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Ascensionf
01-13-2005, 04:23 PM
mystics rock, please dont change them because people cry a lot on these boards devs~thanks,quirk

Jays
01-13-2005, 06:46 PM
<DIV>Are you a Dev?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ummari</DIV> <DIV>Lvl 27 Mystic</DIV>

BigDa
01-13-2005, 07:53 PM
<DIV>Yeah, that was ordered badly, it think it was meant to be: -</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>"mystics rock, please dont change them because people cry a lot on these boards [signed ~ the] devs"</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>*chuckle* It sure wasn't a mystic.</DIV>

Mystiq
01-13-2005, 11:40 PM
<DIV>No he's a mystic alright, and here's his <A href="http://eq2players-beta.station.sony.com/en/pplayer.vm?characterId=209572205" target=_blank>profile</A>. Too bad the number one Mystic to 50 has been so scarse on these boards when people like the Gnome post so much :smileysad:</DIV>

Ascensionf
01-14-2005, 02:42 AM
I post sometimes, I just see a lot of crying and complaining about things that I dont believe are broken.. what am I to say when its like 50 vs 1? I dont think wards are broken or underpowered, I think they should stay the same. I think shaman is the hardest priest subclass to play and that the rewards for playing it well are excellent. It just boggles me why so many think a class so powerful is broken =X. The healing style required takes a lot of concentration and skill and most people that play arent expecting to offer that. I just wanted to make a pro-mystic post to offset all of the pessimism I see here.mystic powa~-quirk

Selnar
01-14-2005, 04:58 AM
<DIV>AMEN, i love the class and i dont see the problems that i see most people complaining about.  Leave us alone before they break us trying to 'fix' us.</DIV>

MIJ
01-14-2005, 05:38 AM
<BR>hrmmm...I enjoy da mystic. And I dont want them changed either. But we need nicer mystics on this board. So that way every time i come on here I dont see a flame between eloora bandit and gnome...gets annoying after a while lol<p>Message Edited by MIJAS on <span class=date_text>01-13-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:43 PM</span>

BigDa
01-14-2005, 02:48 PM
<DIV>Guys, I fully appreciate that a well played mystic rocks.  I flatter myself that I manage to be a very useful player despite the irritations and frustrations.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The problem I have is that I feel that I am constantly overcoming unnecessary issues to be effective and it grates on my nerves.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I'm in a group and the party has to wait to pull after every fight because I blow my power keeping the tank up and I get "Jeez we should get another healer" or "The templar we had yesterday didn't keep going oop - what are you drinking?" etc. I feel a bit angry, ok?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm sorry, guys, but I find it hard to accept that wards do <EM>nothing</EM> in certain encounters where vitaes and HoTs are always effective.  Cleric/Druid envy?  Well, maybe *shrug*</DIV>

cas
01-14-2005, 11:58 PM
<DIV>Im glad Im not the only one happy with there choice to be a Mystic..  It is hard to play this class you are always casting something you are always doing something..  thats why I like the mystic..</DIV>

MIJ
01-15-2005, 09:03 AM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> BigDave wrote:<BR> <DIV>Guys, I fully appreciate that a well played mystic rocks.  I flatter myself that I manage to be a very useful player despite the irritations and frustrations.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The problem I have is that I feel that I am constantly overcoming unnecessary issues to be effective and it grates on my nerves.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I'm in a group and the party has to wait to pull after every fight because I blow my power keeping the tank up and I get "Jeez we should get another healer" or "The templar we had yesterday didn't keep going oop - what are you drinking?" etc. I feel a bit angry, ok?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm sorry, guys, but I find it hard to accept that wards do <EM>nothing</EM> in certain encounters where vitaes and HoTs are always effective.  Cleric/Druid envy?  Well, maybe *shrug*</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> maybe its your tank and not you. If you get the feeling that people dont want you there than why bother being there. I joined a guild and enjoy grouping with my guildies and they just cant stop complementing the fact that I'm a great healer as a mystic. So might be your tank and not you.

