View Full Version : So how about you teach us some stuff...

03-07-2005, 07:39 PM
<DIV>So half of us are beating ourselves up about how bad we suck as a class now and the other half is still tickled pink about being a troub...</DIV> <DIV>Personally I still enjoy it, but I am a bit frustrated about my effectiveness, groups do tell me i make a difference which makes me feel good, but my solo experience really has gone into the crapper...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Half of the posts I read are people saying they have no problem with green ^^ mobs and the others (myself included) find ourselves consistenly in the weeds against them...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What are we doing wrong?  Specifically... not "make sure all your buffs are up and use your HO's"  can you talented individuals help us out with specifics?  I'm 25 and here's what i use buff-wise (all my buffs are App4 or Ad1)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Raxxyl's Energizing Harmony</DIV> <DIV>Rousing Tune</DIV> <DIV>Bria's Stirring Ballad</DIV> <DIV>Aria of Excitement</DIV> <DIV>Performer's Talent (only app2 can't find any others... but takes no conc so im not concerned)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That leaves me 1 conc slot that i use for Reproaching Discante</DIV> <DIV>I typically hit them with a ranged (Singing Shot or Belious') and then sing the reproaching and start an HO with Lore's Snapping Sonnet.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The buffs I have that I'm not using are my 2 conc slot buffs Songster's Luck and Merciless Melody...</DIV> <DIV>Arcane Chorus is only for use against magic users right?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Should I be using Songster's?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Maybe the more successful troub can help some of us that are struggling...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh forgot to list my gear.  I wear all AQ armor except for my bracers which i got from the artifact quest in Stormhold ( I recommend that one, easyish to complete in a good group and better than the AQ bracers)  All my jewelry is white or above and I wield twin steel stillettos...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Longspoon</DIV> <DIV>Kerra Troubador</DIV> <DIV>Nektulos</DIV><p>Message Edited by Longspoon on <span class=date_text>03-07-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:53 AM</span>

03-07-2005, 09:26 PM
:smileyvery-happy:Nice one :smileyhappy: I'd be interested getting advice for past level 40 myself.Personally can't give you any as I had closed in to end thirties as the revamp was implemented.What I can say is that medium armor mitigation stinks, sorry. If I get hit, that plenty with all the changes, I get hit darn hard.But yes, I do love being a Troubador and I look forward to getting some needed adjustments to the class :smileywink:

03-07-2005, 09:39 PM
<DIV>Lvl 27 here using pretty much the same tactics.  Also lousy results.   Swapping songs out doesn't seem to make much difference at all; I'm just not very effective.  Please help Longspoon and me!!!  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

03-07-2005, 10:32 PM
Ok, lvl 28 troub here, I can solo a reasonable amount of time & the key tactic as a troubador is to buff defense. Nothing else appears to improve my chances. In general this means:-songsters luck (adds 4-5 to your defense skill....best song we have)-rousing tune for agi/str/sta (or the lvl 20 training upgrade)-raxxyls for agi/str/sta-Arcane Chorus for casters (I'll swap this to a dmg increaser for melee mobs)-performers talent +agi (or the upgrade elises ditty if you have it)-insatiable ardor for +parry-a shield! (often makes a huge difference in the rate I take damage)Songster-luck adds to your defense skill, this is the primary attribute that effects a mob's ability to hit you, 5 points of defense is the equivelant of being one level higher. High agility also makes a huge difference, we can stack agi upgrades and once we do life gets much much nicer against the right mob. Also do not mock the shield, it provides another way to avoid damage (blocking) while boosting your AC. You also have to pick your targets. I find a group of green-heroic mobs are easier to tackle than a single green-heroic mob. Its primarily because the individuals in the group have a lower chance to hit & are easier to dodge, while a single mob that con's the same as the group never misses (has a higher personal attack value to make him equal to the group) I also love caster mobs because we have magic-resist buffs & power-drains sprinkled throughout our songs. In general you just have to pick your targets, all mobs of-a-con are not created equal.Our haste-songs suck, very limited times when you can use em...definetly not something when you are trying to solo a tough encounter. Have you noticed that when you use combat-art that the CA & both your weapons hit at the same time? This is because weapons are delayed until the CA is done....increasing the weapon-delay by the duration of the CA. So who cares if the haste song reduced a weapon delay from 1.2 to 1.0....if that weapon has to wait 2 seconds for a song to finish then you've lost all benefits of the haste song, in that situation your weapon has a delay of 3 seconds....without the haste it would be 3.2 seconds. The only time to use the haste-song is when you aren't using CA's, typically when stretching power to attack many mobs in a short period of time (ie hunting crabs)In the low 20s (24ish) I could solo the gnoll-camp in NW TS, but I couldn't take out solo mobs (griffs) that conn'd the same as that group. But since my defense was all aovidance it was like a light switch, at lvl 23 I couldn't go near the group, at lvl 24 they couldn't touch me (mighta been lvl24 & lvl 25...but you get the idea)Right now I can solo the yellow & some orange non-heroic orcs in zek, but only if I have all my defenseive buffs up. If I try for all offensive buffs I go down very very quickly.*** changed rousing-tune to arcane-chorus...very stupid mistake ****<p>Message Edited by Jarkun on <span class=date_text>03-07-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:12 PM</span>

