Enhance Fanaticism : Still bugged

Avirodar · 12-30-2006, 05:00 PM

The subject says it all.I will make it clear, by quoting the spell description.---------------------------Enhance: Fanaticism (Rank 1)Removes the self-Stifle component of Zealotry and its higher level upgrades. As an alternative penalty while it is active, the Inquisitor's spell section of their knowledge book all require twice as much power, additional casting time, and heal for much less---------------------------I can pick that detailed description to bits, because yes, it is --THAT-- bad.I will assume you (anyone reading this) is of decent intelligence, and has actually played Everquest 2. Is the manastone clickie a part of the Inquisitors spell section of their knowledge book? No. Despite the description of Fanaticism saying it affects the spell section of the knowledge book, mana stone (along with all mana procs, from mana clickies, to mana drains, to mana procs on armor) is halved. Why? (Yes, its a bug, I reported it, no response, no fix, to date). To make it worse, activation time on all clickables are penalised...Not to mention, it the AA description reads: "As an alternative penalty while it is active..."Penalty implies one, yet it describes three penalties. It also fails to describe the penalties correctly, due to the penalties being bugged.It also penalises reactives cast prior to fanaticism being used.To make another point - Cost vs Effectiveness?Enhance: Fanaticism costs FIVE (5) AA points, not one. How can anyone in their right mind justify such massive penalties to something that is so expensive, yet penalises Inquisitors in a manner worse than the non-enhanced state? Without Enhance: Fanaticism, I could precast reactives, then cast Fanaticism, and have my reactives kicking for full healing capacity, along with having chilling inquest work properly (not halved), along with the proc items on my weapons and armor not being halved. And Fanaticism is easy to toggle.The excessive penalties are a joke, and make the "enhance" a downgrade. This AA requires a fix, no question about it.SOE : Fix it. Many inquisitors have proposed fixes and solutions, not just myself.In my opinion, for a 5 point AA, the penalties of Enhance: Fanaticism should be:1) Doubles all mana expenditure while in effect.2) Spells contained within the Inquisitor's knowledge book will take 25% longer to cast. (And actually take effect as stated!!!)Any penalties beyond this should result in (De)Enhance: Fanaticism being made to cost 1 AA point, not 5. The penalties listed would still heavily favor use of the battle cleric line, which it is a part of.I will post as many new threads as I have to, for this matter to recieve attention. I am sick to death of being all but a forgotten, after-thought class that gets left half done and majorly bugged.- Avirodar

Message Edited by Trinral on 12-30-2006 04:02 AM

Demoniac · 12-30-2006, 08:33 PM

it's a fatal bug i would have to say...whoever gets the AA you can't really use fanaticism any more or you don't need to cast reactive at all. it's much a like a curse.NOTE: fanaticism and any type reactive can NOT be on at the same time. this is the major problem. fanaticism almost make your procs cut to half as well, that's just a plus.

Gobbwin · 12-30-2006, 09:47 PM

Actually the devs are aware of this and are looking into it. The search engine is your friend: http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=14&message.id=12295

Rckmer wrote:

Ssinurn wrote:
On test the text now says:

Removes self-Stifle component...the Inquisitor's spell section of their knowledge book all require twice as much power, additional casting time and heal for much less.

At least they've got it being honest now...but I doubt they realize the side effect to our power drain/proc items. This needs to be made 100% clear, because it's bogus.

EDIT: I proposed this question in the IRC chat just now...it was skipped, but I received a personal message from Gallenite that the bug concerning our power drain etc has been forwarded to QA.

Message Edited by rckmer on 12-12-2006 05:20 PM

TheSpin · 01-02-2007, 11:52 AM

I have personally really enjoyed enhance fanatacism. I guess I haven't paid enough attention to my reactives to notice them disappear when I activate fanaticism...but I haven't had any healing problems related to it. If that's true, then I definately think it needs some attention. I think I would have noticed my reactive disappearing with the buff activating so maybe it's fixed...or maybe it's because I don't have fanatacism yet and am still using the lower level version.

From everything I've personally seen so far it's working completely as I expected it to and it's totally worth it to me. I often start casting a reactive or other spell while it's up and just cancel it before the spell completes casting and it removes all the penalties I would have taken if I had left it running when the spell finished casting (of course I do get a longer casting time doing this, but if I cancel it mid-cast it speeds back up again).

Sometimes because of the increased int I leave it up while I'm casting retribution type spells cuz it adds a little more damage to the spell and I don't have to drop it so that the rest of the group can continue to enjoy it.

I'm not saying you don't have valid complaints, but I guess I'm just not seeing the problems in my own experience with the spell.

