PDA

View Full Version : Death of a Guild


Slapfish
02-17-2007, 03:03 PM
<p>Probably all of you have been through it a time or two, but I'm beginning to think that I'm the kiss of death to a guild. Every guild I've ever been in has just dwindled away to nothing within months of joining it. It even happened when I played EQ. I just seem to have the worst luck ever. </p><p>The guild I'm in now has recently lost a large number of it's most consistant players (including officers) to Vanguard and WOW, leaving me and a handful of other new members scratching our heads and wondering if they will ever come back and ummmm lead us? Some of the other remaining long time members have left in the past week and this once, very active guild, is just an empty shell. It's very discouraging. </p><p>So what do the rest of you do in this kind of situation? I have only been in this guild since Nov, and I was a low level player working my way up, so I didn't know the other players that well. I don't have phone #'s I can call and ask what the heck is going on and when are you coming back. Should I try to rally what troops are left and try to engage them in activities and create a sense of unity? Should I at least try that before I jump ship? Is jumping ship just quitting? Is it premature at this point? Then again, if the leaders of the guild don't care enough to at least let us know what's going on and when they will be back, what's the point? Is there anything there to save?</p><p>Then again since I seem to have such bad luck I hate to look for another guild. This one seemed to be quite solid. It's been around since shortly after launch and still has many of the same core members. It was very busy and members grouped together quite a bit and all seemed to get along well. I thought I'd finally found a stable group and now this. So ummmm I'm not sure I know how to find a good guild. </p><p>*sigh* any suggestions?</p>

scruffylookin
02-17-2007, 03:23 PM
<cite>Slapfish wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Probably all of you have been through it a time or two, but I'm beginning to think that I'm the kiss of death to a guild. Every guild I've ever been in has just dwindled away to nothing within months of joining it. It even happened when I played EQ. I just seem to have the worst luck ever. </p><p>The guild I'm in now has recently lost a large number of it's most consistant players (including officers) to Vanguard and WOW, leaving me and a handful of other new members scratching our heads and wondering if they will ever come back and ummmm lead us? Some of the other remaining long time members have left in the past week and this once, very active guild, is just an empty shell. It's very discouraging. </p><p>So what do the rest of you do in this kind of situation? I have only been in this guild since Nov, and I was a low level player working my way up, so I didn't know the other players that well. I don't have phone #'s I can call and ask what the heck is going on and when are you coming back. Should I try to rally what troops are left and try to engage them in activities and create a sense of unity? Should I at least try that before I jump ship? Is jumping ship just quitting? Is it premature at this point? Then again, if the leaders of the guild don't care enough to at least let us know what's going on and when they will be back, what's the point? Is there anything there to save?</p><p>Then again since I seem to have such bad luck I hate to look for another guild. This one seemed to be quite solid. It's been around since shortly after launch and still has many of the same core members. It was very busy and members grouped together quite a bit and all seemed to get along well. I thought I'd finally found a stable group and now this. So ummmm I'm not sure I know how to find a good guild. </p><p>*sigh* any suggestions?</p></blockquote><p>I don't think it's you. It's the nature of a maturing MMO. As EQ2 has been around a while, it's pretty common for people to try out other, newer MMOs. And many guilds don't last a few months to start with. </p><p>My guild has been around since launch (on Blackburrow). Of course, that's just because my wife and I refuse to leave.... so the guild has a remarkable membership total of... three. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </p><p>Honestly, if you don't want this to happen, try to get into some of the bigger named guilds. If you see one you've never heard of, there's a good chance it'll be gone in a month or so. </p>

Jynnan
02-17-2007, 03:23 PM
<p>If there's enough of you (6) who are left playing and looking for guidance or whatever, you might as well all agree to leave and create a new guild together.</p><p>I think that's what I'd be tempted to do.</p>

CHIMPNOODLE.
02-17-2007, 03:44 PM
Ya, lotta guilds come and go. What server are you on?

Xadius
02-17-2007, 04:07 PM
If you are not setup as a guild leader then you won't be able to do much for guild unity. I would suggest moving on. Either start your own guild or find a more estabolished and active one.