03-07-2005, 10:56 PM
<DIV>Songster's Luck / Minstral's Fortune made the difference for me to be able to solo green++ critters.  Mind you, these were green++ that were the minimum level to still be green.  Particularly with the latter, adding five points to your offensive and defensive stats (the base stats), you essentially become one level higher than you actually are.  With the stat boosting songs also going, my AGI is normally high enough that anything grey will usually miss me (I think AGI is at about 100 unbuffed).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Another thing that I'll do is to begin siphoning the monster's power early in the fight via Swindle Essence and the special attacks that have a power draining component.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So, we now have a green++ monster, with no power that <EM>should</EM> rarely be able to hit you!</DIV>

03-07-2005, 11:51 PM
<DIV>"-rousing celebration for casters (I'll swap this to a dmg increaser for melee mobs)"</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>wait, isnt rousing celebration our fluff song???  does it have an actual use???</DIV> <DIV>I can only assume you meant Arcane Chorus and what dmg increaser are you referring to?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ok so by what yall are saying I should be using Songster's Luck...</DIV> <DIV>Here's the pickle, I then have 1 slot available for either...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Bria's Ballad (stirring or thrilling)</DIV> <DIV>Aria of Excitement</DIV> <DIV>Reproaching Discante</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm pretty confident about dropping the Aria, but I do notice a difference with the other two in use...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is helpful I appreciate this advice...</DIV>

03-08-2005, 12:09 AM
<DIV>Hello, this is my experience. I cant really help you with the songs names for i am 50 and i dont know the names sorry.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Forget bria, proc songs, and the group debuff song. Proc songs give you 5% chance to proc 100 dmg, kina useless. Bria, you dont even see any [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing difference, forget this song unless it's patched.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The big stuff :</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Skill songs : the +4-5-6 ... piercing, defense, parrying. </DIV> <DIV>Stat songs : Try to "stack" them, they become good when you have 2-3 of them together. </DIV> <DIV>Dot song : good when killing groups</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Use always Haste song : Not really good, use it only if skill / stats song dont take your 5 slots.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Use your self buffs : Attack and defense. Buy good arrows, start with the 2 shots skill, and chain OH. Dont forget to debuff before using the mental spells. If you want, you can attack off / stun / go behind and backstab.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Remember :</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Troub shine from lvl 30 to 50 (but they are boring in my opinion).</DIV> <DIV> You need adept 1 songs at least.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Daerron on <span class=date_text>03-07-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:11 AM</span>

03-08-2005, 01:53 AM
Jarkun's post was particularly good, I think. Songster's/Minstrel's is a great song for soloing, and shields are your buddy. Don't know what he was referring to when he mentioned rousing celebration, but it doesn't really effect your solo song choices.I'd like to add that Performer's Talent and Elise's Ditty stack, if you weren't already aware. Performer's stacks with anything from that line.He also mentioned the level 20 training, and I think this should be touched upon. In the endgame, you'll want every single statbuff song available to you; the ability to boost your group's str, agi, and sta by 150 or more is priceless. Generally you will sacrifice the least of them (about a 30 point buff) for something else (I generally go with the vhalen's damage proc as it hits for around 170 and includes a chance to interrupt), but for the MT in a raid every point counts.Also, I'd like to strongly disagree with Daerron's assertion that Bria's is a largely useless line. If you are not using it in groups you are hindering your group's performance, period. Further, its effect upon you while soloing is unsubtle, IMO. Troubs take a while to finish off heroic encounters by themselves, and every little bit of extra power regen while you're fighting cuts your downtime between encounters.I'm glad he mentioned the stun/attack off/flank attack method, though. Most people use this, but just to be sure: you can use Cheap Shot on a mob, turn off attack while it charges, and dash behind them for a quick flank attack. It's not a lot of extra dps, but every little bit counts. ^_^Good luck with your bard, and I hope you aren't forced to solo too often. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

