Fan Faire Discussion

[Sandain666]

Hello Fellow Mystics,

I am planning to attend the 2007 Fan Faire. What are the major issues that bother mystics the most? If this Fan faire is like ones past there will be a forum for class discussion. Hopefully I can raise some questions there. Two issues seem to have been constant themes for many mystics

1) Lack of HP on "Dogdog"

2) Lack of communication concerning the SOW AA speed reduction (especially considering it was live for quite awhile)

 Are there any other concerns? One thing that always bothered me was the incredible lack of decent quality one-handed-spears in the game.

Sandain

[canislupus64]

I would say:

1.) Power Regen capabillity compared to defilers

2.) Priest auto damage being too low, since we have multiple AA's regarding melee damage (EoF combat line)

3.) Stamina curve being too high, by this i mean even if we buff a tank to 800 sta, they get very minimal hp from it 1-2 hp per sta.

4.) Why is ancestry a single target buff while all other trigger augments are group? (dirge, templar and warlock are all group)

5.) maybe the possiblity of making Weapon mastery a single target buff, then we could put it on a tank thus giving us purpose and a use in a tank group.

6.) Changing the effects on our class armor becasue we all love symettry X as our 7 piece.

7.) Changing the effect on our fabled set legs, there are far more useful effects then uping the amound our big heal heals for.

8.) maybe adding a little shaman loot into the EoF tables, as far as our fable set pieces, i have only seen the hat off PHH which was decent.

Well this is all i can think of for the time being, give me a day and i can think of others.

I am not sure if you are a raider, so i will just say that these are my view points as a raider in one of the top guilds world wide. There is a very good spear off matron (spear of the mighty grutan), there is the serpentil spear from labs, pernumbral spear from cube mobs. but i know what you mean, i have not seen too many shaman friendly spears in EoH.

[Sandain666]

Canislupus64 

Thanks much for the reply. I totally agree with you about those areas of concern. Sorry but in my original post I forgot to ask for possible solutions to the problems. For every Fan Faire I have attended the EQ Reps have always been more responsive to people who give practical solutions to the problems we experience in game. What would you like to see done ? This will make it alot easier for me if I only have a couple of minutes to speak. (Which is usually the case)

[Prrasha]

canislupus64 wrote:

4.) Why is ancestry a single target buff while all other trigger augments are group? (dirge, templar and warlock are all group)

That one's easy... because ours is so much better!  Ours increases the proc percent by a flat amount, so the very-strong-but-seldom-triggered effects are increased greatly by our buff.  The proc rate has to be up in the teens to start with for the percent-of-existing-proc-rate buffs from others to be more effective than ours... I'd rather have a big boost to my tank's proc rates than a watered-down groupwide boost to everyone.  (I mean, where does the Warlock-style one out-boost ours?  On the dirge's disease-proc buff line?  Woohoo!)

[canislupus64]

The warlocks line is a straight 3% group buff in essence a group version of ancestry.

1.) Power Regen capability compared to defilers

On this one i am not too sure how they could fix this. As on now defilers have a spell (forced cannibalize) and an AA (cannibalize). Short of giving us a spell the only logical thing would be a mystic only item with a cannibalize effect on it, much like the tribal spiritualist hat, but  maybe on our class hat, possibly double the mana given while keeping the damage and cast time the same.

2.) Priest auto damage being too low, since we have multiple AA's regarding melee damage (EoF combat line)

This would affect all priest but move our damage to be more in line with fighter melee power. Not sure if they would go for it but all priest would not mind the extra damage.

3.) Stamina curve being too high, by this i mean even if we buff a tank to 800 sta, they get very minimal hp from it 1-2 hp per sta.

This would require a lowering of the steep stamina curve. it should be more in line with the wisdow curve for priest. about 3-4 hp per sta.

4.) Why is ancestry a single target buff while all other trigger augments are group? (dirge, templar and warlock are all group)

Self-explanatory. Just make it a group buff instead of single target.

5.) maybe the possiblity of making Weapon mastery a single target buff, then we could put it on a tank thus giving us purpose and a use in a tank group.

Self-explanatory. Again make this a single target buff and not a passive ability. By sacrificing the hp given by a defiler a tank could have increased parry bonus and increased melee skills in piercing in crush. It not an all around spell but would give us person in a tank group.

6.) Changing the effects on our class armor becasue we all love symettry X as our 7 piece.

