NDA Lifted? Discuss TSO AA's?

Rayche · 10-30-2008, 08:03 PM

I see a nice thread in the Mystic section involving the new Mystic/Shaman/Priest AA's, I was wondering if anybody cares to extrapolate on the Defiler AA's and how they work into our arsenal.

Did anybody find some AA lines it's worth grabbing right away? (Meaning to spend some of our original 140 points on?)

And how does purchasing in the new trees work? Do you have to spend a pre-requisite amount throughout a single tree? Or just spend a certain number of points in any ability in a tree to buy the end line?

tikasa · 10-30-2008, 10:09 PM

Nothing great.. Most of the skills just even out the 2 shamen classes. Oh and Temps got thier own Deathward...

Macross_JR · 10-31-2008, 09:06 AM

There is a difference between deathward and what I read the cleric one does. I don't know if the cleric one is a ward or not, but from reading the description it is a direct heal not a ward. Which in my opinion makes a huge difference.

Macross_JR · 10-31-2008, 09:07 AM

Rayche@Antonia Bayle wrote:

I see a nice thread in the Mystic section involving the new Mystic/Shaman/Priest AA's, I was wondering if anybody cares to extrapolate on the Defiler AA's and how they work into our arsenal.
Did anybody find some AA lines it's worth grabbing right away? (Meaning to spend some of our original 140 points on?)
And how does purchasing in the new trees work? Do you have to spend a pre-requisite amount throughout a single tree? Or just spend a certain number of points in any ability in a tree to buy the end line?

The way the aa's work you can't spend points you previously spent in a different aa tree, or points you have been saving. Also you need to spend certain amounts of aa's in the other trees before you can progress to some of the new lines.

flowercivicsi · 10-31-2008, 10:46 AM

Heal stances - Not too keen on this idea simply because when I heard of new abilities I was thinking maybe a new ability like a nuke, or a massive heal/ward. Not a buff that will make me rock heals and do terrible dps, or vice versa.

The Sacrifical Heal for clerics, broke my heart as much as when they gave Templars repent. Again, they are taking away from the uniqueness of defilers and shamans. Defilers have always been the sacrifical healer, and for each of our heals we hurt ourselves to do it. Soulward is a 90% conversion of our health into a ward, and for a complete kick to the defiler class... they get to convert 95% into a direct heal... Our dog dog gets a new attack though... umm okay. I care more about my overall ability to support my group, and uniqueness of my class. Not what my dog can do.

I have yet to really test anything as I was never in beta so with the right set up these AA's may be awesome. I can see this will be beneficial to solo defilers that need to chew thru mobs faster.

Kindred restoration seems like it would make my mythical almost useless, or would they stack?

I heard something terrible was done to overloaded heals but we shall see.

GENERAL AA TREE

Pet of the Gods - Improves the casting speed and attribute bonuses of your diety pet by 10% 5 ranks
Bountiful Feast - Improves the duration of food and drink by 2.5% 5 ranks
Ample Harvest - Caster will double harvest 3% of the time 5 ranks
Hearty Constitution - Increases max health by 0.5% 5 ranks
Swift Journey - Increases mount speed by 2% 5 ranks
Enhanced Mind - Increases max power by 0.5% 5 ranks
Swift Strides - Increases speed of caster 1% 5 ranks
Swift Creation - Increases crafting progress by 0.5%

HEALER TYPE AA TREE

Litany of Combat - Grants additional spells which increase spell, melee dmg or buffs pet, no other description listed
Ally Revivication - Improves reuse speed of combat res by 12 seconds
Prayer of Healing - Improves single target direct heal amount by 2% and crit amount 3%
Protective Prayer - Improves mit bonus of class mit buff by 3%
Secular Protection - Improves resist bonus of class resist buff by 5%
Seal of Faith - Increases shield effectiveness of caster by 2%
Supplication of the Fallen - 24 man 100 meter range 100% power and HP revive applys rev sickness

SHAMAN ARCHTYPE

Ancestral Curse - Improves debuff amounts by 5% curse/haze lines
Tribal Frenzy - Improved hp and pwr to the shamans single target buff
Soiritual Storm - Improves base dmg 4% crit dmg 2% fuliginous sphere/cold flame line
Kindred Restoration - Adds heal to shamans group ward 5 ranks
Prophetic Spirit - Increase base and crit ward on single target ward 2%
Ethereal Weaponry - 3 weapon bonus 4% dbl attack 5 ranks
Ancient Pedigree - Adds additional hp to shamans pet and grants a special attack. No description listed.

Macross_JR · 10-31-2008, 06:48 PM

what they are doing to overloaded heals is instead of each person having a chance to proc olh on a group heal/ward it will only proc once, there also is a 20m range on it now as well(no more zone wide olh procs). That is what they are doing to any proc that proc's a group effect, pondwash belt, and water sprinkler gloves also getting that nerf.

Estean1 · 10-31-2008, 07:15 PM

Can someone please post pics of the aa's maybe? or at least list what the defiler specific ones are. Not all of us got to see the leaked ones and would like to know what they are.. thank you

SlickSlamander · 10-31-2008, 11:23 PM

Is alacrity still available or is it totally gone from the aa sets?

Rayche · 11-02-2008, 11:28 AM

The EOF and KOS AA tree's remain unmodified for Shamans.

tikasa · 11-03-2008, 10:29 AM

Gimbel@Permafrost wrote:

what they are doing to overloaded heals is instead of each person having a chance to proc olh on a group heal/ward it will only proc once, there also is a 20m range on it now as well(no more zone wide olh procs). That is what they are doing to any proc that proc's a group effect, pondwash belt, and water sprinkler gloves also getting that nerf.

What this does not tell you though... I have 8 OLH type items. The changes seem to have gone too far. On average they seem to proc 1 time for every 8 heals cast. I have not seen more then 1 proc in 3 hours of continuous instances in Beta. With 8 items, at least 1 should proc every time or at worst every other time, but it is not workiing that way.

flowercivicsi · 11-03-2008, 06:32 PM

I checked to see if the image was available for the end line abilities, but the two links that I had to the defiler trees have been removed. Sawry

That's typical for SoE to take things too far from one end of the spectrum to the other end of the spectrum. It takes some time to find that happy middle ground. I hope that they will be making some tweaks to this to make this better for you all in the future. However; you should never base all of your gear off of Overload or Overflow anyways. 2 is all you need.

