way over powered dps classes.. but you'll do OK.  There is a good reason 95% of the level lockers are scouts and bruisers.</p><p>Exur - 70 Coercer</p><p>Venekor</p>

MokiCh
05-27-2007, 02:00 AM
Yeah you're gonna get rocked if you lock in T2, or T3 for that matter. You don't start getting any of your real good spells until the late 20's. You could lock at 24, get Sybillant master 2 and spank unwary scouts with it, but that's still a very risky option. Like Exur said, go level that Coercer up, it's much more fun than locking

dellaripa
05-27-2007, 04:04 AM
Yep, like others have said PvP life as a coercer doesn't start until level 28 when you get despotic mind (burns their health for every power point they spend).  At that point you will officially become a caster/healer genocider). 

Norrsken
05-27-2007, 06:13 AM
<p>Ouch, coercer? Thats the hardest class to play. You wont get into your own until 28 somewhere, and everyone hates the enchanters (Coercer/illu) because of the massive crowd control they have. So as a coercer, you have no way of upping your survivability by aas, and you will be the first target in your group. Fun stuff. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

TniEradani
05-27-2007, 06:48 AM
<p>Don't listen to these guys that want you to unlock and hurry up lvling.</p><p>Listen to <b>Chuntastic1. </b>Hunt AA's, harvest rares for gear and spells, farm nameds for masters and legendary gear.</p><p>Go slow - learn your class and keep all your skills up. I don't care if you don't 'come into your own till lvl X', if you hurry too fast, you won't know your abilities as well as if you take your time.</p><p>And BSV = Blood Skull Valley. There's a couple of really good instances there. The quest starters are out of WFP gate and that tower past The Sprawl entrance. There's a whole bunch of T2 quests involving those menacing orcs. A Broken Harness gives access to one really good instance. ROTL (Return of the Light HQ) is another good one for AA and horse buying status. Another nice BS Orc quest is from some guy by the river near Hidden Canyon - ends with a 20 ^^^ and a really nice ring.</p><p>Good hunting and have fun</p>

Norrsken
05-27-2007, 06:51 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><p>Don't listen to these guys that want you to unlock and hurry up lvling.</p><p>Listen to <b>Chuntastic1. </b>Hunt AA's, harvest rares for gear and spells, farm nameds for masters and legendary gear.</p><p>Go slow - learn your class and keep all your skills up. I don't care if you don't 'come into your own till lvl X', if you hurry too fast, you won't know your abilities as well as if you take your time.</p><p>And BSV = Blood Skull Valley. There's a couple of really good instances there. The quest starters are out of WFP gate and that tower past The Sprawl entrance. There's a whole bunch of T2 quests involving those menacing orcs. A Broken Harness gives access to one really good instance. ROTL (Return of the Light HQ) is another good one for AA and horse buying status. Another nice BS Orc quest is from some guy by the river near Hidden Canyon - ends with a 20 ^^^ and a really nice ring.</p><p>Good hunting and have fun</p></blockquote>Never said he needs to level up fast, only made clear that he is in his weak levels and he will continue to die, and die lots. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Cantilena
05-27-2007, 09:06 AM
<p>Welcome to solo PvP, aka "Rock, Scissors, Paper".  Given two players who don't suck and whose gear doesn't suck, solo PvP will pretty much always boil down to which class beats which.  At the lowest levels it usually means whichever class has the most stuns and dps.</p><p>When I played a Coercer, I simply never bothered going anywhere without a Guardian, Inquisitor, and some kind of Scout, hehe.  Sorry I can't remember enough about those low levels to be any real help to you.  Things are different now that you get AA at lvl 10 instead of 20.  Back then, unless you planned to be a n00b-eating Caves ganker, you didn't lock until 20, by which time Coercers have many more interesting things in their arsenal.</p>

Image_Vain
05-27-2007, 09:39 AM
Solution? ask yourself what chuck norris would do in your situation.

