Simple Ideas on Helping Druids in Raids.

Kunaak · 07-25-2011, 06:40 PM

shaman - prevents damage with wards - but very slow healers otherwise.

clerics - very big heals, but ok at everything else otherwise.

druids - very fast healers, but very little defensive healing possible. must take damage to heal anything.

the problem. anything a druid does well, any combination of cleric + shaman can do it better. theres a few rare instances when a druid has a specific advantage, like when Tshell is needed often, or elemental wards help, or a tank needs nature walk to avoid being rooted. but otherwise, its still a rather bleak road for a druid.

furies have some help in this expansion, as thier buffs are very solid for mages, and a good fury can solo heal a mage group most of the time.

but that still leaves me sitting here... always lfg while others are "looking for non leather healer for....". for 3 expansions its been like that. seems theres no real faith in druids.

so I was trying to think "what could be simple, and yet helpful for a druid"?

not sweeping grand changes, not something that gets a answer like "well, its a good idea, we'll think about it".... meaning, "dont hold your breath, we got a ton to do, and redoing 1 class from the ground up, isnt on the calander any time in this century".

1. allow druids to heal, while moving as a innate ability to the class, not something that would be kinda enabled while over some stat cap.

2. make druids the buff healers, allow instinct and primal fury to be on as many or few people as they want, within the conc slot limit of course.

3. make druids AE healers, reguardless of whos in group, anyone near the druid is healed. if heals were like AE spells, all heals currently would be like encounter spells. theres no real "AE" heals - in the same sense of a AE DPS spell is a AE.

4. make druids powerful at curing curse and group cures- cut it down to 30 seconds for druids on cure curse. shaman are your prevention healers, clerics the big heals - druids your best curers.

5. give druids some sort of "tank buff" - a hate buff, positional hate, mutagenic burst buff, anything - tanks most of all seem to avoid druids, since they get no real defensive buff from a druid. clerics have shield ally, and such, shaman have very nice tank buffs - and even DPS buffs that can go on multiple people. but a druid only has 1 DPS buff, and you can bet, its almost never gonna go on a tank - and they know that.

I dont want to suggest anything thats some "grand sweeping change" to the class, as I know that pretty much means it will never happen - reguardless of how good or bad the ideas are. what I hope, is that the idea is simple, and only modifies whats already there.

I do happen to like that druids are the fastest healers - AE hits, almost everyones dead, a warden will fill that group in a second. but sometimes - thats not enough - and overall - its always better to prevent damage, then heal it.

I dont want to imply that druids are in horrible shape, and no one wants one around - but they are most definatly pushed aside in favor of just about any other healer class, for very simple reasons.

Tigress · 07-25-2011, 08:24 PM

Kunaak wrote:

1. allow druids to heal, while moving as a innate ability to the class, not something that would be kinda enabled while over some stat cap.
2

this would be awesome and much needed, i think. unless im with a coercer who gives me coersive healing, then i have to be really close to the tank that i often get hit with the AOEs. if someone else gets in dire help needs a big emergency or solo heal and has gone out of my short heal range, i have to run to be able to reach them and hope that i make it there in time and cannot set off group heals while i'm running. if i could do this, then i could keep the rest of the ppl healed while i'm running to rescue someone who got themself into trouble (perhaps a crazy necro who lifeburned, lol).

PLUS... paladins have a running heal! why don't druids? during the shutdown, i played a druid in WoW. that running heal was sweet.

i wish that my group heals were not just group. would be nice to have a raid heal. untamed regeneration says that it heals all nearby allies but it also reads that it is "group".

Griffildur · 07-27-2011, 12:22 PM

Tigress wrote:

Kunaak wrote:
1. allow druids to heal, while moving as a innate ability to the class, not something that would be kinda enabled while over some stat cap.
2
this would be awesome and much needed, i think. unless im with a coercer who gives me coersive healing, then i have to be really close to the tank that i often get hit with the AOEs. if someone else gets in dire help needs a big emergency or solo heal and has gone out of my short heal range, i have to run to be able to reach them and hope that i make it there in time and cannot set off group heals while i'm running. if i could do this, then i could keep the rest of the ppl healed while i'm running to rescue someone who got themself into trouble (perhaps a crazy necro who lifeburned, lol).
PLUS... paladins have a running heal! why don't druids? during the shutdown, i played a druid in WoW. that running heal was sweet.
i wish that my group heals were not just group. would be nice to have a raid heal. untamed regeneration says that it heals all nearby allies but it also reads that it is "group".

