looking at either a mystic or a defiler how are they differnt?

[Barbai]

Hello everone I am currently looking at making a shaman but not sure of the difference between the two and figured I would get opionions from both.  My current playstyle is that of a troub and I tried the druid lines before and didn't like it that much atleast in the first 15 levels or so. My  main thing is solo abiliity something the healer types are often weak, I know nearly all healers are accepted in a group but how mystics what things to they bring to a group I'm used to minor dps and some minor buffs is it basicly just buffs and wards from mystics and defiliers?Forgot to ask as far as equipment how easy is it to get the good equipment for this type most chain I seen is for the scout types and leathers being made for priest.

Message Edited by Barbai on 01-14-2007 08:54 PM

[SonnyA]

Mystics are better debuffers. Defilers are better buffers and have slightly better heals.

They don't have any soloability. They can do it, but it's slow as hell.

It's pretty easy to get good equipment, but there are 8 chain classes in the game, 6 plate classes, 6 cloth classes and only 4 leather classes. So you'll be contesting for chain drops in group/raid situations more often.

If you want to be a healer with good soloability and easy access to items, go fury..

[Eileithia]

Just to clarify Sonny's post..

Mystics are better AE Debuffers - Defilers are better Single target. Both are able to hit the cap for slows/DPS reduction..
Mystics buff Stats (STR/STA/AGI etc) - Defilers buff Raw HP/Power.
Wards are Identical
Mystics have a small HP buff on their heals - Defilers heal for more, but cast times are slower.
Defilers have slightly higher DPS from spell damage - Mystics have more Melee DPS due to STR buffs.

Basically the classes are fairly well balanced when you look at the overall picture, really you should be asking Should i live in Freeport or Qeynos..

There are a ton of Mystic vs Defiler posts all over the boards, so I'd suggest doing a search if you want more detailed information..

And like Sonny said, if you want a healer who can solo well, Fury would be your best choice.. Good heals, and great DPS (for a priest) at later levels.

[Vulking]

I agree with SonnyA.

Shamans have virtually no solo ablity beyond maybe level 20.  And I only say that because getting to level 20 is pretty fast.  They are one of the most group dependent classes there are.

Again, if you want to solo, fury all the way.

[Nregnen]

In the early days....pre LU7 or so.....we mystics had a melee component to our bear form, which made it cost 3 concentration.  A reasonable sacrifice to group buffs so that you could solo more effectively.  However, that was removed for whatever reason.  Singing and rejoicing happened at LU13 because our wards finally worked.  But ever since then we've recieved no love and were basically screwed with end-game content due to stat caps, thus always taking 2nd seat to defilers(buffs direct to HP's/power). 

 

That has finally changed with the new stat caps AND a new mystic tree ability that you probably have seen.  The bear maul is BACK!!!!  At no extra charge then a few AP's you can add up to a 25% chance(increments of 5) to proc a slashing melee attack of around 250-400 (at lvl 70).  stack this with the Agil line end ability, and you have yourself a pretty powerful melee healer dmg dealer.  Solo i can do up to 500dps consistantly with that setup on blue con stuff(writs and such).  But I'm extremely pleased with the return of our Bear Maul.  love it.  Just a bit of info to keep in mind while making your shaman..

 

Oh, explanation of the Agil line i mentioned in case you havn't created the char yet..... costs 8 points of course....basically 35% chance to cast if you attack/arehit/deathblow to increase your attack speed by 35% and 35% chance to double attack.  Combine this with your 50% chance to crit hit (potential for 100% chance with 8 points, but i passed on that in order to max both lines STR/AGIL)using a 2h spear with a proc(also gives you a melee attack from agil line), and you have yourself a fairlly well dmg output shaman.  I havn't had a chance yet to test if the bear maul recieves the bonus for crit hit yet or not...computer is not available since i had just put my points into it.

