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View Full Version : SOE keep making Illusionists useless


Elephanton
02-26-2007, 04:19 PM
<p>From test update notes:</p><p><b><span style="color: #ff0000">*** Unrest ***</span></b></p><p><span style="color: #ff0000">The seven loot dropping named in Unrest can no longer be stunned, stifled, dazed, or mezzed.</span></p><p>May I ask what am I supposed to do there in that case, should I may be DPS then?</p><p>Wow, any unrest group will throw me away now and get an extra Wizard instead... so frustrating to play crowd control class and see more and more content becoming immune to everything my class is all about. You can as well just remove this class from the game, if you think you can add class-specific content now, like mobs against which half of my spells just does not work.</p><p>This is so tremendously shocking and disappointing...</p>

Ba
02-26-2007, 04:31 PM
<p>/sarcasm on</p><p>Yeah, lets allow a group with 2 chanters using timers to almost completely shutdown every major loot dropping named in a zone via chain combos of stifles/stun/daze/mezz. No-one will ever abuse that! No, not EQ2 players, they are too moral and honorable for that!</p><p>/sarcasm off</p><p>Seriously, just because you cant mess with the named itself doesnt mean you can't CC his pals or other adds. Plus no-one ever brings a chanter along just for their CC abilities. Its the whole package thats useful not just one aspect.</p>

Philiac
02-26-2007, 04:42 PM
If you wsnt every thing a chanter brings without the control abilities, you want a bard. So as tpo not repeat myself, I just point to the other thread on the same subject just below this one.

Jaroth Cloudwalk
02-26-2007, 04:44 PM
Kind of reminds me of a certain zone in Fallen Dynasty that required you to have a chanter.

Antryg Mistrose
02-26-2007, 07:37 PM
Well, ahem, troubadours have Mezz ..... I wonder if charm still works? Seriously, 99% of the time Illusionists are dps, and buffs.  Mezz is not a big part of this game, and never has been.

ke'la
02-27-2007, 12:07 AM
<p>I can think of many places where a Chanter can't Mezz the Named but without the Chanter's CC, it would make the fight Much more difficult.</p><p>Understand this, you whinny chanters... CC stands for CROWD control not SINGLE MOB LOCKDOWN so I can solo/duo it. Just because you can't Mezz/Stun/Stifle a Named does not mean you can't Stun/Stifle/Mezz adds and so on that could be ether part of the encounter or just near by.</p>

Cocytus
02-27-2007, 12:13 AM
<p>Hello, power drain? Helps.</p><p>Anyway...I love illusionists, myself. I love illusionists on my main, and I LOVE my illusionist alt.</p>

Soldancer
02-27-2007, 02:06 AM
Hey Devs didn't You forgot something? Maybe this: <p><b><span style="color: #ff0000">*** Unrest ***</span></b></p><p><span style="color: #ff0000">The seven loot dropping named in Unrest can no longer be taunted and is piercing/slashing/crushing immune and also immune to any damage based on cold/heat/magic/mental/divine/disease/poison.</span></p> /sarcasm off So this is Your "creativity"? To simply block class abilities? Isn't that a bit lame and unimaginative? Even Your predecessors who were fired had more creativity than You, they allowed mezzed nameds to cast a special - by this way they made it possible that boss encounters are not too easy without Your stupid class ability blocking. It was not a bug from the last LU that suddenly 3 instances was completely charm-immune, I say the truth is that one of You guys was going nuts (btw, nek3 is still not "fixed" and still has Your "charmbug"). I guess the same unimaginative guy have now decided to simply block class abilities in Unrest. A long time ago first the nameds were made charm immune, that was ok. Later all ring-event mobs were made charm immune, this was acceptable too inspite of the fact that there are better ways to prevent disturbing gameplay of others. Problem is that more and more of this kind of stupid "solution" came in. I could list so many nameds and simple heroics who are immune to charm or stun or root. To where is this way leading to, Devs? To an EQ2 which is a stupid hack'n'slash game where CC is pointless? Do You really think that it will attract players if You solve Your problems by simply blocking class abilities? And do You think that You will stay long in Your job with such unimaginative ideas?

samejima
02-27-2007, 02:42 AM
Are you guys handicap..................... oh right you don't have to answer that I know the answer. If everything was able to be mezed and stuned ect you could solo this entire game you guys to pretty [Removed for Content] nice dps you have power regen and good buffs stop being [Removed for Content] over one mob.