I would like to see something thats not a generic effect. Look at the warden set bonus. its unique our is just an effect placed on a very of items. I am sure the devs are coming up with ideas, i would really like to see nice, nothing comes right to the mind maybe an effect to increase the ward amount of runic aegis and the mit buff of it.

7.) Changing the effect on our fabled set legs, there are far more useful effects then uping the amound our big heal heals for.

i would not mind seeing the 5 piece bonus effect as the effect on legs. These legs drop off one of the hardest mobs, it should be the best. The leggings of corruption from matron should not be better than them.

8.) maybe adding a little shaman loot into the EoF tables, as far as our fable set pieces, i have only seen the hat off PHH which was decent.

 This an item and dev team decision.

One of the other things is i would not mind seeing some of the set pieces increased in stats, with the normal being 30-40 of a stat per stat. Say the item is supposed to be int,sta, and wis there should be about 100-120 of total stats, not about 70

[Prrasha]

canislupus64 wrote:

The warlocks line is a straight 3% group buff in essence a group version of ancestry.

Does Ancestry affect all procs, or just procs based on spells?  The Warlock version specifies that it does not affect item-based procs, and the Mystic one doesn't, so it should affect proccing items as well.  (I have an alt of both classes, but neither has gathered enough AAs to play with those skills.) Anyway, mea culpa for my earlier post that lumped all the other proc increasers into the same bin... the warlock one is (apparently) inferior for a different reason.

[Sandain666]

So what should be our top 10 concerns? I am trying to prioritize by issues that first affect all or most Mystics of all levels and play types then go down to more specific issues such as itemization and end game play.

1) Dogodog: a) more HP  or upgrade from a triple down or both b) cast time reduction

2)Stamina Curve too high needs: a) Stamina curve for preist spells needs raise. maybe 3-4 HP per stamina point

 Care to help me round out the rest. Or perhaps add more solutions to what I have already?

Sandain

[Rythen16]

I like most of Canislupus64's concerns. I"m not too sure the power regen suggestion would fly, but still a good point.

I would like to see Mystics get some type of utility spell/ability. Most other priests get some type of spell like odyssey (sp??), evac, group invis, port ability. We did have a fast run speed until they slowed our SoW even slower than others. So now we are the slowest (along with defilers, I believe) healers to get around.

Zogarr, 70 Mystic, Everfrost

[Zelkova]

Both defilers and mystics should have a cannibalize line. Always struck me as odd that mystics have NONE whatsoever, when lore-wise, they are so much more closely related to what shamans in EQ were. It wouldn't affect balance in anyway. Though, that being said... mystics are not defilers so you shouldn't simply expect to have equal abilities. As was stated, Ancestry affects ALL procs. It is not always superior to the group versions, but in a lot of situations, it really is. Complain about it if you must, but do so at your own risk!

[Fippe]

Lepios@Kithicor wrote:

I would say:

1.) Power Regen capabillity compared to defilers

2.) Priest auto damage being too low, since we have multiple AA's regarding melee damage (EoF combat line)

3.) Stamina curve being too high, by this i mean even if we buff a tank to 800 sta, they get very minimal hp from it 1-2 hp per sta.

4.) Why is ancestry a single target buff while all other trigger augments are group? (dirge, templar and warlock are all group)

5.) maybe the possiblity of making Weapon mastery a single target buff, then we could put it on a tank thus giving us purpose and a use in a tank group.

6.) Changing the effects on our class armor becasue we all love symettry X as our 7 piece.

7.) Changing the effect on our fabled set legs, there are far more useful effects then uping the amound our big heal heals for.

8.) maybe adding a little shaman loot into the EoF tables, as far as our fable set pieces, i have only seen the hat off PHH which was decent.

Fully agree with Lepios, those are the main main concerns. Would also like to add:

1. That the AOE immunity on doggy is very unreliable for some EoF content. For encounters in EH or MIS I'd say doggy have a 50% chance of actually not eating AE rendering our whole str AA line useless for those mobs.

2. That Oberon is not possible to cast over groups in raids. Since the diminishing returns cure of sta is putting us outside mt group in most cases I would like to be able to use this ability on the MT. Kind of sucks that we cant use our "class defining spell" on raids.