Mystiq
01-16-2005, 08:50 AM
<DIV>I just upgraded Enlightened Healing from app 2 to adept 3. The heal jumped from 707 to 955. Now I can actually heal decently every 13 seconds! Go me go!  :smileyindifferent:</DIV>

MIJ
01-16-2005, 10:41 AM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Eloora wrote:<BR> <DIV>I just upgraded Enlightened Healing from app 2 to adept 3. The heal jumped from 707 to 955. Now I can actually heal decently every 13 seconds! Go me go!  :smileyindifferent:</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> Lol there ya go. Tho you could also heal for more than just 955 in 13 seconds. So far sadly only level 23 so i use totemic aid and a nice quick heal. The quick heals doesnt heal for much but has a 13 second recast and totemic aid has a 110 point heal right now and recasts every 8 seconds or 5 seconds i ferget which lol and i can use both of those heals simultaneously.

FelixDomesticus
01-16-2005, 05:03 PM
<blockquote><hr>Ascensionftw wrote:mystics rock, please dont change them because people cry a lot on these boards devs~thanks,quirk<hr></blockquote>Mystic rock, but wards SUCK. Mystics would rock even more if they would finally fix those weak wards

MIJ
01-17-2005, 04:37 AM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Felix Domesticus wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Ascensionftw wrote:<BR>mystics rock, please dont change them because people cry a lot on these boards devs~<BR><BR><BR>thanks,<BR>quirk<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Mystic rock, but wards SUCK. Mystics would rock even more if they would finally fix those weak wards<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> hehe yeah. in my oponion wards dont suck for 2 reasons. After slow and debuff almost impossible to hit my tank so ward is very useful there and I like the fact that wards absorb hp. best idea ever. I like to know that my tank wont loose hp if I keep ward up and it costs maybe a whole 20% power to slow debuff, ward, ward, ward and if needed another debuff.

Triyton
01-17-2005, 07:53 AM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Ascensionftw wrote:<BR>I post sometimes, I just see a lot of crying and complaining about things that I dont believe are broken.. what am I to say when its like 50 vs 1? I dont think wards are broken or underpowered, I think they should stay the same. I think shaman is the hardest priest subclass to play and that the rewards for playing it well are excellent. It just boggles me why so many think a class so powerful is broken =X. The healing style required takes a lot of concentration and skill and most people that play arent expecting to offer that. I just wanted to make a pro-mystic post to offset all of the pessimism I see here.<BR><BR>mystic powa~<BR><BR><BR>-quirk<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Lets see now:  <FONT color=#3366ff> </FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#3366ff>I think shaman is the hardest priest subclass to play and that the rewards for playing it well are excellent.  </FONT><FONT color=#ffffff>So Shaman have the short end of the stick, but we can feel proud of ourselves when we make things work despite that.  (Also of note to be picky, Shaman is the class not the subclass.  This is important because wards start being the most highly broken after level thirty, when we are into the subclass zone.  That is why some people have defended the viability of wards and Shaman/Mystics only to recant when they gained levels.)</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#3366ff>The healing style required takes a lot of concentration and skill.</FONT>  So we have to have to work harder than other priests to get the same results.  If we played one of the other priest classes and put this extra level of concentration and skill into it even though it was not required, just think how much more we could achieve.</P> <P>Thank you for helping demonstrate that the Mystic subclass is not on a par with the other subclasses.  As to why wards are broken it has been proven in-depth elsewhere (a good read as I recall) and it would be stupid to rewrite that whole thread here.</P> <P> </P>

Ascensionf
01-17-2005, 02:04 PM
I never said the rewards were less, you suck at reading sir. Shaman are the best healers in the game in my opinion. Stick to single player games or go play a cleric Triyton, I dont think you can handle the powa of being a mystic.-quirk

BigDa
01-17-2005, 02:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Triyton wrote: <P><FONT color=#3366ff>The healing style required takes a lot of concentration and skill.</FONT>  So we have to have to work harder than other priests to get the same results.  If we played one of the other priest classes and put this extra level of concentration and skill into it even though it was not required, just think how much more we could achieve.</P> <P>Thank you for helping demonstrate that the Mystic subclass is not on a par with the other subclasses... <HR> </P></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>This is exactly the issue.  I'm not saying I can't be a good healer, I'm saying it's much harder for me than for druids and clerics.  And that isn't just a personal "poor me" issue - the community <EM>also</EM> know that a good mystic is very hard to play, so they tend to lean towards the clerics and druids.  A lot.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The specifics of the issues are discussed lots elsewhere, but the fact is, it's <EM>hard</EM> being a mystic and, yes, I'm proud of myself for managing to be effective, but I'm sick of working like a dog to still be seen as a second-class healer.</DIV>

