Hmm

DarkMirrax · 12-05-2006, 03:26 PM

*** Gameplay ***

- All classes now determine their base avoidance based on their class rather than the avoidance offered by their armor. For every class, the amount of avoidance for each class is equal to the original amount of avoidance offered by the heaviest armor they could wear before the update.

* Guardians, Berserkers, Paladins, Shadowknights, Templars, Inquisitors: 5% Avoidance

* Assassin, Ranger, Brigand, Swashbuckler, Dirge, Troubador, Defiler, Mystic: 10% Avoidance

* Warden, Fury, Monk, Bruiser: 15% Avoidance

* Wizard, Warlock, Coercer, Illusionist, Necromancer, Conjurer: 24% Avoidance

wesblueeyes · 12-05-2006, 10:02 PM

Yah I am curious as to how this is gonna work out too. At least we wont be seeing anymore lvl 70 guardians running around in cloth robes....

Risos · 12-06-2006, 01:40 AM

I had to read it 3 times before I saw the bruiser class... I thought they forgot us heheheh. Thank god its not apocalypse...

Sco · 12-06-2006, 03:55 AM

Tab key for the win!

Message Edited by Scorn on 12-05-2006 03:01 PM

Sco · 12-06-2006, 03:55 AM

Tab key for the second win!

Forum stopped it from the TKO!

Message Edited by Scorn on 12-05-2006 03:02 PM

Sco · 12-06-2006, 04:00 AM

The Patch missed some of the point that everyone was trying to make. I am glad that the plate classes are not running around with as much avoid as bruisers/monks now by wearing cloth, but I am sure they are not totally happy. Some concerns still are...

1. Mit curve dimishes way too tight. From what I have read and tried to peak at myself, it is almost like hitting a brick wall from getting absorb percent to not getting absorb percent. It should hit a point where you think, wow, i am not getting much anymore, but it is worth fighting for more mit still. Then thinking, yikes this is getting rough, i am not getting much, but i will still try, and then finally feeling like you hit the wall. This will still be a big topic amongst plate wearers, and even nicely equiped bruisers.

2. A concern I have myself is on realism. Who trained these finger wagglers so that they are able to avoid 9 percent better than me. Or is leather 9 percent more hindering than cloth? I can see the progression from plate to chain to leather, but then it seems a pretty big jump to cloth. If it is necessary for survival so be it, i just originally found it odd.

Hopefully when I log in tonight, I don't see myself changed at all, doesnt sound like I should from the patch notes.

Marasmus

Hailing from Mistmoore

Member of NOR

Novusod · 12-07-2006, 12:06 AM

Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas.

Gungo · 12-07-2006, 12:22 AM

Novuso wrote:
Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas.

I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance.

Gungo · 12-07-2006, 12:31 AM

Scorn wrote:

The Patch missed some of the point that everyone was trying to make. I am glad that the plate classes are not running around with as much avoid as bruisers/monks now by wearing cloth, but I am sure they are not totally happy. Some concerns still are...

1. Mit curve dimishes way too tight. From what I have read and tried to peak at myself, it is almost like hitting a brick wall from getting absorb percent to not getting absorb percent. It should hit a point where you think, wow, i am not getting much anymore, but it is worth fighting for more mit still. Then thinking, yikes this is getting rough, i am not getting much, but i will still try, and then finally feeling like you hit the wall. This will still be a big topic amongst plate wearers, and even nicely equiped bruisers.

2. A concern I have myself is on realism. Who trained these finger wagglers so that they are able to avoid 9 percent better than me. Or is leather 9 percent more hindering than cloth? I can see the progression from plate to chain to leather, but then it seems a pretty big jump to cloth. If it is necessary for survival so be it, i just originally found it odd.

Hopefully when I log in tonight, I don't see myself changed at all, doesnt sound like I should from the patch notes.