MokiCh
05-27-2007, 09:48 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><p>Don't listen to these guys that want you to unlock and hurry up lvling.</p><p>Listen to <b>Chuntastic1. </b>Hunt AA's, harvest rares for gear and spells, farm nameds for masters and legendary gear.</p><p>Go slow - learn your class and keep all your skills up. I don't care if you don't 'come into your own till lvl X', if you hurry too fast, you won't know your abilities as well as if you take your time.</p><p>And BSV = Blood Skull Valley. There's a couple of really good instances there. The quest starters are out of WFP gate and that tower past The Sprawl entrance. There's a whole bunch of T2 quests involving those menacing orcs. A Broken Harness gives access to one really good instance. ROTL (Return of the Light HQ) is another good one for AA and horse buying status. Another nice BS Orc quest is from some guy by the river near Hidden Canyon - ends with a 20 ^^^ and a really nice ring.</p><p>Good hunting and have fun</p></blockquote>This strategy works if you're a level locking newb ganker, but not for a Coercer. Pre-20 a Coercer is wasted space in a pvp group cause all he's gonna do is die a lot, and I wouldn't even bother to try solo pvping. At 23 you get Synergism and at 28(ish) you get Despotic Mind, and that's really when you start being able to kill people. If you get a master pet, T4 is the best level range to be a pvp Coercer.

Roald
05-27-2007, 10:18 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><p>Don't listen to these guys that want you to unlock and hurry up lvling.</p><p>Listen to <b>Chuntastic1. </b>Hunt AA's, harvest rares for gear and spells, farm nameds for masters and legendary gear.</p><p>Go slow - learn your class and keep all your skills up. I don't care if you don't 'come into your own till lvl X', if you hurry too fast, you won't know your abilities as well as if you take your time.</p><p>And BSV = Blood Skull Valley. There's a couple of really good instances there. The quest starters are out of WFP gate and that tower past The Sprawl entrance. There's a whole bunch of T2 quests involving those menacing orcs. A Broken Harness gives access to one really good instance. ROTL (Return of the Light HQ) is another good one for AA and horse buying status. Another nice BS Orc quest is from some guy by the river near Hidden Canyon - ends with a 20 ^^^ and a really nice ring.</p><p>Good hunting and have fun</p></blockquote><i>This strategy works if you're a level locking newb ganker, but not for a Coercer. Pre-20 a Coercer is wasted space in a pvp group cause all he's gonna do is die a lot, and I wouldn't even bother to try solo pvping.</i> At 23 you get Synergism and at 28(ish) you get Despotic Mind, and that's really when you start being able to kill people. If you get a master pet, T4 is the best level range to be a pvp Coercer. </blockquote><p>Sorry but this is complete rubbish. I got slayer on my coercer at level 11 while i was questing In gfey. Thats B4 any MC gear, and with quite a few spells App1, with most of my targets higher level than me. Coercers are great in a group in T2 and are average soloers, if u can PLAY the class WELL. I can take down pretty much any white healer or tank atm, wizards and rangers/swashies are tough but not massively so.</p><p>Sop, u did well yesterday, things will only get better. </p>

Greeen-_-Ranger
05-27-2007, 10:20 AM
What was that first streak we had Milambers?  What is the second?!?  You are a coercer right?!

Roald
05-27-2007, 11:17 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>What was that first streak we had Milambers?  What is the second?!?  You are a coercer right?! </blockquote> 72-73 <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Brig/Coercer duo ftw

Bi
05-27-2007, 10:59 PM
well, im not going to unlock, as i still have massive problems finding groups in my timezone, and my guild takes care of me when there are similar levels on. I will do the droag thing - i ahve some nice masters now, so hopefully soloing will be a lot easier. I hit 15 next level, and blink and invis will make things easier.. but i realise I'm likely to die alot - I only hope for a ratio of 1, and I have a ratio of 2 atm =) thanks for the props milamber, I did enjoy that group

