Brigand V Swashbuckler

[Azmeire]

<DIV><FONT color=#ff0000>Hey everyone.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ff0000>Just wanted to know what defines a brigand, and that compared to a swashbuckler... swashbucklers in my eyes look like they have awsome evades? but brigands have awsome stuns/roots?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ff0000>Anyway, any inoput will be helpful, thanks.</FONT></DIV>

[Jida]

<div><blockquote><hr>Azmeire wrote:<div><font color="#ff0000">Hey everyone.</font></div> <div><font color="#ff0000">Just wanted to know what defines a brigand, and that compared to a swashbuckler... swashbucklers in my eyes look like they have awsome evades? but brigands have awsome stuns/roots?</font></div> <div><font color="#ff0000">Anyway, any inoput will be helpful, thanks.</font></div><hr></blockquote><a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=34&message.id=10893&jump=true" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=34&message.id=10893&jump=true</a>One of the many posts regarding.Search is your friend =))</div>

[The-Fourm-Pirate]

<DIV>Swashbucklers beat Brigands in every concievable way. Brigands are a broken class and Swashbucklers are the greatest, them or Assassins.</DIV>

[DaLurk]

<div><blockquote><hr>Jida wrote:<div><a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=34&message.id=10893&jump=true" target="_blank">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=34&message.id=10893&jump=true</a>One of the many posts regarding.Search is your friend =))</div><hr></blockquote>I had to bring back that one too <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=34&message.id=6555" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=34&message.id=6555</a></div>

[Big Da]

<DIV>Anyone else read the title for this and think ... oh dear this isnt going to be pretty? :smileywink:</DIV>

[Jida]

<div><blockquote><hr>Big Dave wrote:<div>Anyone else read the title for this and think ... oh dear this isnt going to be pretty? :smileywink:</div><hr></blockquote>/raises hand.. ME ME ME!!</div>

[Carna]

<P>The pat answer is... Brigand heals suck... Swashies nukes rock... go Swashie.</P> <P>A more serious answer is... we avoid getting drawn on this topic in an overly direct way, as it's not productive for the broader Rogue community.</P> <P>Swashbucklers have an advantage in AE combat, have hate transfer and a mez. Brigands have an advantage in single target combat, have arguably stronger debuffs and stuns.</P> <P>If you group more than raid it's my opninion that the Swashies advantages might be interesting for you. If you raid as a primary concern, the Brigands debuffs might be of interest to you.</P> <P>Noting your sig... Brigand debuffs only get interesting in the 50s. Until then Swashbuckler debuffs may well be superior as Brigands don't debuff physical mitigation at all until the 50s.</P>

[Shiverr]

<P>Dont make the swashbuckler mistake.  I've never been "right" since.  Go <FONT color=#ffff99>Brigand</FONT> FTW!!</P> <P> </P>

[ag]

Yarr, all Brigands should betray to Swashbucklers. Go Swashes! Buckle buckle!

[AegisCrown]

<div></div>go brigand they beat swashbucklers, better yet go assassin<div></div><p>Message Edited by AegisCrown on <span class=date_text>06-28-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:40 PM</span>

[Azmeire]

<FONT color=#ff0000>Hehe, ive got a lvl 59 brigand on Nagafen server so from what I hear I might stick with him... I just have my sig the way it is cause I cant be bothered to change it</FONT>

[Jeffmaster]

<P>once again...the never ending battle....</P> <P>listen and listen closely..........all caracters in the game equal out....each has its own advantages depending on your play style....its like you ask which is better between a wiz or warlock....or conj or necro......can you really answer to the question..people all preach for their caracter because they have chosen the one they liked the most...</P> <P>brigand is more solo target.....swash is more aoe....both are fun to play depending on what you like</P> <P> </P> <P>end of discussion.....next thread please</P>

[Sack]

<P>      I could care less about DPS all I want to know is whether the Brig. and Swashy have have the same ability to absorb damage. The Swashy's full frontal attacks without have to stealth and AoE's would be perfect for my fo my playstyle, however, I don't wanna have a glass jaw.</P> <P>Very simply put if I stood still and took damage with all varibles being the same which would go down first?</P>

