a happy post about paladins

therodge · 01-15-2007, 09:22 AM

I SAID IT! I LIKE MY PALADIN!

ok but seriously their are alot of negitive posts on these boards and i have some things to say, and that is if you are new and are looking at making a paladin here is my 2 cents unless you plan on being the mt for an extreamly high end raiding guild then you have choosen an excellent and versitile class and you can specialize you class a hundred diffrent ways AND still be a great tank.

I will use my paladin as an example im level 70 in decent gear am i uber no but I have specialized my paladin through gear and AA to put out some serious dps for a tank.

I parse between 500-700 single target dps and can go up to 1200 multitarget dps with a good group whitch is often right up their with alot of the dps.

I can and have MHed for many grouped and have even mhed and mted at the same time even on raids i show up fairly high on heal parses.

And Tanking? i have tanked mistmoor castle groups with little problem and have tanked MTed some lower end teir 7 pickup raids with little problem also if better geared wouldednt doubt high end content would be to far out of my reach sure matron and cheldrak would be pushing it but hey thats what 1% of the populace ever makes it that far

so yes i like my paladin do we fall behind 9in tanking compared to a guardian i say no unless your doing high end raid content. and I can live with that expecially considering paladins are probobly THE most versitile class in the game

MeridianR · 01-15-2007, 08:01 PM

Group wise nobody really argues we are fine. It's raid wise. Like it or not raiding is the end game.

therodge · 01-16-2007, 05:18 AM

raiding may be the endgame but raiding cheldrek is way further then most people ever get i would say 90% of people have never gone past lyceum and 99% never made it past DT a well geared paladin can tank anything up tothat point so not really seeing the problem unless you plan on being that 1%

khufure · 01-16-2007, 06:01 AM

therodge wrote:
raiding may be the endgame but raiding cheldrek is way further then most people ever get i would say 90% of people have never gone past lyceum and 99% never made it past DT a well geared paladin can tank anything up tothat point so not really seeing the problem unless you plan on being that 1%

But a warrior can tank it more reliably. Nobody argues with that, either. If you want to tank raid content do yourself a favor and roll a guardian.From a group tanking perspective I tank every zone fine with my pally alt. For some reason obelisk monsters resists a lot of divine but otherwise we are fine.From a duo/trio perspective we are really versatile and useful.From a solo perspective.. don't do it. It is amazingly slow even at T5 much less T7.

MeridianR · 01-16-2007, 06:35 PM

therodge wrote:
raiding may be the endgame but raiding cheldrek is way further then most people ever get i would say 90% of people have never gone past lyceum and 99% never made it past DT a well geared paladin can tank anything up tothat point so not really seeing the problem unless you plan on being that 1%

Wait so we can tank, as long as we are geared and maxed out for 1 expansion ahead of the current raiding tier?Great, nothing like gearing out, getting new upgrades and AA's just to tank Kingdom of Sky stuff, woot!

MeridianR · 01-16-2007, 06:36 PM

BTW - The majority of higher end paladins here tanked all of KoS back in KoS (and some of FD, Chel'drak yes, but I don't believe any Paladin can tank The Matron, at least the final form since Overseer of Change and Kurzog is easy enough to tank)

Anariale · 01-16-2007, 08:50 PM

If a Paladin is parsing 1200 DPS in a fight (without consecration), then the DPS should be parsing 1800+

W

therodge · 01-17-2007, 02:27 AM

acually im not raid geared nor are many of the people i group with so no most of the dps i group with on my server push maybe a 1k-1400 damage. in raids they may push 1800 when i pushing 1000 mainly due to the time it takes to take down a heroic mob if it goes down in 10 seconds basically just enough time to run through all my spells most of whitch are aoes in multi target encounters. sorry if that was missleading

Unwise · 01-17-2007, 10:08 AM

As a low-end raid leader I really like seeing that a paladin has signedup. True I don't need many of them, but if you are going to have some extra fighters, they are a great one to have. Ammends is sort of a 'fire and forget' agro control for the most overzealous DPS. If Celestial Touch even saves the day once, the paladin has pretty much earned their spot. With so many healers throwing out heals that don't stack, any other class that can heal a bit actually climbs quiet high on the healing parse. Wards, intercepts, mit transfers etc all make them great to have around even if you don't need them to tank.

I can see how paladin's get frustrated since they seem to specialise in helping others tank to the extent they are so good at it that you prefer to use them in that roll.

PattontheGen · 01-17-2007, 01:23 PM

Look the simple fact is ...pally's are excellent toons. By far the best well rounded toons in the game. There is not another toon in the game that can multi-task like we do.

Now are we the best for every situation out there..no...but who is.