theriatis
02-27-2007, 09:26 AM
<p>Hi,</p><p>i'm not an Illusionist, but i understand them and agree completely. </p><p>First thing, 2 Mezzer can NOT duo a mob just with mezzes... ever heard of the introduced "Mezz/stun Immunity after you mezz/stun" ?</p><p>They could have easily introduced that on that nameds... or make them immune to ONE or TWO CC Abilities, but NOT ALL OF THEM !</p><p>Sorry, there are far more creative ways to make an encounter hard.</p><p>I, playing a wizard, loved (just for the sake of arguments) the heat/cold resistant Mobs in Gates o.A.A. Oh well... there's the Vampire... i have a Vampire Spell from Bloodlines... oh, it's heat based... and the Vampire is heat immune....haha... made me laugh every time... cast Rending Icicles and Icenova, wait 45 seconds till its up again... that's what i think of playing... standing and looking around.</p><p>I want a whole instance where the loot dropping nameds are all immune to damage if it's not magic based, no ranged, no melee, no CA... then i want to hear YOU complain.</p><p>Regards, theriatis.</p>

Mayve
02-27-2007, 09:53 AM
theriatis wrote: <blockquote><p>First thing, 2 Mezzer can NOT duo a mob just with mezzes... ever heard of the introduced "Mezz/stun Immunity after you mezz/stun" ?</p></blockquote>  Actually, one Illusionist can solo a heroic mob, don't need two, and the immunity granted after a mez/stun is only granted to epic mobs, named or otherwise, not anything you mez/stun.

Elephanton
02-28-2007, 10:12 AM
<cite>Soldancer wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hey Devs didn't You forgot something? Maybe this: <p><b><span style="color: #ff0000">*** Unrest ***</span></b></p><p><span style="color: #ff0000">The seven loot dropping named in Unrest can no longer be taunted and is piercing/slashing/crushing immune and also immune to any damage based on cold/heat/magic/mental/divine/disease/poison.</span></p>/sarcasm off </blockquote> At least this would be fair to everyone!

Kaiser Sigma
02-28-2007, 10:30 AM
Tanks should raise up in arms that there is a mob in a *raid zone* that they cannot tank (Tactician's Armor) then. In fact, they should petition for scout-wide nerfs. If an enchanter can do more than mezzing (and they can) then you have not been rendered useless.

Zagats
02-28-2007, 10:59 AM
<p>Brigands complained that they'd no longer be wanted in raids after the amazing reflexes ubernerf.  That was not true at all.  We're still wanted in raids despite our inability to be AOE immune.  (SOE, you might as well remove that ability completely and give us something useful in return, thx.)</p><p>So what if 7 mobs out of the entire zone are immune to a few of your spells?  You've still got other spells to use on them, and you're still able to use those mez/stun/stifle etc on every other mob in zone.</p>

Jeepned2
03-02-2007, 04:21 AM
<cite>Zagats wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Brigands complained that they'd no longer be wanted in raids after the amazing reflexes ubernerf.  That was not true at all.  We're still wanted in raids despite our inability to be AOE immune.  (SOE, you might as well remove that ability completely and give us something useful in return, thx.)</p><p>So what if 7 mobs out of the entire zone are immune to a few of your spells?  You've still got other spells to use on them, and you're still able to use those mez/stun/stifle etc on every other mob in zone. </p></blockquote>Ok Brigand guy. Since you're know so much, let's do a test. How many mobs in Deathtoll can be charmed? How about Inner Santum? How about all the rest of the the T-7 raid zones? Oh and how long does a group mez last in these zones? And how long does the mobs get complete immunity from another group mez? Look that up and when you see the numbers, come back and try to make an intelligent comment. Oh and just to let a bunch of the rest of you know, Illusionist can parse high, coercers can not, unless we want to restucture our AA's and not provide much benefits to the group, such as, say Heal crit bonuses and minor stuff like that. Oh, and immune to "a few of our spells"? How about all of them that make us enchanters? No big deal I guess. Unless you happen to be an enchanter.