Camibella
02-17-2007, 04:23 PM
<p>I would not recommend starting a guild to anyone I liked =). Yes it can be very rewarding but its also extremely all consuming. </p><p>The number of Balancing issues that have to be faced on a guild leader level every day is a commitment that should not be stepped into lightly. Even if its only SIX of you, what happens when one of the six doesn't log in and now that six cant group do you recruit and make that one who couldn't log in that one week feel as though he's being bumped? </p><p>Once you start a guild you now have a commitment much like a child or a dog. It has to be feed and cared for on a daily basis. Yes eventually after a long period of time they can become somewhat self sufficient but your hand will ALWAYS need to be there to help guide it along. </p><p>Lets say you get your once in a life time opportunity to join guild X, the guild everyone on the server wants to be in and would give there left arm to join! Are you going to abandon those who you started the guild with? It can be extremely hard to stand through the lows with a guild, but its those "lows" that make every "high" so much more rewarding. </p><p>There is more to starting a guild then just having SIX PEOPLE in a group. I wish more would think it out all the positives and negatives. Would I give up my guild? Not for all the plat in the game. Are there days I wish I wasn't the guild leader? Yes. As a guild leader try XPing on an alt or just logging in to "Play" the game vs managing the guild. Its almost an impossibility. I have an EXCEPTIONALY low drama guild (I would venture to guess its 99% drama free) and its still requires consistent nurturing to ensure it flourishes. </p><p>I have attended raids on days I wasn't even capable of going to work. I have raided with Pinkeye, Strepthroat and migrains. The raid force is fully capable of proceeding without me, my officers are AMAZING and capable of managing every aspect of the raid from start to finish but once again it resorts back to "responsibility to the guild" from a leader standpoint. </p><p>Are you ready to start a webpage, page for hosting and give your members a place to chat outside of game? There are other outside financial responsibilities as well! These are not requirements but there a small part of what makes a guild grow. </p><p>Think it through, if starting a new guild sounds right for you then I wish you luck on that endeavor. Like I said above, I love being the guild leader of my guild and I wouldn't give it up for all the plat in game! But its a lot to keep people active and interested in the game so that members arnt faced with the same situation you find yourself in now.</p><p>Suggestions for finding a guild?</p><p>Look for a guild with some longevity and member commitment - Guild level is an excellent tool for that. Is this guild level 32 and it was just level 20 a few months ago? That's an active guild with members working at it. I generally hate to recommend that way of seeking out active guilds because it almost punishes start up guilds. =(</p><p>Find out who the leaders are, their alts and the officer core. Do /who alls on them frequently. Are they online? Are they playing? If they are that's a good sign. </p><p>Group with some of the members of the guild. How many members of that guild are in your group 1? 2-3? Does it indicate there grouping together? How well do the mesh?</p><p>Visit guilds websites. How active are there message boards? </p><p>I wish you luck. Its hard to find that "Just right" guild, but when you do congratz to you and welcome to your new home!</p>

Oakleafe
02-17-2007, 04:27 PM
Personally I don't like to quit a thing until I'm sure that there's no chance of keeping it going. If you have the time and the energy then I'd suggest doing a bit of rallying, plus if you have a guild forum post on there asking what people in your guild are thinking (some players may pop off to try new MMO's but they tend to check back on their previous guilds forums, especially leaders and officers who've been in the guild a while).  If nothing else you will at least get to know a bit more about the players who are still playing in your guild, and then if you decide that you have to move on then you can try and get the people you have got to know and trust to go to the same guild.  I'll echo the points made by others in this post, it's not you being a jinx as most guilds have a limited life span (or dwindle to few members and just trickle on).  The loss of members happens to all guilds, be it due to RL commitments, other MMOs, quitting dur to nerf-bat or whatever.  This means that all guilds will at some point be interested in getting new members, so they'll be a new home for you if it comes to that.

erin
02-17-2007, 04:50 PM
<cite>Oakleafe wrote:</cite><blockquote>Personally I don't like to quit a thing until I'm sure that there's no chance of keeping it going. </blockquote>From the OPs description, it sounds fairly over. To the OP - don't take it on yourself.  This isn't about you.  Guilds have lifecycles, they get born, they grow up, they die.  Don't assume it has anything to do with your presence, you aren't some sort of guild-destroyer <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Now that Vanguard and such are out, take a look around your server and see what guilds are thriving.  Make sure the guild has people your level, and that they hang out together (this is easy to check, do a who on the guild during your playtime, are there 2 or 3 people together in different zones, or is every person in the guild in a different place.  Are the same folks together regularly?  This could be good or bad, it could be a sign of a clique, or it could be a sign that guildmates are encouraged to hang out together). Try and group with some of them, see if you get a good feeling.  Then join up and hope for the best!

