Have Ranger been nerfed into utter gimpness?

[caliburns]

Seriously, rangers i need to know, i wanted to make one as an alt for pvp but if they are nerfed into nothingness like i hear i wont bother and instead you could give me info on another fun >GOOD< solo pvp class

[XEmericaSurfe]

On my ranger I went from killing blue druids to dying to green ones.

[caliburns]

Hay is that Runz? we fought afew times ^_- Heh.

[Magius789]

Short answer...yes.  The recent change to focus aim has pretty much removed our best ability.  Now I fear all we are is mages who can't do good dmg.  We have to stand still while attacking but if you get to close then our ranged stuff don't work, etc. etc.  So basically I'd roll something else if I were you.

[Wytie]

Thats crap, Rangers still own, just not in the lower levels too much.

Rangers still have the most control over their situation, its just not such an easy class to pvp with anymore it actually takes some work, go figure....  Welcome to the rest of the community.

Low level healers own, not just druids either

[yellowbelly08]

explain exactly how "rangers still own plx" what with our innability to crit auto much, and inability to crit ca much,,and with our innability to kite much..and with our innability to receive arrows of the same tier of our bows...and with out innability to...ahh [Removed for Content] it why am i listening to a lowby defiler anyway.

Galoro

[Badaxe Ba]

We still have......

Dang, I can't think of anything SOE has left us.  Oh yeah, Out of combat runspeed.  I will win many pvp fights with that!

/sarcasm off

[Dannd]

Its tougher now for sure, but not game ending.

Just have to learn new tactics while this issue gets addressed.  Although, I don't think they'll go back on their decision.  But our Rouge and Assassin brethren do need their temp buffs halted as well.

Does anyone know if Killing Instict and Honed still work? 

[Tybr]

From a PvP perspective....My god you guys loose one skill and it's the end of the world...seriously get a grip!Take away all of my skills and you know what ?....I'm still going to do my best to kick yer [Removed for Content].

[Magius789]

Wytie wrote:

Thats crap, Rangers still own, just not in the lower levels too much.

Rangers still have the most control over their situation, its just not such an easy class to pvp with anymore it actually takes some work, go figure....  Welcome to the rest of the community.

Low level healers own, not just druids either " width="15" height="15" />

Quit trolling on our boards. Defiler, SK, whatever your flavor of the month is quit talking about stuff you know nothing about!

[Deterre]

Tybr wrote:

From a PvP perspective....My god you guys loose one skill and it's the end of the world...seriously get a grip!It was the single best skill rangers have.Take away all of my skills and you know what ?....I'm still going to do my best to kick yer [I cannot control my vocabulary]. Yes, the key words here are "DO YOUR BEST" to kick butt. Not the same as just kicking butt.

[Krakelkr]

Killing instinct and honed reflexes still work. Not really a big deal though. No +ranged or +crit on those and only every 5.5 minutes.

[Badaxe Ba]

Tybr wrote:

From a PvP perspective....My god you guys loose one skill and it's the end of the world...seriously get a grip!Take away all of my skills and you know what ?....I'm still going to do my best to kick yer [I cannot control my vocabulary].

So just how does a one-legged man win a butt-kicking contest?

Answer:  petition for all others to lose both legs!

[Zechariah]

I think a more viable solution would not be to take away others legs but to add one to us (heh a 3rd leg). But seriously if all we do is damage then shouldnt we do the highest?  Give us something that makes us raid viable or something unique to us.  And don't say oh well you guys have tracking.  But don't all scouts?  And eq2maps is just as good to those classes without it.

[Gareorn]

Harry@Venekor wrote:

So just how does a one-legged man win a butt-kicking contest?

Answer:  petition for all others to lose both legs!

  LOL.  Someone's been cruising the wizzy forums again.

[littleman17]

This is just a pvp issue right? It would be one of the lamest things that soe has ever done if they gimped our best skill in pve too.

[RaunII]

pve or pvp im getting sick of the nerfs...i want my ranger to be my main but they keep ruining him...give him t8 ammo, and either better dps when using crappy bows, or more bow selection through ALL teirs...

look, both sides are right...the class is nerfed, but no, it isnt unplayable....its just getting really tough. not even pvp, just to pve and get decent dps or to small group or solo my ranger is starting to be a pain in the butt...add that fact that he has had horrid bow selection to choose from, and most gear no having + ranged or + ranged crit chance, or the buffs rangers really could make good use of.

