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View Full Version : Devs: Please Fix Beguile


jaboogw
02-10-2005, 07:35 AM
Regardless of the many threads on this issue, I wanted to bring this back up to the attention of the devs if possible. There has obviously been many complaints regarding the "bugginess" of Beguile, yet none that stay on the front page of the Coercer forums for more than a couple days. I simply want to use this as a means to get the fix rolling as soon as possible, or at least have the satisfaction that we tried as hard as possible to get the attention that the spell deserves. I have had the spell for 2 levels at adept 1, and have noticed the following:-never lands on the first cast (this is for all mobs that can be targetted). Usually takes 2nd or 3rd cast to stick. This does not include resists. The pet command will flash, and the spell breaks immediately. This never fails.-after the spell sticks, the pet interface comes up--however, the charmed mob will not perform any of the commands. (this seems to be random, as I can occasionally get the mob to fight, stay, etc. and the mob absolutely will never follow)-the spell ALWAYS breaks the encounter. It doesn't matter if the charmed mob kills a target, if the spell breaks, etc, Beguile "always" breaks the encounter thus producing no loot, xp.-The length of time alloted for the spell is not a feasible window to use this spell in any context.MY SUGGESTIONS---- Obviously, other than resists, allow the spell the opportunity to stick on the first hit.-Please fix the pet interface. When you click follow/attack/etc, the pet should immediately obey--This should not be difficult to employ, considering that necros/conjurers have this coded-Code beguile so that it does not break encounters. As long as this is the case, the spell will always be totally worthless. (I'm also curious to know if other classes have spells that break encounters as well)-please increase the timer on beguile to 4-5 minutes.Hopefully something, anything, will be done about Beguile. Maybe with enough posts the devs will see this and consider the changes. If you are reading this post and have nothing to respond with, please just respond with "PLEASE FIX BEGUILE"!!!!!! Thanks folksSoulgrinder lvl 39 coercer/10 scholar Grobb

Overc
02-10-2005, 10:46 AM
<DIV>Yes, I must say that this spell was the one I looked most forward to and has resulted in a most worthless and never to be used spell.  It needs some looking into</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-Overcer Coax</DIV> <DIV>lvl 38 Coercer</DIV> <DIV>lvl 41 Provisioner</DIV>

Sekhau
02-10-2005, 11:08 AM
<DIV>Most definately. Many many players have stated that this single spell has in some way influenced their decision to become a Coercer. Obviously for game balance </DIV> <DIV>issues charming an orange mob might be a bit much, but the simple fact that the spell doesn't <EM>work or function </EM>at all is an immense disappointment. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Devs, please do something.</DIV>

Sanben
02-10-2005, 01:33 PM
I'm obviously in a minority but I use beguile. Not sure if its really much use buts its fun to play with and I use it with groups. Useless for soloing though.It doesn't always unlock the encounter. The encounter unlocks if you charm a pet, send it to tank for you, it gains aggro, charm falls, the mob you are attacking then continues to attack the mob which was once your pet. Basically it becomes NPC vs NPC rather than pet vs NPC which will break the encounter. As the charm will invariably fail before the mob you targetted is killed the encounter will break so it's useless as a tank or for soloing.The encounter doesnt unlock if you have aggro so the target is not beating on your pet when charm fails. That's why I use it in groups when fighting large groups of standard mobs - the situation when people AE rather than bothering with mez, especially if there are wiz/warlocks in a group. When the tank has a good aggro I usually charm the caster in a group and send it to attack the tanks target. IF mezzing I will mez, charm and by this time mez will have recycled so i can mez again. Charm generates large amounts of aggro though so best to do this near the end of the battle.Unfortunately it can drop as soon as cast even on grey mobs. This definately needs fixing. Either resist or stick, just like mez does. To last 1 second is stupid.I don't have a problem with the pet interface. Guard and attack is fine but follow often breaks charm. I have a problem with targetting though. Once charm has dropped F8/tab doesnt target the mob, instead I have to click with the mouse to select them - this applies to solo mobs, cant remember with grouped mobs.4/5 minutes would probably result in coercer being overpowered. The time it takes for a battle to end so its one charm per battle would be fine, though more time would mean more fun.If the stupid sticking/dropping issue is fixed this would be a great spell and a lot of fun.PLEASE FIX BEGUILE <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Thanks.

ericb1
02-10-2005, 09:35 PM
Not to sound stupid, but you guys do /bug this in game don't you? Devs probably don't bother to read the class boards.