[Kal]

Even if it doesnt concern most of the mystic, I would think of a change on the bonus for 5 items on pvp armor set. Its currently a increase of 4 seconds duration on wards. Pvp and raid wise, I dont think ward last the full 30 sec very foten. So 34 is  useless.

[icetower]

Solution: Dogdog needs more hps and to be made immune to EVERYTHING that is not a direct attack, including riposte and damage shields. End of story.

Why ?

The pathing mechanics in this game are not good enough to stop random ripostes.

A lot more mobs have damage shields in EoF, making a 500 hp dog impossible to use.

As an extra note, Dogdog misses all the toughest named mobs on most attacks, making his procs even more useless.

Really, could there be a less reliable or a more frustrating basis for an entire AA setup.

In relation to stat diminishing returns, I would like to ask the devs why they think it is fair for us to use one extra spell (avatar), devote an entire AA line to augments, yet still get less results than Defilers. Frankly, it [I cannot control my vocabulary] sucks.

Defilers debuff faster, with less resists, heal for more, buff for more hps using less spells and AA, monopolise a spot in the MT group (unless they are moronic), cure thru stun, can (situationally) beat our dps with a single spell, and all of this with superior mana regen. Seriously, W..T..F..!!!

Armour sets: Decrease cast times on healing spells or wards, or change our useless rez and cure AA to have the same effect.  The stuff we have now is garbage.

If templars can get 33% faster cast times for all spells on their non fabled armour, when clerics already have 2 AA lines to hasten casting, there is no reason for us not to get a reduction in cast time for our painfully slow group heals.

Feel free to print this out and staple it to a devs head at FF.

[canislupus64]

One big thing i have noticed when killing avatars and contested mobs, there is alot more curing going on, so the 5 sec cast time of group wards sucks when you got to cure an effect every 4 seconds.

Not to mention the world of stuns mobs have and how useless ancient balm is.

BTW i am canislupus, i ust changed my forum name to my main chars name.

[Sa'meria]

Pharli@Runnyeye wrote:

Lepios@Kithicor wrote:

I would say:

1.) Power Regen capabillity compared to defilers

2.) Priest auto damage being too low, since we have multiple AA's regarding melee damage (EoF combat line)

3.) Stamina curve being too high, by this i mean even if we buff a tank to 800 sta, they get very minimal hp from it 1-2 hp per sta.

4.) Why is ancestry a single target buff while all other trigger augments are group? (dirge, templar and warlock are all group)

5.) maybe the possiblity of making Weapon mastery a single target buff, then we could put it on a tank thus giving us purpose and a use in a tank group.

6.) Changing the effects on our class armor becasue we all love symettry X as our 7 piece.

7.) Changing the effect on our fabled set legs, there are far more useful effects then uping the amound our big heal heals for.

8.) maybe adding a little shaman loot into the EoF tables, as far as our fable set pieces, i have only seen the hat off PHH which was decent.

Fully agree with Lepios, those are the main main concerns. Would also like to add:

1. That the AOE immunity on doggy is very unreliable for some EoF content. For encounters in EH or MIS I'd say doggy have a 50% chance of actually not eating AE rendering our whole str AA line useless for those mobs.

2. That Oberon is not possible to cast over groups in raids. Since the diminishing returns cure of sta is putting us outside mt group in most cases I would like to be able to use this ability on the MT. Kind of sucks that we cant use our "class defining spell" on raids.

I totally agree with these as well. Oberon and the mutt getting beat down all the time being the top 2 for me.

Personally I would like to see our health increase from our direct heals increase in amount and duration, something that is more noticeable. Give us a reason to use them more often.

[Albiw]

- I agree - it would really be nice to be able to cast Oberon barrier across groups in a raid.

- The casting time on dogdog is a big pet peeve for me - not sure why it has to be as long as it is

- The AA enhancements to our cures ward too low of an amount to be useful

- I'd like to see the AA combat art abilities be ranged like their spell counterparts are

- bigger healing range for umbral attendant

I know this is a very general gripe, but... I feel like when I am picking out AA's for my mystic, I am making decisions based on what is less worthless rather than what is most beneficial.  I think there are some much more useful AA possibilities that would help us without overpowering us... (decrease cast time on group ward and encounter debuffs maybe?  reduced reuse time on our de-agro, group cure or ancient balm?  - just some ideas)

[ScurvyTRatt]

Albiwon wrote:

- I agree - it would really be nice to be able to cast Oberon barrier across groups in a raid.