I have not pre-ordered this expansion yet as I have been debating purchasing it. I kinda feel like our class is the red-headed stepchild right now. We did not get a whole lot of attention this expansion, nor the last... remember "Deathward"

Now they are giving clerics our Soulward, but instead of a ward it's a super heal that has a "better" conversion on our Soulward. Which we paid our AA's to earn that "end" ability, and defilers "were" the sacrifical healer. Just as shamans "were" the preventative healer. Again taking away from what makes our class unique. Now the prime healer, healer deity looks SWEET, but here's the kick in the tushy... it's another GOOD healer deity. The former prime healer is another evil tank deity! /sigh Not only are our uniqueness being taken away from us, but we lose out on yet another healing deity. A sad sad day for evil healers...

Then looking at out new AA's was kinda funny... No one should have said remove the stifle from Pand as now we can waste AA's on it to be a DPS only spell... Deathward got a silly boost to make it somewhat useful... umm no thanks I know when I talked about deathward I was referring to the original ability lacking... I don't want to have to spend 10 AA points to make 2 abilities somewhat useful.

tikasa · 11-03-2008, 08:52 PM

Alaocia@Guk wrote:

I checked to see if the image was available for the end line abilities, but the two links that I had to the defiler trees have been removed. Sawry
That's typical for SoE to take things too far from one end of the spectrum to the other end of the spectrum. It takes some time to find that happy middle ground. I hope that they will be making some tweaks to this to make this better for you all in the future. However; you should never base all of your gear off of Overload or Overflow anyways. 2 is all you need.
I have not pre-ordered this expansion yet as I have been debating purchasing it. I kinda feel like our class is the red-headed stepchild right now. We did not get a whole lot of attention this expansion, nor the last... remember "Deathward"
Now they are giving clerics our Soulward, but instead of a ward it's a super heal that has a "better" conversion on our Soulward. Which we paid our AA's to earn that "end" ability, and defilers "were" the sacrifical healer. Just as shamans "were" the preventative healer. Again taking away from what makes our class unique. Now the prime healer, healer deity looks SWEET, but here's the kick in the tushy... it's another GOOD healer deity. The former prime healer is another evil tank deity! /sigh Not only are our uniqueness being taken away from us, but we lose out on yet another healing deity. A sad sad day for evil healers...
Then looking at out new AA's was kinda funny... No one should have said remove the stifle from Pand as now we can waste AA's on it to be a DPS only spell... Deathward got a silly boost to make it somewhat useful... umm no thanks I know when I talked about deathward I was referring to the original ability lacking... I don't want to have to spend 10 AA points to make 2 abilities somewhat useful.

Look at the bonuses on the sets. It is quite obvious Templars are the healers. 15% heal crit 4% reuse time Shamen get 15% increase to the heal amount on OLH and a small damage proc on wards..

I would settle for a redheaded stepchild..... right now they are pushing hard for Templars to be in all 6 raid spots.

just in ....

ClericAdded combat art damage to the offensive stances.Overwhelming Arms now improves your chance to double attack.Healer stances now give a bonus to critical heal amounts.

Cheydak · 11-04-2008, 01:52 PM

Alaocia@Guk wrote:

I checked to see if the image was available for the end line abilities, but the two links that I had to the defiler trees have been removed. Sawry
That's typical for SoE to take things too far from one end of the spectrum to the other end of the spectrum. It takes some time to find that happy middle ground. I hope that they will be making some tweaks to this to make this better for you all in the future. However; you should never base all of your gear off of Overload or Overflow anyways. 2 is all you need.
I have not pre-ordered this expansion yet as I have been debating purchasing it. I kinda feel like our class is the red-headed stepchild right now. We did not get a whole lot of attention this expansion, nor the last... remember "Deathward"
Now they are giving clerics our Soulward, but instead of a ward it's a super heal that has a "better" conversion on our Soulward. Which we paid our AA's to earn that "end" ability, and defilers "were" the sacrifical healer. Just as shamans "were" the preventative healer. Again taking away from what makes our class unique. Now the prime healer, healer deity looks SWEET, but here's the kick in the tushy... it's another GOOD healer deity. The former prime healer is another evil tank deity! /sigh Not only are our uniqueness being taken away from us, but we lose out on yet another healing deity. A sad sad day for evil healers...
Then looking at out new AA's was kinda funny... No one should have said remove the stifle from Pand as now we can waste AA's on it to be a DPS only spell... Deathward got a silly boost to make it somewhat useful... umm no thanks I know when I talked about deathward I was referring to the original ability lacking... I don't want to have to spend 10 AA points to make 2 abilities somewhat useful.

You know, it's kind of sad that I'm dreading this expansion even more than the last one and if things aren't tweaked before it launches this may very well be it for me. I really don't understand why the balance among the healer classes is being skewed so out of line yet again. It's incredible that, once again, one of our unique abilities is being handed over to clerics only bigger and better than anything we had. This is really starting to feel like EQ1 all over again. If I wanted to be forced to play a cleric in order to be an effectual raid healer, I'd blow the dust off the one I have in EQ1 and play that instead. I'm also fed up with having more useless dps abilities rammed down my throat. If DPS was a primary concern of mine, I would have rolled a wizard...or a DE assassin.

If they're that concerned with bumping up our dps then they could just revise the Intel line on the shaman tree and be done with it. Let us have the ability to enhance our primary role as HEALERS with the TSO AAs and help make up for the bilge we were forced to swallow in RoK. It's sad that the developers are still so out of touch. Like Tikasa said, at this point I'd settle for even being a red headed stepchild.

MalkorGodchyld · 11-04-2008, 08:12 PM

Our class has gotten progressively worse since DOF...throughout every expansion thereafter we've been chipped away at for no apparent reason. Nerf this here...nerf that. Switch this mechanic just a bit... lol. I saw the road this was leading to a long time ago & here we are...still going. Notice how other class forums are atleast semi excited about the expansion...some VERY excited. Us? a lot of us could care less that there's no screenies of our aa's etc. Im used to it now...but im starting not to just blame SOE's incompentance. I think its past time to question our community...if we sit here & take it up the rear every single time...well who's really to blame??

The person in charge of Defiler balance etc...him being a hopeless suck job isn't the only reason we get neglected. Thats just my opinion.