Xran
01-18-2005, 11:33 PM
Well, it is kinda many classes out there.Can Monk tank? Definitely. Does it require more effort? Definitely too!Can Pally tank? Yes!Does Zerker/Guardian have an easier time? Slightly easier time than Pally. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Can Templar deal dmg? Yes.Require more effort than Druid/Shaman? Yes.Are we going to look a class entirely or just a specific section?Mystics are great, but wards suck. Templars are great, but their dmg spells suck compared to Druid/Shaman.

cas
01-18-2005, 11:56 PM
<DIV>sorry I havnt figured out how to quote people...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>BigDave said</DIV> <DIV> <DIV>The specifics of the issues are discussed lots elsewhere, but the fact is, it's <EM>hard</EM> being a mystic and, yes, I'm proud of myself for managing to be effective, but I'm sick of working like a dog to still be seen as a second-class healer...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>now after you get done grouping do they see you as a second-class healer..  more and likely not and you just made some friends and if they see 3 healers lfg and your one of them you will probally get picked...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I don't mind being seen as a second class healer or a 4th class for that matter..  I know my capabilities and in a group situation how many times does anyone die hardly ever right...  doesnt that tell us something..  every time I group I hear horror stories about dieing alot in groups getting debt up to 100% or more..  It makes me feel better that my groups dont die..  that right there tells me we are way more than a second rate healer...  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>personally I played EQ1 since jan of 2000 as a Shaman..  and I work harder at that then I do now..  </DIV></DIV>

NightPhoenix
01-19-2005, 12:32 AM
<DIV>I would have to say that I agree that Mystics are a great class.  I am currently at lvl 26 and find my benefit to a group enormous!  It would apear that the vast majority of the complainers don't realize that the Mystic has skills other than their ward.  In my opinion, if you learn how to balance your wards, debuff's, AND HEALS (No one has even talks about our heals when they are complaining) that the class is extremely powerfull.  It isn't easy at all times... but personaly I like it like that.  Why would you want to play this game if it took no effort and you just slaughtered every group you came across?  Even if SOE made the wards absorb 10,000 hps I think people would just start complaining about something else.  What I'm trying to get at is that a Mystic CAN BE just as powerfull as any other priest class if you learn how to balance your spells.  On top of that, I think we are even more powerfull.  I get constant comments from people in my guild about my play and they never seam to have problems with my grouping.  We spend all of our time around very difficult mobs of all varieties not just killing greens all day.</DIV> <DIV>Also if you want a solo comparison, like I said... I am currently lvl 26 and just last night was soloing lvl 31 orcs in Zek.  At the same time a lvl 30 Templar was soloing the same guys and had lower heath and power than I did after a fight.  Keep in mind that Templars can also wear heavy armor while we wear medium.</DIV> <DIV>No one class or subclass does it all... if they did.... everyone would play that character class.  My sugestion is that if you don't like playing a Mystic, go be something else!  Because I personally enjoy being one of the few around.  If you want to grind it out and learn how to play the class then feal free.  I'm not trying to bash anyone and tell you that you suck for not being a good Mystic.  I am just hear to let you know that some people don't have any problems so you may want to start looking at how you play.  If you are looking for a class where you just click assist on the tank and then walk away to go get a Coke... this is not the class for you.  So my advise if you are going to continue to play is to use all of the spells you have available to you, not just a few.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Frangelle</DIV> <DIV>lvl 26 Mystic</DIV> <DIV>Oggok Server</DIV> <DIV>The Guild with No Name</DIV>

Banditman
01-19-2005, 03:05 AM
<DIV>Comparing how well a person plays their character should never come into the equation when balancing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Every player should have equal, yet perhaps different, tools at their disposal.  Going forward from that point, the individual talents, knowledge and experiences of a given player should separate a good Templar from a bad Mystic.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Unfortunately, the starting points are not equal at present.  Until they are, an average Templar is as efficent and effective AT HEALING as a well played Mystic.  That is what needs to change.  An average player of one class should be the equivalent of an average player at another class.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This isn't about what you can solo versus what someone else can solo, its about making the starting line the same point.</DIV>