As a tank class..we heal (very well)..we use plate..we can ward (very well)..if you go down the right AA's we can out right kick butt at DPS...and with the right AA's and lvl spells we can hold agro awsome. Our group buffs are so so....and we can use amends (which is a god like spell)..we have 6 AOE's (with the right AA line) they hit for a hell of a lot..and if used right can control out of group agro which no other tank can really do. We hvae the best in combat battle rez..we can use tower shields..we can debuff...we can use ranged (bow) now..hell the only thing we can't really do is cure ..but then again we can't have it all.

Now are we the best for high end raiding..well no..but come on you can't be the best for everything..where would that leave the other tanks.

So all in all we are the best all around tank class in the game...I know there are a lot of others out there that don't think so..but if you spent time building your pally right you would see that we can do a bit of everything.

It is nice to finaly see a post that gives some props to the pally rather that all the post that do nothing but [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] about them. We are what We are ..there is a role for a pally in every group out there ..no matter if it is MT, off healing, warding, mit buff, group mit buff, rez'ing, dps, off tanking..ect.ect..the list goes on and on

Rast · 01-17-2007, 07:05 PM

for the most part I am happy with my Pally. He solos well, he groups well. I MT for my guild for instances and in general, but we don't raid as a guild (only 8 or 9 of us who are active).

From what I've heard from those who have actually raided with the Pally, it is simply a case of our abilities not scaling which 'should' be a simple matter to fix (take divine favor and turn it into a %ward instead of a broken and useless deathward) and you have the scaling. The Paladin isn't broke, it just needs tweaked to allow it to fill the role that we were supposed to fill SMILEY

Marcula · 01-20-2007, 02:35 AM

Just for the record.......I solo very easily as a paladin......and we absolutely rock in PvP.

Wanderingwilly - Paladin of the 61st order of merit

- Armorer of the 65 apprenticeship level

khufure · 01-20-2007, 03:08 AM

PattontheGen wrote:
As a tank class..we heal (very well)..we use plate..we can ward (very well)..if you go down the right AA's we can out right kick butt at DPS...and with the right AA's and lvl spells we can hold agro awsome. Our group buffs are so so....and we can use amends (which is a god like spell)..we have 6 AOE's (with the right AA line) they hit for a hell of a lot..and if used right can control out of group agro which no other tank can really do. We hvae the best in combat battle rez..we can use tower shields..we can debuff...we can use ranged (bow) now..hell the only thing we can't really do is cure ..but then again we can't have it all.

Corrections:1.) Our 1 meter battle rez sucks compared to dirge or necro or priest. Grabbing someone's nuts to res them sucks enough that I usually don't bother.2.) We can cure if you go down that AA line. Power is an issue (as usual).3.) Zerkers own us in aggro and tanking, including AE. We are the second best AE tank, though.

Demoley · 01-21-2007, 02:03 AM

you should hardly ever have to rez in the first place, if you do your dirges are slacking, only time a paladin should have to drop out of the fight and rez someone is if its too much for a dirge to get up, and with most guilds running 2+ dirges its usually declared a whipe by that point if 2 dirges can get dead people up, and parsing 1k auto attack parses are not uncommon for some top end paladins, tanking ability is still very good if you konw your class, there are a few things that could be more useful to us such as better snap aggro, but other than that once we have established aggro we hold it very well, and i still believe our ward should be a ca, able to cast it on the run, other than that i really have no issues with playing a paladin, to me its the only class i can stand raiding/playing at an end game level

Ratora · 01-21-2007, 07:17 PM

We are a very versatile class but we really don't stand out as the best in any of the roles that we can fill, "a jack of all trades master of none" so to speak. I am pleased so far with our class. From day one I knew that I wasn't going to be the best DPS out there if I wanted to do that I would have gone and made class that is designed for that. It's the same way for healing. As far as agro control as long as everybody in the grp is doing their part, I have no problems with agro or getting agro back, but everybody in the grp needs to realize that they all have a role in maintaining agro on the tank.

Our rez is a decent rez even on raids. Yeah it has a short range but it comes in very handy when the dirge goes down or one of the MT healers is near by and quicker for the pally to get to then the dirge. Plus it rezzes the fallen and heals them back to full. I can't even begin to count the number of times I have seen and been rezzed with minimal HP's only to be layed back out by an AoE from the mob.

So all in all don't discount our abilities even though they have down falls.

If everything worked the way we wanted it to we wouldn't need 23 other people with us when we raid.