I have to have masters just to out parse my wifes brigand who is in full apprentice 1's and 4s...and last i checked predators dps was SUPPOSED to be better than a rouges dps...i mean, rogues at least get usefull stuff to contribute to groups unlike rangers.

im sorry, but its really starting to look like the devs have decided they dont like rangers....its no longer about balancing....its not even a SOE giveth and taketh away...its like SOE taketh away enough i made another class cause no one wanted the class of my choice to group or raid with.

as long as there are good players out there rangers are still gonna get gimped. why? because...the way their CA's are set up, the damage they do in PVP is insane...even in duels on PVE servers is insane...if the ranger has a clue about what he is doing when i duel, he kicks my tail on my zerk and swashy...burst DPS some rangers can pull 1500+dps in duels...against plate tanks...if snares and stuns work its over. SOE is not balancing the right stuff...they are just randomly hitting things that affect EVERYTHING, not just PVP...and everyone is crying cause rangers can sometimes make the top of the parse if they are in the best gear in the game....SO WHAT??? they are a pure DPS class....in the best gear they should be at the top or near it.

seriously sony...balance us in other ways...get your stuff together...cause the stuff you are doing so far hasnt really helped anything, other than make groups,raids,and guilds want the character i wish i could make my main want me even less....

[inshiningarmor]

Zechariah@Mistmoore wrote:

I think a more viable solution would not be to take away others legs but to add one to us (heh a 3rd leg). But seriously if all we do is damage then shouldnt we do the highest?  Give us something that makes us raid viable or something unique to us.  And don't say oh well you guys have tracking.  But don't all scouts?  And eq2maps is just as good to those classes without it.

Scouts 

1. Rogues offer debuffs and great DPS
2. Bards debuffs and buffs
3. Preds DPS  ( Should be highest of scout class )

Casters

1. Enchanters offer great buffs and raid functionality
2. Summoners offer raid functionality and great DPS
3. Sorcerers DPS ( should be highest of all classes, (slightly above Preds due to no mitigation / one shots ))

[RaunII]

im in total agreement. i dont want to see my swashy get skills or dps taken away just because the devs got to liberal with the nerf bat on rangers...i dont want TWO classes that suck.  I just want them to finally say: "its ok that rangers are close to topping the parse and out parsing rogues, they are supposed to". heck, even assasins get hate transfer and in smaller raid guilds get put in the MT group...my ranger has nothing...and now that miracle shot is toast im not even good for pulls...the pet classes and healers with pets took over that role.

just up our DPS, stop taking away from us, and find other ways to balance us in PVP and in duels, rather than other measures...there has to be better ways to balance the class out...and regardless, find ways to balance our PVP and duels WITHOUT affecting player vs enviroment. i still want to be usefull on raids or groups...i mean, where do we draw the line? when we can no longer take on a green triple down? or when we cant get into even a casual raid guild with a ranger even if we know people? at what point will the class become unplayable?

[Pletia]

Sorry, but I don't really see a nerf there.. look my auto attack in PvP combat.. 3477 dmg.. AFTER ""nerf"". Ok, maybe before nerf it was 4k, but.. 3.5k or 4k.. still don't really make a big difference to me. Just need to learn to play little bit different, and you will still get about the same amount of DPS in PvP.

[Krakelkr]

letia@Nagafen" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Pletia@Nagafen wrote:

snip

Sorry, but I don't really see a nerf there.. look my auto attack in PvP combat.. 3477 dmg.. AFTER ""nerf"". Ok, maybe before nerf it was 4k, but.. 3.5k or 4k.. still don't really make a big difference to me. Just need to learn to play little bit different, and you will still get about the same amount of DPS in PvP.

How can I? my crits are as high as before but I don't crit as often = lower dps.

[RaunII]

   "Sorry, but I don't really see a nerf there.. look my auto attack in PvP combat.. 3477 dmg.. AFTER ""nerf"". Ok, maybe before nerf it was 4k, but.. 3.5k or 4k.. still don't really make a big difference to me. Just need to learn to play little bit different, and you will still get about the same amount of DPS in PvP."

ok, there is the issue...they are nerfing the wrong stuff, rangers are still capable of creaming just about anyone at pvp, so people are still screaming for us to be nerfed....however they are gimping the wrong stuff, which means GOOD rangers will still be completely destroying everyone on pvp servers or in pve duels...

but, they continue to throw random nerfs at us in a attempt to balance us out...however, these nerfs are affecting PVE combat on PVP servers because they affect combat arts and actual DPS. not to mention, no matter what anyone says, its alot more work to make the pve and pvp servers have differant mechanics for differant classes to keep things balanced, so most tweaking that affects pvp affects us on the pve servers.

the ranger class was not designed with pvp in mind from what i can tell, and in a attempt to make them "even", they are chucking random "debuffs" at our class in a attempt to level the playing field. while i dont have a ranger on pvp, i can say from a PVE perspective that since i made my ranger last year it has just been one big long NERF...

I want to play my ranger, but I am afraid to make him my main because every LU they get a little more worthless on the PVE server and guilds and groups want them a little less...im not wasting time on him if eventually he wont be able to solo unless he is in fabled set armour and has the best bow in the game.

[Kage8]

Whats with all the PvP crap? I dont give a [Removed for Content] about PvP and it really pisses me off when my class get nearfed cause of some punks on PvP crying about balance.Change the rules on PvP all u want on the PvP servers but stop messing up a good class for PvP reasons. EQ2 is a PvE game. Its not WoW. If u get owned by rangers on PvP cause there uber too bad.