zorros
05-28-2007, 07:08 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><b>Maybe I can give a few tips: </b></span></span><ul><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you haven't already, make sure you're /anon</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you can, use an illusion form so it's harder for people to tell what class you are. Form of the Droag collection can often be found cheap, (look for awakened emblems) and doesn't break during combat.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">When you are solo, ALWAYS have a pet. <strike>Grab the best one you can, perferrably heroic</strike>. Make sure your charm is at least Adept 3, if not master. Remember, if you get killed, your heroic pet will start beating on them. Get all your other spells up to at least Ad1. Harvest rares till you can get Ad3s made, and make sure your gear is at least as good as Tier 2 Mastercrafted. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Do instances, like decrepit crypt, BSV, Den of Darkblade assassins, etc. to get drops you can use or sell for better gear/spells</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Make your coercer a crafter so you can make $ and gear. Tailor, Sage, would help.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Become a transmuter, and transmute your old gear/crappy drops. You can turn the stuff you get into adornments, or have them made for you. Look for + vs crushing/slashing/piercing, + to mental dmg, and Int, sta, hp adorns.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a good imbued wand for when you are oop, or for runners.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Agi AA line is good. Some people like Str line for the reflect ability. In EoF tree, there is an ability that lowers resist rates to your spells by 50%. Some Coercers I talked to think this is a must for PVP. May be worth trying if you get a load of AAs.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a load of AAs. Kill every named you see, join pickup groups who are AA hunting, go to Gfay and do the outpost quest series, go to Darklight and finish those quests. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Try to find PvPing groups. Most pvp groups will be all scouts, bruisers, druids and Sks anyway, and would probably like a Coercer to group with. In a group you will shine, use your encounter disrupts, mezz like crazy, and remember to cast see invis on yr friends. And don't be shy about using your dispel magic. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> Solo? roll with pets, lead off with mezz then root, let pet hit them while you blast them. Vs healers, throw some power drains in. A OOP healer = a dead healer. </span></span></b></li></ul><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Best of luck, and stick with it. Coercer is a hard class to play, but if you stick it out, you'll have fun. Go to the Coercer forums, there is some great info there, as well as links to some of the better pets per tier. Be prepared to die a lot, because all casters do.From what I hear, you won't start becoming a force till around tier 3. So use these early levels to rake in the AA, and try not to worry about that KvD ratio too much <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </span></span></b></blockquote><p>Dont even bother to charm herioc mobs,any good coercer knows thhy make no difference and just make you life harder when they break and believe me they always break when u dont want them too.</p><p>BB is a great place to solo as a coercer and they is a good lvl range of pets there and a good supply of Q.</p><p>Put your aa's into making charm and spells harder to resist then into making reactives count bigger and dont lock before 24 thats where the fun starts.Coercers are a great soloing class IF you can get a spell to hit and you take control. </p>

Norrsken
05-28-2007, 07:15 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><b>Maybe I can give a few tips: </b></span></span><ul><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you haven't already, make sure you're /anon</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you can, use an illusion form so it's harder for people to tell what class you are. Form of the Droag collection can often be found cheap, (look for awakened emblems) and doesn't break during combat.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">When you are solo, ALWAYS have a pet. <strike>Grab the best one you can, perferrably heroic</strike>. Make sure your charm is at least Adept 3, if not master. Remember, if you get killed, your heroic pet will start beating on them. Get all your other spells up to at least Ad1. Harvest rares till you can get Ad3s made, and make sure your gear is at least as good as Tier 2 Mastercrafted. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Do instances, like decrepit crypt, BSV, Den of Darkblade assassins, etc. to get drops you can use or sell for better gear/spells</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Make your coercer a crafter so you can make $ and gear. Tailor, Sage, would help.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Become a transmuter, and transmute your old gear/crappy drops. You can turn the stuff you get into adornments, or have them made for you. Look for + vs crushing/slashing/piercing, + to mental dmg, and Int, sta, hp adorns.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a good imbued wand for when you are oop, or for runners.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Agi AA line is good. Some people like Str line for the reflect ability. In EoF tree, there is an ability that lowers resist rates to your spells by 50%. Some Coercers I talked to think this is a must for PVP. May be worth trying if you get a load of AAs.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a load of AAs. Kill every named you see, join pickup groups who are AA hunting, go to Gfay and do the outpost quest series, go to Darklight and finish those quests. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Try to find PvPing groups. Most pvp groups will be all scouts, bruisers, druids and Sks anyway, and would probably like a Coercer to group with. In a group you will shine, use your encounter disrupts, mezz like crazy, and remember to cast see invis on yr friends. And don't be shy about using your dispel magic. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> Solo? roll with pets, lead off with mezz then root, let pet hit them while you blast them. Vs healers, throw some power drains in. A OOP healer = a dead healer. </span></span></b></li></ul><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Best of luck, and stick with it. Coercer is a hard class to play, but if you stick it out, you'll have fun. Go to the Coercer forums, there is some great info there, as well as links to some of the better pets per tier. Be prepared to die a lot, because all casters do.From what I hear, you won't start becoming a force till around tier 3. So use these early levels to rake in the AA, and try not to worry about that KvD ratio too much <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </span></span></b></blockquote><p>Dont even bother to charm herioc mobs,any good coercer knows thhy make no difference and just make you life harder when they break and believe me they always break when u dont want them too.</p><p>BB is a great place to solo as a coercer and they is a good lvl range of pets there and a good supply of Q.</p><p>Put your aa's into making charm and spells harder to resist then into making reactives count bigger and dont lock before 24 thats where the fun starts.Coercers are a great soloing class IF you can get a spell to hit and you take control. </p></blockquote> Heroic pets have their uses in pvp. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Cantilena
05-28-2007, 09:09 AM
One thing that most certainly makes a difference is whether the mob is a caster or melee.  Caster mobs are dumb, and don't dps as fast as they should, and usually have fewer HP.  Melee mobs generally make better pets.