Rienlos
03-02-2007, 05:05 AM
I think the thing that makes me laugh the most about this is the fact that since unrest release the thing I have noticed in the 60-70 chans the most is "Group looking for mezzer". You're right this must be completely destroying the CC classes. Get a grip.  Enchanters plain rock. 

Chog
03-02-2007, 05:41 AM
<cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Zagats wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Brigands complained that they'd no longer be wanted in raids after the amazing reflexes ubernerf.  That was not true at all.  We're still wanted in raids despite our inability to be AOE immune.  (SOE, you might as well remove that ability completely and give us something useful in return, thx.)</p><p>So what if 7 mobs out of the entire zone are immune to a few of your spells?  You've still got other spells to use on them, and you're still able to use those mez/stun/stifle etc on every other mob in zone. </p></blockquote>Ok Brigand guy. Since you're know so much, let's do a test. How many mobs in Deathtoll can be charmed? How about Inner Santum? How about all the rest of the the T-7 raid zones? Oh and how long does a group mez last in these zones? And how long does the mobs get complete immunity from another group mez? Look that up and when you see the numbers, come back and try to make an intelligent comment. Oh and just to let a bunch of the rest of you know, Illusionist can parse high, coercers can not, unless we want to restucture our AA's and not provide much benefits to the group, such as, say Heal crit bonuses and minor stuff like that. Oh, and immune to "a few of our spells"? How about all of them that make us enchanters? No big deal I guess. Unless you happen to be an enchanter. </blockquote><p> 1.  Epic immunity has what to do with the viability of an Enchanter in Unrest?</p><p>2.  Illusionist give up the group benefit achievments to parse as high as they do, why should it be different for a Coercer?</p><p>3.  Last time I checked group and single target buffs where desired by the group more then the ability to crowd control.  With CC not being required for most zones, asking an enchanter into a group for CC would be like asking a Wizard to join the group for their roots.  </p>

Valanthe
03-02-2007, 08:36 AM
<cite>Chogar wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Jeepned2 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Zagats wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Brigands complained that they'd no longer be wanted in raids after the amazing reflexes ubernerf.  That was not true at all.  We're still wanted in raids despite our inability to be AOE immune.  (SOE, you might as well remove that ability completely and give us something useful in return, thx.)</p><p>So what if 7 mobs out of the entire zone are immune to a few of your spells?  You've still got other spells to use on them, and you're still able to use those mez/stun/stifle etc on every other mob in zone. </p></blockquote>Ok Brigand guy. Since you're know so much, let's do a test. How many mobs in Deathtoll can be charmed? How about Inner Santum? How about all the rest of the the T-7 raid zones? Oh and how long does a group mez last in these zones? And how long does the mobs get complete immunity from another group mez? Look that up and when you see the numbers, come back and try to make an intelligent comment. Oh and just to let a bunch of the rest of you know, Illusionist can parse high, coercers can not, unless we want to restucture our AA's and not provide much benefits to the group, such as, say Heal crit bonuses and minor stuff like that. Oh, and immune to "a few of our spells"? How about all of them that make us enchanters? No big deal I guess. Unless you happen to be an enchanter. </blockquote><p> 1.  Epic immunity has what to do with the viability of an Enchanter in Unrest?</p><p>2.  Illusionist give up the group benefit achievments to parse as high as they do, why should it be different for a Coercer?</p><p>3.  Last time I checked group and single target buffs where desired by the group more then the ability to crowd control.  With CC not being required for most zones, asking an enchanter into a group for CC would be like asking a Wizard to join the group for their roots.  </p></blockquote>1. Nothing. 2. No, we really don't. Name me one thing we give up that would actually be WORTH a [Removed for Content] to take in any of the other lines for a raiding Illusionist. 3. Nizara, anyone?