- The casting time on dogdog is a big pet peeve for me - not sure why it has to be as long as it is

- The AA enhancements to our cures ward too low of an amount to be useful

- I'd like to see the AA combat art abilities be ranged like their spell counterparts are

- bigger healing range for umbral attendant

I know this is a very general gripe, but... I feel like when I am picking out AA's for my mystic, I am making decisions based on what is less worthless rather than what is most beneficial.  I think there are some much more useful AA possibilities that would help us without overpowering us... (decrease cast time on group ward and encounter debuffs maybe?  reduced reuse time on our de-agro, group cure or ancient balm?  - just some ideas)

I agree about the AA Enhancements on the cures. Would like to see about double what it does now too really be worth it.

And number one that [Removed for Content] sow nerf! Came out of nowhere and really [Removed for Content] me off that no one will comment on it. Not even lip service like "We are looking into it" just nothing at all. Just nerf and run. It seriously bothered me, I have played about 2 hours of EQ2 since the nerf. I would love it if you could ask why they did it, and why they feel it makes more people play EQ2.

[Sandain666]

Thanks for all of the input so far. I will try and take everyone input and consilidate everything into a list. Keep the idea coming!

Sandain

[Albiw]

A couple more things, and maybe someone can clarify a little better than I can on this one... Runic Aegis conflicts with some Cleric buff... the bottom line is I get told not to use runic aegis frequently when I am grouped with a cleric. 

This may be knitpicking, but - I'd like to see the spell description on Oberon and Oberon Barrier improved to include the regeneration rate of the ward

Also, change the description on umbral attendant - "summons a limited pet to aid the caster" isn't a very good description.

[Sandain666]

OK VERY ROUGH DRAFT below. Let the input begin!!! I tried to shorten things to make them as easily readable as possible

1) Dogodog: Pet too weak, too long to cast, AE immunity not working in some encounters (specifically Mistmoore Inner Sanctum and Emerald Halls) , Dogdog misses all the toughest named mobs on most attacks, making his procs even more useless

Solution: a) more HP or upgrade from a triple down or both Solution: b) cast time reduction Solution: c) fix AE immunity Solution: d make immune to EVERYTHING that is not a direct attack, including riposte and damage shields Solution: e Make Dogdog hit more often

2.) Power Regen capability compared to defilers: Solution: Give mystics cannibalize type spell, AA or item

3.) Priest auto damage being too low, since we have multiple AA's regarding melee damage (EoF combat line) Solution: Increase Priest autodamage

4)Stamina Curve too high needs: Solution: Stamina curve for priest spells needs to rise. maybe 3-4 HP per stamina point

5.) Ancestry : single target buff needs change Solution: Make it a group buff instead of single target (WITHOUT NERFING IT PLEASE).

6.) Weapon Mastery Self buff needs change: Solution Make Weapon mastery a single target buff, then we could put it on a tank thus giving us purpose and a use in a tank group. By sacrificing the hp given by a defiler a tank could have increased parry bonus and increased melee skills in piercing in crush. It not an all around spell but would give us person in a tank group.

7.) Changing the effects on our class armor. (symmetry X as our 7 too generic). Something that's not a generic effect. Look at the warden set bonus. Maybe an effect to increase the ward amount of runic aegis and the mit buff of it.

8.) Change the effect on our fabled set leg Solution: Make the 5 piece bonus effect as the effect on legs. These legs drop off one of the hardest mobs, it should be the best. The leggings of corruption from matron should not be better than them.

9.) maybe adding more shaman loot into the EoF tables some of the set pieces need increased stats ,if int,sta, and wis there should be about 100-120 of total stats, not about 70

10)Oberon : Cannot cast outside of group Solution : Make Oberon castable outside of group in Raid

11) The AA enhancements to our cures ward too low of an amount to be useful Solution: At least Double the amount of ward

12) Umbral Attendant: Solution: Increase healing range. Current healing range is too short to be useful

13) Mystics need some type of utility. Other priests get odyssey ,evac, group invis or ports. Possible solution: A spell that will pull a corpse to the mystics feet for agrro free rezzing.