zorros
05-28-2007, 09:37 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><b>Maybe I can give a few tips: </b></span></span><ul><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you haven't already, make sure you're /anon</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you can, use an illusion form so it's harder for people to tell what class you are. Form of the Droag collection can often be found cheap, (look for awakened emblems) and doesn't break during combat.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">When you are solo, ALWAYS have a pet. <strike>Grab the best one you can, perferrably heroic</strike>. Make sure your charm is at least Adept 3, if not master. Remember, if you get killed, your heroic pet will start beating on them. Get all your other spells up to at least Ad1. Harvest rares till you can get Ad3s made, and make sure your gear is at least as good as Tier 2 Mastercrafted. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Do instances, like decrepit crypt, BSV, Den of Darkblade assassins, etc. to get drops you can use or sell for better gear/spells</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Make your coercer a crafter so you can make $ and gear. Tailor, Sage, would help.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Become a transmuter, and transmute your old gear/crappy drops. You can turn the stuff you get into adornments, or have them made for you. Look for + vs crushing/slashing/piercing, + to mental dmg, and Int, sta, hp adorns.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a good imbued wand for when you are oop, or for runners.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Agi AA line is good. Some people like Str line for the reflect ability. In EoF tree, there is an ability that lowers resist rates to your spells by 50%. Some Coercers I talked to think this is a must for PVP. May be worth trying if you get a load of AAs.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a load of AAs. Kill every named you see, join pickup groups who are AA hunting, go to Gfay and do the outpost quest series, go to Darklight and finish those quests. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Try to find PvPing groups. Most pvp groups will be all scouts, bruisers, druids and Sks anyway, and would probably like a Coercer to group with. In a group you will shine, use your encounter disrupts, mezz like crazy, and remember to cast see invis on yr friends. And don't be shy about using your dispel magic. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> Solo? roll with pets, lead off with mezz then root, let pet hit them while you blast them. Vs healers, throw some power drains in. A OOP healer = a dead healer. </span></span></b></li></ul><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Best of luck, and stick with it. Coercer is a hard class to play, but if you stick it out, you'll have fun. Go to the Coercer forums, there is some great info there, as well as links to some of the better pets per tier. Be prepared to die a lot, because all casters do.From what I hear, you won't start becoming a force till around tier 3. So use these early levels to rake in the AA, and try not to worry about that KvD ratio too much <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </span></span></b></blockquote><p>Dont even bother to charm herioc mobs,any good coercer knows thhy make no difference and just make you life harder when they break and believe me they always break when u dont want them too.</p><p>BB is a great place to solo as a coercer and they is a good lvl range of pets there and a good supply of Q.</p><p>Put your aa's into making charm and spells harder to resist then into making reactives count bigger and dont lock before 24 thats where the fun starts.Coercers are a great soloing class IF you can get a spell to hit and you take control. </p></blockquote> Heroic pets have their uses in pvp. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></blockquote><p> True<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.Its always nice to see someone that killed you get their butts handed to them by your "pet" once u have died.Other than than its no use as herioc charmed mobs dont hit any harder than normal mobs.</p><p> Also from what ive read a certain guild likes to use them to pop people out of immunity<img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

Roald
05-28-2007, 11:03 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>One thing that most certainly makes a difference is whether the mob is a caster or melee.  Caster mobs are dumb, and don't dps as fast as they should, and usually have fewer HP.  Melee mobs generally make better pets.</blockquote> Frim my experience i have found the opposite. so few people attack the pet that HP isnt really important. Most caster pets around lvl 15 hit for 160-200 damage in PvP, it would take a melee pet about 15 seconds to do that much, meanwhile the caster pet is also meleeing and the nuke is about to come again. Having a caster pet while solo as a coercer has saved my [Removed for Content] quite a few times, and they can help get runners.