aureisumus
03-02-2007, 09:54 AM
<p><b><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman">I have a 63 illusionist on live but is over year since i played it, but i beleive the3 so called whiner by some sarcastic guy is unjustified as I have an illusionist, with master spells mainly just couple ad3's , and i was able to take down solo a lot of named, b4 i left live so i see his point, i was also a very good group player in guild, and many guilds dont even have illusionists or many of them , which is why i brought him up in 1st place, as main is 70 ranger, my guild started tyo break up after lu24 changes on live and i came full time to test, but i still miss times when i could be called uber in  keeping grp from massacre or when myself grabbing good gear 4 me and guildies off of named, now a named i used to be able to kill easy in living tombs is unkilleable now! If this happened to solo class's  a nerf on main instrument/spell that makes sure named can be killed, they alll would be up in arms so less of the nastyiness i see a lot on posts when saying peeps r whineing, on test i have main 63 nec, and 45 druid and am happy briunging those 2 up on test, i suspect the guy who had go at illusionists 4 whineing is prob one of the guys from live who look thru test to see ahead wharts coming as i find testers r more readily guys who like to get on with each other and see both sides of arguements, basically r much fairer<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></span></b></p><p><b><span style="font-size: small; font-family: Times New Roman">slipslideing nec 63 silvenlake druid 45</span></b></p>

Chog
03-02-2007, 10:28 PM
<cite>Valanthe wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Chogar wrote:</cite><blockquote><b></b> 1.  Epic immunity has what to do with the viability of an Enchanter in Unrest? <p>2.  Illusionist give up the group benefit achievments to parse as high as they do, why should it be different for a Coercer?</p><p>3.  Last time I checked group and single target buffs where desired by the group more then the ability to crowd control.  With CC not being required for most zones, asking an enchanter into a group for CC would be like asking a Wizard to join the group for their roots.  </p></blockquote>1. Nothing. 2. No, we really don't. Name me one thing we give up that would actually be WORTH a [I cannot control my vocabulary] to take in any of the other lines for a raiding Illusionist. 3. Nizara, anyone? </blockquote><p>1. ...</p><p>2.  Group Dehate?</p><p>3.  Can add Mistmoore Castle as well.  I am still confident that two zones is not "most zones." </p>

xXBubblez
03-03-2007, 05:00 AM
<p><span style="color: #66ffff">the content is pretty easy to begin with this change isn't going to make it harder, just annoy the classes that are affected.  What they need to do is give the mobs some more hp and maybe some nice undead type ability that can be shared thru out the zone similar to flameclaw in nizara.  Wouldn't it be great if they made an instance where when you go the first or even the secound time and just can't complete it because its difficult? Specially with the loot that drops from their i think the difficulty should be raised to be more on par with nizara.</span></p>

Emerix
03-03-2007, 07:47 AM
So i got to finish Unrest yesterday and i have to say this zone is SO easy that extra mezzes and stuns would lower the difficulty to like ... Nest .. I really dont get why you guys are complaining . And since the adds are rathereasy ot get especially outside crowd control does help with trash . Calm down guys really .

Cocytus
03-03-2007, 02:30 PM
<p>I wouldn't call the zone "easy". It does have difficulty, but it's not the annoying difficulty of Nizara. It's more of a "puzzle and luck" difficulty.</p><p>That aside, illusionists are NOT useless. I love them. And yes, coercers can parse high too. The coercer I raid with generally parses 1100-1200 which is really [Removed for Content] good for an enchanter. Oughta be happy with that.</p>

Mawie
03-03-2007, 03:11 PM
Yes... SOE has rendered an entire class useless because they have created a zone where mobs cannot be controlled! <img src="http://e.deviantart.com/emoticons/f/faint.gif" border="0"> Please forgive my sarcasm, but in all honestly, the mobs in that zone already move at a snails pace. And I'm sure your friends in game would still go with you into that zone whether you are "uesless" or not. Look at it this way, would they want some random pick up player, or someone they can trust?

Pins
03-03-2007, 04:44 PM
Let's go into a zone where healers can't debuff!  That's exactly the same thing as having a zone where enchanters can't do Crowd Control.

Emerix
03-03-2007, 05:39 PM
<p>SOE has yet to put in a zone where chanters cant crowd control .</p><p>As i said before you can crowd control . you just cannot mez/stun nameds . HUGE difference . Trash isnt immune to mez .</p>

Pins
03-03-2007, 06:20 PM
[email protected] Bayle wrote: <blockquote><p>SOE has yet to put in a zone where chanters cant crowd control .</p><p>As i said before you can crowd control . you just cannot mez/stun nameds . HUGE difference . Trash isnt immune to mez .</p></blockquote>Because trash is harder than the named, aren't they?  I'd really like you to show me a zone where trash is harder than named.