[Eileithia]

On the Defiler side. if you go down the Cannibalize line, you're going to get approx 35% DPS increase for your major damage spells. Re-use time on Defile is cut almost in half, and Forced cannibalize will give you 36 power back every 3 seconds (72 per tick). This is a huge benefit for soloing. Cannibalize it's self is a 25% HP for 10% power every 20 seconds with a 3 second cast time. Again, if you solo a lot, or Duel/PVP a lot this is a huge benefit.

 

With INT gear on (~400-500ish INT) I'm hitting about 500-600DPS single target, and can hit 1000-1400 DPS AE if it's 3-4 green/blue mobs and Defile and Malestrom are up.

 

My Shammy tree is spec'd for raiding so STR/INT. if I re-speced for soloing I would take the AGI/INT lines for even more melee damage.

[Effie]

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They don't have any soloability. They can do it, but it's slow as hell.

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With melee AAs and the agility AA line, Mystics can be excellent soloers.

 

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I havn't had a chance yet to test if the bear maul recieves the bonus for crit hit yet or not

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That proc does not receive the crit bonus but all the melee AAs (glacial strike, etc) do.

 

Message Edited by Effie on 01-24-2007 11:34 AM

[Jatofyr324]

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Duntzzzz wrote:

Just to clarify Sonny's post..

Mystics are better AE Debuffers - Defilers are better Single target. Both are able to hit the cap for slows/DPS reduction..Mystics buff Stats (STR/STA/AGI etc) - Defilers buff Raw HP/Power.Wards are IdenticalMystics have a small HP buff on their heals - Defilers heal for more, but cast times are slower.Defilers have slightly higher DPS from spell damage - Mystics have more Melee DPS due to STR buffs.

Basically the classes are fairly well balanced when you look at the overall picture, really you should be asking Should i live in Freeport or Qeynos..

There are a ton of Mystic vs Defiler posts all over the boards, so I'd suggest doing a search if you want more detailed information..

And like Sonny said, if you want a healer who can solo well, Fury would be your best choice.. Good heals, and great DPS (for a priest) at later levels.

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Do Defilers have anything that is like torpor or oberon? Those are 2 of my favorite moves on my mystic, although I don't get to use oberon too often (Its great in duels though).Edit: ZOMFGZ My 40th post! Thats like, almost 1k!!!!!!!!!!1!1!1!1!1!ONE

Message Edited by Jatofyr324 on 01-25-2007 11:53 PM

[Eileithia]

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Jatofyr324 wrote:

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Duntzzzz wrote:

Just to clarify Sonny's post..

Mystics are better AE Debuffers - Defilers are better Single target. Both are able to hit the cap for slows/DPS reduction..
Mystics buff Stats (STR/STA/AGI etc) - Defilers buff Raw HP/Power.
Wards are Identical
Mystics have a small HP buff on their heals - Defilers heal for more, but cast times are slower.
Defilers have slightly higher DPS from spell damage - Mystics have more Melee DPS due to STR buffs.

Basically the classes are fairly well balanced when you look at the overall picture, really you should be asking Should i live in Freeport or Qeynos..

There are a ton of Mystic vs Defiler posts all over the boards, so I'd suggest doing a search if you want more detailed information..

And like Sonny said, if you want a healer who can solo well, Fury would be your best choice.. Good heals, and great DPS (for a priest) at later levels.

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Do Defilers have anything that is like torpor or oberon? Those are 2 of my favorite moves on my mystic, although I don't get to use oberon too often (Its great in duels though).

Edit: ZOMFGZ My 40th post! Thats like, almost 1k!!!!!!!!!!1!1!1!1!1!ONE

Message Edited by Jatofyr324 on 01-25-2007 11:53 PM

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We dont' have anything like Oberon or Torpor.. we do however have Spiritual Circle wich is fairly uber.. only problem is the little circle pet can get killed by AE's. it casts ~600HP ward on the group every 5 seconds for a minute... We also have some pretty insane power regen with Forced Cannibalize, so you're able to keep healing for longer without having to worry about power constraints..