Xran
01-19-2005, 03:25 AM
You know, SOE could make balancing really easy if that's what desired for balance between healing classes.Shall we have SOE do this? ----><b>Same exact healing, just different looks and style:</b>Cleric BoV Reactive heal - 100hp/tick for a total of 400 hp.Druid Regrowth HoT heal - total heal over time = 400 hpShaman Spectral Ward - will soak up 400hp<b>Now how about same exact dmg spells:</b>How about have 3 of priest class all do same DD dmg?<b>Debuffs:</b>Now how to we make debuffs exactly the same as other classes so there's no class differentiation?Is that what we really want?

cas
01-19-2005, 03:33 AM
<DIV>why is this geared towards Templars and Mystic's....  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>and not Templar Inquisitor Fury Warden Mystic Defiler..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>is this the problem we don't compete with the biggest healers in the game...  Templar's heal thats about all they do.  to me of course they will be better at it..  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>common sense...</DIV>

Triyton
01-19-2005, 04:45 AM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> NightPhoenix wrote:<BR> <DIV>I would have to say that I agree that Mystics are a great class. <FONT color=#ffff99> I am currently at lvl 26 </FONT>and find my benefit to a group enormous!  It would apear that the vast majority of the complainers don't realize that the Mystic has skills other than their ward.  <FONT color=#ffff99>In my opinion, if you learn how to balance your wards, debuff's, AND HEALS </FONT>(No one has even talks about our heals when they are complaining) that the class is extremely powerfull.  It isn't easy at all times... but personaly I like it like that.  Why would you want to play this game if it took no effort and you just slaughtered every group you came across?  Even if SOE made the wards absorb 10,000 hps I think people would just start complaining about something else.  What I'm trying to get at is that a Mystic CAN BE just as powerfull as any other priest class if you learn how to balance your spells.  On top of that, I think we are even more powerfull.  I get constant comments from people in my guild about my play and they never seam to have problems with my grouping.  We spend all of our time around very difficult mobs of all varieties not just killing greens all day.</DIV> <DIV>Also if you want a solo comparison, like I said... I am currently lvl 26 and just last night was soloing lvl 31 orcs in Zek.  At the same time a lvl 30 Templar was soloing the same guys and had lower heath and power than I did after a fight.  Keep in mind that Templars can also wear heavy armor while we wear medium.</DIV> <DIV>No one class or subclass does it all... if they did.... everyone would play that character class.  My sugestion is that if you don't like playing a Mystic, go be something else!  Because I personally enjoy being one of the few around.  If you want to grind it out and learn how to play the class then feal free.  I'm not trying to bash anyone and tell you that you suck for not being a good Mystic.  I am just hear to let you know that some people don't have any problems so you may want to start looking at how you play.  If you are looking for a class where you just click assist on the tank and then walk away to go get a Coke... this is not the class for you.  So my advise if you are going to continue to play is to use all of the spells you have available to you, not just a few.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Frangelle</DIV> <DIV>lvl 26 Mystic</DIV> <DIV>Oggok Server</DIV> <DIV>The Guild with No Name</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Now here is a real case in point.  The higher level Mystics tel us that is at level 30 where wards start failing so miserably.  Not surprising that you are happy with them at level 26, despite all the other problems wards have.  SOE can and did balance the inferiority of wards with the use of debuffs.  It is basic Mystic technique to use the debuffs (and the time and power they require) so that your wards can be effective.  And waste power on less efficient direct heals if you don't time things just right to renew the ward or debuffs before they are used up (a guesstimate) or expire.</P> <P>But their balancing act can and did break down at the higher levels, so that even with debuffs wards are just awful, and the higher level you go the worse they are.</P> <P>Are you looking forward to that?  Or would you rather feel proud of yourself because you can stilll get by despite the known severe problems.  Lets just hope they fix things before you get there.</P> <P>Healing is the primary function of ALL priests.  A little less effective at healing but a little better at doing damage is fine.  (If you can even spare the power as the only healer while making up for the poor healing.)  But the healing has to be close, it is barely in the same ballpark.</P> <P><BR> </P>