Marius X

tikasa · 11-04-2008, 09:55 PM

I am waiting till the day of release... if nothing changes they loose 5 subscritions and 5 purchases of TSO. I am tired of all the excuses. We pay the bills, but they do not have enough people to fix the product we pay for,,, sad

flowercivicsi · 11-05-2008, 04:34 PM

MalkorGodchyld · 11-05-2008, 05:38 PM

What i would have been satisfied with

Seal of Repulsion ~ Enhances Repulsion line of spells by allowing a % based reduction. 5% per rank ~

This was nerfed from a 32% stat reduction at the same time Mystics got bolster...a 20% stat increase. /boggle

This in my opinion was what really tipped Defilers into the unbalanced category, which is especially evident on pvp servers.

Devout Endurance ~ Stays the same ~

Hastened Poisoning ~ Reduces ALL DoT tick durations allowing dmg intervals to occur faster. 5% per rank ~ Our problem with dmg dealing isnt so much the lack of dmg abilities as it is, the fact that we do it TOO SLOW! Way out of line with any other healer in game. We are NOT a dps class...noted. But options and versatility are king in any gaming experience.

Ancient Bulwark ~ Stays the same ~

Pandemic ~ Can stay the same but...dont make it a requirement to get max rank in the skill, in order to see a removal of the stun/stifle. That should be a choice left to the player as to whether they want to do increased dmg with healing reduction imo.

Prophetic Protection ~ Personally i would have kept Deathward out of if completely...it sucks so either change it drastically or leave it alone! But since they bothered anyway... ~ Reduces recast by 5 sec & increases heal amount by 20% per rank~ The dmg reduction could work also assuming that it was done correctly. Fat chance though.

There are quite a few other things that i would like to see tweaked to our class but this in particular. Our Crystallize Spirit line... I dont think it would be overpowered or unbalancing to see that spell changed instead to a % chance for an automatic stackable ward on the group. The clicky items are near useless, which in turn makes the aa line devoted to them...near useless. This one change would go a ways in not only making a very questionable skill useful, but balancing Defilers in pvp.

Another thing to take note of is the casting penalties for our stances...Every healer class is NOT created equal & a casting time reduction for us, for any reason, is felt a bit more than others!!!

The frustrating thing is that this took all of 5 min... And i can think of a few other Defilers who's ideas are just as solid without being unbalancing.

Marius X

Besual · 11-06-2008, 05:49 AM

MalkorGodchyld wrote:

What i would have been satisfied with
Seal of Repulsion ~ Enhances Repulsion line of spells by allowing a % based reduction.     5% per rank ~
This was nerfed from a 32% stat reduction at the same time Mystics got bolster...a 20% stat increase.    /boggle
This in my opinion was what really tipped Defilers into the unbalanced category, which is especially evident on pvp servers.
Sure, percent based statt reduction would be better then a flat one. But percent based spells have the tendency not to get upgraded. Anyway, I don't know how good / important the stat debuffs are because you can't see it in the parser.
Devout Endurance ~ Stays the same ~
Hastened Poisoning ~ Reduces ALL DoT tick durations allowing dmg intervals to occur faster.     5% per rank ~    Our problem with dmg dealing isnt so much the lack of dmg abilities as it is, the fact that we do it TOO SLOW!     Way out of line with any other healer in game. We are NOT a dps class...noted. But options and versatility are king in any gaming experience.
Yes, mobs are often dead before a DoT has done all the ticks. Adding more damage backend dosn't make it better.
Ancient Bulwark ~ Stays the same ~
Pandemic ~ Can stay the same but...dont make it a requirement to get max rank in the skill, in order to see a removal of the stun/stifle. That should be a choice left to the player as to whether they want to do increased dmg with healing reduction imo
Yes, I would spent 1 point to get rid of the stuffle (don't care much about the root) but wasting 5 points... I think I will pass on this.
Prophetic Protection ~ Personally i would have kept Deathward out of if completely...it sucks so either change it drastically or leave it alone! But since they bothered anyway... ~ Reduces recast by 5 sec & increases heal amount by 20% per rank~ The dmg reduction could work also assuming that it was done correctly. Fat chance though.
Someone said the damage reduction last only 5sec. Hm, 5sec on a spell with 1min recast. Guess I will pass here too.
There are quite a few other things that i would like to see tweaked to our class but this in particular.       Our Crystallize Spirit line...   I dont think it would be overpowered or unbalancing to see that spell changed instead to a % chance for an automatic stackable ward on the group.     The clicky items are near useless, which in turn makes the aa line devoted to them...near useless.             This one change would go a ways in not only making a very questionable skill useful, but balancing Defilers in pvp.
Another thing to take note of is the casting penalties for our stances...Every healer class is NOT created equal & a casting time reduction for us, for any reason, is felt a bit more than others!!!
The frustrating thing is that this took all of 5 min...     And i can think of a few other Defilers who's ideas are just as solid without being unbalancing.
Marius X

Macross_JR · 11-06-2008, 09:17 AM

The thing that is really confusing is acording to the wording on pandamic, even with 1 point in it, it should remove the stifle part. But in reality, in beta, it does not, you need to spend all 5 points to get rid of the stifle and root. I have bugged this twice but nothing has changed yet.

Besual · 11-06-2008, 11:29 AM

Gimbel@Permafrost wrote:

The thing that is really confusing is acording to the wording on pandamic, even with 1 point in it, it should remove the stifle part. But in reality, in beta, it does not, you need to spend all 5 points to get rid of the stifle and root. I have bugged this twice but nothing has changed yet.

The screenshot here says "Also at maximum rank, the spell will no longer stifle and root the defiler." but SOE should change the first part of the description.

BTW does the AA skill also reduce the mana regen part? I know with all the mythicals mana regen isn't an issue for many peoples (aka raiders) but sometimes I go with PUGs without mana regen / mythicals and mealstrom helped a bit in such situations.

flowercivicsi · 11-06-2008, 01:41 PM

FOR COMPARING PURPOSES

Cleric Tree (Inquis & Templar)

Templars...

Inquisitor...

DRUID:

Fury...

Warden:

Mystic:

Sedenten · 11-06-2008, 02:05 PM

I've been feedbacking the state of our healing stance since the first day I was in beta. The reduction in casting speed for non-damaging debuffs is one of the worst bonuses they could have given us. I honestly cannot tell a difference at all in the speed of casting them with/without the healer stance up (this is with Curseweaving trained). It speeds up Bane of Warding a noticeable amount, but I feel the bonus should be replaced with something else.