[Jeffmaster]

swash

[1dollarMox]

<DIV>LOL are u people high... brigs pown swashys 9 out of 10 time. for sure</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Dispatch, Deviatalize, Dead</DIV>

[skidmark]

<div><blockquote><hr>Sack wrote:<div></div> <p>      I could care less about DPS all I want to know is whether the Brig. and Swashy have have the same ability to absorb damage. The Swashy's full frontal attacks without have to stealth and AoE's would be perfect for my fo my playstyle, however, I don't wanna have a glass jaw.</p> <p>Very simply put if I stood still and took damage with all varibles being the same which would go down first?</p><hr></blockquote>All things being equal the Brigand can stand up to more damage because their self-buff buffs mitigation. With a Master version of your appropriate level it is like having a Plate Breastplate on top of your chain armor.</div>

[Shidonya]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> 1dollarMox wrote:<BR> <DIV>LOL are u people high... brigs pown swashys 9 out of 10 time. for sure</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Dispatch, Deviatalize, Dead</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>hehehehe...someone seems a bit unfamiliar with the kind of banter the brigand community brings to the table....It's all about deception. </P> <P>Will Turner "You cheated!!!"</P> <P>Jack Sparrow With a look of DUH!! on his face "Pirate!"</P>

[Dak]

<DIV>Brigands are USALLY > Swashies in PvP.  I play a 70 swash on Nagafen and find it extremely hard to kill a brigand, even if I get the jump.  AoE's and mezzes don't help me out there.  Dispatch + Debilitate + Double Up = DEAD SWASH</DIV>

[Jeffmaster]

I agree with that! Brig have incredible single target DAM

[Rokjin]

<P>Brigands are very good in 1 on 1 PvP. However after they take out one person, they are pretty much sitting ducks due to timers. Swashbucklers can't deliver as much upfront damage, but give out a lot more AoE damage, which is useful in groups.</P> <P>Overall, it's just a matter of how damage is distributed. One on one, Brigand wins (once a minute), group vs group, Swashbuckler wins due to AoEs and Hurricane.</P>

[Sack]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Rokjin wrote:<BR> <P>Brigands are very good in 1 on 1 PvP. However after they take out one person, they are pretty much sitting ducks due to timers. Swashbucklers can't deliver as much upfront damage, but give out a lot more AoE damage, which is useful in groups.</P> <P>Overall, it's just a matter of how damage is distributed. One on one, Brigand wins (once a minute), group vs group, Swashbuckler wins due to AoEs and Hurricane.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Alright this is a person who has both classe at a high level (see sig.) and therefore appears to be qulified to rate the two Rouges. His/Her answer sums it up perfectly. If you can't choose from this then play something else. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>On paper it looks as though the Brig. has higher DPS however if you take into account the longer recast times ...</P> <P>If u wanna Solo PvP (which rarely happens, most ppl travel with at least one friend) and some Raid, go Brigand</P> <P>If you wanna solo PvE, Group PvP, Group PvE, and Raid, go Swashbuckler (Oh and En Garde makes you a Bruiser/Monk ganker) <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>So as said many times before it all boils down to individule play-style and the only way to find out which one suits you is to roll both and play them. I alternate days and it works out well cause I always have vitality. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P>

[kyth]