Chanliang
01-19-2005, 03:20 PM
<DIV>I team regularly with templar and fury and I can easily notice that I'm quite far off in healing powers compared to them but then again I can act as primary healer as well (takes more power tho) and I kinda like the fact that people don't expect me to heal their butts all the time so I can concentrate on debuffing and back up primary healer, saves power for all team members. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Could use boost to wards like wards would work after migration or more absorb to them but so far I'm quite happy.</DIV>

BigDa
01-19-2005, 04:08 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> casie wrote:<BR> <DIV>why is this geared towards Templars and Mystic's....  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>and not Templar Inquisitor Fury Warden Mystic Defiler..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>is this the problem we don't compete with the biggest healers in the game...  Templar's heal thats about all they do.  to me of course they will be better at it..  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>common sense...</DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>Why 'of course' when SOE stated specifically in many different threads that all healer classes would be equally good at healing?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They specifically said this (not linking coz lazy and coz it's common knowledge) - they did <EM>not </EM>say "mystics are not as good at healing, but they will get other stuff to make up for it".</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Unless SOE are not intending to go through with the ARAC principles, mystics should be as good a healer as druids and clerics.  Yes, we get Slow.  If druids and clerics feel they don't have anything more than healing to do, then that's their issue to resolve, but that's not what is being discussed here.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I like being a healer.  That's why I chose a healer class.  If I had been informed at level 10 that "choosing a mystic, you will not be as good a healer as druids and clerics, but we'll give you other stuff to do" I wouldn't have chosen a mystic.</DIV>

Banditman
01-19-2005, 07:45 PM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Xrande wrote:<BR>You know, SOE could make balancing really easy if that's what desired for balance between healing classes.<BR><BR>Shall we have SOE do this? ----><BR><BR><B>Same exact healing, just different looks and style:</B><BR><BR>Cleric BoV Reactive heal - 100hp/tick for a total of 400 hp.<BR>Druid Regrowth HoT heal - total heal over time = 400 hp<BR>Shaman Spectral Ward - will soak up 400hp<BR><BR><BR><B>Now how about same exact dmg spells:</B><BR><BR>How about have 3 of priest class all do same DD dmg?<BR><BR><BR><B>Debuffs:</B><BR>Now how to we make debuffs exactly the same as other classes so there's no class differentiation?<BR><BR><BR>Is that what we really want?<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <P>No.</P> <P>But could balance not also be served by giving Mystics a more efficient, or larger, instant heal ?</P> <P>Could balance not also be served by doubling the size of Ward to compensate for zero AC ?</P> <P>Could balance not be served by giving us an unresistable, encounter wide version of Slow ?</P> <P> </P> <P>The point here is that there are tons of options that would serve balance.  There is tons of evidence that there is an imbalance.  Yet nothing is being done or discussed to resolve it.  That is the issue.</P>

Karla
01-19-2005, 11:46 PM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Ascensionftw wrote:<BR>I post sometimes, I just see a lot of crying and complaining about things that I dont believe are broken.. what am I to say when its like 50 vs 1? I dont think wards are broken or underpowered, I think they should stay the same. I think shaman is the hardest priest subclass to play and that the rewards for playing it well are excellent. It just boggles me why so many think a class so powerful is broken =X. The healing style required takes a lot of concentration and skill and most people that play arent expecting to offer that. I just wanted to make a pro-mystic post to offset all of the pessimism I see here.<BR><BR>mystic powa~<BR><BR><BR>-quirk<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>your from AL huh?</FONT></DIV>

Karla
01-19-2005, 11:50 PM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Ascensionftw wrote:<BR>I never said the rewards were less, you suck at reading sir. Shaman are the best healers in the game in my opinion. Stick to single player games or go play a cleric Triyton, I dont think you can handle the powa of being a mystic.<BR><BR>-quirk<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> Quirk you dont want to know what i think about you.

TrueRuneCra
01-23-2005, 02:03 PM
<DIV>I love grouping with Mystics, they're great!</DIV>