Demoniac · 01-02-2007, 03:28 PM

this is a big problem when you cast fanaticism. all the procs cut to half such as inquest line. all the pre-heals ( I am talking about you cast reactive before you cast fananticism ) will cut to half basically, all the reactive, you will heal like 200-250 per hit.. if that's not a problem, what is a problem??

TheSpin · 01-02-2007, 04:47 PM

I just tested this out and you're right. I misread the previous posting thinking that the reactives were 'dispelled' when you turn on fanatacism, but I just checked for myself that the reactives are only half as good, even if you cast it before putting up fanat. Thank you for bringing this to my attention,

I hope it's something that gets fixed soon. No way this could be as intended because it really is making the spell less useful rather than more.

Avirodar · 01-03-2007, 04:20 AM

TheSpin wrote:
I just tested this out and you're right. I misread the previous posting thinking that the reactives were 'dispelled' when you turn on fanatacism, but I just checked for myself that the reactives are only half as good, even if you cast it before putting up fanat. Thank you for bringing this to my attention,

I hope it's something that gets fixed soon. No way this could be as intended because it really is making the spell less useful rather than more.

Yeah, but its more than just that. The mana from Manastone, Necro Hearts and Conj Shards are also cut in half. Also restorative procs from worn armor is also halved (examples: 3 princes hammer, outcast BP, Innoruk diety cloak). According to the description of Enhance: Fanaticism, none of these spells should be affected.In response to Gobbwin, I am hoping to see something a little better than a reported private message that a problem has been "forwarded" to another department. As I have no doubt you'd be aware, problems can often be "lost" or "forgotten" when in the forwarding process. Until an actual open/public statement that a fix is in the works, or a fix is actually put in, I will keep posting about this bug.- Avirodar

TheSpin · 01-04-2007, 11:34 AM

Trinral wrote:

TheSpin wrote:

I just tested this out and you're right. I misread the previous posting thinking that the reactives were 'dispelled' when you turn on fanatacism, but I just checked for myself that the reactives are only half as good, even if you cast it before putting up fanat. Thank you for bringing this to my attention,

I hope it's something that gets fixed soon. No way this could be as intended because it really is making the spell less useful rather than more.

Yeah, but its more than just that. The mana from Manastone, Necro Hearts and Conj Shards are also cut in half. Also restorative procs from worn armor is also halved (examples: 3 princes hammer, outcast BP, Innoruk diety cloak). According to the description of Enhance: Fanaticism, none of these spells should be affected.

In response to Gobbwin, I am hoping to see something a little better than a reported private message that a problem has been "forwarded" to another department. As I have no doubt you'd be aware, problems can often be "lost" or "forgotten" when in the forwarding process. Until an actual open/public statement that a fix is in the works, or a fix is actually put in, I will keep posting about this bug.

- Avirodar

As a huge fan of the battle line, I'm with you all the way on this. I hope it gets some attention soon because I'm scared of using fanaticism now.

Avirodar · 01-04-2007, 07:30 PM

I noticed I have worded something very poorly in my prior post. To address that issue before some "kind" person tries to make a deal out of it...Problem quote : "According to the description of Enhance: Fanaticism, none of these spells should be affected."I incorrectly refer to the mana procs on armor as spells, when they are not. I meant to say that none of these procs should be affected.

Solar_Fla · 01-10-2007, 09:17 PM

I need to add to this thread that EVERY proc or ability that I have when running fanaticism is "halfed". There is something wrong with it. I notice that when I have enhanced fanaticism going that Chilling Inquest get halved even though its already on someone thus making me not gain as much power. Manastone and Vessel of Fryun too! I am sorry but this needs to be fixed asap. Having an "enhancement" cost 5 AA points but it hamstrings you so you can do dps? So lets recap, without enhanced fanaticism bought I can continue to gain the same from chilling inquest, my vessel and manastone work correctly and the only diffrence is I can't cast spells with it on not that I cast heals with it on in the first place. So in order for me to cast my CA's with it on I have to spend 5 points in this skill but i can't turn the "aa" off to resume getting the rest of the benefits from inquest and mana increasers. I am sorry but that was no explained in the spell and needs to be fixed. It says it only affects SPELLS YOU CAST! There is no mention whatsoever that it affects spells ALREADY cast. I am begining to wonder if I cast a reactive and then put on fanaticism that it might lower the amount it heals for and I am sorry thats wrong. If i have to go to the trouble to toggle it off to cast a spell put it back on and then find out my heals are halved then, whats the point? Please fix this AA it is very important to some of us and I am tired of your buggy coding getting in the way of this.