01-15-2007, 08:01 PM	#2
MeridianR Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,402	Group wise nobody really argues we are fine. It's raid wise. Like it or not raiding is the end game. __________________ Meridian - L70 Brigand (Vendetta)

01-16-2007, 06:01 AM	#4
khufure Lord Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 649	therodge wrote: raiding may be the endgame but raiding cheldrek is way further then most people ever get i would say 90% of people have never gone past lyceum and 99% never made it past DT a well geared paladin can tank anything up tothat point so not really seeing the problem unless you plan on being that 1% But a warrior can tank it more reliably. Nobody argues with that, either. If you want to tank raid content do yourself a favor and roll a guardian.From a group tanking perspective I tank every zone fine with my pally alt. For some reason obelisk monsters resists a lot of divine but otherwise we are fine.From a duo/trio perspective we are really versatile and useful.From a solo perspective.. don't do it. It is amazingly slow even at T5 much less T7.

01-16-2007, 06:35 PM	#5
MeridianR Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,402	therodge wrote: raiding may be the endgame but raiding cheldrek is way further then most people ever get i would say 90% of people have never gone past lyceum and 99% never made it past DT a well geared paladin can tank anything up tothat point so not really seeing the problem unless you plan on being that 1% Wait so we can tank, as long as we are geared and maxed out for 1 expansion ahead of the current raiding tier?Great, nothing like gearing out, getting new upgrades and AA's just to tank Kingdom of Sky stuff, woot! __________________ Meridian - L70 Brigand (Vendetta)

01-16-2007, 06:36 PM	#6
MeridianR Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,402	BTW - The majority of higher end paladins here tanked all of KoS back in KoS (and some of FD, Chel'drak yes, but I don't believe any Paladin can tank The Matron, at least the final form since Overseer of Change and Kurzog is easy enough to tank) __________________ Meridian - L70 Brigand (Vendetta)

01-16-2007, 08:50 PM	#7
Anariale Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 476	If a Paladin is parsing 1200 DPS in a fight (without consecration), then the DPS should be parsing 1800+ W __________________ Wyrd, 80 Paladin - ex-Ghosts of War, Permafrost Darton, 70 Guardian (was stolen) Permafrost

01-15-2007, 09:22 AM	#1
therodge Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 824	I SAID IT! I LIKE MY PALADIN! ok but seriously their are alot of negitive posts on these boards and i have some things to say, and that is if you are new and are looking at making a paladin here is my 2 cents unless you plan on being the mt for an extreamly high end raiding guild then you have choosen an excellent and versitile class and you can specialize you class a hundred diffrent ways AND still be a great tank. I will use my paladin as an example im level 70 in decent gear am i uber no but I have specialized my paladin through gear and AA to put out some serious dps for a tank. I parse between 500-700 single target dps and can go up to 1200 multitarget dps with a good group whitch is often right up their with alot of the dps. I can and have MHed for many grouped and have even mhed and mted at the same time even on raids i show up fairly high on heal parses. And Tanking? i have tanked mistmoor castle groups with little problem and have tanked MTed some lower end teir 7 pickup raids with little problem also if better geared wouldednt doubt high end content would be to far out of my reach sure matron and cheldrak would be pushing it but hey thats what 1% of the populace ever makes it that far so yes i like my paladin do we fall behind 9in tanking compared to a guardian i say no unless your doing high end raid content. and I can live with that expecially considering paladins are probobly THE most versitile class in the game

01-16-2007, 05:18 AM	#3
therodge Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 824	raiding may be the endgame but raiding cheldrek is way further then most people ever get i would say 90% of people have never gone past lyceum and 99% never made it past DT a well geared paladin can tank anything up tothat point so not really seeing the problem unless you plan on being that 1%

01-17-2007, 02:27 AM	#8
therodge Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 824	acually im not raid geared nor are many of the people i group with so no most of the dps i group with on my server push maybe a 1k-1400 damage. in raids they may push 1800 when i pushing 1000 mainly due to the time it takes to take down a heroic mob if it goes down in 10 seconds basically just enough time to run through all my spells most of whitch are aoes in multi target encounters. sorry if that was missleading

01-17-2007, 10:08 AM	#9
Unwise Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 226	As a low-end raid leader I really like seeing that a paladin has signedup. True I don't need many of them, but if you are going to have some extra fighters, they are a great one to have. Ammends is sort of a 'fire and forget' agro control for the most overzealous DPS. If Celestial Touch even saves the day once, the paladin has pretty much earned their spot. With so many healers throwing out heals that don't stack, any other class that can heal a bit actually climbs quiet high on the healing parse. Wards, intercepts, mit transfers etc all make them great to have around even if you don't need them to tank. I can see how paladin's get frustrated since they seem to specialise in helping others tank to the extent they are so good at it that you prefer to use them in that roll.