Norrsken
05-29-2007, 05:03 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><b>Maybe I can give a few tips: </b></span></span><ul><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you haven't already, make sure you're /anon</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">If you can, use an illusion form so it's harder for people to tell what class you are. Form of the Droag collection can often be found cheap, (look for awakened emblems) and doesn't break during combat.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">When you are solo, ALWAYS have a pet. <strike>Grab the best one you can, perferrably heroic</strike>. Make sure your charm is at least Adept 3, if not master. Remember, if you get killed, your heroic pet will start beating on them. Get all your other spells up to at least Ad1. Harvest rares till you can get Ad3s made, and make sure your gear is at least as good as Tier 2 Mastercrafted. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Do instances, like decrepit crypt, BSV, Den of Darkblade assassins, etc. to get drops you can use or sell for better gear/spells</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Make your coercer a crafter so you can make $ and gear. Tailor, Sage, would help.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Become a transmuter, and transmute your old gear/crappy drops. You can turn the stuff you get into adornments, or have them made for you. Look for + vs crushing/slashing/piercing, + to mental dmg, and Int, sta, hp adorns.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a good imbued wand for when you are oop, or for runners.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Agi AA line is good. Some people like Str line for the reflect ability. In EoF tree, there is an ability that lowers resist rates to your spells by 50%. Some Coercers I talked to think this is a must for PVP. May be worth trying if you get a load of AAs.</span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Get a load of AAs. Kill every named you see, join pickup groups who are AA hunting, go to Gfay and do the outpost quest series, go to Darklight and finish those quests. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Try to find PvPing groups. Most pvp groups will be all scouts, bruisers, druids and Sks anyway, and would probably like a Coercer to group with. In a group you will shine, use your encounter disrupts, mezz like crazy, and remember to cast see invis on yr friends. And don't be shy about using your dispel magic. </span></span></b></li><li><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> Solo? roll with pets, lead off with mezz then root, let pet hit them while you blast them. Vs healers, throw some power drains in. A OOP healer = a dead healer. </span></span></b></li></ul><b><span style="color: #0099ff"><span style="font-size: small; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Best of luck, and stick with it. Coercer is a hard class to play, but if you stick it out, you'll have fun. Go to the Coercer forums, there is some great info there, as well as links to some of the better pets per tier. Be prepared to die a lot, because all casters do.From what I hear, you won't start becoming a force till around tier 3. So use these early levels to rake in the AA, and try not to worry about that KvD ratio too much <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </span></span></b></blockquote><p>Dont even bother to charm herioc mobs,any good coercer knows thhy make no difference and just make you life harder when they break and believe me they always break when u dont want them too.</p><p>BB is a great place to solo as a coercer and they is a good lvl range of pets there and a good supply of Q.</p><p>Put your aa's into making charm and spells harder to resist then into making reactives count bigger and dont lock before 24 thats where the fun starts.Coercers are a great soloing class IF you can get a spell to hit and you take control. </p></blockquote> Heroic pets have their uses in pvp. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></blockquote><p> True<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.Its always nice to see someone that killed you get their butts handed to them by your "pet" once u have died.Other than than its no use as herioc charmed mobs dont hit any harder than normal mobs.</p><p> Also from what ive read a certain guild likes to use them to pop people out of immunity<img src="/smilies/e8a506dc4ad763aca51bec4ca7dc8560.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p></blockquote>Actually, if the guy you send your heroic pet after is dumb enough to hit it, you can dispell it and have a full heroic help you tear that silly sod to shreds.

Norrsken
05-29-2007, 05:05 AM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>One thing that most certainly makes a difference is whether the mob is a caster or melee.  Caster mobs are dumb, and don't dps as fast as they should, and usually have fewer HP.  Melee mobs generally make better pets.</blockquote>A caster pet, a good one, will nuke for about 1/3rd - 1/4th of a players health every 6 seconds if your charm is m1, whereas melee pets will not be anywhere near that until t7. And autoattack is not affected by the quality of your charm and as such, sucks.