03-08-2005, 02:19 AM
didn't even think to try stacking performers & elises...gonna try that out asapwhen fighting non-casters I'll swap arcane-chorus for the dmg-proc, mana-regen or debuff, in a group I'll save that slot if I think I might need charm as a pocket-mez/agro-generator (if no-tank & I'm supposed to hold mobs off of casters for example) but honestly can't say I've noticed a difference in which one has the best effect on winning faster and/or reducing downtime. I have noticed that if any of the spells used in my first 4 concentration slots drops that the fight dynamics....change for the worse <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

03-08-2005, 04:51 AM
One thing that came up in the Monk forum that might make a difference is the realization that facing matters... a lot! You only get your parry/deflect/block against opponents that are within a 120 degree arc in front of you. Mobs automatically try to flank you and so you wind up taking a lot more damage from the ones that are to your sides.There is a technique you can use that is supposed to line them up in front of you so that you get full defense against them all. It involves rotating to one side and then side stepping. I don't think I've mastered this yet as I've had it work one time and then the next time I tried it they kept moving to flank me again.Anyway, I hope this helps. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

03-08-2005, 06:59 AM
I do a lot of tanking with my lvl 28 (gnome), and often surprise myself how much i can take a beating. My hint is in a group be aware of how affective Archane Chorus is if you your tank is very badly hurt... this tune is a brilliant Taunt for us to use. I give you this example... the other day myself and a tank were fighting Octopus in TS due to some reason as we started the fight allmy buffs disppeared... the tank took some heavy damage 2/3's worth, i quickly buffed again.. and i knew that i could make a big dent in this stupid mob. So i use Archane Chorus STRAIGHT AWAY the mob came for me and the fight was on, i was lucky that the tank i was with my smart enough not to use his taunts to get the mob off me. I tanked the mob while the real tank was basicaly hitting him from behind do enough damage but allowing me to take the beating but the time my power was gone, the tanks health was back into yellow and he taunted and finished off the mob.My point is if you see a group member about to die dont just think the tank will taunt the mob. the world isnt that perfect.. use this spell because it may buy tank time enough. I know i use this tactic almost everyday. once the taunt off the mob is complete right click and cancel the spell freeing up another slot

03-08-2005, 08:09 AM
this 1 is easy. go for the agi debuff. it lasts 10 mins, longer than the fight will, you can cast brias after taht.a 5% proc attack using up 1 conc slot isnt worth it in a solo situation; especially when most other buffs you have are non proc, does what it says on the tin- type spells.rousing tune btw - only adds AC not agi. I tested this today. still worthwhile imoat 22 im soloing scarecrows with ease.songsters, discante, rousing tune and callindras (as well as performers talent - also adds to AC)eating quality food/drink will make a big difference to your regen.I'm using 2x pristine carbonite leafblades, all pristine chainmail crafted except bracers of thunder; jewellery is mostly grey/blue <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> except for 2x fashioned (non prist) gold bangles for +agialso.. soloing a single mob rather than 2-3 will make a big difference, despite arrows up <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />hope this helps you, i'm young in the troub world, but this is what is working for me atm...

03-08-2005, 06:59 PM
<DIV>Ok so last night I went and bought an emblazoned round shield and dusted off my Arrell's sword of song...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I sang Raxxyl's, Rousing Tune, Songster's, Performer's talent and attacked Chiptooth...</DIV> <DIV>He was level 21 green ^^ and it took him many swings before he even hit me...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I was pleased... only wish he'd given me some loot...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Next i went to TS and attacked an unearthed villager level 22 green ^^ in the riverbed behind Thundermist Village...</DIV> <DIV>Same setup...</DIV> <DIV>I got worked... twice...</DIV> <DIV>During the second fight I realized the problem, magic.  I didnt sing Arcane Chorus... and I got owned...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So all in all I'd say I had a better experience last night though I will be doing some more testing...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And since my Arcane Chorus is only app1 and i cant seem to ever find any upgrades on the broker, I'll be staying away from casters for a while...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>thanks yall...</DIV>