Marasmus

Hailing from Mistmoore

Member of NOR

1) Really this is no different from before EOF. What people didn't realise or what was not readily apparent was once you reached the cap before EoF you didnt get much if any return. Now in EoF they adjusted those numbers downward (essentially a nerf) and made us able to reach 65% farily easily w the next 10% (75% cap a near impossible accomplishment). It made playing more challenging, but set a diminishing return curve at a very sharp decline. While it would be simple to just recommend a softer curve thus granting less mitigation at the lower numbers and more mitgation at the higher numbers. It is just not that easy. To much and that treasured geared tank is completely ineffective to little and we have the situation we are currently in. Given all this i think they have a tiny tiny bit of room to soften the curve, but realise this will not come without the OMG you nerfed me threads. Especially from lesser geared brawlers who have the least amount of mitigation of all the tanks.

2) Remeber the finger wigglers do not have parry or deflection/block as such it will still be less then most everyone else. This does not raise thier effective avodiance at all it only shifts it to a different medium.

Message Edited by Gungo on 12-06-2006 11:32 AM

DisturbedMagg · 12-07-2006, 07:37 AM

Gungo wrote:

Novuso wrote:
Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas.

I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance.

My avi went up by 1.4%

Gungo · 12-07-2006, 09:12 AM

DisturbedMaggot wrote:

Gungo wrote:

Novuso wrote:
Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas.

I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance.

My avi went up by 1.4%

Hmm Maybe because of diminsihing returns based on low level items?

I know people posted their avoidanc ewent down when thier tinkered goggles or fae glide boots went to leather avoidance.

Message Edited by Gungo on 12-06-2006 08:13 PM

DisturbedMagg · 12-07-2006, 02:40 PM

Gungo wrote:

DisturbedMaggot wrote:

Gungo wrote:

Novuso wrote:
Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas.

I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance.

My avi went up by 1.4%

Hmm Maybe because of diminsihing returns based on low level items?

I know people posted their avoidanc ewent down when thier tinkered goggles or fae glide boots went to leather avoidance.

Message Edited by Gungo on 12-06-2006 08:13 PM

Check my gear out that i wear 90% of the time on EQ2 players and see if you consider it low lvl

Novusod · 12-08-2006, 03:25 PM

Well I have come up with a plan to save my bruiser. Since they nerfed stats with their dim curve so much I can safely drop 30str and 30agi and lose less then 1% avoidence. So if I replace my rings of str and agi with resist rings and put on fabled sta adornments I might have the same survivablity as before all the nerfs.

Gungo · 12-08-2006, 08:37 PM

DisturbedMaggot wrote:

Gungo wrote:

DisturbedMaggot wrote:

Gungo wrote:

Novuso wrote:
Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas.

I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance.

My avi went up by 1.4%

Hmm Maybe because of diminsihing returns based on low level items?

I know people posted their avoidanc ewent down when thier tinkered goggles or fae glide boots went to leather avoidance.

Message Edited by Gungo on 12-06-2006 08:13 PM

Check my gear out that i wear 90% of the time on EQ2 players and see if you consider it low lvl

What i mean is maybe if you had a bunch of items at lvl 67 it added up to 1.4% drop in the base item avodiance. Then when it got removed from items to base it is a constant variable based on yoru class and not effected by item lvl.

EQ2Luv · 12-08-2006, 08:53 PM

The current mitigation curve puts brawlers closer to plate tanks in % dmg absorbed. Any change that makes higher % more attainable would most likely increase the gap between brawlers and plate tanks and make us weaker when mobs are adjusted to this new level of plate absorption. Personally, I'd focus on getting avoidance fixed as this is the only way we'll ever be back on par with the other tanks.