General concerns

Lack of communication concerning the SOW AA speed reduction

General wish list

AA possibilities: A) decrease cast time on group ward, encounter debuffs B) reduced reuse time on our de-agro, group cure or ancient balm C) some type of cure through stun

Armor sets A) Decrease cast times on healing spells or wards,

[Sandain666]

So looks like alot has changed on the Mystic end of things since I first posted this topic. Are there any new issues we need to address? From reading various posts I think our pet is a major area of concern for almost everyone so I will definately try to speak about that.  Is there anyway we could get some type of consensus on what our top concerns or fixes should be?

1)Pet : low HP, Cast time too long, AE immunity dicey, Needs immunity to riposte and damage shields, needs hit more often

2)

3)

more...

If you do post a concern please post a possible fix. As before I am hoping to get Mystic specific concerns as I am sure plenty of others will cover general priest concerns 

[Sandain666]

I was only able to squeeze one question in at Fanfaire  Mystics need some type of utility. Other priests get odyssey ,evac, group invis or ports. I was told by Lockeye our utility spell is SOW. I don't get the feeling Mystic issues will be looked into anytime soon and with the lack of activity on these forums I cannot blame them at all Sandain

[Owlbe]

Give the dog disease based attack so it will not eat ripostes!

[rvbarton]

Any form of PVP skill that would give us a bit of defensive help.  Perhaps make is so that our wards are not removed via Pumice stones? 

any form of defensive assistance would be nice.  I don't mind dying in PVP.  I'm used to it.  But I'd like to last more than 3 - 5 seconds, and if this issue could simply be discussed, that would be great!

[Rythen16]

What!!!!!!!!!!! You asked about getting mystics some utility and Lockeye answered that SoW was our utility!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Holy crap! Does he know that when they nerfed our 50% SoW down to 40% (with AA's) that our SoW is the slowest SoW once AA's are added!!!! Other enhanced SoW's are 45% and we get 40% and that's our utility.

Wow, that's all I have to say. Wow. I guess I see how much attention good 'ol Lockeye is paying attention to us.

[Sandain666]

Rythen16 wrote:

What!!!!!!!!!!! You asked about getting mystics some utility and Lockeye answered that SoW was our utility!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Holy crap! Does he know that when they nerfed our 50% SoW down to 40% (with AA's) that our SoW is the slowest SoW once AA's are added!!!! Other enhanced SoW's are 45% and we get 40% and that's our utility.

Wow, that's all I have to say. Wow. I guess I see how much attention good 'ol Lockeye is paying attention to us.

Yes they know. Lockeye is the one responsible for bringing down the Sow aa "into balance"

[SnAke19]

It´s sad too see that only the classes screaming loudest get heard - we mysts get punished for patiently waiting devs recognize the problems themselfs (and now when some are rising their voices they still count us as unimportant matters) with eof i would say we mysts got worst tree of all a ill-conceived cureline which doesn´t suit to our class --> too long cast times for some of our spells-canceling them for the need of a cure can be fatal - other thing is that we have nothing to protect us from stuns/stifles(thinking on mobs like gardener thirgen)->makes us not very suited for this job (with the recast reduction of immunnization it got a little better - but we still have nothing to cure us from  such effekts which not in all cases could be timed accurate enough that its 15 sec duration protects us save) a rezzline with no use at all - with little exceptions all mysts agree - but we have to have it... a buffline which is ok - but compared to other classes no big deal a dmgline - we are more or less forced to take considering the uselessness of all other (some mysts are happy being able to do some dmg , others sad to have nothing to make their classdefining abilities-wards/debuffs- any better) other big term over all of this is that in end game fights are considered to take longer and longer but we´ve gained nothing to have enough power for those long fights ->fighting mobs like majong or wuoshi i have to count my wards/heals (sometimes concentrate more on manareg than healing) for not going oom untill fight is over while other healers could spam their heals with no prob at all (and thats already with nearly all manareg/leach items available in game) - and that´s let alone from real long avatar fights

[Finora]

Sandain666 wrote:

Yes they know. Lockeye is the one responsible for bringing down the Sow aa "into balance"

Into balance??? Really. In balance with what? The bards who thought that they should be the fastest things going since EQ1 bards were? In balance with the warden sow that is not only faster than ours but lasts longer? The fury's perma runspeed buff that is pretty darn speedy? (I don't know exact numbers atm I'd have to log on my fury and add it up). The rangers, who are faster than the druids?

/glower

The only runspeed buffer that is worse is the defilers. Poor slow defilers. But they get so much other good stuff with the aa's.