Exacting

[Homeskillet]

Most useless skill, period.How useless? SO useless.<div></div>

[MystaSkrat]

<div></div>I use it every 3 minutes... /shrug   I didn't find more damage with less reuse timer to be useless IMO

[SmEaGoLLuM]

<div></div>Definitely not one the best of the lvl 65 ancients out there, but not useless. Our AAs are nice so I am not fussed about this one. I also like the fact that it takes a bit of skill to use and needs to be timed in conjunction other CAs and not simply a click and damage art - which then separates the good and crap Assasins.

[bobbit]

<div></div>yep, i have a pre-buff macro for exacting, honed and deathly focus (i know the 2 latter are on 5 min as opposed to the 3 on exacting... but i take w/e is up)... i find when all three are up, i can get as much dps as if kb and decap are up (maybe a tad less). Either way, it does make quite a difference.

[Fahrenheig]

I agree with most of the above, although exacting may not be the best 65 power and is deffinately not as good as the previous power, vanish, what is there to complain about with extra dmg and lower reuse timers?<div></div>

[ZaranilShadowfie]

Exacting is great, I love it.  Knowing when to cast it makes all the difference in how useful it is.<div></div>

[Satie]

<div></div>As an assassin something to help with burst dps, maybe a haste buff or a chance to attack multiple targets would have been more appropriate.  In reality, youll actually be losing dps if you try to get teh most out of exacting so i would say its something like 3-5k at most.  Pretty helpfull for soloing though and still better then what some other classes got.Satinah/Satie, AB<div></div><p>Message Edited by Satie on <span class="date_text">04-05-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:02 PM</span></p>

[Kaiser Sigma]

<div>We already have a haste buff that chances are will never be upgraded, Honed Reflexes. Exacting isn't bad but the cast timer should be instant to be of use, something like Concealment.</div>

[Homeskillet]

<div></div>     That is pretty much my issue with it, casting time, duration, and the skills it affects. At best, it helps with Punch Blade, Masked Attack, Scraping Blow, and Insidious Wound (I know it has an upgrade, just been lazy bout getting it since I have it at Master :p). While yes, it can help those skills maximize their damage, much of the issue is having at least 2 of those skills up to even make this worth its salt. Also, the casting time, while not obscenely long, is enough that I could have auto attacked the extra damage it would have given me.   I honestly think Exacting was just thrown together in a hurry when they realized Vanish was almost exactly like Smoke Bomb, the depth 5 ability on the predator WIS tree. While the duration does improve on Exacting as you upgrade it, it has never made a difference in my DPS really, I can pump out as much damage with it as without it. Nor is it a question of my skill. Perhaps some have worked to utilize Exacting to benifit them, my point is, its not worth it. I would have liked a more well thought out, unique and useful skill for our level 65 special spell.Hell, an in-encounter AoE would have made me happy and been alot more useful.<div></div><p>Message Edited by Homeskillet on <span class="date_text">04-06-2006</span><span class="time_text">06:29 AM</span></p>

[Demonskill]

it's not useless, but it's not very useful either. I usually use it when most of my CA is down, which im referring to the 1 min recast ones, then i'll pop extacting up, MoN + punchblade chain. i got extacting m1 so it last for 40 secs, after that duration which is enough for the 1 min CA again.BTW exact punchblade crit can hit up to 2.2k for me, as for 7 secs recast while in exact, i think it's not bad. However, when EVERYTHING is down for me, THEN i'll use brutal focus and honed reflex to buy time for CA to reload.Yes i agree for the people saying know when to use exact differ from good or bad assassin, DPS on a good and bad one is pretty significant too