TheSpin · 01-16-2007, 07:29 PM

Solar_Flare wrote:
I need to add to this thread that EVERY proc or ability that I have when running fanaticism is "halfed". There is something wrong with it. I notice that when I have enhanced fanaticism going that Chilling Inquest get halved even though its already on someone thus making me not gain as much power. Manastone and Vessel of Fryun too! I am sorry but this needs to be fixed asap. Having an "enhancement" cost 5 AA points but it hamstrings you so you can do dps? So lets recap, without enhanced fanaticism bought I can continue to gain the same from chilling inquest, my vessel and manastone work correctly and the only diffrence is I can't cast spells with it on not that I cast heals with it on in the first place. So in order for me to cast my CA's with it on I have to spend 5 points in this skill but i can't turn the "aa" off to resume getting the rest of the benefits from inquest and mana increasers. I am sorry but that was no explained in the spell and needs to be fixed. It says it only affects SPELLS YOU CAST! There is no mention whatsoever that it affects spells ALREADY cast. I am begining to wonder if I cast a reactive and then put on fanaticism that it might lower the amount it heals for and I am sorry thats wrong. If i have to go to the trouble to toggle it off to cast a spell put it back on and then find out my heals are halved then, whats the point? Please fix this AA it is very important to some of us and I am tired of your buggy coding getting in the way of this.

Using a little more 'white space' would have made this much easier to read (posting on the web is much easier to read if you have a bunch of short paragraphs rather than one long blog). That's not my reason for replying though.

It is absolutely correct that when you cast a reactive and then put up enhanced zealotry that your heals become halved. I have the AA in enhanced zealotry and now I'm restricted to direct heals in groups if i want to use zealotry at all. When I do cast a reactive I find myself hovering my mouse over the reactive buff in my maintained spells box and I can't wait for all the triggers to expire so I can put back up zealotry.

I do enjoy being able to keep zealotry up and cast debuffs and cures (when power consumption is not an issue), but I would much rather be restriced to using only my combat arts with zealotry up if it would be a possible fix to this heal/proc bug.

12-30-2006, 05:00 PM	#1
Avirodar Server: Oasis Guild: Tyranny Rank: Champion Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,035	The subject says it all.I will make it clear, by quoting the spell description.---------------------------Enhance: Fanaticism (Rank 1)Removes the self-Stifle component of Zealotry and its higher level upgrades. As an alternative penalty while it is active, the Inquisitor's spell section of their knowledge book all require twice as much power, additional casting time, and heal for much less---------------------------I can pick that detailed description to bits, because yes, it is --THAT-- bad.I will assume you (anyone reading this) is of decent intelligence, and has actually played Everquest 2. Is the manastone clickie a part of the Inquisitors spell section of their knowledge book? No. Despite the description of Fanaticism saying it affects the spell section of the knowledge book, mana stone (along with all mana procs, from mana clickies, to mana drains, to mana procs on armor) is halved. Why? (Yes, its a bug, I reported it, no response, no fix, to date). To make it worse, activation time on all clickables are penalised...Not to mention, it the AA description reads: "As an alternative penalty while it is active..."Penalty implies one, yet it describes three penalties. It also fails to describe the penalties correctly, due to the penalties being bugged.It also penalises reactives cast prior to fanaticism being used.To make another point - Cost vs Effectiveness?Enhance: Fanaticism costs FIVE (5) AA points, not one. How can anyone in their right mind justify such massive penalties to something that is so expensive, yet penalises Inquisitors in a manner worse than the non-enhanced state? Without Enhance: Fanaticism, I could precast reactives, then cast Fanaticism, and have my reactives kicking for full healing capacity, along with having chilling inquest work properly (not halved), along with the proc items on my weapons and armor not being halved. And Fanaticism is easy to toggle.The excessive penalties are a joke, and make the "enhance" a downgrade. This AA requires a fix, no question about it.SOE : Fix it. Many inquisitors have proposed fixes and solutions, not just myself.In my opinion, for a 5 point AA, the penalties of Enhance: Fanaticism should be:1) Doubles all mana expenditure while in effect.2) Spells contained within the Inquisitor's knowledge book will take 25% longer to cast. (And actually take effect as stated!!!)Any penalties beyond this should result in (De)Enhance: Fanaticism being made to cost 1 AA point, not 5. The penalties listed would still heavily favor use of the battle cleric line, which it is a part of.I will post as many new threads as I have to, for this matter to recieve attention. I am sick to death of being all but a forgotten, after-thought class that gets left half done and majorly bugged.- Avirodar Message Edited by Trinral on 12-30-2006 04:02 AM __________________ Templar of Oasis