Raid heals ? That's asking for a bit too much, don't you think ?

Xillean · 07-27-2011, 10:09 PM

For heal over times not really imo, so long as they are minimal raid HOT's. Kinda like the heal you can add to procupine and prehaps if its a raid heal that is a ubber one make it on a long recast like the furies raid cure. 10 min base for something ubbertastic? If it is going to be raid wide it shouldnt be something we can spam imo.

Kunaak · 07-28-2011, 12:55 AM

Xillean@Nagafen wrote:

For heal over tiems not really imo, so long as they are minimal raid HOT's. Kinda like the heal you can add to procupine and prehaps if its a raid heal that is a ubber one make it on a long recast like the furies raid cure. 10 min base for something ubbertastic? If it is going to be raid wide it shouldnt be something we can spam imo.

read closer....

Xillean · 07-28-2011, 01:53 AM

I did read.

I know Untamed was mentioned, im not talking about that. IF a raid hot is given in any way for a druid warden or fury it would need to be minimal at best or if providing a large amount or more it would need to be on a fairly hefty recast such as 10 mins or so. And yes if your refering to your AE heals my point stands, it would need to be on a long recast, its to OP to ask for raid or AE heals with as fast of recasts as we can get on them.

We can agree to disagree

Kunaak · 07-31-2011, 10:40 PM

ok.... if you really read that, and arent just trying to be sarcastic for the sake of derailing the thread....

a blue AE has a max target of 8 usually.

a encounter AE can hit as many things as are linked.

currently, heals work as if they were encounter AE's - meaning they only heal your group, and no one else.

if there was AE heals - they would be like blue AEs - meaning they can hit anyone within range, with a max target of 8, reguardless of what group they are in....

clear?

Xillean · 08-01-2011, 10:34 AM

You dont have to be rude to me, You didnt specify, simple as that. Not all blue AOEs have limits I can name several that hit as many as possible that are within range. If your idea as you just stated limits it to 8 then fine no problems here, though I worry when used it would heal those not in group when your trying to heal your group due to placement of your group but eh not a big deal.

And saying blue aoes usally have something doesnt mean squat, we have to specify what we want exactly to a dev, cant leave it open ended. I am not trying to argue or be rude with you just giving my thoughts on it. We can always agree to disagree and leave it at that. I dont think more healing is something we need personaly though if it were to happen I wouldnt complain, we need better buffs imo.

Arielle Nightshade · 09-12-2011, 06:10 AM

Mrrshan@Runnyeye wrote:

Tigress wrote:
Kunaak wrote:
1. allow druids to heal, while moving as a innate ability to the class, not something that would be kinda enabled while over some stat cap.
2
this would be awesome and much needed, i think. unless im with a coercer who gives me coersive healing, then i have to be really close to the tank that i often get hit with the AOEs. if someone else gets in dire help needs a big emergency or solo heal and has gone out of my short heal range, i have to run to be able to reach them and hope that i make it there in time and cannot set off group heals while i'm running. if i could do this, then i could keep the rest of the ppl healed while i'm running to rescue someone who got themself into trouble (perhaps a crazy necro who lifeburned, lol).
PLUS... paladins have a running heal! why don't druids? during the shutdown, i played a druid in WoW. that running heal was sweet.
i wish that my group heals were not just group. would be nice to have a raid heal. untamed regeneration says that it heals all nearby allies but it also reads that it is "group".
Raid heals ? That's asking for a bit too much, don't you think ?

No, it's not. If druids were asking for every heal to be raidwide, yes. But to have one or two AE heals would be kind of nice. What Wardens specifically need, though, is BUFFS. Give a Warden one decent melee buff (and no, Instinct doesn't cut it) or one good tank buff (And no, the Crit Mit buff doesn't cut it) and they will be needed past EM raids - if they are even being taken on them.

07-25-2011, 08:24 PM	#2
Tigress Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,739	Kunaak wrote: 1. allow druids to heal, while moving as a innate ability to the class, not something that would be kinda enabled while over some stat cap. 2 this would be awesome and much needed, i think. unless im with a coercer who gives me coersive healing, then i have to be really close to the tank that i often get hit with the AOEs. if someone else gets in dire help needs a big emergency or solo heal and has gone out of my short heal range, i have to run to be able to reach them and hope that i make it there in time and cannot set off group heals while i'm running. if i could do this, then i could keep the rest of the ppl healed while i'm running to rescue someone who got themself into trouble (perhaps a crazy necro who lifeburned, lol). PLUS... paladins have a running heal! why don't druids? during the shutdown, i played a druid in WoW. that running heal was sweet. i wish that my group heals were not just group. would be nice to have a raid heal. untamed regeneration says that it heals all nearby allies but it also reads that it is "group".