[Graton]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Homeskillet wrote:<div></div>     That is pretty much my issue with it, casting time, duration, and the skills it affects. At best, it helps with Punch Blade, Masked Attack, Scraping Blow, and Insidious Wound (I know it has an upgrade, just been lazy bout getting it since I have it at Master :p). While yes, it can help those skills maximize their damage, much of the issue is having at least 2 of those skills up to even make this worth its salt. Also, the casting time, while not obscenely long, is enough that I could have auto attacked the extra damage it would have given me.   I honestly think Exacting was just thrown together in a hurry when they realized Vanish was almost exactly like Smoke Bomb, the depth 5 ability on the predator WIS tree. While the duration does improve on Exacting as you upgrade it, it has never made a difference in my DPS really, I can pump out as much damage with it as without it. Nor is it a question of my skill. Perhaps some have worked to utilize Exacting to benifit them, my point is, its not worth it. I would have liked a more well thought out, unique and useful skill for our level 65 special spell.Hell, an in-encounter AoE would have made me happy and been alot more useful.<div></div><p>Message Edited by Homeskillet on <span class="date_text">04-06-2006</span><span class="time_text">06:29 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote>it also affects finishing blow, the mark line, contrived weapon and it's not useless. i use it all the time - 30% extra dmg on attacks i was going to use anyway is not useless. at master it lasts for 40 seconds so i'm not sure how you can argue 'having enough up to make it useful'. many of the skills you mention refresh in 10 seconds without exacting.</span></div>

[Zero]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Homeskillet wrote:<div></div>     That is pretty much my issue with it, casting time, duration, and the skills it affects. At best, it helps with Punch Blade, Masked Attack, Scraping Blow, and Insidious Wound (I know it has an upgrade, just been lazy bout getting it since I have it at Master :p). While yes, it can help those skills maximize their damage, much of the issue is having at least 2 of those skills up to even make this worth its salt. Also, the casting time, while not obscenely long, is enough that I could have auto attacked the extra damage it would have given me.<hr></blockquote>You try casting this when the tank says  "Inc 10 sec" ?  I dont seem to autoattack during this time.  I don't mean to sound like a jerk, but like someone else said, its very usefull when used correctly.

[Satie]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Graton wrote:<div><span><blockquote><hr>Homeskillet wrote:<div></div>     That is pretty much my issue with it, casting time, duration, and the skills it affects. At best, it helps with Punch Blade, Masked Attack, Scraping Blow, and Insidious Wound (I know it has an upgrade, just been lazy bout getting it since I have it at Master :p). While yes, it can help those skills maximize their damage, much of the issue is having at least 2 of those skills up to even make this worth its salt. Also, the casting time, while not obscenely long, is enough that I could have auto attacked the extra damage it would have given me.   I honestly think Exacting was just thrown together in a hurry when they realized Vanish was almost exactly like Smoke Bomb, the depth 5 ability on the predator WIS tree. While the duration does improve on Exacting as you upgrade it, it has never made a difference in my DPS really, I can pump out as much damage with it as without it. Nor is it a question of my skill. Perhaps some have worked to utilize Exacting to benifit them, my point is, its not worth it. I would have liked a more well thought out, unique and useful skill for our level 65 special spell.Hell, an in-encounter AoE would have made me happy and been alot more useful.<div></div><p>Message Edited by Homeskillet on <span class="date_text">04-06-2006</span><span class="time_text">06:29 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote>it also affects finishing blow, the mark line, contrived weapon and it's not useless. i use it all the time - 30% extra dmg on attacks i was going to use anyway is not useless. at master it lasts for 40 seconds so i'm not sure how you can argue 'having enough up to make it useful'. many of the skills you mention refresh in 10 seconds without exacting.</span></div><hr></blockquote>As far as i know mark is not effected.3 dots (untreated is not effected on flowing wound), finishing blow, masked, puncture, contrived and assailing blast.  Correct me if i am wrong.And to whoever posted right after me. . . i know we have honed reflexes.  Was just trying to give some sugestions along with my thoughts of exacting on what i would really like to see (more haste and some help in aoe departement).</span></div>

[Homeskillet]

    Oh aye, I know its uses and how best to utilize it, I just think its kinda meh...I would have loved the agro management skill rangers get with their bird pet thingy at 65.<div></div>

[Graton]