My personal preference would be 10% casting speed to beneficials (to offset the fact we get 5% more to base heals over Mystics and they get 15% casting speed) or a lesser amount of reuse (5-10%) on beneficials.

Our stance is still quite nice as long as you don't start comparing it to other healer stances. The 15% casting speed to non-damaging debuffs is just wasted on our class. I would think mystics would need it more, but I'm sure if they were given the choice they would rather have 15% to all beneficials than non-damaging debuffs.

Sedenten · 11-06-2008, 03:04 PM

I just noticed the major difference between the mystic and defiler healer stances--ours doesn't weaken our ability to debuff. Their stance makes all of their hostile spells (including damaging as well as non damaging debuffs) have a longer reuse as well as cost more power. Ours is restricted only to hampering damaging debuffs.

I'm agreeing with them (mystics) that neither shaman should be penalized for non-damage debuffs and that both should get comparable casting speed or reuse to beneficials as part of their stances.

flowercivicsi · 11-06-2008, 06:18 PM

LOL right now thats the only downside of their healstance... Slows spells, but most mystics prefer their CA's so the downside of their heal stance is just debuffs. I'm sure SoE will update this soon to include CA's on their DPS stance, and on their Heal stance.

However; I would be MORE than happy to trade out cast speed/reuse of beneficials for allowing them to debuff with no downsides! Other than that I can't complain too much about the stance... other than it seems soooo much like a copy past from Vanguard healers.

More of the Shaman line that chaps my backside. YAY more dog bites... what were they thinking on that one. Gave us dog stuff from Litany of Combat, and another dog trick in our shaman tree... Dissapointing

Seal even maxed at 20% is pathetic as it would you would not even get an additional 20 points to stat reduction. Granted we would finally have it in the 3 digit area, but still meh. - Perhaps doubling it to 40% maxed out would at least give us almost 40 points to play with upping the debuff @ M1 from 97 to 135 to STR, AGI, WIS. In it's current form you will go from 97 to 116 for 5 of our AA points. This is not worth the AA points in it's current state.

Deathward - That was a great idea Malkor! If they would add 20% to the ward amount along with the damage reduction per a point that it would be more beneficial to add some points to that area.

I know lets add a reactive to deathward, and make it's tick larger than the Templars single target reactive! I think that's only fair!

Maelstrom - fix is laughable, and should be removed for something a little better. Crystalize line buffage, and I do like the idea of it being a ward, but if they want to do this with ease I would recommend 5% per a point increase to the heal amount. Since the heal is a small amount it would not be over powered by getting a 25% heal amount boost with 5 points spent, but it would be a little more useful for sticky situations.

MalkorGodchyld · 11-06-2008, 07:54 PM

I made a post in the Testing forums you guys but its not all inclusive...i didnt cover all my bases so it would be awesome of some of you checked it out & chimed in.

Thks

Marius X

Blueboyke · 11-07-2008, 03:01 PM

Well from what I read here I think it's about time I say EQ2 goodbye... was the guild keeping me there for a long time anyway.

Thou I read Defilers been nerfed for a few expansions now I'm still on top of the heal parses for most of the raids.

However I don't like what they doing too the defiler class and the same goes for the serker class last few expansions.

True I have a lvl80 Templar as well, but I really enjoyed playing the Defiler more. SoE seems to give people who ever made a Berserker, Monk or Defiler a reason too say goodbye to the game SMILEY and that covers 3/4th of my lvl 80 toons.

In the end it will only save me money thou, I'm subscribed to 2 other MMO's as well with multiple accounts and overthere they seem to be able to make the updates interesting for all classes.

Too bad SoE has inhouse persons who 'think' they know what's good for some classes instead of getting good feedback from the vaste amount of good players before showing their silly ideas.

Thanks god there's competition muahahhahahahaaaaaaa

flowercivicsi · 11-07-2008, 04:26 PM

I wish I could hop on beta to chime in and join in on the discussions, but only my boyfriends alt account was approved for beta. I have never been a card player so I did not hop on LoN to play for the beta key. /kicks self

I sure hope the developers come to our little corner of the class forums to see that we still need some major changes to our Shaman & Defiler trees before this becomes set in stone.

Cheydak · 11-07-2008, 04:41 PM

I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you, Aloacia. It's obvious where the priorities are and it isn't on Defilers at all the past few expansions. I have a feeling we're probably at the bottom of the list for every expansion. By the time they get to us someone just tosses some random junk onto paper thinking "Good enough! My work here is done."

Oakum · 11-07-2008, 06:02 PM

Cheydak wrote:

I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you, Aloacia. It's obvious where the priorities are and it isn't on Defilers at all the past few expansions. I have a feeling we're probably at the bottom of the list for every expansion. By the time they get to us someone just tosses some random junk onto paper thinking "Good enough! My work here is done."

I wouldnt say you are at the bottom of the list. Wardens have been there since LU-13. Most of the wardens who were played as mains are now little used alts in favor of more useful new mains.

A lot of newer warden players are so used to the warden weakeness that they dont even realize how unbalanced they are compared their fellow druid (fury's) dps buffs compared to cleric and shamen, and group dps buffs compared to the other healers classes also.

I guess its a case of ignorance is bliss for a lot of them, lol.

Cheydak · 11-07-2008, 06:18 PM

I feel for you Oakum. My first main was a Warden which I dropped like a bad habit after LU 13 when SOE essentially gave the class a resounding kick in our collective backsides. I agree that Wardens have their own issues that really need to be addressed and resolved and I wholeheartedly back you in your efforts to do so. But, please don't denigrate the issues that the defiler class has had and will have and please don't derail this thread. Maybe they don't seem like game breakers to you but they are to us much the same way your issues are for Wardens.