07-27-2011, 12:22 PM	#3
Griffildur Server: Antonia Bayle Guild: First Lords Rank: Peasant (0-100) Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,136	Tigress wrote: Kunaak wrote: 1. allow druids to heal, while moving as a innate ability to the class, not something that would be kinda enabled while over some stat cap. 2 this would be awesome and much needed, i think. unless im with a coercer who gives me coersive healing, then i have to be really close to the tank that i often get hit with the AOEs. if someone else gets in dire help needs a big emergency or solo heal and has gone out of my short heal range, i have to run to be able to reach them and hope that i make it there in time and cannot set off group heals while i'm running. if i could do this, then i could keep the rest of the ppl healed while i'm running to rescue someone who got themself into trouble (perhaps a crazy necro who lifeburned, lol). PLUS... paladins have a running heal! why don't druids? during the shutdown, i played a druid in WoW. that running heal was sweet. i wish that my group heals were not just group. would be nice to have a raid heal. untamed regeneration says that it heals all nearby allies but it also reads that it is "group". Raid heals ? That's asking for a bit too much, don't you think ? __________________

07-27-2011, 10:09 PM	#4
Xillean Server: Nagafen Guild: Legends of Firiona Vie Rank: Founders Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 115	For heal over times not really imo, so long as they are minimal raid HOT's. Kinda like the heal you can add to procupine and prehaps if its a raid heal that is a ubber one make it on a long recast like the furies raid cure. 10 min base for something ubbertastic? If it is going to be raid wide it shouldnt be something we can spam imo. __________________ Naggy Characters: Xillean 90 Warden, Annajhilam 90 Fury, Sageth 90 Templar, Eylisa 90 Defiler, Galacia 90 Wizard, Mayladen 90 Necromancer, Nameless 90 Coercer, Rauz 90 Berserker, Jacelyn 90 Paladin, Whispers 90 Monk, Trayleigh 90 Dirge, Jillean 44 Ranger

07-28-2011, 12:55 AM	#5
Kunaak Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,081	Xillean@Nagafen wrote: For heal over tiems not really imo, so long as they are minimal raid HOT's. Kinda like the heal you can add to procupine and prehaps if its a raid heal that is a ubber one make it on a long recast like the furies raid cure. 10 min base for something ubbertastic? If it is going to be raid wide it shouldnt be something we can spam imo. read closer....

07-28-2011, 01:53 AM	#6
Xillean Server: Nagafen Guild: Legends of Firiona Vie Rank: Founders Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 115	I did read. I know Untamed was mentioned, im not talking about that. IF a raid hot is given in any way for a druid warden or fury it would need to be minimal at best or if providing a large amount or more it would need to be on a fairly hefty recast such as 10 mins or so. And yes if your refering to your AE heals my point stands, it would need to be on a long recast, its to OP to ask for raid or AE heals with as fast of recasts as we can get on them. We can agree to disagree __________________ Naggy Characters: Xillean 90 Warden, Annajhilam 90 Fury, Sageth 90 Templar, Eylisa 90 Defiler, Galacia 90 Wizard, Mayladen 90 Necromancer, Nameless 90 Coercer, Rauz 90 Berserker, Jacelyn 90 Paladin, Whispers 90 Monk, Trayleigh 90 Dirge, Jillean 44 Ranger