<div></div>i stand  corrected, mark for whatever irritating reason, is not affected the non-replaced tier 6/7 affected spells are:scraping blowflowing wound (upfront melee only)deadly wound (upfront melee only)puncture blademasked attackcontrived weaponassailing blastfinishing blow<div></div><p>Message Edited by Graton on <span class="date_text">04-06-2006</span><span class="time_text">08:09 PM</span></p>

[ranma5]

When I looked at my Spitting Asp icon last night, it had a recast of 55 seconds.<div></div>

[Fahrenheig]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Satie wrote:<div></div>As an assassin something to help with burst dps, maybe a haste buff or a chance to attack multiple targets would have been more appropriate.  In reality, youll actually be losing dps if you try to get teh most out of exacting so i would say its something like 3-5k at most.  Pretty helpfull for soloing though and still better then what some other classes got.Satinah/Satie, AB<div></div><p>Message Edited by Satie on <span class="date_text">04-05-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:02 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>1) I already stated I think it is usefull, just has to be used correctly and dont feel like reiderating2) Honed reflexes is never replaced and 36% haste3) We have a chance to attack multiple targets in AA, but I at least group with alot of mezzers and that would be a disaster4) If your using your 1 min ca's anyways how would you possibly be losing dps by casting exacting beforehand, not like the .4sec cast time is gunna kill you.</span></div>

[Satie]

<div></div><div><span><blockquote><hr>Fahrenheight wrote:<div><span><blockquote><hr>Satie wrote:<div></div>As an assassin something to help with burst dps, maybe a haste buff or a chance to attack multiple targets would have been more appropriate.  In reality, youll actually be losing dps if you try to get teh most out of exacting so i would say its something like 3-5k at most.  Pretty helpfull for soloing though and still better then what some other classes got.Satinah/Satie, AB<div></div><p>Message Edited by Satie on <span class="date_text">04-05-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:02 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>1) I already stated I think it is usefull, just has to be used correctly and dont feel like reiderating<font color="#ff0000">What makes you think i was talking to you?</font>2) Honed reflexes is never replaced and 36% haste<font color="#ff0000">I am very aware of honed reflexes, was simply a suggestion. . . i would take some more haste over a couple of thousand extra damage out of exacting anyday. (not like its gonna happen, 'a suggestion' is the keyword)</font>3) We have a chance to attack multiple targets in AA, but I at least group with alot of mezzers and that would be a disaster<font color="#ff0000">I am not willing to sacrifice my single target dps in order to get some aoe AA.  At lvl70 you can pretty much masspull all the content exept epics and epics cant be mezzed, so yea. . . i would take some sort of aoe help over exacting anyday.  If theres a mezzer trying to mezz stuff that would be dead withing 10 sec otherwise, that mezzer wont last long around me.  (i have a high lvl chanter myself and mezzing is not all chanters do or should do lol)</font>4) If your using your 1 min ca's anyways how would you possibly be losing dps by casting exacting beforehand, not like the .4sec cast time is gunna kill you.<font color="#ff0000">Exactly, exacting is only usefull when you use the CAs 'anyway' thus ~3-5k and not close to 10k if you were only chaincasting effected CAs but coming out with lower dps at the end of the fight then if you hadnt bothered with exacting at all.</font></span></div><hr></blockquote></span></div><p>Message Edited by Satie on <span class="date_text">04-07-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:38 PM</span></p>

[MystaSkrat]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Satie wrote:<div></div><div><span><blockquote><div><span>2) Honed reflexes is never replaced and 36% haste<font color="#ff0000">I am very aware of honed reflexes, was simply a suggestion. . . i would take some more haste over a couple of thousand extra damage out of exacting anyday. (not like its gonna happen, 'a suggestion' is the keyword)</font></span></div><hr></blockquote>Sorry, with the right group make up, I can cap haste and dps mod both... I'd much rather have a skill that raises my CA damage above the cap it gets from STR.  Seems a lot of people don't like (or use) Exacting.. you're going to use those CAs anyway, why not have them doing more damage and refreshing faster?</span></div><hr></blockquote>

