Max DPS

[LiquidFusion17]

<DIV>Just wondering...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Whats going to give me more dps for raiding,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wis - 4 5 4 8 8 --- Str 4 4 4 8</DIV> <DIV> or</DIV> <DIV>Wis 4 5 4 8 --- Agi 4 4 4 8 8</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>buddy of mine has lower one and [Removed for Content] the parse.... but then again he has a better 1h, still working on getting mine. He said to use a 1.6 delay wep otherwise sailwind will mess up damage....</DIV><p>Message Edited by LiquidFusion17 on <span class=date_text>11-04-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:37 PM</span>

[sobek_eq2]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LiquidFusion17 wrote:<BR> <DIV>Just wondering...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Whats going to give me more dps for raiding,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wis - 4 5 4 8 8 --- Str 4 4 4 8</DIV> <DIV> or</DIV> <DIV>Wis 4 5 4 8 --- Agi 4 4 4 8 8</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>buddy of mine has lower one and [Removed for Content] the parse.... but then again he has a better 1h, still working on getting mine. He said to use a 1.6 delay wep otherwise sailwind will mess up damage....</DIV> <P>Message Edited by LiquidFusion17 on <SPAN class=date_text>11-04-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>06:37 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Wis/Str -> it's better damage in a good dps group and traumatic swipe is the best raiding skill in the rogue AA line. Also, a 2.0 delay 1H weapon is better than a 1.6 delay weapon at 100% haste.</P> <P> </P><p>Message Edited by sobek_eq2 on <span class=date_text>11-04-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:48 PM</span>

[LiquidFusion17]

Hmm ok... guild suggest i dont use torp strike they said it messes up the timers and bugs mobs.... know anything?<BR>

[Keldo]

It doesn't and if your timer can't add 50% to timers and call it fire them and get someone else, not to mention there's a total of 3 fights where you actually need to dodge.<div></div>

[sobek_eq2]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LiquidFusion17 wrote:<BR> Hmm ok... guild suggest i dont use torp strike they said it messes up the timers and bugs mobs.... know anything?<BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>ACT has timers that will take traumatic swipe into account for timing AAs.</P> <P> </P>

[A 12 Gauge 007]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> sobek_eq2 wrote:<BR> <BR> <P><BR> Also, a 2.0 delay 1H weapon is better than a 1.6 delay weapon at 100% haste.</P> <P> </P> <P>Message Edited by sobek_eq2 on <SPAN class=date_text>11-04-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>06:48 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>How did you come up with this?? The best weapon CURRENTLY for a wis spec swashy is 1.4 delay. The minimum delay is .7 thats the best delay possible. At 100% haste a 1.4 delay weapon is .7. Is a 1.4 weapon better then a 2.0 weapon.. if you take Inspiration out of the equation no its not.. but at max haste the 1.4 will be .7 and the 2.0 will be 1.0 which means you will get more blows per inspiration with a 1.4.</P> <P>Now after the expansion goes through the haste cap is said to be 125% so on paper the best weapon will be 1.8 delay. 1.4 delay weapons will see no benifit from the new haste cap. Unless of course the lower the minimum delay. </P> <P>/weaponstats is your friend</P>

[Luk]

<div><blockquote><hr>A 12 Gauge 007 wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> sobek_eq2 wrote: <div></div> <div></div> <p> Also, a 2.0 delay 1H weapon is better than a 1.6 delay weapon at 100% haste.</p> <p>Message Edited by sobek_eq2 on <span class="date_text">11-04-2006</span> <span class="time_text">06:48 PM</span> </p><hr> </blockquote> <p>How did you come up with this?? The best weapon CURRENTLY for a wis spec swashy is 1.4 delay. The minimum delay is .7 thats the best delay possible. At 100% haste a 1.4 delay weapon is .7. Is a 1.4 weapon better then a 2.0 weapon.. if you take Inspiration out of the equation no its not.. but at max haste the 1.4 will be .7 and the 2.0 will be 1.0 which means you will get more blows per inspiration with a 1.4.</p> <p>Now after the expansion goes through the haste cap is said to be 125% so on paper the best weapon will be 1.8 delay. 1.4 delay weapons will see no benifit from the new haste cap. Unless of course the lower the minimum delay. </p> <p>/weaponstats is your friend</p><hr></blockquote>100% haste that a swashy can easily attain means a 2 second delay weapon will auto attack every 1 second, therefore there is no waste or waiting and your auto attack will hit exactly between each CA used in a chain.</div>

[A 12 Gauge 007]

Sorry that just makes no sense to me... lets assume that 1.0 is the perfect delay to time an auto attack between every CA. Like you said you do one auto attack every second. Well with a .7 delay you would do 1 auto attack every less then a second so it would be more likely the your auto attack would be waiting for your CA to finish casting rather then perfectly timed with the 1.0 delay. Either way this is DEFINATELY looking WAY too deep into haste and DPS. We are talking about fractions of percents lol.