Gilbert
02-11-2005, 03:16 AM
<DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>I thought Beguile was our fluff spell? (sic)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>Yes, I'm kidding but how would you fix Beguile?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>I think if it lasted for 2 - 3 minutes and we could recast it while it was in effect and keep it going I would be happy.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>Maybe that would be too game changing though. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>I've bugged this and other spells and it still seems to get no attention.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>Gilbertus</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2>38 Coercer (Steamfont)</FONT></DIV></DIV>

neble
02-11-2005, 06:25 PM
<DIV>The devs definitely do not appear to read the class boards from what I've seen.  However, if folks who have Beguile would like to comment on it's broken componets in hopes of drawing the attention of a dev, please post a thread in the <A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board?board.id=spellart" target=_blank>Spells, Abilities, and Combat Arts</A> folder.  I truly believe it will have a better chance of gaining attention from a dev there.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'd do it myself, but I don't have Beguile so I really don't wish to comment on it yet.</DIV>

Inkant
02-13-2005, 09:38 PM
<DIV>I don't have Beguile yet either but I hope everyone is sending /bug and /feedback reports.  A swarm of /bug and /feedback reports from different players on the same issue can have an impact.  I will join the fray once I can comment.</DIV>

Enkan
02-14-2005, 10:44 PM
<DIV>Beguile should work the same way that it worked in EQ1.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In the middle of a fight u charmed one of the mobs and send it to attack it's former allies.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It did not break encounters as there was no encounter codes in EQ1.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Once the pet broke charm it would go after the charmer, the party would help kill it for no exp.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Which is fine as long as the pet served a purpose which was to eliminate one of the allies from the encounter and turn it into a damage dealer for your cause.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is the way I had imagine that it would work in EQ2 but unfortunately it does not!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The Illusionist get a summon pet spell that performs the attack for its master and after combat it disapears. I thought that Beguile was our version of the Illusionist spell but instead of 'summoning' it we just charmed it out of an encounter.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We should also be able to charm a higher level con mob, since this spell will mainly be used to advance ur cause in a party it is worthless to try to find a lower con mob when u are figthing red con mobs in parties.</DIV>

Ol'b
02-18-2005, 09:14 AM
<DIV>I could not agree more Enkanto , and i dont think this would be all that game changing considering the dmg upgrade wizzys/warlocks recently recived. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Although i have found a use for beguile untill it gets fixed. If someone in yer group pulls aggro from a mob thats not the primary target, when whomever pulled agg is about to die cast beguile on the mob and shoop he's on yer butt instantly then mezzem. Only dont try this on 40+ mobs you may go down in a couple hits if your mezz gets interupted.</DIV>

Krewlryali
02-18-2005, 11:23 PM
<DIV>I think that this is one of the spells that will be drastically changed once the devs take a deeper look into the caster classes aside from Wiz/Warlock.</DIV>

Kna
02-19-2005, 04:12 AM
I got beguile a few days ago and I was not looking forward to it because of the posts on this board, but it seems to work fine for me in groups. It has never broken an encounter in a group, it has never failed to stick (I have been resisted once) and I've noticed no sluggishness to the response of my commands to the pet. In fact, I love this spell. It completly removes one creature from the encounter much like mez, except others can't break this. On top of that, the charmed creature adds some DPS to the battle. I was fighting level 35s to 37s in the Obelisk of lost souls and it worked like intended as far as I could tell. I did get it to break the encounter once while experimenting with soloing, but like was stated earlier, it only broke the encounter because the charmed pet gained aggro. So, unless this was just fixed in the big patch, I really don't see the problems everyone is complaining about. I agree though, that it shouldn't break the encounter in solo play, but other than that, it works fine. Oh, and I have yet to upgrade it (apprentice 1.)