[Eepop]

Maelestrom is supposed to be roughly equivilent to Oberon.  Im not saying it IS per se, but if its not, I support it being fixed. Defilers get Forced Cannibalize in the slot that Mystics get Torpor.  Both are pretty crazy good, and I think both sides are pretty much equally jealous of the other. Defilers and mystics have the exact same number of spells, which spells you like more is mostly up to personally opinion*. * - Assuming that all spells on both sides worked properly, which isnt really the case.  Defilers have a few broken lines, and mystic stamina buffing could certainly fall in the broken category.

[Jatofyr324]

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Duntzzzz wrote:

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Jatofyr324 wrote:

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Duntzzzz wrote:

Just to clarify Sonny's post..

Mystics are better AE Debuffers - Defilers are better Single target. Both are able to hit the cap for slows/DPS reduction..Mystics buff Stats (STR/STA/AGI etc) - Defilers buff Raw HP/Power.Wards are IdenticalMystics have a small HP buff on their heals - Defilers heal for more, but cast times are slower.Defilers have slightly higher DPS from spell damage - Mystics have more Melee DPS due to STR buffs.

Basically the classes are fairly well balanced when you look at the overall picture, really you should be asking Should i live in Freeport or Qeynos..

There are a ton of Mystic vs Defiler posts all over the boards, so I'd suggest doing a search if you want more detailed information..

And like Sonny said, if you want a healer who can solo well, Fury would be your best choice.. Good heals, and great DPS (for a priest) at later levels.

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Do Defilers have anything that is like torpor or oberon? Those are 2 of my favorite moves on my mystic, although I don't get to use oberon too often (Its great in duels though).Edit: ZOMFGZ My 40th post! Thats like, almost 1k!!!!!!!!!!1!1!1!1!1!ONE

Message Edited by Jatofyr324 on 01-25-200711:53 PM

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We dont' have anything like Oberon or Torpor.. we do however have Spiritual Circle wich is fairly uber.. only problem is the little circle pet can get killed by AE's. it casts ~600HP ward on the group every 5 seconds for a minute... We also have some pretty insane power regen with Forced Cannibalize, so you're able to keep healing for longer without having to worry about power constraints..

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   But we have a bear that...heals the group...poorly...and...dies...ok I want your spiritual circle :smileytongue:

[Eileithia]

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Eepop wrote:
Maelestrom is supposed to be roughly equivilent to Oberon.  Im not saying it IS per se, but if its not, I support it being fixed.

Defilers get Forced Cannibalize in the slot that Mystics get Torpor.  Both are pretty crazy good, and I think both sides are pretty much equally jealous of the other.

Defilers and mystics have the exact same number of spells, which spells you like more is mostly up to personally opinion*.



* - Assuming that all spells on both sides worked properly, which isnt really the case.  Defilers have a few broken lines, and mystic stamina buffing could certainly fall in the broken category.

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Malestrom is slightly different.. it's an Encounter AE Damage/Power drain.. that gives the group a HoT, and increases power.. the problem is that Malestrom in it's original form ticks every 6 seconds.. so the miniscule amount of power it gives your group back, and the small heal is not worth being stifled for the duration of the spell. One of our AA's makes this spell tick faster and shortens the overall duration.. Even with this AA maxed, it's still very situational, but it is much more useful than the original form..

Circle is great compared to your horrid little badger/beaver/bear ghosty thing you guys have I will give you that.. only major problem with Circle is the range is 10M from where you place it, and it doesn't move with you so once it's down everyone has to stay in range to get the maximum effect. I also think that if the Defiler backs too far away from the circle pet it stops warding all together, but that may have been changed?!?  This spell's been screwed with more times than a South Freeport harlet..

[Eepop]

I think Oberon is a great tool, but it is also very situational.  The HPS it gives is less than if we were doing a normal, non-stunned healing cycle.  I agree that Maelstrom probably needs some love, but just want to be clear that Oberon isnt something that should inspire much envy.  Theres a reason that every few weeks a mystic makes a post about how useless Oberon is before we reveal what few situations its good in.