10-30-2008, 08:03 PM	#1
Rayche Server: Antonia Bayle Guild: Mayhem Rank: Alts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 519	I see a nice thread in the Mystic section involving the new Mystic/Shaman/Priest AA's, I was wondering if anybody cares to extrapolate on the Defiler AA's and how they work into our arsenal. Did anybody find some AA lines it's worth grabbing right away? (Meaning to spend some of our original 140 points on?) And how does purchasing in the new trees work? Do you have to spend a pre-requisite amount throughout a single tree? Or just spend a certain number of points in any ability in a tree to buy the end line? __________________ Rhandy Rhoades ~ 90 Troubador Kasey ~ 90 Bruiser Cometus ~ 82 Conjuror / 90 Master Sage Rayche ~ 81 Mystic / 90 Master Alchemist / 450 Adorning Tungar ~ 64 Necromancer / 80 Master Tailor Antonia Bayle Server

10-31-2008, 09:06 AM	#3
Macross_JR Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 547	There is a difference between deathward and what I read the cleric one does. I don't know if the cleric one is a ward or not, but from reading the description it is a direct heal not a ward. Which in my opinion makes a huge difference. __________________

10-31-2008, 09:07 AM	#4
Macross_JR Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 547	Rayche@Antonia Bayle wrote: I see a nice thread in the Mystic section involving the new Mystic/Shaman/Priest AA's, I was wondering if anybody cares to extrapolate on the Defiler AA's and how they work into our arsenal. Did anybody find some AA lines it's worth grabbing right away? (Meaning to spend some of our original 140 points on?) And how does purchasing in the new trees work? Do you have to spend a pre-requisite amount throughout a single tree? Or just spend a certain number of points in any ability in a tree to buy the end line? The way the aa's work you can't spend points you previously spent in a different aa tree, or points you have been saving. Also you need to spend certain amounts of aa's in the other trees before you can progress to some of the new lines. __________________

10-31-2008, 10:46 AM	#5
flowercivicsi Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Freeport Posts: 155	Heal stances - Not too keen on this idea simply because when I heard of new abilities I was thinking maybe a new ability like a nuke, or a massive heal/ward. Not a buff that will make me rock heals and do terrible dps, or vice versa. The Sacrifical Heal for clerics, broke my heart as much as when they gave Templars repent. Again, they are taking away from the uniqueness of defilers and shamans. Defilers have always been the sacrifical healer, and for each of our heals we hurt ourselves to do it. Soulward is a 90% conversion of our health into a ward, and for a complete kick to the defiler class... they get to convert 95% into a direct heal... Our dog dog gets a new attack though... umm okay. I care more about my overall ability to support my group, and uniqueness of my class. Not what my dog can do. I have yet to really test anything as I was never in beta so with the right set up these AA's may be awesome. I can see this will be beneficial to solo defilers that need to chew thru mobs faster. Kindred restoration seems like it would make my mythical almost useless, or would they stack? I heard something terrible was done to overloaded heals but we shall see. GENERAL AA TREE Pet of the Gods - Improves the casting speed and attribute bonuses of your diety pet by 10% 5 ranks Bountiful Feast - Improves the duration of food and drink by 2.5% 5 ranks Ample Harvest - Caster will double harvest 3% of the time 5 ranks Hearty Constitution - Increases max health by 0.5% 5 ranks Swift Journey - Increases mount speed by 2% 5 ranks Enhanced Mind - Increases max power by 0.5% 5 ranks Swift Strides - Increases speed of caster 1% 5 ranks Swift Creation - Increases crafting progress by 0.5% HEALER TYPE AA TREE Litany of Combat - Grants additional spells which increase spell, melee dmg or buffs pet, no other description listed Ally Revivication - Improves reuse speed of combat res by 12 seconds Prayer of Healing - Improves single target direct heal amount by 2% and crit amount 3% Protective Prayer - Improves mit bonus of class mit buff by 3% Secular Protection - Improves resist bonus of class resist buff by 5% Seal of Faith - Increases shield effectiveness of caster by 2% Supplication of the Fallen - 24 man 100 meter range 100% power and HP revive applys rev sickness SHAMAN ARCHTYPE Ancestral Curse - Improves debuff amounts by 5% curse/haze lines Tribal Frenzy - Improved hp and pwr to the shamans single target buff Soiritual Storm - Improves base dmg 4% crit dmg 2% fuliginous sphere/cold flame line Kindred Restoration - Adds heal to shamans group ward 5 ranks Prophetic Spirit - Increase base and crit ward on single target ward 2% Ethereal Weaponry - 3 weapon bonus 4% dbl attack 5 ranks Ancient Pedigree - Adds additional hp to shamans pet and grants a special attack. No description listed. __________________

10-31-2008, 06:48 PM	#6
Macross_JR Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 547	what they are doing to overloaded heals is instead of each person having a chance to proc olh on a group heal/ward it will only proc once, there also is a 20m range on it now as well(no more zone wide olh procs). That is what they are doing to any proc that proc's a group effect, pondwash belt, and water sprinkler gloves also getting that nerf. __________________

10-30-2008, 10:09 PM	#2
tikasa Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 283	Nothing great.. Most of the skills just even out the 2 shamen classes. Oh and Temps got thier own Deathward...

10-31-2008, 07:15 PM	#7
Estean1 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 308	Can someone please post pics of the aa's maybe? or at least list what the defiler specific ones are. Not all of us got to see the leaked ones and would like to know what they are.. thank you __________________

10-31-2008, 11:23 PM	#8
SlickSlamander Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 5	Is alacrity still available or is it totally gone from the aa sets?

11-02-2008, 11:28 AM	#9
Rayche Server: Antonia Bayle Guild: Mayhem Rank: Alts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 519	The EOF and KOS AA tree's remain unmodified for Shamans. __________________ Rhandy Rhoades ~ 90 Troubador Kasey ~ 90 Bruiser Cometus ~ 82 Conjuror / 90 Master Sage Rayche ~ 81 Mystic / 90 Master Alchemist / 450 Adorning Tungar ~ 64 Necromancer / 80 Master Tailor Antonia Bayle Server

11-03-2008, 10:29 AM	#10
tikasa Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 283	Gimbel@Permafrost wrote: what they are doing to overloaded heals is instead of each person having a chance to proc olh on a group heal/ward it will only proc once, there also is a 20m range on it now as well(no more zone wide olh procs). That is what they are doing to any proc that proc's a group effect, pondwash belt, and water sprinkler gloves also getting that nerf. What this does not tell you though... I have 8 OLH type items. The changes seem to have gone too far. On average they seem to proc 1 time for every 8 heals cast. I have not seen more then 1 proc in 3 hours of continuous instances in Beta. With 8 items, at least 1 should proc every time or at worst every other time, but it is not workiing that way.