[sobek_eq2]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> A 12 Gauge 007 wrote:<BR> Sorry that just makes no sense to me... lets assume that 1.0 is the perfect delay to time an auto attack between every CA. Like you said you do one auto attack every second. Well with a .7 delay you would do 1 auto attack every less then a second so it would be more likely the your auto attack would be waiting for your CA to finish casting rather then perfectly timed with the 1.0 delay. Either way this is DEFINATELY looking WAY too deep into haste and DPS. We are talking about fractions of percents lol.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>If that's what you think, just do whatever you want. My autoattack damage is 100 to 250 DPS greater than another brigand in the same group, when I use a 2.0 1h delay vorpal blade (or the 2.0 delay 1h sarnak blade) and he's using a 1.6 delay Qeynos Kilij (otherwise we're comparably equipped). There are other differences between the 2 weapons but weapon speed is a major factor in this difference (and max damage differences).</P> <P> </P>

[Rokjin]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> A 12 Gauge 007 wrote:<BR> Sorry that just makes no sense to me... lets assume that 1.0 is the perfect delay to time an auto attack between every CA. Like you said you do one auto attack every second. Well with a .7 delay you would do 1 auto attack every less then a second so it would be more likely the your auto attack would be waiting for your CA to finish casting rather then perfectly timed with the 1.0 delay. Either way this is DEFINATELY looking WAY too deep into haste and DPS. We are talking about fractions of percents lol.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Yep.. since it's easy to self cap 100% haste in raids.. the ideal weapon is 2.0. Almost all of our CAs are 0.5 second cast, and 0.5 recovery. In a real situation, there will also be another 0.1-0.5 seconds of lag until the next CA casts, even when it's queued.</P> <P>So if your spamming CAs, the maximum number of times you can autoattack is once a second. With a 1.4 delay weapon, fully hasted you'll be 'losing' 0.3 seconds of auto-attack every time.</P> <P>So in the worst possible situation, you will be losing 30% auto-attack DPS with a 1.4 weapon compared to 2.0. That's not a fraction of a precent, that's quite a lot..</P> <P>In reality, it is more of a 5-10% difference or so. This will of course vary widely based on how much people spam CAs, etc.</P> <P>It's much harder to quantiy the Inspiration difference, though you'd get 18 attacks with a 0.7 delay compared to 13 with a 1.0.. So that is a best case ~38% more damage (counting pure auto-attack only). The difference will go down, since you could use 8-10 or so CAs when using Inspiration as well, which would make the difference be closer to ~23%..</P> <P>This actually makes me consider trying WIS+AGI with Sailwind and a 1.6 delay weapon. See how that fares DPS wise against WIS+STR with a 2.0 delay weapon, considering the faster weapons and Sailwinds contribution to Inspiration.</P>

[Rokjin]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> sobek_eq2 wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE>If that's what you think, just do whatever you want. My autoattack damage is 100 to 250 DPS greater than another brigand in the same group, when I use a 2.0 1h delay vorpal blade (or the 2.0 delay 1h sarnak blade) and he's using a 1.6 delay Qeynos Kilij (otherwise we're comparably equipped). There are other differences between the 2 weapons but weapon speed is a major factor in this difference (and max damage differences). <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I am wondering, if you could convince your friend to get Sailwind, and see how that changes his DPS compared to you.</P> <P>The Qeynos Kilnij and the 2.0 Venekor weapons (AVB and Sarnak) are the only weapon upgrades I could get right now (excluding Chel'Drak), and I am curious how they scale comparably.</P>

[Keldo]

Of course a Swash is going to outdamage a brigand in the same group - a brigand has no self haste or dps, while you can self buff nearly to 100% haste.  Not to mention we simply deal more damage overall and your weapon is better than his (and not just because of delay, it's better DR and has a exellent range for critical hits).<div></div>

[SmCaudata]

<div><blockquote><hr>A 12 Gauge 007 wrote:<div></div>Sorry that just makes no sense to me... lets assume that 1.0 is the perfect delay to time an auto attack between every CA. Like you said you do one auto attack every second. Well with a .7 delay you would do 1 auto attack every less then a second so it would be more likely the your auto attack would be waiting for your CA to finish casting rather then perfectly timed with the 1.0 delay. Either way this is DEFINATELY looking WAY too deep into haste and DPS. We are talking about fractions of percents lol.<hr></blockquote>Either weapon will wait for the recovery.  This means that a 1.0 delay weapon will swing every 1.0 sec, meaning no drop in DPS.  A 0.7 delay weapon will be delayed 0.3 sec when queuing CAs.  This is a 40% or so drop in DPS to your auto attack when CAs are queued up.  Since raiding is a mix of auto attacking and queuing CAs you won't see this drastic of a drop, but it will proabably be about 25% or so, so that 80DR 1.4 delay weapon acts more like a 60DR 2.0 delay weapon.I currently use the Qeynos 1hder and do fine DPS wise, but I know i would see a significant improvement with one of the Venekor 1 handers. If only we could get one to drop for us.  Also remember with EoF coming out we can get over 100% haste so those 2.0 delay weapons will approach 0.89 dealy with diminishign returns.  If I do get a Venekor weapon I will keep my Kilij around to swap in for inspiration burst damage for the extra couple of swings.I too would be curious how Wis+Agi with a proper delay weapon fares against Str+Agi.  Agi gives a decent proc and significant boost to auto attack time. </div>