Siphar
05-29-2007, 06:47 AM
<p>your main problem was selecting to play a PvP coercer and your next was to solo. I have a T7 Coercer and he has sucked all the way to 70.</p><p>Your only chnace is to max aa, gear with shields/wards (later levels) and find a group.</p><p>Other than that i wouldn't even bother soloing, and you will be owned 90% of the time, and there is no fun in that.</p><p>On the other hand if you are level locked, you can simply go out and PvP to accumulate debt, as you won't need to use the guards in a city and people will do it for free as you try and kill them.</p><p>Coercers and illusionists to some degree are the weakest in PvP by far.</p><p><b>/rebalance</b> please</p>

Norrsken
05-29-2007, 07:10 AM
<cite>Siphar wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>your main problem was selecting to play a PvP coercer and your next was to solo. I have a T7 Coercer and he has sucked all the way to 70.</p><p>Your only chnace is to max aa, gear with shields/wards (later levels) and find a group.</p><p>Other than that i wouldn't even bother soloing, and you will be owned 90% of the time, and there is no fun in that.</p><p>On the other hand if you are level locked, you can simply go out and PvP to accumulate debt, as you won't need to use the guards in a city and people will do it for free as you try and kill them.</p><p>Coercers and illusionists to some degree are the weakest in PvP by far.</p><p><b>/rebalance</b> please</p></blockquote>My lvl 34 coercer is killing orange con whatevers. I bet that it is more a case of not having figured out that class yet since both enchanters are monsters in pvp.

Bi
05-29-2007, 08:32 AM
i dont think coercers are monsters in pvp pre 24. They are difficult to play, but definitely have some charm to them =) I do think that the lower levels need a slight rebalance- chanters seem to be very underpowered there.

Greeen-_-Ranger
05-29-2007, 09:05 AM
I simply think you are the man Sop and I <3 both of my coercer playing kick [I cannot control my vocabulary] guildies.  I could've used you last night man, there were some great matches.  Cannon Fodder?!? I think dug in their heals at the Q griff in antonica and at the end of the match every person from both groups was dead.  Was freakin amazing.  I wish we would've had more than 1 heal...but Milambers (my coercer buddy numero uno...your numero dos!!!) was the man on the healers and the cc.  Hats off the Cannon Fodder's teen twinks, they are definately worthy opponents.

Ozgood
05-29-2007, 11:56 AM
<p>Monsters of PvP?  Come on!  You must be the only one of the planet that knows how to play the class correctly then.  Look at the leaderboards, lowest KVD ratio, Coercer and Defilers.  Lowest PvP kill streaks, I had 22 in a row at one time and made the top 30 gamewide!  Compare that to other classes that are over 400+ to be in the same rank.</p><p>They are a clothie, with no warding, no pet bodyguards, with no DD and have to be hit to do damage.  <img src="/smilies/385970365b8ed7503b4294502a458efa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Someone who asked for balance was dead on.</p><p>In a good group, that knows how to play with a Coercer, I agree, they are quite nasty.  I can take Orange healers as well, breaking little sweat, because they actually kill themselves.  I just help a little <img src="/smilies/908627bbe5e9f6a080977db8c365caff.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>To the OP:</p><p>Coercers are not a lock toon unless you roll with a 6 some.  The first AAs you should have got are the ones that make your reactives tick for more as that is you mode of doing damage.  At 30, they do get better, but you need to be fully mastered, with crazy resists and a nuker pet to be really effective solo.  Other toons, not so much.</p>

Bozidar
05-29-2007, 12:02 PM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><p>Monsters of PvP?  Come on!  You must be the only one of the planet that knows how to play the class correctly then.  Look at the leaderboards, lowest KVD ratio, Coercer and Defilers.  Lowest PvP kill streaks, I had 22 in a row at one time and made the top 30 gamewide!  Compare that to other classes that are over 400+ to be in the same rank.</p><p>They are a clothie, with no warding, no pet bodyguards, with no DD and have to be hit to do damage.  <img src="/smilies/385970365b8ed7503b4294502a458efa.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Someone who asked for balance was dead on.</p><p>In a good group, that knows how to play with a Coercer, I agree, they are quite nasty.  I can take Orange healers as well, breaking little sweat, because they actually kill themselves.  I just help a little <img src="/smilies/908627bbe5e9f6a080977db8c365caff.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>To the OP:</p><p>Coercers are not a lock toon unless you roll with a 6 some.  The first AAs you should have got are the ones that make your reactives tick for more as that is you mode of doing damage.  At 30, they do get better, but you need to be fully mastered, with crazy resists and a nuker pet to be really effective solo.  Other toons, not so much.</p></blockquote><p>A coercer is a group toon, period.  These guys in this thread have had 100 kill streaks because of good, well lead, well built, groups.  That's pvp.. </p><p>KvD ratio of the overall population just shows you that most people suck at those classes and don't play them right. </p>