[tanafanaboba]

I started as a mystic and betrayed to defiler around level 26 because of the lack of spell upgrades. There were very few on the broker and the ones that were on there were outrageously overpriced, even for Adept I spells. I played my defiler up to level 70 was very happy with my toon. I could buff anyone for about 2000 hp. I wasn't terribly happy with my heals though. Yeah you get 2 single target heals and a group heal as well and a single target and group ward, but I never was completely happy with them. The single target heals just took too long to cast. I wasn't terribly happy with my class tree either. I took the buff line all the way down to get Soul Ward and used the rest of my points in my spell line. After a while, I started to become frustrated again with the lack of spell upgrades. People like to charge ridiculous amounts for Defiler Master 1 spells. Even the crappy ones you rarely use were way over priced. I got my single traget ward for 9 plat but every time I'd look for my group ward, it was never on the broker and if it was, it was priced for 100+ plat. Out of curiousity about 6 days ago, I looked up the mystic's group ward and to my suprise it was 5 plat. Same ward, different name. This made me want to betray again.

After the betrayl, I was impressed with how much better the mystic's class tree was and the fact that Ancient Avatar could be Master II was amazing. Their choices for the last MII was much better than the defilers. The mystics also get an achievement that will let you add a wis and int buff to Ancient avatar. Their SoW can be upgraded to 50% which will also decrese falling damage by up to 25%. All of your Str and Sta buffs get added to. You can add duration to bolster and increase your ward amount with Oberon Barrier. The class tree also lets you add small wards to your cures. There is also a spell line on there which will give you an alternate spell of one you already have. These ones are slightly better and it gives you the option to use them as melee attacks. If you're like me, I don't like the shaman tree. I took my 8 points in wis and 8 points in int and moved on to the other tree. I took the melee attacks in the class tree and went to the 3rd ability on the agility line in the shaman tree. For every point spent on this ability, it will increase your melee crit chance by 12.5%. Put 8 points in there and you're almost always critting with those new alternate melee atacks. This helps out a lot since me and my husband duo a lot and I don't do much dps.

All in all, the mystics are a lot better in the high end. Better heals since wards can be added on to cures and also, their buff gives a ward on physical mit. The defilers gives one for magic mit. Physical is a lot handier. Not to mention, your level 50 and 70 spell is a ward. I wasn't too impressed with the defiler's maelstrom and rarely ever used it. The mystic's Sta ,Str and dps debuffs are nice too. Especially the encounter only one.

[Owlbe]

I did kinda the same thing, glad I'm not the only wierdo around hehe . Mystic=>Defiler=>Mystic. Started my Mystic way back at launch but when LU13 went in and [Removed for Content] the Mystics dps I stopped playing him. I betrayed him when they added the betrayal in after lvl 16. I really liked the cannibalize spell and and warding pet. I always seemed to have a near limitless supply of mana with the Defiler, not so much as a Mystic. Defile was pretty cool to. When EoF was realeased the wife was bound and determined to play a Fae wiz so I've been pl'ing her as best I can. The Defiler/wiz combo was just not working out well. Having to cast while getting beat on was just to many interupts to dps/ward/heal and whatever and keep aggro off the wifes wiz. I love shaman so I didn't really want to give on him so I re-looked at the mystic and with the EoF combat ca's it was a god send. I can fire off a ton of damage and get all the ca's off in 2 secs and still have time to ward/heal/debuff/what ever. The ca's do so much damage in the first barrage that the wife can nuke to her hearts content for the most part and the duo is working quite well.  Happy with the Mystic.... again.Thats my Mystic love story anyways

Message Edited by Omegarhino on 01-31-2007 03:04 PM

[Eepop]

They are fairly well balanced, although both sides have a few gripes to be sorted out. As for the ward buff issue, Mystics do physical, Defilers do magical.  Sounds like mystics are better huh?  Until you take into account that the Defiler buff wards for twice as much.  Then you see its alot more even.