<div><blockquote><hr>Sack wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Rokjin wrote: <div></div> <p>Brigands are very good in 1 on 1 PvP. However after they take out one person, they are pretty much sitting ducks due to timers. Swashbucklers can't deliver as much upfront damage, but give out a lot more AoE damage, which is useful in groups.</p> <p>Overall, it's just a matter of how damage is distributed. One on one, Brigand wins (once a minute), group vs group, Swashbuckler wins due to AoEs and Hurricane.</p> <hr> </blockquote> <p>Alright this is a person who has both classe at a high level (see sig.) and therefore appears to be qulified to rate the two Rouges. His/Her answer sums it up perfectly. If you can't choose from this then play something else. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p> <p>On paper it looks as though the Brig. has higher DPS however if you take into account the longer recast times ...</p> <p>If u wanna Solo PvP (which rarely happens, most ppl travel with at least one friend) and some Raid, go Brigand</p> <p>If you wanna solo PvE, Group PvP, Group PvE, and Raid, go Swashbuckler (Oh and En Garde makes you a Bruiser/Monk ganker) <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p> <p>So as said many times before it all boils down to individule play-style and the only way to find out which one suits you is to roll both and play them. I alternate days and it works out well cause I always have vitality. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><hr></blockquote>Actually Brigands only win out on single targets.  Swash win out with multi mob encounters.I dont get it why you would say "If you wanna solo PvE, Group PvP, Group PvE, and Raid, go Swashbuckler (Oh and En Garde makes you a Bruiser/Monk ganker) <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />"  At lvl 70 brigands can solo pve better.  A lot of pvp groups love brigands.  Raid, well every raiding guilds has/wants a brigand probably more so then a swash.  Both classes have their plus sides.  Being a brigand i am biased to say that brigands are by far the better class.  Stuns, debuffs, snares, AR, and all the other tools brigands get are awsome.  Swash on the other hand have hurricane, agro xfer, and to me thats about it.Oh and i kill most swash's in less then 10 seconds in duels.</div>

[Shidonya]

Wow Kyth. just noticed the sig. no more FoH?

[Trollb]

<DIV>i got both. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As of 3 months ago, the swash simply sucked... not in pve, but pvp too. Brigand on the other hand- was a better overall tank, better overall rogue, and the master trainable stun basically put it over the top. No stopping him, and no limits. Just to be a proper assman, I rolled as ogre and chose tank racials... just in case anyone ever wanted me to tank, which I did a few times... the real problem wasnt taking hits... it is using taunts effectively enough to not get people killed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My swash on the other hand, couldnt touch the same dps, couldnt tank nearly as good, and the AOE can actually be a liability for getting unwanted adds... or breaking mezzes when in group PVP. The mezz however, is a great getaway or put someone out of commission for a while.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>That said, I only renewed since 3 months ago. So alot could have changed. Ill check back and give my opinion then too.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Trollboy on <span class=date_text>08-12-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:46 AM</span>

[Rokjin]

<P>Brigands are signifcantly better at single target damage.. I mean there is really nothing to compete with Dispatch, Surprise Attack and Double Up along with Restrain to keep your target vulnerable to your back attacks.</P> <P>That said, Hurricane + Inspiration absolutely devestates entire groups which is great for group PvP if your tank provides a distraction. </P> <P>Soloing, Brigand is better just because the tough fights aren't really groups, and the ones that are, you can kill one off then shake aggro, then come back and repeat.</P> <P>Brigands are better at burst damage and debuffing offense. Swashbucklers are much better at sustained damage (Bravado line, which is pretty much a non-stop 58% haste if you aren't getting hit) and at debuffing defense, which makes a big difference for the tank. Lung Puncture is -50 to all offensive skills, which makes a big difference in damage output from the monster.</P> <P>Swashbucklers are a bit weaker overall then Brigands I'd say mainly because Hail of Steel (one of our Ancients) is pretty much useless. At end-game it deals less damage then just ranged auto-attack.</P> <P>So at 52, Brigs get Amazing Reflexes, Swashies get Hurricane. One avoids AOE damage, the other deals it</P> <P>At 55, Brigs get Dispatch, Swashies get Hail of Steel, One debuffs defense tremendously, the other gets a really weak ranged attack that costs power and stuns</P> <P>At 58, Brigs get Double Up, Swashies get Lung Puncture, one is a great offense tool to increase damage, the other is a large offense debuff.</P> <P>You can see where there is a bit of a difference. Dispatch has a counterpart in Lung Puncture, Amazing Reflexes has a counterpart in Hurricane, but Double Up doesn't really have a counterpart because Hail of Steel sucks [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]. If Hail of Steel gets changed (unlikely) it should probably become some sort of utility or defensive ability. Perhaps some way to shorten the 3 minute Inspiration timer down to a minute or something once in a while, since it sucks that Brigands have all their big damage on one minute timers while Swashies have it on three.<BR></P>

[kyth]

<div><blockquote><hr>Shidonya wrote:<div></div>Wow Kyth. just noticed the sig. no more FoH?<hr></blockquote>yeap i removed myself from that guild.</div>