R
02-17-2007, 06:08 PM
<cite>erin wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Oakleafe wrote:</cite><blockquote>Personally I don't like to quit a thing until I'm sure that there's no chance of keeping it going. </blockquote>From the OPs description, it sounds fairly over. To the OP - don't take it on yourself.  This isn't about you.  Guilds have lifecycles, they get born, they grow up, they die.  Don't assume it has anything to do with your presence, you aren't some sort of guild-destroyer <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Now that Vanguard and such are out, take a look around your server and see what guilds are thriving.  Make sure the guild has people your level, and that they hang out together (this is easy to check, do a who on the guild during your playtime, are there 2 or 3 people together in different zones, or is every person in the guild in a different place.  Are the same folks together regularly?  This could be good or bad, it could be a sign of a clique, or it could be a sign that guildmates are encouraged to hang out together). Try and group with some of them, see if you get a good feeling.  Then join up and hope for the best! </blockquote>Good words Erin. Same as I've experienced during my time in EQ2.

MaryJane666
02-17-2007, 06:52 PM
<cite>Camibella wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I would not recommend starting a guild to anyone I liked =). Yes it can be very rewarding but its also extremely all consuming. </p><p>The number of Balancing issues that have to be faced on a guild leader level every day is a commitment that should not be stepped into lightly. Even if its only SIX of you, what happens when one of the six doesn't log in and now that six cant group do you recruit and make that one who couldn't log in that one week feel as though he's being bumped? </p><p>Once you start a guild you now have a commitment much like a child or a dog. It has to be feed and cared for on a daily basis. Yes eventually after a long period of time they can become somewhat self sufficient but your hand will ALWAYS need to be there to help guide it along. </p><p>Lets say you get your once in a life time opportunity to join guild X, the guild everyone on the server wants to be in and would give there left arm to join! Are you going to abandon those who you started the guild with? It can be extremely hard to stand through the lows with a guild, but its those "lows" that make every "high" so much more rewarding. </p><p>There is more to starting a guild then just having SIX PEOPLE in a group. I wish more would think it out all the positives and negatives. Would I give up my guild? Not for all the plat in the game. Are there days I wish I wasn't the guild leader? Yes. As a guild leader try XPing on an alt or just logging in to "Play" the game vs managing the guild. Its almost an impossibility. I have an EXCEPTIONALY low drama guild (I would venture to guess its 99% drama free) and its still requires consistent nurturing to ensure it flourishes. </p><p>I have attended raids on days I wasn't even capable of going to work. I have raided with Pinkeye, Strepthroat and migrains. The raid force is fully capable of proceeding without me, my officers are AMAZING and capable of managing every aspect of the raid from start to finish but once again it resorts back to "responsibility to the guild" from a leader standpoint. </p><p>Are you ready to start a webpage, page for hosting and give your members a place to chat outside of game? There are other outside financial responsibilities as well! These are not requirements but there a small part of what makes a guild grow. </p><p>Think it through, if starting a new guild sounds right for you then I wish you luck on that endeavor. Like I said above, I love being the guild leader of my guild and I wouldn't give it up for all the plat in game! But its a lot to keep people active and interested in the game so that members arnt faced with the same situation you find yourself in now.</p><p>Suggestions for finding a guild?</p><p>Look for a guild with some longevity and member commitment - Guild level is an excellent tool for that. Is this guild level 32 and it was just level 20 a few months ago? That's an active guild with members working at it. I generally hate to recommend that way of seeking out active guilds because it almost punishes start up guilds. =(</p><p>Find out who the leaders are, their alts and the officer core. Do /who alls on them frequently. Are they online? Are they playing? If they are that's a good sign. </p><p>Group with some of the members of the guild. How many members of that guild are in your group 1? 2-3? Does it indicate there grouping together? How well do the mesh?</p><p>Visit guilds websites. How active are there message boards? </p><p>I wish you luck. Its hard to find that "Just right" guild, but when you do congratz to you and welcome to your new home!</p></blockquote><p>Wow.  On some points I really agree with you, on others, not so much.  As a guild leader, yes you do have to log in consistantly but at the same time, I don't think it is an absolute requirement to do everything you listed.  In my guild we are a close knit group that does HQ's and other types of groups and such but we also have the qualifier that RL comes first for EVERYONE.  That maybe why we are still a tiny guild, but then again we have been going strong for almost two years and every once in a while we pick someone else up that is of like mind.  We don't do a whole bunch of special events, or raids but then again that isn't the point for us.  Our point is just to enjoy the game and have fun together.  </p><p>To the OP, if you do decide to look in to other guilds ask questions about the type of guild they are.  Are they heavy raiding guild?  More casual?   If a new game is coming out, I think it would be fair to ask if a majority of the guildies are planning to try that other game out.  Then just explain that you have had a history of joining guilds then having them break up on you a couple months later.  I wish you the best of luck and hope that you find a guild that has the stability you are looking for. </p>