11-03-2008, 06:32 PM	#11
flowercivicsi Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Freeport Posts: 155	I checked to see if the image was available for the end line abilities, but the two links that I had to the defiler trees have been removed. Sawry That's typical for SoE to take things too far from one end of the spectrum to the other end of the spectrum. It takes some time to find that happy middle ground. I hope that they will be making some tweaks to this to make this better for you all in the future. However; you should never base all of your gear off of Overload or Overflow anyways. 2 is all you need. I have not pre-ordered this expansion yet as I have been debating purchasing it. I kinda feel like our class is the red-headed stepchild right now. We did not get a whole lot of attention this expansion, nor the last... remember "Deathward" Now they are giving clerics our Soulward, but instead of a ward it's a super heal that has a "better" conversion on our Soulward. Which we paid our AA's to earn that "end" ability, and defilers "were" the sacrifical healer. Just as shamans "were" the preventative healer. Again taking away from what makes our class unique. Now the prime healer, healer deity looks SWEET, but here's the kick in the tushy... it's another GOOD healer deity. The former prime healer is another evil tank deity! /sigh Not only are our uniqueness being taken away from us, but we lose out on yet another healing deity. A sad sad day for evil healers... Then looking at out new AA's was kinda funny... No one should have said remove the stifle from Pand as now we can waste AA's on it to be a DPS only spell... Deathward got a silly boost to make it somewhat useful... umm no thanks I know when I talked about deathward I was referring to the original ability lacking... I don't want to have to spend 10 AA points to make 2 abilities somewhat useful. __________________

11-03-2008, 08:52 PM	#12
tikasa Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 283	Alaocia@Guk wrote: I checked to see if the image was available for the end line abilities, but the two links that I had to the defiler trees have been removed. Sawry That's typical for SoE to take things too far from one end of the spectrum to the other end of the spectrum. It takes some time to find that happy middle ground. I hope that they will be making some tweaks to this to make this better for you all in the future. However; you should never base all of your gear off of Overload or Overflow anyways. 2 is all you need. I have not pre-ordered this expansion yet as I have been debating purchasing it. I kinda feel like our class is the red-headed stepchild right now. We did not get a whole lot of attention this expansion, nor the last... remember "Deathward" Now they are giving clerics our Soulward, but instead of a ward it's a super heal that has a "better" conversion on our Soulward. Which we paid our AA's to earn that "end" ability, and defilers "were" the sacrifical healer. Just as shamans "were" the preventative healer. Again taking away from what makes our class unique. Now the prime healer, healer deity looks SWEET, but here's the kick in the tushy... it's another GOOD healer deity. The former prime healer is another evil tank deity! /sigh Not only are our uniqueness being taken away from us, but we lose out on yet another healing deity. A sad sad day for evil healers... Then looking at out new AA's was kinda funny... No one should have said remove the stifle from Pand as now we can waste AA's on it to be a DPS only spell... Deathward got a silly boost to make it somewhat useful... umm no thanks I know when I talked about deathward I was referring to the original ability lacking... I don't want to have to spend 10 AA points to make 2 abilities somewhat useful. Look at the bonuses on the sets. It is quite obvious Templars are the healers. 15% heal crit 4% reuse time Shamen get 15% increase to the heal amount on OLH and a small damage proc on wards.. I would settle for a redheaded stepchild..... right now they are pushing hard for Templars to be in all 6 raid spots. just in .... ClericAdded combat art damage to the offensive stances.Overwhelming Arms now improves your chance to double attack.Healer stances now give a bonus to critical heal amounts.

11-04-2008, 01:52 PM	#13
Cheydak Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 110	Alaocia@Guk wrote: I checked to see if the image was available for the end line abilities, but the two links that I had to the defiler trees have been removed. Sawry That's typical for SoE to take things too far from one end of the spectrum to the other end of the spectrum. It takes some time to find that happy middle ground. I hope that they will be making some tweaks to this to make this better for you all in the future. However; you should never base all of your gear off of Overload or Overflow anyways. 2 is all you need. I have not pre-ordered this expansion yet as I have been debating purchasing it. I kinda feel like our class is the red-headed stepchild right now. We did not get a whole lot of attention this expansion, nor the last... remember "Deathward" Now they are giving clerics our Soulward, but instead of a ward it's a super heal that has a "better" conversion on our Soulward. Which we paid our AA's to earn that "end" ability, and defilers "were" the sacrifical healer. Just as shamans "were" the preventative healer. Again taking away from what makes our class unique. Now the prime healer, healer deity looks SWEET, but here's the kick in the tushy... it's another GOOD healer deity. The former prime healer is another evil tank deity! /sigh Not only are our uniqueness being taken away from us, but we lose out on yet another healing deity. A sad sad day for evil healers... Then looking at out new AA's was kinda funny... No one should have said remove the stifle from Pand as now we can waste AA's on it to be a DPS only spell... Deathward got a silly boost to make it somewhat useful... umm no thanks I know when I talked about deathward I was referring to the original ability lacking... I don't want to have to spend 10 AA points to make 2 abilities somewhat useful. You know, it's kind of sad that I'm dreading this expansion even more than the last one and if things aren't tweaked before it launches this may very well be it for me. I really don't understand why the balance among the healer classes is being skewed so out of line yet again. It's incredible that, once again, one of our unique abilities is being handed over to clerics only bigger and better than anything we had. This is really starting to feel like EQ1 all over again. If I wanted to be forced to play a cleric in order to be an effectual raid healer, I'd blow the dust off the one I have in EQ1 and play that instead. I'm also fed up with having more useless dps abilities rammed down my throat. If DPS was a primary concern of mine, I would have rolled a wizard...or a DE assassin. If they're that concerned with bumping up our dps then they could just revise the Intel line on the shaman tree and be done with it. Let us have the ability to enhance our primary role as HEALERS with the TSO AAs and help make up for the bilge we were forced to swallow in RoK. It's sad that the developers are still so out of touch. Like Tikasa said, at this point I'd settle for even being a red headed stepchild.