zorros
05-29-2007, 12:52 PM
<cite>Siphar wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>your main problem was selecting to play a PvP coercer and your next was to solo. I have a T7 Coercer and he has sucked all the way to 70.</p><p>Your only chnace is to max aa, gear with shields/wards (later levels) and find a group.</p><p>Other than that i wouldn't even bother soloing, and you will be owned 90% of the time, and there is no fun in that.</p><p>On the other hand if you are level locked, you can simply go out and PvP to accumulate debt, as you won't need to use the guards in a city and people will do it for free as you try and kill them.</p><p>Coercers and illusionists to some degree are the weakest in PvP by far.</p><p><b>/rebalance</b> please</p></blockquote><p>I guess you never saw stormings pvp vid.Coercers destroys scouts and healers and most case's fighters if played right 1v1.</p><p>Illusionists are prob better than coercers in pvp slightley as they dont need to get hit to do damage in a 1v1 but to say they are the weakest pvp class thats total bollocks.They are prob the hardest class to play but by no means are they the weakest.</p>

Splintered
05-29-2007, 01:02 PM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><cite>Siphar wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>your main problem was selecting to play a PvP coercer and your next was to solo. I have a T7 Coercer and he has sucked all the way to 70.</p><p>Your only chnace is to max aa, gear with shields/wards (later levels) and find a group.</p><p>Other than that i wouldn't even bother soloing, and you will be owned 90% of the time, and there is no fun in that.</p><p>On the other hand if you are level locked, you can simply go out and PvP to accumulate debt, as you won't need to use the guards in a city and people will do it for free as you try and kill them.</p><p>Coercers and illusionists to some degree are the weakest in PvP by far.</p><p><b>/rebalance</b> please</p></blockquote><p>I guess you never saw stormings pvp vid.Coercers destroys scouts and healers and most case's fighters if played right 1v1.</p><p>Illusionists are prob better than coercers in pvp slightley as they dont need to get hit to do damage in a 1v1 but to say they are the weakest pvp class thats total bollocks.They are prob the hardest class to play but by no means are they the weakest.</p></blockquote>On my warden, which I haven't played in a few months, I have never once lost to a coercer in a solo vs solo situation. The problem you see with most healers losing to coercers is because they don't know how to fight them. If you let the coercers impairements take effect, you are a fool. It comes down to I have to hope my hp's hold up until I can remove those impairements, and hit when I can. Its generally a longer battle, and my power is getting drained the entire time, but I have never lost.

Ozgood
05-29-2007, 01:26 PM
<p>We are saying the same thing then.  One of the posters above said that Coercers are Monsters of PvP.  The OP is saying he is having trouble killing anybody or not getting resisted.</p><p>Again, for the record, Coercers are not weak.  They are far however from being beasts in PvP.  </p><p>Bottom line; a well played Coercer can do well.  A well played (insert FoTM class here) can do great to incredible.</p><p>Apples to apples, bragging on someone that has a 100 kill streak on any other class board will get you laughed off.  Coercers do need some loving and are not for the impatient or those that want an I win class.</p>

Bi
05-30-2007, 09:12 PM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote>This strategy works if you're a level locking newb ganker, but not for a Coercer. <b>Pre-20 a Coercer is wasted space in a pvp group</b> <i>cause all he's gonna do is die a lot,</i> and I wouldn't even bother to try solo pvping. </blockquote> <img src="http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p22/Rigorr/coercer250-101.jpg?t=1180570492" border="0"> <a href="http://s124.photobucket.com/albums/p22/Rigorr/?action=view&current=coercer250-101.jpg" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://s124.photobucket.com/albums/...rcer250-101.jpg</a> if the embed doesnt work many thanks to my group - Ratfacekilla, Dazzo, Ratfaceheala, Ratfacedrilla, Kekekeke, Rips, and many others (sorry i dont remember all your names) ironically have just died while writing this post, after the group split I'm still a newbie to pvp, sadly props to my guild Norrath Pirates for showing me some of the intricacies of pvp play, and showing some tolerance <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  3 names especially here are ratfacekilla, milambers, and raike

Bi
05-30-2007, 09:29 PM
just wanted to say that coercers  <b>ARE</b> very useful in pvp groups, especially at shutting down healers and casters. Slayer at 15 as well =) Level locked but not staying in tier2 - just want to get my cash up enough to not be ganked too badly as I advance through the tiers