Forsaken1
03-03-2007, 06:38 PM
<cite>Pinski wrote:</cite><blockquote>[email protected] Bayle wrote: <blockquote><p>SOE has yet to put in a zone where chanters cant crowd control .</p><p>As i said before you can crowd control . you just cannot mez/stun nameds . HUGE difference . Trash isnt immune to mez .</p></blockquote>Because trash is harder than the named, aren't they?  I'd really like you to show me a zone where trash is harder than named. </blockquote> The point is, YOU CAN USE YOUR CC SPELLS IN THE ZONE. SOE didnt create a zone where your spells dont work. SOE didnt nullify the need or usefullness of chanters. They simply made it so you arent the 'easy button' for the group.

Emerix
03-03-2007, 06:52 PM
'a named' is quite easy compared to say 3 death beetles 4 ghouls a horde of skellies and a named that was ''accidently'' aggroed by 'someone' at once .

Cocytus
03-04-2007, 04:13 PM
<p>The hardest mobs in the zone are the ones that are spawned by the ?'s inside the house.</p><p>The nameds require strategy, but aren't annoyingly/stupidly hard to kill. I like that.</p>

electricninjasex
03-04-2007, 05:09 PM
<cite>Pinski wrote:</cite><blockquote>Let's go into a zone where healers can't debuff!  That's exactly the same thing as having a zone where enchanters can't do Crowd Control. </blockquote> Actually I think you should suggest a NO MELEE zone, since n00bz don't debuff anyway. On the other hand, a melee-free zone would be very interesting, kinda like the Cult of Kefka tower in FF6.

electricninjasex
03-04-2007, 05:11 PM
<cite>Forsaken1 wrote:</cite><blockquote>They simply made it so you arent the 'easy button' for the group.</blockquote> I get this creeping feeling that you've never played an enchanter before.

Forsaken1
03-04-2007, 11:09 PM
<cite>electricninjasex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Forsaken1 wrote:</cite><blockquote>They simply made it so you arent the 'easy button' for the group.</blockquote> I get this creeping feeling that you've never played an enchanter before. </blockquote><p> I have played a chanter but didnt get him past mid- teens in level. Wasnt my thing.</p><p>I have played WITH chanters in the group, and base my comment on that. By refering to them as the 'easy button'  I am in no way implying that they are over powered.</p><p>If you're gonna quote me, quote my whole comment. You can and do function in the zone. </p><p>By eliminating your ability to mez the named it makes the zone a little tougher, providing more challenge for the group. It seems every other post is someone whining that the game is too easy....</p><p>If the Devs had made it so that none of your class defining skills could be used, then I would completely agree with your complaints. But the simple fact is that just isnt true. You just cant use them on every mob that crosses your path.</p>

Ebarel
03-05-2007, 09:32 AM
<cite>Forsaken1 wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>electricninjasex wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Forsaken1 wrote:</cite><blockquote>They simply made it so you arent the 'easy button' for the group.</blockquote> I get this creeping feeling that you've never played an enchanter before. </blockquote><p> I have played a chanter but didnt get him past mid- teens in level. Wasnt my thing.</p><p>I have played WITH chanters in the group, and base my comment on that. By refering to them as the 'easy button'  I am in no way implying that they are over powered.</p><p>If you're gonna quote me, quote my whole comment. You can and do function in the zone. </p><p>By eliminating your ability to mez the named it makes the zone a little tougher, providing more challenge for the group. It seems every other post is someone whining that the game is too easy....</p><p>If the Devs had made it so that none of your class defining skills could be used, then I would completely agree with your complaints. But the simple fact is that just isnt true. You just cant use them on every mob that crosses your path.</p></blockquote><p>can you please read the update notes before you post? </p><p>It is not about not being able to mezz the (1?)  named it is about not being able to mezz, stun, stifle, daze ANY of the named in there. That is exactly the reason for chanters not being happy there, they cant use ANY of their class defining skills in there. (ok, i can use my fun illusion, still i think that doesnt help much for the fight). But thanks that you agree after we made that clear <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </p>

Emerix
03-05-2007, 10:41 AM
<p>Its fun to post the same stuff over and over again . You can still mez trash . which is 95 % of the mobs in the zone . So you can still use your class defining abilities . Its not like you have to mez single nameds in other zones when your group burns them . Saying you cant use your class defining abilities is plain wrong . </p><p>/sarcasm It would be fun to solo the whole zone with mez/nuke tho . Poor guys you cant do that now .</p>

