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Nibbl
03-28-2005, 08:28 PM
<DIV>Have we given up?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It seems that the coercer boards have fallen silent over the past weeks and no longer see any real posts on the abilities boards. Has everyone left the class to go play warlocks?</DIV>

xtroze
03-28-2005, 08:47 PM
<DIV><FONT size=3>Have you seen a single message in regards to any of the posts dealing with our issues? This weekend the servers were hard to log in and Scott EQ2 Senior Producer left a message on EQ vault board about it. He then left 4 more posts answering others people posts.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>This shows they do read, but in our case they must feel we are full of it and our class is just fine.  Here is a great question, was the wizard/warlock DPS so bad that it effected their ability to play? Or was it so bad they never got a group and couldn't level?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>Before their increase they were still 2xs my DPS.  So they get a 200 to 300 % increase on spells that worked just fine but we have many issues like charm reseting the encounters, 3 sec root and priest level DPS but I guess these are not that big a deal in their eyes.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>So I'm not sure what to do at this point. The big reason for our post count to be one of the lowest is we are second to the lowest subclasses out there, and I bet a big number of them are alts that never make it very far. The post 40 coercer is a rare mob indeed and SOE seems to not care.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>Xtro</FONT></DIV>

Kilferf 'U
03-28-2005, 10:43 PM
<DIV>I heard this was a tough class to play, i wanna see for myself what this is all about  :smileytongue:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>42 Wiz <EM>solo</EM> <EM>extraordinaire</EM> Qeynos</DIV> <DIV>17 Enchanter <EM>solo</EM> <EM>extraordinaire</EM> Freeport</DIV>

Nibbl
03-29-2005, 12:02 AM
<P>Welcome and hope you have fun... this class was a hoot to play through 30 and then it starts the downward spiral we call... well I don't know what we call it but it aint good!</P> <P> </P>

Sy
03-29-2005, 12:41 AM
You know what I find tough?  The fact that all mobs come straight to me.. and pop me in like 3 hits.. Maybe the mobs im fighting are too hard for a 44.. maybe.. maybe not..  See... Healers wear good armour because they are built to get aggro randomly.. Were we built that way?  Im not sayin I peel of tanks.. lol I DONT COME CLOSE TO PEELING.. but right at the beginnign of a battle.. if that tank doesnt have 360 vision  im likely to die.. Ya sure I can save myself.. if i mez/stun.. if it get resisted im dead...  Any coercers out there with a 250 Kill/death ratio?  If there are.. plz let me know how its done..  Dont tell me better armour.. because im sittnig at legendary/fabled.. nothin else.

Kilferf 'U
03-29-2005, 01:20 AM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Nibbles wrote:<BR> <P>Welcome and hope you have fun... this class was a hoot to play through 30 and then it starts the downward spiral we call... well I don't know what we call it but it aint good!</P> <P> </P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>That's plenty of time lol. The way i figure it, you guys are going to get what you want/need for this class before i hit that downward spiral. Until then i'll get used to what we have to work with, so i can better appreciate what we will get in the future.</P> <P> </P> <P>I also plan on working heavily within the guild and with my friends to make this character work best for us. I realize alot of the problems with being "inefficient" is simply groups not utilizing you to your full potential. I think. :smileywink:</P><p>Message Edited by Kilferf 'Uhn on <span class=date_text>03-28-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:23 PM</span>

Tanatus
03-29-2005, 03:10 AM
Syan best I ever got was aroune 145 kill/death ratio but once I start active raiding lol ration now 97 kill/death

Zmokyn
03-29-2005, 08:24 PM
<DIV>I think that maybe a coercer is more vulnerable to poor play from other classes. </DIV> <DIV>If your tank is competent at their agro management, then most times you should be safe and draw no agro. But if they miss-time their taunt then the mobs are on you. Tissue-paper for armor means we die fast.</DIV> <DIV>The other risk time is a wanderer, who will come straight to you (and your 14 maintained buffs). Dealing with that is down to you. I spend a lot of time just looking around for whats coming at the group next.</DIV>

Signal9
03-30-2005, 01:04 AM
<P>Nibbles, I can only beat my head against a rock for so long before I realize that it hurts.</P> <P> </P> <P>I will kekep some optimism for LU#7, lo these many months away, and hope for some positive changes.  The track record so far, however, has been positively abyssmal.</P>