01-17-2007, 01:23 PM	#10
PattontheGen Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: San Antonio, Tx Posts: 77	Look the simple fact is ...pally's are excellent toons. By far the best well rounded toons in the game. There is not another toon in the game that can multi-task like we do. Now are we the best for every situation out there..no...but who is. As a tank class..we heal (very well)..we use plate..we can ward (very well)..if you go down the right AA's we can out right kick butt at DPS...and with the right AA's and lvl spells we can hold agro awsome. Our group buffs are so so....and we can use amends (which is a god like spell)..we have 6 AOE's (with the right AA line) they hit for a hell of a lot..and if used right can control out of group agro which no other tank can really do. We hvae the best in combat battle rez..we can use tower shields..we can debuff...we can use ranged (bow) now..hell the only thing we can't really do is cure ..but then again we can't have it all. Now are we the best for high end raiding..well no..but come on you can't be the best for everything..where would that leave the other tanks. So all in all we are the best all around tank class in the game...I know there are a lot of others out there that don't think so..but if you spent time building your pally right you would see that we can do a bit of everything. It is nice to finaly see a post that gives some props to the pally rather that all the post that do nothing but [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] about them. We are what We are ..there is a role for a pally in every group out there ..no matter if it is MT, off healing, warding, mit buff, group mit buff, rez'ing, dps, off tanking..ect.ect..the list goes on and on

01-17-2007, 07:05 PM	#11
Rast General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,805	for the most part I am happy with my Pally. He solos well, he groups well. I MT for my guild for instances and in general, but we don't raid as a guild (only 8 or 9 of us who are active). From what I've heard from those who have actually raided with the Pally, it is simply a case of our abilities not scaling which 'should' be a simple matter to fix (take divine favor and turn it into a %ward instead of a broken and useless deathward) and you have the scaling. The Paladin isn't broke, it just needs tweaked to allow it to fill the role that we were supposed to fill __________________ Ancient Council Jalathan T'Varik (90 Paladin) Rhapsodee Windsong (90 Troubador) Garaok (90 Brigand) Tytherian (90 Templar) Shaydroth (51 Illusionist) Raston Roderick (28 Assassin) Saphyrria (21 Warlock) Concordia Discors Jalathe Stoneshield (34 Guardian)

01-20-2007, 02:35 AM	#12
Marcula Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 177	Just for the record.......I solo very easily as a paladin......and we absolutely rock in PvP. Wanderingwilly - Paladin of the 61st order of merit - Armorer of the 65 apprenticeship level

01-20-2007, 03:08 AM	#13
khufure Lord Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 649	PattontheGen wrote: As a tank class..we heal (very well)..we use plate..we can ward (very well)..if you go down the right AA's we can out right kick butt at DPS...and with the right AA's and lvl spells we can hold agro awsome. Our group buffs are so so....and we can use amends (which is a god like spell)..we have 6 AOE's (with the right AA line) they hit for a hell of a lot..and if used right can control out of group agro which no other tank can really do. We hvae the best in combat battle rez..we can use tower shields..we can debuff...we can use ranged (bow) now..hell the only thing we can't really do is cure ..but then again we can't have it all. Corrections:1.) Our 1 meter battle rez sucks compared to dirge or necro or priest. Grabbing someone's nuts to res them sucks enough that I usually don't bother.2.) We can cure if you go down that AA line. Power is an issue (as usual).3.) Zerkers own us in aggro and tanking, including AE. We are the second best AE tank, though.

01-21-2007, 02:03 AM	#14
Demoley Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 156	you should hardly ever have to rez in the first place, if you do your dirges are slacking, only time a paladin should have to drop out of the fight and rez someone is if its too much for a dirge to get up, and with most guilds running 2+ dirges its usually declared a whipe by that point if 2 dirges can get dead people up, and parsing 1k auto attack parses are not uncommon for some top end paladins, tanking ability is still very good if you konw your class, there are a few things that could be more useful to us such as better snap aggro, but other than that once we have established aggro we hold it very well, and i still believe our ward should be a ca, able to cast it on the run, other than that i really have no issues with playing a paladin, to me its the only class i can stand raiding/playing at an end game level __________________

01-21-2007, 07:17 PM	#15
Ratora Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 18	We are a very versatile class but we really don't stand out as the best in any of the roles that we can fill, "a jack of all trades master of none" so to speak. I am pleased so far with our class. From day one I knew that I wasn't going to be the best DPS out there if I wanted to do that I would have gone and made class that is designed for that. It's the same way for healing. As far as agro control as long as everybody in the grp is doing their part, I have no problems with agro or getting agro back, but everybody in the grp needs to realize that they all have a role in maintaining agro on the tank. Our rez is a decent rez even on raids. Yeah it has a short range but it comes in very handy when the dirge goes down or one of the MT healers is near by and quicker for the pally to get to then the dirge. Plus it rezzes the fallen and heals them back to full. I can't even begin to count the number of times I have seen and been rezzed with minimal HP's only to be layed back out by an AoE from the mob. So all in all don't discount our abilities even though they have down falls. If everything worked the way we wanted it to we wouldn't need 23 other people with us when we raid. __________________