11-04-2008, 08:12 PM	#14
MalkorGodchyld Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 131	Our class has gotten progressively worse since DOF...throughout every expansion thereafter we've been chipped away at for no apparent reason. Nerf this here...nerf that. Switch this mechanic just a bit... lol. I saw the road this was leading to a long time ago & here we are...still going. Notice how other class forums are atleast semi excited about the expansion...some VERY excited. Us? a lot of us could care less that there's no screenies of our aa's etc. Im used to it now...but im starting not to just blame SOE's incompentance. I think its past time to question our community...if we sit here & take it up the rear every single time...well who's really to blame?? The person in charge of Defiler balance etc...him being a hopeless suck job isn't the only reason we get neglected. Thats just my opinion. Marius X

11-04-2008, 09:55 PM	#15
tikasa Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 283	I am waiting till the day of release... if nothing changes they loose 5 subscritions and 5 purchases of TSO. I am tired of all the excuses. We pay the bills, but they do not have enough people to fix the product we pay for,,, sad

11-05-2008, 04:34 PM	#16
flowercivicsi Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Freeport Posts: 155	__________________

11-05-2008, 05:38 PM	#17
MalkorGodchyld Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 131	What i would have been satisfied with Seal of Repulsion ~ Enhances Repulsion line of spells by allowing a % based reduction. 5% per rank ~ This was nerfed from a 32% stat reduction at the same time Mystics got bolster...a 20% stat increase. /boggle This in my opinion was what really tipped Defilers into the unbalanced category, which is especially evident on pvp servers. Devout Endurance ~ Stays the same ~ Hastened Poisoning ~ Reduces ALL DoT tick durations allowing dmg intervals to occur faster. 5% per rank ~ Our problem with dmg dealing isnt so much the lack of dmg abilities as it is, the fact that we do it TOO SLOW! Way out of line with any other healer in game. We are NOT a dps class...noted. But options and versatility are king in any gaming experience. Ancient Bulwark ~ Stays the same ~ Pandemic ~ Can stay the same but...dont make it a requirement to get max rank in the skill, in order to see a removal of the stun/stifle. That should be a choice left to the player as to whether they want to do increased dmg with healing reduction imo. Prophetic Protection ~ Personally i would have kept Deathward out of if completely...it sucks so either change it drastically or leave it alone! But since they bothered anyway... ~ Reduces recast by 5 sec & increases heal amount by 20% per rank~ The dmg reduction could work also assuming that it was done correctly. Fat chance though. There are quite a few other things that i would like to see tweaked to our class but this in particular. Our Crystallize Spirit line... I dont think it would be overpowered or unbalancing to see that spell changed instead to a % chance for an automatic stackable ward on the group. The clicky items are near useless, which in turn makes the aa line devoted to them...near useless. This one change would go a ways in not only making a very questionable skill useful, but balancing Defilers in pvp. Another thing to take note of is the casting penalties for our stances...Every healer class is NOT created equal & a casting time reduction for us, for any reason, is felt a bit more than others!!! The frustrating thing is that this took all of 5 min... And i can think of a few other Defilers who's ideas are just as solid without being unbalancing. Marius X

11-06-2008, 05:49 AM	#18
Besual Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 830	MalkorGodchyld wrote: What i would have been satisfied with Seal of Repulsion ~ Enhances Repulsion line of spells by allowing a % based reduction. 5% per rank ~ This was nerfed from a 32% stat reduction at the same time Mystics got bolster...a 20% stat increase. /boggle This in my opinion was what really tipped Defilers into the unbalanced category, which is especially evident on pvp servers. Sure, percent based statt reduction would be better then a flat one. But percent based spells have the tendency not to get upgraded. Anyway, I don't know how good / important the stat debuffs are because you can't see it in the parser. Devout Endurance ~ Stays the same ~ Hastened Poisoning ~ Reduces ALL DoT tick durations allowing dmg intervals to occur faster. 5% per rank ~ Our problem with dmg dealing isnt so much the lack of dmg abilities as it is, the fact that we do it TOO SLOW! Way out of line with any other healer in game. We are NOT a dps class...noted. But options and versatility are king in any gaming experience. Yes, mobs are often dead before a DoT has done all the ticks. Adding more damage backend dosn't make it better. Ancient Bulwark ~ Stays the same ~ Pandemic ~ Can stay the same but...dont make it a requirement to get max rank in the skill, in order to see a removal of the stun/stifle. That should be a choice left to the player as to whether they want to do increased dmg with healing reduction imo Yes, I would spent 1 point to get rid of the stuffle (don't care much about the root) but wasting 5 points... I think I will pass on this. Prophetic Protection ~ Personally i would have kept Deathward out of if completely...it sucks so either change it drastically or leave it alone! But since they bothered anyway... ~ Reduces recast by 5 sec & increases heal amount by 20% per rank~ The dmg reduction could work also assuming that it was done correctly. Fat chance though. Someone said the damage reduction last only 5sec. Hm, 5sec on a spell with 1min recast. Guess I will pass here too. There are quite a few other things that i would like to see tweaked to our class but this in particular. Our Crystallize Spirit line... I dont think it would be overpowered or unbalancing to see that spell changed instead to a % chance for an automatic stackable ward on the group. The clicky items are near useless, which in turn makes the aa line devoted to them...near useless. This one change would go a ways in not only making a very questionable skill useful, but balancing Defilers in pvp. Another thing to take note of is the casting penalties for our stances...Every healer class is NOT created equal & a casting time reduction for us, for any reason, is felt a bit more than others!!! The frustrating thing is that this took all of 5 min... And i can think of a few other Defilers who's ideas are just as solid without being unbalancing. Marius X __________________ The Nu-Team Defiler 90 / Provisioner 90 Berserker 90 / Jeweler 90 Brigant 90 / Alchemist 90 Coercer 90 / Sage 90

11-06-2008, 09:17 AM	#19
Macross_JR Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 547	The thing that is really confusing is acording to the wording on pandamic, even with 1 point in it, it should remove the stifle part. But in reality, in beta, it does not, you need to spend all 5 points to get rid of the stifle and root. I have bugged this twice but nothing has changed yet. __________________

11-06-2008, 11:29 AM	#20
Besual Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 830	Gimbel@Permafrost wrote: The thing that is really confusing is acording to the wording on pandamic, even with 1 point in it, it should remove the stifle part. But in reality, in beta, it does not, you need to spend all 5 points to get rid of the stifle and root. I have bugged this twice but nothing has changed yet. The screenshot here says "Also at maximum rank, the spell will no longer stifle and root the defiler." but SOE should change the first part of the description. BTW does the AA skill also reduce the mana regen part? I know with all the mythicals mana regen isn't an issue for many peoples (aka raiders) but sometimes I go with PUGs without mana regen / mythicals and mealstrom helped a bit in such situations. __________________ The Nu-Team Defiler 90 / Provisioner 90 Berserker 90 / Jeweler 90 Brigant 90 / Alchemist 90 Coercer 90 / Sage 90