07-25-2011, 06:40 PM	#1
Kunaak Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,081	shaman - prevents damage with wards - but very slow healers otherwise. clerics - very big heals, but ok at everything else otherwise. druids - very fast healers, but very little defensive healing possible. must take damage to heal anything. the problem. anything a druid does well, any combination of cleric + shaman can do it better. theres a few rare instances when a druid has a specific advantage, like when Tshell is needed often, or elemental wards help, or a tank needs nature walk to avoid being rooted. but otherwise, its still a rather bleak road for a druid. furies have some help in this expansion, as thier buffs are very solid for mages, and a good fury can solo heal a mage group most of the time. but that still leaves me sitting here... always lfg while others are "looking for non leather healer for....". for 3 expansions its been like that. seems theres no real faith in druids. so I was trying to think "what could be simple, and yet helpful for a druid"? not sweeping grand changes, not something that gets a answer like "well, its a good idea, we'll think about it".... meaning, "dont hold your breath, we got a ton to do, and redoing 1 class from the ground up, isnt on the calander any time in this century". 1. allow druids to heal, while moving as a innate ability to the class, not something that would be kinda enabled while over some stat cap. 2. make druids the buff healers, allow instinct and primal fury to be on as many or few people as they want, within the conc slot limit of course. 3. make druids AE healers, reguardless of whos in group, anyone near the druid is healed. if heals were like AE spells, all heals currently would be like encounter spells. theres no real "AE" heals - in the same sense of a AE DPS spell is a AE. 4. make druids powerful at curing curse and group cures- cut it down to 30 seconds for druids on cure curse. shaman are your prevention healers, clerics the big heals - druids your best curers. 5. give druids some sort of "tank buff" - a hate buff, positional hate, mutagenic burst buff, anything - tanks most of all seem to avoid druids, since they get no real defensive buff from a druid. clerics have shield ally, and such, shaman have very nice tank buffs - and even DPS buffs that can go on multiple people. but a druid only has 1 DPS buff, and you can bet, its almost never gonna go on a tank - and they know that. I dont want to suggest anything thats some "grand sweeping change" to the class, as I know that pretty much means it will never happen - reguardless of how good or bad the ideas are. what I hope, is that the idea is simple, and only modifies whats already there. I do happen to like that druids are the fastest healers - AE hits, almost everyones dead, a warden will fill that group in a second. but sometimes - thats not enough - and overall - its always better to prevent damage, then heal it. I dont want to imply that druids are in horrible shape, and no one wants one around - but they are most definatly pushed aside in favor of just about any other healer class, for very simple reasons.

07-31-2011, 10:40 PM	#7
Kunaak Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,081	ok.... if you really read that, and arent just trying to be sarcastic for the sake of derailing the thread.... a blue AE has a max target of 8 usually. a encounter AE can hit as many things as are linked. currently, heals work as if they were encounter AE's - meaning they only heal your group, and no one else. if there was AE heals - they would be like blue AEs - meaning they can hit anyone within range, with a max target of 8, reguardless of what group they are in.... clear?

08-01-2011, 10:34 AM	#8
Xillean Server: Nagafen Guild: Legends of Firiona Vie Rank: Founders Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 115	You dont have to be rude to me, You didnt specify, simple as that. Not all blue AOEs have limits I can name several that hit as many as possible that are within range. If your idea as you just stated limits it to 8 then fine no problems here, though I worry when used it would heal those not in group when your trying to heal your group due to placement of your group but eh not a big deal. And saying blue aoes usally have something doesnt mean squat, we have to specify what we want exactly to a dev, cant leave it open ended. I am not trying to argue or be rude with you just giving my thoughts on it. We can always agree to disagree and leave it at that. I dont think more healing is something we need personaly though if it were to happen I wouldnt complain, we need better buffs imo. __________________ Naggy Characters: Xillean 90 Warden, Annajhilam 90 Fury, Sageth 90 Templar, Eylisa 90 Defiler, Galacia 90 Wizard, Mayladen 90 Necromancer, Nameless 90 Coercer, Rauz 90 Berserker, Jacelyn 90 Paladin, Whispers 90 Monk, Trayleigh 90 Dirge, Jillean 44 Ranger

09-12-2011, 06:10 AM	#9
Arielle Nightshade Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,727	Mrrshan@Runnyeye wrote: Tigress wrote: Kunaak wrote: 1. allow druids to heal, while moving as a innate ability to the class, not something that would be kinda enabled while over some stat cap. 2 this would be awesome and much needed, i think. unless im with a coercer who gives me coersive healing, then i have to be really close to the tank that i often get hit with the AOEs. if someone else gets in dire help needs a big emergency or solo heal and has gone out of my short heal range, i have to run to be able to reach them and hope that i make it there in time and cannot set off group heals while i'm running. if i could do this, then i could keep the rest of the ppl healed while i'm running to rescue someone who got themself into trouble (perhaps a crazy necro who lifeburned, lol). PLUS... paladins have a running heal! why don't druids? during the shutdown, i played a druid in WoW. that running heal was sweet. i wish that my group heals were not just group. would be nice to have a raid heal. untamed regeneration says that it heals all nearby allies but it also reads that it is "group". Raid heals ? That's asking for a bit too much, don't you think ? No, it's not. If druids were asking for every heal to be raidwide, yes. But to have one or two AE heals would be kind of nice. What Wardens specifically need, though, is BUFFS. Give a Warden one decent melee buff (and no, Instinct doesn't cut it) or one good tank buff (And no, the Crit Mit buff doesn't cut it) and they will be needed past EM raids - if they are even being taken on them.