Roriondesexiest
03-05-2007, 11:59 AM
[email protected] Bayle wrote: <blockquote><p>Its fun to post the same stuff over and over again . You can still mez trash . which is 95 % of the mobs in the zone . So you can still use your class defining abilities . Its not like you have to mez single nameds in other zones when your group burns them . Saying you cant use your class defining abilities is plain wrong . </p><p>/sarcasm It would be fun to solo the whole zone with mez/nuke tho . Poor guys you cant do that now .</p></blockquote><p>Jealous much?</p>

Emerix
03-05-2007, 12:01 PM
Not at all im a Trouby . Mez/nuke is what i do =)

Iseabeil
03-05-2007, 12:03 PM
<p>It would be so awesome if people stopped talkin like they know things, when they obviously do <i>not</i> know.</p><p>So I cant CC nameds eh? Thats why I mezzed the hag when we accidently got her too early? Anyone reading whats been said would noticed a test player saying that the 'no CC named' part of patch was removed when it was still on test. The ONLY things Im unable to mez or stun etc is the Garanel shades, someone gonna say those arent trash but in fact named mobs?</p><p>As the devs didnt go throgh with 'no CC named mobs', you can argue all you want about how chanters still got stuff to play with, they obviously decided we should be allowed to use our tools, wich for me on a named mob is mainly stun, stifle and daze, not mez. Id love to be able to atleast root the shades just incase, but compaired to the possibilities, one sort of trash mob bein immune is nothin.</p><p>(There might be more immune trash, those are the only ones I have seen keep moving with a mez active on them).</p>

Aioli
03-07-2007, 04:53 AM
<cite>Chogar wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>1.  Epic immunity has what to do with the viability of an Enchanter in Unrest?</p><p>2.  Illusionist give up the group benefit achievments to parse as high as they do, why should it be different for a Coercer?</p><p>3.  Last time I checked group and single target buffs where desired by the group more then the ability to crowd control.  With CC not being required for most zones, asking an enchanter into a group for CC would be like asking a Wizard to join the group for their roots.  </p></blockquote><p>The only thing I am going to comment here is #2. One thing that differs apart from AA setup between coercers and illusionists is the charm that coercers has whereas the illusionists has their pet. The charm works great for soloing and level grinding, in the right zone coercers can get in a good amount of XP and dps from having the "right" pet. </p><p>In raids we dont have that luxury as 99% of all raid zone monsters are charm immune. Illusionists on the other hand has a built in pet, perhaps not the best pet, but its always there if they want to spend concentration on summoning it to add to their parses.</p><p>I have made the choice to select AA lines suitable for being member of a MT group on "hard" monsters like the Matron. (incidently most of the harder EoF instance bosses seems to be variations of the Matron, different adds, different resists needed an so on but for me basically the same tactics. &nbsp<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> This means I parse low on dps compared to a combat illusionist (or combat coercer) but I am into this for the guild and the raid, not for personal parser glory so this I have to take.</p>

03-07-2007, 12:17 PM
<p>(1)  Your group pulls a named mob and his 3 buddies</p><p>(2) You mez the three buddies</p><p>(3) Group kills named mob</p><p>(4) Group kills 3 buddies</p><p>vs.</p><p>(1) Your group pulls a named and his three buddies</p><p>(2) Your group kills three buddies while named beats on the tank</p><p>(3) Group kills named. (you can choose to kill named first while buddies beat on the tank i guess)</p><p>Which option has the enchanter?  Which group is more likely to survive the encounter?</p><p>Enchanters are still useful.  Mez'ing the adds on a pull help limit the amount of damage being taken by the tank.  Stop whineing.  </p>

Pins
03-07-2007, 12:28 PM
[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><p>(1)  Your group pulls a named mob and his 3 buddies</p><p>(2) You mez the three buddies</p><p>(3) Group kills named mob</p><p>(4) Group kills 3 buddies</p><p>vs.</p><p>(1) Your group pulls a named and his three buddies</p><p>(2) Your group kills three buddies while named beats on the tank</p><p>(3) Group kills named. (you can choose to kill named first while buddies beat on the tank i guess)</p><p>Which option has the enchanter?  Which group is more likely to survive the encounter?</p><p>Enchanters are still useful.  Mez'ing the adds on a pull help limit the amount of damage being taken by the tank.  Stop whineing.  </p></blockquote>I bring a warlock and AoE the adds down before they are even a problem.