12-05-2006, 03:26 PM	#1
DarkMirrax Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 1,238	* Gameplay * - All classes now determine their base avoidance based on their class rather than the avoidance offered by their armor. For every class, the amount of avoidance for each class is equal to the original amount of avoidance offered by the heaviest armor they could wear before the update. * Guardians, Berserkers, Paladins, Shadowknights, Templars, Inquisitors: 5% Avoidance * Assassin, Ranger, Brigand, Swashbuckler, Dirge, Troubador, Defiler, Mystic: 10% Avoidance * Warden, Fury, Monk, Bruiser: 15% Avoidance * Wizard, Warlock, Coercer, Illusionist, Necromancer, Conjurer: 24% Avoidance __________________ Q - Named and epics get + to hit which makes avoidance tanking suck. A- Yes they do, and yes it does =========================== Steve Danuser, a.k.a. Moorgard Game Designer, EverQuest II ... Whats Amazing Reflexes ?? ....... ===========================

12-07-2006, 12:06 AM	#7
Novusod Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,719	Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas. __________________

12-07-2006, 12:22 AM	#8
Gungo Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Crushbone Posts: 5,378	Novuso wrote: Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas. I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance.

12-07-2006, 12:31 AM	#9
Gungo Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Crushbone Posts: 5,378	Scorn wrote: The Patch missed some of the point that everyone was trying to make. I am glad that the plate classes are not running around with as much avoid as bruisers/monks now by wearing cloth, but I am sure they are not totally happy. Some concerns still are... 1. Mit curve dimishes way too tight. From what I have read and tried to peak at myself, it is almost like hitting a brick wall from getting absorb percent to not getting absorb percent. It should hit a point where you think, wow, i am not getting much anymore, but it is worth fighting for more mit still. Then thinking, yikes this is getting rough, i am not getting much, but i will still try, and then finally feeling like you hit the wall. This will still be a big topic amongst plate wearers, and even nicely equiped bruisers. 2. A concern I have myself is on realism. Who trained these finger wagglers so that they are able to avoid 9 percent better than me. Or is leather 9 percent more hindering than cloth? I can see the progression from plate to chain to leather, but then it seems a pretty big jump to cloth. If it is necessary for survival so be it, i just originally found it odd. Hopefully when I log in tonight, I don't see myself changed at all, doesnt sound like I should from the patch notes. Marasmus Hailing from Mistmoore Member of NOR 1) Really this is no different from before EOF. What people didn't realise or what was not readily apparent was once you reached the cap before EoF you didnt get much if any return. Now in EoF they adjusted those numbers downward (essentially a nerf) and made us able to reach 65% farily easily w the next 10% (75% cap a near impossible accomplishment). It made playing more challenging, but set a diminishing return curve at a very sharp decline. While it would be simple to just recommend a softer curve thus granting less mitigation at the lower numbers and more mitgation at the higher numbers. It is just not that easy. To much and that treasured geared tank is completely ineffective to little and we have the situation we are currently in. Given all this i think they have a tiny tiny bit of room to soften the curve, but realise this will not come without the OMG you nerfed me threads. Especially from lesser geared brawlers who have the least amount of mitigation of all the tanks. 2) Remeber the finger wigglers do not have parry or deflection/block as such it will still be less then most everyone else. This does not raise thier effective avodiance at all it only shifts it to a different medium. Message Edited by Gungo on 12-06-2006 11:32 AM

12-07-2006, 07:37 AM	#10
DisturbedMagg General Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 164	Gungo wrote: Novuso wrote: Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas. I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance. My avi went up by 1.4%

12-05-2006, 10:02 PM	#2
wesblueeyes Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Hades Posts: 81	Yah I am curious as to how this is gonna work out too. At least we wont be seeing anymore lvl 70 guardians running around in cloth robes....

12-06-2006, 01:40 AM	#3
Risos Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 24	I had to read it 3 times before I saw the bruiser class... I thought they forgot us heheheh. Thank god its not apocalypse...