Chog
03-30-2005, 01:40 AM
<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Syan wrote:<BR><BR>You know what I find tough?  The fact that all mobs come straight to me.. and pop me in like 3 hits.. <BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Do you have mana regen up on anyone on the mob's hate list (like the puller)? I stopped breezing the puller, and I haven't had this happen to me since (though it hasn't been long enough to be a conclusive test).</P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kilferf 'Uhn wrote:<BR> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>42 Wiz <EM>solo</EM> <EM>extraordinaire</EM> Qeynos</DIV> <DIV>17 Enchanter <EM>solo</EM> <EM>extraordinaire</EM> Freeport</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>One of the most disappointing things about being a coercer has been the plummeting of my ability to solo as I moved through the 20s (I'm 29 now). </P> <P>I think I'm a pretty good soloer. In Tier 2 I solo'd almost exclusively on heroic mobs. I figured when I got to Tier 3, I'd have to wait a bit for the level 20 heroics to turn green before I could do them. Well, they turned green, but there is just no way I can solo them. The last green ^^ I tried, I was running with a sliver of health in 15 seconds flat. Thank goodness I have a fast horse. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>My 24 Warden, on the other hand, has no problems with any heroic encounter that's level 22 or below. I regularly do groups of zombies and gnolls in TS and bears and trees in Nek. </P> <P>In fact, I have taken my Warden to the area outside Varsoons in TS to solo exactly the same mobs my Coercer solos. While the 29 Coercer does OK against them (they're low blue and green after all), I have occasional close calls when there is a resist or when I can't get root to stick. Those mobs are yellow and orange to the Warden, but he rips right through them. </P> <P>The coercer has better gear and spells than the warden, btw.</P>

yes4
03-30-2005, 05:49 AM
<P>I love the coercer idea... but so far, my experience is quite a great challenge:</P> <P><BR>1. Start to cast a spell and wait for X seconds.<BR>2. Monster is too weak or powerfull? Go back to 1 and cast another spell.<BR>3. fizzle? Go back to 1.<BR>4. Got hit by crunching attack? Go back to 1.<BR>5. Got interrupted? Go back to 1.<BR>6. Got resisted? Go back to 1.<BR>7. You die? OMG... go to forum and post coercer sucks :smileywink:<BR>8. Spell casted. /dance and go back to 1.<BR>9. Monster dead? 5 min later, Sony nerfs coercer :smileysad:</P><p>Message Edited by yes4me on <span class=date_text>03-29-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:52 PM</span>

Orki who Pos
03-30-2005, 01:49 PM
<P>>Ya sure I can save myself.. if i mez/stun.. if it get resisted im dead...  Any coercers out there with a 250 Kill/death ratio?  If there are.. plz let me know how its done..  </P> <P>I was sitting at 190ish for a loong while</P> <P>>Dont tell me better armour.. because im sittnig at legendary/fabled.. nothin else.<BR></P> <P>My armor was crap (orange-blue crap, mostly) atmor doesnt do squat, dont get hit.</P> <P> </P> <P>Part of the trick is, dont fight mobs so red they resist everything, when doing that i'd guess i was at about 100 kill/death</P> <P> </P> <P>Stifle ALOT, stun alot, blink alot, mez little, and be ready to call the evac, better an early evac than a dead group.</P> <P> </P> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

yes4
03-30-2005, 05:11 PM
<P>OMG I was in Varsoom today and we were trying to kill a named clay guardian. The monster resisted almost all my spells until I ran out of power.</P> <P>We tried again 4 times to kill it without any success and I ended up in the same situation each time. It was a complete nightmare.</P> <P> </P> <P>I can understand if I cannot mezz an orange monster because he is too powerfull, but let me at least be able to damage it, slow down, reduce his power, dispel magic or something when I use adept 1 spell... I was not able to do anything until I got a lucky stunt. By that time all my power was almost all gone as well as everyone.</P><p>Message Edited by yes4me on <span class=date_text>03-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:14 AM</span>

Orki who Pos
03-30-2005, 05:23 PM
<P>When the mob is red to you and there's no adds... you'r basically reduced to a breeze/haste bitc..</P> <P> </P> <P>Try with gloom/dots, they tend to get resisted abit less.</P>

Drakonblayde
03-30-2005, 09:24 PM
Just out of curiosity, would that have been the tempered clay guardian you're talking about? If so, what level were you? Reason I ask is because I had a run in with him the other night... I was 29, and the highest member of the group. He was 34 if I remember right. We decided to go ahead and kill him anyway. To my utter surprise, I was able to land everything on him with only a few resists here and there  (mostly on Cereberal Spasm). I even managed to mez him at one point when the healer got dangerously low on mana. I'm actually a bit surprised on how well we can do against reds... last night, I set foot in Nek Castle for the first time. Well, group decided to go for Everling. Now most of the castle outside of the basement was yellow or orange to me, and I didn't have a single problem landing spells that night. Hell, even when the dolls (who were red) popped on us like 3 times, I was able to mez them without any difficulty. I started to run into a few problems down in the basement... the named beetles were very resistant... the half duration timer on named combined with that resist rate let them get loose a few times. And the patchwork fleshrippers didn't like me either. Couldn't land anything on The Juggernaut either, but when we got down to Everling, I *could* mez his pet and his little level 36 companions without any trouble. Couldn't land a thing on Everling himself though. <div></div>

yes4
03-30-2005, 11:17 PM
<P>I am 28. I used every single spells in the book against the tempered clay guardian during 4 fights. He was orange to me, because most of the folks were level 28 and above.</P> <P>That's one thing I hate about EQ2. One level difference makes a huge difference if you can hit or not hit an opponent. The battle is either too easy or impossible. Sony doesn't want us to powerlevel up, but they forced us to do it anyhow because if I don't I can't hit mob X.</P><p>Message Edited by yes4me on <span class=date_text>03-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:18 AM</span>