[Fahrenheig]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Satie wrote:<div></div><div><span><blockquote><hr>Fahrenheight wrote:<div><span><blockquote><hr>Satie wrote:<div></div>As an assassin something to help with burst dps, maybe a haste buff or a chance to attack multiple targets would have been more appropriate.  In reality, youll actually be losing dps if you try to get teh most out of exacting so i would say its something like 3-5k at most.  Pretty helpfull for soloing though and still better then what some other classes got.Satinah/Satie, AB<div></div><p>Message Edited by Satie on <span class="date_text">04-05-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:02 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>1) I already stated I think it is usefull, just has to be used correctly and dont feel like reiderating<font color="#ff0000">What makes you think i was talking to you?</font>2) Honed reflexes is never replaced and 36% haste<font color="#ff0000">I am very aware of honed reflexes, was simply a suggestion. . . i would take some more haste over a couple of thousand extra damage out of exacting anyday. (not like its gonna happen, 'a suggestion' is the keyword)</font>3) We have a chance to attack multiple targets in AA, but I at least group with alot of mezzers and that would be a disaster<font color="#ff0000">I am not willing to sacrifice my single target dps in order to get some aoe AA.  At lvl70 you can pretty much masspull all the content exept epics and epics cant be mezzed, so yea. . . i would take some sort of aoe help over exacting anyday.  If theres a mezzer trying to mezz stuff that would be dead withing 10 sec otherwise, that mezzer wont last long around me.  (i have a high lvl chanter myself and mezzing is not all chanters do or should do lol)</font>4) If your using your 1 min ca's anyways how would you possibly be losing dps by casting exacting beforehand, not like the .4sec cast time is gunna kill you.<font color="#ff0000">Exactly, exacting is only usefull when you use the CAs 'anyway' thus ~3-5k and not close to 10k if you were only chaincasting effected CAs but coming out with lower dps at the end of the fight then if you hadnt bothered with exacting at all.</font></span></div><hr></blockquote></span></div><p>Message Edited by Satie on <span class="date_text">04-07-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:38 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>wow..aight 1) this is a public thread [Removed for Content] 2) werd skratch 3) of course mezzing not all chanters do but its basically thier sig, and if you think you can roll into places like upper poa, or hof and just mass pull everything and have it dead in 10s anyway your really a [Removed for Content], so now the good idea is to hit em all up with a zerker o stance type of ability to bust up the mezz's and get the chanter killed, ideas gettin better and better. and 4) werd again skratch.....way to try and flame me and come out on top buddy</span></div>

[Satie]