12-06-2006, 03:55 AM	#4
Sco General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 35	Tab key for the win! Message Edited by Scorn on 12-05-2006 03:01 PM

12-06-2006, 03:55 AM	#5
Sco General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 35	Tab key for the second win! Forum stopped it from the TKO! Message Edited by Scorn on 12-05-2006 03:02 PM

12-06-2006, 04:00 AM	#6
Sco General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 35	The Patch missed some of the point that everyone was trying to make. I am glad that the plate classes are not running around with as much avoid as bruisers/monks now by wearing cloth, but I am sure they are not totally happy. Some concerns still are... 1. Mit curve dimishes way too tight. From what I have read and tried to peak at myself, it is almost like hitting a brick wall from getting absorb percent to not getting absorb percent. It should hit a point where you think, wow, i am not getting much anymore, but it is worth fighting for more mit still. Then thinking, yikes this is getting rough, i am not getting much, but i will still try, and then finally feeling like you hit the wall. This will still be a big topic amongst plate wearers, and even nicely equiped bruisers. 2. A concern I have myself is on realism. Who trained these finger wagglers so that they are able to avoid 9 percent better than me. Or is leather 9 percent more hindering than cloth? I can see the progression from plate to chain to leather, but then it seems a pretty big jump to cloth. If it is necessary for survival so be it, i just originally found it odd. Hopefully when I log in tonight, I don't see myself changed at all, doesnt sound like I should from the patch notes. Marasmus Hailing from Mistmoore Member of NOR

12-07-2006, 09:12 AM	#11
Gungo Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Crushbone Posts: 5,378	DisturbedMaggot wrote: Gungo wrote: Novuso wrote: Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas. I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance. My avi went up by 1.4% Hmm Maybe because of diminsihing returns based on low level items? I know people posted their avoidanc ewent down when thier tinkered goggles or fae glide boots went to leather avoidance. Message Edited by Gungo on 12-06-2006 08:13 PM

12-07-2006, 02:40 PM	#12
DisturbedMagg General Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 164	Gungo wrote: DisturbedMaggot wrote: Gungo wrote: Novuso wrote: Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas. I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance. My avi went up by 1.4% Hmm Maybe because of diminsihing returns based on low level items? I know people posted their avoidanc ewent down when thier tinkered goggles or fae glide boots went to leather avoidance. Message Edited by Gungo on 12-06-2006 08:13 PM Check my gear out that i wear 90% of the time on EQ2 players and see if you consider it low lvl

12-08-2006, 03:25 PM	#13
Novusod Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,719	Well I have come up with a plan to save my bruiser. Since they nerfed stats with their dim curve so much I can safely drop 30str and 30agi and lose less then 1% avoidence. So if I replace my rings of str and agi with resist rings and put on fabled sta adornments I might have the same survivablity as before all the nerfs. __________________

12-08-2006, 08:37 PM	#14
Gungo Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Crushbone Posts: 5,378	DisturbedMaggot wrote: Gungo wrote: DisturbedMaggot wrote: Gungo wrote: Novuso wrote: Did Bruisers just get nerfed AGAIN? This is the third nerf in less then a month. I spent 15 plat trying to overcome the the last two nerfs and now I am out of plat and out of ideas. I don't think our avodiance changed at all it was just shifted from item based avodiance to inherent class based avodiance. My avi went up by 1.4% Hmm Maybe because of diminsihing returns based on low level items? I know people posted their avoidanc ewent down when thier tinkered goggles or fae glide boots went to leather avoidance. Message Edited by Gungo on 12-06-2006 08:13 PM Check my gear out that i wear 90% of the time on EQ2 players and see if you consider it low lvl What i mean is maybe if you had a bunch of items at lvl 67 it added up to 1.4% drop in the base item avodiance. Then when it got removed from items to base it is a constant variable based on yoru class and not effected by item lvl.

12-08-2006, 08:53 PM	#15
EQ2Luv Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 217	The current mitigation curve puts brawlers closer to plate tanks in % dmg absorbed. Any change that makes higher % more attainable would most likely increase the gap between brawlers and plate tanks and make us weaker when mobs are adjusted to this new level of plate absorption. Personally, I'd focus on getting avoidance fixed as this is the only way we'll ever be back on par with the other tanks.