PaganLeviath
03-30-2005, 11:38 PM
<P>Though I have a series of up's and down's w/ my Coercer character. There is definitely room for improvement on the Coercer class itself. I think my main reason for pick this class was this statement by SOE defining Coercer's: </P> <P> "Coercers dominate the minds of the weak and hurl their foes into paralyzing states of confusion and catatonia. They can also enhance the mental abilities and combat prowessof their allies." </P> <P>Now yes we do stun, mez, breeze ,buff dot, dd, power drain. Which is just fine. But, I don't feel that there is much difference in style between a Illusionist and a Coercer.  In my mind I was thinking a Coercer would get some more defined fun spells that are reminiscent of EQ1 enchanters. Example EQ1 spell: "Whirl to you hurl" -which was an ae spell that made your mobs get sick for no reason. Sounds like fun, sounds like something a Coercer would do. </P> <P>In definition by the Standard College Dictionary by Funk & Wagnalls to Coerce is: To compel by force, law, authority, fear. To restrain or repress by superior force.  To bring by forcible measures. Or, Coercion is:  Forcible constraint or restraint, moral or physical. </P> <P>I think that by the above definition more creative style of what a Coercer should be instituted in the game.</P> <P>I also wish there was more availability to solo in the game w/ charm. Our charm at this point at best can be used in a duo situation. Which is pointless. I also chose this class thinking I was able to solo. Which clearly is not easy to do compare to other classes. Which I would think as a Coercer and by definition should be very easy. Recast time for stuns, mezzes should be shorten not just for soloing but, to work better with Ho's timing. </P> <P>Well,  that is all for now.  At this point as a Level 44 Coercer I can't wait to get to level 50 and retire my character until some changes are made. Also, tired of people not understanding the function of a enchanter in groups , It's like pulling teeth . There are good days and bad days as this class, it depends on the group you get....  very frustrating.  All I can say is I am glad I made alts.</P> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P><p>Message Edited by PaganLeviathan on <span class=date_text>03-30-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:02 AM</span>

Arithion
04-06-2005, 07:19 PM
<P>I really don't know if SOE reads any of this. </P> <P>But I almost gave up yesterday... almost seriously gave up. I have always played a psionic class, and I adored my EQ1 enchanter. I realised when I finally got my pc working again almost 6 weeks ago that it wouldn't be the same playing an EQ2 enchanter class. And I decided on coercer because of the charming ability and because of the name. A coercer implies that we compel our opponents and this appealed to me. I've hit level 35 and with that also a brick wall.</P> <P>Until a couple of levels ago I could mez with a 4 second recast by juggling two of my mez's and  effectively managing to keep six - 7 mobs mesd at a time. *$%#&!, I actually felt like an enchanter again. But lately, because of the rise in levels and one of my mez spells being too weak for targets over 35, I find myself back to relying on my ae mez and my lovely 8 second recast mez which cuts my effectiveness down to 3 mobs being safely mezd, 4 if I really push it. Granted the mez rarely hold for the full 42 seconds anyway, or maybe I'm the only one who's noticed this.</P> <P>I'm wary of leveling my character further and finally getting my hands on the holy grail of a charm spell, which seems to be booby trapped like hell if the horror stories I've heard are anything to go by.</P> <P>As far as I can tell, our class should be called Crackgivers or something because all I seriously contribute to a group or a raid at this point in time is Mana regen and speed. </P> <P>Give us a decent charm - hell make it drain mana per tick over time if you have to, but 36 seconds is ridiculous. <BR>Give us more than one strain of mez and allow us not to fizzle like the illusionists, because heaven knows I can't cast when stunned even though it says I should be able to.</P> <P>I can live without the dps, because I've never been a dps class, but stop making the name Coercer a joke, because so far it's not even coming close to living up to it's definition.</P> <P>~</P> <P>I haven't been back to playing for long, but I'll definitely be around, and I don't plan on being quiet or giving up. They need to balance us out, because the amount of people who have given this class up in exasperation is more than ridiculous.</P>

Savara
04-07-2005, 08:05 PM
I'm still here.  Keep up the good work on the consolidated Coercer thread <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />   I knew before EQ2 came out that the first year would be frustrating.  I played Eq1from the get-go, so I have witnessed the class balancing nerfarama already.  They arent finished here.  I think the only reason that PvP didnt make it in was because they knew ahead of time the classes weren't balanced and the players would complain more about it on the PvP servers, but thats another issue. <DIV>  </DIV> <DIV>Hopefully, We will get our class fixed(To some extent) in the next couple patches.  We should have a lottery to guess which Live Update that will happen <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>