[Theodrec]

Kage848 wrote:

Whats with all the PvP crap? I dont give a [I cannot control my vocabulary] about PvP and it really pisses me off when my class get nearfed cause of some punks on PvP crying about balance.Change the rules on PvP all u want on the PvP servers but stop messing up a good class for PvP reasons. EQ2 is a PvE game. Its not WoW. If u get owned by rangers on PvP cause there uber too bad.

True that it is a pvp issue.  But to remove perhaps our most defining dps skill COMPLETELY much discussion or notice because of other players whining is about all I can stand.  It is extremely frustrating that for my favorite class I have undergone nothing but a consistent and steady stream of nerfs.  And as to focus aim - I honestly don't get it.As to the Nagafen problem.  I believe the numbers are terribly skewed by the sheer number of ranger wannabes that play.  If you are opposing faction odds are you are going to be frustratingly ganked by the class because they are so predominant.In the end, I do not feel we are a balanced class.  We are nothing but sheer dps, yet not at the top when compared with casters.  The dps gap between ranger and rogues is not nearly wide enough to overcome the amount of buffs/debuffs they bring to the table compared with us.  I wont even acknowledge the caster haters here.  We are not balanced because we are not slotted co rrectly in the dps/utility curve that SOE appears to strive for.  In the end I have pride in my ranger and will withstand unlike some.  But I do want rangers to speak even more loudly.  It is time the devs give us serious consideration in the grand scheme of things.  And for the devs who obviously think we are just right - you are just wrong.Theodorik - 72 ranger of Nagafen

[Badaxe Ba]

To Pletia,

what bow did you have equipped, and what arrows were you using?  I notice that you are now level 73, what level and class was your opponent?  Also, you are in a group in that screenshot, but I can't quite make out what buffs you might have had that would help increase your damage, if any.  Also, what is your STR?

Asking these questions to try to gather information on the disparity between high top end rangers and the average ranger.

I've had autoattack hit for 4k in PvE, I've never had one hit for that in PvP, not even close.  Not even 3k.

[Pletia]

Harry@Venekor wrote:

To Pletia,

what bow did you have equipped, and what arrows were you using?  I notice that you are now level 73, what level and class was your opponent?  Also, you are in a group in that screenshot, but I can't quite make out what buffs you might have had that would help increase your damage, if any.  Also, what is your STR?

Asking these questions to try to gather information on the disparity between high top end rangers and the average ranger.

I've had autoattack hit for 4k in PvE, I've never had one hit for that in PvP, not even close.  Not even 3k.

I was in same group than the screen shot. It was Berserker, Warden, Swash and me (Ranger). So with Berserker STR buff I'm guessing I was maybe at 600-620 STR. The Melee/Ranged buff of Warden was on Swash. But in PvP I almost alway hit for 2.5k+ auto attack, I use the bow from Claymore.. Byzle something or w/e it's called with T8 crafted arrow. I was level 73 on that screen shot, the enemy was 71.. Didn't look at the class.

[Runewind]

Gotta say, we're not as powerful as before and we've certainly been nerfed hard... but I can still solo any yellow or lower Heroic ^^^ mob so long as I have room to kite and I still top every parse I'm on so long as I'm not DRASTICALLY out geared.

[Krakelkr]

Pletia@Nagafen wrote:

Harry@Venekor wrote:

To Pletia,

what bow did you have equipped, and what arrows were you using?  I notice that you are now level 73, what level and class was your opponent?  Also, you are in a group in that screenshot, but I can't quite make out what buffs you might have had that would help increase your damage, if any.  Also, what is your STR?

Asking these questions to try to gather information on the disparity between high top end rangers and the average ranger.

I've had autoattack hit for 4k in PvE, I've never had one hit for that in PvP, not even close.  Not even 3k.

I was in same group than the screen shot. It was Berserker, Warden, Swash and me (Ranger). So with Berserker STR buff I'm guessing I was maybe at 600-620 STR. The Melee/Ranged buff of Warden was on Swash. But in PvP I almost alway hit for 2.5k+ auto attack, I use the bow from Claymore.. Byzle something or w/e it's called with T8 crafted arrow. I was level 73 on that screen shot, the enemy was 71.. Didn't look at the class.

Wow. Very impressive. What am I doing wrong... Even with close to capped dps mod and 600 str I've almost never hit 2k+ on auto attack using that same bow. T8 arrows would help but surely not that much.Nowadays my dps mod solo sits at around 100 in pvp and crit at 25%, str 550 or a bit higher. I'm nowhere near my old dps in pvp, I estimate it to be about 30-40% lower compared to my old focus aim dps and that is huge. I can raise that perhaps 10% tops by swapping eq and respeccing.I hope it gets better as I level.

[jarlaxle8]

Magius789 wrote:

The recent change to focus aim...

Did I miss the memo? What change?

[Krakelkr]

Ryilan@Runnyeye wrote:

Magius789 wrote:

The recent change to focus aim...

Did I miss the memo? What change?

Focus aim was disabled in pvp combat, it cancels. It's pvp servers only.