Lilda
02-17-2007, 08:14 PM
Most "serious" (as in not a boutique guild for a couple friends) guilds have a website.  If there is no information to be found on the website at this point, or if there is none, I'd say move on.  I still have a site for a guild that is no longer active on any game, but we still keep in touch letting each other know what games we are playing, etc.

Kendricke
02-18-2007, 11:47 AM
<cite>Camibella wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I would not recommend starting a guild to anyone I liked =). Yes it can be very rewarding but its also extremely all consuming. </p><p>The number of Balancing issues that have to be faced on a guild leader level every day is a commitment that should not be stepped into lightly. Even if its only SIX of you, what happens when one of the six doesn't log in and now that six cant group do you recruit and make that one who couldn't log in that one week feel as though he's being bumped? </p><p>Once you start a guild you now have a commitment much like a child or a dog. It has to be feed and cared for on a daily basis. Yes eventually after a long period of time they can become somewhat self sufficient but your hand will ALWAYS need to be there to help guide it along. </p><p>Lets say you get your once in a life time opportunity to join guild X, the guild everyone on the server wants to be in and would give there left arm to join! Are you going to abandon those who you started the guild with? It can be extremely hard to stand through the lows with a guild, but its those "lows" that make every "high" so much more rewarding. </p><p>There is more to starting a guild then just having SIX PEOPLE in a group. I wish more would think it out all the positives and negatives. Would I give up my guild? Not for all the plat in the game. Are there days I wish I wasn't the guild leader? Yes. As a guild leader try XPing on an alt or just logging in to "Play" the game vs managing the guild. Its almost an impossibility. I have an EXCEPTIONALY low drama guild (I would venture to guess its 99% drama free) and its still requires consistent nurturing to ensure it flourishes. </p><p>I have attended raids on days I wasn't even capable of going to work. I have raided with Pinkeye, Strepthroat and migrains. The raid force is fully capable of proceeding without me, my officers are AMAZING and capable of managing every aspect of the raid from start to finish but once again it resorts back to "responsibility to the guild" from a leader standpoint. </p><p>Are you ready to start a webpage, page for hosting and give your members a place to chat outside of game? There are other outside financial responsibilities as well! These are not requirements but there a small part of what makes a guild grow. </p><p>Think it through, if starting a new guild sounds right for you then I wish you luck on that endeavor. Like I said above, I love being the guild leader of my guild and I wouldn't give it up for all the plat in game! But its a lot to keep people active and interested in the game so that members arnt faced with the same situation you find yourself in now.</p><p>Suggestions for finding a guild?</p><p>Look for a guild with some longevity and member commitment - Guild level is an excellent tool for that. Is this guild level 32 and it was just level 20 a few months ago? That's an active guild with members working at it. I generally hate to recommend that way of seeking out active guilds because it almost punishes start up guilds. =(</p><p>Find out who the leaders are, their alts and the officer core. Do /who alls on them frequently. Are they online? Are they playing? If they are that's a good sign. </p><p>Group with some of the members of the guild. How many members of that guild are in your group 1? 2-3? Does it indicate there grouping together? How well do the mesh?</p><p>Visit guilds websites. How active are there message boards? </p><p>I wish you luck. Its hard to find that "Just right" guild, but when you do congratz to you and welcome to your new home!</p></blockquote>One of the best posts on guilds and guild leadership I think I've ever read.