Aoi
02-19-2005, 05:08 AM
<DIV>Good post Knarl, I agree, and let me take it one step further...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am a 38 coercer with Adept1 Beguile, and on whim I decided to try to charm one of the two mobs pulled while grouped last night (encounter consisting of 2 single up arrow lamias in Rivervale).  Mind you, both of these conned yellow to me.  Basically, charm worked exactly as intended.  It lasted about 30-40 secs, pet commands worked fine, and it put out some decent DPS without getting agro.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Over the next few fights, this was the case to my pleasant surprise.  Charm would ALWAYS break on the death of the mob it was attacking.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>On a fight where we pulled a double up arrow scarecrow, I charmed a yellow-con elemental mob (dont remember exact name but was a caster type mob) that added early in the fight, and sicced it on the scarecrow.  I recharmed no less than 3 times before the encounter broke.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It is my opinion that the encounter broke at or near the point the charmed pet either got agro or exceeded the damage of my group (we were kinda low on the DPS side, fyi).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think beguile is working in a sense, and actually is allowing us to charm mobs higher than the spell description indicates.  At the same time, I think there is indeed a bug with the way a charmed mob is handled during an encounter; or it is related to the dmg output of the charmed mob as a balance mechanism and is not bugged at all, which is a scary thought.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Cyene</DIV> <DIV>Najena</DIV>

Sna
02-19-2005, 05:38 AM
<DIV><FONT size=1>Sorry but if you think Beguile is working then you have a completely different idea to me about what a coercer is. To me a pet should be an <STRONG>additional </STRONG>boost to our dps that we have to manage (ie recharm and direct pet). As it stands it can be used in a group but our dps drops using a charmed pet because most of our non-buff time is spent dealing with the pet, and in my experience charm does not break as soon as the target mob dies, infact i got the tanks annoyed because they had to wait for me to break charm to enable the to kill the mob. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=1></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=1>To me our charm should add to our dps, to bring it up to close but not quite that of a wizard, indeed i would be very happy for our sub par nukes and dots to remain as they are if we could have a charmed pet along to compliment our exiting dps, not completely take over what i have to do. In my limited knowledge of the game the only way i can see this work is to extend the duration of charm and/or allow recharm of an existing pet.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=1></FONT> </DIV> <DIV>For solo encounters I have found Beguile to lead to more xp debt than xp, even when i have a good run at a few mobs I would still be better off just going pure dps and forgetting the pet.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I had such high hopes for this spell and I really cant see how it would unbalance us to have a decent, long duration charm spell, but for now I will bide my time and see what happens over the next week or two. If nothing changes I dont want to end up as a buff bot who can do mez in a game that doesnt need mez.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=1></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=1></FONT> </DIV>

Kna
02-19-2005, 06:12 AM
There is a command to break the charm, it looks like a little skull and crossbones on your screen. This will keep the tank from getting mad.

Aoi
02-22-2005, 04:21 AM
<DIV><FONT size=2>"To me our charm should add to our dps, to bring it up to close but not quite that of a wizard"</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>Sorry to say, but I doubt this will ever happen.  Sure, more dmg on charm would be great, but at the cost of being very hard to balance.  Chanters have too many tools at our disposal (both working and broken presently) to expect damage close to Sorcs.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>I hear what you are saying, but judging by what I have seen so far, Beguile does not seem to be engineered for DPS.  Mobs just do too much damage with their frontal styles to balance any situation where we could have even a semi-permanent pet.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>I do agree both coercers and illusionists need a dmg boost, but be careful what you wish for when it comes to charm.  Would you rather have better nukes/DoTs or the upgrade/nerf/upgrade/nerf cycle for the next year with Beguile?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>All that being said, Beguile does need something to make it at least useful.  I'm not necessarily asking for it to be our "dps", but at least make it viable enough to build a strategy around.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3>Cyene</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3></FONT> </DIV>