12-30-2006, 09:47 PM	#3
Gobbwin Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 305	Actually the devs are aware of this and are looking into it. The search engine is your friend: http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=14&message.id=12295 Rckmer wrote: Ssinurn wrote: On test the text now says: Removes self-Stifle component...the Inquisitor's spell section of their knowledge book all require twice as much power, additional casting time and heal for much less. At least they've got it being honest now...but I doubt they realize the side effect to our power drain/proc items. This needs to be made 100% clear, because it's bogus. EDIT: I proposed this question in the IRC chat just now...it was skipped, but I received a personal message from Gallenite that the bug concerning our power drain etc has been forwarded to QA. Message Edited by rckmer on 12-12-2006 05:20 PM __________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Kikio 80 Inquisitor Ferochus 70 Bruiser (Retired) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

01-03-2007, 04:20 AM	#7
Avirodar Server: Oasis Guild: Tyranny Rank: Champion Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,035	TheSpin wrote: I just tested this out and you're right. I misread the previous posting thinking that the reactives were 'dispelled' when you turn on fanatacism, but I just checked for myself that the reactives are only half as good, even if you cast it before putting up fanat. Thank you for bringing this to my attention, I hope it's something that gets fixed soon. No way this could be as intended because it really is making the spell less useful rather than more. Yeah, but its more than just that. The mana from Manastone, Necro Hearts and Conj Shards are also cut in half. Also restorative procs from worn armor is also halved (examples: 3 princes hammer, outcast BP, Innoruk diety cloak). According to the description of Enhance: Fanaticism, none of these spells should be affected.In response to Gobbwin, I am hoping to see something a little better than a reported private message that a problem has been "forwarded" to another department. As I have no doubt you'd be aware, problems can often be "lost" or "forgotten" when in the forwarding process. Until an actual open/public statement that a fix is in the works, or a fix is actually put in, I will keep posting about this bug.- Avirodar __________________ Templar of Oasis

01-04-2007, 11:34 AM	#8
TheSpin Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,587	Trinral wrote: TheSpin wrote: I just tested this out and you're right. I misread the previous posting thinking that the reactives were 'dispelled' when you turn on fanatacism, but I just checked for myself that the reactives are only half as good, even if you cast it before putting up fanat. Thank you for bringing this to my attention, I hope it's something that gets fixed soon. No way this could be as intended because it really is making the spell less useful rather than more. Yeah, but its more than just that. The mana from Manastone, Necro Hearts and Conj Shards are also cut in half. Also restorative procs from worn armor is also halved (examples: 3 princes hammer, outcast BP, Innoruk diety cloak). According to the description of Enhance: Fanaticism, none of these spells should be affected. In response to Gobbwin, I am hoping to see something a little better than a reported private message that a problem has been "forwarded" to another department. As I have no doubt you'd be aware, problems can often be "lost" or "forgotten" when in the forwarding process. Until an actual open/public statement that a fix is in the works, or a fix is actually put in, I will keep posting about this bug. - Avirodar As a huge fan of the battle line, I'm with you all the way on this. I hope it gets some attention soon because I'm scared of using fanaticism now.

01-04-2007, 07:30 PM	#9
Avirodar Server: Oasis Guild: Tyranny Rank: Champion Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,035	I noticed I have worded something very poorly in my prior post. To address that issue before some "kind" person tries to make a deal out of it...Problem quote : "According to the description of Enhance: Fanaticism, none of these spells should be affected."I incorrectly refer to the mana procs on armor as spells, when they are not. I meant to say that none of these procs should be affected. __________________ Templar of Oasis

12-30-2006, 08:33 PM	#2
Demoniac Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 489	it's a fatal bug i would have to say...whoever gets the AA you can't really use fanaticism any more or you don't need to cast reactive at all. it's much a like a curse.NOTE: fanaticism and any type reactive can NOT be on at the same time. this is the major problem. fanaticism almost make your procs cut to half as well, that's just a plus.

01-02-2007, 11:52 AM	#4
TheSpin Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,587	I have personally really enjoyed enhance fanatacism. I guess I haven't paid enough attention to my reactives to notice them disappear when I activate fanaticism...but I haven't had any healing problems related to it. If that's true, then I definately think it needs some attention. I think I would have noticed my reactive disappearing with the buff activating so maybe it's fixed...or maybe it's because I don't have fanatacism yet and am still using the lower level version. From everything I've personally seen so far it's working completely as I expected it to and it's totally worth it to me. I often start casting a reactive or other spell while it's up and just cancel it before the spell completes casting and it removes all the penalties I would have taken if I had left it running when the spell finished casting (of course I do get a longer casting time doing this, but if I cancel it mid-cast it speeds back up again). Sometimes because of the increased int I leave it up while I'm casting retribution type spells cuz it adds a little more damage to the spell and I don't have to drop it so that the rest of the group can continue to enjoy it. I'm not saying you don't have valid complaints, but I guess I'm just not seeing the problems in my own experience with the spell.