11-06-2008, 01:41 PM	#21
flowercivicsi Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Freeport Posts: 155	FOR COMPARING PURPOSES Cleric Tree (Inquis & Templar) Templars... Inquisitor... DRUID: Fury... Warden: Mystic: __________________

11-06-2008, 02:05 PM	#22
Sedenten Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 680	I've been feedbacking the state of our healing stance since the first day I was in beta. The reduction in casting speed for non-damaging debuffs is one of the worst bonuses they could have given us. I honestly cannot tell a difference at all in the speed of casting them with/without the healer stance up (this is with Curseweaving trained). It speeds up Bane of Warding a noticeable amount, but I feel the bonus should be replaced with something else. My personal preference would be 10% casting speed to beneficials (to offset the fact we get 5% more to base heals over Mystics and they get 15% casting speed) or a lesser amount of reuse (5-10%) on beneficials. Our stance is still quite nice as long as you don't start comparing it to other healer stances. The 15% casting speed to non-damaging debuffs is just wasted on our class. I would think mystics would need it more, but I'm sure if they were given the choice they would rather have 15% to all beneficials than non-damaging debuffs.

11-06-2008, 03:04 PM	#23
Sedenten Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 680	I just noticed the major difference between the mystic and defiler healer stances--ours doesn't weaken our ability to debuff. Their stance makes all of their hostile spells (including damaging as well as non damaging debuffs) have a longer reuse as well as cost more power. Ours is restricted only to hampering damaging debuffs. I'm agreeing with them (mystics) that neither shaman should be penalized for non-damage debuffs and that both should get comparable casting speed or reuse to beneficials as part of their stances.

11-06-2008, 06:18 PM	#24
flowercivicsi Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Freeport Posts: 155	LOL right now thats the only downside of their healstance... Slows spells, but most mystics prefer their CA's so the downside of their heal stance is just debuffs. I'm sure SoE will update this soon to include CA's on their DPS stance, and on their Heal stance. However; I would be MORE than happy to trade out cast speed/reuse of beneficials for allowing them to debuff with no downsides! Other than that I can't complain too much about the stance... other than it seems soooo much like a copy past from Vanguard healers. More of the Shaman line that chaps my backside. YAY more dog bites... what were they thinking on that one. Gave us dog stuff from Litany of Combat, and another dog trick in our shaman tree... Dissapointing Seal even maxed at 20% is pathetic as it would you would not even get an additional 20 points to stat reduction. Granted we would finally have it in the 3 digit area, but still meh. - Perhaps doubling it to 40% maxed out would at least give us almost 40 points to play with upping the debuff @ M1 from 97 to 135 to STR, AGI, WIS. In it's current form you will go from 97 to 116 for 5 of our AA points. This is not worth the AA points in it's current state. Deathward - That was a great idea Malkor! If they would add 20% to the ward amount along with the damage reduction per a point that it would be more beneficial to add some points to that area. I know lets add a reactive to deathward, and make it's tick larger than the Templars single target reactive! I think that's only fair! Maelstrom - fix is laughable, and should be removed for something a little better. Crystalize line buffage, and I do like the idea of it being a ward, but if they want to do this with ease I would recommend 5% per a point increase to the heal amount. Since the heal is a small amount it would not be over powered by getting a 25% heal amount boost with 5 points spent, but it would be a little more useful for sticky situations. __________________

11-06-2008, 07:54 PM	#25
MalkorGodchyld Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 131	I made a post in the Testing forums you guys but its not all inclusive...i didnt cover all my bases so it would be awesome of some of you checked it out & chimed in. Thks Marius X

11-07-2008, 03:01 PM	#26
Blueboyke Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 14	Well from what I read here I think it's about time I say EQ2 goodbye... was the guild keeping me there for a long time anyway. Thou I read Defilers been nerfed for a few expansions now I'm still on top of the heal parses for most of the raids. However I don't like what they doing too the defiler class and the same goes for the serker class last few expansions. True I have a lvl80 Templar as well, but I really enjoyed playing the Defiler more. SoE seems to give people who ever made a Berserker, Monk or Defiler a reason too say goodbye to the game and that covers 3/4th of my lvl 80 toons. In the end it will only save me money thou, I'm subscribed to 2 other MMO's as well with multiple accounts and overthere they seem to be able to make the updates interesting for all classes. Too bad SoE has inhouse persons who 'think' they know what's good for some classes instead of getting good feedback from the vaste amount of good players before showing their silly ideas. Thanks god there's competition muahahhahahahaaaaaaa

11-07-2008, 04:26 PM	#27
flowercivicsi Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Freeport Posts: 155	I wish I could hop on beta to chime in and join in on the discussions, but only my boyfriends alt account was approved for beta. I have never been a card player so I did not hop on LoN to play for the beta key. /kicks self I sure hope the developers come to our little corner of the class forums to see that we still need some major changes to our Shaman & Defiler trees before this becomes set in stone. __________________

11-07-2008, 04:41 PM	#28
Cheydak Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 110	I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you, Aloacia. It's obvious where the priorities are and it isn't on Defilers at all the past few expansions. I have a feeling we're probably at the bottom of the list for every expansion. By the time they get to us someone just tosses some random junk onto paper thinking "Good enough! My work here is done."

11-07-2008, 06:02 PM	#29
Oakum Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 1,441	Cheydak wrote: I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you, Aloacia. It's obvious where the priorities are and it isn't on Defilers at all the past few expansions. I have a feeling we're probably at the bottom of the list for every expansion. By the time they get to us someone just tosses some random junk onto paper thinking "Good enough! My work here is done." I wouldnt say you are at the bottom of the list. Wardens have been there since LU-13. Most of the wardens who were played as mains are now little used alts in favor of more useful new mains. A lot of newer warden players are so used to the warden weakeness that they dont even realize how unbalanced they are compared their fellow druid (fury's) dps buffs compared to cleric and shamen, and group dps buffs compared to the other healers classes also. I guess its a case of ignorance is bliss for a lot of them, lol. __________________

11-07-2008, 06:18 PM	#30
Cheydak Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 110	I feel for you Oakum. My first main was a Warden which I dropped like a bad habit after LU 13 when SOE essentially gave the class a resounding kick in our collective backsides. I agree that Wardens have their own issues that really need to be addressed and resolved and I wholeheartedly back you in your efforts to do so. But, please don't denigrate the issues that the defiler class has had and will have and please don't derail this thread. Maybe they don't seem like game breakers to you but they are to us much the same way your issues are for Wardens.