<div><span><blockquote><hr />Fahrenheight wrote:<div><span><blockquote><hr />Satie wrote:<div><span><blockquote><hr />Fahrenheight wrote:<div><span><blockquote><hr />Satie wrote:As an assassin something to help with burst dps, maybe a haste buff or a chance to attack multiple targets would have been more appropriate. In reality, youll actually be losing dps if you try to get teh most out of exacting so i would say its something like 3-5k at most. Pretty helpfull for soloing though and still better then what some other classes got.Satinah/Satie, AB<p>Message Edited by Satie on <span class="date_text">04-05-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:02 PM</span></p><hr /></blockquote>1) I already stated I think it is usefull, just has to be used correctly and dont feel like reiderating<span style="color: #ff0000">What makes you think i was talking to you?</span>2) Honed reflexes is never replaced and 36% haste<span style="color: #ff0000">I am very aware of honed reflexes, was simply a suggestion. . . i would take some more haste over a couple of thousand extra damage out of exacting anyday. (not like its gonna happen, 'a suggestion' is the keyword)</span>3) We have a chance to attack multiple targets in AA, but I at least group with alot of mezzers and that would be a disaster<span style="color: #ff0000">I am not willing to sacrifice my single target dps in order to get some aoe AA. At lvl70 you can pretty much masspull all the content exept epics and epics cant be mezzed, so yea. . . i would take some sort of aoe help over exacting anyday. If theres a mezzer trying to mezz stuff that would be dead withing 10 sec otherwise, that mezzer wont last long around me. (i have a high lvl chanter myself and mezzing is not all chanters do or should do lol)</span>4) If your using your 1 min ca's anyways how would you possibly be losing dps by casting exacting beforehand, not like the .4sec cast time is gunna kill you.<span style="color: #ff0000">Exactly, exacting is only usefull when you use the CAs 'anyway' thus ~3-5k and not close to 10k if you were only chaincasting effected CAs but coming out with lower dps at the end of the fight then if you hadnt bothered with exacting at all.</span></span></div><hr /></blockquote></span></div><p>Message Edited by Satie on <span class="date_text">04-07-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:38 PM</span></p><hr /></blockquote>wow..aight 1) this is a public thread [Removed for Content] 2) werd skratch 3) of course mezzing not all chanters do but its basically thier sig, and if you think you can roll into places like upper poa, or hof and just mass pull everything and have it dead in 10s anyway your really a [Removed for Content], so now the good idea is to hit em all up with a zerker o stance type of ability to bust up the mezz's and get the chanter killed, ideas gettin better and better. and 4) werd again skratch.....way to try and flame me and come out on top buddy</span></div><hr /></blockquote>1) Touchy touchy 2) ? 3) Assuming things again? 'pretty much' does not mean 'all' and yes, even in upper poa and hof we masspull (2-3 encounters) every day unless its the harder ^^^ with knock backs etc. 4) You are more then welcome to take it as a flame if you like to, but i suggest reading posts twice before you do so.</span></div>

[Satie]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>MystaSkratch wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>Satie wrote:<div></div><div><span><blockquote><div><span>2) Honed reflexes is never replaced and 36% haste<font color="#ff0000">I am very aware of honed reflexes, was simply a suggestion. . . i would take some more haste over a couple of thousand extra damage out of exacting anyday. (not like its gonna happen, 'a suggestion' is the keyword)</font></span></div><hr></blockquote>Sorry, with the right group make up, I can cap haste and dps mod both... I'd much rather have a skill that raises my CA damage above the cap it gets from STR.  Seems a lot of people don't like (or use) Exacting.. you're going to use those CAs anyway, why not have them doing more damage and refreshing faster?</span></div><hr></blockquote>Illusionists are a dime a dozen though <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.  I am very jelous you can get that group setup.  You sort of want the troub with casters and some dps buffs for the monks and zerkers.  Basically, IMO its not very practical putting all the haste buffers in the same group just because the assassin is short on haste.T6 ancient teachings:Apply poison: Hate/damage for tank.Concealment: Allows us to unload all stealth attacks at easeFinishing blow:  does severe amount of damage when under 20% and fast recast.T7 ancient teachings:Exacting:  Some damage and something to keep us busy when all timers are down?  I already have a bow to fill the downtime with.Its still better then what some other classes got.  I dont have a problem doing dps and its not about not liking or using it.  Its simply not very usefull IMHO.<hr></blockquote></span></div>

[EtoilePirate]

I actually just got the Adept I Exacting in a chest today.  Had forgotten it even existed in the game at all, but as I was 75% of the way thtough 65 at the time it was well-placed. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />It came in fairly useful in the insane amount of dungeon-crawling we did today.  (An ambitious group of six, only two of whom were level 70, wanted to see if we could do the class hats quest in a single day.  For the record, we came close, but three of our number had to call it a night after our 4th wipe to Sothis, alas.)  In Halls of Fate, certain protracted fights, or fights with adds, or fights where much of the group was low on power, that boost came in handy.  Masked Attack + Puncture Blade is an efficient, low-power combination, as we all know, and with a damage boost and a drop to 7.5ish seconds recast, I was able to help more than I otherwise would have been.Totally not worth a moonstone, though.  Not until everything else has been upgraded, anyway.<div></div>