03-07-2007, 02:02 PM
<cite>Pinski wrote:</cite><blockquote>[email protected] wrote: <blockquote><p>(1)  Your group pulls a named mob and his 3 buddies</p><p>(2) You mez the three buddies</p><p>(3) Group kills named mob</p><p>(4) Group kills 3 buddies</p><p>vs.</p><p>(1) Your group pulls a named and his three buddies</p><p>(2) Your group kills three buddies while named beats on the tank</p><p>(3) Group kills named. (you can choose to kill named first while buddies beat on the tank i guess)</p><p>Which option has the enchanter?  Which group is more likely to survive the encounter?</p><p>Enchanters are still useful.  Mez'ing the adds on a pull help limit the amount of damage being taken by the tank.  Stop whineing.  </p></blockquote>I bring a warlock and AoE the adds down before they are even a problem. </blockquote><p>Yes, but doing that brings additional issues including warlock aggro issues (my regular group doesn't include a wizard base class, however I do hear in chat often about how they get aggro and die.. alot..)..  AFAIK the warlocks aren't able to one shot down ^^^ heroics, which means you have to deal with the effects of aoe nukeing and aggro.. plus the damage those mobs do while you are in the process of nuking them down.</p><p>My point isn't that the fight can't be done differently (My group uses neither)... my point is that in a group of six, their mez's actually do fill a useful role in the party.</p>

Jeepned2
03-08-2007, 10:31 AM
[email protected] Bayle wrote: <blockquote><p>SOE has yet to put in a zone where chanters cant crowd control .</p><p>As i said before you can crowd control . you just cannot mez/stun nameds . HUGE difference . Trash isnt immune to mez .</p></blockquote>???????? Have you ever been in a raid? Do you know what kind of restrictions that Mezzes have on any epic mobs, trash or named? There is NO CC allowed in T-7 raid zones. Do you consider an 8 sec group mez against x4 mobs as CC, that the mobs (all of them, not just named) get a huge immunity against before it will effect again? How about my monster 3 sec stun? How about NO charm of even the heroic mobs that might be running around in zone? As to how effective I am in Unrest and group zones, I could care less. 90% of my playing time is in raiding and there is no CC, no charm and slowly but surely no reason to take a Coercer into most of the raid zones when there is a warlock, assassin, ranger, dirge or swashy waiting to get an invite to go too. At least the Illusionist gets time compression. Let's see, I'm a raid leader and have a full raid except for one spot. I can either take the coercer or the dirge that are still waiting to be invited. Ummmmmm...

Emerix
03-08-2007, 10:47 AM
<p>Yea . you get 100 points for not reading the topic . the OP complained about Unrest . My comment was about Unrest . Unrest is not a raid zone . The raid mob stuff doesnt apply here .</p><p>Reading+thinking for the win !</p><p>by the way : I do know about how effective chanters are in raids .</p>

Koilla
03-08-2007, 01:36 PM
<p>just my 2cp...</p><p>first: own an 70 illu myself. so i know how essential it is to keep a named mezzed/stiffled, especially when SOLOING. i´m for sure not happy that the nameds in unrest are immun to that part of CC-spells, but i think i will have to live with it.</p><p>so what does it mean, when mobs are immune to this part of the CC-abilities, that are for sure a class specific part of the chanter, which are definining the role of this class? </p><p>the nameds in unrest wont be soloable for chanters, and so the whole zone wont be. (only my opinion that i need a mezz/stun/stiffleable named of appropiate level to get it solo down).</p><p>further it does mean, chanters are starting to complain, because there is a group-zone out there, which is not soloable. finally soe put a zone in the game, that makes chanter also "someone among others" while they are used to be "The One among the crap". </p><p>why does any non-raidzone have to be soloable by certain classes? some classes find their sololimit in nest, while other still can go through hof, and even less others can solo valdoon! finally unrest has turned into a zone, noone will be able to solo. and thats good.</p><p>cool down you uba geared and uba skilled peeps out there. think about what you are able to do compared to the others out there. and remember, its still a game and its still fun to play that game. go out and find someone to play with and stay happy =)</p>