Spyderbite
02-18-2007, 01:17 PM
As others have already mentioned.. this happens in all MMO's.. not just EQ2. I've seen guilds in UO that were 5+ years old, fold over night because of the release of a new game, or a bad development decision regarding PvP or factions. Regardless of the reasons.. People move on. Will they return? For the most part, people will come back because the "flavor of the week" MMO offered alot but also was lacking much of what they had in the previous game. IMO.. find a way to contact the guild leader.. convince them to turn leadership over to you or somebody else who is still active. Holding on to the reins while they're out sewing their wild MMO oats is simply not fair to the guild. If the leader refuses to relinquish ownership of the guild.. do as others have suggested.. move on. Its tough to start a new guild, especially if you joined when the guild was already established and high level. You lose your guild level, status points (guild not personal), etc. But, while you build your new guild of dedicated players.. you have control. I purposely chose to join a brand new guild.. Level 1 with only 6 players. And, when I joined, we all went over the ground rules should a leader quit EQ2 or whatever. Who will take over, etc. That way we're not in the position you are right now. I hope you're able to get a hold of the guild leader and either establish a new leader or get some closure so you can move on. /bows with a flourish

Lortet
02-19-2007, 12:48 AM
<p>As a long term member of a medium sized "family" guild, I have seen members come and go. Our guild is very social, supportive of new characters and alts and regularly has 5 to 20 members online at any one time. We are truly international with about 45% Australian, 45% UK/Euro and 10% US membership on a Euro Server (Runnyeye). Once any member has been in the guild for longer than about 7 days and begun to get a feel for us, there seems to be only one major leak. That leak is to raiding guilds. (yes we have the odd player leave due to other MMO's, conflicts and unspecified, but all of these are a fraction of loss to raiding guilds)</p><p>I am not anti-raiding, but neither am I personally a raider. I have far too many irl commitments including a young family and after hours on-duty requirements to be able to participate in regular raiding. It is very frustrating though to lose guildies who leave giving raiding as the reason they wish to go. Some of those with them leave an alt in our guild to keep in touch, but we lose the nucleus required to allow our own members to raid (upper levels) together.</p><p>It would be excellent if there was a separate system for guilds when raids are involved. ie the ability to have a family guild for casual play, the social side and levelling up those alts while there is an independent raid system allowing membership with the associated organisation, raid points etc. That way the nursery - mid life guilds would keep in touch with the raid world. This would not have any negative effect on the raid dedicated guilds - they are already set up - but it would help the smaller and family type guilds to get involved.</p><p>I don't think that the current situation of trying to join or organise a "pick up" raid is seen as a solution for those wishing to stay with their preferred but non-raiding guild.</p>

Slapfish
02-19-2007, 05:07 PM
<p>Wow-thanks for so many great responses. I have to say I never considered creating my own guild. As one poster mentioned, it's a great deal of responsiblility. At least if one is to do it properly. I really don't think I have the discipline to do it. I've kind of gotten used to soloing and being able to do what I want when I want to and being responsible for a guild would change all that. Not to mention that I just don't have the game knowledge to do it. I have no idea how to organize a raid or lead a group through an instance zone. </p><p>I have contacted a couple of guild members and discussed the curent state of the guild. One is a returning EQ2 player so he still has a lot to learn about and enjoy in the game. Not likely to game-jump any time soon and there are a few other new players I think will stick around. I've been encouraging some of the newer players to group together with an alt of mine, and just generally trying to create some connections/friendships among those of us who remain. Hopefully if we run through some of the lower level HQ's and other quests we'll create some connections and unity. I guess it's worth a try. </p>

DngrMou
02-19-2007, 06:09 PM
<cite>Kulssin wrote:</cite><blockquote> IMO.. find a way to contact the guild leader.. convince them to turn leadership over to you or somebody else who is still active. Holding on to the reins while they're out sewing their wild MMO oats is simply not fair to the guild. If the leader refuses to relinquish ownership of the guild.. do as others have suggested.. move on. </blockquote> I was going to post, and suggest this exact same thing.  If the leader, or leaders are planning on returning, or they're hanging their hats up for good, they still need to ensure that their guild can continue to function...no leader worth his or her salt would refuse a request to pass on the reins...even if only temporarily.