03-08-2005, 11:20 PM
<DIV>At lvl 49, I am able to solo stuff that is 43-44 ^^ (green) with ease (unless it is a wizard/warlock) and some 45 ^^ because of the defense songs.  I went and soloed the big eye in runnyeye (one of the reasons i havent lvled to 50 is because i dont want some of these named turning grey).  In my opinion, we are probably one of the best soloers in this game... just have to know what you are doing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>+Stat buff series is still good (more power, more hp, not as much dmg/avoidance as before but still a boost)</DIV> <DIV>+Defense songs (swan song, niv's song of fortune) are amazing... raising defense and offensive abilities by 9 is almost a 2 lvl boost.</DIV> <DIV>+Parry song (the last in the series, which unfortunately i must say is bugged in a GOOD way, makes me at 49 have the defense of a lvl 55)</DIV> <DIV>+Power song (well, they blow and need to be strengthened... but for all groups know they are awesome and just play it to make them happy)</DIV> <DIV>+Haste songs (not bad, invigorating opus raises defense and agility also, so this makes things even easier)</DIV> <DIV>+HP regen (I actually found a use for this song amazingly.. it is good on very very long solo fights (think 10 min+ fights) where the npc might hit you once out of every 50 hits.. and when they do hit it hurts, but with this song you can regen it all back)</DIV> <DIV>+agi/dps song (Amazing song, that is if they fix it so it doesnt drain power like crazy... but still good even broken)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I rarely, if ever, use the proc songs... I feel a minor boost in defense, hp, power, haste all come before a small increase in damage.</DIV> <DIV>Resist songs are horrible in my opinion, resists do nothing.</DIV> <DIV>Charm is bad.</DIV> <DIV>Discante line is worthless, str/agi debuff barely effects npcs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Equipment is a big factor (PGT is an amazing weapon if you use it to it's full potential, raise that AC up as high as possible and good luck)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Anyway, Troubadors are probably the class that should be furthest from a solo class.. but in fact we are really good.  It is rough at the start, but as the songs get more abilities as the songs progress down the line, things become much better.</DIV>

03-09-2005, 12:05 AM
<DIV>I prefer the slow and Sure method Stat buff, Haste and Swan Song for extra 2 levels in defense. Couple with a shield and power drain to remove the specials I can take out just about any green^^ that I see as long as it's not those damned wizard mobs <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Make sure you have good food and drink, and your armor should all be the best you can find for your level. I have been solo'ing these mobs almost all level's except 46 when they changed the level spread and took away my lowest level of greens, it came back at 48 but I had already adjusted just watch out for casters and drain that power.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Darkmane 49th Troubador of Permafrost</DIV>

03-09-2005, 03:11 AM
There are two different kinds of green mobs. One's that are 3 levels below you, and ones that are 4 levels below you. Very common misconception.

03-11-2005, 04:24 AM
defense is the way to go. get defense as high as you can (swan song at master1 should grant defense +10), add some agi, good armor, maybe a shield and you're able to eventually win against a green++ mob.and don't forget the short duration parry buff. +21 parry for 30 seconds makes you invulnerable to nearly every mob (yellow con ++ have no chance to hit you. even some raidmobs can't land a hit). 30 seconds is enough time to recast some buffs... or run ^^

03-11-2005, 01:24 PM
An fyi I don't think I have seen it posted, or if it was my drunkness has passed over it. Regarding getting beaten to a pulp, how to fix this, get your AC over 7k ASAP.I really can't tell you what the exact % of damage mitigation there is but it is visably large for scouts.Example on nameds or lvl 50 ^^ mobs, normally I would take around 1000-1400 depending on what type of mob it was, after my AC reached 7200 ish, it went to 600 ish to high 900's. I have been camping nameds and tanking them lately and have no issues at all, except lower hp's then a tank. In some situations can exceed a tank's tank-ability *only seems to work on caster mobs with personal resists*I know people may disagree with me, but if you ask anyone I know they will tell you the same theory, especially my cleric <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><p>Message Edited by Nobolis on <span class=date_text>03-11-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:26 AM</span>

03-11-2005, 04:54 PM
<DIV><FONT size=2>As has already been said, don't underestimate shields! I no longer risk taking on yellow, white and even blue solo mobs with my DW weapons, trying to kill them before they kill me. Much easier to buff up (at 36 I use Minstrels, Niv's, Performers Talent, Elise's if neccesary, Arcane/2nd stat buff depending on encounter, and last spot for Kian's or Discouraging Discante depending), use a good 1h and shield, buff your parry, drain their power if required and soak up their hits. After that, I normally have more than enough power to hit HO's and specials that will take down yellow solos and green heroics (some green heroics are quite impossible of course).If you are going to use your specials to kill it you may as well be using 1h anyway, as you won't be spending much time doing melee damage.</FONT></DIV>