01-02-2007, 03:28 PM	#5
Demoniac Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 489	this is a big problem when you cast fanaticism. all the procs cut to half such as inquest line. all the pre-heals ( I am talking about you cast reactive before you cast fananticism ) will cut to half basically, all the reactive, you will heal like 200-250 per hit.. if that's not a problem, what is a problem??

01-02-2007, 04:47 PM	#6
TheSpin Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,587	I just tested this out and you're right. I misread the previous posting thinking that the reactives were 'dispelled' when you turn on fanatacism, but I just checked for myself that the reactives are only half as good, even if you cast it before putting up fanat. Thank you for bringing this to my attention, I hope it's something that gets fixed soon. No way this could be as intended because it really is making the spell less useful rather than more.

01-10-2007, 09:17 PM	#10
Solar_Fla General Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 99	I need to add to this thread that EVERY proc or ability that I have when running fanaticism is "halfed". There is something wrong with it. I notice that when I have enhanced fanaticism going that Chilling Inquest get halved even though its already on someone thus making me not gain as much power. Manastone and Vessel of Fryun too! I am sorry but this needs to be fixed asap. Having an "enhancement" cost 5 AA points but it hamstrings you so you can do dps? So lets recap, without enhanced fanaticism bought I can continue to gain the same from chilling inquest, my vessel and manastone work correctly and the only diffrence is I can't cast spells with it on not that I cast heals with it on in the first place. So in order for me to cast my CA's with it on I have to spend 5 points in this skill but i can't turn the "aa" off to resume getting the rest of the benefits from inquest and mana increasers. I am sorry but that was no explained in the spell and needs to be fixed. It says it only affects SPELLS YOU CAST! There is no mention whatsoever that it affects spells ALREADY cast. I am begining to wonder if I cast a reactive and then put on fanaticism that it might lower the amount it heals for and I am sorry thats wrong. If i have to go to the trouble to toggle it off to cast a spell put it back on and then find out my heals are halved then, whats the point? Please fix this AA it is very important to some of us and I am tired of your buggy coding getting in the way of this.

01-16-2007, 07:29 PM	#11
TheSpin Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,587	Solar_Flare wrote: I need to add to this thread that EVERY proc or ability that I have when running fanaticism is "halfed". There is something wrong with it. I notice that when I have enhanced fanaticism going that Chilling Inquest get halved even though its already on someone thus making me not gain as much power. Manastone and Vessel of Fryun too! I am sorry but this needs to be fixed asap. Having an "enhancement" cost 5 AA points but it hamstrings you so you can do dps? So lets recap, without enhanced fanaticism bought I can continue to gain the same from chilling inquest, my vessel and manastone work correctly and the only diffrence is I can't cast spells with it on not that I cast heals with it on in the first place. So in order for me to cast my CA's with it on I have to spend 5 points in this skill but i can't turn the "aa" off to resume getting the rest of the benefits from inquest and mana increasers. I am sorry but that was no explained in the spell and needs to be fixed. It says it only affects SPELLS YOU CAST! There is no mention whatsoever that it affects spells ALREADY cast. I am begining to wonder if I cast a reactive and then put on fanaticism that it might lower the amount it heals for and I am sorry thats wrong. If i have to go to the trouble to toggle it off to cast a spell put it back on and then find out my heals are halved then, whats the point? Please fix this AA it is very important to some of us and I am tired of your buggy coding getting in the way of this. Using a little more 'white space' would have made this much easier to read (posting on the web is much easier to read if you have a bunch of short paragraphs rather than one long blog). That's not my reason for replying though. It is absolutely correct that when you cast a reactive and then put up enhanced zealotry that your heals become halved. I have the AA in enhanced zealotry and now I'm restricted to direct heals in groups if i want to use zealotry at all. When I do cast a reactive I find myself hovering my mouse over the reactive buff in my maintained spells box and I can't wait for all the triggers to expire so I can put back up zealotry. I do enjoy being able to keep zealotry up and cast debuffs and cures (when power consumption is not an issue), but I would much rather be restriced to using only my combat arts with zealotry up if it would be a possible fix to this heal/proc bug.